Irishman Entering Uk With Thai Wife & Stepdaughter

[Connor2010]

Hope this is unique enough to deserve a new topic, found nothing related in a search.

OK so I'm an Irish citizen plus my wife has an Irish passport from marrying me, also her niece [13] lives with us here in LOS. I am getting old now, and after 12+ years of Thailand we want to resettle in Europe. Her favoured place is southern England, where she has many Thai friends.

We heard that EU citizens can go anywhere in the EU without obstruction, but surely life is never that easy. Does anybody know what sort of entry pass we could get for her niece, some friends say the Brits cannot refuse her a Visa but I have my doubts. No offence meant, but that embassy has to be one of the most unfriendly there is. We have been there with friends who got treated like sh1t

We have tried to make sense of various web searches but it is all conflicting. Any advice or actual experiences would be really appreciated. Edit for update: Ooops, forgot to explain niece is not legally adopted, but lives as part of our family here. She is on the house paper with us. Usual case of real parents neglect and inability to cope. Plus why offend the brother by formally adopting, no body cares while we are here. Guess it could be awkward in UK though, any opinions on that score please ?

Edited December 31, 2009 by Connor2010

[kennkate]

I guess you would have to adopt the Niece in order to obtain a Visa for her,

You don't state Northern Ireland or Ireland . If you and your wife have Irish Passports then you will be able to gain entry into the UK

(If southern Ireland maybe you will have restrictions with regard to benefits, again not sure but you can check )

I would think the position regarding entry for the little girl without a UK visa might be different.

But no doubt others IE 7by7 will give you the correct info.

Sorry I cannot be much help but it will keep the thread going untill you get better advice.

Good Luck. Better to wait until April it's Sooo Cooold at the moment

[JackSterling]

Good luck to all.. but just a thought...WHY WOULD YOU WANT TO LIVE IN EUROPE?? after living in paradise??

[7by7]

As your wife has an Irish passport, and so presumably Irish citizenship, then she has the same treaty rights to live and work in the UK, or any other EEA state, that you do.

Your niece will need to apply for an EEA Family Permit, which she can do as an extended family member.

From EUN2.7 Who are an EEA national’s extended family members?

An extended family member of an EEA national is any other relative who meets one of the requirements listed in regulation 8 of the EEA Regulations.

An applicant may be considered for an EEA family permit as an extended family member if they are:

residing in the same state in which the EEA national also resides and are dependent on the EEA national or are a member of the EEA national’s household; and

accompanying the EEA national to the UK or wishing to join them there.

You will need to show that she is related as claimed, i.e. birth certificates, and that she has been living with and maintained by you and your wife for at least the last 6 months.

See also Guidance - EEA & Swiss nationals (INF 18) and ISSUE OF AN EEA FAMILY PERMIT.

EEA family permits can be refused, especially if applying as an extended family member, but from what you have said the only grounds that I can see for doing so would be if you were not able to maintain and accommodate you niece in the UK without recourse to public funds; see Maintenance and accommodation.

For where and how to apply, see UK visa application website.

Adopting her in Thailand would only delay things, and as adoptions in Thailand are not recognised in the UK you would only have to adopt her again once there. See Intercountry adoption.

[Connor2010]

As your wife has an Irish passport, and so presumably Irish citizenship, then she has the same treaty rights to live and work in the UK, or any other EEA state, that you do.

Your niece will need to apply for an EEA Family Permit, which she can do as an extended family member.

Many thanks 7by7, that fits exactly with the rumours I had heard. I really hope I did not waste your time by asking this, but I just could not seem to reliably pin down the details you have provided here.

Yes my wife is a fully fledged Thai/Chinese/Irish Citizen

So case closed, with our grateful thanks

[Connor2010]

Good luck to all.. but just a thought...WHY WOULD YOU WANT TO LIVE IN EUROPE?? after living in paradise??

Thanks for the good luck Jack

As for 'paradise' then I assume you are being sarcastic ? One man's paradise is another man's 'hel_l on earth' ;(

We shall not miss Thailand one bit, we all find Thai 'culture' to be excessively LOUD, unbelieveably inconsiderate and just downright boring. For me it is also extremely claustrophobic. I like modern Europe's open borders and genuine freedoms. IMHO Europe is simply better by far.

As for our other reasons, well I am a European after all, and my wife is really Chinese though she spent most of her life in Thailand until meeting me. For us Europe is rich in culture, history, endless places to explore and has proper weather, not the Cataract/Melanoma causing endless sunshine of this awful place. One thing I have missed above all else is the long summer evenings of the Northern Hemisphere.

Thailand has been a tolerable base while I was working in this region of the world, but if I had known what it is really like I would have based myself in Malaysia, or Singapore. Of course we will visit Thailand for holidays, and that will be more than enough 'paradise' until the end of my days.

Edited January 1, 2010 by Connor2010

[Connor2010]

I guess you would have to adopt the Niece in order to obtain a Visa for her,

You don't state Northern Ireland or Ireland . If you and your wife have Irish Passports then you will be able to gain entry into the UK

(If southern Ireland maybe you will have restrictions with regard to benefits, again not sure but you can check )

I would think the position regarding entry for the little girl without a UK visa might be different.

But no doubt others IE 7by7 will give you the correct info.

Sorry I cannot be much help but it will keep the thread going untill you get better advice.

Good Luck. Better to wait until April it's Sooo Cooold at the moment

Thanks for your assistance kennkate, I am truly impressed by how 'strangers' help each out on this board.

Jokingly .. I assume by 'southern Ireland' you must mean the Irish Republic ? Begorrah and bejabers, don't you know that there is only one Ireland, the entire island of Ireland

[7by7]

I really hope I did not waste your time by asking this, but I just could not seem to reliably pin down the details you have provided here.

No problem; it's what this forum is here for.

[true blue]

Good luck to all.. but just a thought...WHY WOULD YOU WANT TO LIVE IN EUROPE?? after living in paradise??

bet youve not been living in the los,for long.

[kennkate]

Hi Connor Bagorra I did indeed mean The Republic of Ireland. And for the record I Love the Republic

I had one very nice holiday touring the republic.

As for your reasons for wanting to get back I could not agree more.

Thailand may be for some people thats fine but like you it's not for me.

Good Luck Ken

[slim]

Good luck to all.. but just a thought...WHY WOULD YOU WANT TO LIVE IN EUROPE?? after living in paradise??

Yes. Wouldn't you miss the corruption that pervades all levels of Thai society?

Wouldn't you miss the inconsiderate motorists and motorcyclists?

Surely you'd miss all the press and TV censorship and suppression of free speech? The blurring out of offensive images on TV like paintings of classical European nudes?

Wouldn't you miss the hoops you have to jump through just for the privilege of staying in this paradise?

You realize they dont have a man village broadcasting his thoughts at 120 decibels for an hour every morning in most of Europe?

I've been here 6 years and its only the weather (and money) that keeps me here.............that and a huge bucket of tolerance.

[7by7]

Please remember that this is a topic about obtaining an EEA family permit.

Please stick to the topic; if members want to discuss the pros and cons of living in Thailand as opposed to Europe, and vice versa, please do so elsewhere.

Thank you.

[gosamgo]

Please remember that this is a topic about obtaining an EEA family permit.

Please stick to the topic; if members want to discuss the pros and cons of living in Thailand as opposed to Europe, and vice versa, please do so elsewhere.

Thank you.

I agree whole heartedly with the sentiments of Conner!

I too am Irish and just over a year ago faced the same predicament and decided to take both my children to SE England (Kent) for their education. (I did look to Ireland first, but it rained there for 7 nights and 7 days)?

Both my children are Thai/Irish and have Irish Passports!

So after picking an area to live, came initially alone to organise suitable accommodation, schools etc and then arrived for the September start of term!

Before leaving Thailand I applied for a settlement Visa for my wife and here my experience differs from a lot of people, because I found the staff at the British Embassy to be both fair and helpful!

I think I owe my success to the fact that I first asked advice on this site, which more or less was, find out what they want and give it to them 100% , leave nothing to chance and make your strongest possible case!

This I did and after the usual TB Testing etc, obtained the settlement Visa within 14 days!

The Embassies main concern seemed to be that I had ample accommodation and funds, so believe me when I say we were just about OK in that department.

A few months later, I applied to the Bangkok Embassy again, but this time for a Settlement Visa for her Thai son

(17). To join the mother, and once again using the same successful format, only this time I was able to show payslips from a full time job my wife had started and also adequate accommodation etc, we were again 100% successful!

He is now doing English in the Kent College as well as a part time job in the local Shopping Mall and at weekends plays football for the local team.

We could not be happier with our decision and would like to thank the staff at the British Embassy and the guys on this forum for their help and support in what at that time seemed not only a most daunting task if not a downright impossible one!

So a 'BIG THANKS' and A Happy New Year to you all!

Two questions, if I may?

1. Am I entitled to get an EEA Family Permit for my wife and her 17 year old son who are presently on a settlement Visa here so we can visit my mother in Ireland or if we just want to hop on a Ferry to Belgium/France etc?

2. My wife's Great Grand Daughter (12) is in dire circumstances at present in Thailand and whom we'd dearly love to join us here, so is there any way other than adoption to make her dream come true?

Many Thanks, Sam.

[7by7]

I am a little confused, as none of your previous posts mention you are Irish, and you say your wife and step son are in the UK with settlement visas, not EEA family permits.

Be that as it may, to answer your questions:-

1) Your wife and step son cannot use an EEA family permit or a settlement visa issued by the UK to enter the Republic of Ireland for a visit; they will need to apply for a visit visa to Irish embassy in London.

Similarly, as neither the UK nor the RoI are fully signed up to the Schengen Agreement they will need to apply for a Schengen visa to enter other EEA states. They should make the application to the embassy of the country they wish to enter first or spend the most time in.

Once they have no restriction on their stay in the UK (PR if they entered with an EEA family permit, ILR if a UK settlement visa) then they can travel freely within the EEA without any visa.

2) Your wife's Great Grand Daughter (12)? Is this right? Or do you mean the daughter of your wife's niece that you refer to here?

Whichever, whether applying under the UK immigration rules or the EEA regulations, as she is not currently living with you you will need to show that the young lady is wholly dependant upon you with no other family to turn to in Thailand for support.

If you are considering adopting her, then read carefully through the adoption link posted above. Remember that adoption does not automatically grant her access to the UK, she will still need a visa of some sort and this could be refused if there was evidence to show that the adoption took place merely to facilitate her entry to the UK!

[gosamgo]

Many Thanks 7by7!

I never mentioned being Irish as it never applied to the situation at hand and the fact that I can also be considered British and have spent most of my life in England!

And yes, I was refering to the daughter of my Niece! I never went forward with any sort of application because I never figured I stood a reasonable chance of success!

But it is a shame, the people who are supposed to care for the childs welfare don't and her circumstances just keep getting worse! I feel quite powerless to do anything!

Thank you also for the info on EEA Regulations, I guess I was looking for an easier softer way!

Keep up the good work, Sam

[Connor2010]

Many Thanks 7by7!

I never mentioned being Irish as it never applied to the situation at hand and the fact that I can also be considered British and have spent most of my life in England!

And yes, I was refering to the daughter of my Niece! I never went forward with any sort of application because I never figured I stood a reasonable chance of success!

But it is a shame, the people who are supposed to care for the childs welfare don't and her circumstances just keep getting worse! I feel quite powerless to do anything!

Thank you also for the info on EEA Regulations, I guess I was looking for an easier softer way!

Keep up the good work, Sam

Hope it all works out for you and your extended family.

I have recently heard from a new friend who PM'd me that simply getting 'relatives' onto the Thai spouses house paper is normally enough to get them an EEA Family Permit; though I believe there is now a 6 month 'cooling off' period applied.

To the Brits who may be reading this: We are not trying to 'invade' your country with lots of semi-legal immigrants. I believe it is true to say that most Thais in the UK work hard, adjust quickly to the local ways and make a good contribution. True that most young women married to old men divorce after a few years [as their Passports arrive usually] but to be fair wouldn't you if the roles were reversed ? Those we have met [around 40 such people at last count] have all re-married, this time for love, and most have gone on to have British families and become good citizens of the UK.