Half-thai, Is It Possible To Apply For Citizenship/passport Once In Thailand?

[MaLaewThailand]

I am luk kreung background, half-Thai and half-US, age 21, born in the US. I know I'm eligible for a Thai citizenship and passport and I'm thinking of getting it done when settled with family in Thailand.

If or when we travel next, what my family might do for me is first get me a year-long visa. Once I'm in Thailand we'll then begin the next phase of getting Thai citizenship and passport.

I'm wondering if this process is possible once in LOS? I'd do it here in the US but we won't be able to spend the time and $ for traveling to the nearest consulate which is many states away so instead we'll mail in an app for a year visa to be received by mail and then complete getting my citizenship and passport in Thailand if that seems like a good idea.

I'm wondering if this is a good plan?

Edited February 9, 2010 by MaLaewThailand

[lopburi3]

You need to have your birth registered with the Thai Embassy (they make your Thai birth certificate) before anything can take place so that and passport should be obtained prior to travel to Thailand.

[nam-thip]

I know an English female who was born in Thailand during a period when her father worked at the British Embassy in Bangkok and his English wife lived here with him.

Being born in Thailand entitled her to a Thai passport and Thai ID which she obtained at the age of 25 without to much difficulty.

The next thing she did was to get a job in Phuket and that’s when her problems started.

The Thai’s who worked for the same company regarded her as farang and not Thai and constantly complained to the local labour office that more than once checked her out.

In the end the company dispenced with her services as they didn’t want the labour office people knocking on their door every other week and going through the books which was the Thai way of applying pressure on the company to force her out.

In the end she left Thailand stating Thai’s are racist and headed out to Australia where she still lives.

That was ten years ago so maybe things have changed or improved since then but having a Thai ID and Thai passport did her no favour’s with regard to working in Thailand.

At least she never had the worry of having to obtain a visa.

[Mario2008]

Yes, do it abroad not in Thailand. It will only take a few weeks to get a Thai birth certificate and passport. You can apply for both at the same time. In Thailand itself you cannot get a passport till you are registered on someones household book.

[tripplejjj]

I am in a similar boat you are in that I am a US citizen. My mother is Thai and I was born in Thailand. My Dad, a white farang, moved us to the US when I was about 9 years old. I never had a Thai passport.

At the age of 36, I came to Thailand on a tourist visa (30 days). Once here, I applied for a Non-Im visa on the basis that I am a Thai national returning to Thailand. (I had no clue then that it was possible.) The only evidence that I had to show was my Thai birth certificate. The certificate was just a piece of paper. It was falling apart. When I showed it to a Thai immigration officer in Bangkok, she looked at me and said that it was very old and accepted it. A short time later she stamped my passport with a one year Non-Im visa.

I had pursued the Thai passport but gave up for several reasons.

1. I had to provide proof that I lived in Thailand. I went from one office after another to trace back the family house records. I finally got to one with everyone's name on it except mine. It had my Dad, Mom, sister, and brother. The boss at the office was sympathetic because our records had not been in the computer so the clerks had to search it manually. To make a long story short, I had to do the leg work by trying to figure how and when I was dropped and reconstruct the history again. I did not have the patience.

2. I realized that if I became a Thai citizen, the US can't really help me any more because I am now a Thai citizen. I am subject to the law of Thailand. (Serving in the military, etc.)

3. I did not want to pay taxes to the Thai government. (This is the biggest reason.)

So, for me to get a Thai citizenship, without #1, I have to apply just like any other farang. In the eyes of the Thai Immigration, I am no longer a Thai citizen. Unlike the US, a birth from a Thai parent alone is not a right to a Thai citizenship. You need to provide proof that you did in fact lived in Thailand. (In my case.)

In your case, you were born in the US so there is no historical record of you ever living here in Thailand as a Thai citizen unless you have a Thai passport. In order to get a Thai passport, you need to be born in Thailand and have a house record to back it up.

You also don't have a Thai birth certificate. Unless things have changed, in order to get a Non-Im visa on the ground that you are a returning Thai national, you have to provide some other paper work trial linking you to a Thai parent. Having one of your parent with the official documentations that he/she is a Thai citizen and physically present when you apply for the Non-Im visa should do it. A DNA test should seal the deal too. (I will post the language later as I am not at my main computer.)

I hope that my posting is resourceful. Please, my all means, don't take my word as an absolute fact. Do your own research and let's compare notes.

Edited February 9, 2010 by tripplejjj

[samran]

To the OP:

Given you were born in the US, only the Thai embassy in Washington can issue you a Thai birth certificate. You won't be able to get one in Thailand as no local municipality has the jurisitiction to issue a BC to anyone outside their own boundries, let alone the country. As a child of a Thai citizen, you are automatically a Thai citizen, but require the documentation.

You should also apply for a Thai passport at the same time and should enter Thailand on this. Once in Thailand, you can go to the municipality where you live, with your Thai PP and birth certificate, where you'll be entered on the house registration and have an ID card issued.

Essentially no BC (issued in Washington) = no Thai passport.

I am in a similar boat you are in that I am a US citizen. My mother is Thai and I was born in Thailand. My Dad, a white farang, moved us to the US when I was about 9 years old. I never had a Thai passport.

At the age of 36, I came to Thailand on a tourist visa (30 days). Once here, I applied for a Non-Im visa on the basis that I am a Thai national returning to Thailand. (I had no clue then that it was possible.) The only evidence that I had to show was my Thai birth certificate. The certificate was just a piece of paper. It was falling apart. When I showed it to a Thai immigration officer in Bangkok, she looked at me and said that it was very old and accepted it. A short time later she stamped my passport with a one year Non-Im visa.

I had pursue the Thai passport but gave up for several reasons.

1. I had to provide proof that I lived in Thailand. I went from one office after another to trace back the family house records. I finally got to one with everyone's name on it except mine. It had my Dad, Mom, sister, and brother. The boss at the office was sympathetic because our records had not been in the computer so the clerks had to search it manually. To make a long story short, I had to do the leg work by trying to figure how and when I was dropped and reconstruct the history again. I did not have the patience.

2. I realized that if I became a Thai citizen, the US can't really help me any more because I am now a Thai citizen. I am subject to the law of Thailand. (Serving in the military, etc.)

3. I did not want to pay taxes. (This is the biggest reason.)

So, for me to get a Thai citizenship, without #1, I have to apply just like any other farang. In the eyes of the Thai Immigration, I am no longer a Thai citizen. Unlike the US, a birth from a Thai parent alone is not a right to a Thai citizenship. You need to provide proof that you did in fact lived in Thailand. (In my case.)

In your case, you were born in the US so there is no historical record of you ever living here in Thailand as a Thai citizen unless you have a Thai passport. In order to get a Thai passport, you need to be born in Thailand and have a house record to back it up.

You also don't have a Thai birth certificate. Unless things have changed, in order to get a Non-Im visa on the ground that you are a returning Thai national, you have to provide some other paper work trial linking you to a Thai parent. Having one of your parent with the official documentations that he/she is a Thai citizen and physically present when you apply for the Non-Im visa should do it. A DNA test should seal the deal too. (I will post the language later as I am not at my main computer.)

I hope that my posting is resourceful. Please, my all means, don't take my word as an absolute fact. Do your own research and let's compare notes.

I think you've been given the wrong information JJJ. Firstly, given you have a Thai birthcertificate, which states you are 'Thai', you are already a Thai citizen. Just because you don't have a Thai passport and are here on a US passport doesn't make it any less.

As you suggest, you will be subject to Thai law...but that goes for all people who live here, not just Thai's. As a result (in the case of Tax) if you are resident in Thailand more than 180 days per year, you are automatically deemed resident for Tax purposes. However, income earned overseas is not liable for tax in Thailand so long as it isn't bought into Thailand that same year. This applies for both Thais and non-Thai's.

As for military service, being over 30 you are autmatically exempt. I too was born overseas (Australia) but didn't apply for my ID card till I was 30 and 'safe'. Technically you still need to report to the conscription office, but they'll simply issue a letter and say you are too old. The max fine you'll have to pay for not reporting earlier is 400 baht (I paid 200 given I voluntarily turned up).

Hope this helps.

ed...also to get on the house book only requires someone to vouch for you. Entirely possible as my mum got back on the house book after being off it for nearly 35 years!

Edited February 9, 2010 by samran

[thaihome]

I know an English female who was born in Thailand during a period when her father worked at the British Embassy in Bangkok and his English wife lived here with him.

Being born in Thailand entitled her to a Thai passport and Thai ID which she obtained at the age of 25 without to much difficulty.

The next thing she did was to get a job in Phuket and that’s when her problems started.

The Thai’s who worked for the same company regarded her as farang and not Thai and constantly complained to the local labour office that more than once checked her out.

In the end the company dispenced with her services as they didn’t want the labour office people knocking on their door every other week and going through the books which was the Thai way of applying pressure on the company to force her out.

In the end she left Thailand stating Thai’s are racist and headed out to Australia where she still lives.

That was ten years ago so maybe things have changed or improved since then but having a Thai ID and Thai passport did her no favour’s with regard to working in Thailand.

At least she never had the worry of having to obtain a visa.

Being born in Thailand does not, and has not for a very long time, entitled you to Thai citizenship. At least one parent must be Thai.

TH

[tripplejjj]

I think you've been given the wrong information JJJ. Firstly, given you have a Thai birthcertificate, which states you are 'Thai', you are already a Thai citizen. Just because you don't have a Thai passport and are here on a US passport doesn't make it any less.

For me to get a Thai passport, I need 2 things:

1. A Thai birth certificate (I have).

2. A historical house record. My name was missing. I am certain that if I solved this mystery, I can get a Thai passport and a Thai citizenship.

As far as wrong information, I got the information from talking physically to a Thai immigration official at the Thai immigration office. She is a high ranking official too and not a clerk. In my quest for a passport and a Thai citizenship, I also physically spoke to the house (Amphur) office (head boss) and the Thai passport office (a clerk who process the passport). All were saying the same thing. To get a Thai passport, in my case, I need a Thai birth certificate and a house record (blue colored one and not the yellow). I even went as far as asking my Thai Mom to put my name on her blue house book but she, and everyone else (including government officials), said that I need a current blue house book to transfer my name off before they can transfer my name on her blue house book. So for me to make this happened, I need to do #2 as well.

As you suggest, you will be subject to Thai law...but that goes for all people who live here, not just Thai's. As a result (in the case of Tax) if you are resident in Thailand more than 180 days per year, you are automatically deemed resident for Tax purposes. However, income earned overseas is not liable for tax in Thailand so long as it isn't bought into Thailand that same year. This applies for both Thais and non-Thai's.

You are correct and I agree with you that all people who live in Thailand are subject to the law of the land.

As a US citizen, you have certain rights protecting you while in a foreign country such as gross injustice like being jailed without due process or inhumane treatment (torture). (I am not saying that Thai government sanctioned any injustices. However, I feeling that my position would be weakened if I am also a Thai citizen when dealing with injustices while I am in another foreign countries.

As far as taxes, I have no income. I have other assets that the Thai government has no reason to know because I am not a Thai citizen.

As for military service, being over 30 you are autmatically exempt. I too was born overseas (Australia) but didn't apply for my ID card till I was 30 and 'safe'. Technically you still need to report to the conscription office, but they'll simply issue a letter and say you are too old. The max fine you'll have to pay for not reporting earlier is 400 baht (I paid 200 given I voluntarily turned up).

This is a conflicting story. As I understand it, if you don't show up when invited to randomly pick a red/black card, then you could still be forced to serve in the military regardless of age. This is assuming that the military wants you to serve even at your current age. Either way, I was referring to a draft. My chances of getting drafted as a Thai citizen living in Thailand is extremely high. This would hamper my lifestyle.

ed...also to get on the house book only requires someone to vouch for you. Entirely possible as my mum got back on the house book after being off it for nearly 35 years!

In my case, my name needs to be on a blue house book before it can be transferred to another. I was only 9 years old then and the village elderly who could have vouched for me (if still alive) would not remember me.

PS: I am stating only what I know, what I did, and what actually happened to me.

@ samran,

Would you tell us if you are a Thai citizen and how did you get it if you are? I would like to compare notes so everyone here can benefit.

From what you are saying, it seems like you are a Thai citizen now. You were born in Australia and one of your biological parent (mum) is Thai. Do you have a Thai passport and what proofs did you used to show that you are a Thai citizen by birth from a Thai parent but born outside of Thailand?

Edited February 9, 2010 by tripplejjj

[tripplejjj]

FYI:

2.23 In the case of visiting family or return of a former Thai national or a person whose father or mother is or once was a Thai:

Permission will be granted for a period of not more than 1 year at a time.

(1) Proof of original Thai nationality or of his/her parent being a Thai or once a Thai.

[wasabi]

I know an English female who was born in Thailand during a period when her father worked at the British Embassy in Bangkok and his English wife lived here with him.

Being born in Thailand entitled her to a Thai passport and Thai ID which she obtained at the age of 25 without to much difficulty.

The next thing she did was to get a job in Phuket and that’s when her problems started.

The Thai’s who worked for the same company regarded her as farang and not Thai and constantly complained to the local labour office that more than once checked her out.

In the end the company dispenced with her services as they didn’t want the labour office people knocking on their door every other week and going through the books which was the Thai way of applying pressure on the company to force her out.

In the end she left Thailand stating Thai’s are racist and headed out to Australia where she still lives.

That was ten years ago so maybe things have changed or improved since then but having a Thai ID and Thai passport did her no favour’s with regard to working in Thailand.

At least she never had the worry of having to obtain a visa.

Being born in Thailand does not, and has not for a very long time, entitled you to Thai citizenship. At least one parent must be Thai.

TH

I agree. I believe someone something is not right with this story. I don't think the person ever was Thai if the facts stated in the post are true.

Edited February 9, 2010 by wasabi

[samran]

I know an English female who was born in Thailand during a period when her father worked at the British Embassy in Bangkok and his English wife lived here with him.

Being born in Thailand entitled her to a Thai passport and Thai ID which she obtained at the age of 25 without to much difficulty.

The next thing she did was to get a job in Phuket and that’s when her problems started.

The Thai’s who worked for the same company regarded her as farang and not Thai and constantly complained to the local labour office that more than once checked her out.

In the end the company dispenced with her services as they didn’t want the labour office people knocking on their door every other week and going through the books which was the Thai way of applying pressure on the company to force her out.

In the end she left Thailand stating Thai’s are racist and headed out to Australia where she still lives.

That was ten years ago so maybe things have changed or improved since then but having a Thai ID and Thai passport did her no favour’s with regard to working in Thailand.

At least she never had the worry of having to obtain a visa.

Being born in Thailand does not, and has not for a very long time, entitled you to Thai citizenship. At least one parent must be Thai.

TH

I agree. I believe someone something is not right with this story. I don't think the person ever was Thai if the facts stated in the post are true.

Long and the short of it is, if you were born on Thai soil before 1971, regardless of your parents nationality, you are automatically a Thai citizen. My personal experience is that holding a Thai passport is a gift if you want to live here. If someone doesn't want to pay me well or treat me well, then I'll go elsewhere. Sounds like a dodgy company more than anything else.

I know quite a few caucasians who hold thai passports due to being born here. They all get along fine.

Edited February 9, 2010 by samran

[samran]

As far as wrong information, I got the information from talking physically to a Thai immigration official at the Thai immigration office. She is a high ranking official too and not a clerk. In my quest for a passport and a Thai citizenship, I also physically spoke to the house (Amphur) office (head boss) and the Thai passport office (a clerk who process the passport). All were saying the same thing. To get a Thai passport, in my case, I need a Thai birth certificate and a house record (blue colored one and not the yellow). I even went as far as asking my Thai Mom to put my name on her blue house book but she, and everyone else (including government officials), said that I need a current blue house book to transfer my name off before they can transfer my name on her blue house book. So for me to make this happened, I need to do #2 as well.

You are right that to apply for a Thai passport, in Thailand, you need to have to have both a BC and be on a house register.

The issue with not on a central blue book is a problem my mother had as well. After 35 years of being off one, she had to go to the central registry where she was on the tabieen baan klang, and then get transferred off it. Only then, could she go back on our family’s house book and then get her ID card. I suspect you are on the central registry, as that is where people are generally moved to if they come off a blue book and have nowhere to go. It is also where children go on automatically when they are born, and before they are moved to a normal house registration.

I suggest you find out where to get access to the central registry. They deal often with people who are not on the house book.

This is a conflicting story. As I understand it, if you don't show up when invited to randomly pick a red/black card, then you could still be forced to serve in the military regardless of age. This is assuming that the military wants you to serve even at your current age. Either way, I was referring to a draft. My chances of getting drafted as a Thai citizen living in Thailand is extremely high. This would hamper my lifestyle.

You can’t be forced into it over the age of 30. I have the rules lying around somewhere, and have read them with a fine tooth comb before I even dared sort out my situation. At 30, you automatically get kicked off. There is an allowance also for people who can’t attend till the age of 30 in those rules, and given that you were out of the country during that time of conscription and could not physically attend, there will be no army sanction. As I said, I only paid a small fine for reporting late, and that was paid at the police station. (the receipt of the fine was needed to process the discharge papers).

Trust me on this one, I went through the process myself and everything happened according to the book.

You are correct and I agree with you that all people who live in Thailand are subject to the law of the land.

As a US citizen, you have certain rights protecting you while in a foreign country such as gross injustice like being jailed without due process or inhumane treatment (torture). (I am not saying that Thai government sanctioned any injustices. However, I feeling that my position would be weakened if I am also a Thai citizen when dealing with injustices while I am in another foreign countries.

To be frank, I think you are overestimating the power of a foreign citizenship in protecting you from these things. Also I think you overlook the fact that you are already a Thai citizen. In which case, the US has no power even to provide you with consular assistance in such a case, given you are on Thai soil.

samran,

Would you tell us if you are a Thai citizen and how did you get it if you are? I would like to compare notes so everyone here can benefit.

From what you are saying, it seems like you are a Thai citizen now. You were born in Australia and one of your biological parent (mum) is Thai. Do you have a Thai passport and what proofs did you used to show that you are a Thai citizen by birth from a Thai parent but born outside of Thailand?

I was born in Australia and my mum is a Thai/Australian dual national. Like many people, I received Thai citizenship in 1992 when the laws were changed, relaxing dual nationally. I was born in the 1970’s but my Thai BC was issued in Canberra and it was issued in 1992. That is when I got my first Thai passport as well.

In terms of proof, my mother always kept her old Thai ID, and herself being born in Thailand before 1971 made her automatically a Thai citizen. It was easy in that case to prove my eligibity for Thai citizenship.

Edited February 9, 2010 by samran

[bushke]

Is it possible to have a dual nationality as Thai.

I am a Farang but my son is half Thai i am moving in August with my family to Europe in July.

But i want to see that i keep his papers in order that if he chooses to return to Thailand when he is an adult that he has the choice and that he does not have to endure all the visa trouble to stay.

He is registered in a blue book, has a Thai birth certificate and i just applied for a Belgium passport for him is it a smart idea to apply for a Thai passport also?

[tripplejjj]

Is it possible to have a dual nationality as Thai.

I am a Farang but my son is half Thai i am moving in August with my family to Europe in July.

But i want to see that i keep his papers in order that if he chooses to return to Thailand when he is an adult that he has the choice and that he does not have to endure all the visa trouble to stay.

He is registered in a blue book, has a Thai birth certificate and i just applied for a Belgium passport for him is it a smart idea to apply for a Thai passport also?

Yes, I say that it is an excellent idea to get a Thai passport before your son leaves Thailand. Both of my sisters are Thai citizens and US citizens.(Thai by birth and US by naturalization.) When they enter and exit Thailand at the immigration points, they use Thai passports. When they enter and exit the US, they use the US passports. There is a believe by a few Thais that if you get a Thai citizenship, then you have to surrender your other citizenship/passport. This is strange to me in that I could just ask the US consulate to issue me another passport.

[tripplejjj]

To be frank, I think you are overestimating the power of a foreign citizenship in protecting you from these things. Also I think you overlook the fact that you are already a Thai citizen. In which case, the US has no power even to provide you with consular assistance in such a case, given you are on Thai soil.

I maybe overstating the power of a US citizenship but it happened time and time again. This was the most recent.

N. Korea Releases U.S. Journalists

I am NOT a Thai citizen given that I need a Non-Im visa to reside in Thailand. I have a US citizenship certificate and a US passport. I will exercise my rights when necessary. (If you don't know what is available, then you don't know what to ask for.) You basically argued my point perfectly given that the US has no power even to provide me with consular assistance if I am a Thai citizen living on Thai soil. By me being a Thai citizen has effectively weakened my US citizenship status. Not a good idea in my book.

You can’t be forced into it over the age of 30. I have the rules lying around somewhere, and have read them with a fine tooth comb before I even dared sort out my situation. At 30, you automatically get kicked off. There is an allowance also for people who can’t attend till the age of 30 in those rules, and given that you were out of the country during that time of conscription and could not physically attend, there will be no army sanction. As I said, I only paid a small fine for reporting late, and that was paid at the police station. (the receipt of the fine was needed to process the discharge papers).

Trust me on this one, I went through the process myself and everything happened according to the book.

I yielded to you on this matter as my source is unreliable. My mind is still on the draft (forced to serve in the military). The issue that plagues me is that one day I could be forced to fight on one side against another. An unlikely scenario but how do you justify it.

I was born in Australia and my mum is a Thai/Australian dual national. Like many people, I received Thai citizenship in 1992 when the laws were changed, relaxing dual nationally. I was born in the 1970’s but my Thai BC was issued in Canberra and it was issued in 1992. That is when I got my first Thai passport as well.

In terms of proof, my mother always kept her old Thai ID, and herself being born in Thailand before 1971 made her automatically a Thai citizen. It was easy in that case to prove my eligibity for Thai citizenship.

@samran,

I need help from you on this one. I was born in the 1960's in Thailand with a Thai birth certificate. I never had a Thai passport before moving to the US. My mom is currently living in Thailand and a Thai citizen. If I was not in Thailand, can I apply for my Thai passport with only my Thai birth certificate at a Thai Embassy?

Edited February 9, 2010 by tripplejjj

[samran]

Well, you are a Thai citizen who has travelled to Thailand on a US passport. Thats all. As a result, you are subject to Thailand immigration rules. But it doesn't change the fact you are born a Thai citizen by virtue of the fact that anyone born on Thai soil pre-1971 is a Thai citizen.

If you think you've got the connections to get old billy boy to your rescue each time you run amok, then fair play to you. Otherwise as I said, consular assistance is farily limited and there are a number of foreigners in Thai and Asian jails rotting away there just like everyone else who's embassy's do sweet FA to help them. The best they usually can do for you is give you a list of lawyers who you can hire.

Generally it is possible at an embassy to process a Thai passport for people who don't have a house registration and an ID card, given that there are many Thai's who have stayed overseas for years (or who were born there) and never had on. This was certainly the case for me. This is totally different in Thailand where you NEED to be on a house registry and have an ID card.

Best to call the embassy in DC in Washington first and see if they'll help you.

But coming back to Thailand you'll need to enter on a Thai passport, and you'll need to get an ID card once here, as is the law if you are residing here. Frankly, having the ID card makes like a hel_l of a lot easier. As per my last post, strongly suggest you go to the central tabieen baan people and get your address sorted. Will make everything easy after that.

[tripplejjj]

Thanks for the info Samran. I am extremely happy with just a US citizenship and will not pursue a Thai citizenship since it weakened my US citizenship status.

@MaLaewThailand,

If you get any lead as far as getting a Thai passport by means of being born of a Thai parent and overseas, then please keep all of us updated.

[bushke]

Yes, I say that it is an excellent idea to get a Thai passport before your son leaves Thailand. Both of my sisters are Thai citizens and US citizens.(Thai by birth and US by naturalization.) When they enter and exit Thailand at the immigration points, they use Thai passports. When they enter and exit the US, they use the US passports. There is a believe by a few Thais that if you get a Thai citizenship, then you have to surrender your other citizenship/passport. This is strange to me in that I could just ask the US consulate to issue me another passport.

If your sisters enter and exit Thailand and US whit different passports is this not an issue for immigration because one passport has only going out stamps and an other has only going is stamps?

When his passport is finished can i just renew it in the Thai embassy in Belgium or does it has to happen in Thailand?

I think that in Belgium it is allowed to have dual nationality. I believe in Germany you can have dual nationality till you are an adult and then you have to change to a single nationality (heard from a friend...).

But i guess this is not the case for Thai nationality

You can't be forced into it over the age of 30. I have the rules lying around somewhere, and have read them with a fine tooth comb before I even dared sort out my situation. At 30, you automatically get kicked off. There is an allowance also for people who can't attend till the age of 30 in those rules, and given that you were out of the country during that time of conscription and could not physically attend, there will be no army sanction. As I said, I only paid a small fine for reporting late, and that was paid at the police station. (the receipt of the fine was needed to process the discharge papers).

Trust me on this one, I went through the process myself and everything happened according to the book.

So if my son enters Thailand before he is 30 he will be automatically be eligible for the army and he has the obligation to report himself?

You are right that to apply for a Thai passport, in Thailand, you need to have to have both a BC and be on a house register.

The issue with not on a central blue book is a problem my mother had as well. After 35 years of being off one, she had to go to the central registry where she was on the tabieen baan klang, and then get transferred off it. Only then, could she go back on our family's house book and then get her ID card. I suspect you are on the central registry, as that is where people are generally moved to if they come off a blue book and have nowhere to go. It is also where children go on automatically when they are born, and before they are moved to a normal house registration.

I suggest you find out where to get access to the central registry. They deal often with people who are not on the house book.

My son is now registered on the blue book of the family of my wife. Does he stay there forever or does he get removed when he is not in Thailand for a certain amount of time?

[bina]

bushke,

it works like this:

my three kids have dual american/israeli citizenship. they leave israel on israeli passports,and enter america on american passports. to do it any other way is illegal. yes, sometimes immigration asks questions, in which case, u show the other passport and id card of your country u left, and vice versa.... when entering or leaving other countries, i suppose u have to just use one passport and both enter and exit with it, so that the stamps are matched up. i have two passports amrican and israeli. i went with husband (thai) to thailand. i used only israeli passport to leave here, and enter thailand. he left israel iwth thai passport but israeli id card, entered thailand, then came back using thai passport but entereing as israeli resident. the minute he will have an israeli passport, he will leave and enter here (israel) wit that passport, and enter and leave thailand with the thai passport.

its very simple. and as samran pointed out, most consulates and embassies dont help their passport holders too much (although ours seems to be a bit more active then some of the european ones, although this is starting to wear down due to miss use) so it doesnt matter on what passport u entered in, it matters to which country u are resident,and /or citizen. i havent been a resident of the states for 30 yrs, dont even have an address there really (my parents).

and my husband pays taxes here, so reports in to the thai labour office when he leaves thailand but doesn have to pay taxes there.

bina

israel

[kenk3z]

To assist the Original Poster, it might be interesting to know if he has to travel to the Thai Embassy in Washington DC to sort out a Thai Birth Certificate and Passport in person, or if this process can be handled with an application sent in by mail.

kenk3z

[nam-thip]

I know an English female who was born in Thailand during a period when her father worked at the British Embassy in Bangkok and his English wife lived here with him.

Being born in Thailand entitled her to a Thai passport and Thai ID which she obtained at the age of 25 without to much difficulty.

The next thing she did was to get a job in Phuket and that’s when her problems started.

The Thai’s who worked for the same company regarded her as farang and not Thai and constantly complained to the local labour office that more than once checked her out.

In the end the company dispenced with her services as they didn’t want the labour office people knocking on their door every other week and going through the books which was the Thai way of applying pressure on the company to force her out.

In the end she left Thailand stating Thai’s are racist and headed out to Australia where she still lives.

That was ten years ago so maybe things have changed or improved since then but having a Thai ID and Thai passport did her no favour’s with regard to working in Thailand.

At least she never had the worry of having to obtain a visa.

Being born in Thailand does not, and has not for a very long time, entitled you to Thai citizenship. At least one parent must be Thai.

TH

Obviously your information is incorrect about one parent having to be a Thai national as this lady was issued with a Thai ID etc.

At the time she was staying in a room at my guesthouse so i was aware of her application and followed it with interest.

[nam-thip]

I know an English female who was born in Thailand during a period when her father worked at the British Embassy in Bangkok and his English wife lived here with him.

Being born in Thailand entitled her to a Thai passport and Thai ID which she obtained at the age of 25 without to much difficulty.

The next thing she did was to get a job in Phuket and that’s when her problems started.

The Thai’s who worked for the same company regarded her as farang and not Thai and constantly complained to the local labour office that more than once checked her out.

In the end the company dispenced with her services as they didn’t want the labour office people knocking on their door every other week and going through the books which was the Thai way of applying pressure on the company to force her out.

In the end she left Thailand stating Thai’s are racist and headed out to Australia where she still lives.

That was ten years ago so maybe things have changed or improved since then but having a Thai ID and Thai passport did her no favour’s with regard to working in Thailand.

At least she never had the worry of having to obtain a visa.

Being born in Thailand does not, and has not for a very long time, entitled you to Thai citizenship. At least one parent must be Thai.

TH

I agree. I believe someone something is not right with this story. I don't think the person ever was Thai if the facts stated in the post are true.

"I don't think the person was ever Thai" is a strange statement.

She was born in Thailand and spent 24 of her 25 years in England.

What does that make her in your opinion?

I repeat...........................

The female was born on Thai soil to English parents in Bangkok which entitled her to apply for a Thai ID which she obtained without to much difficulty at the age of 25.

I followed her application with interest and saw the Thai ID with my own eyes.

She was in big demand and the biggest Dive company on Phuket employed her services as she was a qualified dive instructor thinking she would be an asset with holding a Thai ID and speaking excellent English etc, etc.

Unfortunatly the Thai's working for that same company hounded her out with numerous complaints to the Thai authorities, in this case it was the labour office.

[Mario2008]

In the past it was the case that you became a Thai citizen by virtue of being born in Thailand. That is no longer the case. Now you only have Thai citizenship by way of law if at least 1 of your parents is Thai.

[samran]

"I don't think the person was ever Thai" is a strange statement.

She was born in Thailand and spent 24 of her 25 years in England.

What does that make her in your opinion?

I repeat...........................

The female was born on Thai soil to English parents in Bangkok which entitled her to apply for a Thai ID which she obtained without to much difficulty at the age of 25.

I followed her application with interest and saw the Thai ID with my own eyes.

She was in big demand and the biggest Dive company on Phuket employed her services as she was a qualified dive instructor thinking she would be an asset with holding a Thai ID and speaking excellent English etc, etc.

Unfortunatly the Thai's working for that same company hounded her out with numerous complaints to the Thai authorities, in this case it was the labour office.

She would have been born pre-1971 to qualify as you claim. Plenty of Thai citizens of 100% European heritage around the traps. You don't notice them basically cause they are in plain sight and you'd never suspect. I know a couple of people like that, who have married other people of european descent, and their kids - all blond haired blue eyed - are Thai citizens as well.

Those born between 1971 and 1992 in Thailand without Thai parents have to prove that they have an ongoing link to Thailand to be able to claim Thai citizenship. This law was introduced in 2008, and there is a good story at the link below of an American girl who grew up here and finally obtained Thai nationality due to the law change:

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-5...777081626060578

As Mario has said to get Thai citizenship these days, you need at least one Thai parent, or two foreign parents who both have PR in Thailand.

In the case of this girl you mention, I think the company was to blame. I and many others have never found having Thai nationality a hinderence to anything. In fact, it is a major advantage. Sounds like jealous staff who had problems with her being paid more than them...and probably rightly so when you think about it.

[bushke]

bushke,

it works like this:

my three kids have dual american/israeli citizenship. they leave israel on israeli passports,and enter america on american passports. to do it any other way is illegal. yes, sometimes immigration asks questions, in which case, u show the other passport and id card of your country u left, and vice versa.... when entering or leaving other countries, i suppose u have to just use one passport and both enter and exit with it, so that the stamps are matched up. i have two passports amrican and israeli. i went with husband (thai) to thailand. i used only israeli passport to leave here, and enter thailand. he left israel iwth thai passport but israeli id card, entered thailand, then came back using thai passport but entereing as israeli resident. the minute he will have an israeli passport, he will leave and enter here (israel) wit that passport, and enter and leave thailand with the thai passport.

Thanks for explaining the procedure.

My son is only 2 years old so he still does not have an ID card not a Thai one or Belgian. This will also be the first time he leaves Thailand. Can this be an issue for immigration?

I still have some other questions if somebody could help me with some answers it would be much appreciated:

When his passport is finished can i just renew it in the Thai embassy in Belgium or does it has to happen in Thailand?

You can't be forced into it over the age of 30. I have the rules lying around somewhere, and have read them with a fine tooth comb before I even dared sort out my situation. At 30, you automatically get kicked off. There is an allowance also for people who can't attend till the age of 30 in those rules, and given that you were out of the country during that time of conscription and could not physically attend, there will be no army sanction. As I said, I only paid a small fine for reporting late, and that was paid at the police station. (the receipt of the fine was needed to process the discharge papers).

Trust me on this one, I went through the process myself and everything happened according to the book.

So if my son enters Thailand before he is 30 he will be automatically be eligible for the army and he has the obligation to report himself?

You are right that to apply for a Thai passport, in Thailand, you need to have to have both a BC and be on a house register.

The issue with not on a central blue book is a problem my mother had as well. After 35 years of being off one, she had to go to the central registry where she was on the tabieen baan klang, and then get transferred off it. Only then, could she go back on our family's house book and then get her ID card. I suspect you are on the central registry, as that is where people are generally moved to if they come off a blue book and have nowhere to go. It is also where children go on automatically when they are born, and before they are moved to a normal house registration.

I suggest you find out where to get access to the central registry. They deal often with people who are not on the house book.

My son is now registered on the blue book of the family of my wife. Does he stay there forever or does he get removed when he is not in Thailand for a certain amount of time?

[tripplejjj]

When his passport is finished can i just renew it in the Thai embassy in Belgium or does it has to happen in Thailand?

I don't know how is works, but my sister had to return to Thailand to renew her passport in 2007. (I think that is BS.)

My son is now registered on the blue book of the family of my wife. Does he stay there forever or does he get removed when he is not in Thailand for a certain amount of time?

Given enough time, your son's name will get drop off.

So if my son enters Thailand before he is 30 he will be automatically be eligible for the army and he has the obligation to report himself?

I appears to be the case. So do like everyone else, wait until 30.

What would happened if your son is currently serving the in Belgium military and he returns to Thailand for a vacation before the age of 30. And let say that the Thai military forces him to serve in the military. How to do sort out this mess? Just a thought.

[thaiphoon]

2 posts removed as poster has already raised seperate topic. Please do not post same questions in multiple threads.

[bina]

bushke cant help about the id card part as israel has all children on the id of the parent until age 16 when they get own id; its like blue book in thailand, a bit. for the states i havent a clue but have never ever had problems with my kids and dual nationality. when they travel to europe, they use the israeli passport s they are living here, and leaving israeli immigration.

i dont think u have too too much to worry aobut. thousands of people are going back and forth, and i know kids with 3 or more passports due to all kinds of nationality rules from different countries.

thai husband renews passport (third time!) from consulate in israel. to do his visa he has to have at least three years left on the passport so has to renew often. PIA really, as they send it to thailand, he is w/o passport with the visa in it... now has id card for temp. resident so less problematic...

cant help with the other stuff...bina

[bushke]

What would happened if your son is currently serving the in Belgium military and he returns to Thailand for a vacation before the age of 30. And let say that the Thai military forces him to serve in the military. How to do sort out this mess? Just a thought.

Thank's for the info.

I Belgium there is no longer military duty, they still have an army but only on voluntary basis so this should not be problem.

Who knows maybe in 20 Years there will also not be military duty in Thailand. We never knows what the future brings but i would like to keep his options open for when he is old enough to decide for him self.

Oh yes from how old can he be forced in the military? 18 years

[samran]

My son is only 2 years old so he still does not have an ID card not a Thai one or Belgian. This will also be the first time he leaves Thailand. Can this be an issue for immigration?

Not at all. He simply leaves Thailand on the Thai passport and enters the EU on the belgian one. Show both to the airline at check in, so they know your son has the right to enter the EU without a visa (via the belgian passport), and that he needs to fill in a departure card (for the Thai passport). Get stamped out on the Thai passport. Thai Immigration don't care about where you are going, so long as you have a passport and boarding card. Upon returning, get stamped in on the Thai passport. Have done this same thing many times with my children, now aged 4 and 1.

When his passport is finished can i just renew it in the Thai embassy in Belgium or does it has to happen in Thailand?

Renew it wherever is most convienient for you.

So if my son enters Thailand before he is 30 he will be automatically be eligible for the army and he has the obligation to report himself?

No. The rules state that should aim to report himself before 30. If he is unable to (eg cause he is not living here) then he can send someone with a power of atterney to represent him. If he can't get someone to send represent him, then not a problem either, however if it goes beyond 30, he must report himself at the first opportunity (at which point he will be officially released).

In short, as long as your son is living outside of Thailand during his conscription years (18 to 30) there is no problem. He can even visit Thailand as often as he wants for varying amounts of time.

My son is now registered on the blue book of the family of my wife. Does he stay there forever or does he get removed when he is not in Thailand for a certain amount of time?

Depends if he gets kicked off the house book of the owner of the house. If no one moves house, and everything stays the same, then he'll likely stay on. People only do 'fall off' if someone takes over the house and dis-allow the previous tenants to remain on it. In that case, if there is no alternative address to move to, your name gets moved to the central tabieen baan (house registry).

Edited February 12, 2010 by samran