Are Many Thais Rude Or Lacking Developed Nation's Common Sense

[meadish_sweetball]

Rudeness (also called impudence or effrontery) is the disrespect and failure to behave within the context of a society or a group of people's social laws or etiquette.These laws have already unspokenly been established as the essential boundaries of normally accepted behaviour. To be unable or unwilling to align one's behaviour with these laws known to the general population of what is socially acceptable is to be rude.

In Thailand, shockingly, Thai people's concept of 'rude' applies.

In my experience most Thais quickly adapt to the norms of their new society when moving abroad, unlike many Westerners here who seem to insist their value system is universal and expect the Thais to change for them.

I am not saying that some of the things that have been mentioned do not annoy me. They do. But those who refuse to see themselves from an outside perspective perhaps would be best off not travelling to cultures that have different conceptions of what is ok and not.

There are many things most Thais would consider rude that Westerners persist in doing while in Thailand.

[bina]

why do poeple insist on comparing everything to the whole world when the whole world from their perpective is the anglo world? havent any of u been to middle eastern countries? egypt? israel? greece?

my thai husband finds people here very rude: loud, bellierant, aggrssive pushy invasive of privacy (ask too many dam_n questions is how he put it), wanting to know what u think (he feels that is rude. only family/friends should want to know what he thinks) , people stop and talk to eachother from car to car at red lights, make converstation in the middle of the super market with trolleys blocking the way, eat and walk at the same time like a buffalo, talk while eating in general, the list is endless... that's his korat bannork thai male perspective.

no one here holds doors either unless they are anglos or russian. everyone pushes and shoves to get on and off busses, trains, and will fight over taxis...

sometimes when im in a different country i catch myself being that way also, and i find the anglo way rather 'pale' lacking in personality, colour, and zombie like... (too too polite)... ive gone native

bina

israel

[Slaps]

I used to ask my ex if she could walk a little bit faster, she would answer I have been walking this speed for 27 years but would stop while she was talking. I would say you don't have to stop walking when you talk you should be able to walk and talk. She would say it's considered rude to walk and talk.

Thailand has blondes??

Good point, what is the Thai equivalent?

But she used to tell me she was educated, she was

More tricks than a bag of monkeys

Miss her though, Like I would miss a hole in the head

[Boo]

The most annoying for me is the kids, going into a 7-11 the other day this kid of about 12 just walked straight in front of me as I was pushing the door open without a backwards glance or "krap" anything, he then proceeded to put his stuff in front of me at the counter, so I picked his snack & drink up, handed it back to him, said "wait your turn" in thai & paid for my stuff. He looked like his eyes were gonna pop out of his head & the girl behind the counter laughed & give me a big grin. I don't care what country you come from you wait your turn.

Thai kids imo are taught to be superficially polite, wai, krap/kha but the important social manners are totally ignored.

[bina]

seems taht globally kids are getting more aggressive and rude regardless of culture; good on u... if i did that here, i would have an angry violent parent on my case....

bina

[johndpoole]

No I wouldnt.. Thai machines only dispense 20 notes at a time.. What do you want me to do queue up 5 times..

Also theres the whole privacy, risk, counting it scene.. No I stay there until I have my cash thanks.

I have seen thais with a HUGE sheet of paper.. Doing a payroll payment (I assume) paying 10's of transactions via ATM.. Once I saw it just join another queue.

Ohh heres another.. At the bank.. Go sit at the 'manager' desks, to modify something, do a passbook, and even with the little 'take a number' system.. Thais come along and interrupt the process, or sit down next to you as tho your banking isnt a private issue, checking out your passbooks and balances etc.

Well certainly not as private but another nutty thing is how when you go to a resteraunt and the waiter hands you the menus and then just stands there waiting for the order. If I already knew what I wanted why bring a menu?!?!? Give me 5-minutes to talk in private with my GF and come back when you see us put the menus down or call you over or at least check back every few minutes .... but they just hover there with pad and pen in hand waiting to take your order.

This may be a personal thing of me by I like a little space and even when talking about what I want to eat, I don't want to do it with a stranger unless I have a question about a particular item but how can I have a question when he wants to take my freaking order before I open the menu. Most of the time they are cool if you say to come back but other times they take it to mean take one step back from the table and continue to stand there with pad and pen ready to take the order.

And what the hel_l is it that they cannot bring food at the same time. I would not mind (actually I would) if it was just a minute or two difference but I have been to fairly nice places where one person doesn't get served until somebody else is already done with their meal.

Oh and wait ... has anybody told anyone here that when you order a salad with your meal that the salad should come first?!?!?

Okay, now I think I have reached the point of bashing Thailand but I actually have a smile on my face. It is just so perplexing to me some of the things they do. I mean if my GF orders something that takes 10-minutes and I order something that takes 5-minutes then why not wait 5-minutes before starting my dish? Is this another Asian thing where it is not considered impolite to start eating in first in front of another hungry person?

[johndpoole]

why do poeple insist on comparing everything to the whole world when the whole world from their perpective is the anglo world? havent any of u been to middle eastern countries? egypt? israel? greece?

my thai husband finds people here very rude: loud, bellierant, aggrssive pushy invasive of privacy (ask too many dam_n questions is how he put it), wanting to know what u think (he feels that is rude. only family/friends should want to know what he thinks) , people stop and talk to eachother from car to car at red lights, make converstation in the middle of the super market with trolleys blocking the way, eat and walk at the same time like a buffalo, talk while eating in general, the list is endless... that's his korat bannork thai male perspective.

no one here holds doors either unless they are anglos or russian. everyone pushes and shoves to get on and off busses, trains, and will fight over taxis...

sometimes when im in a different country i catch myself being that way also, and i find the anglo way rather 'pale' lacking in personality, colour, and zombie like... (too too polite)... ive gone native

bina

israel

Good points or I should say info as I have never been to those countries but then again those "i believe" are real tourist destinations in terms of us Westerners. Go to Egypt and see the pyramids, look around and go back home. Go to Greece and see the ruins and look around and go back home. If your Jewish then you may want to immigrate to Israel but not sure too many non-Jews look to Israel as a vacation spot or potential place to live.

Except on the part of "what are you thinking", I am surprised by your husbands irritation because I find Thai's ask questions or make comments that would be considered extremely rude in Western society such as how much you make or how much something cost. I almost dropped dead when my GF and I were speaking to a girl who worked at a school and my GF brought up the bald patching on her head. I might have found it alright if she had explained her brother-in-law had the same problem and went to get treatments that helped but she basically just said something to the effect of you got a big problem and should go to the hospital to get it checked. Then they went on to have a conversation about her hair problems. We knew this girl all of 1-minute before my GF did this. A few months back my GF gained some weight (she was very thin) and we went to a friend of a friend'ss house and as soon as she opened the door asked if she was pregnant and then argued that she must be because she was fat .... this person was not a friend but somebody she had only met once before.

If Israel is worse than this then it certainly will not be on my list of countries to visit.

On the other hand, Americans are big on asking "what is wrong" or "what are you thinking about" but it has to be somebody you know and typically a friend. But talk of how much one makes or telling somebody they are fat is very uncool. In fact, if somebody looks like they gained weight I think most people respond by telling them they look good and asking if they lost weight or have been working out. So, I guess it is just not Thais who see lying as being okay in some situations.

And am curious, do Thais generally prefer not to talk while eating or do you mean talking with food in your mouth. I never thought of it before but now when I think about eating with my GF Thai family, it is usually pretty quiet around the table. The one thing however I do notice is they don't drink (water / soda) during their meal but typically drink after they eat or a little before. Maybe it is the spicy food by I always notice I will have two or three drinks during the course of the meal while nobody else touches their water.

[johndpoole]

Thanks everyone for sharing and letting me rant. Not having the best of days today and this has kept my mind of things. But would still love to hear from some Thais / Asians who don't hold the doors and such. I really want to know if it doesn't occur to them to do (don't buy it) or they just believe people need to fend for themselves or if they literally are just oblivious to people around them. The consensus here seems to be it is an Asian thing of not being taught or multitasking thinking but I just have to believe we are all aware of the do unto others as you want done to you philosophy and certainly they must notice when they are impeding or hurting other people with actions that in most cases are not even benefiting themselves. I almost have to wonder if it is a passive aggressive thing of letting out some frustration on others after being taught to hold their tongue their whole life when somebody wrongs them ... or maybe they really are not bothered themselves when they are in a hurry and people won't let them pass, are mauled when trying to enter/exit an elevator or a door knocks them in the face .... so maybe they assume others don't care either.

[johndpoole]

Rudeness (also called impudence or effrontery) is the disrespect and failure to behave within the context of a society or a group of people's social laws or etiquette.These laws have already unspokenly been established as the essential boundaries of normally accepted behaviour. To be unable or unwilling to align one's behaviour with these laws known to the general population of what is socially acceptable is to be rude.

In Thailand, shockingly, Thai people's concept of 'rude' applies.

In my experience most Thais quickly adapt to the norms of their new society when moving abroad, unlike many Westerners here who seem to insist their value system is universal and expect the Thais to change for them.

I am not saying that some of the things that have been mentioned do not annoy me. They do. But those who refuse to see themselves from an outside perspective perhaps would be best off not travelling to cultures that have different conceptions of what is ok and not.

There are many things most Thais would consider rude that Westerners persist in doing while in Thailand.

I agree 100% with you in terms of adapting and not expecting another culture to see things the way we do. Who is to say what is right or wrong. Isn't there some country where belching after a meal is a compliment? But nobody wants a door slammed in their face or somebody holding up dozens of people in que when there is no reason for it. Maybe I am wrong but I believe having consideration of your fellow man is not a cultural thing in this day and age. Thailand is not a 3rd world country and is a developing nation. Tell me if I am wrong but I am having a hard time differentiating between culture and just plain inconsideration of your fellow man ... again, I am not sure of any civilized civilization where the general populous believes it is okay to be treat others in ways you would not like others to treat you. The only exception would be if you saw other groups of people below or not worthy of consideration. So, am I to believe that Thais enjoy getting hit in the face with a spring loaded door or enjoy when the person on the elevator they want to get on presses the button to close the door before they can enter? I am just not aware of any culture that likes hardships put on them by others and therefore try to make life harder for others as a favor to them .... Is it maybe Asians are taught only to think of themselves and others are just unimportant unless they have something to offer them. I saw one poster mention these types of things don't happen in the work place ,,, which could be very telling as to what the reasons are when Thais or other Asians are dealing with the general public who they want/need nothing from.

If true then we are saying the Thai culture is one of complete selfishness and to only do good if you can get something out or it or believe it will help bad things from happening to you. Not too far from Budha teachings. We are all rude and inonsiderate at times but I have always wanted to believe that people try to do good because it is just the right thing to do... Then again in America you have a huge percentage of folks who do good because they believe it will get them in heaven and literally ask people what is the point of doing good if you don't believe in heaven or hel_l .... as if we were all born without a conscious and needed Moses to come down with the 10 Commandments to tell us it is wrong to kill, steal and screw your neighbors wife.

[a2396]

People in Thailand are generally quite polite, compared to what I experienced in Malaysia or even in my home country sometimes.

[johndpoole]

It is also worth considering that all cultures are rude and inconsiderate to some degree. With all the tourism to the US, it is amazing how many people get irritate when somebody comes to American and can not speak English ... meanwhile Americans do very little in the way of teaching Spanish to students even though there is a huge population of Mexicans in the US.

I can only imagine our reaction here of Thais looked at us with the same irritation we do Mexicans who cannot speak English in America or looked at us like lower class workers good for cleaning the pool or cutting the grass.

[canuckamuck]

It is the Asian personal bubble. If you aren't in their bubble you don't exist.

In Thailand the bubble is very small.

Westerners have bubbles too, but they can see outside their own bubble.

Edited March 16, 2010 by canuckamuck

[johndpoole]

People in Thailand are generally quite polite, compared to what I experienced in Malaysia or even in my home country sometimes.

I think this was my originally point. For such nice people the quirks mentioned in this thread make no sense because they can only be described as inconsiderate.

[FM505]

why do poeple insist on comparing everything to the whole world when the whole world from their perpective is the anglo world? havent any of u been to middle eastern countries? egypt? israel? greece?

my thai husband finds people here very rude: loud, bellierant, aggrssive pushy invasive of privacy (ask too many dam_n questions is how he put it), wanting to know what u think (he feels that is rude. only family/friends should want to know what he thinks) , people stop and talk to eachother from car to car at red lights, make converstation in the middle of the super market with trolleys blocking the way, eat and walk at the same time like a buffalo, talk while eating in general, the list is endless... that's his korat bannork thai male perspective.

no one here holds doors either unless they are anglos or russian. everyone pushes and shoves to get on and off busses, trains, and will fight over taxis...

sometimes when im in a different country i catch myself being that way also, and i find the anglo way rather 'pale' lacking in personality, colour, and zombie like... (too too polite)... ive gone native

bina

israel

Are you confusing personal discipline with indifference to others...?

While we may seem pale or colorless to you... we find civilized behavior in the routine of daily life preferable to the alternatives. When we tire of this then it may be time to go out for beers or take in a ball game... or work overtime to stay ahead of the tax man. We're not 'too polite' in the business or sporting arenas... we love to compete.

We know how to manage our lives just fine... while respecting the boundaries of our neighbors. We look out for each other... we call it common courtesy. That's big heart stuff... takes some doin'... but its well worth the effort. Causes a more peaceful surrounding... better for people in general... all that kind of crap.

"Being a civilized human being is dam_n hard work." A. Bartlett Giamatti

[buffcoat]

I am afraid that if you believe western standards are higher in regard to pushing onto trains/buses and queing etc you are sadly mistaken.

I work in London and all the negative behaviours mentioned in this thread are an everyday event here.

The main culprits are Europeans but locals and Americans can be just as bad. It is not all of them of course but enough to make it a nuisance.

I find that Bangkok is far more polite than London in general.

[Edmond]

Culture my ass, i don't see any difference to some Thais and some Westerners, some are polite with manners and some not.

Our direct neighbours are saints, nice as pie, clean living hard working professionals, whereas a little further away they are animals, brain dead thick simpletons.

It's the same the world over.

[johndpoole]

I am afraid that if you believe western standards are higher in regard to pushing onto trains/buses and queing etc you are sadly mistaken.

I work in London and all the negative behaviours mentioned in this thread are an everyday event here.

The main culprits are Europeans but locals and Americans can be just as bad. It is not all of them of course but enough to make it a nuisance.

I find that Bangkok is far more polite than London in general.

Never used the London subway but I can tell you in NYC the general practice of entering a train or elevator is to allow the others to get off first .. Why? Because there is NO benefit to doing it the other way and in fact causes more problems for everyone if you don't. Also, last time I was in NY they didn't require arrows on the ground where to stand (not in front of doors) or signs explaining to wait for passengers to depart before entering or for that matter looped videos explaining the same on Video monitors in the station. Sounds like London may need some educating too to avoid injuries, confusion and just general politeness lessons.

Yes, of course there a rude and stupid people in every culture but for the most part, even in NYC, people realize if you follow simple common sense approach to things then everything works out well for everyone and things get done faster as it actually takes more time at the station if people try to enter and exit at the same time because there are always those who stand aside and wait for the kaos to end before getting on or off.

[bina]

Western society such as how much you make or how much something cost

so do people here, but that is different than asking u what u are thinking or feeling, which here is a daily occurence also. u can get in a taxi and someon next to you will strike up a conversation not about the weather but much more personal;are u married, how many kids, why dont u hae kids, do u believe in god, dont u miss your relatives over seas? its endless.

Are you confusing personal discipline with indifference to others...?

absolutely not. i just find that in america everything seems sort of bland and quiet compared to here where i am now. my daughter works with american kdis and she gets culture shock everytime she leaves them to deal with our kids (she's on continuous duty for three weeks of intensive housemothering to teenage americans. these are good kids, not problem kids. the funniest thing with them is when they ask for , say, an ice coffee, they request permission for one (can i have an ice cofffee please) , they dont 'demand' one (i want an ice coffee please) , from the waiters where i work. ive corrected them cause if they ask that way in town, they will never get served. on the other hand, theya re loud and noisy and disregard elderly people on busses and other areas...the list is endless)

they don't drink (water / soda) during their meal but typically drink after they eat

maybe a chinese thing ? also, in issaan, bringing someone water, giving someone a drink of water is more then jsut that, it is a way of showing respect and love.... dont remember where and why i remember this but that is a cultural fact.

yes, anglos have a difficult time here and whinge a lot at the top of their lungs on busses thinking we dont udnerstand english, til i turn around in my american accent and put them in their place... tourists get on busses and bash us in the face with their backpacks whearas a soldier with his heavy gun and backpack and dead tired will go thru convoluted twists to avoid smashing passengers in the face...

ettiguete and cultural niceties are funny things.

you order a salad with your meal that the salad should come first

says who? my italian brother in law demands his salad after the heavy main course, that is how his area of italy eats salad. thais traditionally dont eat salad, all their food is on the table at the same time. hy should they know that in america salads come first?

people here also dont wait to everyone starts eating, however, no one will sit at a table with someone else eating and not order ata least a cup of tea or coffee. its considered rude to watch someone sit and eat with out also eating.

americans also shocked my first husband by not offerring food when we went to visit in the states. here, u cant get away with not eating cake, sunflowers, coffee, whatever. and u have to eat . its rude to not eat. u dont have to finish it like iwth the beduins (husband hates that, having to eat all and then drink strong horrible coffee) but u have to at least eat some. special diets/etc means the host will start to run around trying to make something u will eat available.

yeah, tourists dont come here for the niceties of civilization thats for sure... and most complain inspite of numerous campaigns to make us nicer people. i often felt that i was too aggressive even in bangkok; i was always expecting that i would have to argue or fight to get something taken care of. but i found people pleasant, low key, polite, quiet, and not too aggressive. guess that must give u a clue as to how it is here, huh? not for the faint hearted. swiss clock types dont do well here.

this whole subject has come up in so many threads here.

btw, i got yelled at by hubby for going up stairs on the wrong side , somehwere in bangkok. left side/right side... cant remember. got lots of dirty looks but no one yelled at me. here a dozen people would stop me, yell, lecture about going on the wrong side of an escalator..

bina

israel

[Tonto21]

Personal favorite, reach the top of the escalator and stop there to have a conversation or make a phone call, while other people are crashing into them from behind. It's baffling.

Ooooh yes! I call this action; “The zombie”

This one with a slight variation, instead of an escalator, it’s a stair well. Basically the same, bottom or top step, step off and stand still………and then some!

My personnel favorites, in this category, I call this one; “The big day out” this is where a family of 3 or more walk shoulder to shoulder, around every store as slow as is humanly possible and in addition have a sixth sense (or rear view mirrors) to drift left or right should a passing maneuver be attempted, all attempts to pass that fail are general met with a vacant look! (Wheels going round….. Just no hamster in control) Then……. Business as usual!

[Yimmy]

You think too much OP.

Don't think.

Problem solved.

[johndpoole]

......

btw, i got yelled at by hubby for going up stairs on the wrong side , somehwere in bangkok. left side/right side... cant remember. got lots of dirty looks but no one yelled at me. here a dozen people would stop me, yell, lecture about going on the wrong side of an escalator..

bina

israel

Thanks for taking the time to respond.... very educational for me. The few Americans I have known who went to stay in Israel came back because they got scared when bombs went off in their vicinity. I had no idea that they were so inquisitive towards others. In fact I always got the feeling they were more private. I am with your husband, it would make me nuts. I am a very open person but enjoy my privacy and space especially in non-social settings. But regardless of where I am, if somebody starts off with asking me questions about religion or similar things I simply act as I didn't hear them and if they ask again I move away ... regardless of how rude I may come across. Just not somebody I need to know.

On the subject of walking in BKK that is another issue of mine. They drive on the left here but in the very few places where they have pedestrian directions, like in stairs, it seems the norm is to walk on the right. But then when you get in open areas like sidewalk, there is no rule to follow and only the guarantee that the side you move to will almost certainly be the side the oncoming people move to.

America is certainly full of problems but knowing to walk to the right when there are crowds is not one of them. Again, just another thing that boggles my mind here.

[bravia69]

Next time, when you see such people, just approach them and ask them to show you their ID card to confirm that always those ugly acts are all done by Thais, let them know that what they did are not correct, don't just keep quiet standing there and assume they will appreaciate your kindness.

[tigerfish]

The biggest nuicance for me is why do thais like to have music blaring at ear splitting decibels.

so that old people like yourself, can hear it

[Hawk]

When in Rome do as the Romans do, run them over.

[Jim's_a_Thai_Fox]

When reading the majority of these posts, my first and strongest feeling is that the (western) people experiencing these 'problems' continue to live with a western mindset and, unless they change this, will always be frustrated/exasperated/unhappy/pee'd off living in Thailand...

[FM505]

You think too much OP.

Don't think.

Problem solved.

Hahahaha... you mean problem ignored... not the same as solved... in reality.

[FM505]

Next time, when you see such people, just approach them and ask them to show you their ID card to confirm that always those ugly acts are all done by Thais, let them know that what they did are not correct, don't just keep quiet standing there and assume they will appreaciate your kindness.

A stunning opener to the forum... exeedingly vapid bit of dialog...

[tigerfish]

why do poeple insist on comparing everything to the whole world when the whole world from their perpective is the anglo world? havent any of u been to middle eastern countries? egypt? israel? greece?

my thai husband finds people here very rude: loud, bellierant, aggrssive pushy invasive of privacy (ask too many dam_n questions is how he put it), wanting to know what u think (he feels that is rude. only family/friends should want to know what he thinks) , people stop and talk to eachother from car to car at red lights, make converstation in the middle of the super market with trolleys blocking the way, eat and walk at the same time like a buffalo, talk while eating in general, the list is endless... that's his korat bannork thai male perspective.

no one here holds doors either unless they are anglos or russian. everyone pushes and shoves to get on and off busses, trains, and will fight over taxis...

sometimes when im in a different country i catch myself being that way also, and i find the anglo way rather 'pale' lacking in personality, colour, and zombie like... (too too polite)... ive gone native

bina

israel

ah the middle east/ israel. this being a country, that on religious holidays, even when one of their own soldiers has been hurt in some kind of conflict. the natives will thrown stones at the ambulance taking him to hosipital, because it goes against their religious beliefs to do such a thing.

kind of on a level par with thailand. ambulance siren blairing out all over the place trying to get through a ton of traffic,and everyone just sits their. no movement, maybe a slight movement of the right hand moving up towards their nose, too see if theres anything worth having a dig at. or to busy on the phone or eating something, to put the gear shift in drive and move out the way.

give me the anglo way of pale and lacking in personalitiy, colour and zombie like (too too polite) any day. against rude, obnoxious impolite, self centrered, pushy blinkered individuals.

like my mother used to say, a please, thankyou and good manners will never cost you anything.

doe it cost you anything, do you lose face over being polite, holding doors open, saying please and thankyou, giving up your seat to an elderly person on the bts. no i dont think so!

the only people who look stupid and lose the respect from their fellow human beings, are the ones that dont aply these kind cival courtesies to other people.

Edited March 16, 2010 by tigerfish

[doggie888888]

I do wish all the very well-mannered, polite, cultured, logical, educated, multi-tasking foreigners who have contributed to this thread would go forth into Thai society and show the locals how they lack a "developed nation's common sense" and how not to be rude...because quite frankly when I go out on my daily business in Pattaya, all I see are very rude, impolite, impatient and downright silly foreigners whose manners (and brains) were apparently left at the airport when they arrived. There are exceptions of course.

I assume most foreigners are merely trying to "do as the Romans do" in trying to outdo the locals in the rudeness stakes...but sometimes I wonder: why are they adding to the problem when they ought to know better?

So all you gentlemanly guys, where do you hang out? Obviously not Pattaya!

[johndpoole]

I do wish all the very well-mannered, polite, cultured, logical, educated, multi-tasking foreigners who have contributed to this thread would go forth into Thai society and show the locals how they lack a "developed nation's common sense" and how not to be rude...because quite frankly when I go out on my daily business in Pattaya, all I see are very rude, impolite, impatient and downright silly foreigners whose manners (and brains) were apparently left at the airport when they arrived. There are exceptions of course.

I assume most foreigners are merely trying to "do as the Romans do" in trying to outdo the locals in the rudeness stakes...but sometimes I wonder: why are they adding to the problem when they ought to know better?

So all you gentlemanly guys, where do you hang out? Obviously not Pattaya!

I think it goes without saying that those generally living in Pattya are not the cream pf the crop regardess of where the hail from.