Bangkok Residents Become Hostages To Red-Shirt Anarchy

[Tod Daniels]

Alright we need to get some of the FACTS straight. ..

FIRST: Arisaman was NOT holding a BOMB, as it clearly says right on the side that it is a CS gas canister. It is designed to be thrown by hand and NOT launched via other means of propulsion; those have a completely different configuration.

SECOND; both the handle and locking pin are in place... Now who in their right mind would throw a tear gas canister into an unruly crowd without pulling the pin FIRST ? (Doesn’t that defeat the purpose of throwing a gas canister in the first place as in all likelihood it’d have the pin pulled and be thrown back at you. )

Isn't it more likely and possibly plausible that the scenario was; hasty retreat the Police made when the gates were breached (seeing as they are unarmed) that someone dropped it, rather than threw it into the crowd.

I also find it strange that the breaking news says; "Core Leaders denounced the storming of Government House”, yet it was lead by Arisaman Pongruengrong. Isn't he one of the core people? Just how many core leaders are there and don’t they ever talk to one another?

Another breaking news first;

THE NATION: Two men in red with tear gas found at the Parliament in the sea of red. Reds leader Arisaman was quick to pronounce them 'fake".

OMG more fake reds (that is a great fall back excuse anytime the red mob runs amok).

I can’t keep track of all the fake colors out there now; fake redz, fake pinkz, fake yellowz . ..

[10027586]

A government which cannot command the police or military is no government.

Couldn't agree more, though it seems that governments of any colour cannot command either the police or military, so maybe it's time to disband both? I honestly don't know how any government can effectively run a country it can't tax and with no ability to enforce law.

[brahmburgers]

According to red TV a red shirt threw some "bombs" but it was a fake red shirt. I think they are back outside now but Arisamon seems agitated and they have taken guns (M16s) from security. God knows what is going on

Is Arisamon's cell phone connection to Thaksin still holding up?

[Jingthing]

Remember Pattaya Asean summit red shirt anarchist takeover. That day, Abhisit looked finished. Today, Abhisit is looking very bad, he calls for a crackdown and nothing, things are getting worse. Abhisit recovered dramatically from Pattaya Asean against all the pundits yakking. Don't count him out yet, but yes, be worried.

[Insight]

Well......

Why not let them have government house? Wouldn't that be a far better rally point for a POLITICAL protest than, say, a random intersection somewhere downtown? And then the yellows took that spot, too, so in this case i'm fully with the reds - political protests should take place at locations where politics is made, not on busy roads.

I went to the Rajprasong site again this morning (had to go to MBK again and it's on the way), they let me ride my motorbike right to the front of the stage. There were probably around 200-300 red shirts there, if that many. A VERY small crowd. And not even in one crowd but scattered around in smaller groups, seeking shelter in the shade of trees and pedestrian bridges. Got pictures to prove it.

Best regards.....

Thanh

There were a fair number there yesterday - a couple of thousand. I guess they're all spread out today, both real and fake.

[ThailandLovr]

A government which cannot command the police or military is no government.

Couldn't agree more, though it seems that governments of any colour cannot command either the police or military, so maybe it's time to disband both? I honestly don't know how any government can effectively run a country it can't tax and with no ability to enforce law.

...herein lies the problem 1002. As long as the Army has a mind of it's own I can't see Thailand's system of government ever being stable. (18 coups since 1932?????)!

[bubba]

This just appeared in the Nation. If true, it's starting to sound like it might soon be coup time...

Apiwan tells his fellow red shirts military stop support govt

Deputy House Speaker Apiwan Wiriyachai went up on the mobile sound truck of the red-shirt protesters in front of Parliament and told them the military was about to withdraw support for the government.

Calling the protesters his "fellow red shirts", Apiwan pleaded them not break into Parliament.

He said he received the phone call from the secretary of the defence minister that the military had stopped supporting the government.

Apiwan told the protesters that they were about to achieve the victory.

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/home/Apiwa...s-30126588.html

[Guest]

The army have said they have no reason to use force, and rumours that they may withdraw support for Mark.

[ChiangMaiFun]

"City residents become hostages to red-shirt anarchy"

don't forget, the same could be said about the "yellow-shirt anarchy" its mutual or reciprocal.

You have to start coming something other than

"yellow shirts did the same" "True democracy" and "double standards"

Your arguements have been proven baseless over and over on this forum

The red leaders are cowards ... staying in sweet hotels while the mass sleep in the street

Your leaders are inciting violence ..... on and on and on .....

While you sleep in the streets, Taksin is sitting by the pool relaxing ...

You reap what you sow ... the end is near (I hope)

The point is yes - the yellow shirts did the same - and the Police/Army did NOTHING don't you get it? the difference in response?

[Old Man River]

Arisman and his thugs (not the majority of the red shirt) have invaded the parliament . What the hel_l is the governement waiting for to arrest Arisman and charge him ?

If the reds really want to score big- THEY will detain ARisman and hand him over to the police.

That is a good idea. My thought has been that they are offering Arismon up so that he can become the Martyr they are so desperately looking for. Since Arismon doesn't think rationally and acts impulsively, he has little long term value to the Red movement. One way or another, for the Reds now is a good time to make use of him.

[jsjohninbkk]

It is easy to know when Apiwan and other Reds are lying ... their lips are moving.

[ChiangMaiFun]

Remember Pattaya Asean summit red shirt anarchist takeover. That day, Abhisit looked finished. Today, Abhisit is looking very bad, he calls for a crackdown and nothing, things are getting worse. Abhisit recovered dramatically from Pattaya Asean against all the pundits yakking. Don't count him out yet, but yes, be worried.

he should stop dithering around - he doesn't have the support... elections will follow soon I would have thought

[anotherpeter]

This just appeared in the Nation. If true, it's starting to sound like it might soon be coup time...

Apiwan tells his fellow red shirts military stop support govt

Deputy House Speaker Apiwan Wiriyachai went up on the mobile sound truck of the red-shirt protesters in front of Parliament and told them the military was about to withdraw support for the government.

Calling the protesters his "fellow red shirts", Apiwan pleaded them not break into Parliament.

He said he received the phone call from the secretary of the defence minister that the military had stopped supporting the government.

Apiwan told the protesters that they were about to achieve the victory.

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/home/Apiwa...s-30126588.html

If Abhisit has the support of the army, then there is no reason for a coup.

If Abhisit doesn't have the support of the army, the reason for that might be that Abhisit doesn't want to stop the protests, but the army does.

Either case is not good for the reds.

Maybe the army should take over, start a process to review the consitition with all parties involved in discussions with a referendum vote by the people. Then they can organise new elections.

That should take about 9 months ....

Edited April 7, 2010 by anotherpeter

[ChiangMaiFun]

The army have said they have no reason to use force, and rumours that they may withdraw support for Mark.

any PM who issues an order and it is dis-obeyed by Army/Police is not longer a functioning PM - some posters don't like it but answer is elections

[jsjohninbkk]

Thailand's history over the last few years could easily be turned into a great Hollwood comedy film.

[Tod Daniels]

Quick NEWS FLASH for the 'thick' :

Deputy House Speaker Apiwan Wiriyachai, IS a Puea Thai MP for Nonthaburi, so he's firmly in the Opposition camp and hardly a reliable "white horse souce" err 'white house source'.

[10027586]

The army have said they have no reason to use force, and rumours that they may withdraw support for Mark.

any PM who issues an order and it is dis-obeyed by Army/Police is not longer a functioning PM - some posters don't like it but answer is elections

Trouble is the army and police haven't obeyed anyone for quite some time now. On that basis, elections won't solve the problem. Until there is substantial reform of the police and the army there will be no functioning government in Thailand.

[jsjohninbkk]

The army have said they have no reason to use force, and rumours that they may withdraw support for Mark.

any PM who issues an order and it is dis-obeyed by Army/Police is not longer a functioning PM - some posters don't like it but answer is elections

Actually in any other democratic nation this would lead to charges against those refusing to carry out orders including the possibility of death for treason when it comes to the Arny. There are lawful ways to disobey commands and legal steps that can be taken as some soldiers did in the US during the Gulf War(s).

[ChiangMaiFun]

Apologies if the Thai is incorrect, google translate isn't great, and neither are my photoshop skills! Btw seriously this shit's just getting ridiculous now. There is no government it seems.

A government which cannot command the police or military is no government.

it's just a question of time... all these posters who thought the reds would achieve nothing look rather silly at the moment - I remember, going back some weeks, everyone saying - there will be no election and Abhisit is a great leader etc. can't see the governement lasting as it has no support

[hammered]

Abhisit looks like Samak and Somchai before him. Any press conference after the meeting at the 11th infantry will be revealing

[ChiangMaiFun]

The army have said they have no reason to use force, and rumours that they may withdraw support for Mark.

any PM who issues an order and it is dis-obeyed by Army/Police is not longer a functioning PM - some posters don't like it but answer is elections

Actually in any other democratic nation this would lead to charges against those refusing to carry out orders including the possibility of death for treason when it comes to the Arny. There are lawful ways to disobey commands and legal steps that can be taken as some soldiers did in the US during the Gulf War(s).

I actually agree but... TIT

[10027586]

Quick NEWS FLASH for the 'thick' :

Deputy House Speaker Apiwan Wiriyachai, IS a Puea Thai MP for Nonthaburi, so he's firmly in the Opposition camp and hardly a reliable "white horse souce" err 'white house source'.

True, and the reds are a bunch of lying bastards, but with the army doing sweet fa it's distinctly possible that he's right.

[LevelHead]

I am hoping Annupong delivers the fatal "no confidence" vote against the coalition, and that will lead to them being foung guilty under the EC rules and disbanded.

Then with new elections Thailand can, at last, move forward.

The Yellows got their way with TRT and PPP disbanded, and if the Reds can see the Democrats disbanded and new elections then its pretty fair, and everyone can move forward in peace.

Come on Annupong, "no confidence and withdraw support" from the coalition, its the way forward to an end of games.

[way2muchcoffee]

The army have said they have no reason to use force, and rumours that they may withdraw support for Mark.

any PM who issues an order and it is dis-obeyed by Army/Police is not longer a functioning PM - some posters don't like it but answer is elections

Oh please. You'll use any angle you can to try to throw some dirt on the government. If the military cracks down on protesters you'll call for house dissolution. If the military and government decide to sit and wait you'll call for house dissolution. In all cases you'll call for house dissolution. So what exactly is your point? Oh yeah - house dissolution under all circumstances.

Well, it exactly that hardline approach, without consideration of the simple fact that the MPs in the coalition represent greater than 50% of the population, is exactly what is the source or these demonstrations. An pure unwillingness to discuss rationally and reach an agreement for the good of Thailand.

And most importantly, neither you nor I nor anyone here is privy to the high level conversations taking place on all sides.

Edited April 7, 2010 by way2muchcoffee

[ChiangMaiFun]

Quick NEWS FLASH for the 'thick' :

Deputy House Speaker Apiwan Wiriyachai, IS a Puea Thai MP for Nonthaburi, so he's firmly in the Opposition camp and hardly a reliable "white horse souce" err 'white house source'.

From one of the 'thick' (people who don't agree with you I presume) - he is deputy house speaker whichever way you look at it

[jsjohninbkk]

The army have said they have no reason to use force, and rumours that they may withdraw support for Mark.

any PM who issues an order and it is dis-obeyed by Army/Police is not longer a functioning PM - some posters don't like it but answer is elections

Trouble is the army and police haven't obeyed anyone for quite some time now. On that basis, elections won't solve the problem. Until there is substantial reform of the police and the army there will be no functioning government in Thailand.

Until Thailand hold people accountable for their illegal actions ... nothing will ever change here. It needs to start with Police being given a decent salary and then jailing police for taking bribes. Once the police are cleaned up everything would begin to change. The PM also needs to be able to appoint there own military commanders ... not the other way around.

[valerian]

The only thing reasonable for Abhisit to do is to resign.

Not because of demands by the red shirts, but because hope for democracy is gone.

Any goverment, without the police or military in their toolbox, is helpless against thugs with opposing views.

Thailand is not ready for Abhisit.

So let the fools run the country.

Edited April 7, 2010 by valerian

[LevelHead]

This just appeared in the Nation. If true, it's starting to sound like it might soon be coup time...

Apiwan tells his fellow red shirts military stop support govt

Deputy House Speaker Apiwan Wiriyachai went up on the mobile sound truck of the red-shirt protesters in front of Parliament and told them the military was about to withdraw support for the government.

Calling the protesters his "fellow red shirts", Apiwan pleaded them not break into Parliament.

He said he received the phone call from the secretary of the defence minister that the military had stopped supporting the government.

Apiwan told the protesters that they were about to achieve the victory.

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/home/Apiwa...s-30126588.html

If Abhisit has the support of the army, then there is no reason for a coup.

If Abhisit doesn't have the support of the army, the reason for that might be that Abhisit doesn't want to stop the protests, but the army does.

Either case is not good for the reds.

Maybe the army should take over, start a process to review the consitition with all parties involved in discussions with a referendum vote by the people. Then they can organise new elections.

That should take about 9 months ....

If it takes a coup to get rid of the unelected Democrat/BJT coalition, which will then see the way to fair elections I am sure the Reds will be fine with that.

They want to stop any possible attempt by the Democrats/BJT lining their pockets with the peoples money in the next 9 months ready to bribe their way to election wins, so a coup would be fine for the Reds as a process in order to get Democracy returned I do beleive.

Sometimes its takes one step back to move two forward.

Edited April 7, 2010 by LevelHead

[ChiangMaiFun]

The army have said they have no reason to use force, and rumours that they may withdraw support for Mark.

any PM who issues an order and it is dis-obeyed by Army/Police is not longer a functioning PM - some posters don't like it but answer is elections

Trouble is the army and police haven't obeyed anyone for quite some time now. On that basis, elections won't solve the problem. Until there is substantial reform of the police and the army there will be no functioning government in Thailand.

Until Thailand hold people accountable for their illegal actions ... nothing will ever change here. It needs to start with Police being given a decent salary and then jailing police for taking bribes. Once the police are cleaned up everything would begin to change. The PM also needs to be able to appoint there own military commanders ... not the other way around.

I agree... but it is decades off - get used to it - this is Wild West country

[bubba]

I am hoping Annupong delivers the fatal "no confidence" vote against the coalition, and that will lead to them being foung guilty under the EC rules and disbanded.

Then with new elections Thailand can, at last, move forward.

The Yellows got their way with TRT and PPP disbanded, and if the Reds can see the Democrats disbanded and new elections then its pretty fair, and everyone can move forward in peace.

Come on Annupong, "no confidence and withdraw support" from the coalition, its the way forward to an end of games.

Supporting the military to make a move in order to remove a constitutionally legal government?

Sounds vaguely familiar to the "double standards" I keep hearing about. So what makes it justifiable this time around?