Thai Forces Use Tear Gas, Water Cannon Against Protesters

[animatic]

The only person that has lost is Abhisit.

- He banned the TV station PTV, yet it's back up against his will.

- He issued nearly 30 arrest warrants for red shirt leaders, yet they're seen on national television chatting and even laughing with high ranking police offers.

Talk about losing face.

I agree with rainman here. The PR battle over violence has now been replaced by the PR battle over who is in charge of the country. All around me are ordinary Thai people who supported Abhisit's compromising attitude last week but now look at him contemptuously as either lacking courage or lacking power. Don't underestimate the significance of what happened today.

Unless he pulls off a masterstroke real soon, I fear the Reds have won this battle. I fear more what happens after that.

That is my take on it as well.

I still don't see Thaksin coming back in though. He remains a threat to those that many in the military would give their lives for.

Well there was no great show of competence today for sure...

It's an ill wind that blows CS back in your face.

Still it's not over till the fat lady sings, and she's still in the dressing room.

We heard much the same talk last Songkran if I remember correctly.

Push came to shove and the shoving back was completed.

Certainly a red win from the street bodes very ill for the future of ALL.

It's hard to believe the army could ultimately sit still for that.

[4223rhodes]

I'll just give you one now. Censorship. It was not good under Thaksin. But even Supinya, sued by Thaksin, has intimated that the censorship of the coup-makers and their puppet Abhisit is far more dangerous than that of Thaksin. Economically and politically the country was headed in a far better direction under Thaksin than under the Sondhi-Abhisit administrations. Perhaps not a good direction, but far better nonetheless. I am sensitive to your criticism of Abhisit for making no attempts at prosecuting anyone for any of the drug killings, not one. Of course, you could hold the Thaksin administration accountable as well, but Abhisit was in the perfect position to tackle this but sadly lacked the balls. Surprise, surprise!

Oops. I made the silly mistake that you actually might have a reasoned opinion. Instead, I see you are just here to spread disinformation, by totally misrepresenting my views and making a ridiculuous statement that Abhisit had any possible chance of pursuing Thaksin's hired killers from 2003.

Ok, troll away. I'll save my breath for those that actually want to show why they support thaksin with arguments. You only discredit further the very view you are trying to support.

Bye bye

You are proving to be a mad man. Read my post. I'm not supporting Thaksin. I'm criticizing Thaksin for his censorship issues and the drug killings. I'm only saying that Supinya and others believe the post-coup right-wing royalists to be far worse.

Edited April 9, 2010 by 4223rhodes

[NCFC]

No, regardless of it's truth it is akin to yelling fire

in a crowded room filled with people wearing straw clothes.

Surely some innocents will be injured.

Sure it's truth if there is a fire, but it's also not allowed.

Huh? It's not allowed to yell "fire" when it's the truth?

Mate, I think you've lost it, lol.

[landofthefree]

Farang should be worried in Thailand but our too bush with chang to care.

Their nations tell them to leave Thailand but they stay.

If the beer stops flowing and the nightlife ends, look for a mass Exodus. it will be better than when the sea parted for Charlton Heston in The Ten Commandments.

Unlike the Jews, the Farang here will be drinking beer on their way out.

Cambodia and other places will have new money soon.

Are revolutions dangerous?

If they turn violent they are.

Will the Police protect Farangs?

HAAAAAA HAAAAAA--that was a funny question.

Good luck all.

your last post made no sense to me............. I can't be drunk enough................ pass me another chang please

[sotsira]

I don't know. Perhaps you could ask the families of the 3000+ people murdered by Thaksin without charge, arrest or conviction in his so-called 'war on drugs'.

The "War on Drugs" has nothing to do with this although i have no sympathy for Drug dealers, Dead or Alive!

For you to mention that as an answer to my previous statement shows that your right, you don't know!

the fact that you think 3000 people murdered without charge, arrest or conviction were drug dealers says a lot about what you think about what it means to live in a free, fair and democratic society. It has EVERYTHING to do with this.

"Free, fair and democratic society", you said it and i agree, thats exactly what the reds are asking for.

What happenned 5 or 6 years ago has NOTHING to do with the current political situation present,

you must be deluded if you so strongly think otherwise.

[dobadoy]

I'll just give you one now. Censorship. It was not good under Thaksin. But even Supinya, sued by Thaksin, has intimated that the censorship of the coup-makers and their puppet Abhisit is far more dangerous than that of Thaksin. Economically and politically the country was headed in a far better direction under Thaksin than under the Sondhi-Abhisit administrations. Perhaps not a good direction, but far better nonetheless. I am sensitive to your criticism of Abhisit for making no attempts at prosecuting anyone for any of the drug killings, not one. Of course, you could hold the Thaksin administration accountable as well, but Abhisit was in the perfect position to tackle this but sadly lacked the balls. Surprise, surprise!

Oops. I made the silly mistake that you actually might have a reasoned opinion. Instead, I see you are just here to spread disinformation, by totally misrepresenting my views and making a ridiculuous statement that Abhisit had any possible chance of pursuing Thaksin's hired killers from 2003.

Ok, troll away. I'll save my breath for those that actually want to show why they support thaksin with arguments. You only discredit further the very view you are trying to support.

Bye bye

You are proving to be a mad man. Read my post. I'm not supporting Thaksin. I'm criticizing Thaksin for his censorship issues and the drug killings. I'm only saying that Supinya and others believe the post-coup right-wing royalists to be far worse.

Read your OWN post...

[animatic]

You're dodging my question. If the red shirt protesters are so violent as you've been claiming for the past days, why is it that Abhisit is putting innocement WOMEN in the front line and potentially in harm's way?

Now you are just being sexist.

No points.

Besides women in combat gear are backed up by men in combat gear.

And I have seen some mean ass Thai ladies beating on their men successfully.

Come on more straws to grasp at, till you're drip dry.

Okay, let's take your point of view then that the women are no less vulnerable than the men against supposed violent crowds. Why are you criticizing the monks then? After all, the police are armed, and the monks are not.

Whatever way you spin it, you know you don't make sense and you don't have a point.

The red leaders are cynically and cowardly using Monks as human shields.

Any monk that would allow that is not a very straight Buddhist path monk....

Or do you think all monks are all good, and none are a little bent?

In any case I wasn't criticizing the monks, and you could read that properly.

Back to the red leaders tactic, which I WAS criticizing;

Might as well be babies and nursing mothers.

Except police women would move them as easily.

[dobadoy]

I don't know. Perhaps you could ask the families of the 3000+ people murdered by Thaksin without charge, arrest or conviction in his so-called 'war on drugs'.

The "War on Drugs" has nothing to do with this although i have no sympathy for Drug dealers, Dead or Alive!

For you to mention that as an answer to my previous statement shows that your right, you don't know!

the fact that you think 3000 people murdered without charge, arrest or conviction were drug dealers says a lot about what you think about what it means to live in a free, fair and democratic society. It has EVERYTHING to do with this.

"Free, fair and democratic society", you said it and i agree, thats exactly what the reds are asking for.

What happenned 5 or 6 years ago has NOTHING to do with the current political situation present,

you must be deluded if you so strongly think otherwise.

ad hominem's are no substitute for a reasoned argument, buddy. You think the present is divorced from the past? You think Jatuporn, Weng and Veera are going to call 'free and fair elections', not - by any chance - use the same tactics that they've been using throughout the last month, of intimidation and veiled threats of violence against anyone that disagrees with them? Show me the evidence.

Edited April 9, 2010 by dobadoy

[animatic]

No, regardless of it's truth it is akin to yelling fire

in a crowded room filled with people wearing straw clothes.

Surely some innocents will be injured.

Sure it's truth if there is a fire, but it's also not allowed.

Huh? It's not allowed to yell "fire" when it's the truth?

Mate, I think you've lost it, lol.

Sorry to disabuse you, but that is the law in several states.

EVEN if there is a real fire, you must use different words to clear the room.

Yelling fire in theaters does cause panic and lives are lost in the mad rush to escape.

I didn't write the laws.

[LuckyFive8888]

state of emergency should not be used against the cornerstone of the democratic process - independent mass media.

Many now would be convinced, in thailand and abroad, that thailand really is an authoritarian regime state, ruled by the army and police, with disregard to laws

there will only be babarism in asia if there are no authoritarian government, army, and police.

[landofthefree]

I am watching Thai TV at the moment with Abhsit droning on,next to him are 3 really bored looking people it looks just like the Muppet show!!!!!! Go for it Kermit!

[whiterussian]

state of emergency should not be used against the cornerstone of the democratic process - independent mass media.

Many now would be convinced, in thailand and abroad, that thailand really is an authoritarian regime state, ruled by the army and police, with disregard to laws

there will only be babarism in asia if there are no authoritarian government, army, and police.

I agree, but in this order:

1 government

1.5 judiciary

2 police

3 army

not: army,judiciary,government,police,koon thai,koon kek,koon farang, then finally koon laos.

Really 'Thai's' should be number one of course. But as the majority of all sensible farang know, the uneducated masses dont need to bypass the middlemen... after all you need to speak Chinese to export!

Edited April 9, 2010 by whiterussian

[4223rhodes]

I am watching Thai TV at the moment with Abhsit droning on,next to him are 3 really bored looking people it looks just like the Muppet show!!!!!! Go for it Kermit!

They've even got the yellow tie tight around his neck!

[Sunderland]

I am watching Thai TV at the moment with Abhsit droning on,next to him are 3 really bored looking people it looks just like the Muppet show!!!!!! Go for it Kermit!

That is a pretty spot on assessment.

There were 12 people including Abhisit the other day ... only Abhisit yesterday ... 4 of them today ... can't make up their mind whether to support him!

[animatic]

ad hominem's are no substitute for a reasoned argument, buddy. You think the present is divorced from the past? You think Jatuporn, Weng and Veera are going to call 'free and fair elections', not - by any chance - use the same tactics that they've been using throughout the last month, of intimidation and veiled threats of violence against anyone that disagrees with them? Show me the evidence.

It isn't just the last month, but these guys have been long term Thaksin operatives since he was in office.

These tactics are years and years old, all over Issan and this is just a more in your face, in Bangkok usage.

[saintofsilence]

I am watching Thai TV at the moment with Abhsit droning on,next to him are 3 really bored looking people it looks just like the Muppet show!!!!!! Go for it Kermit!

Are you sure your old enough to watch it ?

[KCM]

From Wikipedia:

Oliver Wendall Holmes wrote: The most stringent protection of free speech would not protect a man falsely shouting fire in a theater and causing a panic. [...] The question in every case is whether the words used are used in such circumstances and are of such a nature as to create a clear and present danger that they will bring about the substantive evils that Congress has a right to prevent. Holmes wrote of falsely shouting fire, because, of course, if there were a fire in a crowded theater, one may rightly indeed shout "Fire!"; one may, depending on the law in operation, even be obliged to. Falsely shouting "Fire!" in a crowded theater, i.e. shouting "Fire!" when one believes there to be no fire in order to cause panic, was interpreted not to be protected by the First Amendment.

No, regardless of it's truth it is akin to yelling fire

in a crowded room filled with people wearing straw clothes.

Surely some innocents will be injured.

Sure it's truth if there is a fire, but it's also not allowed.

Huh? It's not allowed to yell "fire" when it's the truth?

Mate, I think you've lost it, lol.

Sorry to disabuse you, but that is the law in several states.

EVEN if there is a real fire, you must use different words to clear the room.

Yelling fire in theaters does cause panic and lives are lost in the mad rush to escape.

I didn't write the laws.

[rainman]

With the billions that Abhisit has borrowed from the World Bank, I'm surprised they haven't yet made his daily TV pool speeches Pay-Per-View.

[bubba]

Here is an interesting cover that appeared on the most recent copy of "Red Power" magazine today.

In English, the caption says The Russian Revolution - The mob toppling the royal figure early in 20th century - History will not forgive us if we do not seize the power at this moment

[Sunderland]

I am watching Thai TV at the moment with Abhsit droning on,next to him are 3 really bored looking people it looks just like the Muppet show!!!!!! Go for it Kermit!

Are you sure your old enough to watch it ?

Check your spelling before you mock others ...

[Sunderland]

THE NATION: Thaksin speaking but Red TV signal's gone!!!!!

Yet more bull <deleted> from the Nation editor. The signal has not been interrupted in the last hour and is still on. I think he needs to pay his Internet bill.

[Old Man River]

The only person that has lost is Abhisit.

- He banned the TV station PTV, yet it's back up against his will.

- He issued nearly 30 arrest warrants for red shirt leaders, yet they're seen on national television chatting and even laughing with high ranking police offers.

Talk about losing face.

I agree with rainman here. The PR battle over violence has now been replaced by the PR battle over who is in charge of the country. All around me are ordinary Thai people who supported Abhisit's compromising attitude last week but now look at him contemptuously as either lacking courage or lacking power. Don't underestimate the significance of what happened today.

Unless he pulls off a masterstroke real soon, I fear the Reds have won this battle. I fear more what happens after that.

That is my take on it as well.

I still don't see Thaksin coming back in though. He remains a threat to those that many in the military would give their lives for.

My fear is not so much Thaksin coming back - I agree that is highly unlikely. My fear is that there are at least as many people of a different coloured shirt persuasion - backed by their own army of toughs, lest anyone forget - that will not stand idly by even if Abhisit does concede defeat.

House dissolution will be the start of bigger troubles, not the resolution of the current ones. That's why, IMHO, Anupong and whoever else is pulling strings really need to get a grip and stop pussy footing around.

Maybe the fix is in, and they've already agreed what's going to happen next, but I'd bet you the few satangs left in my Bangkok Bank bank account that if Abhisit dissolves the house you will see a military coup sooner rather than later. It could be pave the way to peace or not, depending on whether the military keep power long enough to put in place the mechanisms for a proper election. If not (and reasonable unlikely), we are heading for harder times down the road.

Right now, all bets are off. Given there is a split in the military, a coup would be difficult (some loyal to Thaksin and some not).

If there is a dissolution there would be a caretaker government put in place until there are new elections. Of course, there is the constant talk of a national unity government, but who would be the PM? It would have to be an elected MP or the constitution would have to be amended, which would take time. If an elected MP, there would be a big fight as to which party that person would come from.

In other words, a lot of questions and very few answers.

[animatic]

From Wikipedia:

Oliver Wendall Holmes wrote: The most stringent protection of free speech would not protect a man falsely shouting fire in a theater and causing a panic. [...] The question in every case is whether the words used are used in such circumstances and are of such a nature as to create a clear and present danger that they will bring about the substantive evils that Congress has a right to prevent. Holmes wrote of falsely shouting fire, because, of course, if there were a fire in a crowded theater, one may rightly indeed shout "Fire!"; one may, depending on the law in operation, even be obliged to. Falsely shouting "Fire!" in a crowded theater, i.e. shouting "Fire!" when one believes there to be no fire in order to cause panic, was interpreted not to be protected by the First Amendment.

No, regardless of it's truth it is akin to yelling fire

in a crowded room filled with people wearing straw clothes.

Surely some innocents will be injured.

Sure it's truth if there is a fire, but it's also not allowed.

Huh? It's not allowed to yell "fire" when it's the truth?

Mate, I think you've lost it, lol.

Sorry to disabuse you, but that is the law in several states.

EVEN if there is a real fire, you must use different words to clear the room.

Yelling fire in theaters does cause panic and lives are lost in the mad rush to escape.

I didn't write the laws.

Oh I know of Holmes, my cousin lives in his old home.

He was a great lawmaker and writer, but didn't write every law in every state.

[NCFC]

I hate to teach people to suck eggs, but please look backwards.

Sondthi, the coup leader who granted himself immunity and said he would never enter politics, who now is in a political party............. (tells you everything)

Sondthi said that he was scared Thaksin would invoke the SOE, as once the SOE is invoked the top brass can be replaced for failing to follow orders.

I think we are seeing a massive fight between Annupong and Abhisit/Suthep.

In order to appear to follow orders its why the Army put up a weak fight, fired some tear gas and then fell back at Thaicom.

Annupong has followed orders so Abhisit and Suthep cannot replace him.

Its all a game but it tells you loud and clear that the invoking of the SOE was a game by Suthep/Abhisit to get rid of Annupong.

We now have the Reds against the Democrats and the Army against the Democrats.

There could well be a coup soon, or more likely Annupong, the man said to be behind getting the small parties to go with the Democrats, will tonight get the small parties to join PTP and get the Democrats kicked out of office.

You are absolutely spot on with this post.

So many posters are looking at events from a western perspective and think that the battle lines are drawn between the government on one side and the reds on the other. In fact the dynamics have changed and the real situation is what will Annupong do next?

Will he continue to support the government - Thaicomm suggests he may not - or will he get the leaders of the smaller parties together - as he did in order to put Abhisit in power and instrut them to shift their support to the opposition?

Whatever he decides it will be based on what he thinks is the best outcome for the army.

[rogerdee123]

With the billions that Abhisit has borrowed from the World Bank, I'm surprised they haven't yet made his daily TV pool speeches Pay-Per-View.

fantasyland

[landofthefree]

I am watching Thai TV at the moment with Abhsit droning on,next to him are 3 really bored looking people it looks just like the Muppet show!!!!!! Go for it Kermit!

Are you sure your old enough to watch it ?

Check your spelling before you mock others ...

Thanks for pointing out the 'your you,re' S.P. from the previous poster Sunderland, I knew the fact that Abhisit is a Newcastle supporter wouldn't go down well with you. My S.P. was 'Abhisit' although we don't need to learn how to spell his name now because I think very soon he will be yesterdays news and noone will remember the man who did nothing!!! I, like many, don't mind if he goes just please dont let him going bring Thaksin back

[Jerrytheyoung]

Right now, all bets are off. Given there is a split in the military, a coup would be difficult (some loyal to Thaksin and some not).

If there is a dissolution there would be a caretaker government put in place until there are new elections. Of course, there is the constant talk of a national unity government, but who would be the PM? It would have to be an elected MP or the constitution would have to be amended, which would take time. If an elected MP, there would be a big fight as to which party that person would come from.

In other words, a lot of questions and very few answers.

Interview of BANHARM this last wednesday;

There is a meeting planned next week between 4 ex PMs ANAND, BANHARM, CHAVALIT. CHUAN LEEKPAI.

(IMHO, there will be an agreement between those "Elephants", Goverment of National Unity), Banharm has given the name of Chuan Leekpai as next PM"

[hyperdimension]

They should announce that Songkran will start a little early this year and go all out with water cannons and extremely loud Thai music.

[landofthefree]

They should announce that Songkran will start a little early this year and go all out with water cannons and extremely loud Thai music.

I bought my 4 (water) guns today. Bring it on asap and lets remember Thais for what they are, great people that love sonook mak mar, low cow and not thinking too much!

[dobadoy]

More fine words from Abhisit about upholding the law and restoring peace and harmony for all Thais.

Question is: are the people who's job it is to uphold the law listening?