Dad Can't Speak Thai, The Kids Can't Speak English

[KarenBravo]

very obvious why the gentleman is here - for the bars and bar-girls.

I'm curious as to how you came to that conclusion?

The OP stated:

"Not only that, he could not speak a word of Thai except for a few words he learned in bars (look lorn, bag wan, sewer'a etc)."

So? That just proves he's been in bars.

Maybe that was the reason he first came, but, many grew out of it and settled down.

You seem very judgemental, which is what I found offensive about the first post.

Too many people constructing a complete house with only two house bricks.

[wallhigh]

I'm always surprised at the number of gentlemen who claim not to "interact with that sort of person" while sporting a lady who clearly has that sort of background and is totally ignorant of their past.

1,2 pretty much true for every man over 40 living out here

3,4,5 who hasn't at one time or another (and what's wrong with that)

A pretty sure test of the lady is to take her into "that sort of bar" (the sort that has bar fines), if she goes in you know her past, and so does everyone else (who has a little bit of common sense) who sees her enter. Don't tell the buffalo holding onto her though, he already knows she is a "good girl".

Anyway back on topic, not everyone wants to learn Thai and we didn't identify that any of the children with the man were actually his, for all we know he hooked up with the girl and the children last week and was nice enought to give them food and shelter for a while.

i know, so many guys get it so wrong here... i feel really bad for some of my friends who have been so horribly cheated

here by their poor choice of women.

thank god i met a girl who never drinks and never smoked, hates bars and that style of nightlife, just like me.

there are many good girls here it just takes effort to find them and get to know them, many take the easy way out, fall in love with the first bar girl they meet.

Edited April 15, 2010 by wallhigh

[Livinginexile]

Alfie, surely giving your children the best start in life whether they live in Thailand or abroad is the number one priority for a parent!

Where have i said " giving your children the best start in life " is not the number one priorty for a parent ?.

and surely out of pure choice for the children when they grow up then they absolutely need to speak, read and write English fluently!

Where have i said that they don't need to speak ,read and write English ?

I think it's a lazy mans way out to say something like "Oh they live in Thailand so why should they learn English"?

Where I work, English speaking professionals get paid far more than non English speakers.

Where have i said this ?

For your info, my daughter (13 years old) can read, write and speak English but it is not at the expense of her Thai education.

If you had taken the time to read my post correctly i was talking about the childs primary language I.E their no1 language.

"I think it depends entirely on where you see them living and working after they have left school in Thailand.

If they are going onto further education at a university in England or the States or working abroad then English must be there primary language, if they going to stay in Thailand then Thai must be there primary language as it is the language of this country.

A lot of foreigners seem obsessed with there children being fluent in English at the expense of there Thai without having any plans for there future."

1) You implied it here. "A lot of foreigners seem obsessed with there children being fluent in English at the expense of there Thai without having any plans for there future". In other words you said it is not important your child learns English if she lives in Thailand.

2) Again you implied it here. "if they going to stay in Thailand then Thai must be there primary language as it is the language of this country".

3) Again here. "A lot of foreigners seem obsessed with there children being fluent in English at the expense of there Thai"

Edited April 15, 2010 by Livinginexile

[hawthorne]

Maybe you just caught him in a grumpy mood from be soaked and constantly bothered by the events. On learning the language it seems he would have no choice but pick it up. To hear the language in your own house for a few hours a day and not learn anything? He will learn it eventually.

[wallhigh]

So? That just proves he's been in bars.

Maybe that was the reason he first came, but, many grew out of it and settled down.

You seem very judgemental, which is what I found offensive about the first post.

Too many people constructing a complete house with only two house bricks.

IMO...

- once a pot head, always a pot head

- you can take the girl out of the bar, but you cant take the bar out of the girl

- once a bar man, always a bar man

once again, IMO, you can have you own, and I hope you do.

[sarahsbloke]

If they are going onto further education at a university in England or the States or working abroad then English must be there primary language, if they going to stay in Thailand then Thai must be there primary language as it is the language of this country.

did anyone else think this post was funny ....... or am I just warped and twisted?

[Sisaketmike]

I never mentioned him talking thai, he is English, why would he communicate with his kids in Thai when he can't even talk to them in English. Hardly a sweeping statement.

I don’t get your point. What do you think are foreigners doing to teach Thai kids who can’t speak a word in English? This guy could teach ‘his’ kids English and he would be able to catch some Thai as well.

[Sisaketmike]

If they are going onto further education at a university in England or the States or working abroad then English must be there primary language, if they going to stay in Thailand then Thai must be there primary language as it is the language of this country.

did anyone else think this post was funny ....... or am I just warped and twisted?

It’s hard to understand what the guy’s trying to say. Even if they’re going to stay in Thailand, it’s very important to learn English as well.

[DP25]

No, it requires 5 years consistent work permit/visa to apply for a residency permit which will cost a minimum of 100K and a shed-load of paperwork, including photos of your house and workplace. After 5 years of having a residency permit you can apply for citizenship which costs about 6K (to apply), you have to be able to converse in Thai, sing the National Anthem, and sing the King's Anthem. After which your application becomes "discretionary"...

I'm not 100% of the facts, correct me if I'm wrong.

The difficult part of that is learning Thai. The rest comes if you're planning on living here long term. Some people who've lived here longer than required can barely even order fried rice. Guy talked about in the OP has been involved with his wife and child for at least 8 years and can not even hold a basic conversation with his own child. His problem would not be paper work.

[Garry9999]

Hopefully this poor bastard, that had the misfortune to meet LIE, has never heard of ThaiVisa and is peacefully going about his life in total ignorance of the crap that's being thrown at him here!

Edited April 15, 2010 by Garry9999

[culicine]

My wife are now the guardians of a boy who is almost 7. We have only had him since last summer. His mother died and his dad is not interested. I speak Thai, but I have a long ways to go. All day long there are things I want to say to him, explain, teach, I really want to be a real dad. But I continually find there are words missing and there are so many moments that pass where I don't say a thing. My wife is good and she translates a lot for me, but I desperately want to improve my Thai and I can't think of a greater motivation to do so. I am working on it all the time.

But in the meantime I am really impressed with the English he has picked up and there times now when we can communicate in English, and that is very encouraging. I am glad he is a sharp kid, it makes this whole thing a lot easier.

I can' imagine what would be going through the mind of the guy mentioned in the OP. I don't envy him one bit, he must feel like a visitor in his own home.

He is still young enough to learn english. If possible, find an english program school where he can study in english as well. My son who is nearly 7 speaks both thai and english though his thai is stronger. If he doesn't know a word in english he asks my wife to translate. He studies in the thai program, by the way.

As for the OP, it seems the father spends hardly any time with the two younger kids, whom I assume are his biological kids. There's now way they can't speak english if he raised them! He doesn't speak thai so that's not the reason.

[sarahsbloke]

The difficult part of that is learning Thai. The rest comes if you're planning on living here long-term.

Sorry but Total bol*&%ks, How do you know, are you a Thai citizen yet, have you even tried?

Citizenship is limited and discretionary, learning Thai is not hard, merely another obstacle put in our way by a government that doesn't want us here.

l wonder how many ThaiVisa members have managed to become citizens.

Let's make a guess ......... 3 out of 100,000 ....... am I close?

Edited April 15, 2010 by sarahsbloke

[Garry9999]

The difficult part of that is learning Thai. The rest comes if you're planning on living here long-term.

Sorry but Total bol*&%ks, How do you know, are you a Thai citizen yet, have you even tried?

Citizenship is limited and discretionary, learning Thai is not hard, merely another obstacle put in our way by a government that doesn't want us here.

l wonder how many ThaiVisa members have managed to become citizens.

Let's make a guess ......... 3 out of 100,000 ....... am I close?

I doubt there are any Farang citizens. Permanent Residents maybe.

[alfieconn]

1) You implied it here. "A lot of foreigners seem obsessed with there children being fluent in English at the expense of there Thai without having any plans for there future". In other words you said it is not important your child learns English if she lives in Thailand.

I wasn't implying that in the slightest, you seem to be reading something into my comments that is not there.

2) Again you implied it here. "if they going to stay in Thailand then Thai must be there primary language as it is the language of this country".

Yes correct, but that doesn't stop them having English as there 2nd language.

3) Again here. "A lot of foreigners seem obsessed with there children being fluent in English at the expense of there Thai"

Yes correct, which is ok if they are going to spend there future in England or the States but not so good if they decide to live and work in Thailand.

You mention that i have implied various things, using the word implied perhaps means that your interpetation of my comments are completely wrong.

I will explain my way of thinking as you obviously don't understand :

A. If a child is going to pursue a career abroad then English must be his/hers no1. language and the no2. language doesn't really matter unless they see part of there life being in Thailand then obviously learning thai would be a help.

B. If a child is going to pursue a career in Thailand then Thai must be there no1. language followed closely by English.

Edited April 15, 2010 by alfieconn

[WOOHOO]

Hmmm, ok and it's because he's English that there should be low expectations of him?

I've only spent four weeks with my girlfriends two lovely daughters who are 9 and 6.

Does that mean you have only been with her for four weeks? If that's the case, those children shouldn't be calling you Pappa, in my opinion. You seem like a nice bloke who's doing right by them, but being a father figure to kids you have known for four weeks is not good, lets face the facts there is a chance things could go belly up any time. Where does that leave the kids? Without a Pappa, AGAIN!

So according to you, it's about time other governments started treating Thai nationals like the Thai government treats foreigners in Thailand then.

When a Thai lady moves to the western world, no land ownership, no citizenship, 90 day reporting, etc.

After all you seem to believe it is the right thing to do.

To assume the same rule is appropriate for all countries is stupid. If someone came to the UK and married a girl they met in a bar two months earlier and will be divorced from in two months time, then it's safe to say they won't be getting citizenship any time soon.

Can you not close your eyes and imagine what Thailand would be like if the average Farang was able to buy land here. A giant Thailand sized Pattaya. No thanks.

i know, so many guys get it so wrong here... i feel really bad for some of my friends who have been so horribly cheated here by their poor choice of women.

I liked your other posts but don't agree with that. We're supposed to get all the confusion and crushes, and broken hearts etc etc, out the way when we're in our teens. There is no excuse for grown men entering relationships, that the stray dog sitting out in the street, is smart enough to know won't last. No sympathy I'm afraid.

The difficult part of that is learning Thai. The rest comes if you're planning on living here long term. Some people who've lived here longer than required can barely even order fried rice. Guy talked about in the OP has been involved with his wife and child for at least 8 years and can not even hold a basic conversation with his own child. His problem would not be paper work.

Exactly. But there are people who think he should get the red carpet all the way to citizenship. What could he possible input in to this country to make it better, and how long would he even be the pathetic presence he is now, after he had his paperwork. Those kids wouldn't see him for dust. Which ironically would improve their chances of a decent future considerably.

Hopefully this poor bastard, that had the misfortune to meet LIE, has never heard of ThaiVisa and is peacefully going about his life in total ignorance of the crap that's being thrown at him here!

Anyone that would call that man a poor bastard, needs help. I do hope you don't have kids as well, because they I'm sure would need help as well.

As people have said. Thailand is full of selfish low life, getting their basic dog like needs, attended to. I have no issue with that what so ever. The bar girl gets abused. The punter gets robbed, who gives a shit. When children are involved, be it by birth or by the fact you've hooked up with someone who's got kids already, it's a different ball game. It's time to put their feelings and future, and happiness before your need to empty your sack.

If you think it is more appropriate to criticize the OP, than it is the man who blatantly neglects his children, then you are nearly as bad as he is.

[somchee]

My wife are now the guardians of a boy who is almost 7. We have only had him since last summer. His mother died and his dad is not interested. I speak Thai, but I have a long ways to go. All day long there are things I want to say to him, explain, teach, I really want to be a real dad. But I continually find there are words missing and there are so many moments that pass where I don't say a thing. My wife is good and she translates a lot for me, but I desperately want to improve my Thai and I can't think of a greater motivation to do so. I am working on it all the time.

But in the meantime I am really impressed with the English he has picked up and there times now when we can communicate in English, and that is very encouraging. I am glad he is a sharp kid, it makes this whole thing a lot easier.

I can' imagine what would be going through the mind of the guy mentioned in the OP. I don't envy him one bit, he must feel like a visitor in his own home.

He is still young enough to learn english. If possible, find an english program school where he can study in english as well. My son who is nearly 7 speaks both thai and english though his thai is stronger. If he doesn't know a word in english he asks my wife to translate. He studies in the thai program, by the way.

As for the OP, it seems the father spends hardly any time with the two younger kids, whom I assume are his biological kids. There's now way they can't speak english if he raised them! He doesn't speak thai so that's not the reason.

i doubt op is biological poppa. or he would take interest in speaking to said kids.

i bet its one of those marriages made over a beer!

[WOOHOO]

The difficult part of that is learning Thai. The rest comes if you're planning on living here long-term.

Sorry but Total bol*&%ks, How do you know, are you a Thai citizen yet, have you even tried?

Citizenship is limited and discretionary, learning Thai is not hard, merely another obstacle put in our way by a government that doesn't want us here.

l wonder how many ThaiVisa members have managed to become citizens.

Let's make a guess ......... 3 out of 100,000 ....... am I close?

I doubt there are any Farang citizens. Permanent Residents maybe.

Sorry mate, you're just high lighting your ignorance there.

The number is very low, and why shouldn't it be. Why would you allow someone in to your country that not only won't improve things, but will undoubtedly make it worse. If only the UK thought of that 20 years ago it wouldn't be such a shit hole now.

Edited April 15, 2010 by WOOHOO

[WOOHOO]

i doubt op is biological poppa. or he would take interest in speaking to said kids.

i bet its one of those marriages made over a beer!

That's Ok then, we don't have to worry about the children being raised by a waist of space because they are not his.

As I said, when it comes to children, having a, couldn't give a shit, attitude is unacceptable. If you're in their life, you owe it to them to do what's right. If you can't, do them a favour, and get the <deleted>$k out of their lives.

[sarahsbloke]

To assume the same rule is appropriate for all countries is stupid. If someone came to the UK and married a girl they met in a bar two months earlier and will be divorced from in two months time, then it's safe to say they won't be getting citizenship any time soon.

Why not assume The man and Thai lady have been married and living in Thailand for 5 years (or 10 or 15 years), then tell us why he shouldn't get Thai citizenship.

While we are all busy making assumptions ... can we assume you speak, read and write no Thai.

From some of your previous posts I can't be sure if English is your 1st language either (but sadly I fear it is).

(I'm working on a pet theory about a certain type of poster on ThaiVisa and to know your level of Thai language competence would be very useful to me)

Edited April 15, 2010 by sarahsbloke

[somchee]

i doubt op is biological poppa. or he would take interest in speaking to said kids.

i bet its one of those marriages made over a beer!

That's Ok then, we don't have to worry about the children being raised by a waist of space because they are not his.

As I said, when it comes to children, having a, couldn't give a shit, attitude is unacceptable. If you're in their life, you owe it to them to do what's right. If you can't, do them a favour, and get the <deleted>$k out of their lives.

calm down. op is doing more than what thai parents are doing. baby steps, at least they have food and water!

Farangs cant save all whats wrong w thailand!

[WOOHOO]

While we are all busy making assumptions ... can we assume you speak, read and write no Thai.

You may. You have made so many wrong assumptions so far, no point stopping now.

[WOOHOO]

calm down. op is doing more than what thai parents are doing. baby steps, at least they have food and water!

Farangs cant save all whats wrong w thailand!

Food AND water. So that's why I never win father of the year. He always beats me to it.

[sarahsbloke]

Sorry Woohoo, I have just added you to my ignore list, so no point in your replying to me any more.

[WOOHOO]

Sorry Woohoo, I have just added you to my ignore list, so no point in your replying to me any more.

Now I know how those kids feel.

[SantiSuk]

If I can ask for a break in the insult-fest, can I have some advice.

My daughter is now 4 months old. In our house my wife and I speak both English and Thai - I speak Thai when it's easy stuff (I have about 1,000 words but poor structure and want to learn a lot more).

Would the board recommend that I stop trying to speak Thai in the house when my daughter is in the early learning stages at least? Will it confuse her too much? She will get a lot of Thai from the extended family (and Lao-Issaan unfortunately)

[WOOHOO]

If I can ask for a break in the insult-fest, can I have some advice.

My daughter is now 4 months old. In our house my wife and I speak both English and Thai - I speak Thai when it's easy stuff (I have about 1,000 words but poor structure and want to learn a lot more).

Would the board recommend that I stop trying to speak Thai in the house when my daughter is in the early learning stages at least? Will it confuse her too much? She will get a lot of Thai from the extended family (and Lao-Issaan unfortunately)

It's a lot harder to do the right thing than it sounds. I would say, yes you need to stop speaking Thai. At your level of Thai she will be learning to speak Thai badly. No offence, the same goes for me. I think your wife only speaking Thai is also needed. (unless you wifes English is very good.) As I said, this is harder than it sounds. It was easy for me to stop speaking Thai, but my wife struggles to only speak Thai, as we have comunicated in English for years, so she ends up speaking both.

I don't think you need to over worry. If you're good parents, with your kids best interests to heart, they will come out on top, one way or the other.

[Johnniey]

I met an Englishman this Songkran holiday, down in Bangkok for a few days with his wife and kids.

He's got 3 kids (the eldest his wife's son from a previous marrage) and not one of them could speak a word of English.

Not only that, he could not speak a word of Thai except for a few words he learned in bars (look lorn, bag wan, sewer'a etc).

They all communicated through his wife! "Darling tell 'em not to shoot the falangs in the head with the water pistols will ya".

He commented how well my son could speak English and I responded by telling him it was my duty as a father to make sure his first language is English and that we would be going home when his high school education starts.

He got quite agressive! allmost shouting about how Thailand was his home now and that he would never return to England.

I never asked him about his future plans! he asked me a question and I responded!

Me me me...not a word about his children who are 12, 8 & 6.

I was actually quite shocked as I view this as child neglect

Firstly, I think it's entirely up to the Englishman what he do with his kids.

My kids, wife and I are bilingual - I think any guy who has been here for more that 5 years or is planning to be has NO excuse in not learning Thai.

I've know a few Westerners to take their kids 'home' for a 'decent education' - dude don't spoil your little one and let him run your life.

I speak Thai and haven't a clue what you mean by

(look lorn, bag wan, sewer'a etc).

Maybe 'bag wan' you mean 'bpaak waan'?

How would you like it if people started telling you what language to learn?

Would the board recommend that I stop trying to speak Thai in the house when my daughter is in the early learning stages at least? Will it confuse her too much? She will get a lot of Thai from the extended family (and Lao-Issaan unfortunately)

I have a PhD in Bilingual Language Acquisition and advise you to stop speaking Thai immediately if you want them to be bilingual.

Why did you marry a Lao-Isaan woman if you don't like her culture? What is wrong with your kids learning English Thai and Laotian - mine did and are proud of it.

Edited April 15, 2010 by Johnniey

[F1fanatic]

It is possible to become a Thai citizen if you're a Farang, but thankfully, you have to do a bit more than hump someone. It would be a bit like giving a dog a treat every time it humped a cushion! There's not a lot the Thai Govt. get right but that sure is one of them.

So according to you, it's about time other governments started treating Thai nationals like the Thai government treats foreigners in Thailand then.

When a Thai lady moves to the western world, no land ownership, no citizenship, 90 day reporting, etc.

After all you seem to believe it is the right thing to do.

Yes. I have no problem with this. Something has to be done about economic migrants to Europe.

Come to Thailand, the government expects you to pay for yourself - they will not subsidise you. Its different in Europe.

Edited April 15, 2010 by F1fanatic

[wallhigh]

She will get a lot of Thai from the extended family (and Lao-Issaan unfortunately)

You dont like Lao and Isaan? What happened mate, too many sick buffalo to pay for?

Or MIL got a case of the green eyed monster and wanted a mansion built? I think its

very fortunate there is Lao and Isaan, they are noble and gracious people....

[wolf5370]

If I can ask for a break in the insult-fest, can I have some advice.

My daughter is now 4 months old. In our house my wife and I speak both English and Thai - I speak Thai when it's easy stuff (I have about 1,000 words but poor structure and want to learn a lot more).

Would the board recommend that I stop trying to speak Thai in the house when my daughter is in the early learning stages at least? Will it confuse her too much? She will get a lot of Thai from the extended family (and Lao-Issaan unfortunately)

If you are living here (in Thailand) - which I assume is true based on your post - then I would concentrate on English in the home. She will learn both Thai and Laotian from her family, pre-school, and later school, friends and teachers. That's what I did, but as we were in the UK when they were very young, we lrft it too late to switch to Thai - here it should not be a problem. In the UK we had a lot of mixed friends with kids too. It seemed that almost all of the kids could speak hardly any English until they reached 4/5 and went to school (friends of the mothers also tended to be Thais and spoke Thai with the kids too). Most of the fathers played with their kids, but didn't talk much with them. There were exceptions and some spoke both languages, but not many. Some of the kids neither my wife or I could talk to in either English or Thai as they only spoke regional dialects like Isaan (Laotian) and neither of us know it.