Thai Army Says Planning Operation To Clear Protesters

[Supernova]

I'm just wondering, who is really in charge. First, there were no press conferences from PM Abhisit for about a week, then the one scheduled was several hours late and when PM Abhisit did finally speak, he handed power, to deal with the Reds, over to General Anupong.

After that brief disappearing act, one would think the PM would come out accepting responsibility and show some remorse, but instead he promises more action. Great, just what this country needs -- more bloodshed.

Who knows what's going on in the barracks? Maybe there was a silent coup...

The owners of Central, Paragon, etc. Shopping malls, are not going to sit back and loose millions of dollars every day, without doing something. I'm surprised, that the protesters are actually still there. One would think, the Government forces would have overrun and arrested them, when there were only 3000 Protesters present yesterday???

I'm afraid the mall owners don't have much say in it.

One thing they're probably worried sick is how much damage will be done after the crackdown.

If protesters numbered only in the thousands, they would've been dispersed by now. Another dose of Government propaganda.

it was later when the grenades was thrown killing those poor troopers..who then had to respond accordingly with firepower.

A matter of great debate. But of course here on TVF, the Reds are guilty as usual.

[ianf]

TO MY FRIENDS

I hear this cry coming from the bowels of the Thai country people, this long cry asking for more justice.

Who can remain insensible to the pain of the millions of men, women and children you represent? Your lives are rooted to this beautiful Country of which you are the gardeners. Generation after generation, you have been shaping the landscape, without you it will be an impenetrable jungle. Long days spent farming this rice, in the heavy rain, in the heavy sun, and when coming the dark, so exhausted that you have only one aim: to rest for working again tomorrow. You have gotten no time to take care of yourself: your wooden houses are nearly the same that those of your grand fathers’ ones and generations before. Modernity is slightly visible through a TV set, a tap water in your garden....few details: it is your life and you can be proud than during Centuries you have feed the whole Country, particularly your fellow town people.

During this time your fellow town people have worked hard also, building factories, making business and they have succeeded: day after day they are accumulating wealth. Today they have nice modern houses, nice cars and all the modern comfort going with. Today they are more and more busy for accelerating the accumulation of wealth. Today they have big projects in which they are going to invest billions and billions. They are so occupied that they have forgotten you have feed them during Centuries. They cannot disturb their activities and give you a small part of their wealth because they need it for their grandiose projects. The Cities are buzzing like beehives: the noise is so important that they cannot hear you: they are deaf to your long pain cry.

Red Shirt people you are entering in Humanity History, I wish the coming days to be Peaceful, I know you love Peace ...

Is this for real?What on earth ............................................................?

[tom21]

i think the shit is going to hit the fan.

[vicco]

TO MY FRIENDS

I hear this cry coming from the bowels of the Thai country people, this long cry asking for more justice.

Who can remain insensible to the pain of the millions of men, women and children you represent? Your lives are rooted to this beautiful Country of which you are the gardeners. Generation after generation, you have been shaping the landscape, without you it will be an impenetrable jungle. Long days spent farming this rice, in the heavy rain, in the heavy sun, and when coming the dark, so exhausted that you have only one aim: to rest for working again tomorrow. You have gotten no time to take care of yourself: your wooden houses are nearly the same that those of your grand fathers' ones and generations before. Modernity is slightly visible through a TV set, a tap water in your garden....few details: it is your life and you can be proud than during Centuries you have feed the whole Country, particularly your fellow town people.

During this time your fellow town people have worked hard also, building factories, making business and they have succeeded: day after day they are accumulating wealth. Today they have nice modern houses, nice cars and all the modern comfort going with. Today they are more and more busy for accelerating the accumulation of wealth. Today they have big projects in which they are going to invest billions and billions. They are so occupied that they have forgotten you have feed them during Centuries. They cannot disturb their activities and give you a small part of their wealth because they need it for their grandiose projects. The Cities are buzzing like beehives: the noise is so important that they cannot hear you: they are deaf to your long pain cry.

Red Shirt people you are entering in Humanity History, I wish the coming days to be Peaceful, I know you love Peace ...

...

Now this should be good for about 40 more pages.....

[chadintheusa]

Gen Anupong has been reluctant to clear the streets, and now he's in charge. Here's my interpretation. PM knows he won't make it till September. Than means his successor will name the replacement for Anupong when he retires. By putting him on the front line now Gen Anupong either has to act and take responsibility for any massacre, or not act and take responsibility for the failure. Either way he can be forced into early retirement and the PM can replace him sooner than September and name a friendly General to head up the military instead of losing the election and having a pro red General leading the Army.

[humfurry]

It's raining this morning... maybe an early rainy season can end this peacefully

[cougar52]

Sorry just passing stuff on as it comes. I'm not in BKK right now so don't know about weather conditions.

Hey A hole, according to your earlier post you said and I quote " A BOMB JUST WENT OFF IN BKK, i AM ON SUKHUMVIT AND I HEARD IT" now you say you are not in Thailand ??? <deleted> idiot !!!

Allseeingeye, what you might want to do is read the post before racing to the keyboard to make stupid, bias posts.

The OP from the onset stated :::

VIA Twitter

So the poster also followed up with "What is happening, I am not in Thailand???

[Bkung]

Police officer taken hostage, then what civilian like us get protection from 'Who' (Red),

This is not rule of the jungle ?

[kimamey]

Sorry just passing stuff on as it comes. I'm not in BKK right now so don't know about weather conditions.

Hey A hole, according to your earlier post you said and I quote " A BOMB JUST WENT OFF IN BKK, i AM ON SUKHUMVIT AND I HEARD IT" now you say you are not in Thailand ??? <deleted> idiot !!!

You didn't quote the bit that said "via Twitter"

[khaowong1]

don't the Thai govt. understand that the world is watching, shaking their heads and laughing at them. Maybe they just don't care. Is there not One person in all of Thailand who knows how a govt should be run and how an Army should be run and how a Police force should be run. Not one person? Can you imagine ANY police force in the rest of the world, putting up with this stuff? In the U.S., there would be red shirts laying dead all over the street, or gassed and put in jail, or both, but not still operating like they are. What is wrong with these people?

[Thai at Heart]

Um.

Just flicked on the TV and the cable TV is off completely up country where I am. Anyone else?

[chadintheusa]

It's obvious that within both the police and the army there are factions that are sympathetic to the Reds. This makes clearing the streets difficult because some hesitate while others undermine their own superiors by informing the Reds before any action occurs. The problem is that Bangkok residents are sick of these protests and we are likely to see the Yellows emerging more and more to prompt the PM to act. If the police and army don't do their job and two opposing mobs are protesting at the same time there will be violent clashes. If the reds don't have to respect the law and can openly defy the police what reason do the Yellows have to behave? Don't forget Yellows have money too and if they want to spend it recruiting their own protesters they can. What you end up with is two militias fighting while the police and army stand there looking stupid. The PM and the army can't delay much longer or they risk the total erosion or law and order. It is better to clear the streets, then call elections than to wait for Thai people to fight in the streets.

[humfurry]

Um.

Just flicked on the TV and the cable TV is off completely up country where I am. Anyone else?

I'm in Bkk and TV is fine... could be the thunderstorms.

Cheers, Hummy

[fruittbatt]

Gen Anupong has been reluctant to clear the streets, and now he's in charge. Here's my interpretation. PM knows he won't make it till September. Than means his successor will name the replacement for Anupong when he retires. By putting him on the front line now Gen Anupong either has to act and take responsibility for any massacre, or not act and take responsibility for the failure. Either way he can be forced into early retirement and the PM can replace him sooner than September and name a friendly General to head up the military instead of losing the election and having a pro red General leading the Army.

This is an incisive analysis of the politics at play here, but it appears that both the police special forces and the army are deeply divided and act according to their factional loyalties rather than being cohesive - evidenced by the failed operations to date. Has anarchy simply been well-hidden until now, or has it emerged as the constitution is tested beyond its limits?

[Thai at Heart]

Um.

Just flicked on the TV and the cable TV is off completely up country where I am. Anyone else?

I'm in Bkk and TV is fine... could be the thunderstorms.

Cheers, Hummy

Thanks. Was just wondering if there was a coup overnight.

You know you are in Thailand when your first response to the TV going off is that you believe there has been a coup.

[SiriusBlack1]

It also came after commandos earlier Friday stormed a Bangkok hotel where leaders of the Red Shirt protest movement were hiding, but the mission ended in dramatic failure after the suspects managed to flee.

"They tried to arrest the co-leaders of the Red Shirts and they were unable to do so. I think that was another humiliation," said Pavin Chachavalpongpun, a fellow at the Institute for Southeast Asian Studies in Singapore.

...

"Police kicked the door open and threw smoke and stun grenades into the room, but luckily I ran to the window and used an electric cord to climb down," said one of the Red Shirt leaders who fled the hotel, Arisman Pongruangrong.

[humfurry]

Um.

Just flicked on the TV and the cable TV is off completely up country where I am. Anyone else?

I'm in Bkk and TV is fine... could be the thunderstorms.

Cheers, Hummy

Thanks. Was just wondering if there was a coup overnight.

You know you are in Thailand when your first response to the TV going off is that you believe there has been a coup.

[khaowong1]

i think the shit is going to hit the fan.

yes, me too. I would be very surprised indeed if this ends peacefully.

[finaisme]

it's amazing that this army can't even surround a hotel and remove some fat middle aged men from a room without incident.

--maybe some leader within the army were intended NOT to capture him.... some reds inside army, some 'army' inside reds.

This is a never ending battle. During rally before the blood shed, we saw trucks loaded with sharp sticks get into the crowd. And i'm sure it's not the only ones. If the reds planning a peaceful rally, why did they need, prepare and stock up weapons after all?

Abhisit doesnt have sufficient background for any battle. His strategy facing the reds really poor.. proven. But with his academic and political background, still he is one of the best thai that could run the country. Can people just wait until next year?

[Sp0t]

The military said it was planning another operation to disperse the thousands of protesters from Bangkok's commercial district but the timing had not yet been decided.

"There will be an effort to retake the area. We can't allow protests there because it damages the country," army spokesman Sunsern Kaewkumnerd told reporters.

Prime Minister Abhisit Vejjajiva said that he was replacing his deputy as head of security operations in the capital, giving army chief Anupong Paojinda broader powers to tackle "terrorism".

Exactly what did the Thai army do to stop damage being done to the country when Suvarnabhumi was seized by the Yellows? Hopping around with Yellow flowers in gun barrels..

I would say more billions were lost over that compared to a few closed Bangkok Elite Paragon shopunits. At least now tourists can still come to Thailand but just visit other shopping malls.

[pontius]

[..] In the U.S., ... [..]

In the US this, in the US that, in the US, man I read that all day long.

It must be heaven, with everything being so perfect. (You're having

a great tea party time I guess.)

Can we please focus on the fact that this is NOT the US, and this is

not ABOUT the US now? (And that the world doesn't turn around

the US either? And that some of us might really, REALLY not give

a *** what would or wouldn't be in the US?)

Thanks, from someone not in the US but in Thailand.

I, for one, would like to know more about what additional power this

recent change has given the army, for instance, except the obvious

one. Does this increase the chance for a potential coup?

That would be a lot more interesting than what would ... Ok, I zip it.

[pkspeaker]

amen to that, i'm from the US and it sucks there so lets not use that as a good example.

[humfurry]

The military said it was planning another operation to disperse the thousands of protesters from Bangkok's commercial district but the timing had not yet been decided.

"There will be an effort to retake the area. We can't allow protests there because it damages the country," army spokesman Sunsern Kaewkumnerd told reporters.

Prime Minister Abhisit Vejjajiva said that he was replacing his deputy as head of security operations in the capital, giving army chief Anupong Paojinda broader powers to tackle "terrorism".

Exactly what did the Thai army do to stop damage being done to the country when Suvarnabhumi was seized by the Yellows? Hopping around with Yellow flowers in gun barrels..

I would say more billions were lost over that compared to a few closed Bangkok Elite Paragon shopunits. At least now tourists can still come to Thailand but just visit other shopping malls.

You simply can't keep pointing to what the Yellows did to justify that the Reds are doing now.

[on-on]

But the question remains why that wasn't done when the yellow shirts shutdown the airports for 2 weeks? i'll say one thing about the redshirts, their protests might be disruptive but they're not nearly as bad as what the yellows did-they sacked and occupied government house for months-vandalizing it in the process, and then the airport takeover which was only about 50 times more damaging to the economy then shuttering 2 malls and a few hotels.. i wonder if this has any real economic impact-Gaysrorn for example is owned by a rich family, and why Siam Paragon and Siam Discovery keep closing even though they are blocks away from the protest site and protesters(I was at Siam bts station yesterday) is beyond my comprehension. As far as the stock market- such political unrest is merely a bargain opportunity for many stocks, you can go buy some of them now and profit take as soon as the protest is ended, its just knowing the right day to buy.

Someone, maybe Dennis Ross, was talking about his time in the Israeli-Palestinian peace negotiations and he said Shimon Peres once told him that there were three kinds of people involved. I forget what the other two were, but the third group was "the collectors of arguments." Of course he was referring to the vocal elements on both sides who always have a definitive history of how anything they did was precipitated by the other side and who have a moral equivalence argument for every situation that shows how whatever they're charged with isn't as bad as some other thing. "Hebron!" "Deir Yassin!" Etcetera, etcetera. That's what about half of Thai Visa is like these days. Sort of an interesting break from the regular "Me missus' buffalo is sick again!" threads, though, I'll give em that.

There's absolutely no question why there wasn't a major crackdown when the yellow shirts were in charge. Everyone knows why. And as for which is worse, we'll know the answer to that when this all ends, but they're both incredibly damaging to the economy. If people want to keep this up until they can sit around the smoldering ruins of the economy going "Ya vell vhat you did vas clearly the vorst now, just look around!" then that's what they'll get. And that, of course, goes for partisans on both sides.

[vicco]

don't the Thai govt. understand that the world is watching, shaking their heads and laughing at them. Maybe they just don't care. Is there not One person in all of Thailand who knows how a govt should be run and how an Army should be run and how a Police force should be run. Not one person? Can you imagine ANY police force in the rest of the world, putting up with this stuff? In the U.S., there would be red shirts laying dead all over the street, or gassed and put in jail, or both, but not still operating like they are. What is wrong with these people?

They are not Americans?? Dead people all over the streets??.....truth, justice and the American way (Superman)

[Thai at Heart]

The military said it was planning another operation to disperse the thousands of protesters from Bangkok's commercial district but the timing had not yet been decided.

"There will be an effort to retake the area. We can't allow protests there because it damages the country," army spokesman Sunsern Kaewkumnerd told reporters.

Prime Minister Abhisit Vejjajiva said that he was replacing his deputy as head of security operations in the capital, giving army chief Anupong Paojinda broader powers to tackle "terrorism".

Exactly what did the Thai army do to stop damage being done to the country when Suvarnabhumi was seized by the Yellows? Hopping around with Yellow flowers in gun barrels..

I would say more billions were lost over that compared to a few closed Bangkok Elite Paragon shopunits. At least now tourists can still come to Thailand but just visit other shopping malls.

You simply can't keep pointing to what the Yellows did to justify that the Reds are doing now.

It doesn't justify, but so what. The actions are essentially the same and yet the responses and statements of the protagonists involved are in complete contrast.

[Sp0t]

The military said it was planning another operation to disperse the thousands of protesters from Bangkok's commercial district but the timing had not yet been decided.

"There will be an effort to retake the area. We can't allow protests there because it damages the country," army spokesman Sunsern Kaewkumnerd told reporters.

Prime Minister Abhisit Vejjajiva said that he was replacing his deputy as head of security operations in the capital, giving army chief Anupong Paojinda broader powers to tackle "terrorism".

Exactly what did the Thai army do to stop damage being done to the country when Suvarnabhumi was seized by the Yellows? Hopping around with Yellow flowers in gun barrels..

I would say more billions were lost over that compared to a few closed Bangkok Elite Paragon shopunits. At least now tourists can still come to Thailand but just visit other shopping malls.

You simply can't keep pointing to what the Yellows did to justify that the Reds are doing now.

I am not justifying anything but it tells me on what side the army is.

[humfurry]

The military said it was planning another operation to disperse the thousands of protesters from Bangkok's commercial district but the timing had not yet been decided.

"There will be an effort to retake the area. We can't allow protests there because it damages the country," army spokesman Sunsern Kaewkumnerd told reporters.

Prime Minister Abhisit Vejjajiva said that he was replacing his deputy as head of security operations in the capital, giving army chief Anupong Paojinda broader powers to tackle "terrorism".

Exactly what did the Thai army do to stop damage being done to the country when Suvarnabhumi was seized by the Yellows? Hopping around with Yellow flowers in gun barrels..

I would say more billions were lost over that compared to a few closed Bangkok Elite Paragon shopunits. At least now tourists can still come to Thailand but just visit other shopping malls.

You simply can't keep pointing to what the Yellows did to justify that the Reds are doing now.

I am not justifying anything but it tells me on what side the army is.

Well if you know anything at all about Thailand then you'll know that the Army is own its own side.

[chadintheusa]

Gen Anupong has been reluctant to clear the streets, and now he's in charge. Here's my interpretation. PM knows he won't make it till September. Than means his successor will name the replacement for Anupong when he retires. By putting him on the front line now Gen Anupong either has to act and take responsibility for any massacre, or not act and take responsibility for the failure. Either way he can be forced into early retirement and the PM can replace him sooner than September and name a friendly General to head up the military instead of losing the election and having a pro red General leading the Army.

This is an incisive analysis of the politics at play here, but it appears that both the police special forces and the army are deeply divided and act according to their factional loyalties rather than being cohesive - evidenced by the failed operations to date. Has anarchy simply been well-hidden until now, or has it emerged as the constitution is tested beyond its limits?

With the divisions that clearly exist in the army and police can they actually do the job that has been put on their shoulders? The streets of Bangkok should be a safe place for all citizens. In order to force the protesters out violence will occur. The reds will fight the police and army as usual and the armed forces will either retreat again, or push back harder. If a massive crackdown occurs and red sympathetic police or army begin to desert and join the reds we'd have the worst case scenario. So we have a situation that demands police action and police that are unable to act. A complete surrender by the PM at this point tells Thailand and the world that terrorism works. Democracy can be replaced by mob rule. As long as the Reds continue to refuse to negotiate there is no solution.

[grandpops]

Gen Anupong has been reluctant to clear the streets, and now he's in charge. Here's my interpretation. PM knows he won't make it till September. Than means his successor will name the replacement for Anupong when he retires. By putting him on the front line now Gen Anupong either has to act and take responsibility for any massacre, or not act and take responsibility for the failure. Either way he can be forced into early retirement and the PM can replace him sooner than September and name a friendly General to head up the military instead of losing the election and having a pro red General leading the Army.

This is an incisive analysis of the politics at play here, but it appears that both the police special forces and the army are deeply divided and act according to their factional loyalties rather than being cohesive - evidenced by the failed operations to date. Has anarchy simply been well-hidden until now, or has it emerged as the constitution is tested beyond its limits?

Good response. The only thing wrong with the post you reply to is that Abhisit did not pull Anupongs strings. Anupong sat out the debacle yesterday morning, watched it go tits up the took charge. Hence Mark shaking like a blancmange on TV last night. He had had the rug pulled out from under him and his stooge in charge of comedic street policing is toast. He was starting to look like Goebels.

You are right about the divided loyalties and if the Army were crazy enough to slaughter a load of reds, you would find people from Bangkok going to Pattani, Beiruit, Gaza and Zimbabwe next year for their holidays to get some peace and quiet away from the troubles here.

IMHO