Girl Girl Relationships On The Increase...?

[Ulysses G.]

How can you folks turn a perfectly good girl-on-girl thread into a sensible they-are-just friends thread? What is the world coming to?

[RakJungTorlae]

Some toms can be very charming in the eyes for thais, I have lots of tom friends and I must say they can be very witty and still girlish even though around me “oh my god look at that doll its so cute” and then a hot girl walks past they shouting “where you going sweetie” and I have never seen a negative response from the girls they holler at. But a lot of them grow out of it and end up marring and having a family. It’s a long term fad for some, but real lesbians will just continue that way of life.

But as I always say now and will continue to say, DON’T DRINK THE WATER!!!

[RakJungTorlae]

Everywhere you look there are toms,katoys and gay thai guys,even up country.Someone suggested it was the water,contaminated with the female pill.

Finaly!! There’s something really bad in the water!!!

[geriatrickid]

"giggitty giggitty"

- Quagmire

If you don't get it, well, brusg p the awesomeness of Seth McFarland.

[somtampet]

Everywhere you look there are toms,katoys and gay thai guys,even up country.Someone suggested it was the water,contaminated with the female pill.

Finaly!! There’s something really bad in the water!!!

sawadee Rak,not seen you long time,been banned again lol

[RakJungTorlae]

Everywhere you look there are toms,katoys and gay thai guys,even up country.Someone suggested it was the water,contaminated with the female pill.

Finaly!! There's something really bad in the water!!!

sawadee Rak,not seen you long time,been banned again lol

hmmm, See what i mean???

[Heng]

IME, in my group of friends, the toms don't just grow out of it. The dees however often do and end up getting married or at least 'christened' (and sometimes Henged) as hetero.

[tangcoral]

Its more of a fashion, thus why upperclass are seen more in numbers as they tend to follow the trend then people from the country side.

Besides the upperclass have more time with this trendsetting bs than the poor.

[kurnell]

From what I have seen over the last 15 years here, girls being in a Tom relationship is part of growing up in Thailand.

[Boo]

the post is directed at the person who's post was deleted; They are the only one who needs to understand it. Suggest you take up any further issue to support.

[BlackArtemis]

I know a few "Tom and Dee" couples, for the most part the Tom does play the part of "See-ah" If you go to the clubs catering to university age kids you will see it a lot more.

[BlackArtemis]

BTW, here in the US we have a term for those young girls who are "lesbians" in their 20's. LUG's, Lesbian Until Graduated, because MANY of them are just Bi and love the attention they get at parties etc, but then end up with a guy.

[witold]

It is pretty sick when I see old men mentally undressing young slim Thai girls yes

I'm pretty sure men all over the world, regardless of country and culture, find 20 something girls very attractive and at least look/check them out. And although we might get older each year, the women we find most beautiful are still about the same age.

[bonobo]

I have a good friend who is a very hiso, attractive tom.  Yes, she has short hair and dresses rather butch, but she is really quite pretty.  She went to grad school in the US and is quite familiar with American humor, so we tend to tease each other quite a bit in the American style.

Her young dee pretty much hates me and thinks I am trying to steal her meal ticket away.  She doesn't understand English and mistakes the two of us (my friend and me) flirting for something serious.  However, while she is actually bi, my friend is 100% hardwired lesbian.

More blatant lesbian activity is on the rise not just in Thailand, but in the West, too.  From Madonna and Britanny's kiss at the Grammies, I think it was, to films and songs like "I Kissed a Girl," it has become socially acceptable for lesbian activity, even if most of the women who do this might still prefer men or will marry men in the future.  From a pop cultural aspect, it is now "cool" to be bi for women, and perhaps some women who otherwise have no interest in women sexually feel compelled to try in order to be considered in, and some women who are genuinely curious now feel "allowed" to explore that side of their lives.

[daoyai]

Pretty common here in Chiang Mai, lot of cute couples, Feel sorry for some of the the Toms because the Dees have male giks and drive their toms crazy with jealousy, also there is alot of competiton for the pretty dees.... so basicly it is sexy soap opera time. I get alot of second hand gossip from the GF....

[RusticCharm]

You shouldn't be looking at young underaged girls anyway.

I find it highly offensive how foreigners look and think about thai girls.

Most lesbian-tomboys are teenagers. You guys know very well what I am talking about. Even low 20ies is sick for guy that is thrice the age. And even if the girl is over 50 I still don't like the look in your eyes.

I take great offense in that and I want it to stop. You guys don't do it in the west then why do it here? Because you think you can get away with it? Because you think it's socially accepted?

 

And I find your dumb posts hilarious.

As Billy Connelly once said, "I've always felt that some people should be offended on a regular basis".

And even if the girl is over 50 I still don't like the look in your eyes.

Oh, I get it. You taking the piss. Very good! 

it has become socially acceptable for lesbian activity

Not sure about this. I think it depends on how hot they are.

I mean who'd want to see Ellen Degeneres and Rosie O'Donnell carpet munching? Pass the sick bag!

On the other hand, Portia De Rossi and that cute little blond Anne Heche would be a best selling video.

Or isn't that the type of 'activity' you're talking about?

Edited April 23, 2010 by RusticCharm

[Ulysses G.]

It is pretty sick when I see old men mentally undressing young slim Thai girls yes

I'm pretty sure men all over the world, regardless of country and culture, find 20 something girls very attractive and at least look/check them out. And although we might get older each year, the women we find most beautiful are still about the same age.

Of course and nature planned it that way. Are there still all these puritanical kooks around in this day and age?

Edited April 23, 2010 by Ulysses G.

[thaibeachlovers]

Most lesbian-tomboys are teenagers. You guys know very well what I am talking about. Even low 20ies is sick for guy that is thrice the age. And even if the girl is over 50 I still don't like the look in your eyes.

I take great offense in that and I want it to stop. You guys don't do it in the west then why do it here? Because you think you can get away with it? Because you think it's socially accepted?

Of course we don't do it in the west Hahahahahahahahahaha

Edited April 23, 2010 by thaibeachlovers

[thaibeachlovers]

I find it highly offensive how foreigners look and think about thai girls.

Edited April 23, 2010 by thaibeachlovers

[Ijustwannateach]

It's called 'lesbianism.' The fact that it's apparently more visible in Thailand doesn't mean it's more or less common than anywhere else- and it's certainly not confined to the middle or upper classes. Welcome to the human race.

[canopy]

If Phetchabun is any indication, the phenomenon extends well into the villages and working classes. It would be rare to go to Tesco and not run acrosss a tom or two. They seem more common than katoeys. Picking out tom's is not trivial so there may be more than it seems. Some are easy with the hair being a tell tale sign, others are more subtle.

[JimmyTheMook]

Most lesbian-tomboys are teenagers. You guys know very well what I am talking about. Even low 20ies is sick for guy that is thrice the age. And even if the girl is over 50 I still don't like the look in your eyes.

You'd surely hate me then.

[theblether]

My Thai girl and I had a meal with two of her lesbian friends who are in a relationship in Bangkok recently. One was Tom, the other a Dee?? So being a guy I had to interrogate them......so here goes.

Tom - traditional masculine / butch type that we are all familiar with.

Dee - lipstick lesbian type.

The Tom plays the part of the man and basically is a lot more loving / caring / attentive than your average Thai man.

The Dee expects to be treated in the same way as your average girlfriend, taken out for meals at the Toms expense etc.

The Tom expects to be a Tom all their lives

The Dee expects to end up being married to a guy. The Tom is convenient and fulfilling a need / want / desire.

To answer the OP's question directly, the reason why it seems Hi-So is a lot of rural girls move to places such as Bangkok as it is far more cosmopolitan and open, or to some other major suburban centre. they find it easier to live the lifestyle away from family pressure, they'll then gravitate towards like minded people in gay bars etc. The underlying need of virtually everyone in Thailand is to earn enough money to survive, and in your home village you would be expected to be married off in your teens. There are probably just as many lesbians in small town Thailand as anywhere in the world but many have been trapped into living the married life. The two I met were from a rural part of Chiang Mai district, one had qualified at CM Uni and moved to BKK as soon as she could, the other followed asap.

Normally there are no children on the scene so they benefit from being a dual income family, without that particular expense. The Toms tend to hate their femininity, so the idea of them having kids repulses them.

The Dees tend to eventually succumb to family pressure to marry and have kids.

The Tom / Dee culture has been growing for a few years, it's just a natural part of the effect of Thai society opening. Bizarrely while the Tom / Dee circuit was rising, the idea of a Dee / Dee relationship was regarded as being disgusting by lesbians, and the idea of a Tom / Tom relationship was regarded with horror and as an oxymoron.

Now that seems to be changing, there seems to be more Dee / Dee relationships taking place. I think if you give it 20 years it will be exactly the same as the West.

Edited September 14, 2011 by theblether

[KeyserSoze01]

Most lesbian-tomboys are teenagers. You guys know very well what I am talking about. Even low 20ies is sick for guy that is thrice the age. And even if the girl is over 50 I still don't like the look in your eyes.

I take great offense in that and I want it to stop. You guys don't do it in the west then why do it here? Because you think you can get away with it? Because you think it's socially accepted?

Guess what sweetheart, we don't care what you like or dislike. Capiche?

Your type is the reason that so many men flock to Thai birds.

[KeyserSoze01]

It is pretty sick when I see old men mentally undressing young slim Thai girls yes

Then don't watch. Problem solved.

[Beetlejuice]

It's on the increase on all social levels here.

& I'd go far as to say that if there was a lesbian survey, Thailand would come very near the top in the world.

Over the last 6 years I've seen a noticeable increase, maybe because it's more culturally acceptable...maybe because of the higher ratio of females to males in this country...maybe because of sensitive broken hearts or maybe it's a craze. I'd go more with the latter.

Lesbian relationships here differ from in the West: here there is a "dee" (the more feminine one, indistinguishable from a straight girl) with a "tom", who is often indistinguishable from a young boy. Many "dek neaw" uni students have this relationship as well as higher social classes.

Some look like divorced or jilted women who've "turned". ;However, I don't know of many hi-so family names who are toms and dees, but there are definitely some. The "tom" will be very protective of their partner and often treat them as an older guy might treat their young gf...with gifts and jealousy and treats and cheating.;

They are openly more affectionate (and sometimes crude). ;A whole lot of complicated love triangles, cheating and pain exists in these relationships from what I've seen. The proportion of Thai girls who have had a lesbian experience in early Uni or late school days is surprisingly high....this may me from being subject to an unwanted crush to a full-blown dorm affair, and some become "dees" as a result until they mature.

Back in my younger days, when dinosaurs ruled the Earth and the continents hadn't drifted apart yet; a Tomboy was a girl who's sartorial appearance was a bit boyish.

The girl often had short hair and hung around with boys, enjoyed tree climbing and kicking footballs around.

But these girls were not lesbians, far from it; as a matter of fact they preferred the company of boys and could be quite a turn on.

Anyone remember Mia Farrow when she starred in the American soap, Peyton Place? Or Doris Day in Calamity Jane? And Shirley MacLaine in her younger days.

These days the term Tomboy has been manipulated as a description of lesbians, which is not correct.

Edited September 14, 2011 by Beetlejuice

[Beetlejuice]

I have known a few bargirls who became so disgrunted with men, that they turned lesbian.

I have heard that this is quite common among bar girls and even prostitutes in the West.

Edited September 14, 2011 by Beetlejuice

[GentlemanJim]

My sister in law is a lesbian of the 'Tom" variety. She is really nice and in her late 20's. She has had a string of drop dead gorgeous girl friends over the last 3-4 years.

I think for most girls it is just a fashion thing, a bit of a fad, and most of the feminine lesbians eventually get married and have kids. The Toms tend to stay as they are. Most of my SIL's girlfriends have been wealthy educated girls. I think one thing to remember that whilst young 20 year olds may well indulge in sex with boys, it really is still frowned upon to have sex before marriage , and is a big no no with parents. Many girls see it much safer to have a 'girlfriend' as their parents are far less suspicious and of course what the girls can then get up to is much more easily hidden. Two girls going for a chat in a bedroom is different to a girl and a boy doing the same thing. I think its an accepted way of young women having sex without upsetting parents who are blissfully unaware what their little darlings are getting up to. Well at least that is how my sister in law has explained it to me. It seems to work. I just feel sorry for my SIL, because whilst she has had some of the loveliest women ever seen, she will never be in a long term stable relationship because eventually the 'girls' always do their family duty and get married and have kids.

[GentlemanJim]

Beetlejuice

It's only my personal opinion, but that photo really is not appropriate. It is taken at a school !!!

[moe666]

Been coming to Thailand regularly since 1998 and my first trip after a 3 year layoff Feb 2010 I was suprised at the number of Toms hadn't really noticed it before.

Spent 1 month at a forest monastary outside mae Hong Song and one day a cute hiso Thai- Chinese girl shows up with her maid, or every thought. After a few conversations it turns out it was a girl she had picked up in Pai and brought along as company for her stay. The abbot bless his soul didn't have a clue what was going on as they where put in the same room together.

As it turned out this girl was from a mafia family in Bangkok her pop owned a enertainment complex in Chonburi, karaoke, massage parlour, cafe, and bar.she said they got all of their girls from the north. Her father basically kept her locked up at home and she could only go out with the body guards, no boy friends as dad didn't want her to hook up with some poor slob.

There was a Thai guy who stayed at the wat (good looking guy ) and they where always making eyes at each other. A friend setting on his porch one night watched them as she came out on the landing to here bungaloo and the Thai was setting on his porch, my friend said they where having long distance sex but he coughed and broke the moment.

maybe not all of these Tom and Dee relationships could be a similar situation as dad doesn't want some poor smuck in the family but ok for the daught to do a bit of carpet licking

We have a similar situation her in new Mexico where it is young hispanic girls playing the rolls. I have always wondered why anyone would try so hard to be so what they dislike

Edited September 14, 2011 by moe666