Thai Protesters Brace For Crackdown As Compromise Rejected

[BKjohn]

The good thing is, how ever much the reds try to spread their propaganda here on TV, it's doing no good what so ever and they are really just wasting their time or provide us with evidence that the reds are really a bunch of IQ challenged morons with no morals what so ever

A person with real conviction and pride would not hide behind women's skirts - nor use children and the elderly as shields

This fact alone shows what we are dealing with, cowards trying to serve their master for a big reward

To name the reds in the same sentence with any real freedom fighters would be an affront - if the Thai government was as the reds put it a "dictatorship" there would be no red shirts ... oh forgot, the cowards have now dropped their red colour not to be recognisable – on the streets of Bangkok

[humfurry]

I have also seen it and walked through it it is huge and well organised. Noone could dispere this number of people without massive casualties. Abhisit's statement about removing it but he is not going to say how or when made me laugh. Why cant he accept that he has already lost and if he really believes the red shirts are a tiny minority call elections to see if he has a popular mandate to be the Thai Prime Minister?

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Some red posters here should really seek some psychological assistance quickly. Delusions are a sign that you have overdone the jaa baa a bit.

BKjohn, why do you denigrate posts by people who actually were on site last night?

it is obvious that trying to remove a massive number of highly energized, angry people risks horrifying casualties, on both sides.

and in order to prevent this from happening, indeed what is so unreasonable about calling for elections?

Hmm?

It doesn't matter how many people there were last night for a bit of excitement - when the shit hits the fan they will run – they are nothing but an accumulation of those gangs that rob people here – only strong as long as the opposition is weaker

You can not use thugs in a revolution as you like to call it but in reality it's nothing but a mob. Thugs, scum serve a self interest and when they realize that they are going to loose the run like rabbits.

I remember your leader proclaiming a million red will protest ……. Never happened .. than it was again we expect 200,000 reds to take part …. Again never happened – now you guy's are spreading blunt lies here on TV - your whole mob is based on lies and distortion of facts

Your cattle from Isaan may believe you, but no one with a brain will !!

-

Events may prove u correct, but i doubt it.

i dont think people come to bkk from afair afield to sleep in the street for days mainly because they seek excitement, certainly not the lots of older folk, and kids with children who are present.

a mob ransacks stores, robs, rapes and pillages. nothing like that is going on. it simply isnt.

GO TO RATCHAPRASONG AND SEE FOR YOURSELF.

for the most part these are people who are aggrieved and seek redress.

if you wish to refer to these people as "cattle", you might wish to consider what that says about yourself.

and by the way i am not a Red, but rather a stakeholder in thailand who sympathizes with both sides of the political spectrum here. but when one sees the truth--in this case the size of the Red Tide--being surpressed, its time to speak out.

"stakeholder" Would that be a bamboo stake with a pointy end that you're holding?

[pornsasi]

This PM has to be respected he would have more respect internationally than any other Thai politician , He has handled a difficult situation thoughtfully and tactfully.

I hope he gets through and is given the respect he deserves. Dealing with mafia , thugs and terrorists and inside spies he is calm and looks at the situation for the benefit of the majority of thai people.

90 percent of the red army are only there because they are getting paid . IF Thailand loses him over this it will put them back another 10 years.

Anyway well done PM keep the good work up .

It is not true that 90% are paid . Those from the country side are yes , otherwise they are so poor that they would not be abble to travel . But the majority of red protesters are by now from Bangkok and surrounding .

[jdinasia]

Again --- claims of massive increase in numbers of the reds are 100% NOT backed up with any evidence. Just the statements from people that support the red cause (return of Thaksin?)

The numbers aren't supported by pictures or even by the claims of the reds ... just by some reds on this forum.

JD I have been there and seen it with my own eyes it is huge. I am not a red supporter but when you see the size of this protest you will be amazed. Why dont you go and look for yourself?

Your words stating you are not a red supporter do not match your posts on this board. Why don't I go there? Ummm I live in Chiang Mai? What I do is have eyes and the ability to read and see photos. The fact that only unsubstantiated claims such as yours and earthpig's and no photos etc exist ... well ....

I think that the world press would be backing up these claims ... that the Red leadership would be backing up these claims etc ... but ... nope --- what the reds are saying is that the government is preventing people from getting into the area (and to stop wearing red so you can sneak in!)

Additionally --- I am smart enough NOT to go into an area where sae Daeng's ronin wander around armed ...

[jcbangkok]

Anybody have the link to the interview were Thaksin explained that he should have listed to his wife when she told him he already had enough money and there was no reason for him to get into politics?

[lannarebirth]

animatic or lannarebirth, please would you be so kind as to educate me!

why do the reds not want to wait for scheduled election date do you think?

It cant be down to an army reshuffle can it?

personally, although I hope the reds win the election out of principle.. even though I prefer Mr A... I too wish the reds would go home, and do whatever they do until its time for polls..

thank you.. if you have the time or inclination...

IMO it is a combination of the military reshuffle and succession issues. The military has long had it's nose in various projects in the provinces but as long as their raison d' etre lived they could give the illusion of cohesiveness. If Thaksin were present here during a succession I think he could scoop up alot of military, who are not loyal to him per se but looking to get paid. These would form the backbone of his "muscle" as he moves Thailand to a more authoritarian government. Abhisit IMO is likely to reshuffle in a way where "professional soldiers" are promoted that are not only loyal to ^^^ but also understand they are servants of the people and not their masters. It's a big f'ing mess and it's baby steps forward and possibly giant leaps backward.

This is what I'm talking about:

"We are an army for the nation, for the monarchy and for the people. We will do our job without taking sides. We will follow government policy," Anupong said.

vs. this:

"Thaksin appoints brother Army Chief"

"Thaksin appoints brother in law Police Chief"

"Thaksin brother in law to replace samak as PM"

[robert00]

A disappointing but unsurprising response from the biggest stubborn mule PM the world has ever seen.

You are death right mate, why doesn't he stand down? and let the public decide, problems solved.

[pornsasi]

I visited Ratchaprasong last night. The turn out of Reds is huge, and is increasing markedly by the day. Any discussion of the army attacking it appears to be absolute propaganda, and propaganda that is backfiring as it appears to be drawing more Reds to the battle zone. A Red crowd this massive hasnt been seen since the opening day of the protest weeks back.

It is not the Reds who need to fear the goverment. They understand that if the Army attacks them, the risk is that the soldiers will turn on their own officers. Its hard to believe that the Reds wont continue to move the boundries of of their encampment further out along Sukhumvit. It already runs from MBK to Ploenchit. How long before they own Asoke?

With Red numbers like this, it is the ancien regime who must be quaking in their boots. Any one at Ratchaprasong last night might be forgiven from wondering is this isnt fast turning from a protest into a revolution.

all BS

Oh great. "all BS", you say. BRILLIANT. Simply BRILLIANT. I was going along with everything in the above arguement until I read your STUNNINGLY bright counterarguement. Thank you for clearing everything up for me. Please just post "all BS" again any time you see a report that is false so that I can know what to believe.

Thanks again,

FreedomDude

I agree. You can't say "all BS" if you are not here. I am not wandering among the reds anymore, but can see perhaps thousands of them coming slightly after midnight for the past 2 nights. 3/5 buses, hundreds of motorbikes with 2-3 people on, dozens of pickups. They come down Rajaprarop with much fanfare ~ 12.45 am. They seem not to be from Bangkok.

The Rajaprarop from Petchburi to Indra hotel became one large parking lot.

But one thing is funny about the re-enforcements - if this is a peasant movement asking for more just wealth distribution, why are there many higher class cars among those that are coming protesting, like Mercedes Benz, BMW? You surely aren't a poor farmer if you can afford one of them...

Back to topic, it's not "all BS". They are taking ever larger area. Which should indicate that their numbers are swelling.

That said, the helicopter just made another few rounds with bang fai shot at it as always when it shows up, missing as always also. Just wondering if these idiots shooting the rockets think that what goes up comes down? Or do they really care so little about people who live around them?

It would seem so, given they keep 2 hospitals full of sick people up for 3 weeks already with speakers turned right towards the rooms where patients are recovering, and are willing to physically attack anyone who doesn't agree with them. So burning down their houses wouldn't be a far stretch from that. In US they would call it "collateral damage".

And so I don't need to make another post:

It would be really hard for the army to disperse them. Not only because Anupong doesn't want it or because this could spark civil war.

But look at the area. It is located next to 2 hospitals, full of people. This rules out any chemical agents as the smoke would inevitably get into Police hospital non-airconditioned rooms with open windows.

The aerial offensive is out. Most of the area is right under the elevated Skytrain and unless demolishing the track, they're out of bounds apart from the small area in front of Central World.

Moving the tanks or combat soldiers in from the 4 sides would bring large toll on the army, as they'd be shooting into each other when they close in. There would also be a sizeable armed resistance and the burning mass/entrance blocking lorries and concrete blocks would slow down movements tremendously. There would also be a huge civilian loss of lives, of course, but this post is meant to show the army's problem in dealing with this.

There are many small sois and glass walled shopping malls and hotels, where the redshirts would seek refuge. It would be close to impossible to prevent them from burning these places to the ground. Yes, eventually they would likely get shot or blown up, but not before they destroy the places by great degree. If the army moved in on large roads, the redshirts could easily escape through small sois, and trying to seal off the small sois, which there are many would require a huge number of soldiers and heavy equipment, which is not easy to move to the site without getting spotted.

And finally, the reds are using walkie talkies to communicate to each other so even shutting mobile signal won't do much. You'd have to black out the whole AM and FM spectrum but that would just turn them from organized to guerilla fighting method. Something army can't do, but these rebels sure are more than comfortable to. As a final nail in the coffin of the military operation are the redshirts that are driving taxis, motorbikes, sit at home, work... with their radio on, live broadcasting from Rajprasong. Should the operation start, the entire Bangkok (and via PTV the whole Thailand) will know about it immediately. If the transmission of PTV or their radio is stopped, this would give a signal just like cutting power or mobile coverage. But having the whole fiasco televised would leave no part to imagination.

Both of these are easy to axe - you just need a more powerful transmitter on the same frequency broadcasting a very powerful 1000 Hz beep to get rid of their radio for each of the frequencies, the closer to their transmitter the better; and a signal jammer pointed at receiving antenna at their relay station or into their transmitting antenna at Imperial Lad Phrao. But as said, doing that would signal that the crackdown has begun and even without emitting the actual scenes and speeches, people might join the protests, which could draw huge numbers in that no matter how big watermelon army could and would not be able or willing to stop.

A professional army could. But that's not what Thailand has.

I am sure that Anupong is aware of all of the above and this could be one of the reasons why he is so much against the military intervention. It's a losing battle.

On the other hand, there doesn't seem to be another strategy on getting the area reclaimed by non-violent means.

We all know why, both sides are sitting on their own demands, without any willingness to accept any real compromise - simply because they can't.

It's kind of like Jerusalem issue between Israelis and Palestinians. Both want it. All of it. You can't have 2 owning the same place at the same time in entirety. Same here. Both sides want to amend constitution their own way and oversee the military reshuffle in September. The only way would be to have both sides together amending constitution with the mediation help perhaps, and install army head that is acceptable to both sides. Trouble with that is that such person would have no power and would hence be useless as noone would follow his directives. Even the constitution amendment would come to pulling the strings from both sides, which would often come into conflict where one side wants something while the other is absolutely against it, ruling out any compromise. Such constitution would also be a very bad one, as it would be based on people involved trying to cover their butt rather than improving prosperity of the nation.

So it's a gordian knot. With both sides pulling to make it tighter, but the sword hasn't been invented yet.

Sorry for the long post. Now let me get my fireman's suit to prepare for all your flaming.

Could it be that Anupong is aware that the puppet PM has no popular support and as a result he dont want to repeat the mistake of sept 2006 ?

[agord]

Oh well, thank you to the Reds and Thaksin for destroying Thailand.

Abhisit will go down as the most educated Thai Prime Minister who (as often is the case with intelligent people) had no common sense whatsoever. He has already lost so why not just go for a good old British compromise where noone loses face. Where the buffalo smiley when you need it?

Compromise? Your buddies dont want compromise. No British PM succumed to threats. You know nothing about nothing.... Yeah a double negative just for your ill informed posting

Incorrect, British Prime Ministers have often comrpomised here is an example:

when Margaret Thatcher refused to negotiate with the IRA we had years more of carnage. Later Tony Blair negotiated and compromised and we now have a peaceful situation. That is what is needed in Thailand but Abhisit hasn't got the common sense to realise it.

Red negotiation = give us 100% of what we want no matter how ridiculous or we will petrol bomb you. Nice! I wonder if reds started beheading govt. officials and anyone not supporting them if these lunatic farang on TV would still defend them? oh they just want democracy - BS!

[ALFREDO]

I was in Patong, since the protests in Bangkok started, Phuket-has a good share of Isaan workers and ladys in every business there,

than now some days in Bangkok, Sukhumvit Soi 4, Nana-Nana Plaza

and arrived yesterday in Udon Thani province in a small village.

My thoughts are, if that REDS movement is so big and so many people identify themselves with it, why,

I do not see a sea of red everywhere I go? Everybody can show easy his solidarity with the REDS by dressing red for weeks! No?

In Phuket red dresses=0

In Bangkok during my stay from 20.4.-24.4. I saw one Taxi driver in a UDD shirt and one lady at Nana Plaza in a red eveningdress-coincidence?

I like to wear red and so I did in Bkk also-people stared at me and a lady of the night urged me to change my outfit.

In the Air Asia plane yesterday to Udon, nearly full, the stewardesses and me where the only red dressed, young Thailadys smiled at me, the falang in red.

Evening, shopping in the Big-C Udon Thani city, no red dresses.

Only when I arrived 80 km from Udon in the small village, 5-6 red dressed UDD people gathered

and where on the way to a discussion in Udon city.

Where is the big RED movement, to wear a red shirt to show his point of view, already to much for most people?

Or is that movement not so big as the REDS leaders want us believe it is?

Edited April 25, 2010 by ALFREDO

[pornsasi]

So, you have some Mercedes cars and BM's parked by people joining .... can believe that, every mafia boss drives them and since this is the biggest gathering of criminals of all times, I'm not surprised they are there to see if they can make some money ... you must be a Thai and of course a red

And now the majority of thais are criminals just because they dont agree with you .

Wonderful ...

[agord]

A disappointing but unsurprising response from the biggest stubborn mule PM the world has ever seen.

You are death right mate, why doesn't he stand down? and let the public decide, problems solved.

I want the US out of Iraq - can I go the Washington with a few of my mates and set up camp, maybe lob a few grenades and some blood at the white house? I mean I am sure that most yanks want the same so I would be justified eh?

[landofthefree]

Again --- claims of massive increase in numbers of the reds are 100% NOT backed up with any evidence. Just the statements from people that support the red cause (return of Thaksin?)

The numbers aren't supported by pictures or even by the claims of the reds ... just by some reds on this forum.

JD I have been there and seen it with my own eyes it is huge. I am not a red supporter but when you see the size of this protest you will be amazed. Why dont you go and look for yourself?

Your words stating you are not a red supporter do not match your posts on this board. Why don't I go there? Ummm I live in Chiang Mai? What I do is have eyes and the ability to read and see photos. The fact that only unsubstantiated claims such as yours and earthpig's and no photos etc exist ... well ....

I think that the world press would be backing up these claims ... that the Red leadership would be backing up these claims etc ... but ... nope --- what the reds are saying is that the government is preventing people from getting into the area (and to stop wearing red so you can sneak in!)

Additionally --- I am smart enough NOT to go into an area where sae Daeng's ronin wander around armed ...

Here is an example of what the world press are saying, note the part about the number of reds growing. I go through the reds demonstartion on my way to work most days and have never had any problems with them they are always friendly to me. Contrary to what the reports and embassies may be saying it is not a war zone.

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/redirect.php...Red-Shirts.html

[saintofsilence]

This PM has to be respected he would have more respect internationally than any other Thai politician , He has handled a difficult situation thoughtfully and tactfully.

I hope he gets through and is given the respect he deserves. Dealing with mafia , thugs and terrorists and inside spies he is calm and looks at the situation for the benefit of the majority of thai people.

90 percent of the red army are only there because they are getting paid . IF Thailand loses him over this it will put them back another 10 years.

Anyway well done PM keep the good work up .

It is not true that 90% are paid . Those from the country side are yes , otherwise they are so poor that they would not be abble to travel . But the majority of red protesters are by now from Bangkok and surrounding .

I am not sure where you source information , but what percentage would you say was from bangkok and surrounding ?

[kentucky]

Might be worth a look.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/...Red-Shirts.html

Yes its a good article and kind of scarry . Hope it does not materialise .

I agree in hoping it does not materialize..

Yesterday posters of the prime minister's smiling face with his eyes gouged out were stuck up around the Red Shirts' encampment

Edited April 25, 2010 by kentucky

[Slaps]

I was in Patong, since the protests in Bangkok started, Phuket-has a good share of Isaan workers and ladys in every business there,

than now some days in Bangkok, Sukhumvit Soi 4, Nana-Nana Placa

and arrived yesterday in Udon Thani province in a small village.

My thoughts are, if that REDS movement is so big and so many people identify themselves with it, why,

I do not see a sea of red everywhere I go? Everybody can show easy his solidarity with the REDS by dressing red for weeks! No?

In Phuket red dresses=0

In Bangkok during my stay from 20.4.-24.4. I saw one Taxi driver in a UDD shirt and one lady at Nana Placa in a red eveningdress-coincidence?

I like to wear red and so I did in Bkk also-people stared at me and a lady of the night urged me to change my outfit.

In the Air Asia plane yesterday to Udon, the stewardesses and me where the only red dressed, young Thailadys smiled at me, the falang in red.

Evening, shopping in the Big-C Udon Thani city, no red dresses.

Only when I arrived 80 km from Udon in the small village, 5-6 red dressed UDD people gathered

and where on the way to a discussion in Udon city.

Where is the big RED movement, to wear a red shirt to show his point of view already to much for most people?

Or is that movement not so big as the REDS leaders want us believe it is?

And on that note I can say last night in Cowboy a few of the bars had all their girls wearing White ribbons

No Colour here

[hammered]

I visited Ratchaprasong last night. The turn out of Reds is huge, and is increasing markedly by the day. Any discussion of the army attacking it appears to be absolute propaganda, and propaganda that is backfiring as it appears to be drawing more Reds to the battle zone. A Red crowd this massive hasnt been seen since the opening day of the protest weeks back.

It is not the Reds who need to fear the goverment. They understand that if the Army attacks them, the risk is that the soldiers will turn on their own officers. Its hard to believe that the Reds wont continue to move the boundries of of their encampment further out along Sukhumvit. It already runs from MBK to Ploenchit. How long before they own Asoke?

With Red numbers like this, it is the ancien regime who must be quaking in their boots. Any one at Ratchaprasong last night might be forgiven from wondering is this isnt fast turning from a protest into a revolution.

all BS

Oh great. "all BS", you say. BRILLIANT. Simply BRILLIANT. I was going along with everything in the above arguement until I read your STUNNINGLY bright counterarguement. Thank you for clearing everything up for me. Please just post "all BS" again any time you see a report that is false so that I can know what to believe.

Thanks again,

FreedomDude

I agree. You can't say "all BS" if you are not here. I am not wandering among the reds anymore, but can see perhaps thousands of them coming slightly after midnight for the past 2 nights. 3/5 buses, hundreds of motorbikes with 2-3 people on, dozens of pickups. They come down Rajaprarop with much fanfare ~ 12.45 am. They seem not to be from Bangkok.

The Rajaprarop from Petchburi to Indra hotel became one large parking lot.

But one thing is funny about the re-enforcements - if this is a peasant movement asking for more just wealth distribution, why are there many higher class cars among those that are coming protesting, like Mercedes Benz, BMW? You surely aren't a poor farmer if you can afford one of them...

Back to topic, it's not "all BS". They are taking ever larger area. Which should indicate that their numbers are swelling.

That said, the helicopter just made another few rounds with bang fai shot at it as always when it shows up, missing as always also. Just wondering if these idiots shooting the rockets think that what goes up comes down? Or do they really care so little about people who live around them?

It would seem so, given they keep 2 hospitals full of sick people up for 3 weeks already with speakers turned right towards the rooms where patients are recovering, and are willing to physically attack anyone who doesn't agree with them. So burning down their houses wouldn't be a far stretch from that. In US they would call it "collateral damage".

And so I don't need to make another post:

It would be really hard for the army to disperse them. Not only because Anupong doesn't want it or because this could spark civil war.

But look at the area. It is located next to 2 hospitals, full of people. This rules out any chemical agents as the smoke would inevitably get into Police hospital non-airconditioned rooms with open windows.

The aerial offensive is out. Most of the area is right under the elevated Skytrain and unless demolishing the track, they're out of bounds apart from the small area in front of Central World.

Moving the tanks or combat soldiers in from the 4 sides would bring large toll on the army, as they'd be shooting into each other when they close in. There would also be a sizeable armed resistance and the burning mass/entrance blocking lorries and concrete blocks would slow down movements tremendously. There would also be a huge civilian loss of lives, of course, but this post is meant to show the army's problem in dealing with this.

There are many small sois and glass walled shopping malls and hotels, where the redshirts would seek refuge. It would be close to impossible to prevent them from burning these places to the ground. Yes, eventually they would likely get shot or blown up, but not before they destroy the places by great degree. If the army moved in on large roads, the redshirts could easily escape through small sois, and trying to seal off the small sois, which there are many would require a huge number of soldiers and heavy equipment, which is not easy to move to the site without getting spotted.

And finally, the reds are using walkie talkies to communicate to each other so even shutting mobile signal won't do much. You'd have to black out the whole AM and FM spectrum but that would just turn them from organized to guerilla fighting method. Something army can't do, but these rebels sure are more than comfortable to. As a final nail in the coffin of the military operation are the redshirts that are driving taxis, motorbikes, sit at home, work... with their radio on, live broadcasting from Rajprasong. Should the operation start, the entire Bangkok (and via PTV the whole Thailand) will know about it immediately. If the transmission of PTV or their radio is stopped, this would give a signal just like cutting power or mobile coverage. But having the whole fiasco televised would leave no part to imagination.

Both of these are easy to axe - you just need a more powerful transmitter on the same frequency broadcasting a very powerful 1000 Hz beep to get rid of their radio for each of the frequencies, the closer to their transmitter the better; and a signal jammer pointed at receiving antenna at their relay station or into their transmitting antenna at Imperial Lad Phrao. But as said, doing that would signal that the crackdown has begun and even without emitting the actual scenes and speeches, people might join the protests, which could draw huge numbers in that no matter how big watermelon army could and would not be able or willing to stop.

A professional army could. But that's not what Thailand has.

I am sure that Anupong is aware of all of the above and this could be one of the reasons why he is so much against the military intervention. It's a losing battle.

On the other hand, there doesn't seem to be another strategy on getting the area reclaimed by non-violent means.

We all know why, both sides are sitting on their own demands, without any willingness to accept any real compromise - simply because they can't.

It's kind of like Jerusalem issue between Israelis and Palestinians. Both want it. All of it. You can't have 2 owning the same place at the same time in entirety. Same here. Both sides want to amend constitution their own way and oversee the military reshuffle in September. The only way would be to have both sides together amending constitution with the mediation help perhaps, and install army head that is acceptable to both sides. Trouble with that is that such person would have no power and would hence be useless as noone would follow his directives. Even the constitution amendment would come to pulling the strings from both sides, which would often come into conflict where one side wants something while the other is absolutely against it, ruling out any compromise. Such constitution would also be a very bad one, as it would be based on people involved trying to cover their butt rather than improving prosperity of the nation.

So it's a gordian knot. With both sides pulling to make it tighter, but the sword hasn't been invented yet.

Sorry for the long post. Now let me get my fireman's suit to prepare for all your flaming.

A good assessment of the complexities of this stand off. It looks set to last a long time.

[pornsasi]

I was in Patong, since the protests in Bangkok started, Phuket-has a good share of Isaan workers and ladys in every business there,

than now some days in Bangkok, Sukhumvit Soi 4, Nana-Nana Placa

and arrived yesterday in Udon Thani province in a small village.

My thoughts are, if that REDS movement is so big and so many people identify themselves with it, why,

I do not see a sea of red everywhere I go? Everybody can show easy his solidarity with the REDS by dressing red for weeks! No?

In Phuket red dresses=0

In Bangkok during my stay from 20.4.-24.4. I saw one Taxi driver in a UDD shirt and one lady at Nana Placa in a red eveningdress-coincidence?

I like to wear red and so I did in Bkk also-people stared at me and a lady of the night urged me to change my outfit.

In the Air Asia plane yesterday to Udon, the stewardesses and me where the only red dressed, young Thailadys smiled at me, the falang in red.

Evening, shopping in the Big-C Udon Thani city, no red dresses.

Only when I arrived 80 km from Udon in the small village, 5-6 red dressed UDD people gathered

and where on the way to a discussion in Udon city.

Where is the big RED movement, to wear a red shirt to show his point of view already to much for most people?

Or is that movement not so big as the REDS leaders want us believe it is?

So all the Air Asia staff are reds because they wear red uniforms ?

Lets have a popular election , best way to see who are supporting the reds and who are not .

But Abhisit wont have that , not that he is against maybe , but because he has been told not to accept it

[BKjohn]

I was in Patong, since the protests in Bangkok started, Phuket-has a good share of Isaan workers and ladys in every business there,

than now some days in Bangkok, Sukhumvit Soi 4, Nana-Nana Placa

and arrived yesterday in Udon Thani province in a small village.

My thoughts are, if that REDS movement is so big and so many people identify themselves with it, why,

I do not see a sea of red everywhere I go? Everybody can show easy his solidarity with the REDS by dressing red for weeks! No?

In Phuket red dresses=0

In Bangkok during my stay from 20.4.-24.4. I saw one Taxi driver in a UDD shirt and one lady at Nana Placa in a red eveningdress-coincidence?

I like to wear red and so I did in Bkk also-people stared at me and a lady of the night urged me to change my outfit.

In the Air Asia plane yesterday to Udon, the stewardesses and me where the only red dressed, young Thailadys smiled at me, the falang in red.

Evening, shopping in the Big-C Udon Thani city, no red dresses.

Only when I arrived 80 km from Udon in the small village, 5-6 red dressed UDD people gathered

and where on the way to a discussion in Udon city.

Where is the big RED movement, to wear a red shirt to show his point of view already to much for most people?

Or is that movement not so big as the REDS leaders want us believe it is?

The Isaanies working in Phuket are probably more than upset with those thugs in Bangkok because they won't have a job anymore soon.

The red follow basic propaganda methods .. remember Hitler or Goebbels were still claiming victory with the Russians 30 miles from Berlin

Sadam was not telling his people that they were getting their ass whopped but proclaimed victory of the jeehad

Thaksin must have studied them all and ordered the red leaders to follow their example - not that this gathering of criminals can be compared with any of the before mentioned of course, they are nothing but cowards hiding behind their women and children, the worse kind

[agord]

The authoritarian farangs who post here are likely to get what they are drooling for - a massacre.

So the Reds threaten this, that & the other? So what else power have the poor got? They have been blocked from the ballot, they got no machine guns, tanks or artillery, & little money.

Their crooked 'leader' is removed by the equally crooked mafiosi of BKK.

What they got left but protest & verbals?

Whenever democracy raises its head in Thailand, the answer from BKK is a massacre. If the rednecks read a little history, they would know this. But authoritarians don't want to know. They don't want democracy, they want 'peace, law & order' - like you get in a prison or a graveyard. The residents there have limited ability to disturb the fun of expat wrinklies. The latter will be able to smile on in the Land of Smiles.

Others, pray for a miracle. OGT

I agree with you .

I have been reading the foreign press (CNN,BBC ,Le Monde, Amnesty international and others ) for last 5 weeks on the BKK events , nowhere , not a single time have i seen the red shirt movement described as a terrorist movement .

Those who called the red shirts terrorists and call for their physical anhilation are best described as cretins

Edit: Typo

So what do you call people who think it's a good idea to bring 1 million glass bottles to BKK with the intent of filling them up with petrol and for those that try and stop them "will disappear from this world"? hmmm? What would you call people who steal grenade launchers and assault rifles from the military? What would you call these people in your own country? Are you for real?!

[danc]

I am not a big fan of the Telegraph Newspaper but I do flick through various publications when on Yahoo and wanting a broader look at the news. Read an interesting article yesterday. May not be 100% factual but it does go to show how others view this matter. In many ways it made scary reading for the future of Thailand as things stand at present.

Might be worth a look.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/...Red-Shirts.html

Thanks for the link. A very interesting article from a quality British newspaper (which incidentaly is politicaly very right wing.) All Thai visa posters should read this uncensored report it may make you think again.

Yup, you would expect the article to be on the incumbent's side - this newspaper would be the breakfast read of his former classmate, Boris Johnson, the conservative party Mayor of London, for example and indeed Eton School, that great bastion of the British establishment, in general!

I have endeavoured to neutrally make this point for a while now that world media does not see things quite the same way the government here wants - just yesterday, there was another BBC report - see live Saturday for the link posted by Maestro late last night - in which the interview with a falang Bkk resident concluded with her stating that she never felt threatened by the Reds as she walked amongst them, this after the grenade incident.

Don't jump on me for posting this - but how this crisis is being perceived on the international stage is hugely important in determining what happens when and how. I conjecture again that the protestors are winning this media battle, the international one and indeed are paying much attention to it. Rightly or wrongly and I suggest Thaksin's hand here, they know that they can at least have a level playing field and find sympathatic ears, unlike here in LOS, given the tendency of all Thai governments both now and in the past, particularly under Thaksin himself, to control and manipulate the media in-country.

The question might well be does Abhsist care? One can only speculate, but one might suggest that somebody born in the UK and educated in the UK is quite internationally media aware and so does see the importance of what they write...and is perhaps feeling a little frustrated that the government's message that these Reds are a bunch of "terrorists" is not getting across?

Edited April 25, 2010 by danc

[jcbangkok]

JD I have been there and seen it with my own eyes it is huge. I am not a red supporter but when you see the size of this protest you will be amazed. Why dont you go and look for yourself?

PLEASE SHOW US YOUR PICTURES

I have been there a number of times with the last being the day before the grenade attacks. Each time the one thing that shocks me is how small the red shirt group is compared to the photos and news reports. It is easy to make groups look bigger in the media. In fact when you go to the red site you see they have numerous projectors set up going back from the stage but none of them are being used because the people don't go that far back.

The below were taken in the days following the group all moving to their current location. The first picture looks like a rather large crowd taken from the first sky bridge but the second is from the next sky bridge and you can see they only reach to the first sky bridge even though they are very spread out.

Point is, this was pretty much at the peak of their numbers there for day time crowds.

This one is looking the other way from the bridge. As you can see they have certainly claimed a lot of area with vehicles and such but the number of folks is not that great, even at the peak of their numbers though I will admit the numbers previously grew at night.

Edited April 25, 2010 by jcbangkok

[pornsasi]

This PM has to be respected he would have more respect internationally than any other Thai politician , He has handled a difficult situation thoughtfully and tactfully.

I hope he gets through and is given the respect he deserves. Dealing with mafia , thugs and terrorists and inside spies he is calm and looks at the situation for the benefit of the majority of thai people.

90 percent of the red army are only there because they are getting paid . IF Thailand loses him over this it will put them back another 10 years.

Anyway well done PM keep the good work up .

It is not true that 90% are paid . Those from the country side are yes , otherwise they are so poor that they would not be abble to travel . But the majority of red protesters are by now from Bangkok and surrounding .

I am not sure where you source information , but what percentage would you say was from bangkok and surrounding ?

I read somewhere about 70% and it was not in a pro-red publication , if there is any left ....LOL.

[rixalex]

I am not a red supporter

Your history of posts tells a very different story, as does the fact you seem to suggest you have joined the protest - let me guess, just an interested observer tagging along with teerak and the in-laws?

[hammered]

2 BKK has a comment on the naming of Chavalit by Abhisit. For anyone wanting an insight into things it is worth reading

[earthpig]

I have also seen it and walked through it it is huge and well organised. Noone could dispere this number of people without massive casualties. Abhisit's statement about removing it but he is not going to say how or when made me laugh. Why cant he accept that he has already lost and if he really believes the red shirts are a tiny minority call elections to see if he has a popular mandate to be the Thai Prime Minister?

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Some red posters here should really seek some psychological assistance quickly. Delusions are a sign that you have overdone the jaa baa a bit.

I am not a red shirt supporter but I have been to the protest and seen how diferent it is to the reports in the government controlled and censored media. Have you been there?

no poster who actually visited Ratchaprasong last night denies the massive size of the crowd, or the obvious massacre that would occur if the army went in.

the people who deny reality are those like jcbangkok who live in a virtual fantasy world, and are in too deep to realize that.

• 
  

[jcbangkok]

I have also seen it and walked through it it is huge and well organised. Noone could dispere this number of people without massive casualties. Abhisit's statement about removing it but he is not going to say how or when made me laugh. Why cant he accept that he has already lost and if he really believes the red shirts are a tiny minority call elections to see if he has a popular mandate to be the Thai Prime Minister?

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Some red posters here should really seek some psychological assistance quickly. Delusions are a sign that you have overdone the jaa baa a bit.

I am not a red shirt supporter but I have been to the protest and seen how diferent it is to the reports in the government controlled and censored media. Have you been there?

no poster who actually visited Ratchaprasong last night denies the massive size of the crowd, or the obvious massacre that would occur if the army went in.

the people who deny reality are those like jcbangkok who live in a virtual fantasy world, and are in too deep to realize that.

• 
  

PLEASE POST US YOUR PICTURES FROM YOUR VISIT

[earthpig]

JD I have been there and seen it with my own eyes it is huge. I am not a red supporter but when you see the size of this protest you will be amazed. Why dont you go and look for yourself?

PLEASE SHOW US YOUR PICTURES

I have been there a number of times with the last being the day before the grenade attacks. Each time the one thing that shocks me is how small the red shirt group is compared to the photos and news reports. It is easy to make groups look bigger in the media. In fact when you go to the red site you see they have numerous projectors set up going back from the stage but none of them are being used because the people don't go that far back.

The below were taken in the days following the group all moving to their current location. The first picture looks like a rather large crowd taken from the first sky bridge but the second is from the next sky bridge and you can see they only reach to the first sky bridge even though they are very spread out.

Point is, this was pretty much at the peak of their numbers there for day time crowds.

This one is looking the other way from the bridge. As you can see they have certainly claimed a lot of area with vehicles and such but the number of folks is not that great, even at the peak of their numbers though I will admit the numbers previously grew at night.

these pictures prove my point. the numbers were small when they were taken.

last night these same streets were packed with humanity.

Red Tide rising.

[pornsasi]

The authoritarian farangs who post here are likely to get what they are drooling for - a massacre.

So the Reds threaten this, that & the other? So what else power have the poor got? They have been blocked from the ballot, they got no machine guns, tanks or artillery, & little money.

Their crooked 'leader' is removed by the equally crooked mafiosi of BKK.

What they got left but protest & verbals?

Whenever democracy raises its head in Thailand, the answer from BKK is a massacre. If the rednecks read a little history, they would know this. But authoritarians don't want to know. They don't want democracy, they want 'peace, law & order' - like you get in a prison or a graveyard. The residents there have limited ability to disturb the fun of expat wrinklies. The latter will be able to smile on in the Land of Smiles.

Others, pray for a miracle. OGT

I agree with you .

I have been reading the foreign press (CNN,BBC ,Le Monde, Amnesty international and others ) for last 5 weeks on the BKK events , nowhere , not a single time have i seen the red shirt movement described as a terrorist movement .

Those who called the red shirts terrorists and call for their physical anhilation are best described as cretins

Edit: Typo

So what do you call people who think it's a good idea to bring 1 million glass bottles to BKK with the intent of filling them up with petrol and for those that try and stop them "will disappear from this world"? hmmm? What would you call people who steal grenade launchers and assault rifles from the military? What would you call these people in your own country? Are you for real?!

Filling the bottle with what ? Sarsi or red bull ? Its hot you know .

Seriously because a few idiots , Arisman , Sae Daeng are asking to burn

Bangkok or sack shopping malls does not mean the immense majority of red

will do it . Bangkok is not on fire , shopping malls are not sacked .

As for stealing weapons of war , perhaps those were abandoned by soldiers

how can they steal those tell me ? And i heard that weapons were returned

to the army or police .

Dont oversimplify

[Pakboong]

Oh well, thank you to the Reds and Thaksin for destroying Thailand.

Abhisit will go down as the most educated Thai Prime Minister who (as often is the case with intelligent people) had no common sense whatsoever. He has already lost so why not just go for a good old British compromise where noone loses face. Where the buffalo smiley when you need it?

Main issue is not his arrogance, not his intelligence, nor even his common sense....

they just expected him to act like a Thai, and he DIDN'T!]

Must have been quite confusing for many of them....

He acted like a national leader would be expected to act most anywhere else.

And there is the problem, he's really Thai, but his education bred much of the

raw roots out of him and replaced it with a proper international perspective.

Which of course is rather confusing to many, if not all, Thais.

Farang BAA!

How could you not know that the guy is 100% Chinese.