Standard House Specifications

[Morden]

I have heard that the Thai government publishes a set of full house specifications. The idea is that individuals with land can choose a specification from the range offered, show it to a builder, agree a price and get exactly what it says on the tin and nothing overlooked. So, no hidden extras.

Has anyone heard of this scheme, please? Any idea where we can get our hands on them. If it helps, we are in the UK and will build close to Korat.

[chownah]

Our tambon administrative office has 3 or 4 books of plans...each with a different emphasis. A couple of them are for houses and a couple of them are for store fronts. These are complete drawing sets with structural, electrical, roof truss, finishing, stairs, everything. It is all in Thai language of course. I can borrow them at no charge....so to start I suggest finding your local tambon administrative office and ask them.

PS Each book has complete plans for 2 or more buildings....they cover everything from small wooden houses to 4 story all concrete and steel shop houses.

Edited June 10, 2005 by chownah

[Morden]

Chownah,

Many thanks for your reply. That's just what I needed to know. We'll be in the local office next time we are over there. The way that things are going, that will be next month to buy the land!

Morden

[ProThaiExpat]

I wouldn't want to live in any standard Thai house I have ever seen!!!

Take little comfort in the fact that you have detailed plans with specifications. I had both, made two visits a day to the job site and still had all the problems one hears about in this forum.

Lower your expectations to the minimum and you will feel less disapointment.

[chownah]

I wouldn't want to live in any standard Thai house I have ever seen!!!

Take little comfort in the fact that you have detailed plans with  specifications.  I had both, made two visits a day to the job site and still had all the problems one hears about in this forum.

Lower your expectations to the minimum and you will feel less disapointment.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

The plans include some houses at the minimum level and some that look pretty upscale with breeze ways, balconies, interesting roof lines, etc. Maybe you could go have a look and then report back on your impressions after you have seen what they have to offer. I do agree with you completely that having detailed plans does not mean you will get a house built to the specifications in the plans...constant vigilance is the only way.....or blind luck in picking your contractor. I have a friend who had a home built in Hua Hin in a rather upscale houseing development...constructed by the owner of the development....and he still had months of delays and several problems to deal with...it seems that he has them all finally worked out...but it has taken several months to do it...and this happened in a circumstance where you would expect minimal problems. I took full charge of building my house...and it has taken forever....but the result has been good and even saved a few baht. And by the way I don't have any plans for the house.

Edited June 10, 2005 by chownah

[Morden]

Many thanks for your advice, folks. I'm not totally surprised at what you say, of course. Much the same in the UK - take your eye off the contractor and your cavity wall insulation has been moved to the next site! The builder that we may use is a family friend and came to our wedding so there's a chance that we can keep him to the deal. I just can't be in LOS for the all of the time that he will need to build - unfortunately. Perhaps I can rely on the family to watch him.

[chownah]

Many thanks for your advice, folks. I'm not totally surprised at what you say, of course. Much the same in the UK - take your eye off the contractor and your cavity wall insulation has been moved to the next site! The builder that we may use is a family friend and came to our wedding so there's a chance that we can keep him to the deal. I just can't be in LOS for the all of the time that he will need to build - unfortunately.   Perhaps I can rely on the family to watch him.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Sounds like with a little luck you should be alright.

Just one more bit of advise. When the house is finished and you do come to see it for the first time...if there are problems.....try to not look shocked, disgusted, or angry....try to just smile and say something positive. In Thailand in a situation like that if you get angry it will probably lead people to make a snap judgement about you that will stick for a long time. By keeping your cool it will help them make a good judgement about you. And...don't worry too much about problems with the house....they can all be straightened out later....it is easier to fix the problems with your house than it is to fix a bad image with the family and neighbors. Someday you may live in a different house but you will still have the same family and friends.

[ozzydom]

I wouldn't want to live in any standard Thai house I have ever seen!!!

Take little comfort in the fact that you have detailed plans with  specifications.  I had both, made two visits a day to the job site and still had all the problems one hears about in this forum.

Lower your expectations to the minimum and you will feel less disapointment.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

The plans include some houses at the minimum level and some that look pretty upscale with breeze ways, balconies, interesting roof lines, etc. Maybe you could go have a look and then report back on your impressions after you have seen what they have to offer. I do agree with you completely that having detailed plans does not mean you will get a house built to the specifications in the plans...constant vigilance is the only way.....or blind luck in picking your contractor. I have a friend who had a home built in Hua Hin in a rather upscale houseing development...constructed by the owner of the development....and he still had months of delays and several problems to deal with...it seems that he has them all finally worked out...but it has taken several months to do it...and this happened in a circumstance where you would expect minimal problems. I took full charge of building my house...and it has taken forever....but the result has been good and even saved a few baht. And by the way I don't have any plans for the house.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Chownah, maybe you can enlighten me, is it legal (or allowed )to do your own plans here ,do you have to lodge them wth relevant dept etc . We are looking to build at village and have designed a Queenslander style. Am looking at using abrick style we found on Hang Dong RD ,imported I believe.. Cement bricks 300 x 150 x100 can be glued or mortared.very impressive by thai standards. Single skin gives you a 6 inch wall

[Morden]

Chownah,

Thank for your sound advice. Transactions can be frustrating at times, I know, and I'll bear in mind what you say.

The builder is well known in the area and has a reputation to maintain so I have high hopes that there will be no serious quality problems. He has offered to help us choose some materials such as tiles and include them in a fixed price for the job. My wife says that she will ask him for a contract that includes penalties if he's late finishing - I hope that she can achieve that.

It's very important to have a detailed specification, I think, and that's why I was trying to trace standard official ones. From the advice I'm getting here I have the feeling that they are uninspiring so I might abandon that route. When we go out to buy the land we will spend some time with the builder looking at houses to get ideas on plans. But saying 'We'll have one like that' doesn't ensure that everything turns as it should. If anyone has advice on this route, I'd be glad to have it.

Thanks again,

Morden

[chownah]

Chownah,

Thank for your sound advice. Transactions can be frustrating at times, I know, and I'll bear in mind what you say.

The builder is well known in the area and has a reputation to maintain so I have high hopes that there will be no serious quality problems. He has offered to help us choose some materials such as tiles and include them in a fixed price for the job. My wife says that she will ask him for a contract that includes penalties if he's late finishing - I hope that she can achieve that.

It's very important to have a detailed specification, I think, and that's why I was trying to trace standard official ones. From the advice I'm getting here I have the feeling that they are uninspiring so I might abandon that route. When we go out to buy the land we will spend some time with the builder looking at houses to get ideas on plans. But saying 'We'll have one like that' doesn't ensure that everything turns as it should. If anyone has advice on this route, I'd be glad to have it.

Thanks again,

Morden

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

You might check them out before you decide if they are uninspired. As I said before I didn't have plans but then I'm experienced in building and what I did is not practical for most people. Also there are tons of other sets of plans which can be purchased in books...I think they are available at book stores but as I said before I've never used them...maybe someone here has some info on these books...they're not expensive (or so I've been told). Perhaps your prospective builder has some plans or knows where to get some. It would probably be an advantage to use plans that the builder is already familiar with.

[chownah]

I wouldn't want to live in any standard Thai house I have ever seen!!!

Take little comfort in the fact that you have detailed plans with  specifications.  I had both, made two visits a day to the job site and still had all the problems one hears about in this forum.

Lower your expectations to the minimum and you will feel less disapointment.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

The plans include some houses at the minimum level and some that look pretty upscale with breeze ways, balconies, interesting roof lines, etc. Maybe you could go have a look and then report back on your impressions after you have seen what they have to offer. I do agree with you completely that having detailed plans does not mean you will get a house built to the specifications in the plans...constant vigilance is the only way.....or blind luck in picking your contractor. I have a friend who had a home built in Hua Hin in a rather upscale houseing development...constructed by the owner of the development....and he still had months of delays and several problems to deal with...it seems that he has them all finally worked out...but it has taken several months to do it...and this happened in a circumstance where you would expect minimal problems. I took full charge of building my house...and it has taken forever....but the result has been good and even saved a few baht. And by the way I don't have any plans for the house.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Chownah, maybe you can enlighten me, is it legal (or allowed )to do your own plans here ,do you have to lodge them wth relevant dept etc . We are looking to build at village and have designed a Queenslander style. Am looking at using abrick style we found on Hang Dong RD ,imported I believe.. Cement bricks 300 x 150 x100 can be glued or mortared.very impressive by thai standards. Single skin gives you a 6 inch wall

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I don't know the requirements for plans in Thailand. Don't know who can make them or what all has to be included. If you find out let me know.

I live in the north. Where I live the tambon is divided up into areas and in certain areas you need to have a building permit and lots of inspections. I'm lucky that I don't live in one of these areas and there is no permit needed and the only inspection is electrical......and is very loose. No drawing is required for the electrical...the inspector just crawls through your attic or whatever and looks at the wiring...suggests improvements..and leaves. My uncle did most of the wiring and he knows the inspector so he just told the inspector that he had made the changes and we didn't even get reinspected. Also the village poo yai baan is suppossed to come by to see if the house is finished so he can make a house book for it and give you your address...but he doesn't inspect anything really...I've been told he is supposed to be sure that you have a toilet and that's all.

Maybe you could check out what type of jurisdiction you are in and you might be lucky too. The bricks sound like a nice idea. I hope you are able to build what you have described and keep us all informed with your progress with pictures etc.

[SpaceKadet]

The house plans I've seen in the books at the Tambon office are pretty similar, if not the same as some plans on this site but generally 30% cheaper.

Your basic 2 bedroom house was priced at 500.000 baht. Don't know what standard that was though. It went up to 3-4 million for the larger houses. It was a mixed bag really, some of the smaller ones didn't have a kitchen, while some of the midrange 3 bedrooms were quite attractive designs. The price there was something like 2 million, but this will obviously vary depending on materials you choose.

I think this is all sponsored by Mr. T and his party. His picture was all over the plan books.

[Morden]

Spacekadet,

Thanks for the link. At the very least that gives me a some guide prices for various styles.

[ProThaiExpat]

My first post in this thread sure came off negative, when it was only my mood at the time.

I certainly suggest a detailed building plan and specifications. While you can't expect complete adherence to them, at least your farther along getting what you want than if you had no plans.

My project developer took my floor plan and paid an archtect to make a eight page building plan out of it. (5k Baht) The process refined my thinking on what I wanted and after a few revisions, I came pretty close to getting to what I wanted. The plan was approved by the local government office. There may have been an inspection.

Areas in which I had no real interest, ie. roof design, I paid little attention to, but bathroom and kitchen design I was all over.

My house is a "western" living "great room" style house, quite foreign to Thais, so their "thinking" and mine were at a divergence most of the time.

Likewise I had a poor job foreman who made many silly mistaks by not paying attention to the plan, but building as he was accustomed. Corrections to conform to the plan were made gladly, quickly and in most cases, unnoticeably, but the escalation of costs as a result put the developer to the "wall" on profitability.

Example, while specs made it clear that all floor levels were to be flat, without any variance, the architect had the traditional step downs into bathrooms, closets, etc. typical of Thai houses on the plans. I didn't pick up on it until on site inspection, corrected immediately, but at a cost.

Fortunately, I am a strong believer in "form" follows "function" in design, so once I got the function built right, I worried less on the form, ie finish detail, which is where many from the west find fault with Thai building standards.

I chose and bought all my finish materials such as tile, cabinets, fixtures and the like so the builder was only faced with installation. Thus the "function" and the "form" were controllable in this regard.

I have often been motivated to start a thread on what to look out for when building in Thailand, that could be checked out by those going into the process, but haven't.

Example:

1. Rooms without structural members intruding into the space, whether it be in corners or right in the middle of the room. Thais tend to put sructural members showing inside the house, when it is easy enough to have them show on the outside. Interior structural members in the middle of a room are common, but avoidable by "beefing up" load bearing beams above the ceiling line.

2. Lowered floor levels in bathrooms, kitchens and closets. Thais wash these rooms with "buckets of water" while westerners use mops and contolled amounts of water. My personal preference is level floors for ease of cleaning and avoiding tripping accidents, easy to provide for if one is alert.

3. Attnetion to privacy. Thais will put windows opposite windows of adjoing houses, some projects you can look "through" the alignment of windows in many houses in a row. Pay attention to wall, window and glass block orientation to maximize privacy and take advantage of sight lines! With no zoning restrictions enforced on any lot, it is easy to build you house anywhere on the lot where you can take adavantage of maximum light, sun, view and privacy. My windows on my one neighbors side and the street are "above eyeline" so I get the light, but still have the privacy. What good are windows if the window covering is drawn all the time for privacy.

4. An electric gate opener and an enclosed garage with electric garage door opener are major conveniences rarely seen in Thai houses, easy to do when building yourself. Planned garage storage is a major consideration.

5. Ceiling height is generally good in Thailand and should be extended at the same level in bathrooms where the high ceiling allows for steam dispersion.

6. Water heaters located other than in shower enclosures is a plus when building yourself. Seprerated toilet facilities from shower and vanity is a nice amenity, easy when building off your own plans.

7. A general tip I learned from a smart architect years ago, is to make a furniture plan for every room on your drawings, after all, the furniture really dictates many design decisions. Thus when planning the size of a bedroom, the size of the furniture and its placement will dictate the placement of closets, you can do builtins if your on your own plans, doors, etc. Every room will ultimately be dictated by the furniture, especially window placement, size and sight line, etc.

8. Your reflected ceiling plan should place your lighting sources to where your furniture is designed to be placed. Dimmers, downlights and "fisheyes" are easily doable on your own plan. Insist on all elevations showing on your plan so you don't miss window, door and cabinet placements.

9. Thai doors are installed to swing out. Sliding glass windows are installed on the outside and screens put on the inside. Then, bars are placed over the outside of the window for "security", because the sliding glass windows can be removed if placed on the outside, not if placed on the inside track. Screens are kept cleaner on the inside, but for one who hates screens, they belong on the outside track in my view. No bars on my windowns as they can't be removed from the outside. My double front doors open inward. All easily doable at the time of construction.

And on it goes. I sure which I had the wise members of Thaivisa to help me when I built, I would have saved a lot of heartache.

[lopburi3]

A lot of good information from PTE above. I would differ a little in that did use raised sill for bathroom and slanted floor (although not lower than room at start of slant) as it is still being washed in the normal Thai way.

For closets I would be very conservative and not have any if at all possible because of the mildew and mold problems with high humidity and no air circulation. If we must have our walk in wardrobe at least leave off the door and use loose fitting folding type or some other non sealing type entry.

Have mentioned several time the kitchen requirements for frying in a wok are much different than we may be used to and highly advise having an easy to clean open area (semi outside) for this activity. We can put our BBQs in the same area.

By all means do your own shopping for tile, fixtures, lights if you can. And the most important thing (which many can not do) is to have someone with some knowledge (and more important the will to question) watch everything. Pride of workmanship is not a high priority for most work crews as the money seems to not get down to the workers. Tips to the lowest rank can sometimes be very beneficial.

[Wee Jimmy]

My first post in this thread sure came off negative, when it was only my mood at the time.

I certainly suggest a detailed building plan and specifications.  While you can't expect complete adherence to them, at least your farther along getting what you want than if you had no plans.

My project developer took my floor plan and paid an archtect to make a eight page building plan out of it. (5k Baht)  The process refined my thinking on what I wanted and after a few revisions, I came pretty close to getting to what I wanted. The plan was approved by the local government office.  There may have been an inspection.

Areas in which I had no real interest, ie. roof design, I paid little attention to, but bathroom and kitchen design I was all over.

My house is a "western" living "great room" style house, quite foreign to Thais, so their "thinking" and mine were at a divergence most of the time.

Morden,

          Remember when you buy your land that if you have to build it up you will have to leave it for a couple of years so it can settle and compress after the rainy seasons. 

Likewise I had a poor job foreman who made many silly mistaks by not paying attention to the plan, but building as he was accustomed.  Corrections to conform to the plan were made gladly, quickly and in most cases, unnoticeably, but the escalation of costs as a result put the developer to the "wall" on profitability.

Example, while specs made it clear that all floor levels were to be flat, without any variance, the architect had the traditional step downs into bathrooms, closets, etc. typical of Thai houses on the plans. I didn't pick up on it until on site inspection, corrected immediately, but at a cost.

Fortunately, I am a strong believer in "form" follows "function" in design, so once I got the function built right, I worried less on the form, ie finish detail, which is where many from the west find fault with Thai building standards.

I chose and bought all my finish materials such as tile, cabinets, fixtures and the like so the builder was only faced with installation.  Thus the "function" and the "form" were controllable in this regard.

I have often been motivated to start a thread on what to look out for when building in Thailand, that could be checked out by those going into the process, but haven't.

Example:

1.  Rooms without structural members intruding into the space, whether it be in corners or right in the middle of the room. Thais tend to put sructural members showing inside the house, when it is easy enough to have them show on the outside.  Interior structural members in the middle of a room are common, but avoidable by "beefing up" load bearing beams above the ceiling line.

2.  Lowered floor levels in bathrooms, kitchens and closets.  Thais wash these rooms with "buckets of water" while westerners use mops and contolled amounts of water.  My personal preference is level floors for ease of cleaning and avoiding tripping accidents, easy to provide for if one is alert.

3.  Attnetion to privacy.  Thais will put windows opposite windows of adjoing houses, some projects you can look "through" the alignment of windows in many houses in a row.  Pay attention to wall, window and glass block orientation to maximize privacy and take advantage of sight lines!  With no zoning restrictions enforced on any lot, it is easy to build you house anywhere on the lot where you can take adavantage of maximum light, sun, view and privacy.  My windows on my one neighbors side and the street are "above eyeline" so I get the light, but still have the privacy.  What good are windows if the window covering is drawn all the time for privacy.

4. An electric gate opener and an enclosed garage with electric garage door opener are major conveniences rarely seen in Thai houses, easy to do when building yourself. Planned garage storage is a major consideration.

5.  Ceiling height is generally good in Thailand and should be extended at the same level in bathrooms where the high ceiling allows for steam dispersion.

6.  Water heaters located other than in shower enclosures is a plus when building yourself.  Seprerated toilet facilities from shower and vanity is a nice amenity, easy when building off your own plans.

7.  A general tip I learned from a smart architect years ago, is to make a furniture plan for every room on your drawings, after all, the furniture really dictates many design decisions.  Thus when planning the size of a bedroom, the size of the furniture and its placement will dictate the placement of closets, you can do builtins if your on your own plans, doors, etc.  Every room will ultimately be dictated by the furniture, especially window placement, size and sight line, etc.

8.  Your reflected ceiling plan should place your lighting sources to where your furniture is designed to be placed.  Dimmers, downlights and "fisheyes" are easily doable on your own plan.  Insist on all elevations showing on your plan so you don't miss window, door and cabinet placements.

9.  Thai doors are installed to swing out.  Sliding glass windows are installed on the outside and screens put on the inside.  Then, bars are placed over the outside of the window for "security", because the sliding glass windows can be removed if placed on the outside, not if placed on the inside track.  Screens are kept cleaner on the inside, but for one who hates screens, they belong on the outside track in my view.  No bars on my windowns as they can't be removed from the outside. My double front doors open inward.  All easily doable at the time of construction.

And on it goes.  I sure which I had the wise members of Thaivisa to help me when I built, I would have saved a lot of heartache.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

[Morden]

ProThaiExpat & lopburi3,

Thanks very much for your welcome and practical advice. I just wish that I could be there every day to watch progress and standards myself but, sadly, that's unlikely to be possible.

I think that I might have to abandon the idea of working from 'government' plans for our dream LOS home and carefully choose from a range that the builder can offer. That would mean he would be comfortable with the design too. It's also very clear from all the advice that has been given to me here that I must be very careful about the minutest detail of the specification before committing to it and a price. Sunken bathroom floors is a good example; a good way to crack your head open on the washbasin during a nightime visit!

I had better start making some notes!

Thanks again folks. If any other thoughts occur to you, please jot them down here.

[ProThaiExpat]

Yuur getting it now Morden.

A small example is bathroom and shower drains. In Austrlia, I think it is code, all bathrooms must have a drain, more or less, in the middle of the bathroom floor. What a way to destroy any concept of beauty often sought in high end U.S. spa bathrooms.

My take on safety and ease of use is stepping from one floor surface to another at the same level. Muscle memory is involved. Thus, when stepping into a room or a shower, stepping onto an identical level surface is a big thing for me.

Thus, while I have no technical objection the a lowered floor in a shower enclosure, comfort and saety tell me to make the floor at the same level as the bathroom. Thus I had my shower enclosure floor placed at the same level as the rest of my bathroom and used a "dam", common in the west, to create the water barrier.

After years of using glass shower enclosures, I opted for a shower curtain here for ease of cleanng and replacement. Glad I did. If Homepro had been open when I built my house, I would have probably ended up with one of these expnsive self contained units at over 100K and regretted it. They sure look nifty though.

For once, after many prior experiences of building bathroom showers, I put the drain in the corner of the square shower, it is quite large, and sloped the floor in the shower toward the drain. Works wonderfully and I don't have to stand on the drain while showering, like you have to do when it is located in the center of the shower floor.

Incidently, I had my tile floors gently sloped toward the exterior wall that has the sliding doors so when there is a water "accident" ,all the water ends up where it is most easily disposed of, of course my floors are 18" tile squares, so this is possible. I have had overflows and flexi-pipe burst and was I thankful. No worry about puddles under cabinets, etc.

On an added thought, specifications in the west usually consist of technical descriptions on how the structrure is to be built. Your unfamiliarity with how things are "done" in Thailand and the difficulty in getting a Thai to build it your way, would only ask for trouble.

I opted for many pages of "specifications", which ended up just my instructions the builder on how I wanted things done, not built. I left the building crew to build the house, concrete, the way they do it here, but put my own "specifications" on room shape and size, finish detail, ceiling height, electrical plan, etc.

You might consider startly multiple word processing pages in your computer labled Kitchen, bathroom etc. and start making your decisions on how you want things done so after a year or more of this constant entry and revision phase, you will have a complete set of "specs" to guide the builder on how you want your house customized.

Lopburi3 is quite right about closets. In Japan they place a incandescent light n all true closets to combat mildew. My slding mirror door "western style" closets were an essential design decision as I feel they make rooms appear larger and have collateral benefits in bedrooms!!! Thais rarely have closets in their bedrooms and opt for furniture, ie. wardrobes, etc. They too can be bought with mirror fronts and are quite reasonable and a huge variety to choose from. I paid 20K per closet for my sliding mirror doors, 3 meter lenght, and you can sure get a beautifuly piece of furniture to hold your clothes for half that. RB Furniture at Homepro did my sliding mirror doors, the best workmaship I have seen in Thailand. World class quality. The only other thing in my house of equal quality is my kitchen cabinets from Tekka. There are Thai cabinet makers of qood quality and my neighbor had his library done beautifully. Custom designs, CAD renderings and excellent execution. Good luck finding someone like that. Chiang Mai is our location.

Edited June 13, 2005 by ProThaiExpat

[autonomous_unit]

3.  Attnetion to privacy.  Thais will put windows opposite windows of adjoing houses, some projects you can look "through" the alignment of windows in many houses in a row.  Pay attention to wall, window and glass block orientation to maximize privacy and take advantage of sight lines!  With no zoning restrictions enforced on any lot, it is easy to build you house anywhere on the lot where you can take adavantage of maximum light, sun, view and privacy.  My windows on my one neighbors side and the street are "above eyeline" so I get the light, but still have the privacy.  What good are windows if the window covering is drawn all the time for privacy.

9.  Thai doors are installed to swing out.  Sliding glass windows are installed on the outside and screens put on the inside.  Then, bars are placed over the outside of the window for "security", because the sliding glass windows can be removed if placed on the outside, not if placed on the inside track.  Screens are kept cleaner on the inside, but for one who hates screens, they belong on the outside track in my view.  No bars on my windowns as they can't be removed from the outside. My double front doors open inward.  All easily doable at the time of construction.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

These two points sure hit home. We're looking at trying to make a prebuilt house a home, and struggling with the creative gardening required to undo the silly windows facing neighbors windows. In one bedroom w/ bathroom, you can open the door and see your infinite reflection in mirror and the opposing house's bathroom mirror!

Does anyone have experience refitting sliding doors and windows to be the right (e.g. non-Thai) way around? I hadn't thought about it being easier to force open, but what galls me is the idea that you have to open the screen (the bug guard) in order to operate the windows. Is it a handicap to enforce fair play with mosquitos in the evening?

Upon close inspection, it seems they installed proper sliding door frames backwards and actually cut extra notches in the doors to make the doors fit backwards on the extruded tracks (because the guide track is not exactly center in the larger groove within which the door slides). I am not 100% sure the doors will operate perfectly if reversed again, but I am also unsure of the possibility of removing and refitting the frames/tracks without damaging the opening in the wall in a way that requires reconstruction. I wouldn't even know how to approach a contractor to get this done... it would be like asking the cook to add vegetables to what they consider a meat dish.

[ray23]

3.  Attnetion to privacy.  Thais will put windows opposite windows of adjoing houses, some projects you can look "through" the alignment of windows in many houses in a row.  Pay attention to wall, window and glass block orientation to maximize privacy and take advantage of sight lines!  With no zoning restrictions enforced on any lot, it is easy to build you house anywhere on the lot where you can take adavantage of maximum light, sun, view and privacy.  My windows on my one neighbors side and the street are "above eyeline" so I get the light, but still have the privacy.  What good are windows if the window covering is drawn all the time for privacy.

9.  Thai doors are installed to swing out.  Sliding glass windows are installed on the outside and screens put on the inside.  Then, bars are placed over the outside of the window for "security", because the sliding glass windows can be removed if placed on the outside, not if placed on the inside track.  Screens are kept cleaner on the inside, but for one who hates screens, they belong on the outside track in my view.  No bars on my windowns as they can't be removed from the outside. My double front doors open inward.  All easily doable at the time of construction.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

These two points sure hit home. We're looking at trying to make a prebuilt house a home, and struggling with the creative gardening required to undo the silly windows facing neighbors windows. In one bedroom w/ bathroom, you can open the door and see your infinite reflection in mirror and the opposing house's bathroom mirror!

Does anyone have experience refitting sliding doors and windows to be the right (e.g. non-Thai) way around? I hadn't thought about it being easier to force open, but what galls me is the idea that you have to open the screen (the bug guard) in order to operate the windows. Is it a handicap to enforce fair play with mosquitos in the evening?

Upon close inspection, it seems they installed proper sliding door frames backwards and actually cut extra notches in the doors to make the doors fit backwards on the extruded tracks (because the guide track is not exactly center in the larger groove within which the door slides). I am not 100% sure the doors will operate perfectly if reversed again, but I am also unsure of the possibility of removing and refitting the frames/tracks without damaging the opening in the wall in a way that requires reconstruction. I wouldn't even know how to approach a contractor to get this done... it would be like asking the cook to add vegetables to what they consider a meat dish.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

You might want to check this out lots of goof info there coolthaihouse forum

[ray23]

3.  Attnetion to privacy.  Thais will put windows opposite windows of adjoing houses, some projects you can look "through" the alignment of windows in many houses in a row.  Pay attention to wall, window and glass block orientation to maximize privacy and take advantage of sight lines!  With no zoning restrictions enforced on any lot, it is easy to build you house anywhere on the lot where you can take adavantage of maximum light, sun, view and privacy.  My windows on my one neighbors side and the street are "above eyeline" so I get the light, but still have the privacy.  What good are windows if the window covering is drawn all the time for privacy.

9.  Thai doors are installed to swing out.  Sliding glass windows are installed on the outside and screens put on the inside.  Then, bars are placed over the outside of the window for "security", because the sliding glass windows can be removed if placed on the outside, not if placed on the inside track.  Screens are kept cleaner on the inside, but for one who hates screens, they belong on the outside track in my view.  No bars on my windowns as they can't be removed from the outside. My double front doors open inward.  All easily doable at the time of construction.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

You might want to check this out lots of good info. coolthaihouse forum

These two points sure hit home. We're looking at trying to make a prebuilt house a home, and struggling with the creative gardening required to undo the silly windows facing neighbors windows. In one bedroom w/ bathroom, you can open the door and see your infinite reflection in mirror and the opposing house's bathroom mirror!

Does anyone have experience refitting sliding doors and windows to be the right (e.g. non-Thai) way around? I hadn't thought about it being easier to force open, but what galls me is the idea that you have to open the screen (the bug guard) in order to operate the windows. Is it a handicap to enforce fair play with mosquitos in the evening?

Upon close inspection, it seems they installed proper sliding door frames backwards and actually cut extra notches in the doors to make the doors fit backwards on the extruded tracks (because the guide track is not exactly center in the larger groove within which the door slides). I am not 100% sure the doors will operate perfectly if reversed again, but I am also unsure of the possibility of removing and refitting the frames/tracks without damaging the opening in the wall in a way that requires reconstruction. I wouldn't even know how to approach a contractor to get this done... it would be like asking the cook to add vegetables to what they consider a meat dish.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

[Morden]

Thanks yet again Guys!

Having started to think about this now, I can see already that my notes will build into something substantial without even a trace of anything technical creeping in! It's amazing what you think of when you get down to work on this.

Phase two will be to get the little lady to look through my ideas. Then there will be another few months of negotiation over the changes.

[ProThaiExpat]

The good side of Thai construction is the ease to which you can "correct" mistakes easily. Since exterior walls are brick and plaster, they can be alterered easily and cheaply.

They made so many mistakes in building my home by not following the plans, that I have seen "corections" made many times. They are so good at making "corrections", I wonder if they don't expect that, paying little attention to detail to begin with hoping you will accept it but knowing they can correct it easily.

As far as window and door openings are concerned, if you watch them during original construction, you will see that they will build a wall up to about 10 cm from the expected joinder with the door frame. Then they install the door frame and fix it into place with support wood until they can fill in the gap around the frame with cement and brick, and when it dries, they remove the support members and the door frame is "cemented in". Moving the door merely involves knocking down that portion of the wall where you want to move the door to, and installing the frame as before.

I arrived at 10:00 am for my "morning inspectinon", having left the afternoon before after my "afternoon" inspection at 4:pm to find that my master bedroom shown on the plan with sliding glass doors, wall to wall, looking out to the view, had been completely blocked in, the room was completely walled in, except for the entry door.

Took them a few hours to demo the new wall and leave an opening the correct size for the sliding glass windows. It matters not if the mortar has dried on not, has I have seen them demo a dried wall just as easily.

The question about what to do with existing windows and doors has differing options.

If the existing window is a metal frame, sliding glass window, I doubt if they can remove the frame and re-install it as the frames are very thin sheet metal, even if you have ordered extra strong ones. However, the frames are not that expensive and the new frames can be installed to fit the existing built windows, especially if they are standard sizes.

Wooden frames can be moved, replaced or re-built at the option of the builder, cementing in any gaps.

All of my door frames were installed 5 cm higher than they should have been so my standard doors were 5 cm off the floor. The builders option was not to replace the doors with ones built to fit the frames, but to add 5 cm. to the bottom of the door, unbelievable in the time sensitive west but cheap with Thai wage rates. There still remained a line accross the doors where the joinder occured, which I solved by extending my baseboards across my doors.

I would just tell your builder what you want changed and let him decide the best way for him to to do it.

Re-locating windows or doors as a remodel wll result in a visible line between the old plaster and the new, finishes rarely match and re-finishing is a real time consuming but cheap solution as they rough up the old finish to take the new finish by chipping it with a nail.

Wallpaper, paneling, gypsum board or a thin coat of concrete patch will work, depending on where the repair line shows up.

Knocking through a new door, compete is rarely more than a two or three day job at a cost of under 5k, depending on how expensive your door choice is. Much corrections or remodeling can be accomplished with the original builder if your close enough in time or his crews are still on a job nearby.

I have used glass block extensively for privacy purposes, thus preserving the light in a room. Bathrooms are particulary suseptable to this approach. On an outside wall, install a tinted square window high up on the wall for ventillation and then extend downward to the floor a glassblock wall the same width as the high window. Window covering is done with a roman shade the same width all the way up. Window coverings are needed when using glass block for heat control except on the north side of the house.

Any exisitng window that would benefit from a glass block window can be accomplished easily as the demo would be to the dimension of the glass block window, wisely slighlty larger than the existing and using a masorary saw to cut the new opening so your joinder of glass block and cement wall would only involve adhesive caulk.

Good luck making your house "customized", its worth the effort as it makes life "easy living". One neighbor had a chain link fence erected as a trellace and planted a fast growing climbing plant, had the privacy he wanted in a matter of a couple of months.

The good side of Thai construction is the ease to which you can "correct" mistakes easily. Since exterior walls are brick and plaster, they can be alterered easily and cheaply.

They made so many mistakes in building my home by not following the plans, that I have seen "corections" made many times. They are so good at making "corrections", I wonder if they don't expect that, paying little attention to detail to begin with hoping you will accept it but knowing they can correct it easily.

As far as window and door openings are concerned, if you watch them during original construction, you will see that they will build a wall up to about 10 cm from the expected joinder with the door frame. Then they install the door frame and fix it into place with support wood until they can fill in the gap around the frame with cement and brick, and when it dries, they remove the support members and the door frame is "cemented in". Moving the door merely involves knocking down that portion of the wall where you want to move the door to, and installing the frame as before.

I arrived at 10:00 am for my "morning inspectinon", having left the afternoon before after my "afternoon" inspection at 4:pm to find that my master bedroom shown on the plan with sliding glass doors, wall to wall, looking out to the view, had been completely blocked in, the room was completely walled in, except for the entry door.

Took them a few hours to demo the new wall and leave an opening the correct size for the sliding glass windows. It matters not if the mortar has dried on not, has I have seen them demo a dried wall just as easily.

The question about what to do with existing windows and doors has differing options.

If the existing window is a metal frame, sliding glass window, I doubt if they can remove the frame and re-install it as the frames are very thin sheet metal, even if you have ordered extra strong ones. However, the frames are not that expensive and the new frames can be installed to fit the existing built windows, especially if they are standard sizes.

Wooden frames can be moved, replaced or re-built at the option of the builder, cementing in any gaps.

All of my door frames were installed 5 cm higher than they should have been so my standard doors were 5 cm off the floor. The builders option was not to replace the doors with ones built to fit the frames, but to add 5 cm. to the bottom of the door, unbelievable in the time sensitive west but cheap with Thai wage rates. There still remained a line accross the doors where the joinder occured, which I solved by extending my baseboards across my doors.

I would just tell your builder what you want changed and let him decide the best way for him to to do it.

Re-locating windows or doors as a remodel wll result in a visible line between the old plaster and the new, finishes rarely match and re-finishing is a real time consuming but cheap solution as they rough up the old finish to take the new finish by chipping it with a nail.

Wallpaper, paneling, gypsum board or a thin coat of concrete patch will work, depending on where the repair line shows up.

Knocking through a new door, compete is rarely more than a two or three day job at a cost of under 5k, depending on how expensive your door choice is. Much corrections or remodeling can be accomplished with the original builder if your close enough in time or his crews are still on a job nearby.

I have used glass block extensively for privacy purposes, thus preserving the light in a room. Bathrooms are particulary suseptable to this approach. On an outside wall, install a tinted square window high up on the wall for ventillation and then extend downward to the floor a glassblock wall the same width as the high window. Window covering is done with a roman shade the same width all the way up. Window coverings are needed when using glass block for heat control except on the north side of the house.

Any exisitng window that would benefit from a glass block window can be accomplished easily as the demo would be to the dimension of the glass block window, wisely slighlty larger than the existing and using a masorary saw to cut the new opening so your joinder of glass block and cement wall would only involve adhesive caulk.

Good luck making your house "customized", its worth the effort as it makes life "easy living". One neighbor had a chain link fence erected as a trellace and planted a fast growing climbing plant, had the privacy he wanted in a matter of a couple of months.

The good side of Thai construction is the ease to which you can "correct" mistakes easily. Since exterior walls are brick and plaster, they can be alterered easily and cheaply.

They made so many mistakes in building my home by not following the plans, that I have seen "corections" made many times. They are so good at making "corrections", I wonder if they don't expect that, paying little attention to detail to begin with hoping you will accept it but knowing they can correct it easily.

As far as window and door openings are concerned, if you watch them during original construction, you will see that they will build a wall up to about 10 cm from the expected joinder with the door frame. Then they install the door frame and fix it into place with support wood until they can fill in the gap around the frame with cement and brick, and when it dries, they remove the support members and the door frame is "cemented in". Moving the door merely involves knocking down that portion of the wall where you want to move the door to, and installing the frame as before.

I arrived at 10:00 am for my "morning inspectinon", having left the afternoon before after my "afternoon" inspection at 4:pm to find that my master bedroom shown on the plan with sliding glass doors, wall to wall, looking out to the view, had been completely blocked in, the room was completely walled in, except for the entry door.

Took them a few hours to demo the new wall and leave an opening the correct size for the sliding glass windows. It matters not if the mortar has dried on not, has I have seen them demo a dried wall just as easily.

The question about what to do with existing windows and doors has differing options.

If the existing window is a metal frame, sliding glass window, I doubt if they can remove the frame and re-install it as the frames are very thin sheet metal, even if you have ordered extra strong ones. However, the frames are not that expensive and the new frames can be installed to fit the existing built windows, especially if they are standard sizes.

Wooden frames can be moved, replaced or re-built at the option of the builder, cementing in any gaps.

All of my door frames were installed 5 cm higher than they should have been so my standard doors were 5 cm off the floor. The builders option was not to replace the doors with ones built to fit the frames, but to add 5 cm. to the bottom of the door, unbelievable in the time sensitive west but cheap with Thai wage rates. There still remained a line accross the doors where the joinder occured, which I solved by extending my baseboards across my doors.

I would just tell your builder what you want changed and let him decide the best way for him to to do it.

Re-locating windows or doors as a remodel wll result in a visible line between the old plaster and the new, finishes rarely match and re-finishing is a real time consuming but cheap solution as they rough up the old finish to take the new finish by chipping it with a nail.

Wallpaper, paneling, gypsum board or a thin coat of concrete patch will work, depending on where the repair line shows up.

Knocking through a new door, compete is rarely more than a two or three day job at a cost of under 5k, depending on how expensive your door choice is. Much corrections or remodeling can be accomplished with the original builder if your close enough in time or his crews are still on a job nearby.

I have used glass block extensively for privacy purposes, thus preserving the light in a room. Bathrooms are particulary suseptable to this approach. On an outside wall, install a tinted square window high up on the wall for ventillation and then extend downward to the floor a glassblock wall the same width as the high window. Window covering is done with a roman shade the same width all the way up. Window coverings are needed when using glass block for heat control except on the north side of the house.

Any exisitng window that would benefit from a glass block window can be accomplished easily as the demo would be to the dimension of the glass block window, wisely slighlty larger than the existing and using a masorary saw to cut the new opening so your joinder of glass block and cement wall would only involve adhesive caulk.

Good luck making your house "customized", its worth the effort as it makes life "easy living". One neighbor had a chain link fence erected as a trellace and planted a fast growing climbing plant, had the privacy he wanted in a matter of a couple of months.

The good side of Thai construction is the ease to which you can "correct" mistakes easily. Since exterior walls are brick and plaster, they can be alterered easily and cheaply.

They made so many mistakes in building my home by not following the plans, that I have seen "corections" made many times. They are so good at making "corrections", I wonder if they don't expect that, paying little attention to detail to begin with hoping you will accept it but knowing they can correct it easily.

As far as window and door openings are concerned, if you watch them during original construction, you will see that they will build a wall up to about 10 cm from the expected joinder with the door frame. Then they install the door frame and fix it into place with support wood until they can fill in the gap around the frame with cement and brick, and when it dries, they remove the support members and the door frame is "cemented in". Moving the door merely involves knocking down that portion of the wall where you want to move the door to, and installing the frame as before.

I arrived at 10:00 am for my "morning inspectinon", having left the afternoon before after my "afternoon" inspection at 4:pm to find that my master bedroom shown on the plan with sliding glass doors, wall to wall, looking out to the view, had been completely blocked in, the room was completely walled in, except for the entry door.

Took them a few hours to demo the new wall and leave an opening the correct size for the sliding glass windows. It matters not if the mortar has dried on not, has I have seen them demo a dried wall just as easily.

The question about what to do with existing windows and doors has differing options.

If the existing window is a metal frame, sliding glass window, I doubt if they can remove the frame and re-install it as the frames are very thin sheet metal, even if you have ordered extra strong ones. However, the frames are not that expensive and the new frames can be installed to fit the existing built windows, especially if they are standard sizes.

Wooden frames can be moved, replaced or re-built at the option of the builder, cementing in any gaps.

All of my door frames were installed 5 cm higher than they should have been so my standard doors were 5 cm off the floor. The builders option was not to replace the doors with ones built to fit the frames, but to add 5 cm. to the bottom of the door, unbelievable in the time sensitive west but cheap with Thai wage rates. There still remained a line accross the doors where the joinder occured, which I solved by extending my baseboards across my doors.

I would just tell your builder what you want changed and let him decide the best way for him to to do it.

Re-locating windows or doors as a remodel wll result in a visible line between the old plaster and the new, finishes rarely match and re-finishing is a real time consuming but cheap solution as they rough up the old finish to take the new finish by chipping it with a nail.

Wallpaper, paneling, gypsum board or a thin coat of concrete patch will work, depending on where the repair line shows up.

Knocking through a new door, compete is rarely more than a two or three day job at a cost of under 5k, depending on how expensive your door choice is. Much corrections or remodeling can be accomplished with the original builder if your close enough in time or his crews are still on a job nearby.

I have used glass block extensively for privacy purposes, thus preserving the light in a room. Bathrooms are particulary suseptable to this approach. On an outside wall, install a tinted square window high up on the wall for ventillation and then extend downward to the floor a glassblock wall the same width as the high window. Window covering is done with a roman shade the same width all the way up. Window coverings are needed when using glass block for heat control except on the north side of the house.

Any exisitng window that would benefit from a glass block window can be accomplished easily as the demo would be to the dimension of the glass block window, wisely slighlty larger than the existing and using a masorary saw to cut the new opening so your joinder of glass block and cement wall would only involve adhesive caulk.

Good luck making your house "customized", its worth the effort as it makes life "easy living". One neighbor had a chain link fence erected as a trellace and planted a fast growing climbing plant, had the privacy he wanted in a matter of a couple of months.

The good side of Thai construction is the ease to which you can "correct" mistakes easily. Since exterior walls are brick and plaster, they can be alterered easily and cheaply.

They made so many mistakes in building my home by not following the plans, that I have seen "corections" made many times. They are so good at making "corrections", I wonder if they don't expect that, paying little attention to detail to begin with hoping you will accept it but knowing they can correct it easily.

As far as window and door openings are concerned, if you watch them during original construction, you will see that they will build a wall up to about 10 cm from the expected joinder with the door frame. Then they install the door frame and fix it into place with support wood until they can fill in the gap around the frame with cement and brick, and when it dries, they remove the support members and the door frame is "cemented in". Moving the door merely involves knocking down that portion of the wall where you want to move the door to, and installing the frame as before.

I arrived at 10:00 am for my "morning inspectinon", having left the afternoon before after my "afternoon" inspection at 4:pm to find that my master bedroom shown on the plan with sliding glass doors, wall to wall, looking out to the view, had been completely blocked in, the room was completely walled in, except for the entry door.

Took them a few hours to demo the new wall and leave an opening the correct size for the sliding glass windows. It matters not if the mortar has dried on not, has I have seen them demo a dried wall just as easily.

The question about what to do with existing windows and doors has differing options.

If the existing window is a metal frame, sliding glass window, I doubt if they can remove the frame and re-install it as the frames are very thin sheet metal, even if you have ordered extra strong ones. However, the frames are not that expensive and the new frames can be installed to fit the existing built windows, especially if they are standard sizes.

Wooden frames can be moved, replaced or re-built at the option of the builder, cementing in any gaps.

All of my door frames were installed 5 cm higher than they should have been so my standard doors were 5 cm off the floor. The builders option was not to replace the doors with ones built to fit the frames, but to add 5 cm. to the bottom of the door, unbelievable in the time sensitive west but cheap with Thai wage rates. There still remained a line accross the doors where the joinder occured, which I solved by extending my baseboards across my doors.

I would just tell your builder what you want changed and let him decide the best way for him to to do it.

Re-locating windows or doors as a remodel wll result in a visible line between the old plaster and the new, finishes rarely match and re-finishing is a real time consuming but cheap solution as they rough up the old finish to take the new finish by chipping it with a nail.

Wallpaper, paneling, gypsum board or a thin coat of concrete patch will work, depending on where the repair line shows up.

Knocking through a new door, compete is rarely more than a two or three day job at a cost of under 5k, depending on how expensive your door choice is. Much corrections or remodeling can be accomplished with the original builder if your close enough in time or his crews are still on a job nearby.

I have used glass block extensively for privacy purposes, thus preserving the light in a room. Bathrooms are particulary suseptable to this approach. On an outside wall, install a tinted square window high up on the wall for ventillation and then extend downward to the floor a glassblock wall the same width as the high window. Window covering is done with a roman shade the same width all the way up. Window coverings are needed when using glass block for heat control except on the north side of the house.

Any exisitng window that would benefit from a glass block window can be accomplished easily as the demo would be to the dimension of the glass block window, wisely slighlty larger than the existing and using a masorary saw to cut the new opening so your joinder of glass block and cement wall would only involve adhesive caulk.

Good luck making your house "customized", its worth the effort as it makes life "easy living". One neighbor had a chain link fence erected as a trellace and planted a fast growing climbing plant, had the privacy he wanted in a matter of a couple of months.

[autonomous_unit]

Thanks for all the construction thoughts!

Thanks for all the construction thoughts!

Thanks for all the construction thoughts!

Thanks for all the construction thoughts!

Thanks for all the construction thoughts!

[lopburi3]

9. Thai doors are installed to swing out. Sliding glass windows are installed on the outside and screens put on the inside. Then, bars are placed over the outside of the window for "security", because the sliding glass windows can be removed if placed on the outside, not if placed on the inside track. Screens are kept cleaner on the inside, but for one who hates screens, they belong on the outside track in my view. No bars on my windowns as they can't be removed from the outside. My double front doors open inward. All easily doable at the time of construction.

Not true IMHO. If you just turn the hardware around they can just as easily (almost - maybe need a suction disk) from the outside/lifted/push in. Open window in any case. As the window on outside is the design for drainage would not bother changing. All you need to do it install a shim on top of sliding window to prevent it being lifted out of track - maybe the self stick back plastic from electric wire covers would work. You prevent removal without the window being opened and the shim removed.

[Morden]

The builder has offered to show us some houses that he is building on a development near to Korat. His suggestion is that we decide what style we like and tell him what changes we want to make. This would seem to be a good way of dealing with the issue of the specification. It would enable us, as ProThaiExpat has suggested, to concentrate on features, facilities and appearance and not get too involved in the engineering spec.

[ProThaiExpat]

Morden: A very positive sign. You might try to determine if your builder has more than one work crew, many builders have subs who have crews, so every house in a development is not built by the same crew.

One of my specs was wall finish to be smooth as shown in model/office of developer. When my sub, who had to be "augmented" with more cash by developer due to cost of his re-doing his many mistakes, saved money on the sand in the finish coat by using coarse grade, the result, I have a very "abrasive" look to my interior finish.

If you see much difference with the finish between the houses shown to you by the builder and he uses different crews, each having crew bosses or subs of different quality, insist on the crew that built the house with the finish you like.

[Morden]

ProThaiExpat,

Thanks very much for that tip. I think that the builder ('engineer') is a sub-contractor to the main developer and employs his own crew or crews. Even if he uses only one crew the individuals within it may change, of course. I shall raise the question with him as we view the houses and also make sure that the ones he shows us were built by him rather than another sub-contractor.

We will probably fly to LOS to deal with the land purchase next month and that is when we will view the housing development. I had better keep making those notes in the meantime!

[Blue Unicorn]

I don't live inThailand anymore, but did for 20 years. I will retire there in 5. Having built 4 homes there I would always use a Thai/foreign build company. If you have atleast one foreigner who oversees the work it will so much less hassle. Also, nearly all builders have to use sub contractors even the big boys. Its standard practice and it also mean you get a better job done. Professional companies will sub work out, as it means you get specialists who specialise in the various areas of the house build. Make sense....kitchen company for kitchen, electrical companies for electirs etc etc. Unless you are building low quality cheap house and you are on a budget.

Edited January 29, 2006 by Blue Unicorn

[stevehaigh]

i would definitely want someone i can trust with a bit of building background to watch over the building for you. plans don't mean much here, the builder will do what every they want to do anyhow.

one thought on the building that hasn't been mentioned yet, make sure they put vent pipes in the plumbing, Thia's often don't bother and the bathrooms smell really bad.

oh, and don't forget lightning protection.