Clashes Continue, Turning Central Bangkok In Virtual Warzone

[LuckyLew]

Some posters here calling Nelson a idiot or inexperienced

"Nelson Rand is an intrepid adventurer. Despite the warnings and threats against his life, he journeyed into the most dangerous parts of Southeast Asia to witness the plight of the oppressed. He hiked through the jungles of Laos to interview Hmong guerillas, the remnants of the rebel army that refused to surrender to the communist government.

In Vietnam, he ventured into the central highlands to document the civil rights abuses suffered by the Montagard people, persecuted by the communist government because they fought alongside American forces in the Vietnam War.

He saw action in Burma where he joined forces with the Karen National Liberation Army and accompanied the insurgents as they mounted full scale attacks on Junta forces. Rand describes the Karen's plight as one of the worst humanitarian disasters of our time. He documented cases of rape, killings, torture and the forced relocation of Karen villages.

His audacious journey also took him to southern Thailand in search of Islamic extremists, who have turned the region into a war zone.

While travelling in Cambodia, he accompanied government soldiers on their final offensive against the Khmer Rouge. Rand's book is a highly informative but sobering portrait of Southeast Asia and its secret conflicts."

Its a very informative book actually and an easy read I can recommend it

From what you say, it sounds as if he's done some interesting journalism, but yesterday, in what was being described as a 'war zone', this "intrepid adventurer" elected :

1 - NOT to wear a green press armband

2 - NOT to wear a protective helmet

3 - NOT to wear a bullet-proof vest

4 - to dress in black

I'm sorry, but this doesn't sound like the most sensible behaviour to me!

In fact, the word "idiot" is the first one that sprang to my mind, too... I'm surprised he didn't finish off his little ensemble with a red bandanna!

e

I would hazard a guess that his attire was purposefull, so he could mingle in the front lines of the demonstrators. His profile reads like an adrenaline junky, hats off to him, hes got balls.

All balls no brain and he almost got those shot off

[deathabovered]

Video footage here of Nelson Rand being shot, make of it what you will but for me this is the most damming video to come out in the last two months.

http://edition.cnn.com/video/data/2.0/vide...mayhem.cnn.html

Why is the idiot dressed in black wearing sunglasses with no visable signs of him being a reporter.Has he got shit for brains or did he think he was immune to bullets.

No green armband, no clear idea of who shot him, and he's standing in the middle of a gun battle..... sorry, but I don't feel sorry for him.

In my country!! they would say SOM NAM NAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA

[animatic]

Abhisit?????? The Army is shooting because they got shot? All that exchange of fire, yesterday. Peaceful demonstrators who got shot by the evil army can not exchange fire, because they don't have guns!

Forgot April 10? 200 Army injured. Forgot all the videos of the black Ronin?

No question that some soldiers, most are almost children, overreact sometimes.

no guns?

on TNN24 i saw protestors making and carrying molotov cocktails and then they focused in on two individuals with poorly disguised assault rifles at their sides who promptly ran away when they saw the camera on them.

on Al Jazeera they have video of reds with handguns

so much for these poor peaceful protestors.......

Yes, we are heading to he Civil war, because of manipulations to create a coalition with a majority, even if it seems "legal".IMHO, the best thing to do for stopping the march to hel_l is to give back power to people immediately: immediate dissolution of parliament and elections.

It is the only way, it is still possible to stop the gearing to violence, but tomorrow or in very few days it will be too late....

Jerry this is a Thaksin powerplay, not a simple peoples democratic movement.

No Thaksin = no street riots. The people have 223 PTP candidates in parliament,

who COULD be effective, but are not. They are a huge opposition block,

but don't even act like a Shadow government. The reds are well represented in parliament,

though ineffectually because of lack of PTP organizational abilities, but they don't control the executive...

So this is a huge powerplay to regain cabinet army list and budgetary control; Patronage power,

and thus abilities get Thaksin back at the helm, if not as PM....

Try not to get caught up in the overlay facade

that is being used to confuse and obscure the REAL reasons.

Edited May 15, 2010 by animatic

[OzMick]

No blood..... looks like he fell out of the lorry and took a hard landing.

If you are part of an army who is shooting and killing civilians then you have to expect the rest of the civilian population to be pretty much anti-army.

Most farangs cannot understand this and its why you see all these "shoot them up" calls, but this is Thailand and the army is a known problem and is tolerated by the people, but if they step over the line the people will turn against them, as you see in that video.... normal people upset and wanting to stop the army from killing more people.

Check your headphone and volume..

He is brainwashed not to hear or anything that might be bad for the red propaganda. He twists dates and events to suit his brainwashing also.

This video will be used as a training aid. Lessons to be learned are:

1/ when you are driving a bloody big truck, DO NOT STOP. Obviously the driver did not want to hurt the pedestrians blocking his path, they did not share the same reticence.

2/ you are given a rifle for self-defence. USE IT. A couple of rounds for warning, then shoot to clear the area. If you are half-hearted, you are already half dead.

3/ when you are dealing with a mob, there is nobody in control to limit their actions. EXPECT THE WORST.

4/ Make a noise. Blow the horn, shoot in the air. You won't get help if nobody knows you are in trouble.

[midas]

Where are you loudmouths who were posting 2 months ago that this thing would be over quickly and easily?

Where are you Thai paid posters who post Thai government propaganda and lies here?

Oh--you are still here.

But I told you to be careful because you might be on the wrong side. If the Reds win and find out you were posting pro regime hate posts, they will lock you up or worse.

But about the fight.

I read a Thai military leader say in an interview that there are at least 500 Thai military dressed in Black inside the buildings all around the War zone. They are heavily armed and prepared to use real bullets with even some artillery support.

There could be as many as a few thousand more outside the area.

So now my opinion.

I think it would be suicide to try and take out the Men in Black with just a few thousand troops. They have the defensive position at the Shopping center and likely the attacking pro government army would find itself being attacked from behind and from the sides as other Blacks moved in for the kill.

Can you imagine the next morning after a few thousand Thai army were killed and wounded?

The regime would cave.

Solutions?

Do the election.

Remove the power from all other than elected officials--a new Constitution.

Likely--no

Likely is the regime will fight until it is forced to surrender at which time its very survival as an institution will be very doubtful.

Can you bet on the sided in London boys?

I bet on the Reds.

Fear mongering to induce some to back letting the rally

keep disrupting the lives of Bangkok citizens indefinitely.

It's gone beyond that. They will finish the job, they have no choice.

No matter which side you sympathise with there is absolutely no excuse for farangs to have posted

some of the very hateful words on this forum.

[agord]

Where are you loudmouths who were posting 2 months ago that this thing would be over quickly and easily?

Where are you Thai paid posters who post Thai government propaganda and lies here?

Oh--you are still here.

But I told you to be careful because you might be on the wrong side. If the Reds win and find out you were posting pro regime hate posts, they will lock you up or worse.

But about the fight.

I read a Thai military leader say in an interview that there are at least 500 Thai military dressed in Black inside the buildings all around the War zone. They are heavily armed and prepared to use real bullets with even some artillery support.

There could be as many as a few thousand more outside the area.

So now my opinion.

I think it would be suicide to try and take out the Men in Black with just a few thousand troops. They have the defensive position at the Shopping center and likely the attacking pro government army would find itself being attacked from behind and from the sides as other Blacks moved in for the kill.

Can you imagine the next morning after a few thousand Thai army were killed and wounded?

The regime would cave.

Solutions?

Do the election.

Remove the power from all other than elected officials--a new Constitution.

Likely--no

Likely is the regime will fight until it is forced to surrender at which time its very survival as an institution will be very doubtful.

Can you bet on the sided in London boys?

I bet on the Reds.

what a complete idiot.

[bangkokeddie]

Some posters here calling Nelson a idiot or inexperienced

"Nelson Rand is an intrepid adventurer. Despite the warnings and threats against his life, he journeyed into the most dangerous parts of Southeast Asia to witness the plight of the oppressed. He hiked through the jungles of Laos to interview Hmong guerillas, the remnants of the rebel army that refused to surrender to the communist government.

In Vietnam, he ventured into the central highlands to document the civil rights abuses suffered by the Montagard people, persecuted by the communist government because they fought alongside American forces in the Vietnam War.

He saw action in Burma where he joined forces with the Karen National Liberation Army and accompanied the insurgents as they mounted full scale attacks on Junta forces. Rand describes the Karen's plight as one of the worst humanitarian disasters of our time. He documented cases of rape, killings, torture and the forced relocation of Karen villages.

His audacious journey also took him to southern Thailand in search of Islamic extremists, who have turned the region into a war zone.

While travelling in Cambodia, he accompanied government soldiers on their final offensive against the Khmer Rouge. Rand's book is a highly informative but sobering portrait of Southeast Asia and its secret conflicts."

Its a very informative book actually and an easy read I can recommend it

From what you say, it sounds as if he's done some interesting journalism, but yesterday, in what was being described as a 'war zone', this "intrepid adventurer" elected :

1 - NOT to wear a green press armband

2 - NOT to wear a protective helmet

3 - NOT to wear a bullet-proof vest

4 - to dress in black

I'm sorry, but this doesn't sound like the most sensible behaviour to me!

In fact, the word "idiot" is the first one that sprang to my mind, too... I'm surprised he didn't finish off his little ensemble with a red bandanna!

e

I would hazard a guess that his attire was purposefull, so he could mingle in the front lines of the demonstrators. His profile reads like an adrenaline junky, hats off to him, hes got balls.

I would agree, up to the point of him being reported as sitting up in his hospital bed and bitching about what happened as a result!

[ozzieman05]

I am niether red nor yellow as I said. If speaking out against inhuman acts of shooting people who are injured or waving a white flag in surrender makes me a red in your eyes then so be it. If this happened in afaganistan and an American, Aust or brit soldier shot a surrendering person they would be brought up on wars crimes. It is the acts I am commenting on not the colour the person is wearing. Tell me truely in your heart if you really believe shooting injured and surrending people is justified regardless of where it is happening.

=====================================================================

An injured person with a weapon is more dangerous than one that can retreat and run away

I agree if the have a white flag becareful

But we learnt the hard way that it could be a trap during the Vietnam way

Its easy for all you computer savy louches to tell young soldiers what to do when they face a violent mob

But as I can say

"Been there done that"

I have the right to say they are doing the best that the circumstance put them under

[jcbangkok]

I am niether red nor yellow as I said. If speaking out against inhuman acts of shooting people who are injured or waving a white flag in surrender makes me a red in your eyes then so be it. If this happened in afaganistan and an American, Aust or brit soldier shot a surrendering person they would be brought up on wars crimes. It is the acts I am commenting on not the colour the person is wearing. Tell me truely in your heart if you really believe shooting injured and surrending people is justified regardless of where it is happening.

How do you know it was a soldier who shot either of them and not a red?

How do you know the shot was a direct shot and not a ricochet?

I also believe the person waiving the white flag was already shot before waiving the flag.

Bottom line is the reds have caused this area to turn into a war zone and these things are COMMON in street battles ... especially when civilians and reporters fail to heed the advice of the lawful authorities.

[BKjohn]

look again the soldier in the back of the truck is armed.

This is kinda sad really.

I may be wrong but I can't imagine a mob of people would be able to approach a convoy of armed Australian soldiers. I would assume that as soon as a crowd came within a certain radius of teh vehicle guns would be pointed and ultimatums made.

The fear in the soldier's face and their reluctance to use their weapons just shows how difficult this situation is.

To be shot for your troubles is a little low though.

Yes, very disturbing stuff. Here we have armed soldiers that didnt want to use their weapons on their fellow countrymen (this is clear) BUT the MOB MENTALITY took over and they were beaten & one of them shot for their consideration. How does anyone make sense of that?

This puts the leader of the army to shame - you can not send your soldiers into a war like situation (which this is since the reds have and use weapons of war) and castrate them by not allowing them to use their weapons as dictated by the situation. You can not win a war by being sensible to the media. In a war there is collateral damage which is unavoidable. By being afraid of the media and public perception, you only prolong the war and subsequently there will be more collateral damage than would otherwise.

This is the reason why politicians should not be involved in any war situation, but the professionals should be in command to quickly and effectively overcome the situation here and bring the country back to normal.

Unfortunately the current high command seems to be more interested in his retirement than in doing his job.

[littleMo]

Justasken said: If the Reds win and find out you were posting pro regime hate posts, they will lock you up or worse.

Many people don't like the reds for this reason. They don't seem interested in freedom of speech and use bullying and intimidation tactics. Even your own post could be seen as being intimidating to posters on TV making people scared to speak their thoughts.

Are you proud of that?

[ozzieman05]

look again the soldier in the back of the truck is armed.

This is kinda sad really.

I may be wrong but I can't imagine a mob of people would be able to approach a convoy of armed Australian soldiers. I would assume that as soon as a crowd came within a certain radius of teh vehicle guns would be pointed and ultimatums made.

The fear in the soldier's face and their reluctance to use their weapons just shows how difficult this situation is.

To be shot for your troubles is a little low though.

Yes, very disturbing stuff. Here we have armed soldiers that didnt want to use their weapons on their fellow countrymen (this is clear) BUT the MOB MENTALITY took over and they were beaten & one of them shot for their consideration. How does anyone make sense of that?

Yes it makes sense that the Red leaders have forced this onto young Thai soldiers

The mob should leave there illegal occupied area and go home

[jcbangkok]

Where are you loudmouths who were posting 2 months ago that this thing would be over quickly and easily?

Where are you Thai paid posters who post Thai government propaganda and lies here?

Oh--you are still here.

But I told you to be careful because you might be on the wrong side. If the Reds win and find out you were posting pro regime hate posts, they will lock you up or worse.

But about the fight.

I read a Thai military leader say in an interview that there are at least 500 Thai military dressed in Black inside the buildings all around the War zone. They are heavily armed and prepared to use real bullets with even some artillery support.

There could be as many as a few thousand more outside the area.

So now my opinion.

I think it would be suicide to try and take out the Men in Black with just a few thousand troops. They have the defensive position at the Shopping center and likely the attacking pro government army would find itself being attacked from behind and from the sides as other Blacks moved in for the kill.

Can you imagine the next morning after a few thousand Thai army were killed and wounded?

The regime would cave.

Solutions?

Do the election.

Remove the power from all other than elected officials--a new Constitution.

Likely--no

Likely is the regime will fight until it is forced to surrender at which time its very survival as an institution will be very doubtful.

Can you bet on the sided in London boys?

I bet on the Reds.

Fear mongering to induce some to back letting the rally

keep disrupting the lives of Bangkok citizens indefinitely.

It's gone beyond that. They will finish the job, they have no choice.

No matter which side you sympathise with there is absolutely no excuse for farangs to have posted

some of the very hateful words on this forum.

I am not seeing "hate" in the posts you are replying to. Not saying I agree with what is being said in the posts but where is the "hate" ?

[Mekhong]

I want to get this awesome bright green armband that provides a forcefield against bullets. (/sarcasm)

Sarcasm works best when you don't tell us you're using sarcasm

[schmutzie]

or it could be this one that gets the award

reds shooting a soldier

I wonder what response levelhead will have for this? Pretty disgusting really.

They will either make no comment at all or claim it was in self defense

what amazes me is that those soldiers were not armed ??? how are they supposed to defend themselves against those criminals?

They were obviously shit scared as they were pulled out of their truck

Soldier in the back appears to be clutching a rifle...

[ozzieman05]

look again the soldier in the back of the truck is armed.

This is kinda sad really.

I may be wrong but I can't imagine a mob of people would be able to approach a convoy of armed Australian soldiers. I would assume that as soon as a crowd came within a certain radius of teh vehicle guns would be pointed and ultimatums made.

The fear in the soldier's face and their reluctance to use their weapons just shows how difficult this situation is.

To be shot for your troubles is a little low though.

Yes, very disturbing stuff. Here we have armed soldiers that didnt want to use their weapons on their fellow countrymen (this is clear) BUT the MOB MENTALITY took over and they were beaten & one of them shot for their consideration. How does anyone make sense of that?

This puts the leader of the army to shame - you can not send your soldiers into a war like situation (which this is since the reds have and use weapons of war) and castrate them by not allowing them to use their weapons as dictated by the situation. You can not win a war by being sensible to the media. In a war there is collateral damage which is unavoidable. By being afraid of the media and public perception, you only prolong the war and subsequently there will be more collateral damage than would otherwise.

This is the reason why politicians should not be involved in any war situation, but the professionals should be in command to quickly and effectively overcome the situation here and bring the country back to normal.

Unfortunately the current high command seems to be more interested in his retirement than in doing his job.

Welcome to Thailand

[animatic]

Watched an interesting discussion last night by a group of Thai's - the consensus was very much the same. Abhisit has no choice but to go through with this. He can not allow anymore half arsed actions by the army. The time has come to put an end to the occupation of Bangkok. The Thai's are fat up with those morons dictating their lives. They pointed out how some of the red shirt leaders jumped at the "road map' for an acceptable way out and everybody breathed a sigh of relieve. but within a couple of day's, unreasonable demands were issued by some of the rd leaders who were not going to accept anything but surrender from the government. By doing so putting an end to negotiations.

They agreed that if anyone is to blame for any casualties. it is the red leadership and their General Thaksin.

One point they raised was that the red shirt leaders would not be able to walk the streets anymore without a large group of body guards because they have many enemies now and not only among the "elite", but also the normal Thai on the street who has been severely affected by all this anarchy.

Found this quite refreshing to listen to Thai's who were quite objective about the whole thing, having an intelligent discussion when compared to the redist morons here on the forum.

Amen, 90% of the Thais have quite reasonably thought out views and an understanding of events, no matter what political leaning they may have. Although I have my views, I've had no trouble holding long, civil discussions with Thais on all sides at all levels. One can only wonder what is going on in this forum.

A quick look at some of the forums in the west (try CNNs) shows this seems to be a Western problem.

Many of my Thai friends and aquantances have strong Issan ties.

That should mean they think red, and that is not the case.

And not because I intimidate them into not talking honestly,

I ENCOURAGE their real opinions. And none positively espouce red philosophy.

The most anyone says is they want better job opportunities there,

rather than have to travel to get better paid work.

But they uniformly think the red shirt mob is NOT helping this and IS hurting their job

possibilities when they travel to find work. This shows they see the bigger picture,

and think out the whole scene. So sad that these people are not getting represented

because the Red Shirts have diominated the public dialog to the exclusion of all else.

[littleMo]

You can not win a war by being sensible to the media. In a war there is collateral damage which is unavoidable. By being afraid of the media and public perception, you only prolong the war and subsequently there will be more collateral damage than would otherwise.

This is the reason why politicians should not be involved in any war situation, but the professionals should be in command to quickly and effectively overcome the situation here and bring the country back to normal.

Unfortunately the current high command seems to be more interested in his retirement than in doing his job.

Yes, I agree with this.

Journalists and all non-combatants should be restricted to outside the area. The security forces should make a clean sweep of the area using necessary force. THEN the investigations should begin about who did what and whether it was justified or not.

Trial by media in the middle of a battle is only going to end up with more people getting hurt.

[jcbangkok]

=====================================================================

An injured person with a weapon is more dangerous than one that can retreat and run away

I agree if the have a white flag becareful

But we learnt the hard way that it could be a trap during the Vietnam way

Its easy for all you computer savy louches to tell young soldiers what to do when they face a violent mob

But as I can say

"Been there done that"

I have the right to say they are doing the best that the circumstance put them under

If you want to know the real problem with politics in Thailand when it comes to the masses ... simply ask Thais under 40 year old what they know about the Vietnam War or ask all what they can tell you about WW I or II. I am not saying to ask them details of any sort but find out if they even know these things took place.

[truethailand]

Where are you loudmouths who were posting 2 months ago that this thing would be over quickly and easily?

Where are you Thai paid posters who post Thai government propaganda and lies here?

Oh--you are still here.

But I told you to be careful because you might be on the wrong side. If the Reds win and find out you were posting pro regime hate posts, they will lock you up or worse.

But about the fight.

I read a Thai military leader say in an interview that there are at least 500 Thai military dressed in Black inside the buildings all around the War zone. They are heavily armed and prepared to use real bullets with even some artillery support.

There could be as many as a few thousand more outside the area.

So now my opinion.

I think it would be suicide to try and take out the Men in Black with just a few thousand troops. They have the defensive position at the Shopping center and likely the attacking pro government army would find itself being attacked from behind and from the sides as other Blacks moved in for the kill.

Can you imagine the next morning after a few thousand Thai army were killed and wounded?

The regime would cave.

Solutions?

Do the election.

Remove the power from all other than elected officials--a new Constitution.

Likely--no

Likely is the regime will fight until it is forced to surrender at which time its very survival as an institution will be very doubtful.

Can you bet on the sided in London boys?

I bet on the Reds.

The fat lady has not sung yet. Cannot believe that anybody goes to a gunfight with a bamboo pole and burning tyres. There must be military units loyal to Thaksin...when are they going to enter the fray. Sounds reasonable to draw the soldiers in and then you have them surrounded. Give them the chance to lay down arms if not armageddon breaks loose. Not a pretty scenario and one nobody wants.

Love or hate the guy Seh Daeng has combat experience and he is not the only military guy on the red side. The final party has not begun yet so either stay neutral or choose your allegiance carefully

[Jerrytheyoung]

Jerrytheyoung:

Yes, we are heading to he Civil war, because of manipulations to create a coalition with a majority, even if it seems "legal".IMHO, the best thing to do for stopping the march to hel_l is to give back power to people immediately: immediate dissolution of parliament and elections.

It is the only way, it is still possible to stop the gearing to violence, but tomorrow or in very few days it will be too late....

Come on Jerry 'fess up. You are really Thaksin in disguise right?

No I am not a supporter of Thaksin even if I have some sympathy for the Poor mob of Issan. I just see the gearing in which we are engaged, and that violence will reply to violence. With a large part of the Country supporting the Red Shirts, we are directly heading to an uncontrollable situation and before it happens better to stop the massacre and give give back power to the Nation (Before it is split in 2 blocks). Better to solve the issues by vote than by weapons.

I am against the killings from both sides.

[BKjohn]

Where are you loudmouths who were posting 2 months ago that this thing would be over quickly and easily?

Where are you Thai paid posters who post Thai government propaganda and lies here?

Oh--you are still here.

But I told you to be careful because you might be on the wrong side. If the Reds win and find out you were posting pro regime hate posts, they will lock you up or worse.

But about the fight.

I read a Thai military leader say in an interview that there are at least 500 Thai military dressed in Black inside the buildings all around the War zone. They are heavily armed and prepared to use real bullets with even some artillery support.

There could be as many as a few thousand more outside the area.

So now my opinion.

I think it would be suicide to try and take out the Men in Black with just a few thousand troops. They have the defensive position at the Shopping center and likely the attacking pro government army would find itself being attacked from behind and from the sides as other Blacks moved in for the kill.

Can you imagine the next morning after a few thousand Thai army were killed and wounded?

The regime would cave.

Solutions?

Do the election.

Remove the power from all other than elected officials--a new Constitution.

Likely--no

Likely is the regime will fight until it is forced to surrender at which time its very survival as an institution will be very doubtful.

Can you bet on the sided in London boys?

I bet on the Reds.

Fear mongering to induce some to back letting the rally

keep disrupting the lives of Bangkok citizens indefinitely.

It's gone beyond that. They will finish the job, they have no choice.

No matter which side you sympathise with there is absolutely no excuse for farangs to have posted

some of the very hateful words on this forum.

I am not seeing "hate" in the posts you are replying to. Not saying I agree with what is being said in the posts but where is the "hate" ?

jc why do you bother answering those reds ?

they are obviously brain amputees and trying to intimidate anyone here is actually funny. If the reds should win, which I very much daubed, who would want to live in this shit-hole this country would become anyway ?

Within a very short time, those posters here would be planting rice and wear straw huts. Thailand would be a small third world country if it had not been for the west to come here for p..... during the Vietnam war and from than on .... have you ever heard of a Thai Nobel price winner ? or any product invented by a Thai ? have you ever seen a Thai car ? you can tell when a bridge was build by a Thai because you have to slow down to a crawl ...... most infrastructure here has been build by western companies because the Thais are so able ????

[schmutzie]

Justasken said: If the Reds win and find out you were posting pro regime hate posts, they will lock you up or worse.

Many people don't like the reds for this reason. They don't seem interested in freedom of speech and use bullying and intimidation tactics. Even your own post could be seen as being intimidating to posters on TV making people scared to speak their thoughts.

Are you proud of that?

That line also caught my attention but I think somehow he was trying to make a point about the current situation and the clamp-down on red media.

[rabo]

16 dead.

No soldiers.

Who is using "live ammo" ?

Certainly looks like its just the Government side, those who should be trying to stop violence and killing, but they are the ones doing the killing.

I know I'm gonna regret asking you this, but how can you possibly take sides with common criminals? That's all they really are. They hide behind what they say is political reform, when in actuality all they want is their paymaster back in Thailand and pardoned for his numerous criminal convictions/charges. I mean what's your angle here? If you have a clear thinking mind, you can't support these thugs. Are you possibly being paid to post here? If you are, cheers!

Also mr un levelhead the army are using live amo on these armed thugs who were warned before anyone armed and threatening will be shot.

what do you want the army to do hide in tress and let them take over

I really don't know why people respond to you .

I think it is kind of like people being fascinated by a horrible auto accident, only this case is a logic and reasoning accident where all the facts get mangled.

In this case trying to paint a picture that all the violence is caused by the govt, totally ignoring the vast amount of evidence that the red group is armed, trained, dangerous, calling for destruction, and blowing up the country's infrastructure to the best of their ability.

[LivinLOS]

Video footage here of Nelson Rand being shot, make of it what you will but for me this is the most damming video to come out in the last two months.

http://edition.cnn.com/video/data/2.0/vide...mayhem.cnn.html

Why is the idiot dressed in black wearing sunglasses with no visable signs of him being a reporter.Has he got shit for brains or did he think he was immune to bullets.

No he was assured by the government that the soldiers were only shooting in self defence.. As he presented no threat at all, was unarmed, etc what were they defending themselves from ?

[AleG]

webfact

Today, 2010-05-15 08:00:27

Group: Admin

Posts: 11,133

Joined: 2003-02-11

Member No.: 327

3 injured as van trying to clash through security checkpoint at Makkasan

A van was speeding to the security checkpoint under the Airport Link Makkasan station at about 30 minutes after midnight, prompting troops to fire at it.

After the van was stopped because of the firing, troops found three persons inside. They were severely injured with bullet wounds. One of them is a boy, who appears to be 10 years old.

The driver has apparently drunk.

-- The Nation 2010-05-15

From the Sat update thread.

Abhisit as PM allows army to shoot children.

Disgraceful.

Well they are shooting kids now, but no doubt its done to "international standards" ? !! Disgrace.

Here we see the genesis of propaganda, take an incident and and pass it through the spin machine until the result it's so unconnected, distorted and biased that it's unrecognizable.

A van speeds into a checkpoint, gets fired on and then it's found that there was a child inside.

SPIN MACHINE

Abhisit, himself personally, allows children to be shot.

This is the kind of crap that gets fed to the masses from the red stages and media, no wonder people are angry when they start to believe the spin as the truth.

This "Abhisit as PM allows army to shoot children" falls in place into the parallel reality of the red shirts, to prop up their narrative of the poor masses rising against the elites against a bloodthirsty, tyrannical, unelected government.

Shame on you LevelHead, your spinning is part of a larger machine put in motion to bring in civil unrest for the benefit of a few power hungry individuals. Twist facts or downright lie to inflame the masses into an unthinking frenzy and push for extremism.

[jcbangkok]

You can not win a war by being sensible to the media. In a war there is collateral damage which is unavoidable. By being afraid of the media and public perception, you only prolong the war and subsequently there will be more collateral damage than would otherwise.

This is the reason why politicians should not be involved in any war situation, but the professionals should be in command to quickly and effectively overcome the situation here and bring the country back to normal.

Unfortunately the current high command seems to be more interested in his retirement than in doing his job.

Yes, I agree with this.

Journalists and all non-combatants should be restricted to outside the area. The security forces should make a clean sweep of the area using necessary force. THEN the investigations should begin about who did what and whether it was justified or not.

Trial by media in the middle of a battle is only going to end up with more people getting hurt.

If you don't think a war cannot be won or lost due to the media ... take a look at Vietnam vs. USA and how Nixon treated the press.

There is a reason the US embedded reporters with troops in Iraq. The number of civilians killed in Iraq are mind blowing but you never heard the numbers from the mainstream media. This is one thing the US got right in that war and that was making reporters feel as the soldiers do as well as feeling attached to those units.

Edited May 15, 2010 by jcbangkok

[whybother]

Jerrytheyoung:

Yes, we are heading to he Civil war, because of manipulations to create a coalition with a majority, even if it seems "legal".IMHO, the best thing to do for stopping the march to hel_l is to give back power to people immediately: immediate dissolution of parliament and elections.

It is the only way, it is still possible to stop the gearing to violence, but tomorrow or in very few days it will be too late....

Come on Jerry 'fess up. You are really Thaksin in disguise right?

No I am not a supporter of Thaksin even if I have some sympathy for the Poor mob of Issan. I just see the gearing in which we are engaged, and that violence will reply to violence. With a large part of the Country supporting the Red Shirts, we are directly heading to an uncontrollable situation and before it happens better to stop the massacre and give give back power to the Nation (Before it is split in 2 blocks). Better to solve the issues by vote than by weapons.

I am against the killings from both sides.

"stop the massacre and give back power to the Nation"

So you're suggesting give in to the violence. Let a protest of a few thousand, many paid, people to bring down a government?

[noahvail]

At the daily news briefing last night (broadcast on TNN), two speakers spoke in Thai and one in English.

They announced that as of today (Saturday) the rules of engagement will change. The army has been told to shoot to kill.

Personal note: the government has applied all the international standards, ramping up the amount of force used over time. At this point, it has reached the highest level. I think it will be a sad day for Thailand. However, had the red shirts continued to negotiate, instead of Mr Weera unilaterally stopping the negotiations, and had they applied the same set of international standards to their own use of force, the situation as it exists today would not have happened.

[deathabovered]

"Nelson Rand is an ................................................................................

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.................................................................................

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His audacious journey also took him to southern Thailand in search of Islamic extremists, who have turned the region into a war zone.

While travelling in Cambodia, he accompanied government soldiers on their final offensive against the Khmer Rouge. Rand's book is a highly informative but sobering portrait of Southeast Asia and its secret conflicts."

Its a very informative book actually and an easy read I can recommend it.

WHICH HIDDEN CONFLICTS RU TALKING ABOUT, KHMER ROUGE DID IT OPENLY,VIETNAM WAS NO SECRET,THE CHINESE,MUSLIMS,LAOS AND THAIS DO it OPENLY, EVEN THAKSIN let 1000ths BE KILLED IN THE OPEN.

SO WHAT SECRETS DO WE NOT KNOW ABOUT!!!!!!!

Edited May 15, 2010 by deathabovered