More Bloodshed In Bangkok As Red Siege Continues

[KhunVee]

Absolutely one of the most ignorant things somebody can try to claim is that the red mob people fighting the army are not armed.

I'd like to see evidence. All I see are stone throwers and slingshots.

Thanks in advance.

Need more? just Google images red shirts weapons armed etc see for yourself

[KhunVee]

Absolutely one of the most ignorant things somebody can try to claim is that the red mob people fighting the army are not armed.

I'd like to see evidence. All I see are stone throwers and slingshots.

Thanks in advance.

Need more? just Google images red shirts weapons armed etc see for yourself

[koosdeboer]

red democracy?

[ChouDoufu]

Every bullet they fire shoots themselves in the foot.

that's a lie! we've now seen two videos where they've shot protesters in the foot!

[BKjohn]

To "farangCravings" If the word 'MURDER' fits into this picture at all, it describes the red-shirt leaders......... They have through their own selfish goals, led all their followers over the cliff............ CHEW ON THAT FOR A WHILE.................

I only see Civilians DEAD not armed red shirt even a 10 year old boy shot by the military

Hmmmm pretty clear

Not really, do a little research about the killing of the 10 year old, or do you have a comprehension deficit?

It would appear so.

It seems more like a lobotomy to me - those civilians they love to talk about, including the press are reds without the red shirt - that seems to be clear and logical to anybody without a lobotomy - civilians are people not engaged in a conflict but not terrorists not wearing a uniform - clever move by the reds leaders though - getting rid of the red shirts thereby confusing the issue

Edited May 17, 2010 by BKjohn

[jcbangkok]

Too bad about the fighting.

It is so sad the deaths and injuries.

I never post but I thought I might add to the place here with a post that is less childish.

I mean all we read is mostly anti red rants here and an occasional rant against the current Thai ruling class, that is quickly removed.

Thaivisa seems to be similar to Fox news.

if it is not rightwing, it is a lie says this site.

My two cents.

I predict the fight could go on for years. Perhaps one side or the other will win for a time but then the fight will break out again. We all can see the hate the two groups have for one another. The Anti Reds call the reds animals and worse.

No matter the nonsense we read here in this strictly controlled and right leaning site, we all know that if an election were held tomorrow, the reds would become the ruling party. This is precisely why it is that the Ruling regime has used coups and fake elections in the past 4 years. if they could defeat the Reds in a real election, they would simply invite in the UN and hold a very open election and win.

So the minority group, Now in power) with most of the power will not give it up without a fight.

Thus Bangkok could be destroyed over the next few years and Thailand could be turned into a wrecked third world nation. The fight could go on and on and on.

Most of you rich Thais will leave. Most all foreigners will leave.

But the fight will go on and on and on until the ruling class gives up.

My prediction.

Good luck all and stay safe.

Remember a rock in the head can kill you just like a bullet can.

Best wishes to all my friends there.

If the site is so controlled and anti-red, why is your post still here?

The reason most red supporters don't like this site, is because any propaganda that they spurt is usually put down with one or two simple facts.

Well the fact is , as reported by the free press ,that the army is killing civilians .

Forget your own propaganda and stick to the real facts

Well duhhhhhh

The illegal violent red mob who has stolen billion of dollars in both private and public property are of course are civilians. So, are the armed ones using deadly weapons against the soldiers and starting fires in the streets. Even if some of them are police or military out of uniform, they are acting as civilians.

Or do you mean non-red shirts when you say civilians? If that is the case, we all know they no longer are required by their leaders to dress in red.

[andrew55]

People from Burma call it Burma.

There are Burmese people, no Myanmarians, nor Myanmarites.

Only the government calls it Myanmar.

The people only use that word when they

are talking with soldiers or government personnel,

and don't want to get in trouble.

Thanks for that ... always wondered when I hear the different names and see it shown differently on a map. I had just did a google search too and this might also help understand if correct:

The name "Burma" is derived from the Burmese word "Bamar" (), which in turn is the colloquial form of Myanmar () (or Mranma in old Burmese), both of which historically referred to the majority Burmans (or the Bamar). Depending on the register used the pronunciation would be "Bama" or "Myanmah". The name "Burma" has been in use in English since the time of British colonial rule.

English is an evolving language. Avoid being pedantic. If you need absolute correctness use Latin or Ancient Greek. I'll collect a wager from you if 'youse' ain't the plural of 'you' in 100 years. Payable in real terms.

Onya mate. (Mc Lovin' the smileys)

[KayT]

2 very irresponsible parents who need to have their child taken from them by protective services and sent to live in a foster home. The parents need to be incarcerated for child endangerment.

These kind of people truly make me nauseous. If you don't even love your children with all your heart, how can you possibly love your fellow man?

There is nothing heart warming about this picture. It is infuriating and disgusting.

Not only in a war zone

but open to the filth, desease, living conditions far worse than they complain they have to live under back in Issan

My Thai wife can not believe any Thai person can stoop so low

She just says they must be Cambodians, Thais not do this

Unfortunately Thais do do this.And that is the saddest part of all.

'''Red leader Nutthawut Saikua urged the government to call a cease-fire.

He said the red shirts were willing to negotiate but only with the United Nations as a mediator.

The government should stop its allegation of that they were 'terrorists' because the protesters were unarmed, he said.''

NATION

17 05 2010

From UN definition of terrorism

"In November 2004, a United Nations Secretary General report described terrorism as any act "intended to cause death or serious bodily harm to civilians or non-combatants with the purpose of intimidating a population or compelling a government or an international organization to do or abstain from doing any act". "

By this definition the Issan Army occupying central Bangkok are terrorists.

ps if they came, would the UN soldiers need work permits?

Yes and the time to get them completed (6-8 weeks ) would mean that they couldnt do anything anyway.

Oh and I didnt realise that this whole protest was just the Issan people.I understand that there are many many from other areas as well. I know many Issan people who are horrified at being labeled as terrorists by biased comments. Please at least try and be a little more considerate before you start to apply labels.

Thank you

[Steely Dan]

REPORT FROM CHIANGMAI

Very quiet indeed here. You see the odd red flag on a Tuk-Tuk or SongTaew but life is incredibly normal here. I guess all the dregs have been sent to Bangkok and the moderate reds (of whom there are many and with legitimate grievances) are probably as embarrassed and disgusted as the majority of the population with the crystal meth mercenary anarchists. Reminds me of how the Union Jack was tarnished by fascist filth.

[rametindallas]

The resolve of the rowdies to keep fighting is an interesting phenomena. What keeps them fighting? Some possible answers:

>>>> the adrenaline rush

>>>> they're jazzed to give vent to being rowdy with their buddies (young guys, in particular, understand this)

>>>> they're getting paid, or at least promises of payment. Most likely, payment is defered until later (this is Thailand).

>>>> security forces aren't instructed to take ground, so the rowdies know troops will pretty much stay at their positions. They're probably thinking, 'Cool, an adversary who can't advance.' It's a bit like playing football against a team that can only stay in their half of the pitch.

>>>> They've got some weapons and ammo (grenades and such), so why not use them. The alternatives are: hide/bury them, or possible get caught with them when it's over ...and then it's added time in the clinker.

. . . . . . . . and the most succinct reason the rowdies are persisting is:

>>>>> They've been successfully brainwashed by the people shouting from the stage for weeks, and a big part of that message is: "If we get our way, and Thaksin comes back (though it's currently not kosher to bandy T's name around), then we'll all get a lot more money!" Ok, they don't say those exact words, but that's the gist of it.

I'm going with the last one on your list. The hate speech has been shrill and unending.

[Bagwan]

Any idiot even you, knows who assassinated the guy

Only the young and the stupid are sure of anything. Since you obviously KNOW who fired the shot, we more sentient people will draw conclusions about your tender years and/or your mental capacity - if they haven't done so already. The unassailable fact is that the jury is still out in the matters of causation and of the affiliation of the person who pulled the trigger.

BTW AFAIK the murderous hot headed military loose cannon in the pay of an absentee convicted criminal is still alive so that any talk of assassination is a tad premature.

[ungcas]

So, we can stay in compliance ... can we get a better understanding of which rule this would fall under? Since you deleted the posts, I am not sure what we cannot say in terms of the dead. Will it result in a suspension if we say we are happy a Terrorist has been killed or making a comment such as "It is a good thing Hitler died" ... to be clear I am not making that comment about Hitler as I don't want to be suspended and just using it as an example.

Looks to me more and more as its Abhisit who is acting like Hitler .

Many thais started to support him for his past moderation but now

that is changing

My wife's family (with the exception of the father who was very pro red and extremely old fashion)didn't really follow politics before this whole event now completely support Abhisit. Believe me, changing my father in law's mind about anything is a very difficult task.

And I also know for a fact that many of her relatives feel the same way.

I'm sure most Thai families now fall into this category.

[animatic]

Obserkomando disgustingly implies that I said he was killed by soldiers for refusing to leave,

when all that was meant was:

He was told to leave because it was too dangerous,

he didn't, and was caught in crossfire or richochet.

What spin? I asked you if you thought a Thai ten year old has the metal capacity to make that decision given the circumstances and gravity of the situation.

You also mention it was "collateral damage, a crossfire or ricochet", I assume you have proof of this?

As usual ignore my answers given and quote me out of context. Same same for you.

I have the published and clear words of the soldiers at the scene to the press,

posted in the TVF locked press release thread right after the incident.

I will not bother to spend an hour trying to back track 100 pages to find it for you.

And yes I think a Ten year old has the capacity for rational thought,

just they still get caught in their emotions too much.

Can a ten year old follow direct orders. Yes, most of them.

[OzMick]

CONCISE AND INFORMED. From Today's Independent:

Background to the current Thai protest

[info] earlywarm wrote:

The Independent (London) Saturday, 15 May 2010 at 12:41 am (UTC)

I suspect that much of the confusion in the reports on the situation in

Thailand is coming from commentators who cannot speak or understand the

Thai language. So much of their analysis is simply a list of cliches

copied from others. <snip>

Thanks for posting that.

It looks like the writer got his info from the ANU discussion about 10 days ago........ nothing wrong with that, as few people would have heard it.

I wish I could find the link to the ANU podcast.

One problem about red sided reporting is surely caused by the reporters having been with the reds and been led by them to see what the reds want them to see.

Have not heard of any reporters being with the army and seeing things from their side when they are being targeted with M79 grenades, AK47's, RPG's, Molotov cocktails, professional slingshots (are illegal in most western countries and considered a weapon that can cause severe injury and/or death)

At the Dusit Thani hotel, which overlooks the Reds' encampment, guests evacuated their rooms and rushed to the basement as staff warned them the hotel was under attack, according to an AFP journalist inside.

"I was in bed. There was a big explosion very close to my room. I went out of the room, other people did too and at that moment the wall outside was hit by bullets," said AFP photographer Pedro Ugarte.

"Everybody is now in the basement, about 100 people," he said by telephone.

It was unclear where the shooting came from.

I liked this gem: Hotel hit by 3 RPG rounds, not used by army. Sherlock is still analysing the evidence.

[Abrak]

Note that not a single demonstrator who has stayed within the restricted demonstration area has been injured.

This is basically true and an important point. I can have little sympathy with protesters who leave the site and start baiting/attacking soldiers if they end up getting shot.

Still it is important to realize that the majority of people at the site are peaceful protestors. I also admit they are unlawful protesters but it is important that they be arrested rather than harmed.

It would be a shame if that headline was to TURN INTO....

Many demonstrators who stayed within the restricted demonstration area have been killed and injured.

....when the crackdown comes......

[Jerrytheyoung]

Absolutely one of the most ignorant things somebody can try to claim is that the red mob people fighting the army are not armed.

I'd like to see evidence. All I see are stone throwers and slingshots.

Thanks in advance.

Need more? just Google images red shirts weapons armed etc see for yourself

MANIPULATION: just the weapons collected in the aftermaith of 10th April and given back to Army/Police.

Edited May 17, 2010 by Jerrytheyoung

[KayT]

Dear other humans,

Please try and control yourselves and not make remarks in bad taste about other people dying. You are much better to say nothing at all than something spiteful. Irregardless of which side of the fence you sit on, please don't be disrespectful to the dead, its not funny, its not smart, it just shows you're lack of intellect.

Seconded... I have just deleted a number of this type of post... any more and the offending member will be suspended from the forum.

Be Warned.

So, we can stay in compliance ... can we get a better understanding of which rule this would fall under? Since you deleted the posts, I am not sure what we cannot say in terms of the dead. Will it result in a suspension if we say we are happy a Terrorist has been killed or making a comment such as "It is a good thing Hitler died" ... to be clear I am not making that comment about Hitler as I don't want to be suspended and just using it as an example.

It is not that one man died for his cause.It is currently many people are dying and suffering for a cause that is confused to say the least.

No matter how right or wrong someone's views are they are still someone's family and are/were loved and cared for.This is why respect is important.For the ones left behind.For the ones who are suffering.For the sake of humanity and compassion. Do not judge until you have walked a mile in someone else's shoes.

People who live in glass houses really should not throw stones.

Thank you

[pornsasi]

Too bad about the fighting.

It is so sad the deaths and injuries.

I never post but I thought I might add to the place here with a post that is less childish.

I mean all we read is mostly anti red rants here and an occasional rant against the current Thai ruling class, that is quickly removed.

Thaivisa seems to be similar to Fox news.

if it is not rightwing, it is a lie says this site.

My two cents.

I predict the fight could go on for years. Perhaps one side or the other will win for a time but then the fight will break out again. We all can see the hate the two groups have for one another. The Anti Reds call the reds animals and worse.

No matter the nonsense we read here in this strictly controlled and right leaning site, we all know that if an election were held tomorrow, the reds would become the ruling party. This is precisely why it is that the Ruling regime has used coups and fake elections in the past 4 years. if they could defeat the Reds in a real election, they would simply invite in the UN and hold a very open election and win.

So the minority group, Now in power) with most of the power will not give it up without a fight.

Thus Bangkok could be destroyed over the next few years and Thailand could be turned into a wrecked third world nation. The fight could go on and on and on.

Most of you rich Thais will leave. Most all foreigners will leave.

But the fight will go on and on and on until the ruling class gives up.

My prediction.

Good luck all and stay safe.

Remember a rock in the head can kill you just like a bullet can.

Best wishes to all my friends there.

If the site is so controlled and anti-red, why is your post still here?

The reason most red supporters don't like this site, is because any propaganda that they spurt is usually put down with one or two simple facts.

Well the fact is , as reported by the free press ,that the army is killing civilians .

Forget your own propaganda and stick to the real facts

Well duhhhhhh

The illegal violent red mob who has stolen billion of dollars in both private and public property are of course are civilians. So, are the armed ones using deadly weapons against the soldiers and starting fires in the streets. Even if some of them are police or military out of uniform, they are acting as civilians.

Or do you mean non-red shirts when you say civilians? If that is the case, we all know they no longer are required by their leaders to dress in red.

[toptuan]

Weng tell protesters not to loot

Weng Tojirakarn told red-shirt protesters Monday morning not to loot shops and break ATM machines.

Weng said the protesters should befriend with the people in the neighbourhood instead of carrying looting.

He said looting would cause the public to hate the demonstrators, and would eventually cause the red-shirt movement to lose the war.

-- The Nation 2010-05-17

Interesting how he appeals to their desire to win the war, not to their Buddhist values ("looting is stealing," Buddhist version of the Golden Rule, etc.) Are the majority of Thais, at least the Red shirts, losing their moral foundations?

[BKjohn]

Obserkomando disgustingly implies that I said he was killed by soldiers for refusing to leave,

when all that was meant was:

He was told to leave because it was too dangerous,

he didn't, and was caught in crossfire or richochet.

What spin? I asked you if you thought a Thai ten year old has the metal capacity to make that decision given the circumstances and gravity of the situation.

You also mention it was "collateral damage, a crossfire or ricochet", I assume you have proof of this?

As usual ignore my answers given and quote me out of context. Same same for you.

I have the published and clear words of the soldiers at the scene to the press,

posted in the TVF locked press release thread right after the incident.

I will not bother to spend an hour trying to back track 100 pages to find it for you.

And yes I think a Ten year old has the capacity for rational thought,

just they still get caught in their emotions too much.

Can a ten year old follow direct orders. Yes, most of them.

Best example, 10 or even younger year old child soldiers in Africa - when asked "how many people have you killed?" his answer was 2 !

[pornsasi]

Absolutely one of the most ignorant things somebody can try to claim is that the red mob people fighting the army are not armed.

I'd like to see evidence. All I see are stone throwers and slingshots.

Thanks in advance.

Need more? just Google images red shirts weapons armed etc see for yourself

MANIPULATION: just the weapos collected in the aftermaith of 10th April and given back to Army/Police.

Of course MANIPULATION .

Well our friend will only manage to convince those already on his side .

Wow , thats an achievement !!!

[BNZ]

My friend , tell me , what do you expect in this forum ?

I'll give you 500 Thai baht to be a rachaprsong at 2.55pm this afternoon

Edited May 17, 2010 by BNZ

[KayT]

red democracy?

That is a woman in this picture in the yellow shirt.So it has become ok now to publically hurt women.By men and women no less.

Can we have some sanity back please?

[BKjohn]

Weng tell protesters not to loot

Weng Tojirakarn told red-shirt protesters Monday morning not to loot shops and break ATM machines.

Weng said the protesters should befriend with the people in the neighbourhood instead of carrying looting.

He said looting would cause the public to hate the demonstrators, and would eventually cause the red-shirt movement to lose the war.

-- The Nation 2010-05-17

Interesting how he appeals to their desire to win the war, not to their Buddhist values ("looting is stealing," Buddhist version of the Golden Rule, etc.) Are the majority of Thais, at least the Red shirts, losing their moral foundations?

Well, as TV footage shows clearly, they apparently didn't hear his orders looting and theft going on all the time

[Blue Unicorn]

To anyone who thinks that the reds or supporters of them, or the various factions of anarchists that have jumped on the band wagon don't have guns......really......please wake up... Are you so naive...how long have you lived in Thailand ? Guns are readably available to buy and many people own one. How do you think students get shot when they have fights. To even think they don't have guns is childish and to live in a fantasy world. Not to be rude as you are allowed your thoughts but come on ! If you live here and think they do not have guns then you are delusional....not to be rude but please wake up. I go upcountry. I have seen guns; I have seen shootings...please....don't be so deluded. We are talking about a serious threat here to the stability of this great country and my home I love. Please if you do not know this country then don't speak about it....Also how the heck do you think that soldier got shot....did they use their finger ? Get into reality please so we can all have an adult conversation

I am also flabbergasted by the sheer ignorance and childish thinking I keep hearing on the BBC and CNN. Anyone with any intelligence or knows this country and lives here would be insulted by the rubbish the BBC and CNN keep spouting.... How do I know....because I live here, work here and have a Thai wife who is from a poor family? She does not support the reds at all as do all her family, relations, village etc....why because they see the truth....this lot are destroying her country and fighting for a man who stole billions from this country in non payment of tax and abused their rights.....she is not stupid hence why she sees it....she thinks they are brain washed by the constant barrage of propaganda being pushed into their heads by the manic leaders......go and listen to it....its is a crazy constant ranting like a dictator...its horrible to even hear:

My poor Thai families are Thai's and they support the crack down. They welcome it and as residents and Thai people do they not have more right then these arrogant, misinformed journalists who fly over here, stay 4 and 5 star then go back to their countries.....Please let those of us who live here see the reality. Do you not remember what it was like under Thaksin? Have you forgotten the Muslims who died at his hands and the thousands of unofficial killings that went on? Have you forgotten his tyrannical reign!!! I have not and I would much rather have a calm, polite, non rich, non businessman who has shown compassion time and time again.... …then ever support or live here under Thaksin again.

Abhisit is trying his best in the most unbelievable difficult circumstances…and he is only in his 40’s….give the man some respect….he was hesitant and took his time because he did not want bloodshed. He was hoping they would go home. He was hoping and desperately trying to reach compromise….but everything that man tried he had thrown back in his face. Everyone criticized all he did and for no reason….That is a fact and an undeniable fact. We all saw it on TV and watched it play out. The reds had everything they wanted…but they screwed up because it was not beneficial to Thaksin. He cannot come back. So why accept the compromises. These people are not democratic and give me Abhisit anytime over them.

Now you got all the foreign outsiders adding their misinformed arrogant views with no idea of what is going on. It’s actually pathetic to watch. I am ashamed to sometimes be a foreigner and hear there nonsense……but its okay for us to go into Afghanistan or Iraq and blow up innocent people by accident….ooops we are sorry…. Its okay for us to use force in protests in the UK (how do I know because I seen it with my own eyes) and its okay for approximately 30,000 gun related crimes to happen in the USA every year….no wonder the rest of the world is sick of our hypocrisy…..we dictate one thing but do another. Thailand has always helped the USA and been a good friend but why will no one help Thailand and put a stop to Thaksin’s desire it seems to destabilize this country. Our countries could help at least with him. Surely Interpol could pick him up. Why does Dubai still allow him in……it is all so wrong and misguided.

Then the poor soldiers being castigated…..they are from poor families too and don’t want to be here. I have spoken to them and they were calm polite guys; so polite and kind. They were embarrassed and apologized to me that there was this problem… But there is an insurrection going on and they have to do their job and stop it. Would the UK and USA accept this in their country? Imagine UK allowing Harrods to be shut for 2 months….and Piccadilly Circus being taken over with barricades and thugs with spiked sticks…wake up…come on get real and be fair to Thailand.

Leave Thailand alone to sort out its problems. It is their country and their right to do so. Do you ever hear Thailand interfering with the UK or USA…….grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr

And yes we do all know people have rights but exercising them must be done in a civilized manner.

But at least I do see here that the majority of people positing it seems see it as I do and are aware and clear headed about what is going on. I guess because you live here and know what it is like for your home to be held hostage by thugs hiding behind old ladies and kids who claim democratic causes that are false...and what about thesort of parent would still have their kids in the protest site while this is going on when its been offered to safely leave....they are unfit to be parents.,..children come first and are innocent..... They are disgusting people using their children...........………please let Abhisit prevail for all our sakes because the alternative option is so awful to even consider.

Edited May 17, 2010 by Blue Unicorn

[rametindallas]

If we could just turn back the clock to pre-coup times. The coup has brought nothing but chaos.

Incorrect and has been proved many many times

you do not listen

If you want to get to the beginning you need to go back to when Thaskin took power

Agree with Ozzieman. Rule of law began to make some traction in Thailand in the aftermath of the 1997 crisis, but was totally side-swiped once Thaksin became PM. In case you weren't around back then, here's an article from The Economist magazine on how it started:

Thailand--Reform in reverse

Thailand's prime minister has escaped censure—for unexplained reasons

Aug 9th 2001 | From The Economist print edition

SINCE Asia was first engulfed in financial turmoil in 1997, no country in the region has struggled as hard as Thailand to clean up its murky politics. Once almost a byword for corruption, Thailand emerged as a bit of a trailblazer. Its new constitution set up powerful independent bodies that would hold politicians to greater account, monitoring their attempts to buy votes and, once in power, keeping a close eye on their assets and kicking them out of office if they were found wanting. Optimists liked to claim that good would come of the economic catastrophe, in the shape of cleaner government and an end to the debilitating sickness of cronyism.

On August 3rd, all that went into reverse. On grounds it chose not to reveal, Thailand's Constitutional Court overturned by eight to seven a ruling last year by the new National Counter-Corruption Commission, which had found that the country's richest businessman, Thaksin Shinawatra, had concealed assets worth tens of millions of dollars while serving as deputy prime minister. The commission refused to believe his explanation—that he had not known that his wife, in whose name much of the family fortune was registered, had put large shareholdings in the names of his driver, his maid and a security guard. A few weeks later Mr Thaksin's new Thai Rak Thai party, personally financed by its leader, swept to power in a general election, even though he faced a five-year ban from politics. The Thaksin affair instantly became a test case for the independence of Thailand's new institutions.

In all the eight other appeals it has heard concerning the commission's verdicts, including one decided on the same day as Mr Thaksin's, the court has upheld the counter-corruption body's ruling. Naturally, the court has every right to overturn a decision in any particular case. But it should, at least, give clear reasons if it is to avoid undermining the commission's authority. Reports say the explanation for its unusual failure to hand down a detailed opinion was the absence of consensus among the eight judges about why they decided to exonerate him. Some of them, apparently, only did so on a strange interpretation of a rule that contradicted their decision in at least one earlier case.

Elected, therefore above the law?

What is most worrying about Mr Thaksin is the contempt he has repeatedly shown for the workings of both the commission and the court. Indeed, at first he refused to testify before the commission at all, though he later relented. And even after he had won his case last week, he complained that he found it "strange" that he, "the leader who was voted in by 11m people had to bow to the ruling of the [counter-corruption commission] and the verdict of the Constitutional Court, two organisations composed only of appointed commissioners and judges, whom people did not have a chance to choose". He has hinted that the laws in question have many "wrong aspects" that need to be changed, and with his strong majority in parliament he will be quite capable of seeing it done.

Most Thais seem happy with the result, however. Mr Thaksin, an energetic telecoms tycoon who launched Thailand's first satellite, has seemed to offer strong government and new hope after years of political weakness and economic pain. He has promoted a few interesting ideas aimed at getting money into the poor rural areas, where it is badly needed, though the results have been patchy. Other promises, such as cleaning out Thailand's bad debts, have hardly been dealt with at all.

In the longer term, Mr Thaksin's lack of enthusiasm for political reform is likely to cost Thailand dear. The promise that the country's relatively superior democracy would promote a greater respect for the rule of law and a decline in corruption has been one of the main factors keeping investors interested. Without that, its attractions may come to seem limited: Thailand lacks the ultra-cheap workforce of Vietnam, the language skills of the Philippines or the relatively efficient bureaucracy and educated workforce of Malaysia. The comparison with Malaysia is particularly apt: for a long time, Malaysians were happy to accept strong if unaccountable government from Mahathir Mohamad in the interests of economic progress. Only in the past few years has it become apparent how badly he has damaged the political fabric of his country.

The stockmarket in Bangkok seemed to sense something like this in Mr Thaksin's case: after rising 4.2% on the first news of the judgment—thanks largely to rises in Mr Thaksin's own Shin Corp and associated companies—it promptly fell back again. After all, Mr Thaksin's main measure to help the exchange, which urgently needs much better supervision and tighter disclosure rules, has been to propose putting Thailand's clocks forward an hour, to match those in Hong Kong and Singapore. It will take a lot more than that.

Thank you.

[toptuan]

I'll give you 500 Thai baht to be a rachaprsong at 2.55pm this afternoon

Add a few zeros to that number, and I'll send in my stunt double.

[Thai at Heart]

Weng tell protesters not to loot

Weng Tojirakarn told red-shirt protesters Monday morning not to loot shops and break ATM machines.

Weng said the protesters should befriend with the people in the neighbourhood instead of carrying looting.

He said looting would cause the public to hate the demonstrators, and would eventually cause the red-shirt movement to lose the war.

-- The Nation 2010-05-17

Interesting how he appeals to their desire to win the war, not to their Buddhist values ("looting is stealing," Buddhist version of the Golden Rule, etc.) Are the majority of Thais, at least the Red shirts, losing their moral foundations?

Not wanting to denigrate all the decent Buddshits out there, but one would have to question a lot of the things we see in Thailand every day and how they fit into Buddhist morals not just the odd bit of looting.

[Jai Dee]

A number of flame posts and derogatory comments have been deleted from this topic. Similarly, posts disrespectful of the dead have also been deleted.

Please feel free to comment and voice your opinion on the forum, but please also abide by the forum rules whan composing your words.

Thank you.

[OzMick]

Dear other humans,

Please try and control yourselves and not make remarks in bad taste about other people dying. You are much better to say nothing at all than something spiteful. Irregardless of which side of the fence you sit on, please don't be disrespectful to the dead, its not funny, its not smart, it just shows you're lack of intellect.

Dead people don't care what you say about them.