Thaksin's Vendetta Is Wrecking The Country

[rametindallas]

Do people still actually believe that this is only about Thaksin?

I will be amazed if people still do not see the bigger picture here.

Would you please spell it out for us Tony?

It's amazing how so many 'educated' farangs are bent on blaming all that ails Thailand on an exiled ex-prime minister. Nobody is responsible for the army shooting civilians in Bangkok except the government. Illegal occupation of private and/or public property is not a good reason to shoot people. Neither is looting. The red shirt leaders may be selfish jerks dancing to Thaksin's tune, but it's NOT AN EXCUSE for the government to SHOOT PEOPLE. The government lies on the news everyday. So do the red shirts, but who should be the higher moral authority here? Most of you farangs come from western democracies... and most of you would support one political party over another. If you think the best solution to political impasse and or civil disobedience is to shoot those who disagree with you, then you should move to a place that supports that kind of thing (domestically) like Burma. The violence started when the army showed up... PERIOD. The rest of these arguments are pure political rhetoric, hearsay, and paranoia. Of course, if this continues, maybe you folks ARE in the right place.

Wow! You managed to knock down every straw man you set up. You win the kewpie doll

[yeeowww]

Do people still actually believe that this is only about Thaksin?

I will be amazed if people still do not see the bigger picture here.

Would you please spell it out for us Tony?

It's amazing how so many 'educated' farangs are bent on blaming all that ails Thailand on an exiled ex-prime minister. Nobody is responsible for the army shooting civilians in Bangkok except the government. Illegal occupation of private and/or public property is not a good reason to shoot people. Neither is looting. The red shirt leaders may be selfish jerks dancing to Thaksin's tune, but it's NOT AN EXCUSE for the government to SHOOT PEOPLE. The government lies on the news everyday. So do the red shirts, but who should be the higher moral authority here? Most of you farangs come from western democracies... and most of you would support one political party over another. If you think the best solution to political impasse and or civil disobedience is to shoot those who disagree with you, then you should move to a place that supports that kind of thing (domestically) like Burma. The violence started when the army showed up... PERIOD. The rest of these arguments are pure political rhetoric, hearsay, and paranoia. Of course, if this continues, maybe you folks ARE in the right place.

Right Vindie... Try pulling any of the crap these zombies have in any other major city in the world and see how quickly the respective governments would break out the big guns. The problem with Thailand is they waited too long. This shi*t would have been mopped up in 72 hours in the USA, and the death toll would have been directly related to how many idiots chose to stick around after the authorities had given the order to disburse or face the consequences.

[grumpyoldman]

Do people still actually believe that this is only about Thaksin?

I will be amazed if people still do not see the bigger picture here.

Would you please spell it out for us Tony?

It's amazing how so many 'educated' farangs are bent on blaming all that ails Thailand on an exiled ex-prime minister. Nobody is responsible for the army shooting civilians in Bangkok except the government. Illegal occupation of private and/or public property is not a good reason to shoot people. Neither is looting. The red shirt leaders may be selfish jerks dancing to Thaksin's tune, but it's NOT AN EXCUSE for the government to SHOOT PEOPLE. The government lies on the news everyday. So do the red shirts, but who should be the higher moral authority here? Most of you farangs come from western democracies... and most of you would support one political party over another. If you think the best solution to political impasse and or civil disobedience is to shoot those who disagree with you, then you should move to a place that supports that kind of thing (domestically) like Burma. The violence started when the army showed up... PERIOD. The rest of these arguments are pure political rhetoric, hearsay, and paranoia. Of course, if this continues, maybe you folks ARE in the right place.

The red shirts lobbing grenades, not a reason to shoot people? Pulling army out of a truck and mob beating them, not a reason to shoot?

If this were "peaceful disobedience" I'd agree with you, but this has been far from that.

The government tried and tried, set a reconciliatory path with no commitment from the reds. Of course it's time to roll. Wake up! Enough is enough and I think you will find most Thais agree (not just "moral farangs).

[tonywebster]

Do people still actually believe that this is only about Thaksin?

I will be amazed if people still do not see the bigger picture here.

Would you please spell it out for us Tony?

no, I suggest you read things other than the Nation and the inane ramblings of certain posters on here, broaden your horizons and the truth will out.

[tonywebster]

Do people still actually believe that this is only about Thaksin?

I will be amazed if people still do not see the bigger picture here.

Would you please spell it out for us Tony?

It's amazing how so many 'educated' farangs are bent on blaming all that ails Thailand on an exiled ex-prime minister. Nobody is responsible for the army shooting civilians in Bangkok except the government. Illegal occupation of private and/or public property is not a good reason to shoot people. Neither is looting. The red shirt leaders may be selfish jerks dancing to Thaksin's tune, but it's NOT AN EXCUSE for the government to SHOOT PEOPLE. The government lies on the news everyday. So do the red shirts, but who should be the higher moral authority here? Most of you farangs come from western democracies... and most of you would support one political party over another. If you think the best solution to political impasse and or civil disobedience is to shoot those who disagree with you, then you should move to a place that supports that kind of thing (domestically) like Burma. The violence started when the army showed up... PERIOD. The rest of these arguments are pure political rhetoric, hearsay, and paranoia. Of course, if this continues, maybe you folks ARE in the right place.

The red shirts lobbing grenades, not a reason to shoot people? Pulling army out of a truck and mob beating them, not a reason to shoot?

If this were "peaceful disobedience" I'd agree with you, but this has been far from that.

The government tried and tried, set a reconciliatory path with no commitment from the reds. Of course it's time to roll. Wake up! Enough is enough and I think you will find most Thais agree (not just "moral farangs).

if the person lobbing the grenade was shot then I agree, if the person doing the shooting was shot then I agree, however shooting an unarmed man for setting up a barricade is too far. I watched the army this morning on TV showing footage they had, only 3 protesters on this footage had firearms (I know there are probably more), however I want them to show me footage showing the dead with firearms, or grenades, or petrol bombs so I can be sure these people were an immediate threat.

[andrewbkk]

Do people still actually believe that this is only about Thaksin?

I will be amazed if people still do not see the bigger picture here.

Would you please spell it out for us Tony?

It's amazing how so many 'educated' farangs are bent on blaming all that ails Thailand on an exiled ex-prime minister. Nobody is responsible for the army shooting civilians in Bangkok except the government. Illegal occupation of private and/or public property is not a good reason to shoot people. Neither is looting. The red shirt leaders may be selfish jerks dancing to Thaksin's tune, but it's NOT AN EXCUSE for the government to SHOOT PEOPLE. The government lies on the news everyday. So do the red shirts, but who should be the higher moral authority here? Most of you farangs come from western democracies... and most of you would support one political party over another. If you think the best solution to political impasse and or civil disobedience is to shoot those who disagree with you, then you should move to a place that supports that kind of thing (domestically) like Burma. The violence started when the army showed up... PERIOD. The rest of these arguments are pure political rhetoric, hearsay, and paranoia. Of course, if this continues, maybe you folks ARE in the right place.

A debatable point, but for the time being I'll agree with you.

Now, we all agree that violence, shootings and killings are bad, so let me ask you a simple question. When it started, how did Mr Thaksin react.........

1. He showed alarm, dismay, concern, grief, horror, shock

2. He let out a long sigh of relief, sat back in his chair, poured himself a drink, and began to smile

[timekeeper]

i have just sent a text message to Abhisit that i think it would be OK to give Veera amnesty if he told everything to the government about this conspiracy

i told him it would be a tough call but the country would forgive him and it would stop the red menace from spreading once the truth comes out.

if you feel the same, or have other good advise, you could do so too

text 4899006

[EarthAlien]

As they say follow the Money. Take the money away the problem will be solved. I am surprised it took them so long to stop the transfer of money. Also I think the Government should allow everyone who has suffered financial losses because of these people who fund these terrorist and their disruptions to sue for all the damages. It will take care of the money these people have so they are not able to destroy this country ever again

there will not be peace,Taksins objective is to have thai fight thais until the whole country is embroiled in civil

war. then when that is done ,cambodia will invade thailand! thais will be so busy fighting each other that it will be a piece of cake. guess who will ride into thailand on a tank? claiming thailand as his own and himself

as supreme ruler ?

Who wants to dispose the monarchy? and the ultimate aim of the udd supports this. even they don't

about the up coming war with thaitland and cambodia.

Now there's a very disturbing thought and scenario. I hope it's one that is only conceptual and highly improbable,.. but I'll concede that it's not an impossible one. Personally I think that if Thailand were to subside into a civil war or some kind of martial law/militia rule then that would satisfy the objectives of many, not the least of whom would be taxsin.

I sure hope it doesn't come to that because I for one would like to stay and build a future for my wife and kids here and have many friends here and people we care about but I can tell you that at the first real sign of anything like that I'm outta here as fast as possible.

[yeeowww]

One thing you need to understand though as difficult as it is for you with your burning hatred for the man, this is about much more than just thaksin and until you grasp that you will continue to bark up the wrong tree, as will all the other posters that think this is about Thaksin and only Thaksin.

Sorry to burst your enlightened bubble tony, but just ask any red tshirt gang member who/what they're fighting for and the majority will proudly exclaim with a huge grin "Thaksin! Bpen kohn DEE MAHK MAHK!" He is their leader and cause. He championed all of this crap and if he waved his hand today for them all to go home, guess what... THEY WOULD! But no, I guess this is really NOT about Thaksin.

[grumpyoldman]

[

if the person lobbing the grenade was shot then I agree, if the person doing the shooting was shot then I agree, however shooting an unarmed man for setting up a barricade is too far. I watched the army this morning on TV showing footage they had, only 3 protesters on this footage had firearms (I know there are probably more), however I want them to show me footage showing the dead with firearms, or grenades, or petrol bombs so I can be sure these people were an immediate threat.

you got it, Seh Daeng.

How about the guy who puts the baby on the barricade, he's unarmed right?

Using his baby as a shield, disgusting behavior although you probably don't agree.......

[Payboy]

It's must be some kind of a record.

This is the only photo of Thaksin in recent weeks that has no one claiming it's been photoshopped.

Psst, did you notice that the handbag shadows are towards the left while Thaksin's shadow is having a cuppa at the sidewalk cafe?

Ummm... ever heard of light coming from more than one source (especially in an expensive designer shop). Check it out next time you're at the mall... oh wait, all the malls here are shut down! Guess you'll never know Einstein.

[rogerdee123]

It's must be some kind of a record.

This is the only photo of Thaksin in recent weeks that has no one claiming it's been photoshopped.

Psst, did you notice that the handbag shadows are towards the left while Thaksin's shadow is having a cuppa at the sidewalk cafe?

They DO have electric lighting in shops these days.... not just a lantern or candle ......modern lighting can caste many different shadows....photoshopped or not it is what the calibre of this despot would do....now where was it he said he would be leading at the front ready to take the first bullet

BTW how come Chavalit had an urgent desire to see the sights of Kumming in China.....one would have thought it would have been more logical to go to the Expo in Shanghai....I did ask this yesterday but unfortunately had to go out so did not see a reply posted.....would really like to know the reason

I think it's known (suspected) why he left the country .... but not know why he went to Kumming instead of Hongkong or Shanghai or some other place.

[sras]

Right Vindie... Try pulling any of the crap these zombies have in any other major city in the world and see how quickly the respective governments would break out the big guns. The problem with Thailand is they waited too long. This shi*t would have been mopped up in 72 hours in the USA, and the death toll would have been directly related to how many idiots chose to stick around after the authorities had given the order to disburse or face the consequences.

Hi Yeeoww.....

Your statement about the US is a complete fabrication.

You cannot name one respected instance in US history where protester's who were peacefully assembled were subject to being shot at and murdered by the US government. Even in the most emotional protests against the US war in Vietnam, when 100s of thousands came to Washington DC and camped out on the mall, there was virtually no violence.

The problem is Thailand is just the opposite. The people cannot assemble peacefully without being murdered. They cannot voice their opinion without their TV stations being shut down. They cannot speak out against social injustice without fear of arrest. They cannot even peacefully assemble on public fields without fear of arrest.

Anyone who says the US would "crack down" on something like this is completely wrong. In the US, citizens have a birth right to assemble peacefully. They can have their own TV stations, new papers, web sites, full freedom to assemble and to protest and to express themselves. In Thailand, the citizens to not have these basic rights, especially the rural poor.

When read these threads and post, I am truly amazed at misinformation and lies posted here. In the US, what is happening in Thailand would never happen because in the US, when you cast your vote at the polls, the military does not kick out the winner just because the elite do not agree with the results. In the US, there is a working form of democracy and the bulk of the power is with the people. Not in Thailand. The power is in guns and murder of people who protest. You can easily witness this is the streets of Bangkok today.

[Vindie]

Do people still actually believe that this is only about Thaksin?

I will be amazed if people still do not see the bigger picture here.

Would you please spell it out for us Tony?

It's amazing how so many 'educated' farangs are bent on blaming all that ails Thailand on an exiled ex-prime minister. Nobody is responsible for the army shooting civilians in Bangkok except the government. Illegal occupation of private and/or public property is not a good reason to shoot people. Neither is looting. The red shirt leaders may be selfish jerks dancing to Thaksin's tune, but it's NOT AN EXCUSE for the government to SHOOT PEOPLE. The government lies on the news everyday. So do the red shirts, but who should be the higher moral authority here? Most of you farangs come from western democracies... and most of you would support one political party over another. If you think the best solution to political impasse and or civil disobedience is to shoot those who disagree with you, then you should move to a place that supports that kind of thing (domestically) like Burma. The violence started when the army showed up... PERIOD. The rest of these arguments are pure political rhetoric, hearsay, and paranoia. Of course, if this continues, maybe you folks ARE in the right place.

The red shirts lobbing grenades, not a reason to shoot people? Pulling army out of a truck and mob beating them, not a reason to shoot?

If this were "peaceful disobedience" I'd agree with you, but this has been far from that.

The government tried and tried, set a reconciliatory path with no commitment from the reds. Of course it's time to roll. Wake up! Enough is enough and I think you will find most Thais agree (not just "moral farangs).

Rewind, reread, and rethink. I'm not defending anarchists or Thaksinites throwing grenades.... but nobody was throwing them until the army showed up. And fact is, in western countries, the extremists do throw grenades and incendiaries... often upon the police. The reaction is not to send snipers up around town, shoot any random person in the street, and then blame the protesters for shooting themselves. Would red shirts lobbing grenades legitimize shooting people? I suppose yes... but they're not shooting the grenade lobbers (nor can anybody photograph them), they're shooting unarmed people some of whom aren't even involved in the protest (lots of footage). Is that a measured and fair response from the authorities? They claim they are protecting people. Who are they protecting? Armies are not safe to be around. If you send an army somewhere, things blow up and people die. That's why we use them for national defense (or to go blow up other countries whose governments we don't like). They're not trained to protect people, they're trained to kill. The government knew what they were doing when they marched the greens in.

[sras]

Right Vindie... Try pulling any of the crap these zombies have in any other major city in the world and see how quickly the respective governments would break out the big guns. The problem with Thailand is they waited too long. This shi*t would have been mopped up in 72 hours in the USA, and the death toll would have been directly related to how many idiots chose to stick around after the authorities had given the order to disburse or face the consequences.

Hi Yeeoww.....

Your statement about the US is a complete fabrication.

You cannot name one respected instance in US history where protester's who were peacefully assembled were subject to being shot at and murdered by the US government. Even in the most emotional protests against the US war in Vietnam, when 100s of thousands came to Washington DC and camped out on the mall, there was virtually no violence.

The problem is Thailand is just the opposite. The people cannot assemble peacefully without being murdered. They cannot voice their opinion without their TV stations being shut down. They cannot speak out against social injustice without fear of arrest. They cannot even peacefully assemble on public fields without fear of arrest.

Anyone who says the US would "crack down" on something like this is completely wrong. In the US, citizens have a birth right to assemble peacefully. They can have their own TV stations, new papers, web sites, full freedom to assemble and to protest and to express themselves. In Thailand, the citizens to not have these basic rights, especially the rural poor.

When read these threads and post, I am truly amazed at misinformation and lies posted here. In the US, what is happening in Thailand would never happen because in the US, when you cast your vote at the polls, the military does not kick out the winner just because the elite do not agree with the results. In the US, there is a working form of democracy and the bulk of the power is with the people. Not in Thailand. The power is in guns and murder of people who protest. You can easily witness this in the streets of Bangkok today.

I challenge you to name one lawful event in US history where protesters were murdered in the streets. There are none.

[whybother]

Right Vindie... Try pulling any of the crap these zombies have in any other major city in the world and see how quickly the respective governments would break out the big guns. The problem with Thailand is they waited too long. This shi*t would have been mopped up in 72 hours in the USA, and the death toll would have been directly related to how many idiots chose to stick around after the authorities had given the order to disburse or face the consequences.

Hi Yeeoww.....

Your statement about the US is a complete fabrication.

You cannot name one respected instance in US history where protester's who were peacefully assembled were subject to being shot at and murdered by the US government. Even in the most emotional protests against the US war in Vietnam, when 100s of thousands came to Washington DC and camped out on the mall, there was virtually no violence.

The problem is Thailand is just the opposite. The people cannot assemble peacefully without being murdered. They cannot voice their opinion without their TV stations being shut down. They cannot speak out against social injustice without fear of arrest. They cannot even peacefully assemble on public fields without fear of arrest.

Anyone who says the US would "crack down" on something like this is completely wrong. In the US, citizens have a birth right to assemble peacefully. They can have their own TV stations, new papers, web sites, full freedom to assemble and to protest and to express themselves. In Thailand, the citizens to not have these basic rights, especially the rural poor.

When read these threads and post, I am truly amazed at misinformation and lies posted here. In the US, what is happening in Thailand would never happen because in the US, when you cast your vote at the polls, the military does not kick out the winner just because the elite do not agree with the results. In the US, there is a working form of democracy and the bulk of the power is with the people. Not in Thailand. The power is in guns and murder of people who protest. You can easily witness this in the streets of Bangkok today.

I challenge you to name one lawful event in US history where protesters were murdered in the streets. There are none.

Where is the peaceful protest in Thailand where people are being murdered?

[animatic]

they backed him into a corner..

using any dirty underhand method they could use..

what is he supposed to do???

Retire, as he promised to do at least three times, on a couple billion dollars. Could have made a nice life for himself; now he will die a tired, sick old man.

Or worse...

Spot on.

[yeeowww]

It's amazing how so many 'educated' farangs are bent on blaming all that ails Thailand on an exiled ex-prime minister. Nobody is responsible for the army shooting civilians in Bangkok except the government. Illegal occupation of private and/or public property is not a good reason to shoot people. Neither is looting. The red shirt leaders may be selfish jerks dancing to Thaksin's tune, but it's NOT AN EXCUSE for the government to SHOOT PEOPLE. The government lies on the news everyday. So do the red shirts, but who should be the higher moral authority here? Most of you farangs come from western democracies... and most of you would support one political party over another. If you think the best solution to political impasse and or civil disobedience is to shoot those who disagree with you, then you should move to a place that supports that kind of thing (domestically) like Burma. The violence started when the army showed up... PERIOD. The rest of these arguments are pure political rhetoric, hearsay, and paranoia. Of course, if this continues, maybe you folks ARE in the right place.

The red shirts lobbing grenades, not a reason to shoot people? Pulling army out of a truck and mob beating them, not a reason to shoot?

If this were "peaceful disobedience" I'd agree with you, but this has been far from that.

The government tried and tried, set a reconciliatory path with no commitment from the reds. Of course it's time to roll. Wake up! Enough is enough and I think you will find most Thais agree (not just "moral farangs).

if the person lobbing the grenade was shot then I agree, if the person doing the shooting was shot then I agree, however shooting an unarmed man for setting up a barricade is too far. I watched the army this morning on TV showing footage they had, only 3 protesters on this footage had firearms (I know there are probably more), however I want them to show me footage showing the dead with firearms, or grenades, or petrol bombs so I can be sure these people were an immediate threat.

The Red Tshirts are the ones who declared War on this government. In war, all enemy are equal targets. There is no sorting out the "good" tshirts from the "bad" tshirts. Those who choose to stay there know full well the possible consequences. Their leaders know full well what they're sending their zombie fool followers into. They are the ones to be held responsible.

And I say it again, why should this government react any differently than that of, let's say, the USA, considered by many to be the most successful democratic government on earth. Any group pulling the sh*t that this brainwashed mob has gotten away with over there would have been met with the firepower of the law looooong ago. And I can tell you, the head count would be MUCH higher.

[321niti123]

I fail to understand why the Thai government have not done everything possible to have an international arrest warrant put out by Interpol for the arrest of Thaksin and the red leaders who have recently fled Thailand. Can anyone help me out here? Why has this not been done? Is it a complex legal procedure?

I don't think they want thaksin back in Thailand, they just want to keep him out there.

[bendejo]

Word is 100,000 baht per family if the reds bring down the gov't. True or false I don't know but that's the scuttlebutt on the street. To have come so far, and to get so close, well, as you can see from reports people are willing to risk the lives of themselves and their kids (I guess laws regarding being a fit parent don't exist in this country). If the gov't efforts to stem the stream of money have an effect the red volunteers will all be stiffed, and man are they gonna be pissed off! Let's see if they go to Hong Kong and burn down his US$27 million mansion. If all this gets out before the reds are dispersed, can you imagine the lynch mobs when the red leadership is given the Mussolini treatment?

I've thought TS was a piece of animated excrement for a long time, but this whole business of getting the poor to risk their lives for a little of his money is the epitome of cynicism. There is no fate so terrible that could befall him that would make me feel sorry for him and his ilk.

The channels of gov't have been bought as well. I think the main hindrance to action against the reds has been duplicity in the ranks, from top levels down to the good ol' pocket-stuffers in brown. Don't expect changes any time soon.

I also wonder if, medically, TS's days are numbered. His constant claims to health mean there is something wrong. This is not proof of anything, but he is definitely wearing a hairpiece these days.

[grumpyoldman]

Right Vindie... Try pulling any of the crap these zombies have in any other major city in the world and see how quickly the respective governments would break out the big guns. The problem with Thailand is they waited too long. This shi*t would have been mopped up in 72 hours in the USA, and the death toll would have been directly related to how many idiots chose to stick around after the authorities had given the order to disburse or face the consequences.

I challenge you to name one lawful event in US history where protesters were murdered in the streets. There are none.

Kent State

[BigC]

As they say follow the Money. Take the money away the problem will be solved. I am surprised it took them so long to stop the transfer of money. Also I think the Government should allow everyone who has suffered financial losses because of these people who fund these terrorist and their disruptions to sue for all the damages. It will take care of the money these people have so they are not able to destroy this country ever again

they are fighting not just for money now. they probably feel cheated. taksin was democraticaly voted in. then his party memeber were re voted in. now the yellows said something about want Abbist to step down because he made a deal to have re- eclections in novemeber.

sounds like the yellows i worriede about democracy.

i hated my PM but all i can do is vote. what the yellows did was the start of all this. hard the army closed them down then none of this would have happened. they should all be arrested aswell.

not everybody is happy in the out come of the election but that is why we have them to get the majority of people in power. if the minority force the voted PM out then what is the point in have elections.

PAD. People Alliance for Dictatorship !

[sras]

I think some of the posters here have been living in a cave for the past three months!

The Red Shirts were protesting peacefully in Bangkok months ago. I was there. I witnessed it directly. I am not brainwashed by reading a bunch of lies in the media.

The Red Shirts were not permitted (as I recall) to peacefully assemble in Sanam Luang, so they had no choice but to assemble where they could. They assembled peacefully and rode through the streets, winning the hearts of the people. They were joyous and having fun, protesting and exercising their birth rights at Thai citizens.

Then, afraid of what was going on, the government issued the standard "censorship" emergency order and shut down the Reds TV station. Then, naturally, the Reds became angry. Then, the government cracked down and murdered Red Shirts in the streets.

Anyone who believes otherwise is a crackhead, LOL.

Edited May 18, 2010 by silkroadasia

[Vindie]

It's amazing how so many 'educated' farangs are bent on blaming all that ails Thailand on an exiled ex-prime minister. Nobody is responsible for the army shooting civilians in Bangkok except the government. Illegal occupation of private and/or public property is not a good reason to shoot people. Neither is looting. The red shirt leaders may be selfish jerks dancing to Thaksin's tune, but it's NOT AN EXCUSE for the government to SHOOT PEOPLE. The government lies on the news everyday. So do the red shirts, but who should be the higher moral authority here? Most of you farangs come from western democracies... and most of you would support one political party over another. If you think the best solution to political impasse and or civil disobedience is to shoot those who disagree with you, then you should move to a place that supports that kind of thing (domestically) like Burma. The violence started when the army showed up... PERIOD. The rest of these arguments are pure political rhetoric, hearsay, and paranoia. Of course, if this continues, maybe you folks ARE in the right place.

The red shirts lobbing grenades, not a reason to shoot people? Pulling army out of a truck and mob beating them, not a reason to shoot?

If this were "peaceful disobedience" I'd agree with you, but this has been far from that.

The government tried and tried, set a reconciliatory path with no commitment from the reds. Of course it's time to roll. Wake up! Enough is enough and I think you will find most Thais agree (not just "moral farangs).

if the person lobbing the grenade was shot then I agree, if the person doing the shooting was shot then I agree, however shooting an unarmed man for setting up a barricade is too far. I watched the army this morning on TV showing footage they had, only 3 protesters on this footage had firearms (I know there are probably more), however I want them to show me footage showing the dead with firearms, or grenades, or petrol bombs so I can be sure these people were an immediate threat.

The Red Tshirts are the ones who declared War on this government. In war, all enemy are equal targets. There is no sorting out the "good" tshirts from the "bad" tshirts. Those who choose to stay there know full well the possible consequences. Their leaders know full well what they're sending their zombie fool followers into. They are the ones to be held responsible.

And I say it again, why should this government react any differently than that of, let's say, the USA, considered by many to be the most successful democratic government on earth. Any group pulling the sh*t that this brainwashed mob has gotten away with over there would have been met with the firepower of the law looooong ago. And I can tell you, the head count would be MUCH higher.

Absolute rubbish. The US tried using the national guard in the 70s to quell unrest. The result was predictable. Look it up.

[yeeowww]

Right Vindie... Try pulling any of the crap these zombies have in any other major city in the world and see how quickly the respective governments would break out the big guns. The problem with Thailand is they waited too long. This shi*t would have been mopped up in 72 hours in the USA, and the death toll would have been directly related to how many idiots chose to stick around after the authorities had given the order to disburse or face the consequences.

Hi Yeeoww.....

Your statement about the US is a complete fabrication.

You cannot name one respected instance in US history where protester's who were peacefully assembled were subject to being shot at and murdered by the US government. Even in the most emotional protests against the US war in Vietnam, when 100s of thousands came to Washington DC and camped out on the mall, there was virtually no violence.

The problem is Thailand is just the opposite. The people cannot assemble peacefully without being murdered. They cannot voice their opinion without their TV stations being shut down. They cannot speak out against social injustice without fear of arrest. They cannot even peacefully assemble on public fields without fear of arrest.

Anyone who says the US would "crack down" on something like this is completely wrong. In the US, citizens have a birth right to assemble peacefully. They can have their own TV stations, new papers, web sites, full freedom to assemble and to protest and to express themselves. In Thailand, the citizens to not have these basic rights, especially the rural poor.

When read these threads and post, I am truly amazed at misinformation and lies posted here. In the US, what is happening in Thailand would never happen because in the US, when you cast your vote at the polls, the military does not kick out the winner just because the elite do not agree with the results. In the US, there is a working form of democracy and the bulk of the power is with the people. Not in Thailand. The power is in guns and murder of people who protest. You can easily witness this is the streets of Bangkok today.

No, I cannot name one PEACEFUL demonstration. But who said this was a PEACEFUL demonstration? Are YOU trying to suggest it is, you've got to be joking! Because if you are, then I'd suggest you change your medication because your not in command of your capabilities for logical thought.

And you are wrong again on another count, when you are found guilty of lies, thievery and corruption in the USA, you are thrown out by one means or another... the end results are the same. You cheat, you get tossed. Remember old "Tricky Dick Nixon"???

I'll say it again, and this time pay attention and open that skull of yours... try the crap the red tshirts have pulled in ANY other major city and you WILL be shot. Guaranteed.

[animatic]

Do people still actually believe that this is only about Thaksin?

I will be amazed if people still do not see the bigger picture here.

Would you please spell it out for us Tony?

It's amazing how so many 'educated' farangs are bent on blaming all that ails Thailand on an exiled ex-prime minister. Nobody is responsible for the army shooting civilians in Bangkok except the government. Illegal occupation of private and/or public property is not a good reason to shoot people. Neither is looting. The red shirt leaders may be selfish jerks dancing to Thaksin's tune, but it's NOT AN EXCUSE for the government to SHOOT PEOPLE. The government lies on the news everyday. So do the red shirts, but who should be the higher moral authority here? Most of you farangs come from western democracies... and most of you would support one political party over another. If you think the best solution to political impasse and or civil disobedience is to shoot those who disagree with you, then you should move to a place that supports that kind of thing (domestically) like Burma. The violence started when the army showed up... PERIOD. The rest of these arguments are pure political rhetoric, hearsay, and paranoia. Of course, if this continues, maybe you folks ARE in the right place.

Blurring the lines of reality and fantasy i see.

The army is not randomly shooting people,

but there are real snipers out there trying to make it look that way.

And a few Issan pawns are a fine strategic sacrifice to propaganda vs the government.

This is about bringing down a government, not playing nice and hoping for the best.

If people are attacking the army they shoot back.

If that means using a vehicle as a deadly weapon that counts too.

If that means filling a tire with flaming gas and rolling it at soldiers that fits too.

Blowing up tank trucks, yep that's fair game too. Shoot'em in the foot.

Looteres get shot dead in emergency situations world wide.

If they CAUSED the emergency... well that's their fault.

The violence started when Red Shirts started attacking those that disagreed with them,

several years in the making at this point. The Reds venture out and attack the army

who have yet to try and enter the Rajaprasong encampment.

This is just the final culmination of their violence ladden journey to hel_l.

[sawadeeken]

I hope they continue to try to arrest the red terrorists AND THEIR LEADERS, show the leaders (Taksins Employees) no mercy, and jail the poor innocent farmers for two years, BUT then suspend their sentences and let them go home -- once they have completed mandatory classes in prison to teach them to use their heads and not be so gullible............... I've said before, they are mostly honest, loving, and MIS-LEAD people who are much like the people who are so hyped up by these devious leaders, that they would march off a cliff if asked to do it for their 'cause'. Do any of you recall the "Jonestown Massacre"????? Think of the comparison when this religious leader was able to convince more than a thousand poeple to follow him to Guyana in South America, live as a cult and finally all commit suicide simultaniously (including their children) -- About a thousand of them.. Think about the comparison!!!

edited to add the following link to Jonestown Massacre

http://www.infoplease.com/spot/jonestown1.html

Edited May 18, 2010 by sawadeeken

[sras]

Absolute rubbish. The US tried using the national guard in the 70s to quell unrest. The result was predictable. Look it up.

Absolutely Right Vindie!

The US has only used violence against anti-government protests a few times and when they did, it was a complete failure. The US does not murder their citizens in the street as happens in Thailand.

In Thailand, when a leader is elected, and the elite want that leader out, they create a coup and kick out the democratically elected leader. Of course the rural poor are very tired of having their votes and rights violated! This could never happen in the US because US citizens have basic human rights assured. Votes count in the US. In Thailand, votes have no meaning, only guns have meaning.

In Thailand, the population has very little rights, and when they try to exercise what little rights they have, the government issues an "emergency degree" and arrests and murders them in the the street.

Read Thai history and get educated. Don't be brainwashed by the press. Thanks!

Edited May 18, 2010 by silkroadasia

[whybother]

As they say follow the Money. Take the money away the problem will be solved. I am surprised it took them so long to stop the transfer of money. Also I think the Government should allow everyone who has suffered financial losses because of these people who fund these terrorist and their disruptions to sue for all the damages. It will take care of the money these people have so they are not able to destroy this country ever again

they are fighting not just for money now. they probably feel cheated. taksin was democraticaly voted in. then his party memeber were re voted in. now the yellows said something about want Abbist to step down because he made a deal to have re- eclections in novemeber.

sounds like the yellows i worriede about democracy.

i hated my PM but all i can do is vote. what the yellows did was the start of all this. hard the army closed them down then none of this would have happened. they should all be arrested aswell.

not everybody is happy in the out come of the election but that is why we have them to get the majority of people in power. if the minority force the voted PM out then what is the point in have elections.

PAD. People Alliance for Dictatorship !

Didn't the PAD start up around the time that Thaksin changed the law (as PM) so he could sell HIS company to the Singaporeans?

Then he dissolved parliament only a year after winning elections. Why?

When did the minority force a voted PM out? There was no elected PM when the coup occured. Samak and the PPP (Somchai) broke the law and were banned by the courts.

Abhisit was democratically voted in. Now, what are the minority reds trying to do?

[lannarebirth]

Do people still actually believe that this is only about Thaksin?

I will be amazed if people still do not see the bigger picture here.

Would you please spell it out for us Tony?

no, I suggest you read things other than the Nation and the inane ramblings of certain posters on here, broaden your horizons and the truth will out.

I don't have a degree in Thai studies, its true. Still, I think I've probably read more material related to Thailand, its history and politics than most people who do have one. Here's something for your reading list:

http://www.asafas.kyoto-u.ac.jp/publicatio...602/454-470.pdf

After reading it give some consideration as to why a central government based welfare state might prove detrimental to the money and power dreams of provincially based power blocs.