PM Abhisit Criticizes Thaksin For Continuing To Damage The Country

[Bakseedaa]

Like it or not, AV may have to made sacrifice and include Taksin in the reconcilation plan. If past history is to set precedent, pardoning Taksin for the sake of permanent peace is not unique.

Thaksin is a criminal.... what should we teach our childrens.. ???

[Bakseedaa]

Like it or not, AV may have to made sacrifice and include Taksin in the reconcilation plan. If past history is to set precedent, pardoning Taksin for the sake of permanent peace is not unique.

100% agree.

The best move Abhisit could make is to "suspend" Thaksins sentance so he can come back to Thailand.... on the proviso that he not get involved in any political party.

Include him as an advisor to the reconciliation comittee. That would immediatly subdue the red shirt movement. He is obviously a good business leader so make use of his talents to get the country pul;ling together.

If he steps out of line...then they have him in the country to do what they want with him.

The charges laid against him were politicly motivated and only designed to keep him out of the political scene...which obviously backfired on those that instigated the charges.

Thaksin may be a murderer and a convicted swindler..... what lessons to the youth of Thailand... get a life...!!!!

[jayjay0]

A reply of "No comment" when asked the question would have reduced the "damage to Thailand's reputation" greatly by keeping the statement off the front pages.

They can't very well say that he continues to damage the country by posting on a "social website" and then follow it up with statements that bring the issue onto the front pages of the news.

Good points. The man not only craves power but he also craves attention.

Strange that these brain washed Thaksin devotee's have not suggested giving him all his money back. Then he will be able to give them all a raise.

[Sao Jiang Mai]

If that "The Joseph Plan" posting doesn't stop I will stop it with a long suspension for the poster in question.

I hope my point is clear

one post and quoted post deleted

I don't even know what that  plan means...

Hallelujah! It has bugged me for months. Either tell us what the plan is or just stop going on about it...

[Canada]

Like it or not, AV may have to made sacrifice and include Taksin in the reconcilation plan. If past history is to set precedent, pardoning Taksin for the sake of permanent peace is not unique.

"If"....Taksin was interested in peace or the welfare of this state and it's people.....then there would be a common goal....and maybe that would work.

However.....this is not the case. He is a shyster, and will live the life of a shyster, as he currently is. Unfortunate that he was able to fool as many citizens as he did....it's a problem. Make no mistake, he is a shyster and not good for this country.

I hope he never gets back...even to do his time.....that would be the worst thing.

Don't bother quoting all the good things he has done.....it cost him and this country nothing to do them. What he did for himself has cost this country a fortune.

[gemini81]

Like it or not, AV may have to made sacrifice and include Taksin in the reconcilation plan. If past history is to set precedent, pardoning Taksin for the sake of permanent peace is not unique.

"If"....Taksin was interested in peace or the welfare of this state and it's people.....then there would be a common goal....and maybe that would work.

However.....this is not the case. He is a shyster, and will live the life of a shyster, as he currently is. Unfortunate that he was able to fool as many citizens as he did....it's a problem. Make no mistake, he is a shyster and not good for this country.

I hope he never gets back...even to do his time.....that would be the worst thing.

Don't bother quoting all the good things he has done.....it cost him and this country nothing to do them. What he did for himself has cost this country a fortune.

He's had several years now to do something positive or turn himself him, but he has done nothing but discredit himself. He is as bad as infamous dictators and their crimes against humanity.

Hope they don't bring him back even to be apprehended, since he disowned himself from thailand, he should be shut out and shut down (by whatever means!)

[gemini81]

The best move Abhisit could make is to "suspend" Thaksins sentance so he can come back to Thailand.... on the proviso that he not get involved in any political party. Include him as an advisor to the reconciliation comittee.

Are you serious??

This guy will NEVER stop until he's reached what he want (and his want is a total power). Especially after he "mistakedly" tried a King's chair in front of the country (a few years ago), and after all of these damages/movements/actions recently...And now you are talking about letting the wolf into the sheep's yard again - to "help the sheeps reconcilate into wolves"...Haha!

He is praying for that.

Totally agree - Thaksin is a narcissistic sociopath Type 'A'. He can never return or the riots will break out on his arrival. Abhisit must go thru the motions of saying he has issued extradition but no way they want this loser back here. The Govt will continue the front whilst someone plots putting a bullet in Thakky from a distance. HIs security bill far outweighs how much he just spent on the Red Shirt rallies!

...at least he has reduced himself to the insecurity of tons of guards, and having to look over his shoulder left right and center. He deserves it, and he brought it on himself.

[virtualtraveller]

You've got it all wrong, arguing among yourselves, look beyond Thaksin, there was a huge gravy train surrounding him when in power and these people constitute the core of his undying support. They are now all in inactive posts and their fast track careers on hold. They want back in power, with their man at the helm with a free hand to continue writing the blank cheques that bought their loyalty. These people will never get the same lucrative deal from another party, so they will relentlessly pursue the goal of power change. They are not interested in reconciliation, as far as they are concerned this is a dictatorship and it's bad for them and for Thailand and if necessary they will try again and again to overthrow this system without having to make any major concessions. They believe the tide of grassroots groundswell is with them and they will eventually triumph and the majority of the country will cheer them and the other 49% should shut up and accept the democratic choice. After the May 2010 crisis they are not in the mood to talk peace with this govt, certainly while a SoE remains.

They came to Rajaprasong expecting to overthrow the govt, believing that the PAD had managed to do the same, and they got beaten, now they hold the cards in the hand for co-operating on reconciliation and you can bet Thaksin is going to tell them to dig their heels in until they have wrung major concessions for him personally. So, perhaps, the only way forward is indeed a pardon, it happens often to resolve deadlock, even at the expense of law and order, and as long as the coup leaders have amnesty then Thaksin has a valid demand (note how the reds have never once demanded justice for the coup makers).

Unfortunately, we all know that you just can't trust Thaksin, so many times in the past he has proved to be a snake, agreeing then going back on his word. Even as the coup was happening he was negotiating on the phone with the army for a sage passage out of Thailand for his family, pretending to concede, but was actually buying time to try and persuade some senior officers to abandon their support for the coup. He's in a state of denial that he did anything wrong and is deeply slighted and determined to exact revenge. Even if he did agree to a GNU and win his freedom on condition of 'retirement' you can bet he will ignore the spirit of the agreement and somehow explore ways around the deal, just like he did with law and tax, putting a gloss of legality on it while trying to force his foot back in the door. Remember, he not only has lost billions, but has spent billions more on this terror campaign and will want a friendly govt that helps him recover it through monopolies or whatever.

So, I'm not sure were we go from here, other than a low level war at political level, a war of attrition that drags on for a decade with power see-sawing back and forth, the economy suffering and Thaksin eventually losing the energy to continue. The institution's best bet is to sniff out divisions in PT and offer the mods a lot of money to go off and form a new party that appeases the reds and helps them forget Thaksin gradually.

[rkidlad]

I live in Thailand but am not Thai. I genuinely worry about Taksin ever coming back to Thailand. I really hope he doesn't come back ever, even if it was to go to prison. I hope he just stays out of the country and wish no one would ever talk about him again.

In a perfect world he'd come here, do his time (which in my opinion should be life) and never be allowed to practise politics again. He should have an asbo blocking him from speaking to any politicians or going anywhere near any government buildings.

I think if he ever comes back here in any shape or form, he'll be basking for blood. Life is cheap in Thailand and he has money. I believe this man would want to kill anyone who betrayed him or who doesn't agree with him.

I worry, and I have the luxury of just upping sticks and moving. Most Thai people I know don't have that luxury.

Edited June 22, 2010 by rkidlad

[animatic]

If that "The Joseph Plan" posting doesn't stop I will stop it with a long suspension for the poster in question.

I hope my point is clear

one post and quoted post deleted

I don't even know what that plan means...

Hallelujah! It has bugged me for months. Either tell us what the plan is or just stop going on about it...

Hosanah hosanah hosana,

,I have also been pretty sick of reading this endless proslytizing for something

that either is a book deal or a minor website. But has never made much clear sense.

[bendejo]

Sociopathic megalomaniacs (is that redundant?) don't make good collaborators.

Letting him in at all will give him the chance to organize enough rats to carry him to the top again.

[scorecard]

PM Abhisit cannot 'suspend' the sentence handed down to thaksin. The appropriate court is the only 'body' that can do that and there is no grounds on which anybody can ask the court to 'suspend' thaksins well deserved sentence.

Suspending thakins sentence would set a precedent which is not appropriate in any way and would provide grounds for thousands of other people to demand that their sentences should also be suspended.

Not a good idea.

[cdnvic]

Several inflammatory posts or ones who mentioned The Monarchy (or foolishly quoted a post which did) removed.

[Tony Clifton]

Sounds and looks like a neo-christian foundation or someone financing his stay in S.E ASia through charity.

That's the plan.

[selftaopath]

Like it or not, AV may have to made sacrifice and include Taksin in the reconcilation plan. If past history is to set precedent, pardoning Taksin for the sake of permanent peace is not unique.

If he gets a pardon, he will sense weakness and then demand power back, or try to take it.

Which he is trying to do now. A pardon will not bring reconciliation, Thaksin wants all or nothing,

that's obvious from the tactics and methodes he uses.

Many people believe most – if not all - politicians, armyelites, police, and business owners are not interested in the well being of TheKingdom of Thailand. Their own personalgreed prompts them to enforce bribery and monopolies which stymies growth invarious sectors. Many would guess thatthese “elites” i.e. rich/powerful do not contribute to Thailand byeven paying any taxes proportionate to their wealth/income. GEEZE . Yes T.S.may rule in these characterizes, but let’s be clear of the feuding familiesinvolvement in the decline of Thailand

Thailandremains a feeding trough for bloodsuckers.

[yoshiwara]

 Thaksin wants all or nothing,

 that's obvious from the tactics and methods he uses.

It certainly seems that way. However, if there is any way to neuter him politically, it would certainly be worth a pardon to straighten out this mess and it is the Thai way. 

There is no doubt that the Thaksin apologists have at the absolute pinnacle of their ambitions a pardon for Thaksin and free him to resume his financial rape of Thailand. That they can with a straight face suggest a pardon to come from the PM is hilarious at best. The Thai way?, more like a vote for suicide. Thaksin is poison. There is no way to neuter him. The situation is not a mess. It is a battle to keep Thaksin away, the red violent thugs off the streets and a return to normality ready for elections in 2011.

[frankman]

Thaksin wants all or nothing,

that's obvious from the tactics and methods he uses.

It certainly seems that way. However, if there is any way to neuter him politically, it would certainly be worth a pardon to straighten out this mess and it is the Thai way.

There is no doubt that the Thaksin apologists have at the absolute pinnacle of their ambitions a pardon for Thaksin and free him to resume his financial rape of Thailand. That they can with a straight face suggest a pardon to come from the PM is hilarious at best. The Thai way?, more like a vote for suicide. Thaksin is poison. There is no way to neuter him. The situation is not a mess. It is a battle to keep Thaksin away, the red violent thugs off the streets and a return to normality ready for elections in 2011.

very true!!!

Edited June 23, 2010 by frankman

[wester]

Pot, Kettle, Black

"When you blame others,

there is no end to the blame."

- Lao Tze, vese 79 - Tao Te Ching

[ihunnieibee]

Pot, Kettle, Black

"When you blame others,

there is no end to the blame."

- Lao Tze, vese 79 - Tao Te Ching

I was thinking the exact same thing...

If you continue to blame this or that, nothing will ever get resolved...

blame doesn't equal a solution

[frankman]

Pot, Kettle, Black

"When you blame others,

there is no end to the blame."

- Lao Tze, vese 79 - Tao Te Ching

[kissdani]

PM Criticizes Thaksin for Continuing to Damage the Country

BANGKOK: -- The prime minister said that he never expected former Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra to stop damaging Thailand with his criticisms. At the same time, he denied having received any report that some fugitive red-shirt leaders are preparing to resume anti-government movements abroad.

Prime Minister Abhisit Vejjajiva commented on the messages posted on a social website, critical of Thailand, by former Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra. Abhisit said that he personally, never expected Thaksin to stop such behavior, which has been detrimental to the country's image.

He also said the ousted premier should stop supporting illegal activities if he is really sincere about partaking in the reconciliation process.

Call the interpol police: Thaksin posted critical messages on a social website.

And Abhisit used the social network website twitter to criticize Thaksin for this criticisms.

http://twitter.com/PM_Abhisit/status/16758235508

Thaksins twitter microblog is now blocked by CAPO.

Means that that the PM has won the twitter war?

Not that i am following these twitter battles, i only look there from time to time when the news reports something was said there.

This time i noticed an odd detail on Abhisit twitter site. In a tweet that blames Thaksin to be not cooperative in the peace process, The PM refers to Thakisn with his full police rank, speaking of Police Lieutenant Colonel(พ.ต.ท.) Thaksin and not just Thaksin.

PM Abhisit is an unfunny and uncreative bureaucrat, a bureaucrat who sticks pedantic to the protocol even on that short message channel twitter. where everybody else comes up with some abbreviation and neologism. Here in Thailand the newspapers referring to politicians by their nicknames and specially the social internet networks came up with new synonyms like The Caller from Dubai or The Traveling Fugitive for example. Only referring to aPol. Lt. Col. without mention his name would have been sufficient and funny too, everybody would know who is that nameless Pol. Lt. Col..

The argument that the Pol. Lt. Col. damages Thailand with his criticisms, is a total silly argument. Abhisit and the current government feel maybe not exactly flattered and honoured by Thaksins messages, but they are only the current government, in a democracy with election always only a temporary position, a temporary appointment. The PM and the govt is not Thailand, they are not the country. And a Government is also not the State.

Censorship and blocking of websites is also not a sign that you invites all sides to a dialogue.

Additional, Thakins twitter channel was one of the main intel source for the officials in tracking Thaksins movement around the globe. To obtain these infomation in a legal way is now more complicated for the investigation teams. I know, technically it is easy to bypass blocking of websites, but these methods are all becoming illegal in the moment they are used to access illegal , prohibited sites. For sure, with additional paper works the investigators will be able to get an exemption certificate but that requires additional paper work and can lead to procedural error, tiny mistakes that can bring a 'success' in a court hearing at risk.

All the newspapers will not be able to report and quote Thaksins latest SMS declarations of terror and manifestos of anarchy, and cannot condemn it accordingly. Or cannot publish the newest destination, last place of exile of the fugitive. what in the past made 50% of The Nation content can now not get mentioned anymore.

The computer crime act makes many innocent net-citizens to criminals. specially in social networks like twitter can that happen very quick.

- insert false data that violates national security or anti.terrorism laws -up to 5 years jail. e.g Thaksin post a messages on a social website, critical of an army general.

- and to publish or forward such data also 5 years jail. e.g. You. On your website/webblog you use some application to publish the rss feed of a certain hashtag from the twitter network, Thaksin himself or someone else retweet the terroist under this certain tag and so the message also can be read by the visitors of your website. guilty, you forwarded false data. you are criminal.

[JetsetBkk]

I know that this subject will invoke emotional outburst as sides and divisions have been well grounded. But is permanent peace for the King, country and our children are more overwhelming reasons for putting aside our differences? If Northern Ireland can be an example and the wise decision of the then British leaders to engage Sinn Fein which was far more radical than the UDD; could we do the same? I am no Taksin fan but I love the country to discard emotional prejudice and think for the future.

Exactly the analogy I was going to make.

Sinn Fein / Provisional IRA / Real IRA... compare to red shirt supporters (me) / red shirt terrorists/bombers/arsonists supporters (not me) / Thaksin supporters (not me).

The majority of the rural poor don't want to burn Bangkok, and they will disown the leaders who suggest it once a real alternative is proposed. The red shirts supporters trapped in the Bangkok rally site encampment were peaceful originally, but the place turned into some kind of Mad Max world by the nutjobs on the stage.

But getting that alternative must involve discussions with the red leaders, just as the British government had to talk to those POSs Adams and McGuiness (excuse my French, they still make my skin crawl).

There are parallels to be drawn, but not very clear ones.

The real point is, this government - any government - will not have peace in this country until all political sides are fairly represented.

The problem is, both the yellow supporters and democrat supporters here are probably as much anti-red as I was anti-IRA back in those bad old days in Ireland.

It's not easy to sit down and talk to your enemies. But I think it's the only solution.

[yoshiwara]

You've got it all wrong, arguing among yourselves, look beyond Thaksin, there was a huge gravy train surrounding him when in power and these people constitute the core of his undying support. They are now all in inactive posts and their fast track careers on hold. They want back in power, with their man at the helm with a free hand to continue writing the blank cheques that bought their loyalty. These people will never get the same lucrative deal from another party, so they will relentlessly pursue the goal of power change. They are not interested in reconciliation, as far as they are concerned this is a dictatorship and it's bad for them and for Thailand and if necessary they will try again and again to overthrow this system without having to make any major concessions. They believe the tide of grassroots groundswell is with them and they will eventually triumph and the majority of the country will cheer them and the other 49% should shut up and accept the democratic choice. After the May 2010 crisis they are not in the mood to talk peace with this govt, certainly while a SoE remains.

They came to Rajaprasong expecting to overthrow the govt, believing that the PAD had managed to do the same, and they got beaten, now they hold the cards in the hand for co-operating on reconciliation and you can bet Thaksin is going to tell them to dig their heels in until they have wrung major concessions for him personally. So, perhaps, the only way forward is indeed a pardon, it happens often to resolve deadlock, even at the expense of law and order, and as long as the coup leaders have amnesty then Thaksin has a valid demand (note how the reds have never once demanded justice for the coup makers).

Unfortunately, we all know that you just can't trust Thaksin, so many times in the past he has proved to be a snake, agreeing then going back on his word. Even as the coup was happening he was negotiating on the phone with the army for a sage passage out of Thailand for his family, pretending to concede, but was actually buying time to try and persuade some senior officers to abandon their support for the coup. He's in a state of denial that he did anything wrong and is deeply slighted and determined to exact revenge. Even if he did agree to a GNU and win his freedom on condition of 'retirement' you can bet he will ignore the spirit of the agreement and somehow explore ways around the deal, just like he did with law and tax, putting a gloss of legality on it while trying to force his foot back in the door. Remember, he not only has lost billions, but has spent billions more on this terror campaign and will want a friendly govt that helps him recover it through monopolies or whatever.

So, I'm not sure were we go from here, other than a low level war at political level, a war of attrition that drags on for a decade with power see-sawing back and forth, the economy suffering and Thaksin eventually losing the energy to continue. The institution's best bet is to sniff out divisions in PT and offer the mods a lot of money to go off and form a new party that appeases the reds and helps them forget Thaksin gradually.

Yes indeed.

Thaksin has made an art out of gravy training his whole political movement.

The red movement has no class demands for the peasantry, just an expectation that if and when Thaksin is restored to power and his blood-sucking corruption that they the reds will be rewarded.

Just like a a mafia organisation.

Abhisit is correct to focus on Thaksin and his ambition to hold Thailand as his private money farm.

The red cheerleaders haven't a clue.

[hyperdimension]

compare to red shirt supporters (me) / red shirt terrorists/bombers/arsonists supporters (not me) / Thaksin supporters (not me).

By being a "red shirt supporter", you will be labeled a terrorism supporter and/or Thaksin supporter, regardless of your sympathy for the poor.

Most people do sympathize with the poor but do not support the red shirt movement, because the UDD are only using the poor to get votes from them.

The poor need to separate themselves from the red shirt movement (including Thaksin) and find some other platform for promoting fair policies that would benefit them. Forget silly colors, incitement to violence and libelous hate speech.

[Ricardo]

<snip for brevity>

The real point is, this government - any government - will not have peace in this country until all political sides are fairly represented.

The problem is, both the yellow supporters and democrat supporters here are probably as much anti-red as I was anti-IRA back in those bad old days in Ireland.

It's not easy to sit down and talk to your enemies. But I think it's the only solution.

I would suggest that the red-shirt/UDD movement is already 'fairly represented', although many might not think much of the PTP in parliament these days, since they seem unwilling to co-operate on electoral-reform, or much else.

Perhaps they might stop proposing censure-motions, and start properly representing their constituents again, then the sit-down/talk you propose would recommence ?

[hyperdimension]

I would suggest that the red-shirt/UDD movement is already 'fairly represented', although many might not think much of the PTP in parliament these days, since they seem unwilling to co-operate on electoral-reform, or much else.

PTP are absolutely useless, as all they seem to do is oppose and criticize everything the Democrats propose and do. Anybody who supports the red shirt movement are supporting these imbeciles.

e.g. how can they openly proclaim that the Bhum Jai Thai bomb incident was just a set-up in order to extend the State Of Emergency, without any evidence whatsoever? They just further lose whatever credibility they have left with such silly proclamations.

Perhaps they might stop proposing censure-motions, and start properly representing their constituents again, then the sit-down/talk you propose would recommence ?

That's very funny! Edited June 25, 2010 by hyperdimension

[MaiChai]

Let me put it simply. Taksin refuses to do things by the rules or by the law. If he did, he could have come back, served his two years, and then eventually re-entered the political system obeying the rules/law. He thinks he is above the law. His lack of obeying the rules/law gets no respect from those who are educated, respect and follow the laws. The land case with his wife was an open and shut case; blatant abuse of power, and he has shown no remorse for this or any other abuse of power he has done.

What worries me is that many people in Peua Thai also have no respect for the laws. If they get back in power I think Thailand will become a very dangerous place. I mean if the party in power has no respect for the law/rules (as in Taksin era), then the country will become a place where peoples rights via the law won't be respected. Money will become the tool that controls anything, and Thailand will become a very unfair place. Democracy won't be able to flourish and all other parties, the press, etc, will be snuffed out (as in Taksins era).

The democrat party, which ever way you look at it, are trying to do things in a legal/fair/transparent way. They are trying to move things forward in terms of democracy and equality. Peua Thai, on the other hand, are trying to moved Thailand back to the old corrupt/cronyism ways. This is very clear. Ok, the democrats are not perfect and they do try and manipulate things to their way, but that is politics? I would prefer to move forward than go back to the old ways.

Thus in my opinion, corporates can invest and make money in Thailand, but would you want to move here permanently with this political environment and uncertainty?

Was David Cameron fairly elected (UK PM)? Yes, because he set up a coalition with another party, which is allowed under the rules. The Thai legal system is based on the British system. Whether you agree with it or not its the law, and a government can be formed in the same as in the UK. Hence Abhisit is allowed to be PM. You may not agree with it, but its the rules and the law. If you don't agree with the rules/law, there are legal ways in which they can be changed.

[MaiChai]

That front page says Mark versus Meow (hill person). Taksin is kind of looked down upon by many as Chao Meow or hill tribe person (Taksin's ancestry). Thai racism at work

[rixalex]

I would suggest that the red-shirt/UDD movement is already 'fairly represented', although many might not think much of the PTP in parliament these days, since they seem unwilling to co-operate on electoral-reform, or much else.

Perhaps they might stop proposing censure-motions, and start properly representing their constituents again, then the sit-down/talk you propose would recommence ?

PTP is far too busy trying to build a robot that can campaign on behalf of Kokaew to be worrying about representing their supporters in parliament.

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/home/2010/06/25/politics/Pheu-Thai-look-for-robot-to-campaign-on-Kokaews-be-30132376.html

Too ridiculous for words.

[animatic]

I would suggest that the red-shirt/UDD movement is already 'fairly represented', although many might not think much of the PTP in parliament these days, since they seem unwilling to co-operate on electoral-reform, or much else.

PTP are absolutely useless, as all they seem to do is oppose and criticize everything the Democrats propose and do. Anybody who supports the red shirt movement are supporting these imbeciles.

e.g. how can they openly proclaim that the Bhum Jai Thai bomb incident was just a set-up in order to extend the State Of Emergency, without any evidence whatsoever? They just further lose whatever credibility they have left with such silly proclamations.

Perhaps they might stop proposing censure-motions, and start properly representing their constituents again, then the sit-down/talk you propose would recommence ?

That's very funny!

What is most funny is the word AGAIN... they have yet to ever do this, not since TRT threw out a few crumbs in 2005.

"AGAIN "

ROTFLOL.