Hospice For The Terminally Ill In Chiangmai

[MAJORUS]

I read some time ago about people looking for an hospice for a terminally ill person

Here is up to date info on Dokkaew Gardens at the McKean Rehabilitation Center Chiangmai

Perhaps a MOD could pin it to the pages of remembrance thread as it may be helpful to someone.

DOKKAEW GARDENS

McKEAN REHABILITATION CENTER

PO BOX 53 CHIANGMAI THAILAND 50000.

CONTACT BETH ROADARMEL,,PROJECT MANAGER

DOKKAEW GARDENS

053 124430-124263. EXT139 , FAX 053 124264

Email //e-mail removed as per forum rules//

Rates are 1000baht per day at time of this notice

Edited July 5, 2010 by Tywais

[Gonzo the Face]

As it would be, I was just looking into this this past Saturday for a freend in need

If you google up McKean or Dok Kaew there is also some very good information on the site.

They show that rates start at 21,500 B per month, but that includes quite a bit of services also..

Those with need or interest , its worth the google

Gonzo

[harrry]

Having known someone who went there and the caare they showed and the beautiful setting it may be well worth it for those who are frail or elderly who can no longer live in their own apartmets on their own

[Gonzo the Face]

Having known someone who went there and the caare they showed and the beautiful setting it may be well worth it for those who are frail or elderly who can no longer live in their own apartmets on their own

Don't know about that Harry, but I'm giving it some thought for myself ..... that place down there is just so peaceful and serene.....beautiful setting ..... like a little world of its own within a world

[cardinalblue]

I get the impression that Dok Gardens is more of a long-term care facility for semi-independent or alzheimer type patients or other patients who have chronic illnesses...

There is a difference between a hospice and long-term care faciility or SNF..

Either way, the concept is new in Thailand and there is no doubt with the number of old foreigners living here, the need will be there. Heck, it might even appeal to thais as their culture adopts more western trends...

Big thumbs up for this facility and I hope they make it....Will be interesting to watch this facility grow and change with market demands...

CB

[jayjay0]

I went out there to visit a fellow who needed care in recovering from a serious sickness. He assured me the care was excellent. While we were there a gentleman who had done the same thing came back for a visit.

They had just opened and were not sure what they were going to offer for TV viewing, wanted to wait and see what people wanted before they went and got it. Shows me they care.

The grounds are somewhere around 50 acres with lots of paths for walking. I am told they have a small hospital on the site. For myself I found it incredibly peaceful. They have about a dozen private apartments for rent. The price started at 21,000 for everything. If special care was needed it was available and would be added to the cost depending on what was needed. When I say everything I mean meals, housing they also take people into the city twice a week. There is a section set up for Alzheimer patients so I am quite sure they could look after a terminally ill person.

I highly recommend it. Take a look for yourself pictures do not do it Justice

Edited July 5, 2010 by jayjay0

[jaideeguy]

Agree that it is a nice peaceful setting with caring people. I made a visit on my 91 yr old father's behalf and the place was deserted, but got a tour by the head of the facility and she seemed like a caring person. The two new buildings are well set-up with modern equipment and altho Christian based, it seemed 'neutral' in that I didn't see too many immages of religion.

I did end up ruling it out when my Pop was adament about wanting to spending his last days at home with family and I can respect that as that's what I would want the same for myself.

So.....are there any hospice services for those that would like to die at home?? If any one knows, please inform me by PM or on this topic.

[Gonzo the Face]

Again , I hear nothing but the best about this whole center and complex.

Last week , a couple who I value as really good friends, were staying there as a couple while she was battling cancer. Unfortunately she passed away this past week. A very special lady. Husband was there with her the entire time and spoke nothing but positive about the project.

I do wish them much success with this much needed facility........ its probably like funeral arrangements, we know we will need them but do not like to think about things like that.

Those of you who knew our old buddy Abe, this complex was his last home beforing moving on...

Gonzo

[jaideeguy]

Bottom line......where would you want to be in 'the end'?? At home with family or in an institution??

Not to bash McKean....it would be MY 1st choice if I didn't have family.....but as nice as it is, there is no place like home.

[harrry]

Bottom line......where would you want to be in 'the end'?? At home with family or in an institution??

Not to bash McKean....it would be MY 1st choice if I didn't have family.....but as nice as it is, there is no place like home.

So you wilol have your family being unable to get any sleep or prepare food because they must provide services for you 24hr a day. I know I would rather someone else did this and enabled my wife time to be near me when she can without her being exausted caring for me day and night.

[jayjay0]

Bottom line......where would you want to be in 'the end'?? At home with family or in an institution??

Not to bash McKean....it would be MY 1st choice if I didn't have family.....but as nice as it is, there is no place like home.

I would rather be at McKean.

I in no way want to be a burden on my family. Lord knows I was a big enough burden on them when they were growing up. LOL

I myself have been out to see the facility and no way does it feel like a institution.

[brianmarinus]

I read some time ago about people looking for an hospice for a terminally ill person

Here is up to date info on Dokkaew Gardens at the McKean Rehabilitation Center Chiangmai

Perhaps a MOD could pin it to the pages of remembrance thread as it may be helpful to someone.

DOKKAEW GARDENS

McKEAN REHABILITATION CENTER

PO BOX 53 CHIANGMAI THAILAND 50000.

CONTACT BETH ROADARMEL,,PROJECT MANAGER

DOKKAEW GARDENS

053 124430-124263. EXT139 , FAX 053 124264

Email //e-mail removed as per forum rules//

Rates are 1000baht per day at time of this notice

http://www.facebook....54892&ref=share

It was my friend who needed it-and we get him there-but he is past away now.

I have post this link to other web sites and to the Embasy, so they know, if they needed it another time, in the future.

Brian.

Edited July 6, 2010 by brianmarinus

[jaideeguy]

Bottom line......where would you want to be in 'the end'?? At home with family or in an institution??

Not to bash McKean....it would be MY 1st choice if I didn't have family.....but as nice as it is, there is no place like home.

So you wilol have your family being unable to get any sleep or prepare food because they must provide services for you 24hr a day. I know I would rather someone else did this and enabled my wife time to be near me when she can without her being exausted caring for me day and night.

One of the advantages of living in LOS is not only the old fashioned family values, but the fact that labor is cheap and I wouldn't be as much of a burden to my wife/children and extended family that I have supported for a decade so far and yes......I would like to be in famaliar surroundings with people that I know instead of being in a 'home' for the unwanted old farts.

Don't get me wrong......if I had to be stuck in a home, McKeans would be the place.

[ThaiPauly]

It's really nice to hear such positive comments about somewhere or service for a change.

We've all gotta go sometime so I suppose when my turn comes (if the traffic does not get me first) it sounds like the kinda place I would want to be at the end

[Flatouthruthefog]

Agree that it is a nice peaceful setting with caring people. I made a visit on my 91 yr old father's behalf and the place was deserted, but got a tour by the head of the facility and she seemed like a caring person. The two new buildings are well set-up with modern equipment and altho Christian based, it seemed 'neutral' in that I didn't see too many immages of religion.

I did end up ruling it out when my Pop was adament about wanting to spending his last days at home with family and I can respect that as that's what I would want the same for myself.

So.....are there any hospice services for those that would like to die at home?? If any one knows, please inform me by PM or on this topic.

There is a home nursing service available in Chiang Mai and I am told it has a great reputation, though of course expensive by some standards.

It is an Australian venture, within a Thai structure of course, and the very helpful Hon Consul of Australia Mike Walther has the details. I don't have his with me at present, sorry, but if you can find him you'll find them.

[jaideeguy]

Agree that it is a nice peaceful setting with caring people. I made a visit on my 91 yr old father's behalf and the place was deserted, but got a tour by the head of the facility and she seemed like a caring person. The two new buildings are well set-up with modern equipment and altho Christian based, it seemed 'neutral' in that I didn't see too many immages of religion.

I did end up ruling it out when my Pop was adament about wanting to spending his last days at home with family and I can respect that as that's what I would want the same for myself.

So.....are there any hospice services for those that would like to die at home?? If any one knows, please inform me by PM or on this topic.

There is a home nursing service available in Chiang Mai and I am told it has a great reputation, though of course expensive by some standards.

It is an Australian venture, within a Thai structure of course, and the very helpful Hon Consul of Australia Mike Walther has the details. I don't have his with me at present, sorry, but if you can find him you'll find them.

Yes, I think that is the service that I checked with and yes they are expensive by Thai standards [and mayby by western standards]. That's when I decided to go it on my own for my 92 yr old Pop and so far so good. There may be a point in which I won't be able to handle his health issues unless he is blessed with a heart attack or something else quick and painless and that's when the services of Mckean may come in handy.

Pop is adament about not going into a home/hospital and I'll try my best to honor his wishes. he is a stubborn old fart with decent health for his age and most probably will hang in there for a few more years and need more and more help and I'll hire it as we have to. Meanwhile, I have my life and family to tend to and often have to make priority decisions.

Meanwhile, I am still searching for a hospice service in CM for when and if needed.....preferably falang friendly.

Edited July 7, 2010 by jaideeguy

[Gladiator]

Again , I hear nothing but the best about this whole center and complex.

Last week , a couple who I value as really good friends, were staying there as a couple while she was battling cancer. Unfortunately she passed away this past week. A very special lady. Husband was there with her the entire time and spoke nothing but positive about the project.

I do wish them much success with this much needed facility........ its probably like funeral arrangements, we know we will need them but do not like to think about things like that.

Those of you who knew our old buddy Abe, this complex was his last home beforing moving on...

Gonzo

I have read many of the postings with interest. Some of you may have seen my previous posting regarding McKeans.

Although I do not have personal experience of the new unit, it was being built while my Mum stayed in the main building, I have seen it and am very impressed.

We struggled long and hard to look after Mum at home with a number of Agency Carers. However the time came that the requirement for instant medical attention 24 hours a day had a higher priority than Mum's or our wishs and she and we relocated to McKeans. My family and I have absolutely no regrets but praise for all of the nurses, doctors and staff. Ultimately the care became more 'hospice' style until Mum left us. Members of my family and I would in turn stay with Mum all of the time and we turned her room into a home away from home, celebrating both Christmas and her birthday there.

Daily, we would take her into the gardens to meet with our family dog and a stroll/wheel around the beautiful grounds. It really did feel anything like but a hospital and although it sounds quite strange it was quite jolly.

There were other western residents there that Mum could chat to, including Abe, who I would daily share a cup of tea and biscuits and play trivial pursuit with.

When the time came for Mum's leaving Mckeans were very supportive and made all of the arrangements for Mum and my family to stay in the chapel for a few days before the final ceremony.

If you wish me to provide further information - you are welome to PM me.

Gladiator

[Gonzo the Face]

Again , I hear nothing but the best about this whole center and complex.

Last week , a couple who I value as really good friends, were staying there as a couple while she was battling cancer. Unfortunately she passed away this past week. A very special lady. Husband was there with her the entire time and spoke nothing but positive about the project.

I do wish them much success with this much needed facility........ its probably like funeral arrangements, we know we will need them but do not like to think about things like that.

Those of you who knew our old buddy Abe, this complex was his last home beforing moving on...

Gonzo

I have read many of the postings with interest. Some of you may have seen my previous posting regarding McKeans.

Although I do not have personal experience of the new unit, it was being built while my Mum stayed in the main building, I have seen it and am very impressed.

We struggled long and hard to look after Mum at home with a number of Agency Carers. However the time came that the requirement for instant medical attention 24 hours a day had a higher priority than Mum's or our wishs and she and we relocated to McKeans. My family and I have absolutely no regrets but praise for all of the nurses, doctors and staff. Ultimately the care became more 'hospice' style until Mum left us. Members of my family and I would in turn stay with Mum all of the time and we turned her room into a home away from home, celebrating both Christmas and her birthday there.

Daily, we would take her into the gardens to meet with our family dog and a stroll/wheel around the beautiful grounds. It really did feel anything like but a hospital and although it sounds quite strange it was quite jolly.

There were other western residents there that Mum could chat to, including Abe, who I would daily share a cup of tea and biscuits and play trivial pursuit with.

When the time came for Mum's leaving Mckeans were very supportive and made all of the arrangements for Mum and my family to stay in the chapel for a few days before the final ceremony.

If you wish me to provide further information - you are welome to PM me.

Gladiator

Very nice and warm post.....to those listening with the heart, I'm sure the feeling came through

G

[jayjay0]

Agree that it is a nice peaceful setting with caring people. I made a visit on my 91 yr old father's behalf and the place was deserted, but got a tour by the head of the facility and she seemed like a caring person. The two new buildings are well set-up with modern equipment and altho Christian based, it seemed 'neutral' in that I didn't see too many immages of religion.

I did end up ruling it out when my Pop was adament about wanting to spending his last days at home with family and I can respect that as that's what I would want the same for myself.

So.....are there any hospice services for those that would like to die at home?? If any one knows, please inform me by PM or on this topic.

There is a home nursing service available in Chiang Mai and I am told it has a great reputation, though of course expensive by some standards.

It is an Australian venture, within a Thai structure of course, and the very helpful Hon Consul of Australia Mike Walther has the details. I don't have his with me at present, sorry, but if you can find him you'll find them.

Yes, I think that is the service that I checked with and yes they are expensive by Thai standards [and mayby by western standards]. That's when I decided to go it on my own for my 92 yr old Pop and so far so good. There may be a point in which I won't be able to handle his health issues unless he is blessed with a heart attack or something else quick and painless and that's when the services of Mckean may come in handy.

Pop is adament about not going into a home/hospital and I'll try my best to honor his wishes. he is a stubborn old fart with decent health for his age and most probably will hang in there for a few more years and need more and more help and I'll hire it as we have to. Meanwhile, I have my life and family to tend to and often have to make priority decisions.

Meanwhile, I am still searching for a hospice service in CM for when and if needed.....preferably falang friendly.

Perhaps if you were to take your father out to see the place he would change his mind. In my opinion it is more than a hospice but if needed it can be. It is more than a old folks home also.

The next post by Gladiator is heart warming and all so true.

[brianmarinus]

Hi.!

I told you about my friend, we get a place at Mckeans, for him-I can just tell you, what he said-it is the same, as coming from hel_l to paradice.He was at puplic hospital in Chiang Rai before.

We was down ther for the kremation-and they arrange everything,about it-very nice.

Gor my part-I think it is, a very beuityfull place, whit a professional, and caring staff-I talk alot whit the head nurce-Beth-who speak very good English-and also, translate the hole ceremoni to us,when Carsten past away.

It will-for sure, be the place for me, when times come.

Brian.

[ThaiPauly]

I know this is personal Gonzo, but was "Pain Managment" freely available.

I had an auntie who recently died in the Uk and in the hospice she was in she was allowed to self medicate, she had cancer so she did not suffer to much as she was allowed to do this.

Was this option like this available in CM ?

The reason I ask is that my parents are both in their 80's now and won't move here while both are still alive, but the remaining one may consider it when one of them passes on as they will not get much help back home and neither want to go into an old people's home then eventually the time would come for my remaining parent to pass on and I would hate to think of them suffering unreasonably.

I hope you see where I am coming from

Regards

TP

[SomchaiCNX]

When I first discovered MacKaen about 12- 13 years ago I told my wife already that in case of an accident or revalidation she should send me there.<BR>They have also an organic vegetable farm (organic pig as well).<BR>

[jaideeguy]

I know this is personal Gonzo, but was "Pain Managment" freely available.

I had an auntie who recently died in the Uk and in the hospice she was in she was allowed to self medicate, she had cancer so she did not suffer to much as she was allowed to do this.

Was this option like this available in CM ?

The reason I ask is that my parents are both in their 80's now and won't move here while both are still alive, but the remaining one may consider it when one of them passes on as they will not get much help back home and neither want to go into an old people's home then eventually the time would come for my remaining parent to pass on and I would hate to think of them suffering unreasonably.

I hope you see where I am coming from

Regards

TP

Pain management and self medication are some of my main concerns when 'the time comes' for my Pop. Thanks for addressing that issue TP. Do they offer that at McKean's?? I know it would be hard to get that at home without local hospice care. Don't think that the local Drs would give morphine to take home??

That makes me think of something that I read about 'opium dens' in Asia as being the humane way to go for the old folks in the good old days.....before the corporate medical system [and DEA] took over the business of Rxing.

There is another topic/poll that is currently running by 'blinkybill' that reveals some interesting figures. Basically it says that we [the tv members who voted] are mostly in the 50-70 yr old range and that near half of us are here to stay till 'the end', which is getting closer every day. Let's hope that the 'McKean option' is available then, or they revive opium dens.

For now, my Pop is doing ok at home and I will honor his wishes as long as it is possible, but it is reassuring to know that there is an option for him if it gets to that point where he needs more professional help than I can offer.

[Gonzo the Face]

I know this is personal Gonzo, but was "Pain Managment" freely available.

I had an auntie who recently died in the Uk and in the hospice she was in she was allowed to self medicate, she had cancer so she did not suffer to much as she was allowed to do this.

Was this option like this available in CM ?

The reason I ask is that my parents are both in their 80's now and won't move here while both are still alive, but the remaining one may consider it when one of them passes on as they will not get much help back home and neither want to go into an old people's home then eventually the time would come for my remaining parent to pass on and I would hate to think of them suffering unreasonably.

I hope you see where I am coming from

Regards

TP

Not too sure that understand your question TP. While the couple were very good friends, there were just some things that I felt better not to ask. But if you will help me I will try and find out the answer to your question.

In a cancer patient I can only guess at the amount of pain that they are experienceing and thus the need for some physical pain releif thru medication. But also we, who presently have our health must try and understand the trememdous level of emotional pain being suffered by both the departing and surviving spouse. This emotional pain can be every bit as destructive as the physical.

Thru your post I will guess, you are meaning the physical pain being felt by the cancer victim. ....and is there an adequate amount of meds that would be given to the patient or care giver, so as the patient would be able to self administer on very short notice adequate amounts to dispell the severe pain of the moment.

If this is the case, I will try and find the answer for you when next I see my friend this week end.....

I do hope and pray that this is not a urgent inquiry as for someone close to you.

Gonzo

Edited July 7, 2010 by Gonzo the Face

[jaideeguy]

In the US, 'hospice' and the Drs offer unlimited self administered dosage of morphine [to terminally ill patients in pain]....usually sublingual or if connected to a tube, you simply push the button [that opens a valve] to get pain relief as needed and that is 'the humane way' to treat pain [iMHO]. I'm not afraid of death, but pain scares the s*%t out of me.

I think what TP was trying to ask is...."do they do that here??"

Edited July 7, 2010 by jaideeguy

[harrry]

It is probably worth noting that it is really a retirement home and not a hospice as such. It is however part of the McKean Hospital which is owned by the church.

[jdinasia]

I am going out to take a look sometime this week. It really is nice to read so many positive responses about a place here in Chiang Mai! (Thank gooddness we aren't talking about an eatery!)

The question that seems to be on some people's minds is "How will I deal with getting older and more infirm while living in Thailand, while still having my own life?" It is a question that deserves thought. I am still under retirement age but this last year+ I have had to deal with intestinal problems and it brought home the idea to me that I need to start planning for my personal long-term care in a way that I have never considered before. My parents are in their 80's and just dealing with this. Frankly, if my father (heart conditions) was not living then the place you have all mentioned would be perfect in many ways. Mom is old and has atypical Parkinson's disease. She is losing her balance and some of her mental faculties. I know she couldn't deal with the heat and humidity of Thailand but I wish that were different.

Throughout all the political growing pains that Thailand is going through I have never considered returning "home" other than to spend time with my parents. Thailand would be the perfect place for them but that won't happen

A planned retirement community with a resort setting that allows farang to still lead the lives they want and yet has nursing and medical care available is being discussed on several webboards and I think it is a good idea.

[Gonzo the Face]

To those who have interest, take a look at this link.

When it opens to MeKean, look at about half way down on the left there is a "click here" for Dok Keaw Gardens, click it and look at the bottom where it sez " accommodations " ...... Might even be better than The Pun Pun.

I can't say enough good about this place.

G

better if I put in the link

http://www.mckeanhosp.org/

Edited July 8, 2010 by Gonzo the Face

[ThaiPauly]

I know this is personal Gonzo, but was "Pain Managment" freely available.

I had an auntie who recently died in the Uk and in the hospice she was in she was allowed to self medicate, she had cancer so she did not suffer to much as she was allowed to do this.

Was this option like this available in CM ?

The reason I ask is that my parents are both in their 80's now and won't move here while both are still alive, but the remaining one may consider it when one of them passes on as they will not get much help back home and neither want to go into an old people's home then eventually the time would come for my remaining parent to pass on and I would hate to think of them suffering unreasonably.

I hope you see where I am coming from

Regards

TP

Not too sure that understand your question TP. While the couple were very good friends, there were just some things that I felt better not to ask. But if you will help me I will try and find out the answer to your question.

In a cancer patient I can only guess at the amount of pain that they are experienceing and thus the need for some physical pain releif thru medication. But also we, who presently have our health must try and understand the trememdous level of emotional pain being suffered by both the departing and surviving spouse. This emotional pain can be every bit as destructive as the physical.

Thru your post I will guess, you are meaning the physical pain being felt by the cancer victim. ....and is there an adequate amount of meds that would be given to the patient or care giver, so as the patient would be able to self administer on very short notice adequate amounts to dispell the severe pain of the moment.

If this is the case, I will try and find the answer for you when next I see my friend this week end.....

I do hope and pray that this is not a urgent inquiry as for someone close to you.

Gonzo

Sorry Gonzo I got a bit confused with who was posting what with all the quotes.

I have no urgent need of the facilities, my query was simply if personal pain management would be available to someone who was dying of cancer for example.

I know in UK Hospices it normally is, but if I needed to bring one of my parents to Thailand if they had the disease I would not want them to suffer, and if there were not qualified Doctors who could prescribe such medication as morphine or pethadine I would natuarally be very distressed to see either of them die in agony.

Regards

TP

[Gonzo the Face]

I know this is personal Gonzo, but was "Pain Managment" freely available.

I had an auntie who recently died in the Uk and in the hospice she was in she was allowed to self medicate, she had cancer so she did not suffer to much as she was allowed to do this.

Was this option like this available in CM ?

The reason I ask is that my parents are both in their 80's now and won't move here while both are still alive, but the remaining one may consider it when one of them passes on as they will not get much help back home and neither want to go into an old people's home then eventually the time would come for my remaining parent to pass on and I would hate to think of them suffering unreasonably.

I hope you see where I am coming from

Regards

TP

Not too sure that understand your question TP. While the couple were very good friends, there were just some things that I felt better not to ask. But if you will help me I will try and find out the answer to your question.

In a cancer patient I can only guess at the amount of pain that they are experienceing and thus the need for some physical pain releif thru medication. But also we, who presently have our health must try and understand the trememdous level of emotional pain being suffered by both the departing and surviving spouse. This emotional pain can be every bit as destructive as the physical.

Thru your post I will guess, you are meaning the physical pain being felt by the cancer victim. ....and is there an adequate amount of meds that would be given to the patient or care giver, so as the patient would be able to self administer on very short notice adequate amounts to dispell the severe pain of the moment.

If this is the case, I will try and find the answer for you when next I see my friend this week end.....

I do hope and pray that this is not a urgent inquiry as for someone close to you.

Gonzo

Sorry Gonzo I got a bit confused with who was posting what with all the quotes.

I have no urgent need of the facilities, my query was simply if personal pain management would be available to someone who was dying of cancer for example.

I know in UK Hospices it normally is, but if I needed to bring one of my parents to Thailand if they had the disease I would not want them to suffer, and if there were not qualified Doctors who could prescribe such medication as morphine or pethadine I would natuarally be very distressed to see either of them die in agony.

Regards

TP

Understood, and in agreement with you 100%

G