Policeman Kills 2 Over Red Light

[cmsally]

Absolutely don't agree that it was OK to gun down motorists whatever the cause.

Absolutely agree that there are enough crazy motorists out there to drive anyone to think of murder.

BUT with all these stories in the paper about various incidents happening, I find it strange as to why nobody questions the actual information we are getting - whether it is true and whether we get to hear all the relevant details . Absolutely not in a lot of cases.

I have known some cases personally and what you see in the papers is absolute fiction many times (who knows maybe all the time).

Example - 1 British girl who was hit over the head by a monk in Kanchanaburi years ago and died. Before they could find her body there was a story in the Thai newspaper stating that she had been kidnapped by a gang of hippies on Khaosan Rd. !!

We know this policeman gunned down 3 people - but did he know them etc etc. There could be a much longer story than anyone knows.

Just a different point of view on things, for godsake don't believe everything you read in the papers.

[JXXXL]

I think your a little out of line here. Most of us are just trying to understand why the parties involed did what they did. It's not fair to either party to just stamp 'em and move on. What the cop did was wrong, yes, but why did he do it? Walk in his shoes and the shoes of the motorists shot. You might find you feel for them both as well as be able to condemn them both. It's at that point to one would be fully able to judge.

WISteve is correct Guns don't kill people, people kill people.

If I wanted to kill someone I can think of more ways to get done than firearm.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Hey, you weren't on the OJ Simpson jury were you?

"Most of us are just trying to understand why the parties involed did what they did. It's not fair to either party to just stamp 'em and move on."

I see, so we should balance verbal abuse with cold blooded murder? Yes, I think we should try to understand before making judgements

"If I wanted to kill someone I can think of more ways to get done than firearm."

Engage them in a debate, that'll do it.

This kind of story reminds me of the rampant ignorance in this country. Be careful out there folks because stupidity reigns supreme in Thailand.

Edited June 30, 2005 by george

[kreon]

Some Thai folks I know commented to the effect he should be given a medal. If they’re going to shoot drug dealers, why not these totally reckless, dangerous drivers?

There would be an aful lot of dead drivers considering the large percentage of the population that drives dangerously in Thailand.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

so what they've blown off the heads of +5,000 not so guilty drug dealers, lets kill them all and then give each cop a medal for each driver murder

geez are we all going insane here

[Bilko]

This kind of story reminds me of the rampant ignorance in this country.  Be careful out there folks because stupidity reigns supreme in Thailand.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Judging by your last remark, I take it you are not stupid and ignorant enough to be in a country where ignorance and stupidity reigns supreme.

Or are you in Thailand?

[Richard Hall]

First of all the heading is surely kind of sensational in the way usually the boulevard press employs to create an outrage impression simply for the sake of increasing the sales figures. No, a policeman has NOT killed over a red light but rather a policeman killed after a hefty argument while in fact the reason for this argument was absolutely neglectable.

"Policeman kills 2 over a hefty arument" reflects the truth much much better and does not implement that Thailand is absolutely law and orderless and populated by violent morons.

Once again also oil in the flames of how unpredictable Thai mentality is and never mess with Thai people because for the slightest reason one may get killed on the spot. All Thai people carry guns, swords, machetes and practise Muay Thai enabling a 50kg pencilneck to beat the &lt;deleted&gt; out of any 100kg foreigner.

By the way, I personally consider the chances to get shot in Texas to be much higher than in Thailand. If you do not believe it just get mouthy on desert avenue with Joe Stetsonhat riding his pick up truck featuring a Winchester over the back widow. When I worked in the States about 15 years ago one of the first advices I received by the natives was to never show anyone the finger in a minor road argument since the odds are very high that you get shot.

Nowadays, there seems to be a worldwide tendencey that arguments escalate. The times appear to be over that a confrontation is settled with a clean fist fight. School kids carry weapons and use them or even seek to provoke when being armed. Society and morales are going down gradually and even former no. one disciplined Japan is facing the music nowadays.

Generally, hot temper appears to be in relation with hot climate means the spark to initiate an explosion is quicker in the sunny south than in the cool north. Things become even worse when alcohol, drugs and handy arms come into play.

Conclusion: Thailand and her nationals are not different than many other nations and their peoples but myths, sensationalism and the lust for it just gives a misleading impression.

Since no one really knows the stage his/her opponent is in the spark that can cause an explosion is unpredictable. Just imagine someone is under extreme emotional pressure may it be for big financial and/or personal problems but still able to control the feelings and may it be by just a big fake smile. All of a sudden a mouthy excrement extracting hole on legs shows up and starts shouting and throwing intimidations and insults around. How much is enough and how much can a person actually bear in this situation? No, an over the edge outburst is surely not justifiable, never, ever, but well, it is human...

Not a question whether but rather when does it happen that the fuse blows and a person goes amok transfering a cuddly rabbit into a rapacious beast. It is always just the famous little last straw that eventually breaks the camel's back. Ever asked yourself how much you can really bear? Superhumans are surely excluded from this poll but all other average Joes like myself are kindly invited.

Cheers,

Richard

Edited June 30, 2005 by Richard Hall

[mnoorsapl]

We know this policeman gunned down 3 people - but did he know them etc etc. There could be a much longer story than anyone knows.

Just a different point of view on things, for godsake don't believe everything you read in the papers.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

quite agreed with your point of view sally, Mae Ai and Fang is about 20 Km apart.

Pisit is from the Fang district Police station and the victims were doing some business in Mae-Ai, most likely they known each other. The third victim pleaded for her life, why not run away instead ?.

[TokyoT]

TokyoT

I am certainly not saying the cops actions were justified. But cut the guy a little slack there is plenty of blame to go around. These bone heads were running a red light – were school children were crossing no less. Then they choose to pick a fight with an armed policeman.

On the other hand the story indicates he shot the two in the cab three times each, and then shot the one in the back of the truck twice. Eight shots? Do the Thai standard issue’s hold eight rounds or did this guy actually reload?

3rd stupid comment.

Cut slack? He ran a red light so he's justified to shoot 3 people? Would you say that if you knew them?

He should rot in h e l l.

And yes they buy their own guns, Glocks are popular, Also Colt 45's & Beretta's hold 15, 16 shots.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

OK - my word selection certainly leaves something to be desired. I indicated that I was not attempting to justify the cops actions. Certainly no one deserves to die over running a red light, or offending a police officer, or causing someone to loose face – whether I know them or not for that matter. And that is not what I was attempting to say.

Just pointing out that it was not quite as simple as it first appears. It’s not like these guys ran the red light, and the cop immediately spun around and open fired on the truck. There was plenty of opportunity for this to end differently than it did. Both the cop and the driver allowed this to continue to escalate into a situation that had tragic consequence for all parties.

So yea – the section of my post “cut the guy a little slack” was a stupid comment. But the point of the post is still valid. Plenty of blame to go around.

[Cpt_M0ney_Sh0t]

Not justified in shooting them. HOWEVER, in the states we have manslaughter, and homicide. I think it should be manslaughter as opposed to homicide.

I mean really, I have 2 kids my self, young children. If I saw some scumbag quai heeeya, as a Thai might say, running a red light in a school crossing zone where kids where going to school I would want him dead too before he takes the life of a inncocent child. His neglagence and caloussness is astounding. To think then the police officer didn't even give them a ticket!!! and the driver and his passengers STILL had to talk crap.

No, pepole like that need to go.

Would anyone argue that?

[george]

A few inappropriate posts and subsequent quotes was edited. Please use decent language.

Thanks.

/Admin

[george]

Update:

Policeman commits suicide after shooting spree

CHIANG MAI: -- A policeman in Thailand's northern province of Chiang Mai yesterday killed himself after going on a shooting spree in which three local residents were shot dead.

Pol. Snr. Sgt. Maj. Wisit Paramee, a traffic police officer based at Fang district police station, died yesterday evening from self-inflicted gun wounds.

The previous day, he had shot dead a local couple and their employee in an attack for which the motivation is still unclear.

The police officer’s son insisted to reporters yesterday that his father had been a patient man who had won awards for police services, and suggested that he had gone on the shooting spree after being verbally abused by the three deceased.

Today traffic police officers in the region will be called to a meeting in which they will be told to exercise patience while carrying out their work.

--TNA 2005-06-30

[Richard Hall]

Quoted post removed by Admin. Reason: Inappropriate language. JXXXL warned by private message.

Nope, Thailand is for sure not what you described her as. Actually, she is a beautiful but still developing country with lots of potential but admittedly still having some problems also caused to some extend by pot smoking overly female attracted low standard foreigners not having the slightest clue about her and her population.

By the way, a cheeta gave great and most appropriate advice a few posts before. Call it a coincidence but actually when taken to heart before 4 people would not have been dead and this thread not even exist.

Conclusion: Never mess with a fast running predator particularly if he features the power of having banning claws.

Cheers,

Richard

Edited June 30, 2005 by george

[thanchart]

Thai temper rage,very dangerous,is it unique to thais or all of asia?.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Being a nation of Buddhists it seems surprising that they often react like this, although storing pent up anger and all the mai pen rais may be a precursor.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I am amazed that u guys can make such statements. Don't shooting scenes from pent up frustrations and hurts also happen outside Asia?

I will never forget the day some years ago when my American friend came over to Singapore for a business meeting and he heard on the radio about a shooting incident in his son's schoo in Denver where someone was killed. I could see the panic on his face as he frantically tried call home. Fortunately his son was safe.

[jomama]

Thai temper rage,very dangerous,is it unique to thais or all of asia?.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Being a nation of Buddhists it seems surprising that they often react like this, although storing pent up anger and all the mai pen rais may be a precursor.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I am amazed that u guys can make such statements. Don't shooting scenes from pent up frustrations and hurts also happen outside Asia?

I will never forget the day some years ago when my American friend came over to Singapore for a business meeting and he heard on the radio about a shooting incident in his son's schoo in Denver where someone was killed. I could see the panic on his face as he frantically tried call home. Fortunately his son was safe.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

You're probably talking about the Colombine massacre -- wasn't just one killed it was 17 (including the two student gunmen who commited suicide). I was born in Denver (the Colombine area is an affluent suburb). The city is still struggling to make sense of it, and of course, they probably never will.

[mcfester]

I am certainly not saying the cops actions were justified.  But cut the guy a little slack there is plenty of blame to go around.  These bone heads were running a red light – were school children were crossing no less.  Then they choose to pick a fight with an armed policeman. 

On the other hand the story indicates he shot the two in the cab three times each, and then shot the one in the back of the truck twice.  Eight shots?  Do the Thai standard issue’s hold eight rounds or did this guy actually reload?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

What do you mean cut him some slack? This is outrageous, after all they were in a rush to sell goods at a weekend market in Mae Ai district

[Jimmy in Bangkok]

First of all the heading is surely kind of sensational in the way usually the boulevard press  employs to create an outrage impression simply for the sake of increasing the sales figures. No, a policeman has NOT killed over a red light but rather a policeman killed after a hefty argument while in fact the reason for this argument was absolutely neglectable.

"Policeman kills 2 over a hefty arument" reflects the truth much much better and does not implement that Thailand is absolutely law and orderless and populated by violent morons. 

Once again also oil in the flames of how unpredictable Thai mentality is and never mess with Thai people because for the slightest reason one may get killed on the spot. All Thai people carry guns, swords, machetes and practise Muay Thai enabling a 50kg pencilneck to beat the &lt;deleted&gt; out of any 100kg foreigner.

By the way, I personally consider the chances to get shot in Texas to be much higher than in Thailand. If you do not believe it just get mouthy on desert avenue with Joe Stetsonhat riding his pick up truck featuring a Winchester over the back widow. When I worked in the States about 15 years ago one of the first advices I received by the natives was to never show anyone the finger in a minor road argument since the odds are very high that you get shot.

Nowadays, there seems to be a worldwide tendencey that arguments escalate. The times appear to be over that a confrontation is settled with a clean fist fight. School kids carry weapons and use them or even seek to provoke when being armed. Society and morales are going down gradually and even former no. one disciplined Japan is facing the music nowadays.

Generally, hot temper appears to be in relation with hot climate means the spark to initiate an explosion is quicker in the sunny south than in the cool north. Things become even worse when alcohol, drugs and handy arms come into play.

Conclusion: Thailand and her nationals are not different than many other nations and their peoples but myths, sensationalism and the lust for it just gives a misleading impression. 

Since no one really knows the stage his/her opponent is in the spark that can cause an explosion is unpredictable. Just imagine someone is under extreme emotional pressure may it be for big financial and/or personal problems but still able to control the feelings and may it be by just a big fake smile. All of a sudden a mouthy excrement extracting hole on legs shows up and starts shouting and throwing intimidations and insults around. How much is enough and how much can a person actually bear in this situation? No, an over the edge outburst is surely not justifiable, never, ever, but well, it is human...

Not a question whether but rather when does it happen that the fuse blows and a person goes amok transfering a cuddly rabbit into a rapacious beast. It is always just the famous little last straw that eventually breaks the camel's back. Ever asked yourself how much you can really bear? Superhumans are surely excluded from this poll but all other average Joes like myself are kindly invited. 

Cheers,

Richard 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Richard, well said indeed this coming from another average Joe. I cannot speak for the U.S. but I can certainly speak for Aus where we have unexplained gratuitous violence occuring on a quite regular basis.

It is a sad day I suppose when something of this nature fails to surprise me to any great degree as it is so common place these days in other countries we tend to become numb when confronted with something of this nature.

It is a happy day though when I see so many people vehemently arguing this post as maybe not all of us are so numb to these types of horrors and possibly shows maybe L.O.S. is not as far down the road to destruction as some other countries.

NO this type of reaction can never be justified and I certainly don't know the answer to stopping it either. Quite a few countries and better minds than mine have tried various methods to curb this sort of ridiculus overreaction and I cannot think of any that have had total success.

Sadly it is an area where I'm woefully lacking in skills but certainly not in compassion for ALL those involved. May you all rest in peace.

[The_Moog]

If every Policeman went into 'Falling Down' mode every time someone swore at them, football stadiums would be full of corpses.

If western tourists had been the victims, we'd be calling for his blood. As it is, its, 'well poor old boy was provoked by these Thai joyriders'

[jackr]

Thai temper rage,very dangerous,is it unique to thais or all of asia?.

Being a nation of Buddhists it seems surprising that they often react like this, although storing pent up anger and all the mai pen rais may be a precursor.

I am amazed that u guys can make such statements. Don't shooting scenes from pent up frustrations and hurts also happen outside Asia?

There's always one!

Have a look at your browser, it's a Thai forum.

[justaskdan]

Someone posted "What would have happened if he shot a Farang?" a couple pages back.

Ya, I would like to meet the Farang that would slag off a Thai police officer under the same circumstances.

Once I blew through a red light on the way to work. The poor cop was chasing me for 15 minutes and I didn't even realize it because my mirror was broken. 900cc bike; if I knew he wanted to talk to me I would have been gone but when I finally stopped at a light he came up beside me and was pissed. He spoke no English and I took the ticket and apologized in broken Thai.

The point of the story. I didn't know I was in danger of being shot but I did know that he was right and I was wrong and it is most advantageous to be curtious to police officers.

Edited June 30, 2005 by justaskdan

[ChiangMaiMike]

Perhaps all aren't familiar with the violence in America.

A couple of terms that were coined in America are "Road Rage" and "Going Postal"...

The first started I think in California with irrate motorists pulling out guns and taking shots at &lt;deleted&gt; who cut them off at exits, etc. I believe it actually had an impact and people became much more considerate in their driving habits.

The later stems from the number of Postal workers who have flipped out and taken guns to work and presumably 'gotten even' with those who had fired/offended them.

From school shootings to random sniper attacks, Americans must hold the record for number of people killed by nut cases. (Hitler, Stalin, etc not included)...

I think the easy access to firearms contributes to this, but it's a complicated subject... I think most Americans are aware that if you have a gun in your house it is most likely to be used on a family member or friend rather than an intruder, yet I think most homeowners have guns.

It is more likely the rarity of the event here that makes it such a 'big deal'.

[Cpt_M0ney_Sh0t]

No Chang Mai Mike, we don't all look at it that way in the States. And carring/owning a gun isn't all about self defnce from a intruder it's to prevent our govt turning out like the one we vailently fought to free ourselves from. One in where a thug could break into your mother's house and attempt to rape her and she go to jail if she had a gun and shot him.

And if the 3 had been westreners my responce would have been the same. They should have had some respect for athurity, expsecialy scince the guy let em go with a warning! that would have never happened where I'm from in Philadelphia.

[Scott]

This is a very sad story, all the way around and a great deal of grief for the families involved.

I am not all that fond of the police, but I sure do not envy traffic police in Thailand. It is a very, very difficult and thankless job.

My overall experience with the police have not been that negative--considering that I have usually done something wrong. I always treat them courteously and follow their instructions. After all, they do have a gun (and some level of authority) and I don't.

[mrmillersr]

As a former police officer, some of the replies I have read are just plain absurd. Everyday throughout the world, police come in contact with verbally abusive individuals that shout, swear and show little respect for the person wearing the badge and gun. Unfortunate, but this is the world we live in.

A police officers first duty is to PROTECT the public, not act as judge, jury and executioner over an incident that could have been sensibly handled. If the verbal attack the Thai officer received broke any of the laws of this country, the party should have been put under arrest. Plain and simple.

To summarily execute 3 unarmed individuals, including the poor hapless employee who pleaded for her life, erases any possible justification for the one wearing the badge and gun in this case. The officer likely needed psychiatric help as do some of the repliers to this post.

[ChiangMaiMike]

Getting 'facts' here is very difficult. Perhaps because of that rumors abound.

I've wagged my finger at &lt;deleted&gt; who think it's ok to turn left in front of me when the light turns green and been told by Thai passengers not to do that. They told me "person follow you home and shoot you."

Doubt anyone will find a lesson to learn about the Fang incident.

"Policeman goes Postal when pushed over edge by Idiot".

I'm sure there's lots more to this tragic story than we will ever know.

[jomama]

If the verbal attack the Thai officer received broke any of the laws of this country, the party should have been put under arrest.  Plain and simple. 

To summarily execute 3 unarmed individuals, including the poor hapless employee who pleaded for her life, erases any possible justification for the one wearing the badge and gun in this case.  The officer likely needed psychiatric help as do some of the repliers to this post.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I do agree with you, but when you were a policeman did you:

Have to use your own motorcycle for work, or did you have a proper police car?

Have a radio to call for immediate backup if you needed it?

Buy you own gun and bullets?

Have superiors who were on the t*ke?

I just can understand how a guy can snap when asked to do the impossible -- uphold the law with people who are used to breaking it and little support when you need it quickly.

And those who say policemen come under verbal abuse all the time -- that is certainly not the case in Thailand. Thais with any common sense (or lacking that, fear and a sense of self-preservation) smile alot, do what the policeman says and get away as soon as they are fee to go.

[DaveYo]

Amazing, over 5,000 visitors have viewed this subject. Wonder why copper stories is so interesting.

Does anyone have clues?????????????

Daveyo

[thaibebop]

I think your a little out of line here. Most of us are just trying to understand why the parties involed did what they did. It's not fair to either party to just stamp 'em and move on. What the cop did was wrong, yes, but why did he do it? Walk in his shoes and the shoes of the motorists shot. You might find you feel for them both as well as be able to condemn them both. It's at that point to one would be fully able to judge.

WISteve is correct Guns don't kill people, people kill people.

If I wanted to kill someone I can think of more ways to get done than firearm.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Hey, you weren't on the OJ Simpson jury were you?

"Most of us are just trying to understand why the parties involed did what they did. It's not fair to either party to just stamp 'em and move on."

I see, so we should balance verbal abuse with cold blooded murder? Yes, I think we should try to understand before making judgements

"If I wanted to kill someone I can think of more ways to get done than firearm."

Engage them in a debate, that'll do it.

This kind of story reminds me of the rampant ignorance in this country. Be careful out there folks because stupidity reigns supreme in Thailand.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I never said that what the police man did was right, I said we needed to understand why he did it, you can read, yes? I can only assume since you posted!

I am an American and believe to trail by jury, fair and balanced. The O.J. verdict has nothing to do with this. A verdict, by the way, I disagree with. So, it seems you don't really argee with understanding before judging since you didn't understand me and judged anyway.

To all those who defend Thailand against those who compare the country to the west thank you. In the U.S. much of what we do turns areas into war zones. Cops and crooks kill each other everyday, gangs as well. Some one losing their temper and killing over it isn't new to the U.S. However, this story is not as chilling as say the story of a black man dragged behind a pick up truck in Texas or 3 white teens raped and kill bcause the wondered too close in the ghetto in St. Paul, or riots in L.A. over the beating of a black man by police officers. What about the Jews and blacks who fought in Battery Park over ten years a go.

Violence is world wide don't be surprised when in visits you or your loved ones.

[sunshine146]

Another depressed Government worker.

[thaibebop]

Another depressed Government worker.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

No, I am a student working towards an english master, with a wife and daughter. I never liked the idea of working for any governments.

[jrincon17]

Being a nation of Buddhists it seems surprising that they often react like this, although storing pent up anger and all the mai pen rais may be a precursor.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Youre shocked by this ?????? Give me a break Yeah being so religious i cant believe there are so many bar girls either , duh . I have never seen so many people hold religon so high and yet do so many sinful things not that im an angel but i dont sit there and praise my religon either. thats what i dont get about thai's

[jrincon17]

Thai temper rage,very dangerous,is it unique to thais or all of asia?.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Of course, people outside of Thailand or Asia don't have temper rage

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Speaking of what i have experienced , I believe that Filapinos are more even tempered and i believe more friendly . thats just me