Uk Tourist - Other Options

[60minuteman]

Hi.... again!..... my thai gf has just returned to bangkok after a 3 month stay in the uk on a 6 month tourist visa...

and it was great to actually spend some time together living a real life, as opposed to being on holiday in LOS....

going forward we would love to spend much more time together but dont want to continue constantly applying for 6 month visa's.

Also we both feel like it is perhaps a bit rash to rush into a wedding just because it will make life a little easier with regards her being able to come to the uk.

What are our option so she can spend more time in the uk but without us actually getting married, can we get settlement as gf and bf? or do we need to get engaged?

or, thirdly, are there any other types of uk visa that will allow her to travel to and from the uk over longer periods....

We have had a relationship for 12 months, i have visited her in thailand 3 times, staying for a total of 3 months, she has her own business in thailand, a share in a house and a child of 10....She has travelled to the uk for 3 months and 3 times to chile, on each occassion complying with her visa's.

thanks....

[7by7]

You are very sensible in agreeing not to marry just to get a visa!

She cannot apply for settlement as your unmarried partner, as to do so you must have been living together in a relationship akin to marriage for at least the last two years.

She could apply for settlement as your fiance, but this is only valid for 6 months and during that time she must marry you and apply to remain in the UK for a further 2 years, or leave when the 6 months are up.

From what you have said, I don't think settlement is what you are after at this stage, anyway.

So, the answer is another visitor's visa; but this time for longer than 6 months. Visit visas can be 6 months, 2 years, 5 years or 10 years long. You must remember, though, that no matter the term of the visa she cannot spend more than 6 months in the UK on anyone visit, nor (usually) more than 6 months out of any 12 in the UK.

From VAT1.4 Visa validity - What period for a multiple entry visit visa?

There is no requirement for a person to have held a short term visit visa before being issued with a visit visa which has a longer validity. For example, an applicant does not need to have been issued with a standard six months visit visa before being issued with a five year visit visa. Unless there are grounds for not issuing a long term visit visa, the ECO should issue the visa applied for.

Applications for long term visit visas will be considered in the light of :

• Credible ongoing reason to visit. A successful applicant must demonstrate a frequent and sustained need to come to the UK, such as family links or an established business connection.
• Stability of personal circumstances. As far as possible applicants 'status should be unlikely to change significantly during the validity of the visa. The better able the applicant is to demonstrate stability over the long term the more it will support an application for a longer period of validity.
• Successful applicants will also need to demonstrate that they are able to support themselves in the UK without recourse to public funds, and demonstrate that they would intend to leave the UK at the end of each visit.
• Previous travel history as evidenced in a current valid passport, which might include travel to Australia, Canada, Ireland, New Zealand, Schengen countries, Switzerland, or the USA in the same category as the application to the UK, for example, as a visitor. Holding a valid visa for any of the aforementioned countries, evidence they complied with conditions of entry, that applications for these countries were not refused nor were they removed from a country on their last trip, would all help to support the application.

Care should be taken when considering long term visa applications from child visitors. They should only be granted a visa which is valid to six months past their 18th birthday. For instance, a 14 year old applying for a five or ten year long term visit visa, the visa expiry date should be limited to the date that is six months after the applicant's 18th birthday.

In all instances, if an ECO decides that a shorter validity of visit visa is more appropriate than the one applied for, the ECM should approve it and notes should be added to Proviso. In such cases, no refund (full or partial) is available. The ECO should ensure that clear explanatory information for the decision is provided in a covering letter when the passport is returned.

[60minuteman]

You are very sensible in agreeing not to marry just to get a visa!

She cannot apply for settlement as your unmarried partner, as to do so you must have been living together in a relationship akin to marriage for at least the last two years.

She could apply for settlement as your fiance, but this is only valid for 6 months and during that time she must marry you and apply to remain in the UK for a further 2 years, or leave when the 6 months are up.

From what you have said, I don't think settlement is what you are after at this stage, anyway.

So, the answer is another visitor's visa; but this time for longer than 6 months. Visit visas can be 6 months, 2 years, 5 years or 10 years long. You must remember, though, that no matter the term of the visa she cannot spend more than 6 months in the UK on anyone visit, nor (usually) more than 6 months out of any 12 in the UK.

From VAT1.4 Visa validity - What period for a multiple entry visit visa?

There is no requirement for a person to have held a short term visit visa before being issued with a visit visa which has a longer validity. For example, an applicant does not need to have been issued with a standard six months visit visa before being issued with a five year visit visa. Unless there are grounds for not issuing a long term visit visa, the ECO should issue the visa applied for.

Applications for long term visit visas will be considered in the light of :

• Credible ongoing reason to visit. A successful applicant must demonstrate a frequent and sustained need to come to the UK, such as family links or an established business connection.
• Stability of personal circumstances. As far as possible applicants 'status should be unlikely to change significantly during the validity of the visa. The better able the applicant is to demonstrate stability over the long term the more it will support an application for a longer period of validity.
• Successful applicants will also need to demonstrate that they are able to support themselves in the UK without recourse to public funds, and demonstrate that they would intend to leave the UK at the end of each visit.
• Previous travel history as evidenced in a current valid passport, which might include travel to Australia, Canada, Ireland, New Zealand, Schengen countries, Switzerland, or the USA in the same category as the application to the UK, for example, as a visitor. Holding a valid visa for any of the aforementioned countries, evidence they complied with conditions of entry, that applications for these countries were not refused nor were they removed from a country on their last trip, would all help to support the application.

Care should be taken when considering long term visa applications from child visitors. They should only be granted a visa which is valid to six months past their 18th birthday. For instance, a 14 year old applying for a five or ten year long term visit visa, the visa expiry date should be limited to the date that is six months after the applicant's 18th birthday.

In all instances, if an ECO decides that a shorter validity of visit visa is more appropriate than the one applied for, the ECM should approve it and notes should be added to Proviso. In such cases, no refund (full or partial) is available. The ECO should ensure that clear explanatory information for the decision is provided in a covering letter when the passport is returned.

thanks 7, so am i right in presuming we can apply for a 2 year visa, and if the ECO thinks it is too long, they may grant the visa for 6 mths.

This appears to be the best course for us to persue, we can apply for say 2 years and we can be together in the uk and thailand until we decide to take our relationship to the next stage, with of course the advantage of not having to constantly go through the strain of applying for visa's every 6 months.

And in you opinion, are they likely to accept a reason for a longer visa being that we wish to marry, but for now would like to spend as much time together to allow our relationship to grow stronger over a longer period of time??? ...i.e to really know each other well before we get married, as oppose to feeling pressurised into marriage as the only way of being together...

we are both in our very late 30's, both have children from previous marriages, both have our own business', and as such are trying to approach this relationship in a mature an open minded way...

[7by7]

so am i right in presuming we can apply for a 2 year visa, and if the ECO thinks it is too long, they may grant the visa for 6 mths.

Yes, but they wont refund the difference in the fees.

And in you opinion, are they likely to accept a reason for a longer visa being that we wish to marry, but for now would like to spend as much time together to allow our relationship to grow stronger over a longer period of time??? ...i.e to really know each other well before we get married, as oppose to feeling pressurised into marriage as the only way of being together...

I don't see why not; although I would advise against saying that you wish to marry, simply concentrate on the relationship building and seeing where it's going.

They have obviously accepted that the relationship is genuine, or they wouldn't have issued the first visa. To doubt that relationship on a second application, without good reason, would be perverse.

I would, though, emphasise that you have family and a business in the UK and she has the same in Thailand, hence the unsuitability of one of you settling in the other's homeland until you are both absolutely sure it is the right thing to do.

I would also mention that you are both aware of the restrictions on her time in the UK as a visitor and that a 2 year visit visa (or whichever you decide upon) doesn't mean she can stay in the UK for 2 years.

[ThaiVisaExpress]

As already clarified by another poster that is only guidance we have had a client spend 6 months in the UK and return to Thailand for 90 days and has been issued with a second tourist visa.

[7by7]

^^^^^

To ensure the OP, and everyone else, understands, TVE, I'd just like to clarify that it's the 'maximum of 6 months in any 12' that's a convention and so flexible.

The maximum of 6 months in any one visit is, of course, a rule and if broken means the person would be an overstayer. Although I believe there are exceptions to this, none of them would apply to a social visitor.

[steveweaver99]

Interesting thread!

So effectively the advantage of having the 2 year Visitor Visa would be that you would not need to re-apply for Visitor Visa's for a period of 2 years, however you could not stay longer than 6 months in the UK at anyone time. You would have to leave the UK before 6 months from the date of the start of the visa and return after a specified period of say 90 days?? And then stay another 6 months in the UK from the date of arrival??

Im also looking into the option of an Unmarried Visa. My partner and will have been together for 2 years in Jan 2011, we have essentially been living together in the UK and Thailand (as I have spent increasing amounts of time in Thailand) and only spent at most 2 months apart.

"You have both been living together as if you were married or in a civil partnership for at least two years"

Not sure how difficult this is to prove?

Thanks

[7by7]

Unless the visa is endorsed differently, the maximum time the holder can spend in the UK on any one visit is 6 months. If a standard 6 month visa this period starts on the date the visa is issued, unless the applicant requested the visa be post dated when making the application. If a longer term visa then the maximum 6 months for each visit starts on the date of entry to the UK. If one holds a long term visit visa, up to 10 years, then there is no official restriction on the number of times one can visit the UK nor is there a minimum time between visits. The "6 months out of any 12" is, as said, a convention.

However, if an Immigration Officer at a port of entry has reason to suspect that the person seeking entry is not a genuine visitor, e.g. using a long term visit visa to bypass the settlement rules, then that person may be questioned and if they cannot satisfy the IO and their manager that they are in fact a genuine visitor they may be refused entry; though they could appeal against the refusal.

If you have been living together in a relationship akin to marriage for at least the last 2 years, then your partner would qualify as an unmarried partner. There is nothing in the rules to say that this period must have been spent exclusively outside the UK, so if you have been living together partly in the UK and partly in Thailand that should be fine.

You will need to provide evidence of this, such as the appropriate visas and entry clearances in both your passports, evidence of where you both lived when in Thailand and the same when living in the UK.

[Mercury]

The only thing I could add would be to question just how she will be able to run her business, which is a good reason for her to return to Thailand, if she spends up to half the year in the UK ?

The issue of who would care for the child, if used as a reason why she must return, would presumably also need to be covered.

[steveweaver99]

If you have been living together in a relationship akin to marriage for at least the last 2 years, then your partner would qualify as an unmarried partner. There is nothing in the rules to say that this period must have been spent exclusively outside the UK, so if you have been living together partly in the UK and partly in Thailand that should be fine.

You will need to provide evidence of this, such as the appropriate visas and entry clearances in both your passports, evidence of where you both lived when in Thailand and the same when living in the UK.

Thanks for that 7.

May have an issue with evidence of a 2 year relationship??

The Entry Clearance Officer will need to see evidence of a two-year relationship. This may include:

• documents showing joint commitments, such as bank accounts, investments, rent agreements or mortgages, and
• letters linking you to the same address, and official records (such as a gas or electricity bill or proof of your rent or mortgage arrangements) of your address.

The time my partner has stayed with me in the UK, I presume will need no further evidence, the visa itself is sufficient? As she is a visitor there will be no joint tenancy agreements or accounts etc.

When she leaves the UK we would have been together 20 months of which we have spent 13 months together which would equate to 24 months Feb 01 2011. So it be a case of what evidence in the ECO's would find acceptable, other than stated above. The only evidence I have for this period is the proof of relationship used in the application for the visitor visa and obviously the stay in the UK.

Any experiences of this anyone or suggestions?