Tired Of Thailand

[4evermaat]

The problem is not the perception.. It is not my attitude to life.. I live a rich and varied life that I enjoy enormously..

The problem is I can no longer keep sweeping the garbage under the rug, I can no longer keep looking away from the crimes committed against me, I can not longer keep smiling while being shafted. If people would stop crapping on me and people I know, there would be no need to leave.

In the last 3 months one person I know was shot, another was held up at gunpoint in his own home, a 3rd had his house broken into and a 4th had his dog poisoned.. Thats in 3 months !!! And I am supposed to balance that with 'positive vibes and energy' !!

Well, whether you choose to stay or leave, I wish you the best and hope you do your best.

I guess I should summarize a negative experience I had with a guesthouse in Patong Beach in the Royal Paradise Complex called Family 2003 guesthouse. I actually moved in when the place was empty and got air condition, balcony, cleaning everyday for 7000 bht/mo. including electicity and water. Many locals said I got an excellent deal. Anyway, on the second month, the manager started acting funny. Started complaining that she was having to clean too often (about every other day or so). Long story short, she wanted 9500 bhat for the next month. But her attitude was that she really didn't want me there anymore. I later found out that some of the other Thai tennants found out that I was paying 7000 for the same size room they were paying 9500 for and they were asking questions (jealousy). My friend said it was common for some thais to get jealous. Plus now that the guesthouse was full(er), the owner perhaps was less willing to be flexible and was more concerned about the bottom line.

So I told my GF that I had no problems leaving if that's what the owner wants, but I would have to get back my deposit + the unused rent. I stayed 1/2 the month, so it was about 3500 bhat + 2000 bhat deposit. Well on move out day, the manager barely wanted to give me back my deposit! Long story short, I got deposit but not pro-rated rent. So I "lost" 3500 bhat. But I didn't take is personally, and did my best to secure a new room (actually I already secured the new room as I anticipated a situation with the money aspect of the deal).

I didn't think it was such a big deal, but no worries. I simply tone it down. And by not taking it personally, I let go and was able to find another place for 5500 bhat. electric was 5bht/unit and water is about 1 bht/unit. And I'm with more honest people now anyway.

3rd month ?? Thats a vacation !!

I was told by my friend who invited me here to get the one year visa, and avoid having to do costly visa extensions. Just once every 90 days, run to a border and back about 1500 bhat. It was very wise advise. I can visit neigboring countries also if i choose and re-enter with no problems.

I think you got to be able to ignore a lot if you want to live here happily long term. Surely not every person can do that. So it's up to each of us to decide if we are ready to live here full time, year in year out, taking all the visa rules, 1000 copy of every page rules and all with it.

Also very important, choosing your partner !!! I married a normal girl, from middle class family, no rich CHinese as some others .

I remember my dad's words : Would I marry a prostitute back home? No, So why fly ....... miles to do it here.

Oh, and to the ones that live here coz they can live off 100 or 200 baht a day. Go home get a job you stingy bunch. :jap:

Ignoring or not taking what is done to you personally is essentially the same idea. Dont let what someone else does to you distract you from your objectives.

The prostitutes here are better fit my needs. The Mastery of Love is the most difficult mastery because we have so much "knowledge" on how people should be, relationships should be, etc we rarely ever accept people just as they are [without trying to change them].

I dont see why you want to spend more money than you have to. I guess if you want to spend 100 bhat or 1000 bhat a day, the choice is yours.

[likewise]

After 10+ years here I'll spend some time on my Sunday morning to reply.

I've lived in about 6 provinces over the years mainly in the South. Phuket being one of them a couple of years ago. Personally I didn't like the place one bit. It's ok for a holiday and fun but not for long term living. Settled down now about 200km from Phuket, less violence/crime, less annoying tourists and Thai vendors......

So IMO, Phuket for a part holiday = yes. Phuket to live full time = definitely NO. Of course to each his own.

I guess that most long term expats go through a stage that they had enough of Thailand.

Then it's time to think if this is just a stage that you are going through or that you really start to hate the country, its people and culture. If the latter, yes time to move on.

Personally as any human being I got good days and bad days, if on the bad days something "thai" happens to worsen that feeling of being anti Thai I tend to stick to myself, indulge in one of my hobbies which I can do solo and after a few hours of "solo-ing" I'm ok again.

I have noticed though that many expats seem to lack hobbies. Everyone, anywhere needs something to do, if not you become a grumpy old git. Boozing and whoring is only fun for so long, becomes tedious too after awhile.

Regarding the Thais, I have quite a few friends amongst them and indeed I have to agree with some other posters they can behave a bit childish/selfish/ignorant even the educated ones.

Little example, lets say they own a house and are noisy. This is not to bother others but they got the idea : I am in my house, on my land I do can do what I like and are oblivious to the fact that they are indeed being a pain in the a.. to the other neighbours.

It's one of their characteristics, selfishness. Forget about all the "kreng jai" stuff they are always on about, this is as the smile just a fake trait.

I think you got to be able to ignore a lot if you want to live here happily long term. Surely not every person can do that. So it's up to each of us to decide if we are ready to live here full time, year in year out, taking all the visa rules, 1000 copy of every page rules and all with it.

Also very important, choosing your partner !!! I married a normal girl, from middle class family, no rich CHinese as some others .

I remember my dad's words : Would I marry a prostitute back home? No, So why fly ....... miles to do it here.

Well I can keep on going but getting a bit lazy, hmm must have been here too long .

Anyway, fair play to the OP and I see no need to scold him or whatever for him being honest.

Oh, and to the ones that live here coz they can live off 100 or 200 baht a day. Go home get a job you stingy bunch. :jap:

Mate, an honest post.

Thanks, :jap:

[likewise]

You have to learn to let it go, you let every little things of every day getting to you and the pressure is building in you, you get frustrated because you can't change those little things who are getting to you, you have no control on them. Face it you can't change the way the Thai are driving anytime soon, the only solutions are to move out of Thailand or to learn to let it go. By the time you get up in the morning until you go to bed at night you let the pressure go up all day long and you are like a pressure cooker ready to explode, you are projecting that image of you to other people you interact with and nobody want to be the detonator of that pressure cooker particularly the Thai people who don't know how to handle that kind of rage. Right now you are harming yourself both mentally and physically by letting those little things getting to you, you have to learn to let it go, don't let this stress getting to you and learn to become more Zen in your life.

Indeed, as I wrote in my post I got days that the "thainess" bothers me but as above poster said you gotta let things like that go since we can change/control them.

I know many might say : Easy to write this but can you actually do it? Well somedays yes somedays no, on the no days which are rare I tend to stick to myself and find mu own little spot to reflect on things.

After that I'm ready again to handle "Thainess"

[Jimi007]

You have to learn to let it go, you let every little things of every day getting to you and the pressure is building in you, you get frustrated because you can't change those little things who are getting to you, you have no control on them. Face it you can't change the way the Thai are driving anytime soon, the only solutions are to move out of Thailand or to learn to let it go. By the time you get up in the morning until you go to bed at night you let the pressure go up all day long and you are like a pressure cooker ready to explode, you are projecting that image of you to other people you interact with and nobody want to be the detonator of that pressure cooker particularly the Thai people who don't know how to handle that kind of rage. Right now you are harming yourself both mentally and physically by letting those little things getting to you, you have to learn to let it go, don't let this stress getting to you and learn to become more Zen in your life.

Indeed, as I wrote in my post I got days that the "thainess" bothers me but as above poster said you gotta let things like that go since we can change/control them.

I know many might say : Easy to write this but can you actually do it? Well somedays yes somedays no, on the no days which are rare I tend to stick to myself and find mu own little spot to reflect on things.

After that I'm ready again to handle "Thainess"

I totally agree with the point you make here. I do at times get annoyed, but rarely now as I have accepted the way things are and getting angry makes you look rather foolish. If you just sit back and relax, and become more "Thai" then you gain respect, instead of looking like a stupid farang throwing a tantrum. It took me a few years to attain this attitude though!

[likewise]

Indeed, it takes time and not everyone succeeds in it.

Gotta work on it everyday .

[4evermaat]

You have to learn to let it go, you let every little things of every day getting to you and the pressure is building in you, you get frustrated because you can't change those little things who are getting to you, you have no control on them. Face it you can't change the way the Thai are driving anytime soon, the only solutions are to move out of Thailand or to learn to let it go. By the time you get up in the morning until you go to bed at night you let the pressure go up all day long and you are like a pressure cooker ready to explode, you are projecting that image of you to other people you interact with and nobody want to be the detonator of that pressure cooker particularly the Thai people who don't know how to handle that kind of rage. Right now you are harming yourself both mentally and physically by letting those little things getting to you, you have to learn to let it go, don't let this stress getting to you and learn to become more Zen in your life.

Holding on to the past makes it very difficult to enjoy what is happening now. Isn't it amazing that whenever you do finally move on, you realize that lthe circumstances you were in previoussly work themself out anyway?

Indeed, as I wrote in my post I got days that the "thainess" bothers me but as above poster said you gotta let things like that go since we can change/control them.

I know many might say : Easy to write this but can you actually do it? Well somedays yes somedays no, on the no days which are rare I tend to stick to myself and find mu own little spot to reflect on things.

After that I'm ready again to handle "Thainess"

The 4 agreements were designed to assist in this process of staying in the present moment. Most people focus on trying to change all of the Secondary characters in their life story. But those secondary characters are causing secondary problems. To solve the main problems, you must transform the MAIN character of the story, which of course is you.. Then you will see changes in your life.

I totally agree with the point you make here. I do at times get annoyed, but rarely now as I have accepted the way things are and getting angry makes you look rather foolish. If you just sit back and relax, and become more "Thai" then you gain respect, instead of looking like a stupid farang throwing a tantrum. It took me a few years to attain this attitude though!

Indeed, it takes time and not everyone succeeds in it.

Gotta work on it everyday .

Just as we learned to write or speak, Repetition and Practice makes the master. There's no kitchen recipe on the art of living. It takes a strong will to adopt even 1 of those 4 agreements. but each time you follow them, you gain more awareness and power. Before you know it, no one will be able to send you any emotional poison. And you will even find it funny how others who were trying to send you all that poison were taking it personally. Sometimes you have to refrain from laughing.

Edited August 23, 2010 by 4evermaat

[NamKangMan]

You have to learn to let it go, you let every little things of every day getting to you and the pressure is building in you, you get frustrated because you can't change those little things who are getting to you, you have no control on them. Face it you can't change the way the Thai are driving anytime soon, the only solutions are to move out of Thailand or to learn to let it go. By the time you get up in the morning until you go to bed at night you let the pressure go up all day long and you are like a pressure cooker ready to explode, you are projecting that image of you to other people you interact with and nobody want to be the detonator of that pressure cooker particularly the Thai people who don't know how to handle that kind of rage. Right now you are harming yourself both mentally and physically by letting those little things getting to you, you have to learn to let it go, don't let this stress getting to you and learn to become more Zen in your life.

Indeed, as I wrote in my post I got days that the "thainess" bothers me but as above poster said you gotta let things like that go since we can change/control them.

I know many might say : Easy to write this but can you actually do it? Well somedays yes somedays no, on the no days which are rare I tend to stick to myself and find mu own little spot to reflect on things.

After that I'm ready again to handle "Thainess"

I totally agree with the point you make here. I do at times get annoyed, but rarely now as I have accepted the way things are and getting angry makes you look rather foolish. If you just sit back and relax, and become more "Thai" then you gain respect, instead of looking like a stupid farang throwing a tantrum. It took me a few years to attain this attitude though!

Ummmm, so, as they continue to "shaft" you everyday, you have just learned to accept it with a smile???? Sounds a bit like "learned self helplessness syndrome." (google it) Basically, get treated like shit for so long and, eventually, you get used tothe shit and it doesn't bother you anymore.

I never throw tantrums, but, does it give me the shits when I am ripped-off or taken advantage of, only because I am a farang - yes it does. It's minimal these days because I only support the ethical businesses around town.

I accept that I am a foreigner in Thailand, and always will be, even if I lived here for 40 years. I'm not sure if Thailand is an incredibly racist country, or it's just a greedy money grab, or both, BUT, don't ever think you are accepted here, as a Thai, because you are not and never will be. It's not just "the round eyes" they exploit, look at the poor Burmese labours. They use and abuse their SE Asia neighbours without a problem.

Look at the hard time the 50% Thai - 50% Farang kids get as they grow up, and they are actually half Thai - you are FULL farang.

They are only interested in you "paying too much" like a good farang and "copping it sweet."

Edited August 23, 2010 by NamKangMan

[Jimi007]

Ummmm, so, as they continue to "shaft" you everyday, you have just learned to accept it with a smile???? Sounds a bit like "learned self helplessness syndrome." (google it) Basically, get treated like shit for so long and, eventually, you get used tothe shit and it doesn't bother you anymore.

I never throw tantrums, but, does it give me the shits when I am ripped-off or taken advantage of, only because I am a farang - yes it does. It's minimal these days because I only support the ethical businesses around town.

I accept that I am a foreigner in Thailand, and always will be, even if I lived here for 40 years. I'm not sure if Thailand is an incredibly racist country, or it's just a greedy money grab, or both, BUT, don't ever think you are accepted here, as a Thai, because you are not and never will be. It's not just "the round eyes" they exploit, look at the poor Burmese labours. They use and abuse their SE Asia neighbours without a problem.

Look at the hard time the 50% Thai - 50% Farang kids get as they grow up, and they are actually half Thai - you are FULL farang.

They are only interested in you "paying too much" like a good farang and "copping it sweet."

No one shaft's me. If I don't like what ever it is, I don't need it that badly. Most everywhere I go there is a set price for everyone. It sounds as though you have been "shafted" and accept it. If there's a problem I walk away and find what I need somewhere else. I would not even try to run a business here, I may as well shoot myself! The last time someone tried to "shaft" me was in the Government office in Sa Kaew. One man saw a farang, and wanted 10,000 Baht for a paper saying my GF had never been married. My GF is a military university graduate. She knows people. We had the paper sent the next day for 100 baht post by EMS. I went to my local bar tonight for a drink, they charge 120 Baht for a gin and tonic. But my price is 100. I bought a round for the bar on my birthday last week it was 500 Baht, for over 10 drinks and I got another free drink for myself. I am treated well here, even at the Immigration office. I never said I was Thai and never will be, but I am liked by my Thai friends and family. It's up to me to know and not get mistreated. My neighbor is a "junkman. " He says that I am Thai, I'm too cheap to be a farang!

[NamKangMan]

No one shaft's me. If I don't like what ever it is, I don't need it that badly. Most everywhere I go there is a set price for everyone. It sounds as though you have been "shafted" and accept it. If there's a problem I walk away and find what I need somewhere else. I would not even try to run a business here, I may as well shoot myself! The last time someone tried to "shaft" me was in the Government office in Sa Kaew. One man saw a farang, and wanted 10,000 Baht for a paper saying my GF had never been married. My GF is a military university graduate. She knows people. We had the paper sent the next day for 100 baht post by EMS. I went to my local bar tonight for a drink, they charge 120 Baht for a gin and tonic. But my price is 100. I bought a round for the bar on my birthday last week it was 500 Baht, for over 10 drinks and I got another free drink for myself. I am treated well here, even at the Immigration office. I never said I was Thai and never will be, but I am liked by my Thai friends and family. It's up to me to know and not get mistreated. My neighbor is a "junkman. " He says at I am Thai, I'm too cheap to be a farang!

Has it ever occured to you that YOUR treatment is due to the fact that your GF is military, therefore, GOVERNMENT, therefore, most Thai's are scared to cross her, therefore, YOU get treated well by association with her????

Why don't you tell us more about all the other farang that DID pay the 10, 000 baht, THAT YOU DID NOT HAVE TO - after all, that's what most of the people on this forum have to pay.

As far as your "round at the bar" - that's the same. The bar is probably scared of your GF and fear attention from the police if you are not treated "well."

Why don't you "STOP BUYING FOR A WHILE" and see how long that last with your Thai friends? You will be OUTCAST as soon as you stop "taking care." Like all of us.

[sbk]

Actually I disagree with you but tbh, I don't see the need to try and convince you of anything, You have clearly made up your mind and so to that end, I think you need to see what you can do for your own peace of mind by getting out as soon as feasible.

No, its not a "if you don't like it get out" post but more of a "you have made up your mind so best get out before you get even more bitter and angry and do something foolish" post.

Thailand is not for everyone. Clearly, its not for you. Accept that and move on. I wish you good luck in your endeavors and hope that you do manage to find happiness in the next place you try.

[NamKangMan]

Actually I disagree with you but tbh, I don't see the need to try and convince you of anything, You have clearly made up your mind and so to that end, I think you need to see what you can do for your own peace of mind by getting out as soon as feasible.

No, its not a "if you don't like it get out" post but more of a "you have made up your mind so best get out before you get even more bitter and angry and do something foolish" post.

Thailand is not for everyone. Clearly, its not for you. Accept that and move on. I wish you good luck in your endeavors and hope that you do manage to find happiness in the next place you try.

I'm not sure who your post was aimed at, but, I'm happy here. I love the place, for now. I have never sent money for "sick buffalo: and know the place, and the scams, pretty well. I'm not bitter or hate Thailand, or Thai people. However, are they "taking the piss" out of all of us - you bet - everyday. That's what I don't like.

Farang will always be farang in Thailand.

[Ulysses G.]

I'm happy here.

I've read your posts and you certainly don't seem to be. Are you being honest with yourself?

Edited August 24, 2010 by Ulysses G.

[LivinLOS]

After 10+ years here I'll spend some time on my Sunday morning to reply.

I've lived in about 6 provinces over the years mainly in the South. Phuket being one of them a couple of years ago. Personally I didn't like the place one bit. It's ok for a holiday and fun but not for long term living. Settled down now about 200km from Phuket, less violence/crime, less annoying tourists and Thai vendors......

So IMO, Phuket for a part holiday = yes. Phuket to live full time = definitely NO. Of course to each his own.

I guess that most long term expats go through a stage that they had enough of Thailand.

Then it's time to think if this is just a stage that you are going through or that you really start to hate the country, its people and culture. If the latter, yes time to move on.

Personally as any human being I got good days and bad days, if on the bad days something "thai" happens to worsen that feeling of being anti Thai I tend to stick to myself, indulge in one of my hobbies which I can do solo and after a few hours of "solo-ing" I'm ok again.

I have noticed though that many expats seem to lack hobbies. Everyone, anywhere needs something to do, if not you become a grumpy old git. Boozing and whoring is only fun for so long, becomes tedious too after awhile.

Regarding the Thais, I have quite a few friends amongst them and indeed I have to agree with some other posters they can behave a bit childish/selfish/ignorant even the educated ones.

Little example, lets say they own a house and are noisy. This is not to bother others but they got the idea : I am in my house, on my land I do can do what I like and are oblivious to the fact that they are indeed being a pain in the a.. to the other neighbours.

It's one of their characteristics, selfishness. Forget about all the "kreng jai" stuff they are always on about, this is as the smile just a fake trait.

I think you got to be able to ignore a lot if you want to live here happily long term. Surely not every person can do that. So it's up to each of us to decide if we are ready to live here full time, year in year out, taking all the visa rules, 1000 copy of every page rules and all with it.

Also very important, choosing your partner !!! I married a normal girl, from middle class family, no rich CHinese as some others .

I remember my dad's words : Would I marry a prostitute back home? No, So why fly ....... miles to do it here.

Well I can keep on going but getting a bit lazy, hmm must have been here too long .

Anyway, fair play to the OP and I see no need to scold him or whatever for him being honest.

Oh, and to the ones that live here coz they can live off 100 or 200 baht a day. Go home get a job you stingy bunch. :jap:

A really solid post.. Theres good and bad and it is about minimizing your problems and maximizing your benefits..

A couple of points tho..

1) I find it disappointing that we need to wall ourself off from the local population to achieve peace time.. One thing I fully expected when moving here was to have Thai friends, everywhere I have lived I have had locals as social mates, Arabs in rocky, Dutchies in Holland, etc etc.. I have always found it possible to integrate.. I find it disappointing that I dont do better at that, every time it seems to be happening, I get a request for a loan !!

2) hobbies.. Here I totally agree, and have loads of distractions that fill chunks of time, probably too many.. But its worth noting, that many western hobbies are either simply unavailable or very very expensive to do here.

[likewise]

Integration is very important for me and yes sometimes it can hurt if we feel that we are doing all we can to fully integrate but still don't get fully accepted.

Yet, what do we expect from immigrants in our own countries? integration! And some of us accept those immigrants and others will never accept them even though they have been living and working in our home countries for years. The same happens here I guess.

I have quite a few good Thai friends and we get along great, they don't ask for loans we just interact as friends do disregarding the nationality issue. Surely there are some sensitive topics that are best to be avoided but they are very few.

Sure there are Thais and probably more then we think that don't like us and see us as money cows. If I feel that that is the case well then that was my first and last interaction with them.

If I see dodgy prices, I smile and walk on to another shop. As a paying customer you get to choose where you buy your goods .

We all know that they are very nationalistic and a bit too proud about their country, culture and such.

Then again, who are we to change that?

It's not paradise and the lovely smile might be fake quite often but really, does that make you sleep less a night?

If anyone knows where the real paradise is with people who never cheat, lie, give you strange looks...... let me know when you find it.

Edited August 24, 2010 by likewise

[stevenl]

1) I find it disappointing that we need to wall ourself off from the local population to achieve peace time.

In my experience: when you wall yourself of you'll never find peace time and Thai friends. I live in the middle of Thais and have no problem at all with making Thai friends. I think one of the long term problems for Phuket is going to be the walled of farang, living their own life with minimal contact with the Thais.

[katabeachbum]

1) I find it disappointing that we need to wall ourself off from the local population to achieve peace time.. One thing I fully expected when moving here was to have Thai friends, everywhere I have lived I have had locals as social mates, Arabs in rocky, Dutchies in Holland, etc etc.. I have always found it possible to integrate.. I find it disappointing that I dont do better at that, every time it seems to be happening, I get a request for a loan !!

First car I financed here in my own name, I asked a Thai friend (police) to guarante for. He did. 6 months later he needed to borrow 30k, I did.

Whenever we needed help from our Kamnan, he did. Whenever he needed help, we did.

Thats what friends do:D

Walling off from the locals doesnt work for me, perhaps thats why I dont live in millionar road in Kamala:lol:

[likewise]

Indeed, good friends can be made here as in any other country. A lot will depend on how you start your friendship with them.

Of course bad apples too, but if you have a bit of a "nose" you quickly know which ones are friends and which ones are hanging around because they think they can get some advantage out of it.

[Ulysses G.]

I am friendly with lots of Thais, but only feel close to a few (the same goes for Westerners). I have to admit that we do business together, so maybe that is their motivation. However, we have fun together, they help me and I help them. Personally, I am satisfied with that.

Edited August 24, 2010 by Ulysses G.

[likewise]

Same here, good friends Thai and Farang I can count on 1 hand. Like to keep it that way too. Don't feel the need to have a big social network.

[Jimi007]

No one shaft's me. If I don't like what ever it is, I don't need it that badly. Most everywhere I go there is a set price for everyone. It sounds as though you have been "shafted" and accept it. If there's a problem I walk away and find what I need somewhere else. I would not even try to run a business here, I may as well shoot myself! The last time someone tried to "shaft" me was in the Government office in Sa Kaew. One man saw a farang, and wanted 10,000 Baht for a paper saying my GF had never been married. My GF is a military university graduate. She knows people. We had the paper sent the next day for 100 baht post by EMS. I went to my local bar tonight for a drink, they charge 120 Baht for a gin and tonic. But my price is 100. I bought a round for the bar on my birthday last week it was 500 Baht, for over 10 drinks and I got another free drink for myself. I am treated well here, even at the Immigration office. I never said I was Thai and never will be, but I am liked by my Thai friends and family. It's up to me to know and not get mistreated. My neighbor is a "junkman. " He says at I am Thai, I'm too cheap to be a farang!

Has it ever occured to you that YOUR treatment is due to the fact that your GF is military, therefore, GOVERNMENT, therefore, most Thai's are scared to cross her, therefore, YOU get treated well by association with her????

Why don't you tell us more about all the other farang that DID pay the 10, 000 baht, THAT YOU DID NOT HAVE TO - after all, that's what most of the people on this forum have to pay.

As far as your "round at the bar" - that's the same. The bar is probably scared of your GF and fear attention from the police if you are not treated "well."

Why don't you "STOP BUYING FOR A WHILE" and see how long that last with your Thai friends? You will be OUTCAST as soon as you stop "taking care." Like all of us.

You are assuming a lot in your post. My GF is no longer military, she last worked for IBM. But she does have friends from her university. The bar owner is an old Thai friend of mine and I don't go out to any bar very often. So, when she knew it was my birthday she made me the offer. I wouldn't have paid the 10,000 Baht no matter what. I would have just not gone back the next time and they wouldn't see the farang to try to milk. It was a paper for her, not for me. We found out later from her friend that worked there, the guy trying to get the money wasn't liked and he was about to get transfered out of his position.

But, if you don't like it here, why do you want to stay here? You seem very bitter and it may be the reason you are treated as you are. Now there I go assuming!

As for your last line, everyone thinks I'm cheap, maybe it's my Scottish grandparents influence. I have never bought a round before! I will buy my neighbor a bottle of Lao Kao or something, when he cuts my yard or looks after my house and dog for a few days, when we go somewhere... But that's just the proper thing to do, in my opinion.

[Peterocket]

Why don't you "STOP BUYING FOR A WHILE" and see how long that last with your Thai friends? You will be OUTCAST as soon as you stop "taking care." Like all of us.

I dont think that you should quote for "all of us" when you are talking about yourself.

[NamKangMan]

No one shaft's me. If I don't like what ever it is, I don't need it that badly. Most everywhere I go there is a set price for everyone. It sounds as though you have been "shafted" and accept it. If there's a problem I walk away and find what I need somewhere else. I would not even try to run a business here, I may as well shoot myself! The last time someone tried to "shaft" me was in the Government office in Sa Kaew. One man saw a farang, and wanted 10,000 Baht for a paper saying my GF had never been married. My GF is a military university graduate. She knows people. We had the paper sent the next day for 100 baht post by EMS. I went to my local bar tonight for a drink, they charge 120 Baht for a gin and tonic. But my price is 100. I bought a round for the bar on my birthday last week it was 500 Baht, for over 10 drinks and I got another free drink for myself. I am treated well here, even at the Immigration office. I never said I was Thai and never will be, but I am liked by my Thai friends and family. It's up to me to know and not get mistreated. My neighbor is a "junkman. " He says at I am Thai, I'm too cheap to be a farang!

Has it ever occured to you that YOUR treatment is due to the fact that your GF is military, therefore, GOVERNMENT, therefore, most Thai's are scared to cross her, therefore, YOU get treated well by association with her????

Why don't you tell us more about all the other farang that DID pay the 10, 000 baht, THAT YOU DID NOT HAVE TO - after all, that's what most of the people on this forum have to pay.

As far as your "round at the bar" - that's the same. The bar is probably scared of your GF and fear attention from the police if you are not treated "well."

Why don't you "STOP BUYING FOR A WHILE" and see how long that last with your Thai friends? You will be OUTCAST as soon as you stop "taking care." Like all of us.

You are assuming a lot in your post. My GF is no longer military, she last worked for IBM. But she does have friends from her university. The bar owner is an old Thai friend of mine and I don't go out to any bar very often. So, when she knew it was my birthday she made me the offer. I wouldn't have paid the 10,000 Baht no matter what. I would have just not gone back the next time and they wouldn't see the farang to try to milk. It was a paper for her, not for me. We found out later from her friend that worked there, the guy trying to get the money wasn't liked and he was about to get transfered out of his position.

But, if you don't like it here, why do you want to stay here? You seem very bitter and it may be the reason you are treated as you are. Now there I go assuming!

As for your last line, everyone thinks I'm cheap, maybe it's my Scottish grandparents influence. I have never bought a round before! I will buy my neighbor a bottle of Lao Kao or something, when he cuts my yard or looks after my house and dog for a few days, when we go somewhere... But that's just the proper thing to do, in my opinion.

I like it here and I am not at the stage that the OP is/was, yet. I may never get to that stage where it all becomes too much and I leave, or, I could get to that stage in a few years time. I'm not bitter. All I am saying is, pretty much at every turn here, you come across someone like the guy you described in your post. The guy that demanded 10,000 baht for your paperwork. It's people like these that can make living here a little challenging and/or frustrating sometimes. Simply put, they will smile while they extort money from you.

Unlike the OP, the traffic doesn't bother me. However, attempting to take advantage of me, just because I am a farang, does bother me and it happens a lot here.

[NamKangMan]

I'm happy here.

I've read your posts and you certainly don't seem to be. Are you being honest with yourself?

Yes - I can honestly say I'm happy, HOWEVER, there is nothing wrong with pointing out some of the "negatives" that exist here for the expat. Some seem to think Phuket is heaven. It's a great place, but, it has it's "issues." Nothing wrong with pointing some of them out on a forum.

Edited August 24, 2010 by NamKangMan

[pmgthailand]

suits me fine I've been offered a job in Bali and can't wait to see the back of this place! Always remember Thailand is for the Thais, and they can have it!!!

Integration is very important for me and yes sometimes it can hurt if we feel that we are doing all we can to fully integrate but still don't get fully accepted.

Yet, what do we expect from immigrants in our own countries? integration! And some of us accept those immigrants and others will never accept them even though they have been living and working in our home countries for years. The same happens here I guess.

I have quite a few good Thai friends and we get along great, they don't ask for loans we just interact as friends do disregarding the nationality issue. Surely there are some sensitive topics that are best to be avoided but they are very few.

Sure there are Thais and probably more then we think that don't like us and see us as money cows. If I feel that that is the case well then that was my first and last interaction with them.

If I see dodgy prices, I smile and walk on to another shop. As a paying customer you get to choose where you buy your goods .

We all know that they are very nationalistic and a bit too proud about their country, culture and such.

Then again, who are we to change that?

It's not paradise and the lovely smile might be fake quite often but really, does that make you sleep less a night?

If anyone knows where the real paradise is with people who never cheat, lie, give you strange looks...... let me know when you find it.

[Jimi007]

No one shaft's me. If I don't like what ever it is, I don't need it that badly. Most everywhere I go there is a set price for everyone. It sounds as though you have been "shafted" and accept it. If there's a problem I walk away and find what I need somewhere else. I would not even try to run a business here, I may as well shoot myself! The last time someone tried to "shaft" me was in the Government office in Sa Kaew. One man saw a farang, and wanted 10,000 Baht for a paper saying my GF had never been married. My GF is a military university graduate. She knows people. We had the paper sent the next day for 100 baht post by EMS. I went to my local bar tonight for a drink, they charge 120 Baht for a gin and tonic. But my price is 100. I bought a round for the bar on my birthday last week it was 500 Baht, for over 10 drinks and I got another free drink for myself. I am treated well here, even at the Immigration office. I never said I was Thai and never will be, but I am liked by my Thai friends and family. It's up to me to know and not get mistreated. My neighbor is a "junkman. " He says at I am Thai, I'm too cheap to be a farang!

Has it ever occured to you that YOUR treatment is due to the fact that your GF is military, therefore, GOVERNMENT, therefore, most Thai's are scared to cross her, therefore, YOU get treated well by association with her????

Why don't you tell us more about all the other farang that DID pay the 10, 000 baht, THAT YOU DID NOT HAVE TO - after all, that's what most of the people on this forum have to pay.

As far as your "round at the bar" - that's the same. The bar is probably scared of your GF and fear attention from the police if you are not treated "well."

Why don't you "STOP BUYING FOR A WHILE" and see how long that last with your Thai friends? You will be OUTCAST as soon as you stop "taking care." Like all of us.

You are assuming a lot in your post. My GF is no longer military, she last worked for IBM. But she does have friends from her university. The bar owner is an old Thai friend of mine and I don't go out to any bar very often. So, when she knew it was my birthday she made me the offer. I wouldn't have paid the 10,000 Baht no matter what. I would have just not gone back the next time and they wouldn't see the farang to try to milk. It was a paper for her, not for me. We found out later from her friend that worked there, the guy trying to get the money wasn't liked and he was about to get transfered out of his position.

But, if you don't like it here, why do you want to stay here? You seem very bitter and it may be the reason you are treated as you are. Now there I go assuming!

As for your last line, everyone thinks I'm cheap, maybe it's my Scottish grandparents influence. I have never bought a round before! I will buy my neighbor a bottle of Lao Kao or something, when he cuts my yard or looks after my house and dog for a few days, when we go somewhere... But that's just the proper thing to do, in my opinion.

I like it here and I am not at the stage that the OP is/was, yet. I may never get to that stage where it all becomes too much and I leave, or, I could get to that stage in a few years time. I'm not bitter. All I am saying is, pretty much at every turn here, you come across someone like the guy you described in your post. The guy that demanded 10,000 baht for your paperwork. It's people like these that can make living here a little challenging and/or frustrating sometimes. Simply put, they will smile while they extort money from you.

Unlike the OP, the traffic doesn't bother me. However, attempting to take advantage of me, just because I am a farang, does bother me and it happens a lot here.

Firstly the incident I described was not in Phuket, it was in Sa Kaew. And it wasn't paper work for me, it was for my GF. I hear the man that I mentioned has lost his job now. How long have you been here in Thailand? Do you speak or understand the Thai language? Yes things can be frustrating at times, but I have learned how to make it not so frustrating to live here. It was a very steep learning curve at first! My last visit to Phuket Immigration was amusing. The only Immigration Officer that wasn't busy was the most senior. I stood in front of him for a minute or two, while he chatted with a younger Thai man. Then asked me in Thai if I could speak Thai. I answered him in Thai and he said sit down. We joked and chatted about our children attending universities and that it was expensive. He stamped my one year extension right away and sent it over to the big boss to sign. I joked with him his boss was a woman and he said you don't have police women that are the boss in the USA? Anyway, the point is, if you understand and get along you gain respect. He did get back at me for giving him sh*t about his boss, by holding out his hand for money when I said she had signed already my passport. I laughed and said hurry up, I'm hungry now. He laughed, handed me my passport and said see you in three months! Good luck and try to have fun. Life is too short!

[F1fanatic]

Integration is very important for me and yes sometimes it can hurt if we feel that we are doing all we can to fully integrate but still don't get fully accepted.

Yet, what do we expect from immigrants in our own countries? integration! And some of us accept those immigrants and others will never accept them even though they have been living and working in our home countries for years. The same happens here I guess.

I have quite a few good Thai friends and we get along great, they don't ask for loans we just interact as friends do disregarding the nationality issue. Surely there are some sensitive topics that are best to be avoided but they are very few.

Sure there are Thais and probably more then we think that don't like us and see us as money cows. If I feel that that is the case well then that was my first and last interaction with them.

If I see dodgy prices, I smile and walk on to another shop. As a paying customer you get to choose where you buy your goods .

We all know that they are very nationalistic and a bit too proud about their country, culture and such.

Then again, who are we to change that?

It's not paradise and the lovely smile might be fake quite often but really, does that make you sleep less a night?

If anyone knows where the real paradise is with people who never cheat, lie, give you strange looks...... let me know when you find it.

Whilst working in my own country, I met quite a few immigrants. I became friends with a few, others I didn't - but they all spoke English so I could communicate with them. Looking back, I became friends with those from Australia or European countries - I never became friends with those from Asia. I possibly should have thought more about that at the time.....

[F1fanatic]

After 10+ years here I'll spend some time on my Sunday morning to reply.

I've lived in about 6 provinces over the years mainly in the South. Phuket being one of them a couple of years ago. Personally I didn't like the place one bit. It's ok for a holiday and fun but not for long term living. Settled down now about 200km from Phuket, less violence/crime, less annoying tourists and Thai vendors......

So IMO, Phuket for a part holiday = yes. Phuket to live full time = definitely NO. Of course to each his own.

I guess that most long term expats go through a stage that they had enough of Thailand.

Then it's time to think if this is just a stage that you are going through or that you really start to hate the country, its people and culture. If the latter, yes time to move on.

Personally as any human being I got good days and bad days, if on the bad days something "thai" happens to worsen that feeling of being anti Thai I tend to stick to myself, indulge in one of my hobbies which I can do solo and after a few hours of "solo-ing" I'm ok again.

I have noticed though that many expats seem to lack hobbies. Everyone, anywhere needs something to do, if not you become a grumpy old git. Boozing and whoring is only fun for so long, becomes tedious too after awhile.

Regarding the Thais, I have quite a few friends amongst them and indeed I have to agree with some other posters they can behave a bit childish/selfish/ignorant even the educated ones.

Little example, lets say they own a house and are noisy. This is not to bother others but they got the idea : I am in my house, on my land I do can do what I like and are oblivious to the fact that they are indeed being a pain in the a.. to the other neighbours.

It's one of their characteristics, selfishness. Forget about all the "kreng jai" stuff they are always on about, this is as the smile just a fake trait.

I think you got to be able to ignore a lot if you want to live here happily long term. Surely not every person can do that. So it's up to each of us to decide if we are ready to live here full time, year in year out, taking all the visa rules, 1000 copy of every page rules and all with it.

Also very important, choosing your partner !!! I married a normal girl, from middle class family, no rich CHinese as some others .

I remember my dad's words : Would I marry a prostitute back home? No, So why fly ....... miles to do it here.

Well I can keep on going but getting a bit lazy, hmm must have been here too long .

Anyway, fair play to the OP and I see no need to scold him or whatever for him being honest.

Oh, and to the ones that live here coz they can live off 100 or 200 baht a day. Go home get a job you stingy bunch. :jap:

A really solid post.. Theres good and bad and it is about minimizing your problems and maximizing your benefits..

A couple of points tho..

1) I find it disappointing that we need to wall ourself off from the local population to achieve peace time.. One thing I fully expected when moving here was to have Thai friends, everywhere I have lived I have had locals as social mates, Arabs in rocky, Dutchies in Holland, etc etc.. I have always found it possible to integrate.. I find it disappointing that I dont do better at that, every time it seems to be happening, I get a request for a loan !!

2) hobbies.. Here I totally agree, and have loads of distractions that fill chunks of time, probably too many.. But its worth noting, that many western hobbies are either simply unavailable or very very expensive to do here.

Like you, when I moved here I was looking forward to making lots of friends in a new country - only to realise after a v short period of time, Thai friends weren't about to happen - they were ony looking to make money from a farang....

I've learned to live with the disappointment, and have also learned to make farang friends whilst smiling all the time at the locals.... Keep myself to myself as far as the locals are concerned - they've no reason to have a grudge against me (definitely dangerous), so we have no problem. Disappointing though compared to my original expectations....

[F1fanatic]

Integration is very important for me and yes sometimes it can hurt if we feel that we are doing all we can to fully integrate but still don't get fully accepted.

Yet, what do we expect from immigrants in our own countries? integration! And some of us accept those immigrants and others will never accept them even though they have been living and working in our home countries for years. The same happens here I guess.

I have quite a few good Thai friends and we get along great, they don't ask for loans we just interact as friends do disregarding the nationality issue. Surely there are some sensitive topics that are best to be avoided but they are very few.

Sure there are Thais and probably more then we think that don't like us and see us as money cows. If I feel that that is the case well then that was my first and last interaction with them.

If I see dodgy prices, I smile and walk on to another shop. As a paying customer you get to choose where you buy your goods .

We all know that they are very nationalistic and a bit too proud about their country, culture and such.

Then again, who are we to change that?

It's not paradise and the lovely smile might be fake quite often but really, does that make you sleep less a night?

If anyone knows where the real paradise is with people who never cheat, lie, give you strange looks...... let me know when you find it.

If anyone knows where the real paradise is with people who never cheat, lie, give you strange looks...... let me know when you find it.

Now that's the real truth in the matter!! Certainly in the UK you could be unlucky enough to be cheated, lied to and given strange looks....., but you'd have to be unlucky.

And that's the point - a minority in the West will cheat, lie, give you strange looks etc..... In my experience, its the vast majority that will do that in Thailand.......

[WarpSpeed]

hmm, like to do some roadtrips around LOS. Just came back from a 3800km trip including Vientienne, Laos. Thai motorists are among the most selfish in the world. Compared to the rest of LOS, traffic in Phuket is civilized. In the north east, not one vehicle/bike ever consider yielding when entering a large road, just jump out and hope to survive.

Get used to it;) or leave or remain miserable here

Agree with this. Traffic on Phuket maybe crazy sometimes, with people driving on the wrong side of the road, motorbikes left and right, etc., but in general they will yield and have patience. Nothing compared to other parts of Thailand, especially Bangkok, and much more polite than many places in the world, including much of Europe.

And besides on occasion just drive off the beaten path maybe up coast to some of the national parks up there and just enjoy the scenery for a change driving at your own pace through the mountains taking care to not to miss taking in the view.

I completely understand your feelings and relate though I would gladly trade you Bangkok for Phuket again, I spent 2 years down there and hated leaving..If I came from somewhere originally like Britain where it is crap weather and cold much of the year I'd feel like some of the others here who see it as such a huge positive change weather wise but I left paradise financially and environment wise to come here and the purpose is irrelevant just as it is for you but are career and family related and everyone comes for varying reasons, if you're not resigned to being here then as you say a good visit is good enough for your fill and time to leave..

[Jimi007]

Integration is very important for me and yes sometimes it can hurt if we feel that we are doing all we can to fully integrate but still don't get fully accepted.

Yet, what do we expect from immigrants in our own countries? integration! And some of us accept those immigrants and others will never accept them even though they have been living and working in our home countries for years. The same happens here I guess.

I have quite a few good Thai friends and we get along great, they don't ask for loans we just interact as friends do disregarding the nationality issue. Surely there are some sensitive topics that are best to be avoided but they are very few.

Sure there are Thais and probably more then we think that don't like us and see us as money cows. If I feel that that is the case well then that was my first and last interaction with them.

If I see dodgy prices, I smile and walk on to another shop. As a paying customer you get to choose where you buy your goods .

We all know that they are very nationalistic and a bit too proud about their country, culture and such.

Then again, who are we to change that?

It's not paradise and the lovely smile might be fake quite often but really, does that make you sleep less a night?

If anyone knows where the real paradise is with people who never cheat, lie, give you strange looks...... let me know when you find it.

If anyone knows where the real paradise is with people who never cheat, lie, give you strange looks...... let me know when you find it.

Now that's the real truth in the matter!! Certainly in the UK you could be unlucky enough to be cheated, lied to and given strange looks....., but you'd have to be unlucky.

And that's the point - a minority in the West will cheat, lie, give you strange looks etc..... In my experience, its the vast majority that will do that in Thailand.......

"And that's the point - a minority in the West will cheat, lie, give you strange looks etc..... In my experience, its the vast majority that will do that in Thailand....." Another bitter farang in Thailand! It is your choice to live where ever you chose to, is it not? Are you stuck in Thailand for some reason? If you seem to think everyone here is out to cheat you, maybe it is time to find somewhere you "think" is better. Or perhaps return to the UK, where you apparently have to be unlucky to find "cheaters" and people who lie... Have a nice time!