Retirement Visa

[lyndyy]

My husband and I are looking at retiring in Thailand.

We are both in our 50's and from the UK.

We were last in Thailand in January and opened a bank account each in which to transfer the necessary funds to qualify for the visa

My questions are:

Do we need to get a 3 month visa in order to get the letter from the bank stating we have the correct funds?

Do we need return flights or get the visa at the end of 3 months?

Any help would be greatly appreciated....

[Jingthing]

If qualifying just based on the Thai bank account, as a married foreign couple you only need ONE Thai bank account. (I am pretty sure about this, but seek confirmation.) For the first extension based on retirement, it must be about 800K baht for two months prior to the extension application.

(Another thing you need to know which I don't, should that one account be a joint account in both your names, or only in one name of the person originating the retirement extension?)

My suggestion would be to use a single entry O visa obtained in the UK. They are good for a 90 day stay. Typically people apply for their extensions based on retirement 30 days before the end of their current permission to stay. You should arrange it so that your Thai bank account is funded early enough so that at the time you go in for the extension application (60 days or more into the 90 day stay), the money will have been in there for at least two months, and never even one baht under 800K.

IMPORTANT -- I do NOT know the details of whether you BOTH need O visas (or O-As if you go that route) or not as you are married and will be piggybacking your extension. Someone with that information will hopefully fill you in about that.

The bank isn't interested in your visa. Immigration is. Generally you get the letter from the bank as close to the application date at immigration as possible. Previous day is typical, I have heard stories of demands for same day letters as well.

As far as flights, check the requirements at the embassy or consulate you apply for the O visa from. You will want a single entry O visa, NOT an O-A retirement visa. That is important. The application for the O-A is a different animal, more work to apply for but it has some features people like. You may want to look into the multiple entry O-A as an option, in that case you may not need to fund your Thai bank account for two years if you play it right. You will also need more of an expert to confirm how a married couple can play the two years O-A "game"; I am not sure how to do that with a piggybacked situation or even sure it is possible.

Good luck.

I hope this gets you started, sorry I am not expert about married couple's retirement visas/extensions.

Edited August 11, 2010 by Jingthing

[BWPattaya]

I suggest that both of you contact the Thai consulate in Hull. Get a retirement visa there. You may need seperate bank accounts for immigration purposes. Ask the consulate for advice.

[Jingthing]

I suggest that both of you contact the Thai consulate in Hull. Get a retirement visa there. You may need seperate bank accounts for immigration purposes. Ask the consulate for advice.

I respectfully disagree with that advice in general although perhaps Hull is an exception. Often the consulates and embassies don't give good advice about what goes on once you get to Thailand. We have had many reports here over the years of people being given very bad information from their embassies/consulates. It really isn't their area of specialization, what happens after you get to Thailand.

I think the best tact is to keep this thread open and the most authoritative visa experts will surely comment on your situation. I know a lot about retirement visas but am weak on the details about married foreigners retiring here together. The above posters suggestion btw literally means to get O-A visas in the UK, and that is only one option. You don't need to do it that way. You should learn about the pros and cons of the O-A route vs. starting with an O and also about how both work with a foreign married couple. Then and only then can you make a fully informed decision about how to proceed.

I don't mean to suggest that this is terribly complicated, only that non-Thai married couples going together is a different situation than the more typical applicant.

Edited August 11, 2010 by Jingthing

[lekatai]

I suggest that both of you contact the Thai consulate in Hull. Get a retirement visa there. You may need seperate bank accounts for immigration purposes. Ask the consulate for advice.

Jingthing(as usual) is right in what he says.Additionally,Hull don't issue O "A" retirement visas,only the London Embassy does,I got a proper O "A" visa there myself.There's really not much point in doing that,it's expensive and complicated. As JT says,get a single entry O visa from Hull,and extend it for the purposes of retirement in the standard way,once you are here.As far as your wife is concerned,the simplest way for her is to get a the same O visa for her from Hull,and then extend it here,as your dependent,based on your retirement extension.This is valid for the same period as yours.The only paperwork you will need is proof that you are married.I had to do this last year,as my wife is not Thai.Immigration didn't ask to see any proof of funds for my wife(or even if she had a bank account)You could,of course,both get independent extensions based on retirement,but as far as I know,there's no advantage in doing that,and it would mean more paperwork and expense

Edited August 11, 2010 by lekatai

[Lite Beer]

Both of you get a single entry Non Imm O Visa . Recommend the Thai Consulate in Hull. The are helpful and very quick at getting your passport sent back to you.

With that Visa you only need one way flights.

With about 30 days remaining on your stay your Husband can apply for a 12 month extension at Immigration.

He will need a letter from his Thai bank verifying his balance of over 800,000 Baht.

The bank account will have to be in his name alone.

You can then apply for the same 12 month extension as his dependent. (No bank balance needed).

For Him

2.22 In the case of a retiree: Permission will be granted for a period of not more

than 1 year at a time.

(1) The alien has obtained a temporary visa (NON-IM);

(2) The applicant is 50 years of age or over;

(3) Proof of income of not less than Baht 65,000 per month; or

(4) Account deposit with a bank in Thailand of not less than

800,000 Baht as shown in the bank account for the past 3 months at the filing date of the application. For the first year, the applicant should have that amount in his bank account for not less than 60 days or

(5) Annual income plus bank account deposit totaling not less

than Baht 800,000 as of the filing date of application

For You.

2.20 In the case of a family

member of an alien who has been permitted temporary

stay under clauses 2.1, 2.2, 2.3, 2.5, 2.6,2.7, 2.10, 2.12, 2.13,2.4, 2.15, 2.16, 2.17,

2.21, 2.22,2.26,6.29 of this Order

Permission will be

granted for a period of

not more than 1 year at a time.

(1) The alien has obtained a temporary visa (NON-IM);

(2) Proof of family relationship;

(3) In the case of a spouse, the marital relationship shall be de

jure (legitimate) and de facto;

[lopburi3]

The above post is the proper method if not obtaining an O-A visa from the Embassy (more paperwork and not worth the trouble if only single entry). Note that only 60 days in bank is required to allow the change during the period of a single entry non immigrant O visa allowed stay.

[OJAS]

Both of you get a single entry Non Imm O Visa . Recommend the Thai Consulate in Hull. The are helpful and very quick at getting your passport sent back to you.

With that Visa you only need one way flights.

With about 30 days remaining on your stay your Husband can apply for a 12 month extension at Immigration.

He will need a letter from his Thai bank verifying his balance of over 800,000 Baht.

The bank account will have to be in his name alone.

You can then apply for the same 12 month extension as his dependent. (No bank balance needed).

For Him

2.22 In the case of a retiree: Permission will be granted for a period of not more

than 1 year at a time.

(1) The alien has obtained a temporary visa (NON-IM);

(2) The applicant is 50 years of age or over;

(3) Proof of income of not less than Baht 65,000 per month; or

(4) Account deposit with a bank in Thailand of not less than

800,000 Baht as shown in the bank account for the past 3 months at the filing date of the application. For the first year, the applicant should have that amount in his bank account for not less than 60 days or

(5) Annual income plus bank account deposit totaling not less

than Baht 800,000 as of the filing date of application

For You.

2.20 In the case of a family

member of an alien who has been permitted temporary

stay under clauses 2.1, 2.2, 2.3, 2.5, 2.6,2.7, 2.10, 2.12, 2.13,2.4, 2.15, 2.16, 2.17,

2.21, 2.22,2.26,6.29 of this Order

Permission will be

granted for a period of

not more than 1 year at a time.

(1) The alien has obtained a temporary visa (NON-IM);

(2) Proof of family relationship;

(3) In the case of a spouse, the marital relationship shall be de

jure (legitimate) and de facto;

Presumably the OP's husband could obtain an Embassy proof of income letter (instead of a bank balance one) if he met criteria (3) and the income in question was generated in the UK?

[Lite Beer]

Presumably the OP's husband could obtain an Embassy proof of income letter (instead of a bank balance one) if he met criteria (3) and the income in question was generated in the UK?

Yes he could.

[Jingthing]

Thanks LiteBeer, you the man.

[lyndyy]

Thank you for all your comments - very informative...

I also emailed Hull with the same questions and here is their reply:

I would suggest you apply for a non immigrant multiple entries visa. This is valid for a year and allows you to stay in Thailand for 90 days at a time. It would mean if the Thai Immigration were not able to process your retirement visa within your first 90 days (due to the funds having to be in a Thai bank account for 3 months) you could leave and re-enter Thailand and be granted a further 90 days stay. You can enter Thailand on an one way ticket if you have a visa before you travel.

[Lite Beer]

The above Visa would give up to 15 months stay.

It would give you time to sort things out if needed.

[lopburi3]

It would mean if the Thai Immigration were not able to process your retirement visa within your first 90 days (due to the funds having to be in a Thai bank account for 3 months)

There is no such requirement. The rule is two months in account not three for first such extension of stay. It would also be easy to obtain another non immigrant entry either inside Thailand or from a nearby Consulate. There is no need for more than a single entry if you plan to extend for retirement. And when talking about two it gets needlessly expensive.

[Jingthing]

The advice you got from Hull indeed had some flaws. It's fun to be correct; like I said what happens to their applicants after they get to Thailand isn't really their expertise.

As lopbori3 said, the money only needs to be seasoned for two months for the first extension based on retirement. It is three months for subsequent extensions, but in your case, definitely two months.

It is nice that they are offering you a multiple entry O but WHY would you want one? With such a visa if you do indeed intend to use it to its completion, you must exit Thailand every three months. With a retirement extension all you have to do is report your address to immigration every three months.

And here is the kicker. The longer you wait to get into the retirement system here, the greater the chance Thai immigration may raise the financial requirement to obtain retirement extensions. If you are already in the system and get your retirement extension based on a single entry O, it is highly likely you would be grandfathered in on the existing money levels (800K baht). The longer you wait to get into the system, the more chance you will be caught out of the system when a change occurs, and then you would have to start with the new levels.

I am pretty sure those still on 0-A visas are also not considered into the Thai immigration system yet for purposes of grandfathering old requirements. That starts upon the date of their first extension based on retirement in Thailand. This last point is academic for you as it sounds like you will be using an O visa, not an O-A.

Best of luck.

Edited August 14, 2010 by Jingthing

[harrry]

I am pretty sure those still on 0-A visas are also not considered into the Thai immigration system yet for purposes of grandfathering old requirements. That starts upon the date of their first extension based on retirement in Thailand. This last point is academic for you as it sounds like you will be using an O visa, not an O-A.

Best of luck.

Could you please confirm if this is true or not Lopburi3

[Lite Beer]

This is the wording of the police order that deals with the last Grandfathering.

(6) For an alien who entered Thailand before October 21,

1998 and continuously allowed to stay in the Kingdom as a

retiree, the following shall apply:

It would remain to be seen whether that would include O-A Visa holders the next time round as they have the same financial requirements.

[Jingthing]

I am pretty sure those still on 0-A visas are also not considered into the Thai immigration system yet for purposes of grandfathering old requirements. That starts upon the date of their first extension based on retirement in Thailand. This last point is academic for you as it sounds like you will be using an O visa, not an O-A.

Best of luck.

Could you please confirm if this is true or not Lopburi3

I recall this being confirmed before, but my memory isn't 100 percent so I also welcome confirmation, yeah or nay.

It's also worth noting there is guarantee they will grandfather anyone upon future changes, so all we have to go on is precedent.

Edited August 14, 2010 by Jingthing

[NiceOldPappy]

Hi,

Great comment on this original question, but you have left me wondering with one of your statements. Could you please elaborate or point me at a link that might explain this...

You will want a single entry O visa, NOT an O-A retirement visa. That is important. The application for the O-A is a different animal, more work to apply for but it has some features people like.

What features?

I am 65 and considering retirement to Thailand. I was just reading about the O-A and it does have a long list of requirements, but have not yet found anything on the O with retirement Visa. The bank deposit is not a problem.

Pappy

[Jingthing]

Hi,

Great comment on this original question, but you have left me wondering with one of your statements. Could you please elaborate or point me at a link that might explain this...

You will want a single entry O visa, NOT an O-A retirement visa. That is important. The application for the O-A is a different animal, more work to apply for but it has some features people like.

What features?

I am 65 and considering retirement to Thailand. I was just reading about the O-A and it does have a long list of requirements, but have not yet found anything on the O with retirement Visa. The bank deposit is not a problem.

Pappy

The O-A is the only retirement visa.

Features --

If using bank account to qualify, you can work it so the 800K doesn't need to be in Thailand for a few years.

Using a multiple entry O-A, you can exit and reenter Thailand near the end of your first year stay and get a new second year. Doing this you don't have to get into the Thai immigration retirement extension system for a few years after your move here.

Retiring using an O visa, you start with retirement extensions obtained in Thailand. With this option, if using the bank account method, you must have the 800K in Thailand seasoned for two months before the first application for retirement extension.

Edited August 15, 2010 by Jingthing

[NiceOldPappy]

Thanks JT,

I think I understand.

You mentioned a good point, not getting into the Immigration Retirement scheme for a few years seems like a good plan. That allows me to be sure I want to retire there before committing to it all

Life is all bout timing and compromise.

Pappy.

[lopburi3]

There is no commitment and no reason not to do as soon as you qualify. You can always leave and return at your bidding. It is not employment or marriage but retirement extension of stay. The money is not a deposit you must leave in account after approval as in some other countries.

[Jingthing]

Agreed, though some people for various reasons would rather delay moving that 800K to Thailand (assuming the use of the bank account option). The mutli-entry O-A allows them to delay that for a few years. Another caveat, it isn't always easy to wire money OUT of Thailand as opposed to into Thailand.

[ChiangMaiFun]

Does the 65,000 a month HAVE TO come into Thailand? i.e. into a Thai bank account or can it be just income in your own country?

[Mario2008]

The money doesn't have to come in on a bank account in Thailand.

(Some immigration offices do want to see a Thai bank book with some money in it, say more than 20,000, to show you have money to spend).

[ChiangMaiFun]

The money doesn't have to come in on a bank account in Thailand.

(Some immigration offices do want to see a Thai bank book with some money in it, say more than 20,000, to show you have money to spend).

Many thanks - I came across this though which seems to suggest it should come into Thailand?

e) be able to support yourself financially. It is necessary to show an income into a Thai bank account of minimum 65,000 baht per month by way of a pension, Investments, etc or a minimum of 800,000 baht in a bank account in Thailand or a mixture of the two..

[Mario2008]

That information is simply not correct and an investment would not count towards the income. The proceeds from investments might.

[Jingthing]

The money doesn't have to come in on a bank account in Thailand.

(Some immigration offices do want to see a Thai bank book with some money in it, say more than 20,000, to show you have money to spend).

Many thanks - I came across this though which seems to suggest it should come into Thailand?

e) be able to support yourself financially. It is necessary to show an income into a Thai bank account of minimum 65,000 baht per month by way of a pension, Investments, etc or a minimum of 800,000 baht in a bank account in Thailand or a mixture of the two..

Whatever you think it "suggests" there is absolutely no requirement to transfer in these monies on an annual basis, whether using the pension method, the bank account method, or the combination. In other words, for example if using the pension method, the embassy letter proves that, if using the 800K bank method it could be the SAME 800K for many years as long as you can show that sum in the Thai bank every time.

Edited December 13, 2010 by Jingthing

[ChiangMaiFun]

The money doesn't have to come in on a bank account in Thailand.

(Some immigration offices do want to see a Thai bank book with some money in it, say more than 20,000, to show you have money to spend).

Many thanks - I came across this though which seems to suggest it should come into Thailand?

e) be able to support yourself financially. It is necessary to show an income into a Thai bank account of minimum 65,000 baht per month by way of a pension, Investments, etc or a minimum of 800,000 baht in a bank account in Thailand or a mixture of the two..

Whatever you think it "suggests" there is absolutely no requirement to transfer in these monies on an annual basis, whether using the pension method, the bank account method, or the combination. In other words, for example if using the pension method, the embassy letter proves that, if using the 800K bank method it could be the SAME 800K for many years as long as you can show it every time.

Let's be clear... I ask this as the British Consulate here said it has to be a Thai Bank Account not in England (in my case):

the 800,000 has to be in Thailand Bank Account right? it can be the SAME 800,000 but it has to be here? right?

the 65,000 has to be a proven amount in your Embassy/Consulates letter - right? so does it have to be transferred INTO Thailand? this is where I was seeking clarification.

The section I cut and pasted is from the Thai regulations which seem to back-up the British Consulates stance that I may be asked to prove the money actually left England and came here - otherwise what point is it? and surely I could have the 800,000 equivilant sitting in a UK Bank Account and not here in a Thai one?

[Jingthing]

The money doesn't have to come in on a bank account in Thailand.

(Some immigration offices do want to see a Thai bank book with some money in it, say more than 20,000, to show you have money to spend).

Many thanks - I came across this though which seems to suggest it should come into Thailand?

e) be able to support yourself financially. It is necessary to show an income into a Thai bank account of minimum 65,000 baht per month by way of a pension, Investments, etc or a minimum of 800,000 baht in a bank account in Thailand or a mixture of the two..

Whatever you think it "suggests" there is absolutely no requirement to transfer in these monies on an annual basis, whether using the pension method, the bank account method, or the combination. In other words, for example if using the pension method, the embassy letter proves that, if using the 800K bank method it could be the SAME 800K for many years as long as you can show it every time.

Let's be clear... I ask this as the British Consulate here said it has to be a Thai Bank Account not in England (in my case):

the 800,000 has to be in Thailand Bank Account right? it can be the SAME 800,000 but it has to be here? right?

the 65,000 has to be a proven amount in your Embassy/Consulates letter - right? so does it have to be transferred INTO Thailand? this is where I was seeking clarification.

The section I cut and pasted is from the Thai regulations which seem to back-up the British Consulates stance that I may be asked to prove the money actually left England and came here - otherwise what point is it? and surely I could have the 800,000 equivilant sitting in a UK Bank Account and not here in a Thai one?

1. The embassy letter proving 65K baht monthly income is adequate for extensions based on retirement in Thailand. It absolutely DOES NOT need to be transferred in to a Thai bank account. Mario is correct that some officers will require that a SMALL Thai bank account be shown anyway for people qualifying on the pension.

2. The 800K method. It can be the same amount every year. It would need to transferred in the first time (exceptions may be people who already live in Thailand before retiring here who have money here already). Most people spend down from that account and top up every year, but it is not required. Not even one baht annual transfer is required. If the account is static, immigration will likely ask how you get your spending money though to ferret out illegal workers.

3. For the O-A visa in your home country, the money shown for that is usually in your home country. For the annual extensions based on retirement in Thailand, the money MUST be be shown in a THAI bank account whether using the bank account method, the combo method, or pension qualifiers who are sometimes asked to show a small Thai bank account. If you are asking WHY, that's above my pay grade. Why does it matter?

Edited December 13, 2010 by Jingthing

[ChiangMaiFun]

Here's why it matters:

Firstly if the 800,000 is required in a Thai Bank Account why should the 65,000 monthly amount not also be required? otherwise it penalises those that put in the 800,000

Secondly I have the 800,000 method but want to change to the 65,000 method but DO NOT want to bring into Thailand the 65,000 a month as I'd prefer to leave it in my UK account

Thirdly what does it prove that I have 65,000 a month in Sterling? surely the whole point is that I have it in Thailand?

Fourthly the British Consulate mentioned this to me - hence I am trying to clarify