Look Kreungs

[Gladiator]

we rule Thailand already.

You just don't know it yet.

How right you are !!!!

[Kwasaki]

The post has started of with trying to explain half Thai and half something else of outside of Thailand mixed race people.

Is that not obvious from seeing the super stars on Thai Television, it's been here for generations, so what !! The post title is totally wrong as well.

Edited October 25, 2010 by Kwasaki

[MZurf]

The post has started of with trying to explain half Thai and half something else of outside of Thailand mixed race people.

Is that not obvious from seeing the super stars on Thai Television, it's been here for generations, so what !! The post title is totally wrong as well.

Huh???

[Kwasaki]

The post has started of with trying to explain half Thai and half something else of outside of Thailand mixed race people.

Is that not obvious from seeing the super stars on Thai Television, it's been here for generations, so what !! The post title is totally wrong as well.

Huh???

" look kreungs " what is it !!!

[SantiSuk]

I won't be looking for my look kreung to break into Thai soceity and be accepted into the system with all its reported paternalism and nepotism. I would hope to breed better and more independent than that. She will also have the financial backing to explore what she is likely to enjoy without worrying about having to get a certain job(s) to keep Mum out of the poor house. Brave words which I hope I can live up to.

I guess there are many other falangs out there of the same fabric, so it could be quite interesting to see what happens in say 20-30 years time.

I am amazed so many seem to think that Falangland is going to be so attractive to our progeny. Some of you need to lift your head out of your beers if you can't see the way the world is shifting. Sure they might want to go to China or Malaysia (say) but Europe or the US in 2025? You're pulling my leg.

[Forethat]

I won't be looking for my look kreung to break into Thai soceity and be accepted into the system with all its reported paternalism and nepotism. I would hope to breed better and more independent than that. She will also have the financial backing to explore what she is likely to enjoy without worrying about having to get a certain job(s) to keep Mum out of the poor house. Brave words which I hope I can live up to.

I guess there are many other falangs out there of the same fabric, so it could be quite interesting to see what happens in say 20-30 years time.

I am amazed so many seem to think that Falangland is going to be so attractive to our progeny. Some of you need to lift your head out of your beers if you can't see the way the world is shifting. Sure they might want to go to China or Malaysia (say) but Europe or the US in 2025? You're pulling my leg.

Interesting post, I tend to agree with most of this. I should also point out that an overwhelming number of farangs in Thailand have no academic background, this in itself (statistically speaking) means their offspring is less likely to get a higher education.

I do understand that the expat community is not entirely made up of TV members, you only have to read the latest posts from Thaddeus - in which he describes how he rather allows uneducated people inject him with "some red stuff" than go to the hospital - to understand that the overall level of cleverness and education is lower than average in their native country. To expect that people like this will raise well educated offspring is a gamble of long odds, I wouldn't bet much on it...

[IanForbes]

A fish doesn't know that it lives in water. A baby born of mixed heritage doesn't know that he or she has a Thai mother and foreign father, or Thai father and foreign mother. All the baby knows in the first few years of his or her life is the love and learning that are brought from the mother and father. If the child grows up seeing, learning and absorbing love, respect, and the value of work and/or education, then the child would certainly be a asset to Thailand, or any other society in which he or she chooses to live as an adult. Some of the responses in this thread smack of jaded pessimism, xenophobia and ignorance.

I think you're wrong here. My eldest who is four already understands thta daddy is from England and mummy is from Thailand and that they are different countries. He also understands about people speaking different languages. He also knows that daddy is different from the vast majority of people he sees around him, on the TV etc. Agree with the rest but kids understand things pretty quick IME.

He said babies, not children. Babies don't understand what is going on around them. They only want nurturing, food and comfort. But, you are correct in that children DO notice what is around them and they learn very quickly. However, It still comes down to how they are raised, and more importantly, by BOTH parents. If the farang father lets his Thai wife do ALL the training then the child will grow up more Thai than whatever nationality the father is. If the father takes an active role in raising the child properly then the child will be well adjusted, self confident and far more stable later in life. When you give your child as many opportunities as possible to succeed then you have little to worry about. Don't worry about the other people's children. Worry about your own. You can't change the world. All you can do is adjust to your surroundings.

[Pakboong]

I'm surprised at the optimism of the thread. I agree that the growing number of half Thai/half Western children is a very significant development with the potential to bring about real change in Thai society, but I'd say there are also very significant obstacles and that many individuals are going to have bad experiences. Thailand is a deeply hierarchical society, in which social contacts often count for more than merit. Unfortunately, irrespective of our income or professional standing, westerners don't rank very highly in that hierarchy as far as upper-class Thais are concerned, and aren't as well connected. My perception, which may be quite wrong, is that while luuk kreung do well in the entertainment industry, they hit a 'glass ceiling' in most other fields. Western parents struggle to work the system to gain an advantage for their offspring. I'm not talking about grades in a middle-ranking secondary school, but something like a good degree from Chula or a decent professional career track. I'd love to be wrong, but I have decided, albeit reluctantly, that my son is better off in school in the UK.

And the pearly gates surely don't all open up after graduating college, that's for sure. There are some, but there aren't nearly enough factories and businesses run by foreigners being handed down to the 'next generation' for there to be much 'luk krung' presence. Inheritance of property is another issue, since foreigners have to go through all of these hoops to own land, and many choose not to at all because of this. Cash holdings are often depleted by the time it's meant to be passed on to the next generation, so the 'luk krung' masses often are 'only' on square 2 (if not square 1) when they are getting their lives started.

On top of that, by generation 3 and 4... you're likely not going to be 'luk krung' anymore. Either you're going to be another 'group' entirely if you've moved abroad or you're going to be 'Thai' and reabsorbed into the system if your family is here.

Heng's view on this is accurate as far as my half Thai 32 year old daughter is concerned. She was educated in the US but has worked in and out of Thailand since the 90s. She now lives and works in Bangkok. When she has had struggles getting to where she wants to be professionally they have been Thai vs Chinese, not Thai vs half Thai.

[canuckamuck]

The problem is that the majority of luk krungs are half Thai Visa Poster and half Thai bargirl. Disadvantaged from both sides I'm afraid.

[bermondburi]

A fish doesn't know that it lives in water. A baby born of mixed heritage doesn't know that he or she has a Thai mother and foreign father, or Thai father and foreign mother. All the baby knows in the first few years of his or her life is the love and learning that are brought from the mother and father. If the child grows up seeing, learning and absorbing love, respect, and the value of work and/or education, then the child would certainly be a asset to Thailand, or any other society in which he or she chooses to live as an adult. Some of the responses in this thread smack of jaded pessimism, xenophobia and ignorance.

I think you're wrong here. My eldest who is four already understands thta daddy is from England and mummy is from Thailand and that they are different countries. He also understands about people speaking different languages. He also knows that daddy is different from the vast majority of people he sees around him, on the TV etc. Agree with the rest but kids understand things pretty quick IME.

He said babies, not children. Babies don't understand what is going on around them. They only want nurturing, food and comfort. But, you are correct in that children DO notice what is around them and they learn very quickly. However, It still comes down to how they are raised, and more importantly, by BOTH parents. If the farang father lets his Thai wife do ALL the training then the child will grow up more Thai than whatever nationality the father is. If the father takes an active role in raising the child properly then the child will be well adjusted, self confident and far more stable later in life. When you give your child as many opportunities as possible to succeed then you have little to worry about. Don't worry about the other people's children. Worry about your own. You can't change the world. All you can do is adjust to your surroundings.

Babies understand more than you think. Apparently at five months pregnant the baby in the womb can already differentiate between the sounds of different languages.

[bermondburi]

Plus he said " in the first few years of life" . Three or four years old is in the first few years of life.

[bermondburi]

The problem is that the majority of luk krungs are half Thai Visa Poster and half Thai bargirl. Disadvantaged from both sides I'm afraid.

What world do you live in to come out with prejudiced bigoted drivel like this ? I'm guessing that a lot of it comes from where you live in Thailand. In Nonthaburi where I live relationships such as those you describe are non-existent because most of the foreigners here have jobs, work etc and DID NOT MARRY A PROSTITUTE !!

[farang000999]

The problem is that the majority of luk krungs are half Thai Visa Poster and half Thai bargirl. Disadvantaged from both sides I'm afraid.

So you are saying that you married a bar girl?

[ozsamurai]

The Chinese have been systematically breeding out the Thai for generations, the new wave of (Anglo-Thai's) luk krung, will have to beat them out of the positions of authority first, which is not likely to happen, as office and importance seems now to be hereditary. Aboriginals, Indians et al, the Thai will be bred out in the long run. Its true a child may have the benefit or detraction of a western parent, but if you have had kids, you'll know that they will BE what they want to be regardless of money. Sure they have more opportunities, but choice of them is entirely up to them, they are not suddenly super because of a bit of mixed genetics.

Ever wondered where the f"wits come from

2 halfwits breed make a 1/4 wit

two of them breed and you end up with a f"wit

Oz

[justaphase]

I quote a Thai university student "If the Chinese hadn't come to Thailand, the Thais would still be pointing at the moon wondering what to do.."

As for look-krung ferangs.. they've been here for years.. look at Tiger Woods or most skin product models... as for bar-girl/ferrang look krungs... they aint gonna grow up with white skin.....

[canuckamuck]

The problem is that the majority of luk krungs are half Thai Visa Poster and half Thai bargirl. Disadvantaged from both sides I'm afraid.

What world do you live in to come out with prejudiced bigoted drivel like this ? I'm guessing that a lot of it comes from where you live in Thailand. In Nonthaburi where I live relationships such as those you describe are non-existent because most of the foreigners here have jobs, work etc and DID NOT MARRY A PROSTITUTE !!

Sorry about my sense of humor, have a coffee and relax. you too Farang0000999

Edited October 26, 2010 by canuckamuck

[justaphase]

"most of the foreigners here have jobs, work etc and DID NOT MARRY A PROSTITUTE !!"

I'm sorry but that MUST be <deleted>... "Did not marry a prostitute"....Where did they meet all those lovely dark ladies then..? At the morning market...?

55555555555+

[scorecard]

They have already made a huge impact, for many years now, on the entertainment business, with greater than average representation in TV and in pop music. Even look khreung popstars who can't speak Thai properly - or who can't read Thai at all - do well in showbiz here.

That's quite a difference from 30 years ago when look khreung were looked down upon. Not sure whether the explanation follows from the OP's suggestion that farang parents nowadays tend to come from a higher socioeconomic status than in the 60s and 70s. Maybe.

I'm not suggesting that farang parents nowadays tend to come from a higher socioeconomic status than before. I would thing that it's the other way around as air travel the last 20 years has become so cheap that "now everyone can fly" (to borrow Air Asia's slogan). I'm thinking of the sheer number of marriages between farangs and Thai that seems to be ever increasing.

I'm aware of the large number of look kreungs in the showbiz industry. At least in front of the camera. I wonder if they are also a force behind the camera?

I think your massively overestimating the whole thing that your talking about.

Sure there are many marriages between Thais and westerners (and lets not forget: Singaporeans, Japanese, and more) but it's not in 'massive' numbers / or in some sizeable pecentage of all marriages, as you seem to believe.

My granddaughter goes to a much better than average school here in Bangkok (but not a full international school), there are over 1,000 students at the school (Kinder, Pathom, and Matayom. The school openly strongly welcomes all students, and the total number of look krueng students is 2.

(On a different point, about 80% of the whole student body are in full English programs.)

I'm just wondering what depth and breadth of contact / interaction do you have with all sectors of Thai society?

[meadish_sweetball]

Mixed Thai-Western children are from all types of socio-economic backgrounds, and that means that as adults, they will also be distributed like that, across the board. Some of them learn two languages, others learn just one. Some of them get to travel from an early age and get used to the rest of the world, some stay in Thailand or in their Farangland and consequently become more like the majority there. Some of them will grow up with just one parent, some of them will grow up with their grandparents, some will be abducted, some will live in fairy-tale land.

So they'll become business owners, librarians, beach bums, bakers, shakers, quakers, nuclear physicists, gender shifters, authors, actors, killers, gardeners, ice skaters, golf players, hotel receptionists, embassy staff, soldiers, porn stars, housewives, househusbands, feminists, racists, catalysts, rapists, pacifists, insurgents, cartoonists, conservatives, pianists, anarchists, florists, liberals, talk-show hosts, motorcyclists, nationalists, lawyers, communists and libertarians.

[Heng]

And while many probably won't like to hear this (on the other hand many people love the idea)... there's no reason to think that they won't be a lot like, and in many cases exactly like their parents. The apple, acorn, mango, kiwi, g-string, etc. doesn't fall far...

[scorecard]

I'm surprised at the optimism of the thread. I agree that the growing number of half Thai/half Western children is a very significant development with the potential to bring about real change in Thai society, but I'd say there are also very significant obstacles and that many individuals are going to have bad experiences. Thailand is a deeply hierarchical society, in which social contacts often count for more than merit. Unfortunately, irrespective of our income or professional standing, westerners don't rank very highly in that hierarchy as far as upper-class Thais are concerned, and aren't as well connected. My perception, which may be quite wrong, is that while luuk kreung do well in the entertainment industry, they hit a 'glass ceiling' in most other fields. Western parents struggle to work the system to gain an advantage for their offspring. I'm not talking about grades in a middle-ranking secondary school, but something like a good degree from Chula or a decent professional career track. I'd love to be wrong, but I have decided, albeit reluctantly, that my son is better off in school in the UK.

And the pearly gates surely don't all open up after graduating college, that's for sure. There are some, but there aren't nearly enough factories and businesses run by foreigners being handed down to the 'next generation' for there to be much 'luk krung' presence. Inheritance of property is another issue, since foreigners have to go through all of these hoops to own land, and many choose not to at all because of this. Cash holdings are often depleted by the time it's meant to be passed on to the next generation, so the 'luk krung' masses often are 'only' on square 2 (if not square 1) when they are getting their lives started.

On top of that, by generation 3 and 4... you're likely not going to be 'luk krung' anymore. Either you're going to be another 'group' entirely if you've moved abroad or you're going to be 'Thai' and reabsorbed into the system if your family is here.

Heng's view on this is accurate as far as my half Thai 32 year old daughter is concerned. She was educated in the US but has worked in and out of Thailand since the 90s. She now lives and works in Bangkok. When she has had struggles getting to where she wants to be professionally they have been Thai vs Chinese, not Thai vs half Thai.

Well I can share another example from when I worked here in an international management consultancy. The staff included: 1 look kreung (he looked more western than Thai,always well preesented, spoke Thai and English perfectly, his behaviors were 99% Thai, well educated, good work experience), me (Western, regional post, located in BAngkok for convenience)and the rest all 100% Thai including the senior staff.

Twice when we presented our team to the client, after we won the contracts, the look krueng member was rejected because of his appearance and nothing more.

But I think there's some other comparisons that need to be made. I can recall very well when large numbers of assisted migrants started to come to Australia, and the newcomers (Italian, Greek and more) were often nastily rejected by their local communities, at work, etc., and marriage across two cultures was absolutely unthinkable. After a few decades and slow integration, this attitude has pretty much died, thankfully.

[Kwasaki]

The problem is that the majority of luk krungs are half Thai Visa Poster and half Thai bargirl. Disadvantaged from both sides I'm afraid.

What world do you live in to come out with prejudiced bigoted drivel like this ? I'm guessing that a lot of it comes from where you live in Thailand. In Nonthaburi where I live relationships such as those you describe are non-existent because most of the foreigners here have jobs, work etc and DID NOT MARRY A PROSTITUTE !!

Sorry about my sense of humor, have a coffee and relax. you too Farang0000999

Just finished drinking my coffee with my wife in her little park cafe where l met her.

And please you one of the best wise ones here can you explain why people put 5555555 is it because they cannot go any further.

[farang000999]

Nothing stopping mixed children from opening their own business. There will always be some form of office politics to deal with.

[canuckamuck]

Just finished drinking my coffee with my wife in her little park cafe where l met her.

And please you one of the best wise ones here can you explain why people put 5555555 is it because they cannot go any further.

Well the word for 5 in Thai is ha, so 555 is hahaha. It is a local variant on lol.

Edited October 26, 2010 by canuckamuck

[Nawtier]

. For some reason it seems quite wrong to me.

Jacki Chan should not be acting in the US either right ? so wrong...

[IanForbes]

Just finished drinking my coffee with my wife in her little park cafe where l met her.

And please you one of the best wise ones here can you explain why people put 5555555 is it because they cannot go any further.

Well the word for 5 in Thai is ha, so 555 is hahaha. It is a local variant on lol.

Thanks for that. I always wondered what it meant. It now makes sense. I never did learn cyber-speak. Pictures and smilie ikons are my gig.

[travelmann]

I'm surprised at the optimism of the thread. I agree that the growing number of half Thai/half Western children is a very significant development with the potential to bring about real change in Thai society, but I'd say there are also very significant obstacles and that many individuals are going to have bad experiences. Thailand is a deeply hierarchical society, in which social contacts often count for more than merit. Unfortunately, irrespective of our income or professional standing, westerners don't rank very highly in that hierarchy as far as upper-class Thais are concerned, and aren't as well connected. My perception, which may be quite wrong, is that while luuk kreung do well in the entertainment industry, they hit a 'glass ceiling' in most other fields. Western parents struggle to work the system to gain an advantage for their offspring. I'm not talking about grades in a middle-ranking secondary school, but something like a good degree from Chula or a decent professional career track. I'd love to be wrong, but I have decided, albeit reluctantly, that my son is better off in school in the UK.

And the pearly gates surely don't all open up after graduating college, that's for sure. There are some, but there aren't nearly enough factories and businesses run by foreigners being handed down to the 'next generation' for there to be much 'luk krung' presence. Inheritance of property is another issue, since foreigners have to go through all of these hoops to own land, and many choose not to at all because of this. Cash holdings are often depleted by the time it's meant to be passed on to the next generation, so the 'luk krung' masses often are 'only' on square 2 (if not square 1) when they are getting their lives started.

On top of that, by generation 3 and 4... you're likely not going to be 'luk krung' anymore. Either you're going to be another 'group' entirely if you've moved abroad or you're going to be 'Thai' and reabsorbed into the system if your family is here.

Heng's view on this is accurate as far as my half Thai 32 year old daughter is concerned. She was educated in the US but has worked in and out of Thailand since the 90s. She now lives and works in Bangkok. When she has had struggles getting to where she wants to be professionally they have been Thai vs Chinese, not Thai vs half Thai.

Well I can share another example from when I worked here in an international management consultancy. The staff included: 1 look kreung (he looked more western than Thai,always well preesented, spoke Thai and English perfectly, his behaviors were 99% Thai, well educated, good work experience), me (Western, regional post, located in BAngkok for convenience)and the rest all 100% Thai including the senior staff.

Twice when we presented our team to the client, after we won the contracts, the look krueng member was rejected because of his appearance and nothing more.

But I think there's some other comparisons that need to be made. I can recall very well when large numbers of assisted migrants started to come to Australia, and the newcomers (Italian, Greek and more) were often nastily rejected by their local communities, at work, etc., and marriage across two cultures was absolutely unthinkable. After a few decades and slow integration, this attitude has pretty much died, thankfully.

Even thru to Aboriginal marriages to Foreigners?

[richard_smith237]

While I doubt that its possible for our children to be politicians etc with the right placement in society, schooling, Uni etc the success of our children is primarily down to the parents.

I doubt very much whether a BG's child (as a luk kreung) is likely to face a high-flying future, however that child's future may well be brighter simply due to the financial benefits a Westerner may bring.

That said: The Luk kreung child born of lady emanating from what may be termed by folk in Thailand as high society has all the advantages of 100% Thai children. I've seen this first hand (not with my children but friends of my wife who is the daughter of a US businessman and a Thai lady of higher socio-economic standing).

I suspect that unless the parents can be seen to behave poorly most folk in Thailand really have too many other things to concern themselves with....

[Kwasaki]

Just finished drinking my coffee with my wife in her little park cafe where l met her.

And please you one of the best wise ones here can you explain why people put 5555555 is it because they cannot go any further.

Well the word for 5 in Thai is ha, so 555 is hahaha. It is a local variant on lol.

So if Sam's wife did this l could say,

3 U 4 silly mia 9 just 6 the lear 7 for a 2 555

l think l could get into this cyber text talk.

[IanForbes]

Just finished drinking my coffee with my wife in her little park cafe where l met her.

And please you one of the best wise ones here can you explain why people put 5555555 is it because they cannot go any further.

Well the word for 5 in Thai is ha, so 555 is hahaha. It is a local variant on lol.

So if Sam's wife did this l could say,

3 U 4 silly mia 9 just 6 the lear 7 for a 2 555

l think l could get into this cyber text talk.

:lol: