Bangkok To Build Giant Tunnels To Prevent Flood

[webfact]

GIANT TUNNELS

Sukhumbhand announces ‘Giant Tunnels’ programme as enduring solution to flooding in Bangkok

By Narisa Chamunee

Four Giant Tunnels to be built in 5 years as part of ‘Bangkok Getting Ahead’ (Krungthep Gao-na) programme to bring enduring solutions to city’s big problems first Giant Tunnel opens Jan 2011

Giant Tunnels to more than double city’s entire current tunnel drainage capacity Giant Tunnels ‘big enough to run a ten-wheel truck through them’ include largest and longest drainage tunnel in Thailand

Bangkok, (11 November 2010) Bangkok Governor MR Sukhumbhand Paribatra, today, announced that the BMA is building a system of four ‘Giant Tunnels’ that will more than double the city’s entire current drainage capacity within five years, and include Thailand’s largest and longest drainage tunnel.

The ‘Giant Tunnels’ project is a part of Governor MR Sukhumbhand’s ‘Bangkok Getting Ahead’ (Krungthep Gao-na) programme, which aims to provide enduring solutions to the city’s recurrent problems.

“We need to stop wasting money on temporary solutions to flooding, with hundreds of thousands of sandbags and more pumps being purchased every year, and get to long-term fixes. In just the last three years we’ve spent 11,000 million baht on flood prevention measures which have still not brought an enduring solution to the city’s flooding problems.

“The Giant Tunnels programme provides a massive amount of additional drainage capacity. The amount of water that can pour through these four tunnels would allow you to drain four average-sized swimming pools in a single second,” said Governor MR Sukhumbhand.

According to MR Sukhumbhand, the system of four tunnels will increase the total length of installed drainage tunnels in Bangkok from 14 kilometres to around 50 kilometres.

“More importantly, they will be really big tunnels, with a diameter of five metres or more, which is around three times larger than the average diameter of existing tunnels, which are at about 1.8 metres. They’re so big that you could comfortably run a ten-wheel truck through them,” he said.

The system of ‘Giant Tunnels’ will increase the city’s tunnel drainage capacity from the current 95 cubic metres a second to 240 cubic metres a second.

MR Sukhumbhand said, “The Giant Tunnels programme will make a huge difference to Bangkok. They will not only help the areas where they are located, but will also help almost every other part of Bangkok, as well, by reducing the amount of water that is now overloading other drainage systems in the city.”

-- The Nation 2010-11-11

[spiderleghead]

and can they use the tunnels to store water to help solve some of the water shortage systems? or pumr the water back up country to help some of the farmers int he future?

[marquess]

and can they use the tunnels to store water to help solve some of the water shortage systems? or pumr the water back up country to help some of the farmers int he future?

Well lets hope that they are reading this!

[kurnell]

I have just asked my enginner mate, who has 20 years experience in projects in Bangkok if this is feasible. Let's see what he says!!

[supaprik]

sounds great, and when its not raining 10 wheel trucks can use it an express way or we can have another 30 klms of market space.wonder what the rental per metre will be?....wonderful guys

Edited November 11, 2010 by supaprik

[Spee]

and can they use the tunnels to store water to help solve some of the water shortage systems? or pumr the water back up country to help some of the farmers int he future?

Well lets hope that they are reading this!

Possibly I'm missing something, but what good are tunnels for a city that is essentially at or below sea level? For the amount of water they're talking about, the amount of energy held in the water would be tremendous. It would require massive pumps and/or very deep tunnels and probably a massive drainage canal around the city to reroute the kind of waters expected at flood time. Hopefully the authorities are doing their due diligence on similar plans, such as the Chicago Tunnel and Reservoir Plan, which has had its fair share of successes and failures over the last 100 years.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tunnel_and_Reservoir_Plan

[dumpling]

5 years will be 3 years to late, 2012 is coming man head for the hills!!!!!!!!!!

[apollo13]

Drain the water to where ? The Chao Prayah ? I've not noticed any news about this until today, are they going to build it first and do the feasibility study after ? Wouldn't it make more sense to create more reservoirs upstream from bangers ?

[thaihome]

and can they use the tunnels to store water to help solve some of the water shortage systems? or pumr the water back up country to help some of the farmers int he future?

Well lets hope that they are reading this!

Possibly I'm missing something, but what good are tunnels for a city that is essentially at or below sea level? For the amount of water they're talking about, the amount of energy held in the water would be tremendous. It would require massive pumps and/or very deep tunnels and probably a massive drainage canal around the city to reroute the kind of waters expected at flood time. Hopefully the authorities are doing their due diligence on similar plans, such as the Chicago Tunnel and Reservoir Plan, which has had its fair share of successes and failures over the last 100 years.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tunnel_and_Reservoir_Plan

The BMA has lots of tunnel experience. Besides a number of smaller tunnels, the BMA has a 4.6 meter diameter tunnel from Makkasan to the Chao Phraya River. You can see one of the intake stations at the Ploenchit offramp near Rama IV.

TH

[LaoPo]

Possibly I'm missing something, but what good are tunnels for a city that is essentially at or below sea level? For the amount of water they're talking about, the amount of energy held in the water would be tremendous. It would require massive pumps and/or very deep tunnels and probably a massive drainage canal around the city to reroute the kind of waters expected at flood time.

Exactly my thoughts also.

And........

".....first Giant Tunnel opens Jan 2011" ... in 8 - 12 weeks from now?

I'm afraid BKK (and Thailand) will never be able to finally solve their floodings' and droughts' problems...MAJOR problems, since they have not been able to create a serious financial buffer to install the implementation of start building on the final solution which will take, at least, a few decades.

To create such a financial buffer you need to work in cooperation with people who have the expertise in living in a country below sea level: The Netherlands and their water management experts.

Amsterdam Airport is 4,5 to 5 meters BELOW sea level and even if a nearby dike would break the complete airport will be under 4 meters of water; a major and serious disaster!

Bangkok's most serious problem lies in the rare event of a huge storm in combination with a so called Spring Tide* during full moon, with serious floodings from up country bringing down enormous amounts of river- and rain waters via the Chao Phraya river.

The city plus airport and it's wide surroundings will be totally flooded and every single household, traffic, electricity..everything will come to a total standstill for many weeks or even months.

The damage will be so huge that it's impossible to calculate how much but the outcome of "Katrina" is a kind of lead although the water powers with Katrina came from only one side...the ocean.

But in BKK's case the water will come from 2 sides: the Gulf and Up north...

Not a pretty future sight but it WILL happen, one day; the question is: WHEN?

* http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_Sea_flood_of_1953

LaoPo

[gemini81]

Drain the water to where ? The Chao Prayah ? I've not noticed any news about this until today, are they going to build it first and do the feasibility study after ? Wouldn't it make more sense to create more reservoirs upstream from bangers ?

thats exactly what I wondered. I hope they are open enough to the input of other countries who have created some great solutions to some of their problems.

[sibeymai]

Thailand: the drainage hub of Asia.

Bangkok: going down the drain.

[phiphidon]

They're going to need a lot of cement for that job! Anybody think of any firms that could help? TPI Polene maybe?

[Spee]

Possibly I'm missing something, but what good are tunnels for a city that is essentially at or below sea level? For the amount of water they're talking about, the amount of energy held in the water would be tremendous. It would require massive pumps and/or very deep tunnels and probably a massive drainage canal around the city to reroute the kind of waters expected at flood time. Hopefully the authorities are doing their due diligence on similar plans, such as the Chicago Tunnel and Reservoir Plan, which has had its fair share of successes and failures over the last 100 years.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tunnel_and_Reservoir_Plan

The BMA has lots of tunnel experience. Besides a number of smaller tunnels, the BMA has a 4.6 meter diameter tunnel from Makkasan to the Chao Phraya River. You can see one of the intake stations at the Ploenchit offramp near Rama IV.

TH

Not suggesting it's not do-able, but just dumping to the C-P isn't the answer. The water has to go somewhere: reservoir, canal, etc. As others have suggested, the solution has to take into account 100-year scenarios: high tide, rainy season, etc.

As with 3G, rail system and other basic infrastructure functions, the worst thing is to do nothing. On the flip side, it is also possible to make things worse, such as put now-dry areas under water, make problems up-country, damage valuable fish & shrimp farming areas, and so on.

[astral]

Possibly I'm missing something, but what good are tunnels for a city that is essentially at or below sea level?

London, which is also pretty close to sealevel has its Underground (MRT) system which is only tunnels.

Mind you, given the size quoted it is going to take some pretty impressive pumping

power to keep the water flowing, and prevent it coming back in again, once it reaches the sea.

[Tokay]

And what happens when these flood because corners are cut and money is pocketed?

[Tokay]

And where will it take the water?

Porn's house, or into another drain system that doesn't work?

[bhoydy]

The solution is not to make more tunnels under an already crippling weight load, which will then flow into the already high level Chao Praya, which will in turn flood directly onto the streets along the banks of the river. The solution is.....i've no idea, i'm not an engineer but good luck anyway.

[TimTang]

WOW what a GREAT IDEA!

So if I just invest in some scuba gear and take a few lessons I can save a fortune in VISA expenses.

Just out of curiosity, How much air would it take to swim to Cambodia?

[mrgreg]

The Nation could have mentionned the location of these 36 kms of tunnels and provide a map to help us understand the idea behind this project...

Seems that it could be a solution for protecting Bangkok from flooding due to heavy rains but that won't protect the city from flooding due to sea level rising...

[yellow1red1]

Drain the water to where ? The Chao Prayah ? I've not noticed any news about this until today, are they going to build it first and do the feasibility study after ? Wouldn't it make more sense to create more reservoirs upstream from bangers ?

This what i always wondered. Divert flood waters in rainy season and ADD irrigation resovoirs for dry season. maybe not enough land available for these huge, seasonal lakes?,

If long section of major roads sat on top of large tunnels, no extra land would be needed, evaporation would be stopped to keep the water for use in dry season.

All dykes could be tunnels for this, too. and made with residences and offices on top, instead of kicking people out to build lunking dykes.

why waste prime waterfront real estate on a single purpose use, when resovoirs and buildings could be incorporated?

if every dyke was a hollow tunnel filled with water for dry season and emptied before the rains came, they would be 1000% more efective.

[Spee]

Possibly I'm missing something, but what good are tunnels for a city that is essentially at or below sea level?

London, which is also pretty close to sealevel has its Underground (MRT) system which is only tunnels.

True, but those tunnels are designed to keep the water out, which is far easier than designing and implementing a flood control system covering thousands of sqkm.

[xen]

Just a question - did Bangkok ever flood before they filled in most of the klongs to make roads and where did the klongs drain to?

I know some circumstances have changed and influence major flooding is caused by deforestration and major development along with changed weather patterns etc , but did the authorities make things worse by filling the klongs in ?

[webfact]

CAPITAL

Giant tunnels to ease Bangkok flood risk

By Jeerawan Prasomsap

The Nation

Bangkok Governor MR Sukhumbhand Paripatra yesterday unveiled a fiveyear plan to invest Bt16 billion to build four giant drainage tunnels to tackle the city’s flood problems.

“They will be like underground highways for floodwater to reach the Chao Phraya River and the sea with the speed of draining four standardsize swimming pools in one second,” said Sukhumbhand.

As Bangkok is located in a bowlshaped area facing the northern runoff of water flowing to the Gulf of Thailand, it is often flooded due to clogged drainage systems.

The city decided to build the four giant tunnels to increase their flood draining capacity from 90 cubic metres per second to 240 cubic metres.

With these four tunnels added to the existing system, the city will drain floodwater faster than it has in the past 25 years especially from repeatedlyflooded areas such as Srinakarin and Ramkhamhaeng 2 roads, Sukhumbhand said.

He also affirmed there was no need for land expropriation as the tunnels, each of about fivemetre radius, would be built deep underground.

First, the 5kilometrelong Rama IXRamkhamhaeng tunnel will cost Bt2 billion and should be completed by next January. It will help drain water at 60 cubic meters per second from Klong Lat Phrao and Klong Saen Saeb to the Chao Phraya River. This tunnel was formerly known as Klong San SaebLat Phrao tunnel and work began in 2001. It was the centre of corruption allegations in July 2008 with a Japanese firm ‘s claim it had paid Thai officials Bt125 million for “favours” in connection with the contract.

The second, third and fourth tunnels are due for completion in five years.

The second, the Bt2.5 billion RatchadapisekSutthisan tunnel, will be subject of an eauction next month and work should begin next year. This 6km tunnel, starting from Ratchadapisek and Sutthisan roads to the Chao Phraya River, will drain water from Huai Kwang, Din Daeng, Chatuchak, Phrayathai, Dusit and Bang Sue areas.

Third, the 6metreradius 13.5km Don Muang tunnel will drain from Chatuchak, Lak Si, Bang Khen, Don Muang and some parts of Sai Mai with a capacity 15 times greater than Bangkok’s first drainage tunnel in Sukhumvit, built 25 years ago.

Fourth, the 9.5km Bt4.9 billion Suan Luang Rama IX tunnel (Nong Beaung BonChao Phraya) is in the process of getting Interior Ministry approval, as it is an adjusted version of the previous 3km Nong Beaung BonKlong Prawet tunnel. It would drain water from Prawet, Phra Khanong, Bang Na and Suan Luang at 60cm per second.

-- The Nation 2010-11-12

[whybother]

As Bangkok is located in a bowlshaped area facing the northern runoff of water flowing to the Gulf of Thailand, it is often flooded due to clogged drainage systems.

Maybe they could spend some money on unclogging the existing drainage systems, and teaching people not to sweep their rubbish into them.

[rakman]

The Nation could have mentionned the location of these 36 kms of tunnels and provide a map to help us understand the idea behind this project...

Seems that it could be a solution for protecting Bangkok from flooding due to heavy rains but that won't protect the city from flooding due to sea level rising...

While it's true (I think) Bangkok is sinking, here is a stunning interview with a real sea level expert. None of the IPCC "scientists" (they have an agenda, like IPCC chair Pachauri and his "research center") are experienced in sea level study.

http://www.climatechangefacts.info/ClimateChangeDocuments/NilsAxelMornerinterview.pdf

Basically, there is no sea level rise. As this interview points out, there are many (tens, hundreds, thousands of ) billions of dollars (pic your currency, pounds, euros, dollars) that can be scammed from the western world.

How many IPCC "facts" have been shown to be wrong?

It all about money and making Governents bigger.

[Guest]

The Bangkok Post published a map showing the tunnel loctiobs. If its correct, these tunnels will drain into the river close to the city center (in different locations). My question then would be, in light of recent runoffs and high tides which caused some riverside flooding, how would these tunnels help in a similar situation?

[apetley]

Look at the size of the Chao Praya river and the ammount of water that flows in that during the rainy season.

Now compare that with the size of 4 6m wide pipes.

The difference in flow capacity is immense.

If it makes even the slightest difference I'll eat my head.

[rakman]

Possibly I'm missing something, but what good are tunnels for a city that is essentially at or below sea level?

London, which is also pretty close to sealevel has its Underground (MRT) system which is only tunnels.

True, but those tunnels are designed to keep the water out, which is far easier than designing and implementing a flood control system covering thousands of sqkm.

I'd enjoy the television show with a few TBM's (Tunnel Boring Machines) scurrying under BKK. Several cities have done this idea. One of the recurring costs are running the pumps to pull the water up to dump in to the river during lower water levels.

California has farmland that is rented (risk is taken) in the San Joaquin delta to be used for flood water storage. If you have crops, opps, they are flooded, but the farmland is cheap to rent. The added benefit is the land gets rejuvenated by the silt in the water. The area isn't used too often for flooding so the farmers have many good years of crops.

The problem is, so much drainage area and so much is near sea level.

[whybother]

While it's true (I think) Bangkok is sinking, here is a stunning interview with a real sea level expert. None of the IPCC "scientists" (they have an agenda, like IPCC chair Pachauri and his "research center") are experienced in sea level study.

http://www.climatech...erinterview.pdf

Basically, there is no sea level rise. As this interview points out, there are many (tens, hundreds, thousands of ) billions of dollars (pic your currency, pounds, euros, dollars) that can be scammed from the western world.

How many IPCC "facts" have been shown to be wrong?

It all about money and making Governents bigger.

This guy is the best. Even he thinks so.

Mörner: I am a sea-level specialist. There are many good sea-level people in the world, but let’s put it this way: There’s no one who’s beaten me.