Thai Democrat Party Accuses Thaksin Of Making Misleading Comments

[GeorgeO]

Beware of any country, political party or organization of political party with the name: Democratic in it. They seldom are...

But the DP is right of course. thailand does have freedom of speech, that is why hundreds of people are arrested on computer crimes acts, or lese majesty charges. There are no political prisoners, that is why the government under the leadership of the DP have blocked websites as Politicial Prisoners Thailand and everything is great in the country.

That is of course when you are rich, vote DP and kiss up with generals. The same generals that interfere in soldier;s family lives by intruding and infringing on their privacy. Their phone calls and internet are monitored even when they are not under suspicion of a crime. In a matter of fact in Burma there is more freedom for soldiers.

At least under Thaksin we could write about it on the internet or comment on it on community radios. No such freedom anymore in the Kingdom of Thailand, soon to be renamed Democratic People's Kingdom of Thailand or something like that.

Mythbuster,

I am staggered by the spin that you manage to put on the various issues.

1. Having spent time in Myanmar, I can tell you that the only reason the soldiers appear to be less oppressed there is that they are totally ruled by fear. Anyone deviating from the junta line is well aware of the consequences.

2. As (as opposed to in) a matter of fact, reliable Internet access is non-existent, so posting any comments is quite an arduous task.

3. Freedom of speech is something enjoyed by those who do not use it to commit acts of defamation.

4. If you preferred things under Thaksin, then we must assume that you are willing to turn a blind eye to extra-judicial killings!

And finally, as for lese majeste (as opposed to lese majesty), I would suggest that you take a little more care in suggesting that His Majesty's Kingdom is soon to become a Republic. That to me, would appear to be the pinnacle of lese majeste!

[animatic]

Propaganda should never go unchallenged.

Besides we'd still have to read it when it's quoted by someone.

So the sole appropriate response is to refute propaganda

with a reality check.

[Thaddeus]

^ Give Jatuporn a couple of days. He's busy preparing the audiotape now that will attest to that.

Money makes the world go around doesn't it SJ, but a good healthy dose of cynicism takes the spin off it

[lungmi]

Propaganda should never go unchallenged.

Besides we'd still have to read it when it's quoted by someone.

So the sole appropriate response is to refute propaganda

with a reality check.

Propaganda in different ways is big business worldwide. Not easy to see what is what, honest people cannot give up, for their own well-being.

[lungmi]

Propaganda should never go unchallenged.

Besides we'd still have to read it when it's quoted by someone.

So the sole appropriate response is to refute propaganda

with a reality check.

Propaganda in different ways is big business worldwide. Not easy to see what is what, honest people cannot give up, for their own well-being.

[yellow1red1]

Propaganda should never go unchallenged.

Besides we'd still have to read it when it's quoted by someone.

So the sole appropriate response is to refute propaganda

with a reality check.

challenge the red propoganda? or

challenge the yellow propoganda?

one is allowed the other isn't

(try to guess which)

[whybother]

Propaganda should never go unchallenged.

Besides we'd still have to read it when it's quoted by someone.

So the sole appropriate response is to refute propaganda

with a reality check.

challenge the red propoganda? or

challenge the yellow propoganda?

one is allowed the other isn't

(try to guess which)

ANY propaganda should go unchallenged.

[Piengrudee]

Thaskin has no right to make any public comment. He is a fugitive. . . . My theory, although I hope that I am wrong, is that ASSK is likely to be murder with a single sniper shot at her head, just like Seh Deang. Then the junta will just keep delaying and delaying the autopsy report, a tactic that is learn from her neighbor Thailand. The junta cannot murder her will she is under arrest, as it will be too suspicious. Such murder tactic work in the past. History repeat itself? Remember Pakistan, Philippines, Gandhi, etc?

[animatic]

Thaskin has no right to make any public comment. He is a fugitive. . . . My theory, although I hope that I am wrong, is that ASSK is likely to be murder with a single sniper shot at her head, just like Seh Deang. Then the junta will just keep delaying and delaying the autopsy report, a tactic that is learn from her neighbor Thailand. The junta cannot murder her will she is under arrest, as it will be too suspicious. Such murder tactic work in the past. History repeat itself? Remember Pakistan, Philippines, Gandhi, etc?

That would cause an explosion even that junta are not prepared for.

That is why it was never done before. Too dangerous.

She is safer, for them, as a marginalized icon, than a martyr for a national cause, that would inspire others to die for it.

'Having the right' to do something, never has appeared of much concern to that Kuhn T.

Edited November 16, 2010 by animatic

[ianbaggie]

Beware of any country, political party or organization of political party with the name: Democratic in it. They seldom are...

But the DP is right of course. thailand does have freedom of speech, that is why hundreds of people are arrested on computer crimes acts, or lese majesty charges. There are no political prisoners, that is why the government under the leadership of the DP have blocked websites as Politicial Prisoners Thailand and everything is great in the country.

That is of course when you are rich, vote DP and kiss up with generals. The same generals that interfere in soldier;s family lives by intruding and infringing on their privacy. Their phone calls and internet are monitored even when they are not under suspicion of a crime. In a matter of fact in Burma there is more freedom for soldiers.

At least under Thaksin we could write about it on the internet or comment on it on community radios. No such freedom anymore in the Kingdom of Thailand, soon to be renamed Democratic People's Kingdom of Thailand or something like that.

Thats right!!!!he promoted democracy when he was Prime Minister - thats why he killed 2500 in his so called "drug war" comitted countless acts of embezlement, fraud and corruption and then went on the run only to become a terrorist in every sense of the word!!

What a GOOD MAN Shinawatra is!!!! Get him back QUICK!!!

[SomTumTiger]

Thats right!!!!he promoted democracy when he was Prime Minister - thats why he killed 2500 in his so called "drug war" comitted countless acts of embezlement, fraud and corruption and then went on the run only to become a terrorist in every sense of the word!!

What a GOOD MAN Shinawatra is!!!! Get him back QUICK!!!

Ian - I can't read this because your font isn't big enough....

[SergeiY]

So what do the democrats when dealing with Burma? Isn't Abhist best friends with the generals over there?

Didn't one of the Democrats suggest that Aung San Suu Kyi is on Thaksins payroll after she made a comment about the coup in Thailand

[Insight]

Isn't Abhist best friends with the generals over there?

He is....?

[whybother]

So what do the democrats when dealing with Burma? Isn't Abhist best friends with the generals over there?

Didn't one of the Democrats suggest that Aung San Suu Kyi is on Thaksins payroll after she made a comment about the coup in Thailand

Didn't someone just make some things up?

[SergeiY]

So what do the democrats when dealing with Burma? Isn't Abhist best friends with the generals over there?

Didn't one of the Democrats suggest that Aung San Suu Kyi is on Thaksins payroll after she made a comment about the coup in Thailand

Didn't someone just make some things up?

Okay, i found only a reference that mentioned only one of the senators who accused ASSK of being on Thaksins payroll after she made some comments about Thailand and the military rule.

http://www.dvb.no/news/suu-kyi-wades-into-thailand-crisis/8738

"Burma opposition leader Aung San Suu Kyi has drawn the ire of Thai politicians after claiming that the country’s instability resulted from a constitution that was drawn up by the military.

She reportedly told lawyer Nyan Win that Burma “need not look very far” to see that “a new government coming to power under a constitution drawn up by the military will never be stable,” according to AFP.

“We just see Thailand. [Former prime minister] Thaksin was an elected person. The military seized the power from an elected person. The constitution was drawn up by the military.”

“After that, what happened with the first [government]? It was not stable,” she said of the short-lived administration that followed the coup. “This was a result of the constitution being written by the military.”

...

Suu Kyi’s comments have angered the upper echelons of the Thai government, whose grip on power is now looking tenuous.

Thai news agency Matichon quoted a Thai senator as saying that he was “so very disappointed” with the comments “because Mrs Aung San Suu Kyi should understand Thailand better”.

He also reportedly demanded that an “audit of the financial path” to Suu Kyi be made public to see whether she had “received support from anyone,” likely a reference to Thaksin.

Thai government spokesperson Panitan Wattan added that Thailand has had a “democratic system for a long time when other countries have never been democratic”, despite Thailand suffering 18 coups since 1930.

Anyway, because you have a limited knowledge and put all your focus only on Thaksin and be blind for the other side - Don't assume that I make things up. Its real. And about the relations of the current government with the generals in Burma you can educate yourself. (but if will try to help you out and post some information later)

[SergeiY]

Isn't Abhist best friends with the generals over there?

He is....?

Yes, somehow he is and they like him too.

Gen Thein Sein: Myanmar won't allow Thailand's foe to use its soil

HUA HIN, Oct 24 (TNA) -- Myanmar Prime Minister Gen Thein Sein has told his Thai counterpart Abhisit Vejjajiva that his country would not allow anyone opposing Thailand to use its soil as a springboard to attack the kingdom.

Gen Thein Sein, who is now attending the 15th Association of Southeast Asian Nations (ASEAN) summit being held in the Thai resorts of Hua Hin and Cha-am, reportedly told Mr Abhisit on the sidelines of the summit Friday that Myanmar upheld the principle of living in harmony and that it would not allow anyone opposing Thailand wishing to use his country as springboard in attacking this country.

Expressing his confidence that Southeast Asian countries, including Thailand, could sail through obstacles and negative challenges, Gen Thein Sein told Mr Abhisit that both Myanmar and Thailand share a long border and both countries have to depend with each other and good neighbourliness is, therefore, significant.

Gen Thein Sein's remarks were made after Mr Abhisit and Cambodian Prime Minister Hun Sen traded words after the Khmer leader reasserted Friday on arriving for the ASEAN summit that his government would reject any Thai request to extradite former Thai prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra if the self-exiled ex-premier accepts an invitation for refuge in Cambodia.

Mr Hun Sen told journalists to read the extradition treaty thoroughly to understand why the former Thai premier, whom he described as his friend, can stay in Cambodia as a guest of the Cambodian government.

Ousted in a bloodless coup in September 2006, Mr Thaksin jumped bail and fled sentencing to a two-year jail term for malfeasance in the controversial Bangkok's Ratchadapisek land purchase case.

The toppled Thai premier now spends most of his time in the United Arab Emirates after his status as a visitor was rejected by a number of countries including both the United Kingdom and Germany.

Thanking Myanmar for its support given to Thailand as chairman of ASEAN, Mr Abhisit told Gen Thein Sein that his government supports Japan's financial assistance bestowed to Myanmar on various projects, including developing hospitals and schools.

Mr Abhisit said his government, as a close neighbour to Myanmar and host of ASEAN, had told every country to strengthen ties with Myanmar and had requested the Myanmar government leader to "unofficially report" on progress on development projects in his country during the ASEAN summit on Saturday.

Wishing Myanmar to successfully hold its general election next year, Mr Abhisit also told Gen Thein Sein that he hopes to officially visit Myanmar when he has the opportunity and to also meet Myanmar's opposition leader Aung San Suu Kyi to boost democracy for the world community.

The leaders of ASEAN's 10 member countries--Brunei, Cambodia, Indonesia, Laos, Malaysia, Myanmar, the Philippines, Singapore, Thailand and Vietnam-- are holding their three-day summit in the Thai resorts with their six dialogue partners--China, South Korea, Japan, India, Australia and New Zealand.

The summit ends Sunday. (TNA)

<img src=http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/pics/tnalogo.jpg target="_blank">

-- TNA 2009/10/24

Abhisit was also there last month paid a visit to the Generals and made (again a pretty 'soft') statement about the 'elections'

Thai PM Abhisit hails Myanmar visit

BANGKOK, Oct 12 - Thai Prime Minister Abhisit Vejjajiva on Tuesday described his one-day visit to Myanmar on Monday as positive for overall relations which would further strengthen the two countries' bilateral ties and cooperation particularly in terms of trade and investment.

During his short stay in Nay Pyi Taw, Mr Abhisit met with his Myanmar counterpart Gen Thein Sein and discussed enhancing and consolidating the two countries' bilateral friendship, promoting bilateral cooperation for the development of both countries' border areas, tackling drug trafficking as well as boosting trade and investment, promoting the tourism sector, building a deep-sea port in Dawei, and the issue of Myanmar workers in Thailand.

...

Regarding Myanmar's general election on Nov 7 which will be the military-ruled country’s first election in 20 years, Mr Abhisit said the Myanmar leader said his country was aware of international concerns but stood firm that it could handle its internal affairs without outside intervention.

The Thai prime minister also made a courtesy call on Senior General Than Shwe, Chairman of the State Peace and Development Council (SPDC).

http://www.mcot.net/cfcustom/cache_page/113925.html

Now we could smear mud on Abhisit too or just accept that this the way of diplomatic dealings between the two neighbour countries here in Asia. And as PM of Thailand- Abhisit does a job that is not much different from the style how Thaksin has done the deal with Myanmar during his times.

[Buchholz]

Didn't one of the Democrats suggest that Aung San Suu Kyi is on Thaksins payroll after she made a comment about the coup in Thailand

Didn't someone just make some things up?

Okay, i found only a reference that mentioned only one of the senators

Don't assume that I make things up. Its real.

What's real is that a non-Democrat made the statement.

[Buchholz]

Isn't Abhist best friends with the generals over there?

He is....?

Yes

Is this another one of your "real" statements?

He is "best friends" based on a requisite handshake photo op and a few obligatory comments at an ASEAN regional conference? Is that what constitutes "best friends"?

Are you one of those guys that has 132,000 friends on Facebook?

[SergeiY]

Isn't Abhist best friends with the generals over there?

He is....?

Yes

Is this another one of your "real" statements?

He is "best friends" based on a requisite handshake photo op and a few obligatory comments at an ASEAN regional conference? Is that what constitutes "best friends"?

Are you one of those guys that has 132,000 friends on Facebook?

Yawn.

i repeat myself:

Now we could smear mud on Abhisit too or just accept that this the way of diplomatic dealings between the two neighbour countries here in Asia. And as PM of Thailand- Abhisit does a job that is not much different from the style how Thaksin has done the deal with Myanmar during his times.

So up to you, feel free to post more old news about PM Thaksin & The Burmese Generals and pretend it were anyhow different.

Stay one-sided, biased, narrow minded and very selective and blind to everything else. If you think it helps you - just do it.

[Buchholz]

Isn't Abhist best friends with the generals over there?

Is this another one of your "real" statements?

He is "best friends" based on a requisite handshake photo op and a few obligatory comments at an ASEAN regional conference? Is that what constitutes "best friends"?

Are you one of those guys that has 132,000 friends on Facebook?

Abhisit does a job that is not much different from the style how Thaksin has done the deal with Myanmar during his times.

I disagree on that. Abhisit didn't push through a corrupt multi-billion baht deal with the Burmese to benefit his own personal company.

He also never said that the continued confinement of Suu Kyi was “reasonable."

Edited November 16, 2010 by Buchholz

[MaiChai]

First time I have heard of Taksin making a statement on this. Obviously his statements hit mainstream international news!

[plachon]

Fugitive and former Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra recently issued a statement, congratulating Myanmar's Aung San Suu Kyi on her freedom after spending 15 of the last 21 years in detention.

The statement also said that the Burmese junta made the right decision

and he sent a completely different signal earlier....

Thaksin Accepts Reasons for Detaining Suu Kyi

The Irrawaddy - December 13, 2004

Thai Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra says he understands why the Burmese government continues to hold opposition leader Aung San Suu Kyi under house arrest.

Speaking in his weekly radio address, Thaksin said he found the reasons given by the Rangoon government for Suu Kyi’s continued detention “reasonable enough and convincing.”

Thaksin raised the issue of Suu Ky’s detention when he met the Burmese leader Sr-Gen Than Shwe during the Buddhist conference in Rangoon last week. He said Than Shwe had told him Suu Kyi remained under house arrest “because the last three times that (she) has been released it would always lead to difficulties.”

Thaksin, speaking on Thai radio following his return from Burma, noted that “there was always political violence and turmoil following (the) two or three previous releases of Aung San Suu Kyi.”

Thaksin also said he thought it “necessary for Myanmar’s government to have political stability

I have commented elsewhere on this.The comments made by Thaksin in 2004, sickening though they are, (his latest comments are just sanctimonious) are not untypical views of key elements in the Thai establishment - ruling politicians, feudalists,aristocrats, senior military and corporate.A key strand is that Aung San Suu Kyi is not really Burmese at all (i.e doesn't understand Burmese culture) and that democracy is in any case a chimera.Politicians are corrupt and only the army can provide integrity and security.Essentially for these delightful people Burma provided a vision of Thailand as they would dream of - a thuggish, Buddhist, army dominated totalitarian state (sustained by a fairytale), where the people knew their place (and those who objected were cut down violently).

And Thaksin, during his 5 year reign of terror, took Thailand nearly into that vision - thuggish (War on Drugs and Southern War on Terror), Buddhist (what's that got to do with it?), army (Chaisit's clique only, mind you) and police dominated totalitarian state (sustained by one megalomaniac's dream), where the people knew their place (in TRT or forget any budget coming your way) and those who objected were cut down violently (from Tak Bai to Mae Sai). Congratulations JayBoy for spotting the similarities.

[jayboy]

And Thaksin, during his 5 year reign of terror, took Thailand nearly into that vision - thuggish (War on Drugs and Southern War on Terror), Buddhist (what's that got to do with it?), army (Chaisit's clique only, mind you) and police dominated totalitarian state (sustained by one megalomaniac's dream), where the people knew their place (in TRT or forget any budget coming your way) and those who objected were cut down violently (from Tak Bai to Mae Sai). Congratulations JayBoy for spotting the similarities.

I pointed out rather clearly in my post that Thaksin certainly was representative of a certain way of very negative thinking about Burma among the ruling elite in Thailand.Your rather strained "reign of terror" spiel is I suppose a fair debating tactic but that's all it is.It doesn't really ring completely true and will not convince any sophisticated or knowledgeable member..Fortunately Thailand is not a totalitarian state (we shouldn't overlook the admirable sheer cussedness on both red and yellow sides for example), or anything like it, whether under Thaksin or Abhisit.

On the question of how the Burma issue among the Thailand feudal class all that is necessary to know is who said what and when.

Or we can all argue like silly schoolgirls and say that all that poison was wrapped up in one person, now an exile.Useful perhaps but actually deeply stupid and unhelpful when trying to understand how to deal with Thailand's problems

[ianbaggie]

Beware of any country, political party or organization of political party with the name: Democratic in it. They seldom are...

But the DP is right of course. thailand does have freedom of speech, that is why hundreds of people are arrested on computer crimes acts, or lese majesty charges. There are no political prisoners, that is why the government under the leadership of the DP have blocked websites as Politicial Prisoners Thailand and everything is great in the country.

That is of course when you are rich, vote DP and kiss up with generals. The same generals that interfere in soldier;s family lives by intruding and infringing on their privacy. Their phone calls and internet are monitored even when they are not under suspicion of a crime. In a matter of fact in Burma there is more freedom for soldiers.

At least under Thaksin we could write about it on the internet or comment on it on community radios. No such freedom anymore in the Kingdom of Thailand, soon to be renamed Democratic People's Kingdom of Thailand or something like that.

Does that include being wary of the "United Front for DEMOCRACY against dictatorship - or is DEMOCRACY not the same as DEMOCRATIC!!??? The number of people convicted of computer crimes is more higher - without it Gary Glitter would still be the "leader of the gang" - you make an invalid post i think!!

[ianbaggie]

Thats right!!!!he promoted democracy when he was Prime Minister - thats why he killed 2500 in his so called "drug war" comitted countless acts of embezlement, fraud and corruption and then went on the run only to become a terrorist in every sense of the word!!

What a GOOD MAN Shinawatra is!!!! Get him back QUICK!!!

Ian - I can't read this because your font isn't big enough....

Far as I can see its the same size as yours - whats your point??

[Thaddeus]

Thats right!!!!he promoted democracy when he was Prime Minister - thats why he killed 2500 in his so called "drug war" comitted countless acts of embezlement, fraud and corruption and then went on the run only to become a terrorist in every sense of the word!!

What a GOOD MAN Shinawatra is!!!! Get him back QUICK!!!

Ian - I can't read this because your font isn't big enough....

Far as I can see its the same size as yours - whats your point??

You made a 'shut up' post in another thread using a very large font, don't you remember?

[jdinasia]

I disagree on that. Abhisit didn't push through a corrupt multi-billion baht deal with the Burmese to benefit his own personal company.

He also never said that the continued confinement of Suu Kyi was “reasonable."

Yeppers,

That a PM of an ASEAN country must have dealings with the Junta in Myanmar is obvious. That does not in any way excuse the personal/business dealings that Thaksin had with the Junta.

[jayboy]

As PM he is held to a higher standard of behaviour than an average investor etc ...

I'm afraid we aren't talking about average investors as my post made clear.I would rather not elaborate further on this.

But you're right Abhisit is not a businessman.But he has strongly promoted Thai investment in Burma, notably in the appalling and outdated infrastructure.I'm not saying he's not right to do so, and from early indications Suu Kyi seems to be modifying her line on inward investment.In terms of moral support to the unpleasant regime however Abhisit stands in the direct line of successive Thai administrations, essentially couldn't care less about the junta's repression.

The trouble is in your eagerness to put Thaksin centre stage of every Thai moral weakness, crime and brutality you end up tying yourself in knots.It just doesn't make sense.

[cdnvic]

Two posts removed for references to Royal Family finances.

[jdinasia]

As PM he is held to a higher standard of behaviour than an average investor etc ...

I'm afraid we aren't talking about average investors as my post made clear.I would rather not elaborate further on this.

But you're right Abhisit is not a businessman.But he has strongly promoted Thai investment in Burma, notably in the appalling and outdated infrastructure.I'm not saying he's not right to do so, and from early indications Suu Kyi seems to be modifying her line on inward investment.In terms of moral support to the unpleasant regime however Abhisit stands in the direct line of successive Thai administrations, essentially couldn't care less about the junta's repression.

The trouble is in your eagerness to put Thaksin centre stage of every Thai moral weakness, crime and brutality you end up tying yourself in knots.It just doesn't make sense.

Thaksin's PERSONAL business dealings ---- (at Thai expense) versus Abhisit's need to deal with the de facto government of an ASEAN nation just aren't on the same playing field.