Karon Roadblock Today

[NamKangMan]

I own some classic Honda 70s & 90s.

All of them are completely legal with green books and tax disks. All except one.

There are quite a few of these bikes on the island and I would say 95% of them are owned by Thais and 90% of those have no book and no tax.

I chat a lot with these Thai owners and always ask if they have problems with the BiB when stopped.

Every one of them said that because they are old and not having a book, thus no tax disk, the BiB understand and let them pass at the road-blocks as long as the rider has a license and is wearing a helmet.

Foolishly, I thought the same would apply to me.

I was riding the Honda 70 that had no book and was stopped by the BiB at Chalong circle.

This cop pointed out that I had no tax and that I would have to take the bike to the police station and it would stay there until I produced the green book.

I explained to him that I didn't have a green book, but, I had tried to get one, but, it was impossible.

He told me that my bike would sit and rot in the police compound unless I paid him 1500 Bt on the spot.

Yes, I was breaking the law (yet, Thais seem to get away with it), but, so was he by taking a bribe.

Now I can't ride that bike anymore and am slowly having to cannabalize it for parts, which is a real shame.

From me, the BiB get the respect they deserve.

Now that is to me valuable first hand information, and to me the first account of BIN bribery on Phuket.

"AND TO ME THE FIRST ACCOUNT OF BIB BRIBERY ON PHUKET" :) :)

You need to get out more.

What do you call all the monthly payments for "tea money????" Ohhhh, sorry, because I don't own a bar and it's never happened to me, it doesn't exist. Never mind I have been sitting in a bar and seen it with my own eyes and questioned the owner about it and then went on to ask other bar owners about it who all said they pay. Ahhhh, ignorance can be bliss. :) :)

[stevenl]

"AND TO ME THE FIRST ACCOUNT OF BIB BRIBERY ON PHUKET" :) :)

You need to get out more.

What do you call all the monthly payments for "tea money????" Ohhhh, sorry, because I don't own a bar and it's never happened to me, it doesn't exist. Never mind I have been sitting in a bar and seen it with my own eyes and questioned the owner about it and then went on to ask other bar owners about it who all said they pay. Ahhhh, ignorance can be bliss. :) :)

Those barowners make the choice not to abide by the law, and pay a price for that. Abide by the law here and don't pay any teamoney, like we do.

You are right though, come to think about it, I know some other examples of bribery as well, divecenters driving cars with guests with white and blue plates e.g.

Edited November 17, 2010 by stevenl

[NamKangMan]

Those barowners make the choice not to abide by the law, and pay a price for that. Abide by the law here and don't pay any teamoney, like we do.

You are right though, come to think about it, I know some other examples of bribery as well, divecenters driving cars with guests with white and blue plates e.g.

Most bar owners would agree that if you don't pay, you will certain get a lot of unwanted attention from the police and eventually, shut down. It's extortion, basically, protection money. Funny thing is, the farang bar owner who pays, actually breaks the law by paying the bribe and the guy he is paying to, whose job it is to uphold the law, is the one taking the money, directly. Not the seedy underworld Thai mafia - the police, directly. It's all very upfront here and operating with impunity.

I can't comment on dive centre cars and what plates the vehicle is displaying, but, I do like observing and speaking with expats here, so, I am happy to learn about it. What do you mean by "dive centres driving cars with guests with white and blue plates?" (obviously, I'm not into diving)

[ScubaBuddha]

I can't believe that all the time you have lived here that is the first incident of bribery you have heard of. Last week a cop at Chalong circle wouldn't let my gf go until she gave him her phone number. She wasn't wearing a helmet.

[NamKangMan]

I can't believe that all the time you have lived here that is the first incident of bribery you have heard of. Last week a cop at Chalong circle wouldn't let my gf go until she gave him her phone number. She wasn't wearing a helmet.

Can someone enlighten me? What should this industry be using to transport their equipment and customers?

[madmitch]

And some dive centers are using the illegal samlors too. (Motorbike with sidecar)

Excellent. LOL.

[NamKangMan]

I can't believe that all the time you have lived here that is the first incident of bribery you have heard of. Last week a cop at Chalong circle wouldn't let my gf go until she gave him her phone number. She wasn't wearing a helmet.

I have heard of cases of bar girls having to "pay the fine" by non-cash methods. I'm sure you all know what I mean.

Not suggesting your gf is a bar girl. Just stating what I have observed, and been told.

[stevenl]

Can someone enlighten me? What should this industry be using to transport their equipment and customers?

Yellow plates with black letters. The same goes for all tour companies BTW, white plates with blue letters are meant for staff transportation and not allowed to transfer tourists, white plates with black letters are personal vehicles, not allowed to transfer tourists in, white plates with green letters are company vehicles, not allowed to transfer tourists in.

The distinction between white plates with black and blue letters, as mentioned above, is the official one. It seems that, at least on Phuket, all 4 door cars are issued white/black, all 2 door cars white/green.

[NamKangMan]

Yellow plates with black letters. The same goes for all tour companies BTW, white plates with blue letters are meant for staff transportation and not allowed to transfer tourists, white plates with black letters are personal vehicles, not allowed to transfer tourists in, white plates with green letters are company vehicles, not allowed to transfer tourists in.

The distinction between white plates with black and blue letters, as mentioned above, is the official one. It seems that, at least on Phuket, all 4 door cars are issued white/black, all 2 door cars white/green.

That might be why I have been in "taxis" in the past and they have been pulled over for no apparent reason, or so I thought, and had to pay money. It must have been because their vehicle was not plated to take farang tourist. Interesting.

[katabeachbum]

Yellow plates with black letters. The same goes for all tour companies BTW, white plates with blue letters are meant for staff transportation and not allowed to transfer tourists, white plates with black letters are personal vehicles, not allowed to transfer tourists in, white plates with green letters are company vehicles, not allowed to transfer tourists in.

The distinction between white plates with black and blue letters, as mentioned above, is the official one. It seems that, at least on Phuket, all 4 door cars are issued white/black, all 2 door cars white/green.

That might be why I have been in "taxis" in the past and they have been pulled over for no apparent reason, or so I thought, and had to pay money. It must have been because their vehicle was not plated to take farang tourist. Interesting.

A taxi has white numbers on green plate. If you pay someone else to drive you, you are supporting black taxis. Black as in no taxes, black as in non approved vehicle safety, black as in non approved driver, black as in mafia

a commercial minivan is lisenced to drive paying passengers, black numbers on yellow plates

a minivan can be privately owned/used for non paying passengers, white plate with blue numbers

[BangTaoBoy]

But were Thai's give the same ticket, for the same offence, at the same roadblock, at the same time. I have posted an example where I definately know one Thai girl was not fined after she simply told the police she had no money.

That day yes, 100%. They walked around the entire circumference of Central and chained every bike and car parked illegaly. Nearly all of them belonged to Thais.

[BangTaoBoy]

Really? One 'interaction' with police in a decade of driving.

During my last visit to Phuket, I was stopped by police almost every single day while riding from Karon to Patong on a motorbike.

You see: straight away our perceptions are different. Does that make me wrong? I don't think so. So please don't make a giant leap (like you do below) and assume that only your opinions are 'based on truth'.

So are you saying, you were wearing a helmet, had a valid license that allows you to ride bikes in Thailand, but were still fined? If so can you please tell us how many times, what you paid, and what the ticket was for.

But how do you know all this? From where do you get your extra-sensory perception that enables you to know what has happened to other people, and allows you to so readily dismiss their stories?

I don't have ESP. I can only go by what I know to be true in my own life, and those of the people I know. The rest comes from all the stories on here, which 9 times out of 10 will start with 'This bloke I know' and 'My mate Dave knew this bloke' etc etc.

If you scan through this forum, as I have done for 4/5 years you will find very little in the way of facts, being told by the person it happened to, and who has proof of what he is saying is true.

Until you show me this source of superior knowledge and intellect, I'm inclined to believe the weight of evidence which is decidedly not in your favour.

What evidence in this thread is in your favour exactly? You didn't exactly give us anything concrete to go on did you. Another poster said he got stopped once but was let off because he was above board. That's just it, there never is any evidence.

If it happens so much, why can't someone post a photo of a ticket on this forum, one that was given out to somebody who had done nothing wrong. It happens so much someone should be able to do it within the next few weeks right? Well it's been nearly 5 years and I haven't seen one yet, so I won't hold my breath.

[pete600]

..., but I wouldn't expect to be pulled over there purely to help pay the coppers wages.

In 15 years I have been stopped endless times with car or motorbike, but only once I was fined and had to pay. That was when the road tax on my motorbike was overdue for about two months. I got a ticket, next day I payed the taxes in town, then I paid 200 Baht fine at Chalong Police Station and that's it. Never I had to top-up 'coppers wages'.

Not been here as long as you but i have never had a problem show them my UK license and off i pop.

[BangTaoBoy]

I was watching a roadblock one day that was set up outside of a bar. (I was sitting in the bar) I saw a Thai girl I know get pulled over (she wasn't wearing her helmet and she's not a bar girl) Later that afternoon I asked her, "What happen with police today?" She basically said, "I tell them, no have money." She was allowed to leave without being fined. I did notice all the farang being made to pay with very few receiving "a ticket." Once again, selective enforcement based on the ability to pay.

Now the double standards issue is something altogether different. As often is the case on TV, many different angles of the same subject get mixed in together and the topic gets confused.

I will start by upsetting a few people and saying that, I have no problems with this what so ever. Thailand is a developing country in SEA, you just simply CAN NOT expect things to operate the same as they do in your own country, and why would you even want them to??

Quite simply, if you go to some body elses country, and break their traffic laws, you deserve to get a ticket. What tickest are being given out to locals or anyone else for that matter, has 100%, got absolutely nothing to do with you. That goes for the workers paying tax in to the system as well, before they pipe up.

So please lets stop getting the two arguments mixed up. The issuing of tickets to people who have broken no traffic laws and have the appropriate license, which is yet to be substantiated in the slightest. And the fact that locals do not get tickets for the same reasons Farang do. Which as I've said doesn't bother me in the slightest. I don't get them, so I don't give a monkeys who else is or isn't getting them.

[mca]

The last two times though, they were waving everyone over, but I was acting like I was looking at the traffic and getting around it.

That's my method too. All the while chanting the mantra in my head " These aren't the droids you're looking for " Seems to have worked so far!

[BangTaoBoy]

I own some classic Honda 70s & 90s.

All of them are completely legal with green books and tax disks. All except one.

There are quite a few of these bikes on the island and I would say 95% of them are owned by Thais and 90% of those have no book and no tax.

I chat a lot with these Thai owners and always ask if they have problems with the BiB when stopped.

Every one of them said that because they are old and not having a book, thus no tax disk, the BiB understand and let them pass at the road-blocks as long as the rider has a license and is wearing a helmet.

Foolishly, I thought the same would apply to me.

I was riding the Honda 70 that had no book and was stopped by the BiB at Chalong circle.

This cop pointed out that I had no tax and that I would have to take the bike to the police station and it would stay there until I produced the green book.

I explained to him that I didn't have a green book, but, I had tried to get one, but, it was impossible.

He told me that my bike would sit and rot in the police compound unless I paid him 1500 Bt on the spot.

Yes, I was breaking the law (yet, Thais seem to get away with it), but, so was he by taking a bribe.

Now I can't ride that bike anymore and am slowly having to cannabalize it for parts, which is a real shame.

From me, the BiB get the respect they deserve.

As I have just said in my last post, I don't honestly think you have a leg to stand on with this argument.

Your bike was illegal. You have no right to expect to be able to ride it without getting pulled and have it taken off the road. To me, expecting any difference is simple arrogance.

This is Thailand. If Thais are lucky enough to get away with something, and not be hounded by the powers that be, then good luck to them.

What a horrible attitude to have. I'm getting done, so I want as many other people to get done as well.

I'll remember not to be too close to you on a sinking ship! Might sudenly find my legs getting grabbed from under the water.

[pete600]

I have never been involved in an incident where I've needed the police, so no, those incidents haven't happened to me personally. But neither has anything bad. I've done a huge amount of driving on this island over the last decade, and have only had one single interaction with the police, which as I mentioned before was a parking ticket, that I deserved 100%.

Really? One 'interaction' with police in a decade of driving.

During my last visit to Phuket, I was stopped by police almost every single day while riding from Karon to Patong on a motorbike.

You see: straight away our perceptions are different. Does that make me wrong? I don't think so. So please don't make a giant leap (like you do below) and assume that only your opinions are 'based on truth'.

So why are my experiences so different from everyone elses? I'll tell you why, because mine are based on the truth.

So everyone's wrong except you, is that it? It's lucky Thailand doesn't have a law against making arrogant statements, or you'd be fined into bankruptcy!

Hard facts as to what's happened (or what hasn't happened) while living here on a day to day basis. If you want me to come on here and post about every eventless day I have on the island, I'm happy to, but you'll get pretty bored, because it'll be the same old story every day.

The difference is, people who come on here and post about all the bad aspects of living in Phuket, are NOT basing tmost of those stories on their actual, personal experiences, they're posting about rumours, stereo types, and exagerated missconceptions, that have been snow balling for several years. People are happy for facts to roll off their tongue, without ever having actually experienced them themselves.

But how do you know all this? From where do you get your extra-sensory perception that enables you to know what has happened to other people, and allows you to so readily dismiss their stories?

Until you show me this source of superior knowledge and intellect, I'm inclined to believe the weight of evidence which is decidedly not in your favour.

I all so get stopped there when they have a road block some time 4 or 5 times a night. But never had a problem with them.

Did you ever get stung by them ?

[KarenBravo]

I own some classic Honda 70s & 90s.

All of them are completely legal with green books and tax disks. All except one.

There are quite a few of these bikes on the island and I would say 95% of them are owned by Thais and 90% of those have no book and no tax.

I chat a lot with these Thai owners and always ask if they have problems with the BiB when stopped.

Every one of them said that because they are old and not having a book, thus no tax disk, the BiB understand and let them pass at the road-blocks as long as the rider has a license and is wearing a helmet.

Foolishly, I thought the same would apply to me.

I was riding the Honda 70 that had no book and was stopped by the BiB at Chalong circle.

This cop pointed out that I had no tax and that I would have to take the bike to the police station and it would stay there until I produced the green book.

I explained to him that I didn't have a green book, but, I had tried to get one, but, it was impossible.

He told me that my bike would sit and rot in the police compound unless I paid him 1500 Bt on the spot.

Yes, I was breaking the law (yet, Thais seem to get away with it), but, so was he by taking a bribe.

Now I can't ride that bike anymore and am slowly having to cannabalize it for parts, which is a real shame.

From me, the BiB get the respect they deserve.

As I have just said in my last post, I don't honestly think you have a leg to stand on with this argument.

Your bike was illegal. You have no right to expect to be able to ride it without getting pulled and have it taken off the road. To me, expecting any difference is simple arrogance.

This is Thailand. If Thais are lucky enough to get away with something, and not be hounded by the powers that be, then good luck to them.

What a horrible attitude to have. I'm getting done, so I want as many other people to get done as well.

I'll remember not to be too close to you on a sinking ship! Might sudenly find my legs getting grabbed from under the water.

Maybe you should read my post again. Nowhere do I say I want other people to get done. Don't twist my words.

Your thoughts on a policeman accepting a bribe?

Ask any Thai what they think of the police in this country might actually give you a clue.

[BangTaoBoy]

Yes, I was breaking the law (yet, Thais seem to get away with it), but, so was he by taking a bribe.

Maybe you should read my post again. Nowhere do I say I want other people to get done. Don't twist my words.

Your thoughts on a policeman accepting a bribe?

Ask any Thai what they think of the police in this country might actually give you a clue.

I was actually using your post as an example, to make my point to several other posters, who do want to see Thai people ticketed exactly the same as Farang.

Anyway, your 'Thais seem to get away with it' comment, seems to be implying that you wish that they didn't get away with it, therefor get tickets as well. If I'm wrong, and you are happy for Thais to be let off for doing the same thing that you got done for, then I beg your pardon. But I don't think you are some how!

As for Police bribing. In your case was that really a bribe? You were riding an illegal bike. You got told to pay up or lose it. I seem to recall the exact same happening in the UK, if your car gets impounded and you never pay up, it gets crushed or sold at auction or something simmilar. So what exactly is it you feel so hard done by, if not for the fact that the Thais were getting let off and you weren't.

[KarenBravo]

[i was actually using your post as an example, to make my point to several other posters, who do want to see Thai people ticketed exactly the same as Farang.

Anyway, your 'Thais seem to get away with it' comment, seems to be implying that you wish that they didn't get away with it, therefor get tickets as well. If I'm wrong, and you are happy for Thais to be let off for doing the same thing that you got done for, then I beg your pardon. But I don't think you are some how!

As for Police bribing. In your case was that really a bribe? You were riding an illegal bike. You got told to pay up or lose it. I seem to recall the exact same happening in the UK, if your car gets impounded and you never pay up, it gets crushed or sold at auction or something simmilar. So what exactly is it you feel so hard done by, if not for the fact that the Thais were getting let off and you weren't.

Deary me. How can you misunderstand a simple post. Of course it was a bribe! I was driving an illegal bike. The money went straight in his pocket. No receipt.

The crux is that all the Thais that I have spoken to always get away with it and white people don't.

Goes back to the law being supplied selectively and that the police are corrupt.

The reason I posted it was to try and knock off your rosy tinted glasses that you see Thailand through.

[merijn]

There is often a police check point in front of my hotel ( Patong ) and all the bikes are stopped without exception.

Also all the owners are fined ( if they did something wrong ) Thai and tourist alike.

I don't have any problem with that.

In the 21 years I live here I’m stopped not to many times in my car or on the scooter and fined once when i did not had the helmet on. ( which I totally accept )

Only why do so many tourists think that they can do things in Thailand which they would never do back in their home country.

Would they drive without a helmet back home NO so why are you doing it then in Thailand ?

[bkmbkk]

Nowadays most people have learned to wear helmet + bring some sort of driving license.

I guess the police have to find other ways to boost the income.

Years back in Patong they cracked hard down on forign driving licenses (only International where accepted) - than that got too hard to deal with and helmets + forgotten licenses where again main reason for a fine.

Lately I have been stopped in that same Karon check point on scooter (late night) and as I was smelling of alcohol I had to blow the meter - (I promised the Officer in charge that I woulden't tell anyone that it was a bit to high so no court hearing for me ).

I'm expecting more comming from that front so I try to avoid - especially - the Karon check point , but ofcourse it is impossible to do 100 %.

[BangTaoBoy]

The reason I posted it was to try and knock off your rosy tinted glasses that you see Thailand through.

I was waiting for the 'rose tinted glasses' comment. It's in the top 10 list, of words and phrases, used by TV members, who can't manage to live in Phuket on a day to day basis, without having issues. I think it's up to 7th now, the word Mafia, has obviously been number one for several years.

KarenBravo, you are a joke. You ride a bike, which is totaly, 100% illegal, and then you moan and winge when you get tapped up for a bribe. People like you and others on this thread, say you want the law to be inforced more like it would be in the West. You wouldn't ride an illegal bike in the West, so why be so arrogant to do it here. Don't you think we all could get our hands on some nice bikes (not poncie, girlie little mopeds) if we were prepared to ride illegal ones, but we don't.

You want the law to be more like the West, but what do you think would happen if you got caught on an illegal bike in Europe. You wouldn't be lucky enough, to be offered the chance to ride away with it, just by paying a measly little fine. The bike would be gone, and so probably would your license.

People like you want all the laid back, care free, do what you want aspects of Phuket, until it doesn't suit you, because it's costing a couple of quid. You can't have it both ways.

[BangTaoBoy]

Nowadays most people have learned to wear helmet + bring some sort of driving license.

I guess the police have to find other ways to boost the income.

Years back in Patong they cracked hard down on forign driving licenses (only International where accepted) - than that got too hard to deal with and helmets + forgotten licenses where again main reason for a fine.

Lately I have been stopped in that same Karon check point on scooter (late night) and as I was smelling of alcohol I had to blow the meter - (I promised the Officer in charge that I woulden't tell anyone that it was a bit to high so no court hearing for me ).

I'm expecting more comming from that front so I try to avoid - especially - the Karon check point , but ofcourse it is impossible to do 100 %.

You start by talking about the police 'boosting their incomes' which is another way of saying extorting people.

You then finish by being blasé about drink driving, something I'm guessing you wouldn't do back home, and if you did, and got caught, you would be walking for quite a while.

Do you ....... really expect to be taken seriously? You break the law, some as serious as drink driving, and then you want to get all high and mighty about paying a few bungs.

You don't realise how hypercritical you all are, and how lucky you are to live somewhere, you can get away with so much.

Edited November 17, 2010 by LivinginKata
flame removed

[BangTaoBoy]

In the 21 years I live here I'm stopped not to many times in my car or on the scooter and fined once when i did not had the helmet on.

So we now have people who have been driving on Phuket for several decades without a single problem with extortion.

How can that be?

Are we all lying?

Have I been lending people my rose coloured specs for 20 years?

Or is it that 99% of people who have been given tickets, got them because they were BREAKING THE LAW. A law right up until they reached the road block, they didn't give a stuff about. And now, all of a sudden out of nowhere, come the principles, and it's corruption this and extortion the other. What hypercrits.

People come to Phuket for the freedom. Don't abuse it then go crying to mummy because you have to bung a cop a few beers worth of money. It comes with the territory.

Edited November 17, 2010 by BangTaoBoy

[bkmbkk]

Nowadays most people have learned to wear helmet + bring some sort of driving license.

I guess the police have to find other ways to boost the income.

Years back in Patong they cracked hard down on forign driving licenses (only International where accepted) - than that got too hard to deal with and helmets + forgotten licenses where again main reason for a fine.

Lately I have been stopped in that same Karon check point on scooter (late night) and as I was smelling of alcohol I had to blow the meter - (I promised the Officer in charge that I woulden't tell anyone that it was a bit to high so no court hearing for me ).

I'm expecting more comming from that front so I try to avoid - especially - the Karon check point , but ofcourse it is impossible to do 100 %.

You start by talking about the police 'boosting their incomes' which is another way of saying extorting people.

You then finish by being blasé about drink driving, something I'm guessing you wouldn't do back home, and if you did, and got caught, you would be walking for quite a while.

Do you morons really expect to be taken seriously? You break the law, some as serious as drink driving, and then you want to get all high and mighty about paying a few bungs.

You don't realise how hypercritical you all are, and how lucky you are to live somewhere, you can get away with so much.

The dark clouds are apparently hanging low in Bang Tao - cheer up buddy - sunshine will come your way some day.

I'm not complaining about how things are run here,(actually quite happy still after 15 years) just trying to share some information’s with other interested.

You don't see it that way - it's hard when all these crazy farangs and morons are all over the place and don’t know how to behave – right

[naiharn]

Bangtao Boy: So are you saying, you were wearing a helmet, had a valid license that allows you to ride bikes in Thailand, but were still fined? If so can you please tell us how many times, what you paid, and what the ticket was for.

You seem to have trouble understanding plain English, so please re-read what I wrote. I did not say I was fined. I said I was stopped. That is an 'interaction' with police. You claim you had only one 'interaction' with police during a decade of driving. I had many interactions during a short period. Your perception is different to mine. But please don't run off and say that your perception is the only valid one, being 'based on the 'truth'' etc.

I don't have ESP. I can only go by what I know to be true in my own life, and those of the people I know.

So you base your judgements on experiences of people you know. Yet you deride people who post here about people they know! Only first-hand experiences allowed! Make up your mind!

Another example of a distinct set of double-standards!

The rest comes from all the stories on here, which 9 times out of 10 will start with 'This bloke I know' and 'My mate Dave knew this bloke' etc etc.

(See what I mean!)

What evidence in this thread is in your favour exactly?

Here you go again setting your own limitations on the debate. Who determines that I can only use evidence in this thread in coming to conclusions about the way police act in Thailand. I can and will use all the evidence available, not just what is written in a thread in a Phuket forum.

You didn't exactly give us anything concrete to go on did you. Another poster said he got stopped once but was let off because he was above board. That's just it, there never is any evidence.

If it happens so much, why can't someone post a photo of a ticket

What ticket? When cops take a bribe they don't give out receipts! What planet do you live on?

[naiharn]

The problem esculates for farang when that same 14 year old Thai kid, on the same defective bike, crashes into you and because, "if farang not in Thailand accident not happen" you have to pay - that really pisses me off.

Incidently, has that actually happened to you personally? To me that is one of those classic quotes, about something that has probably happened to 3 people in the last 3 years, yet it just rolls of everybodies tongue, like they were talking about a daily occurance.

So you don't accept that Farang drivers are often (or usually) assumed to be guilty in traffic accidents in Thailand, even when they are not at fault?

Here are a few other opinions:

- from The Tourism Authority of Thailand official website:

"If you have (the) misfortune to get into an accident, it's likely to be judged as your fault (even if it wasn't) and you will be expected to pay (on the spot) for any damage caused (to vehicles and people)."

- from "Thai Law for Foreigners" by writer Benjawan Poomsan Becker and Thai lawyer Roengsak Thongkaew

" ... In most cases, no matter who caused the accident, you will be blamed because you are a foreigner"

"... whether or not it's fair to you, when you (a foreigner) drive and are involved in an accident, it is usually considered your fault for not knowing how to drive the Thai way"

Whose opinion should I trust: the opinion of anonymous poster on Thaivisa who has by his own admission not had an accident in ten years of driving in Phuket, or the opinion of Thais, including a lawyer, who presumably knows at least a little about the subject?

I think I will take the latter. Others can form whatever judgement they like.

I will take a risk here and post 2 links to stories from foreigners with interesting stories on this subject. (I know how much you dislike hearing non-first-hand reports, so skip if it irks you too much to hear evidence that doesn't fit your own perceptions.)

Story1

Story2

[naiharn]

It's often not a bad idea to carry a photo copy of your passport with you. can just leave it in your wallet. Not sure if they would accept it or not in this case. Probably not.

Is a copy of your passport sufficient? Will the cops accept it?

I contacted the TAT, who replied:

As per your inquiry, we would like to inform you that while you are in Thailand it is

not necessary to carry your original passport

all the time. All you need is the copy of your passport on

1. Main page

2. Latest visa

3. Latest entry stamp

4. Current extension of stay

5. Departure card

So that answers the first question.

The answer to the second one is more difficult, and possibly costly, to determine

[markg]

In 7 years on Phuket i have been stopped maybe a dozen times at Police checkpoints.

I always wear a helmet. I have a valid Thai driving licence. (I also have a full motorcycle licence from the UK)

In Phuket town, the cops are definitly NOT just after farangs. They stop the first ten bikes and check them and WILL go to town on Thai people breaking the law.

I have been in checks where Thai people have their bikes searched, and the farang has not.

I've also been in checks where the surlyness of the officer turned into a salute and click of the heels when i produced my Thai 5 year driving licence.

I've never been asked for money.

I've was given a ticket once for out of date tax disc on a rental bike i once had. Paid that money at the police station - that's fair enough. (Rental guy paid me back)

Accidents that are foreigners fault irrespective of the actual facts - I've many stories from friends and witnessed myself and it's more or less true. In most cases, it's our fault. That;s the risk you take driving here.