pauleddy Posted January 12, 2011 Share Posted January 12, 2011 Just read about a pensioner on here who has 100,000euros in a Spanish regional bank SOLBANK. He is worried because of the possible bailout of Spain. My situation is similar but further removed. I live in Thailand, but have my retirement savings in Alliance and Leicester and Brad-Bingley in the offshore Isle of Man. Both of these banks are owned by the Spanish giant Santander. My money is in Sterling deposits and bonds. When I spoke to the offices, I was told not to worry because my money is guaranteed by the IOMan (but I know there is a catch--only the first 100 million of client savings is paid out) AND by the Parent Santander UK (which is Abbey etc.) Could the effect of a skint Spain roll along and hit UK and Offshore Santander divsions? Has Santander claim to my money if it goes broke? What are the mechanics of this? My money is in pounds and not in Spain, but those banks are owned by Santander. Am I paranoid? I am soon to be a pensioner and I cannot lose my savings. Are there any economists or bankers on here who could explain what I must do? Thanks Eddy P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
midas Posted January 12, 2011 Share Posted January 12, 2011 To me your question reminds me of the frog in boiling water Why wait for the water to get hot ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pauleddy Posted January 12, 2011 Author Share Posted January 12, 2011 To me your question reminds me of the frog in boiling water Why wait for the water to get hot ? Because the money is not in Spain and has 2 guarantees, I didn't want to try and find another bank to put it in. The Irish banks are still taking lots of deposits even after the bailout. I'm not sure what to do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheyCallmeScooter Posted January 12, 2011 Share Posted January 12, 2011 To me your question reminds me of the frog in boiling water Why wait for the water to get hot ? I agree with midas and am baffled. If the question is important enough to query, it's important enough to move to safety. How is this a complex dilemma? Your explanation appears nonsensical to me...perhaps I'm missing something? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pauleddy Posted January 12, 2011 Author Share Posted January 12, 2011 It will take a few weeks to move the money around. In a sense you are both correct, but I cannot see that it is logical or inevitable that UK branches of Spanish banks will be allowed to grab the funds of UK or offshore clients. This is like saying that everyone who has money in the Abbey UK will lose it if they dont move it. That's millions of people. On the money websites, the Irish banks are at the top for offering good rates, even though there has been a bailout and Ireland is a mess. Yes, maybe I need a financial advisor. Nobody has explained the mechanics. I have about 100,000 pounds in the banks mentioned. Edd Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
midas Posted January 12, 2011 Share Posted January 12, 2011 To me your question reminds me of the frog in boiling water Why wait for the water to get hot ? Because the money is not in Spain and has 2 guarantees, I didn't want to try and find another bank to put it in. The Irish banks are still taking lots of deposits even after the bailout. I'm not sure what to do. If you believe in government guarantees these days you are braver than me! ha ha ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheyCallmeScooter Posted January 12, 2011 Share Posted January 12, 2011 If in doubt, move it out. Two weeks to move it out doesn't seem relevant to me, apologies if I'm missing something. But you're not actually exerting yourself for those two weeks right? Put in the Wire TT order, sit back and relax. Piece of mind has got to be worth the 20 min effort no? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pauleddy Posted January 12, 2011 Author Share Posted January 12, 2011 If in doubt, move it out. Two weeks to move it out doesn't seem relevant to me, apologies if I'm missing something. But you're not actually exerting yourself for those two weeks right? Put in the Wire TT order, sit back and relax. Piece of mind has got to be worth the 20 min effort no? Yes, but I have to do new forms, certified passport copies and all the things needed by a new bank. I dont even know which bank to use! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheyCallmeScooter Posted January 12, 2011 Share Posted January 12, 2011 Yes, but I have to do new forms, certified passport copies and all the things needed by a new bank. I dont even know which bank to use! Ah gotcha. Well, I can't assist with advice on which bank, but in my experience, the ongoing stress of doing nothing (my default preference) is rarely preferable to the determined focused effort of moving to higher ground. I guess you're trying to assess whether the effort is warranted, and that's a sentiment I can definitely respect. Might be time for financial advisor of a friend or family member (i.e. someone who comes recommended, the vast majority of financial advisers aren't qualified to advise squat). I don't understand this 100mil guarantee by Isle of Man. How do you know if your 100k is in the 100mil or not? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pib Posted January 12, 2011 Share Posted January 12, 2011 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deposit_insurance Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheyCallmeScooter Posted January 12, 2011 Share Posted January 12, 2011 http://en.wikipedia....posit_insurance I didn't see anything about 100mil guarantee but I see this... October 2008 compelled a radical revision of deposit insurance in the Isle of Man. The Isle of Man government called an emergency session of the Tynwald parliament which voted unanimously to bring the Isle of Man depositors' compensation scheme into line with the newly-enlarged scheme in the United Kingdom, guaranteeing with immediate effect 100 percent of the first £50,000 per depositor per bank... Seems like good news no? Just reading about it all gives me a queer uneasiness. These are murky fellows, shiver. There is no guarantee these guys could ever give me that would be a true 100% guarantee. It's whether or not I'd even rate it at 50% which has me narrowing my eyes at it all. Masters of the house, and of the fine print. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old wanderer Posted January 12, 2011 Share Posted January 12, 2011 I would get on the internet and carefully read the history of Iceland. The bank there were giving execelent returns on deposits. The citizens were happy, and investors had thought they were safe. Right up until the day everything went out the window. The currency became almost worthless, banks failed and were closed. The Icelandic government was so unhappy they even (for a change) put some of the bankers in jail. I would never commit to having my future located in one central location. The Swiss Franq is very stong today. Look at accounts that you can hold multiple currencies and change on line. Singapore is great for this. A lot of my friends acuse me of wearing a tin hat, because I moved 98% of my wealth into gold and silver over the past 2 years. Last year silver was up 73% and still going strong, gold was up 23%. So if I have to dress funny to have returns like this on my money, so be it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LaoPo Posted January 12, 2011 Share Posted January 12, 2011 To me your question reminds me of the frog in boiling water Why wait for the water to get hot ? Because the money is not in Spain and has 2 guarantees, I didn't want to try and find another bank to put it in. The Irish banks are still taking lots of deposits even after the bailout. I'm not sure what to do. Don't worry too much about Banco Santander - STD on the NYSE. In the past year-on-year Banco Santander dropped -36% on the NYSE but "just" - 15% in the last 6 months. However, today there was splendid good news about Europe and the EU and STD went already up a stunning 11.46% so far (still trading at this moment). Banco Santander, with a market capitalization of $ 88 Billion, isn't a small bank and although there are no guarantees from nobody, I think you're rather safe with your money on the IOM. I would rather have my money there than in Ireland....with tiny banks like Bank of Ireland ($ 3.38 Billion) or Allied Irish Banks with a mere $ 550 Million Market Cap. Even Banco Santander (Brasil) - BSBRhas a market cap of almost $ 51 Billion. Also: http://www.bloomberg...ty-preview.html LaoPo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pauleddy Posted January 13, 2011 Author Share Posted January 13, 2011 To me your question reminds me of the frog in boiling water Why wait for the water to get hot ? Because the money is not in Spain and has 2 guarantees, I didn't want to try and find another bank to put it in. The Irish banks are still taking lots of deposits even after the bailout. I'm not sure what to do. Don't worry too much about Banco Santander - STD on the NYSE. In the past year-on-year Banco Santander dropped -36% on the NYSE but "just" - 15% in the last 6 months. However, today there was splendid good news about Europe and the EU and STD went already up a stunning 11.46% so far (still trading at this moment). Banco Santander, with a market capitalization of $ 88 Billion, isn't a small bank and although there are no guarantees from nobody, I think you're rather safe with your money on the IOM. I would rather have my money there than in Ireland....with tiny banks like Bank of Ireland ($ 3.38 Billion) or Allied Irish Banks with a mere $ 550 Million Market Cap. Even Banco Santander (Brasil) - BSBRhas a market cap of almost $ 51 Billion. Also: http://www.bloomberg...ty-preview.html LaoPo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pauleddy Posted January 13, 2011 Author Share Posted January 13, 2011 Thanks I know that Santander is huge and owns Abbey, Bingley, AL, Cahoots etc and that is only in UK, not to mention Brazil and Spain. Maybe even if Spain gets a bailout, that will not bust its largest banks. Maybe I am worrying too much. This is where I don't understand the mechanics of banks and bailouts. Eddy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mania Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 Dont roll the dice if you can't pay the price The things you mention like forms & passport may be small potato's in hindsight. Since your in Thailand why not look into some Singapore banks? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FarangBuddha Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 To me your question reminds me of the frog in boiling water Why wait for the water to get hot ? Because the money is not in Spain and has 2 guarantees, I didn't want to try and find another bank to put it in. The Irish banks are still taking lots of deposits even after the bailout. I'm not sure what to do. Don't worry too much about Banco Santander - STD on the NYSE. In the past year-on-year Banco Santander dropped -36% on the NYSE but "just" - 15% in the last 6 months. However, today there was splendid good news about Europe and the EU and STD went already up a stunning 11.46% so far (still trading at this moment). Banco Santander, with a market capitalization of $ 88 Billion, isn't a small bank and although there are no guarantees from nobody, I think you're rather safe with your money on the IOM. I would rather have my money there than in Ireland....with tiny banks like Bank of Ireland ($ 3.38 Billion) or Allied Irish Banks with a mere $ 550 Million Market Cap. Even Banco Santander (Brasil) - BSBRhas a market cap of almost $ 51 Billion. Also: http://www.bloomberg...ty-preview.html LaoPo Completely agree...Banco Santander [sTD...gotta love that ticker symbol ] is one of the best world-wide banking franchises around. It is based in Spain and has major exposures to the sick Spanish economy but is also one of the biggest banks in Latin American and Mexico [which are booming]. If Santander goes down then all of Spain goes down and it is one of the "too big to fail" banks that will never be allowed to fail. The problems in Spain's banking system are confined primarily to the system of small regional banks found in all the towns and villages in the country and not the big Madrid-based money center Spanish banks. So I would not be in the least worried about funds kept in STD or any of its foreign affiliates. In fact, I'm about to make a major move into STD stock as that 8% yield is looking so good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andytime Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 Eddy.. some good suggestions from others.. Singapore banking DBS et al super safe. The issue of solvency on many of the big banks is at hand and the way the fractional reserve banking system works I would not want to be standing in the line waiting for one's money nor accepting a government or banking body guarantee because they will be worth a lot less than the physical bank notes despite both being printed on paper. The following articles are generally making reference to the us banking system, but almost all of them are in very hot water and no good having them tell you that they invested on your behalf in an office building in Dubai that they can't find a tenant for. If the articles are only 1/2 right then very scary. Some suggested articles http://livinglies.wo...-on-watch-list/ http://www.marketora...ticle24474.html This is an independent Banking report which is apparently the best and rates all banks without any kickbacks to the rating agency and the service is free. Can read about it and check online notes about it. For US banks... www.weissratings.com shows you how many banks are in trouble. All I know from younger days is that getting a D on ones report card not good and here they have many E'S and F's to. Andy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trickcyclist Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 See Swiss Franc appreciation against $US since 1950 2000 1990 1980 1970 1960 19501.68881.38921.67574.3734.3734.373Today, 2011, the exchange rate is 0.9. Therefore, $10,000 just left sitting in Swiss Francs in 1950 would be worth $US34,700 today without any any cash deposit interest, stock dividend, or investment appreciation of any kind. If you are really scared. Go into Swiss Francs and keep them under the bed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kennalder Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 It will take a few weeks to move the money around. In a sense you are both correct, but I cannot see that it is logical or inevitable that UK branches of Spanish banks will be allowed to grab the funds of UK or offshore clients. This is like saying that everyone who has money in the Abbey UK will lose it if they dont move it. That's millions of people. On the money websites, the Irish banks are at the top for offering good rates, even though there has been a bailout and Ireland is a mess. Yes, maybe I need a financial advisor. Nobody has explained the mechanics. I have about 100,000 pounds in the banks mentioned. Edd Offering high interest rates on deposits is not a sign of strength, on the contrary, it is a sign of weakness. If they have to offer high rates, it is because no one wants to put their money with them at lower rates. If you really want to sleep at night, find several banks that are strong and offering lower rates, then spread it around among them. I would be leery of bonds. Many US cities are on the verge of bankruptcy making muni bonds suspect. If it starts and in my opinion, it is almost inevitable, interest rates will go sky high across the board and the value of all bonds will go way down. Even if you can hold to maturity you might get paid back with near worthless inflated currencies. Probably a good idea to have some in Gold and Silver. In a crisis Silver will probably go up a bigger percentage than Gold, but it is not as easy to carry around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naam Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 (edited) If you are really scared. Go into Swiss Francs and keep them under the bed. but don't sleep in a bed. beds are dangerous places. it is a well known fact that the majority of people die when in bed or on a mattress. p.s. and after you went into Swiss Francs leave them under the bed for 60 years. only then check. Edited January 13, 2011 by Naam Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PattayaParent Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 Isn't Santander something like the fourth biggest bank in the world? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
a99az Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 It will take a few weeks to move the money around. In a sense you are both correct, but I cannot see that it is logical or inevitable that UK branches of Spanish banks will be allowed to grab the funds of UK or offshore clients. This is like saying that everyone who has money in the Abbey UK will lose it if they dont move it. That's millions of people. On the money websites, the Irish banks are at the top for offering good rates, even though there has been a bailout and Ireland is a mess. Yes, maybe I need a financial advisor. Nobody has explained the mechanics. I have about 100,000 pounds in the banks mentioned. Edd Split it up into 4 or 5 unrelated banks, play safe and put some in gold. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.png.3b3332cc2256ad0edbc2fe9404feeef0.png)
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now