Strangers Taking Digital Photos Of Your Children + Touching

[roadschooler]

Hello,

I hesitated at first posting this thread but I wanted to find out what other parents are doing. My children are getting bothered with complete strangers snapping photos of them with their phones.

At first, I brushed this off and told my kids that the Thais think they are cute. But, I noticed that people don't even ask to take a photo and they often just point their camera at them. In rare cases, the person attempting to snap a picture jokingly will chase after my children when they turn their back to try and take a picture. I intervene and tell them politely in Thai "Dek mai chop" (Child doesn't like it).

This never happened the last time I was in Thailand but now there seems to be a proliferation of digital camera cell phones. Is this cultural? What do other parents do? Personally, I do find it a little rude because I believe in the West, strangers taking photos of your child in pubic is taboo. And touching is certainly not acceptable behavior by complete strangers.

My 7 year old is now shielding her face and grabbing her little brother and sister and walking/turning away whenever people try to snap their picture. And my 4 year old coils away from strangers when they attempt to touch her. The touching is confined to their hair, skin, and sometimes cheeks.

I would be very interested in finding out what other parents are doing in this situation. I realize that the Thais do not mean any harm and they adore children but I am starting to become concerned with this behavior. What do you tell your children? If you are uncomfortable responding on the forum, please contact me offline.

Again, I want to state that I find Thais to be very welcoming and friendly, especially toward families with young children. It is not my intention to start a diatribe on Thais or Thai society but to explore how to co-exist with the difference in cultures.

Thank you.

[venturalaw]

I don't mind the photographing as much as the touching - especially when they are trying to touch my child's face. However, if the picture taking was troubling my child, as you said you did, I would tell them that my child does not like having his/her picture taken. That should stop it.

[NanLaew]

It's tough having cute kids. And the proliferation of phones with cameras and their unsolicited use in public is something that is not uniquely Thai. I think one has to accept that no matter how uncomfortable it makes one feel. I used to get annoyed when in airports or malls and someone was snapping or filming away and I was going to be in the frame. Now I try and turn my head so my face isn't visible or partially cover my face... whipping out the cellphone and making a faux phone call is great for this btw. If I don't have a phone, I speak into my CIA issued wrist microphone. I then kid myself that it's a Special Forces undercover ops training refresher.

Start charging for snapshots. Seriously. Get the kids to brazenly ask for 20 baht. Thais do.

[bifftastic]

I don't know about yours, but in my country people are very wary of touching children and consequently, it doesn't happen very much. It wasn't always like that, and isn't the same everywhere in the world.

Not to negate what you're saying at all, but it's possible that your children have picked up on your dislike of this practice.

It's kind of hard to stop people taking photo's really. I do the opposite of the above poster when in public and in the background of someone's photo-shoot. Big cheesy grin and a wave!

But that's me, not your children.

I agree with the person who says your kids should start charging for the snaps, maybe try and make more of a game of it all so they don't feel like recoiling away?

When someone whips out the camera phone, all get together, big smiles and then....when they're about to take the snap, pull some faces at them. Then, hands out 'yee sip baht yee sip baht yee sip baht'

I don't think you can ever change the way people out in public behave towards you and your family, but you can change how you perceive and react to it. I think a strategy designed to lessen the impact of this, be it the one I suggested or a different one, is the way to proceed so that your children aren't scared of people.

Good luck,

Biff

[gregb]

In the West, famous actors and the like are constantly bothered by people snapping pictures. They find it annoying but deal with it because it is their job. You need to accept that your children are just like those famous people here in Thailand, except they don't get any money for it. Thais are fascinated by farang babies and children. You can blame a decade or 2 of Western style advertising that has drilled it into their brain what a cute kid is supposed to look like, and how white their skin should be.

You really can't blame the Thais. They are responding to a cultural imperative that was inflicted on them largely by Western multinationals. The fact that you are a small part in this otherwise rather unfortunate system can't be helped. Do keep in mind that your wealthy lifestyle is at least partially responsible for the reasons behind this, so you are not totally without blame here, even if that is a very unintended and unwanted consequence of the way the world developed. The Thais have no hang ups about taking pictures or touching your children. They do it to each other, and they will act similarly with you. Unlike hiso Thais, farangs are considered approachable.

I submit if you didn't see this the last time you were here it is simply because the advertising and lifestyle changes in Thai culture had not become as developed as they are today. The seeds were already planted though. If it makes you feel any better, you can rest secure knowing that as the West becomes increasingly impoverished and the Chinese become increasingly wealthy, advertising and the fads of tomorrow will abandon the farang features as the ideal and Chinese babies will once again be considered the most attractive. Your grandchildren will likely be able to walk around Thailand without being overly disturbed.

This is the way of the world. You can't really stop the pictures, but as for touching we simply tell everyone the children have severe skin allergies and are very sensitive to being touched. Most people don't take offence at this and subsequently refrain from touching the children.

[Boo]

if the kids don't like or court the attention then imo it's your job to minimise the issues. If someone tries to touch your child, teach them how to say NO very loudly & how to push away the hand coming near them. This should usually stop the person in their tracks & then you can say, sorry no picture or my child doesn't want to be touched.

I wouldn't look for potential peados in every situation but not ALL thai people have kids best interest at heart. There are nutters in every society. Thailand is no different.

My son thankfully has never needed to be taught this, he has his own strong little personality & no one goes near him unless he wants them to, sometimes when someone tries to pinch his cheek he will knock their hand away, if someone thinks he is being rude then they clearly don't understand that their behavior is also rude. I would rather he offend some stranger than start to be scared of any physical contact or people in general.

so my advice is, if your kids are bothered by it then teach them how to stop it or at least deflect the attention themselves.

[jonnyscot]

Hi, our kids love their photo being taken by anyone, the wife doesn't seem to mind although I am a bit hesitant about it I do allow it, although some people don't ask permission, which I don't think is right,, I know at home it is considered inappropriate for a stranger to take photos of the children, but to my mind they have taken things a bit too far in UK,,, example : I know the schools must now have written authority from the parents in order for them to take the annual school photo, or the xmas nativity play,, 2 years back my brothers child once missed out on his annual photo because he didn't take the letter from the school home to be signed by his parents,,, We all want to protect our children as best we can but some things go a bit too far..

[pjclark1]

Touching is a no no.

But taking photos?

As far as I know no laws in any country in the world to stop anyone taking a photo of anyone else in a public place.

(with or without permission)

And why should there be?

Edited February 5, 2011 by pjclark1

[sbk]

if the kids don't like or court the attention then imo it's your job to minimise the issues. If someone tries to touch your child, teach them how to say NO very loudly & how to push away the hand coming near them. This should usually stop the person in their tracks & then you can say, sorry no picture or my child doesn't want to be touched.

I wouldn't look for potential peados in every situation but not ALL thai people have kids best interest at heart. There are nutters in every society. Thailand is no different.

My son thankfully has never needed to be taught this, he has his own strong little personality & no one goes near him unless he wants them to, sometimes when someone tries to pinch his cheek he will knock their hand away, if someone thinks he is being rude then they clearly don't understand that their behavior is also rude. I would rather he offend some stranger than start to be scared of any physical contact or people in general.

so my advice is, if your kids are bothered by it then teach them how to stop it or at least deflect the attention themselves.

Imagine that, Baby Boo has a strong personality

My sister came with her then 4 year old to visit and he was treated like a rock star, I recall we went to Erawan Waterfalls and a group of students all wanted their photos taken with him. My sister obliged for the first few but put her foot down when it became too many. My nephew never developed a complex over being petted and photographed but did, near the end of the 3 week visit turn to my sister with a cheeky little grin and say, "I'm cute, huh mom?"

I've seen a few Thai kids who don't like being touched either but the Thais don't really seem to notice that and do it anyway, best thing for you to do, is what you are doing, tell them my kids don't like it, please don't do it.

[Flatouthruthefog]

<br />Touching is a no no.<br />But taking photos?<br /><br />As far as I know no laws in any country in the world to stop anyone taking a photo of anyone else in a public place.<br />(with or without permission)<br />And why should there be?<br />

<br /><br /><br />

No laws, yes. But is it "ok" (the photos by strangers)?

It makes me feel uneasy and I don't like it. I watch our 5 year old son carefully when this happens (I am biased of course, but he IS very good looking)and I follow his reaction. If he smiles happily, so do I.

If he makes it clear he doesn't like it, I frown slightly and slowly shake my head.

No way would I post a picture of him on the other thread here: 'Show your half Asian baby' or whatever.

Why?

Proud parenting?

OK. But WHY?

It makes me uneasy and at my age I ought to listen to my inner voices.........!

[jonnyscot]

Touching is a no no.

But taking photos?

As far as I know no laws in any country in the world to stop anyone taking a photo of anyone else in a public place.

(with or without permission)

And why should there be?

Agreed, "public place" being the decisive factor there,, if however on any private property, institute or schools then may be a different ball game,, certainly as mentioned in Schools in Scotland,UK then permission is first sought from the parent,,,,,, I also think it may be unwise to take photographs of "anyone" for example; military personnel in quite a few countries even in public places,, otherwise you may find yourself in a rather unfavourable situation,,, although this topic refers to children

[koknia]

I'm a kid's photographer living here, but working mainly with the expat communities in Hong Kong and other large centers. In HKG this is a big issue there with the huge numbers of mainland tourists who completely overrun Disneyland and Ocean Park on weekends and holidays. Tourists will literally push the parents out of the way to take photos of the kids. If the kids are blond it's like a feeding frenzy,

The upshot is that the kids resent being treated like zoo animals and get negative associations about certain groups early on. I know it's not that bad in Thailand, but now that everyone is a photographer it can become very tiresome.

Try doing this in NYC and see how long it takes before you have a major problem, if not with the law, with a very angry dad....

[Senia]

how is the wife dealing with this ? most mommies are proud to have cute kids.

in all seriousness, just get the kids to say no . that should stop it. tell the kids to be firm and assertive when they say it.

last month I had women rubbing my pregnant belly for luck at the casinos , I did not like it . I guess they are just tactile in nature. but I had to be firm then they understood and left me alone.

[doglover]

Touching is a no no.

But taking photos?

As far as I know no laws in any country in the world to stop anyone taking a photo of anyone else in a public place.

(with or without permission)

And why should there be?

Well touching may be a "no no" for you, but certainly not for Thai. Glad the OP opened this thread. I have never liked the touching and photos of my child as if they were a zoo animal. I find it very rude and disrespectful yet I go along with it, to a degree, as it is the cultural norm. I really struggled with letting strangers hold her when she was still a baby and after a couple times decided that was going to be the end of it. I now no longer concern myself with the feelings of strangers on this but do my best to keep things polite. With our next baby I will just follow my heart. If I get a good vibe from a stranger I will let them hold my baby. If I have any hesitation I will stick to to it.

My daughter also does not like it (yes, could have come from me) and thankfully has a strong personality and from very early would respond with a gruntal "hugh" when someone would try to take her from me, as that's what they try to do. If they tried a second time she would hit there a hand. A third time she would just keep her arm swinging back an forth and turn her whole body away! I loved it! Up here in Issan, in my experience, it is the minority that will respectfully offer there hands for the child to come into to be held. Anyone who tries to pull my child from my hands does not always get a polite response from me, but never outright rude as understand they suffer from a lack of awareness. If a stranger shows a respectful desire to hold her I then have left it up to her from as soon as she could show her desires (she is now almost 2 yrs. old). If she wants to go, I let her (it's the odd time she does). If not, I politely get the message across.

What I especially don't like is the Thais that walk by and take a grab at her head area or a leg or an arm and give it a pinch and keep on walking. I call it a drive-by. Really lacking in descency. I think if I did something like that to their child they would think I was a bit of a nutter. I don't notice Thais performing the drive-by on Thai kids, but maybe I just haven't noticed it. But it the fact is there are people that just lack awareness of their actions and I think that's the case with the drive-by grabbers. If my daughter cried or was hurt even minimally I would do a follow up on it. But that has never been the case so I just have to put my feelings aside as usual.

Another bizzare one to me is close family or friends that think she is so cute that can't handle seem to handle it so they let it out with a somewhat hard slap on her skin...lol. You see that one? Usually with a bit of a lip bite and then followed by the slap. Sort of like.......How can you be so cute? Slap! I leave that one alone too because Mom is right there when they do it and she does it herself anyway! And my daughter only shows mild discontent so........it's just how Thais do it.

I have tried to educate the locals here with how to properly drive a car for 5 years. Honks of the horn, cutting them off in return, tailgating, etc.... They still drive the same! (And I still ignorantly go about educating them) So I agree with some of the other posters that Thais will be Thai (as they should be) so we can only deal with ourselves and do our best to keep an open mind. Bottom line is I don't let the strangers dictate the situation. I respect that what they are doing is normal here. But I also respect myself and my daughter. If I don't want to be in a photoshoot from a whipped out cellphone camera I ignore them like I would a tuk tuk driver and just keep walking. So to the OP, if your kids don't like it I agree that they should say "No", just in a polite manner. And I see nothing wrong with screening the photo with there hand over there face. Maybe after a few generations they'll get the message.... or our light features will fall from the limelight as another poster suggests.....(interesting outlook by the way, could very well be the truth)

I realize Thais adore children and love it even more when people show adoration for their own children. But I think even Thais would get tired of the amount of attention some of our farang-thai children get. At least when my daughter is a super star she'll already know how to deal with all the attention! ...Grin and bear it .

[roadschooler]

Thank you very much everyone for your thoughtful responses. I really do appreciate them. Some were quite funny and were very interesting to read. My wife is always eager to hear the latest post.

Thank you Doglover for sharing your personal stories. I have relaxed quite a but and I have told my daughter to trust her own feelings. If she does not like a situation then she should trust her feelings and take appropriate action. I have instructed her to push the stranger's hand away from her face if it bothers her. My kids are bothered by the "drive-bys" as well by the way.

I have to share an interesting event the other day. We were at HomePro in Bangkok and a sales girls asked my wife if she could kiss my 2 year old son. Of course, my wife said no. The sales girl must have thought my wife didn't understand her because after the uttered "no", she asked again but louder. The answer was still no. I think she was surprised that my wife refused her request.

I have come to an interesting conclusion. It seems that the most egregious behavior happens at the malls and not on the streets. It usually happens with young Thai women (teenagers, college students, and others). They whip out their cameras and with "baby voices" state "look at the cute farangs". Some will attempt to touch. But, I am a little dismayed that others are calling my kids "farang" because they are Thai as well. I guess this is another thread. ;(

My kids have taken my genes and all have white skin and light brown to blond hair. I joke and tell people that the genes from the ancestors of Great Britain are so strong that they don't respect genetic rules. All kidding aside, I have learned to deal with people's behavior with my kids. I keep in mind that Thais really love kids and overall mean no harm. However, I do keep a watchful eye out as any good father should be doing.

Again, thank you all very much for sharing your thoughts.

All the best.

[kannon99]

It bothered me with my first kid here but now that I have 4 here I'm kindof used it. I don't care for the touching but sometimes it happens so fast I can't prevent it. Photos, what can you really do?

My kids usually do the following:

7 yr old daughter: she says "Mai ow" and then poses anyway lol

5 yr old son: crosses his arms and scowls

3 yr old identical twin girls: one screams a high pitch scream and hides behind me, and the other one puts her hand on hip in a pose.

It was really bad when the twins were smaller; like think paparazzi in the mall. My husband and I had a rule that whoever is pushing the stroller with twins DOES NOT STOP. If you stop, you're surrounded!

[Forethat]

Not many dare touch or take picture of my baby when I'm around. It usually only takes one look at me eyes and that's the end of it....

I was once thinking about making a sign or something in two languages and attach to the stroller "if any part of your body touches my daughter - I'll fracture it"

[doglover]

Not many dare touch or take picture of my baby when I'm around. It usually only takes one look at me eyes and that's the end of it....

I was once thinking about making a sign or something in two languages and attach to the stroller "if any part of your body touches my daughter - I'll fracture it"

Ouch! Certainly one way to deal with it.....I'm sure your wife would be happy to write down the translation into Thai for you...

[Carry]

Not only thai but tourist as well snapping away usually I make a comment stating we're not a tourist attraction...

As for touching, I was in MBK last week and had the babe iin our pram, I look away for 2 minutes and the pram is empty my heart sank...2 m. up ahead she is in the arms of an old chinese lady, I really dislike that people pick up your baby at anytime, while theyre sleeping or they try to take her while im feeding her?!

I dont mind that people want to hold her as long as she is awake and likes it [and oh she does love the attention already, oh boy!] and they just ask the parent!

[koknia]

I was visiting friends here in '91. They had just gone out for their first meal after having a baby. They took their 2-month old to a restaurant on the first floor of a mall somewhere out on Sukhumvit. When the waitress asked if they could hold the baby they handed her over, not thinking twice. A couple minutes later they saw a small crowd out on Sukhumvit and wondered what the fuss was, when they realized it was their daughter being passed around.

[doglover]

Not only thai but tourist as well snapping away usually I make a comment stating we're not a tourist attraction...

As for touching, I was in MBK last week and had the babe iin our pram, I look away for 2 minutes and the pram is empty my heart sank...2 m. up ahead she is in the arms of an old chinese lady, I really dislike that people pick up your baby at anytime, while theyre sleeping or they try to take her while im feeding her?!

I dont mind that people want to hold her as long as she is awake and likes it [and oh she does love the attention already, oh boy!] and they just ask the parent!

That's just nuts Carry. Besides carrying a taser you could try buckling your little one down. I am assuming a 'pram' is a stroller and they usually have a strap to buckle the little snuggler in.

[sylvafern]

I hardly ever visit Thaivisa these days so it's funny that I logged in today and saw this topic as I started a thread the same as this exactly 5 years ago back in the days when family related questions were posted in the Ladies forum. Here's the link:

It started a hot debate where people even accused me of lying about things like my son being taken out of his pram, etc but there were also a lot of other people that, like me, found this type of behaviour difficult to deal with. What I can add to the conversation now is that it does get easier as your child gets older. My son is 6 1/2 now and the instances of him being touched by strangers are rare (maybe once every month or two). He still doesn't like it and I always know when it happens as he comes very close to me and tries to 'hide' himself with my body but at least he now understands the reasons why and I can brush it off with a 'never mind, just ignore it'.

Edited March 10, 2011 by sylvafern

[Carry]

There is no strapping the baby since she was only 3 months old at the time....visiting the Thai family and what they all do to her with the best means is something Im having a hard time with too though might not be the same as strangers maybe even worst because you can't tell them to leave your kid alone.......

[Crossy]

I thought of this thread yesterday.

My two granddaughters (2 and 3 years) are over on holiday, they brought the other grandparents with them, mum and dad are at home earning next years trip.

We went to Safari World, great day out and the little horrors were totally worn out at the end (both got in free too as <1m high).

The girls, both blue-eyed, blonde, fair skin attracted a LOT of attention and a fair number of photos (wish we'd charged). ALL the Syrians (there was a tour in) asked if they could take pictures, 90% of the Indians (yes another tour) also asked, about 60% of the Thais asked, nobody tried to pick either of them up. The girls mostly love having their pictures taken so there's no problem as far as they are concerned (towards the end when they were getting tired they started saying 'no' and hiding), in the controlled environment of the park two sets of proud grandparents (ok, my wife is only a proxy grandma) were quite happy to oblige.

Move to Future Park Rangsit (actually earlier in the week), obviously 99% Thais. Again lots of attention, mainly from the young shop girls (neither granddad had any problem at all with this ), the difference here is lots of people (mainly older ladies) tried to touch or pick up the younger of the two without asking (she didn't like it anyway and made her objection known at 98dB [that's loud]). Understandably, in the less controlled environment of a mall with multiple exits we were more on guard (not exactly edgy, but certainly watchful) but we're like that with them in the UK too.

Now I've written that lot I'm not entirely sure what my point is, let's just say that it's essential to be in control of the situation (and the little horrors) at all times, drop your guard in these busy places and there could be heart-stopping moments.

By the way, if you visit Safari World it's worth knowing that if you buy the cuddly toys after each show rather than from one of the stalls around the park, that a. they are half the price and b. you get to take as many pictures of the kids with the animals as you like (the bird show people were particularly obliging).

P.S. The two lovelies aren't really horrors, they have been little angels for the two weeks they've been here (a week to go), but wouldn't any granddad say the same .

[CMwanderer]

I am so glad to read this and realise that it isn't just me. We have just moved here and my (almost) 2 year old daughter is constantly being snatched at and touched. After travelling around Europe we were sort of used to strangers taking photos of her without asking, even though it was annoying it didn't really impede on us too much. But here, it is the touching that gets on my nerves. She has blonde hair, green eyes and is cute as a button (if I do say so myself) so she stands out in the crowd here. I will certainly learn to say "please don't she doesn't like it" (anyone know how to say this in Thai?). I understand the cultural differences and try and let it slide but some days it is just too much to bear. I need to learn how to politely tell them no until she is old enough to not be shy in saying it herself.

[MikeyIdea]

I was visiting friends here in '91. They had just gone out for their first meal after having a baby. They took their 2-month old to a restaurant on the first floor of a mall somewhere out on Sukhumvit. When the waitress asked if they could hold the baby they handed her over, not thinking twice. A couple minutes later they saw a small crowd out on Sukhumvit and wondered what the fuss was, when they realized it was their daughter being passed around.

Yepp, Mummy and I used to do the same. We thought it was a perfect way for us to get some free time to eat undesturbed. We still think the same actually

My daughter is 6 years old now and she has never complained, nor did she ever catch any bugs from it either, she got stronger instead

[bow]

My seven years old, half Thai half farang daughter gradually dislikes the touching more and more. (People are especially after her long wavy brown hair - I suppose because it is unusual in Thai girls.) She used to just give people a hostile stare, but these days she runs away and tries to hide behind mum or dad. I don't blame her - few people like to be treated as an animal in a zoo !

[CMwanderer]

I am concerned that it is making my daughter scared of people in general and while I do appreciate that she has 'stranger danger' I am worried about the long term effect of this on her. Is anyone else worried about this?

[chunktal]

I have a 2 1/2 year old daughter and people have been trying to touch her since she was born, some get through but most get stopped and ironically do not like being grabbed by a 6' 4" bloke with bear claws. i don't think they understand that from her point of view in the world, it is the same thing.

I'm constantly aware of the people around us when we go out, especially the ones that try to get behind us as they tend to do "sneak" attacks from the rear, that really annoys me.

The only problem with photos is that she shys away from them as people come at her and now does it even when we are taking a photo ourselves.