So Who Finds Themselves Being Converted?

[Moonrakers]

Just a quick question to the board.

How many of you are starting to convert to Buddhism without actually being aware of it??

Not a chance in hell.

If anything, 'Mrs. Rakers is becoming increasingly agnostic and little rakersette absolutely will not be indoctrinated with such nonsense.

The temples make for a nice day out, that's it.

respect for pulling the word agnostic into the debate.

people who bandy about the term atheist generally have little idea of what it means.

Dont confuse the good intentions of most religions with those pervert them to their own ends. like guns, religions do not kill people. people kill people.

for the record, i am agnostic.

Whilst I agree with most of your post, I disagree that Western people don't know the difference between atheist and agnostic.

I am inclined to agree with nocturn here.

It seems to me that a lot of people don;t know the true meaning of atheism. Sit down and have a proper chat with many people who claim t be atheist and it soon becomes apparent that they are agnostic. People also have a habit of labelling me as an atheist because I believe the bible (or whatever scripture) is all nonsense.

Edited February 12, 2011 by Moonrakers

[mca]

My best mate is a dyslexic agnostic insomniac.

He stays awake all night pondering the existence of dog.

[apetley]

Just a quick question to the board.

How many of you are starting to convert to Buddhism without actually being aware of it??

I am involved with a Thai family who are very staunch Buddhists, and seeing that it is almost a state religion here, I find it almost impossible to avoid it.

I have never been religious myself and when i first came here, i just went along with it to keep people happy and avoided it whenever i could. My Thai family are very understanding and i have explained that in the UK we are not very religious.. Well not those who were born into the Christian religion anyway. They are happy for me to not participate or participate as I wish.

I have been to a lot of temples, and i have tried waiiing etc, and when we donate for caskets, I do the bunch of incense sticks thing and bang the drum.

I actually quite enjoy this religion as it seems harmless to me. I don't believe in god, and this religion seems to not really have a god so much as a code.

Anyway. I am not saying that i am being converted by a long stretch of the imagination. You could say that i go along with parts of it as a mixture of curiosity and politeness.

Am i alone in this? Do many of you just refuse to even look at this religion after being so turned off by other religions. How many actually just go along with it for politeness and interest? How many of you have actually been drawn in and becoming quite involved? How many of you want to be monks?...lol

[Thongkorn]

I believe in Right and wrong , I believe in good and bad , is that not religion.

What determines right and wrong for you?

Is it the laws of the country you live/ were born in, the god that you follow or your inner conscience?

Answer that then you may be closer to determining if your you are following a religion, or a spiritual path .

What is right or wrong under one belief may be different under another

What determines my belifes are. I treat people like I would like to be treat. I talk to people like i would be talked too. And if i can do good i will , But I do not care if people do bad to me because they only do it once and then I do not bother ever again with them , I never seek revenge because Revenge finds the person its self.

[Moonrakers]

Do unto others as you would have them do unto you

I would like for Megan Fox roger me senseless................

[phetaroi]

Buddha never claimed to be a god, so to me Buddhism is not a religion but a philosophy or way of life, therefore I think the question is incorrect.

As for the way of life and respect for sell and others that was taught by Buddha, I believe that is a good way to live you life, and to follow such teachings does not need any form of 'conversion'

That's one point of view. A different point of view depends on how you define a religion.

[phetaroi]

Back to the original question. I was brought up a Methodist, converted to Catholicism when in my teens (but never felt quite comfortable in it). When I began visiting Thailand in the late 1980s I did become attracted to Thai Buddhism, primarily because I felt that Thais were, in general, on the poorer side of things, yet relatively content and happy. I guess you would say I became a Christian Buddhist, or a Buddhist Christian. Some combination...not instead of, but parallel to. More recently I have become just as convinced that Buddhism doesn't have the answers to the "great questions", anymore than Christianity does. Yet, I find that each religion has some very good and practical aspects. So, I piece together those principles that make logical sense to me, and in "the end", let's the chips fall where they may.

[mark45y]

Right...... i accept there are atheists, and i accept there are hypocrites...

When a dying man who was an atheist all his life suddenly starts to ponder on it, and then embraces a religious thought for personal comfort. Does it mean that man died a hypocrite??

James morrow once said.... "There are NO atheists is foxholes"

Know what I an saying?

I never had a foxhole but I was an atheist in a bunker. Does that count. Bunkers were normally safer than foxholes and drier too. I was young it was my atheist period.

[mark45y]

I used to date a Scottish lass. She was a Wiccan or something like that. We went to parties for the changing seasons where guys with deer horns ran around naked and the women danced topless while bag pipes and drummers played. The men would dance too but after 2 or 3 hours they would fall down but the women continued (I was a drummer). It was pagan whatever it was. They called the four winds and things like that. They danced around a maypole too.

Then I became a Buddhist years ago. But when I came to Thailand I realized they were closer to the Scottish woman, Animists. They remind me of the nuns in grade school who used to put the statue of St Anthony out in the rain if they couldn't find the object they misplaced and had prayed to St. Anthony to help them find. Although the Thais do it with a positive twist. They don't put Buddha out in the rain they give him strawberry soda pop. The nuns could have learned something from the positive approach. Like they could have given me a chocolate bar to do my homework instead of hitting me on the head with a pointer.

But I am not really into it. In my apartment I only have 10 Buddha statues, 4 amulets, some sacred wood from Pitchit and these black hard beans, 4 cloth flag monk things, two large old monk photographs 4 Jatucams amulets made especially for me and some small clay pressed thingys, one really nice old small framed photo of an old monk and some green leaves that make your breasts lucky and a plant that cures vaginal infections. The only reason I buy incense by the hundred count is because it is cheaper.

I have never been worried about hell as long as my first wife dies before me. She gets there the devil is gone, for sure and she is cold enough to put out any fire even the fires of hell.

[Moonrakers]

Back to the original question. I was brought up a Methodist, converted to Catholicism when in my teens (but never felt quite comfortable in it). When I began visiting Thailand in the late 1980s I did become attracted to Thai Buddhism, primarily because I felt that Thais were, in general, on the poorer side of things, yet relatively content and happy. I guess you would say I became a Christian Buddhist, or a Buddhist Christian. Some combination...not instead of, but parallel to. More recently I have become just as convinced that Buddhism doesn't have the answers to the "great questions", anymore than Christianity does. Yet, I find that each religion has some very good and practical aspects. So, I piece together those principles that make logical sense to me, and in "the end", let's the chips fall where they may.

So you basically go about bouncing between one religion and another depending on how it suits you at the time!

Are you a Man U fan as well?

[gregb]

Richard Dawkins is my hero, and I am most definitely a teapot agnostic.

Religion is not a personal thing. It is a means of control and enforcing a standard of behavior on a group of like minded people.

I am no more likely to adopt religion over here that I was in the West. I will happily pretend to do the religion thing if it helps me to fit into a peer group. But I would never believe it is anything more than an act to make my acquaintances feel more comfortable. I don't view this as being a hypocrite. People don't like those who are different, so when in Rome, you do as the Romans. It is nothing more than that.

There are good people who are religious, and good people who are not religious. And there are bad people of both varieties also. If religion works for you, then go right ahead. You get no argument from me. But I myself would put more faith in a rock helping me out in a tough spot than I would some imaginary friend in the sky.

[geriatrickid]

My friend that is often clueless does come up with idiot savant statements at times and offered his views on Thais, religion and religious interactions with farangs, which I think was brilliant;

A Thai that takes his/her religion seriously and understands its precepts will remain discreet and private. Outside of the long term relationship couples, the Thais that take the farang along to the Temple do it for show because they think that's what the farang wants to see or do. He never ever takes me along to the Temple when he goes as he says, he knows I do not believe and will not accept. I have made clear that I am not a proponent of idolatry, whether it be making offerings before a Buddha or praying to a statue of the virgin Mary. The Thais that drag the farangs when visiting a wat often do it to show that the locals have morals etc. His is sort of a conservative view, but I believe it is typical of the "better" educated Thais. One is welcome to come, visit and see, but it should come out of interest and a desire to learn.

There are only two established religions that I know of where there is no desire to recruit or convert people; Buddhism and Judaism. Maybe this is why they have been able to last so long despite existing in a world and place that is hostile to the two religions.

Edited February 12, 2011 by geriatrickid

[mark45y]

My friend that is often clueless does come up with idiot savant statements at times and offered his views on Thais, religion and religious interactions with farangs, which I think was brilliant;

A Thai that takes his/her religion seriously and understands its precepts will remain discreet and private. Outside of the long term relationship couples, the Thais that take the farang along to the Temple do it for show because they think that's what the farang wants to see or do. He never ever takes me along to the Temple when he goes as he says, he knows I do not believe and will not accept. I have made clear that I am not a proponent of idolatry, whether it be making offerings before a Buddha or praying to a statue of the virgin Mary. The Thais that drag the farangs when visiting a wat often do it to show that the locals have morals etc. His is sort of a conservative view, but I believe it is typical of the "better" educated Thais. One is welcome to come, visit and see, but it should come out of interest and a desire to learn.

There are only two established religions that I know of where there is no desire to recruit or convert people; Buddhism and Judaism. Maybe this is why they have been able to last so long despite existing in a world and place that is hostile to the two religions.

I don't think Quakers, Amish or Mennonites try and convert people. At least in my experience having lived in communities dominated by those religions.

[thaimite]

Do unto others as you would have them do unto you

I read some where that the original of this quote was actually "Do NOT do unto others as you would NOT have them do to you".

That makes a lot more sense to me

[Moonrakers]

Do unto others as you would have them do unto you

I read some where that the original of this quote was actually "Do NOT do unto others as you would NOT have them do to you".

That makes a lot more sense to me

I'm drunk, Swindon town fc have lost again and I'm in a bad mood.

Let;s put is this way..............

If Megan Fox knocks on my door right now and demands that I give her the shafting of her life time, then I might possibly start believing more that theire is a god after all.

[Thongkorn]

Do unto others as you would have them do unto you

I read some where that the original of this quote was actually "Do NOT do unto others as you would NOT have them do to you".

That makes a lot more sense to me

I'm drunk, Swindon town fc have lost again and I'm in a bad mood.

Let;s put is this way..............

If Megan Fox knocks on my door right now and demands that I give her the shafting of her life time, then I might possibly start believing more that there is a god after all.

Have you thought it may be Gods way of punishing you for not being religious, Swindon losing that is.

[newsite12]

Right...... i accept there are atheists, and i accept there are hypocrites...

When a dying man who was an atheist all his life suddenly starts to ponder on it, and then embraces a religious thought for personal comfort. Does it mean that man died a hypocrite??

James morrow once said.... "There are NO atheists is foxholes"

Know what I an saying?

Yes then he is a hypocrite. I know what your saying your trying to disguise your own shortcomings by going after atheists. Just believe in your mombo jumbo and be happy with it.

So are you going to tell the board now that you never nor have you ever celebrated Christmas?

Being that it is the biggest Christian festival in the calendar.

So if you have or do celebrate it, or Easter for that matter, then by your own rationale I would consider you a hypocrite. .

[ELCata]

I'm an agnostic in every sphere of life, assigning a negligible probability to the existence of God. I celebrate Christmas as a non-religious holiday & accompany the GF to the temple etc. but view this as more of an educational experience.

I don't think of religion as a problem per se, more the 'process of non-thing called faith'; whether this is a fundamentalist belief in Islam or neo-conservatism makes no difference.

If I can paraphrase the Nobel prize winning physicist & noted sceptic Steven Weinberg, 'Without faith, good people would do good things & bad people would do bad things, but for good people to do bad things, that takes faith.'

I believe in Right and wrong , I believe in good and bad , is that not religion.

No that's moral relativism. I'd suggest that Humanism would be a better description. If you'd said that you believe in good & evil then...

[jaideeguy]

I find that the more I learn about Buddhism, the more I see the same same, but different hiprocies that abound in all other major organized religions [christianity, muselem, etc etc], I used to assume that Buddhism was less violent and war mongering, but got that bubble popped when I read up on the bloody history of Thailand and see how Thai gets along with it;s neighbors. I also have heard many stories of corruption within the ranks of monks and see how the wats encourage the rampant abuse of alcohol at wat gatherings. Sorry if I am offending anyone, but this is just my opinion after observing this country's religion for 12 yrs.

I also see the same amount of superstitions that abound in the christian [catholic] religions.

The longer I live and learn, the further away from organized religions I drift. I do see that they can and do give the ignorant masses something to live for and offer a sense of community.

[pitrevie]

Right...... i accept there are atheists, and i accept there are hypocrites...

When a dying man who was an atheist all his life suddenly starts to ponder on it, and then embraces a religious thought for personal comfort. Does it mean that man died a hypocrite??

James morrow once said.... "There are NO atheists is foxholes"

Know what I an saying?

Yes then he is a hypocrite. I know what your saying your trying to disguise your own shortcomings by going after atheists. Just believe in your mombo jumbo and be happy with it.

So are you going to tell the board now that you never nor have you ever celebrated Christmas?

Being that it is the biggest Christian festival in the calendar.

So if you have or do celebrate it, or Easter for that matter, then by your own rationale I would consider you a hypocrite. .

Christmas is in fact a pagan festival which the early Christian church took over from the Romans in order to accommodate the pagan converts who wished to continue the celebrations. The birthday of Christ if it ever took place is not recorded anywhere in the New Testament. I celebrate it every year and it has no religious significance for me.

[robblok]

fault

Edited February 13, 2011 by robblok

[robblok]

Right...... i accept there are atheists, and i accept there are hypocrites...

When a dying man who was an atheist all his life suddenly starts to ponder on it, and then embraces a religious thought for personal comfort. Does it mean that man died a hypocrite??

James morrow once said.... "There are NO atheists is foxholes"

Know what I an saying?

Yes then he is a hypocrite. I know what your saying your trying to disguise your own shortcomings by going after atheists. Just believe in your mombo jumbo and be happy with it.

So are you going to tell the board now that you never nor have you ever celebrated Christmas?

Being that it is the biggest Christian festival in the calendar.

So if you have or do celebrate it, or Easter for that matter, then by your own rationale I would consider you a hypocrite. .

Kinda depends how you celebrate Christmas and its a public secret its stolen from the pagan light festival to get more converts. So in a way Christmas is hypocritical. I have never ever celebrated Christmas by going to the church and praying. I do have spend it as a day with my family without any religious meaning. Im pretty sure all the lights and the three plus the presents have no real christian meaning ? Next time if you make remarks do a little background check it makes you look less stupid.

I also dont see myself as a hypocrite if i go into a church to pay my respects to a death friend. Just being in a church does not make me a hypocrite any more then adapting a holiday and making it a family holiday without any religious meaning.

So if Christmas was manipulated to suit the pagans its actually hypocritical from the Christians to celebrate it on the wrong day and adapting the pagan rituals. Your turn.

[Huey]

I'm Wiccan and my wife and her family are Buddhist. I find that in many ways our faiths are quite similar and with a lil bit of understanding on both sides we get along really well.

[timekeeper]

i was talking to a friend the other day and in low serious tones he said to me'

''have you ever thought about committing suicide?''

i said ''i no, do you think i should?''

anyway it got me thinking, maybe this is the place to be:

The Church of Euthanasia

their motto is :

"Save the Planet, Kill Yourself"

seems like a worthy cause.

i am not ready for it yet myself but i do encourage some members on TV to go for it and bring salvation to the rest of us.

there may be a dwindling congregation in Pattaya you could join..............

[Moonrakers]

Right...... i accept there are atheists, and i accept there are hypocrites...

When a dying man who was an atheist all his life suddenly starts to ponder on it, and then embraces a religious thought for personal comfort. Does it mean that man died a hypocrite??

James morrow once said.... "There are NO atheists is foxholes"

Know what I an saying?

Yes then he is a hypocrite. I know what your saying your trying to disguise your own shortcomings by going after atheists. Just believe in your mombo jumbo and be happy with it.

So are you going to tell the board now that you never nor have you ever celebrated Christmas?

Being that it is the biggest Christian festival in the calendar.

So if you have or do celebrate it, or Easter for that matter, then by your own rationale I would consider you a hypocrite. .

I have never celebrated Christmas in my adult life

I've endured it, as a marketing gimmick which is more or less forced upon me. And no doubt I'll end up buying presents for my children, because the marketing gimmick would make them feel left out if I didn't.

Asides from the few days off, which again are forced upon me, I'd rather not have Christmas at all. Bah humbug and all that but for a self employed person such as myself, it really can be a major pain in the ass.

And besides, since when has Christmas or Easter been about religion anyway? Do you go to mass on Xmas Eve? No, Thought not. So stop branding everybody else a hypocrite, innit!

[Moonrakers]

Double post

Edited February 13, 2011 by Moonrakers

[timekeeper]

i am an atheist but i do celebrate Christmas for religious reasons

i think that any reason to offend any loud mouthed Islamist toerag or some self loathing multicultural politically correct thumbsucker is a great opportunity

therefore for that religious reason alone, i am more than happy to celebrate Christmas with all the bells and whistles i can muster, baby Jesus and all!

(a quote from the wonderfully sinful outspoken atheist Pat Condell)

[Moonrakers]

Bleedin 'eck the self righteous get under my skin at times.

Somebody's GF starts telling him about Buddha and ghosts and stuff and then they think they can tell everybody else how to live their lives.

If there is a god, he'd be looking down on rather a lot of people and doing major face palms right now.

[IanForbes]

Okay, I'm back. I should have stayed here all night. One hour in Spicey reminded me why I don't like that place... and especially after 3 AM. Only two fights while I was there, but my sinuses are acting up again... and that was even with a face mask.

Now, where were we? Have we solved the religion problem yet? Has Moonrakers had his visit with Megan Fox yet. I DID give her a call and left a message that he was interested. Sometimes I think I'm too good at being nice to people. But, it DID pay off late this morning. Unfortunately, I'm going to need a nap this afternoon ... again.

[timekeeper]

What a mess the world would be in if there were no religions.

I respect them all.

Atheists make me laugh.

this atheist will make you laugh:

ok maybe not..........

Edited February 13, 2011 by timekeeper