Bentonite? And A Leaky Dam

[Foreverford]

My lake is leaking into an adjacent klong through the klong levee road that was damaged by my f-i-l 's fish trap a few years ago. I fixed the blow out but now have noticed that the lake that is on the other side of the levee road is leaking into the klong. I have heard of bentonite(sp?) that is used to fix leaks and I believe it is a form of clay in powder form and it is effective. Has anyone used this and is it readily available here in Thailand. Any other sugggestions that would be practical would be greatly appreciated. the leak is about 6-7 meters below the top of the levee road (dam for the lake). Forever in a Ford

[WatersEdge]

It is available in Thailand,

although I don't remember the company source,

I sourced it via CemenThai HomeMart Chiang Mai

The lady at that office is Prae Weeraprachamate 081-952-9292

She speaks near perfect English.

It is not one of her standard product lines,

but she did a search and found it.

It comes in 50 kg sacks, and if memory serves correctly,

a ten wheel load of 300 sacks was the minimum order.

This is the Sodium Bentonite

the fancy stuff intended for well drilling, trench shoring, etc,

At that time, four years ago, the cost was B9 / kg.

After this much time has passed, she may not remember that she sourced it.

I buy bulk as mined Calcium Bentonite for B900 / ten wheel truckload.

At 15,000 kg that comes to B0.06/kg.

Soaked in water it absorbs water until a slippery grease.

I've line the bottom of one pond and it holds very tightly.

I applied it thick, but I'm sure far less would work just fine.

I happen to have 5 dumptruck loads standing by on the farm that I'm in the process of losing.

Should there be a steady market for it,

I'd gladly clean up the run of the mine material

so that it is also in powdered form in a nice clean bag.

The process of cleaning it up is simple enough,

Soak and periodically stir in a volume of water so that it forms a slurry,

which then allows any heavy solids to sink to the bottom of the vessel.

Then sundry on a plastic sheet, and hammer mill the shrunken tiles to dust.

If you simply dump the chunks of stiff hard clay as it comes off the dumptruck,

into the edge of the pond, it will absorb water and melt to slippery greasy slurry,

running down the side of pond bank.

Of course it will follow any water that is escaping, and eventually clog the porous gravel of the escape route.

If any are interested

I'll inquire what it takes to ship bulk loads to your location,

as a good friend is a truck company owner.

Calcium Bentonite as available here is also the stuff used as vegetable oil filter, skin treatment, and digestive tract cleanser.

[Foreverford]

It is available in Thailand,

although I don't remember the company source,

I sourced it via CemenThai HomeMart Chiang Mai

The lady at that office is Prae Weeraprachamate 081-952-9292

She speaks near perfect English.

It is not one of her standard product lines,

but she did a search and found it.

It comes in 50 kg sacks, and if memory serves correctly,

a ten wheel load of 300 sacks was the minimum order.

This is the Sodium Bentonite

the fancy stuff intended for well drilling, trench shoring, etc,

At that time, four years ago, the cost was B9 / kg.

After this much time has passed, she may not remember that she sourced it.

I buy bulk as mined Calcium Bentonite for B900 / ten wheel truckload.

At 15,000 kg that comes to B0.06/kg.

Soaked in water it absorbs water until a slippery grease.

I've line the bottom of one pond and it holds very tightly.

I applied it thick, but I'm sure far less would work just fine.

I happen to have 5 dumptruck loads standing by on the farm that I'm in the process of losing.

Should there be a steady market for it,

I'd gladly clean up the run of the mine material

so that it is also in powdered form in a nice clean bag.

The process of cleaning it up is simple enough,

Soak and periodically stir in a volume of water so that it forms a slurry,

which then allows any heavy solids to sink to the bottom of the vessel.

Then sundry on a plastic sheet, and hammer mill the shrunken tiles to dust.

If you simply dump the chunks of stiff hard clay as it comes off the dumptruck,

into the edge of the pond, it will absorb water and melt to slippery greasy slurry,

running down the side of pond bank.

Of course it will follow any water that is escaping, and eventually clog the porous gravel of the escape route.

If any are interested

I'll inquire what it takes to ship bulk loads to your location,

as a good friend is a truck company owner.

Calcium Bentonite as available here is also the stuff used as vegetable oil filter, skin treatment, and digestive tract cleanser.

Thanks much Edge of the Water. You sound like you have the stuff I need. In bulk is no problem as I can use chunks of it to beat against my head instead of my poor fists as the in-laws continue to astound me with their "unique" ways. I can do the "Shake" and the "Shimmy" with a bit of the "Funky Chicken" and the "Boog-a-lou" to get all the dust off and be able to use it in powder form. I PM'd you so hopefully we can get it together and will await your reply. thanks for the response and info. Bent Fords tonite Forever

[joker7]

If there is any drilling rigs in your area you could take a few sx from then im certain they wouldnt mind.

Either that or contact a few drilling fluids companies in Thailand they may be able to help you source some.

MI Drilling Fluids / Halliburton.

Let me know how you get on.

Good luck.

[WatersEdge]

Hi joker7,

If I was paying the bills on a drill rig,

and someone came wanting to make off with a couple sacks of mud,

I'd naturally object.

The price I got on full truckload quantity a couple years ago was B9.00 / kg.

That makes a 50 kg sack worth B450

That said, Sodium Bentonite has a much higher swell ratio than Calcium Bentonite.

As I recall in the order of 20X versus perhaps 2-5X

so depending on the application, the high price is justified.

The cost of a collapse downhole or lost circulation greatly outweighs the cost of mud.

I'm talking out of my expertise, but there's a couple of guys I know of nearby on the forum

who can set us right on particulars.

It would be nice to know a sack by sack price,

and who's selling where.

The full truckload was to come out of Bangkok area, but not sure exactly where.

I didn't go that route, so didn't learn the details.

[TPI]

[quote

I buy bulk as mined Calcium Bentonite for B900 / ten wheel truckload.

At 15,000 kg that comes to B0.06/kg.

Soaked in water it absorbs water until a slippery grease.

I've line the bottom of one pond and it holds very tightly.

I applied it thick, but I'm sure far less would work just fine.

I happen to have 5 dumptruck loads standing by on the farm that I'm in the process of losing.

Should there be a steady market for it,

I'd gladly clean up the run of the mine material

so that it is also in powdered form in a nice clean bag.

The process of cleaning it up is simple enough,

Soak and periodically stir in a volume of water so that it forms a slurry,

which then allows any heavy solids to sink to the bottom of the vessel.

Then sundry on a plastic sheet, and hammer mill the shrunken tiles to dust.

If any are interested

I'll inquire what it takes to ship bulk loads to your location,

as a good friend is a truck company owner.

Calcium Bentonite as available here is also the stuff used as vegetable oil filter, skin treatment, and digestive tract cleanser.

Love Bentonite! We used bags of the stuff wildcatting in Oz. I've been looking everywhere for it, can you send 10 wheel trucks to Phrae....say 10 trucks??

[WatersEdge]

I'd like to repeat that this material is Calcium Bentonite,

it looks and smells like drilling mud

but I need to be clear that it has only around 1/10 the swelling capacity of Sodium Bentonite.

It's good stuff but it's not out of this world fabulous as the expensive stuff is.

Even so, with transport and labor added, it still represents considerable cost savings.

With two of you inquiring on truckloads, I've set about getting it all to happen.

Waiting for the details on official requirements of shipping raw materials province to province.

Should have answers in hand early this week.

While thousands of truckloads are hauled all over town regularly,

there's a problem with going out of province.

It's apparently not as simple as loading a truck and sending to destination

Who'd have known that there would be some daffy obstacle to a simple good idea?

What could be wrong with loading dirt onto a truck and hauling it?

Our dubiously brilliant public servants in the US have coined the phrase,

"Out of an abundance of caution."

Doesn't that just make you feel totally safe? They are looking out for you!

Bet that would catch on real well here as well.

In the US we have abundantly cautioned ourselves right out of international competitive edge

but that's becoming business' prime function, Make up for government's waste.

Hmmm...back to the issue at hand.

My goal is to define it in terms of freight charge per kilometer

and then add in the official fees.

The material cost is "dirt cheap"

If the destination point can accommodate a truck and trailer,

then the truck will carry 14.5 tons and the trailer 15.5

total rig 30 tons

Labor to unload ready on arrival.

The next step is to put a little preparation into it,

because apparently the raw material restrictions don't exist for a packaged product.

A bag over the same material evidently makes a difference.

I ran some through my hammer mill a few years ago, and it came out the most beautiful fine dust,

It's a dry season project as the chunks must first be totally dry.

Incidentally, it is a great absorbent / dessicant when placed anywhere with a moisture problem.

It is sold as dessicant packs for keeping shipping containers dry during transit.

Much cheaper than Calcium Chloride or Silica Gel, although it is heavier for equivalent absorbent capacity

It works great mixed into damp grain,

as it takes moisture from the grain,

but it also adds clay weight to the mix,

so it's limited to grain you intend to use in house.

or a trusting relationship with your buyer that there is exactly this much clay weight in this grain.

No effect on animals or humans eating it, it's apparently even good for you.

One final point...it is found in other places beside Mae Sot.

I saw material on trucks in Chiang Mai that looked exactly the same

With a bit of exploring, it may very well be in your back yard.

The defining test is to dump clumps in a bucket of water.

After several hours it will disperse evenly into the water when agitated.

Since the concentrated material is all but impervious,

it takes time for water to soak into clumps from all sides.

The right stuff will not settle out, but float in a suspended slurry indefinitely,

settling only so far as a thin layer of clean water over the slurry.

There is a settled concentration that it stabilizes at.

If you have a lot of water and a little clay, it will form a thin layer at the bottom of the container.