Red Shirt Leader Jatuporn To Reveal 'Solid Evidence' Of Abhisit's UK Citizenship

[thaikahuna]

Look for the crap that happened last spring to be repeated this spring...

[Nisa]

Being born in another country allows you the right to CHOOSE at age 18 which country you will be citizen of, it is not automatically bestowed for life, nor is it permanent, but only for the time you are a minor person. At Age 18 you get the choice, clearly Abhisit chose Thailand.

And several countries do not allow dual citizenship Thailand being one of them. So there is no chance Abhisit could have gotten registered to run as an MP without showing a proper Thailand ID or Passport, and then be elected as an MP, if he did not have Thai citizenship in full.

Prior to that you can't be indescriminately thrown out of the country you were born in.

"And several countries do not allow dual citizenship Thailand being one of them."

Why do so many people in Thailand have dual citizenship then?

They don't legally. But TIT, people just do what they want.

The US used to allow dual citizenship in certain cases. I have a friend born to USA military personell on a USA Airbase in France in the late 60's. before DeGaule kicked out NATO. She has valid for life USA and French Nationality, but it is no longer available, and she is 'grandfathered' in for life. They

The US does allow dual citizenship and there was actually a US Supreme Court ruling on this. Unless as you say that has changed.

According to the many threads her on TV Thailand doesn't seem to have any clear laws stating it is permissible or is not. However, I just did a quick internet search and found a page that lists each countries view on Dual Citizenship and see they claim this for Thailand ...

DUAL CITIZENSHIP: NOT RECOGNIZED.

Exceptions:

Child born abroad to Thai parents, who obtains the citizenship of the foreign country of birth, may retain dual citizenship until reaching the age of majority (18). At this point, person must choose which citizenship to retain.

A Thai woman who marries a foreign national and acquires her husband's citizenship has technically lost her Thai citizenship. Should the marriage end in death or divorce, the Thai national woman could regain her Thai citizenship. This is an unofficial dual citizenship designed to protect female Thai nationals.

[slapout]

I can't believe you guys are getting so worked up about Jatuporn's verbal diarrhea. Bars close early or something?

If the man had put the effort into helping the general Thai population that he puts into verbal assaults on others he would have much more support.

His campaign to bring the PM up on human right charges is laughable when he is using the immunity loophole for himself. He would appear to justify the concern for several deficiencies which affect mental health in this country.

Someone should get a copy of the anti everything CD that the red shirts have cut and put out to the public and then go after the whole bunch to the full extent of the law. The translation given to me, if valid, could lead to a fast exoduses of those involved, or they set a new standard for time in the monkey house.

[Nisa]

I can't believe you guys are getting so worked up about Jatuporn's verbal diarrhea. Bars close early or something?

They didn't just close early ... they were not even open yesterday and last night due to the holiday!!!!

[slapout]

I can't believe you guys are getting so worked up about Jatuporn's verbal diarrhea. Bars close early or something?

If the man had put the effort into helping the general Thai population that he puts into verbal assaults on others he would have much more support.

His campaign to bring the PM up on human right charges is laughable when he is using the immunity loophole for himself. He would appear to justify the concern for several deficiencies which affect mental health in this country.

Someone should get a copy of the anti everything CD that the red shirts have cut and put out to the public and then go after the whole bunch to the full extent of the law. The translation given to me, if valid, could lead to a fast exoduses of those involved, or they set a new standard for time in the monkey house.

[slapout]

I can't believe you guys are getting so worked up about Jatuporn's verbal diarrhea. Bars close early or something?

If the man had put the effort into helping the general Thai population that he puts into verbal assaults on others he would have much more support.

His campaign to bring the PM up on human right charges is laughable when he is using the immunity loophole for himself. He would appear to justify the concern for several deficiencies which affect mental health in this country.

Someone should get a copy of the anti everything CD that the red shirts have cut and put out to the public and then go after the whole bunch to the full extent of the law. The translation given to me, if valid, could lead to a fast exoduses of those involved, or they set a new standard for time in the monkey house.

[SomTumTiger]

Ladies and Gentlemen. By paying attention to the words of this incompetent cretin (Jatuporn), you only lend him credibility. Ignore him.

[DP25]

I think it's more of a political issue for Abhisit - that is, people won't like that he has British citizenship, even though there is nothing legally wrong with it.

The issue is that Robert Amstermdam is attempting to charge Abhisit with crimes against humanity in the International Criminal Court for stopping the reds from rioting and killing last year. Thailand has never signed on to be bound by the court, so a Thai could not be tried. The UK has signed on to it though, so Thaksin has gone with this strategy.

Of course since Montenegro has also signed it, that means that Thaksin also could be tried, where as if he were only Thai he could not

[jimbeam1]

Nothing really new, he is not Thai anyway but Chinese and just of the few elite Chinese that been running Thailand and hold most of the wealth and have a trickle down effect to the native Thais.

Don't you mean he is a Thai of Chinese ancestry as most of the Hi So's, businessmen, politicians etc here are?

Hmmm, I think so.

jb1

[AleG]

"And several countries do not allow dual citizenship Thailand being one of them."

Why do so many people in Thailand have dual citizenship then?

Well, it's not as if Thai's in general didn't have a tendency to stretch, bend and time/space warp laws and rules.

The other thing is that while Thailand doesn't recognize a dual citizenship, for example Thai/US; that doesn't stop the US to recognize it. That is, such a person can have dual citizenship in the US, but not in Thailand.

Ladies and Gentlemen. By paying attention to the words of this incompetent cretin (Jatuporn), you only lend him credibility. Ignore him.

Team Taksin's strategy is spelled FUD, Fear, Uncertainty and Doubt; you can't ignore it, it must be shot down with facts and reason. It is said that there's no better disinfectant than sunlight, so let it shine on the (barely) sentient pustule that is Mr. J.

...

In the US a President has to be born in the US regardless of your citizenship.

...

That's not actually correct. In the last US election one of the candidates wasn't born in the US... and it wasn't Obama.

Amusingly enough, after all the "Birthers" brouhaha about Obama being a secret muslim Kenian Manchurian candidate from outer space (or something nearly as ridiculous)it was John McCain who was born outside the US, in Panama to be precise. But his parents were US citizens so (as far as I understand it) that grants him Natural Born Citizen status which is what the US constitution sets as a requirement.

Sorry for the sidetrack.

[mca]

In the US a President has to be born in the US regardless of your citizenship.

So for example if I and my pregnant wife were American and lived near the Canadian border and decided to take a day trip to Canada where my wife then went into labour and gave birth my child would be illegible to run for the presidency?

[alant]

No way is he British, or he would have sorted the stupid visa rules out!

great joke

[prefabs]

When it all gets sorted out, will he play sport for Thailand or England? That is the question

[Scott]

A great deal of misinformation on citizenship is being presented.

1. Each country decides the criteria for being a citizen. There are no international laws governing this.

2. Because one country does not recognize dual citizenship does not mean another involved country cannot.

3. In most countries you do not choose your citizenship. It is a birthright. You do not get a little form in the mail on your 18th birthday asking you to recognize or renounce your citizenship.

4. You do not have to be a citizen of country to obtain a passport. It is up to the country to decide who gets a passport and the conditions for issuance. Likewise, you can be a citizen and be denied a passport.

5. Usually one country may not know if you are a citizen of another country. No international data base on this.

6. Renouncing your citizenship is a formal process done in writing and presented to the authorities of your country (usually).

7. In the case of US-Thai nationals, the US Embassy in the past used to advise parents that if there is a concern, the child should chose Thai nationality. The reason being that the person did not lose US citizenship by choosing Thai nationality.

The issue of this thread concerns the implications of dual citizenship for the PM. It does not, nor will a discussion be allowed, pertain to members of the royal family.

[jayjay0]

No way is he British, or he would have sorted the stupid visa rules out!

great joke

Good thing he isn't English.

If he was the visa laws would not let in most of the tourist's.

[mca]

No way is he British, or he would have sorted the stupid visa rules out!

That would be kind of cool.

At the immi.

" Yearly extension? Are you British? Yes? Put all that paperwork away. Completely superfluous to requirements. Just give me your passport. How many years extension would you like? 10? 20? Tell you what we'll make it 100. That should sort you out. 90 day reporting? For you Sir it's 90 year reporting. Have a nice day. "

[Huey]

I hope he stands strong against the Terrorists and crushes the red shirts first.

[jayjay0]

"And several countries do not allow dual citizenship Thailand being one of them."

Why do so many people in Thailand have dual citizenship then?

Well, it's not as if Thai's in general didn't have a tendency to stretch, bend and time/space warp laws and rules.

The other thing is that while Thailand doesn't recognize a dual citizenship, for example Thai/US; that doesn't stop the US to recognize it. That is, such a person can have dual citizenship in the US, but not in Thailand.

Ladies and Gentlemen. By paying attention to the words of this incompetent cretin (Jatuporn), you only lend him credibility. Ignore him.

Team Taksin's strategy is spelled FUD, Fear, Uncertainty and Doubt; you can't ignore it, it must be shot down with facts and reason. It is said that there's no better disinfectant than sunlight, so let it shine on the (barely) sentient pustule that is Mr. J.

...

In the US a President has to be born in the US regardless of your citizenship.

...

That's not actually correct. In the last US election one of the candidates wasn't born in the US... and it wasn't Obama.

Amusingly enough, after all the "Birthers" brouhaha about Obama being a secret muslim Kenian Manchurian candidate from outer space (or something nearly as ridiculous)it was John McCain who was born outside the US, in Panama to be precise. But his parents were US citizens so (as far as I understand it) that grants him Natural Born Citizen status which is what the US constitution sets as a requirement.

Sorry for the sidetrack.

I believe McCain was born on a US Military base.

[rotary]

Being a Dual Citizen does not stop some other countries from having leaders that are dual citizens<img src="http://static.thaivisa.com/forum/public/style_emoticons/default/unsure.gif" alt="" class="bbc_emoticon"> Is it in the Thai laws that the PM cannot be a dual citizen???

[Nisa]

In the US a President has to be born in the US regardless of your citizenship.

So for example if I and my pregnant wife were American and lived near the Canadian border and decided to take a day trip to Canada where my wife then went into labour and gave birth my child would be illegible to run for the presidency?

According to the Constitution of the United States No person except a natural born Citizen, or a Citizen of the United States, at the time of the Adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the Office of President.

The courts may have since defined this as being born to US Parents living in another country but the intent of this law appears clear andI believe most US citizens take this as being born in the US and the reason why you have the birther movement claiming Obama wasn't born in the US and therefore cannot be president. But who knows, the laws may define "natural" born as being born to US parents living abroad too.

Part of the assumption of it meaning being born in the US may also be because ANY person born in the US regardless of parent's citizenship is entitled to be a US citizen.

Edit: In the US we can twist and turn any law to our liking and am sure we could even interpret the above to mean a person born by cesarean section cannot be president ... certainly a test tube baby cannot

Edited February 19, 2011 by Nisa

[DP25]

In the US a President has to be born in the US regardless of your citizenship.

So for example if I and my pregnant wife were American and lived near the Canadian border and decided to take a day trip to Canada where my wife then went into labour and gave birth my child would be illegible to run for the presidency?

Yup. John McCain was born in Panama, but on a US Air Force base in the Panama Canal Zone. If he'd been born outside of it in some city in Panama, he would not have been eligible

[barney42bb]

Jatuporn, he will volunteer to be put in jail too

:clap2:

This is very strange..But it appears much of the Thai population..is completely unawares of Abhisit's background.

I am not sure if there is censorship on the website Wikipedia...but he has a substantive entry there..as with many prominant Thai people and subjects.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abhisit_Vejjajiva (copy and paste to open in search bar)

Inspection will show Abhisit is from a very good stock..and earned outstanding academic achievements..which have fuelled his rapid success in Public Life.

Furthermore..he has an English Birth Cerificate..British passport..enjoying all the rights of such ..and received the finest education at Eton and Oxford.

Better informed Thais have told me that Abhisit attained his Thai Citizenship status by living in Thailand...to be naturalised over 10 year residence..to qualify.....Similar system to how foreighners in UK attain British citizenship.

However in many people views...regardless of this...Your nationality always is the country in which you were born...even if both your parents from another country.

But whatever your view..one has to concede that Abhisit is from good parents..and has achieved outstanding academic levels to pave his success in Public life.

I fail to see what advantage Red Shirts will achieve with their point...unless they are Racist and have a problem with The English.

[truethailand]

ICC will be duty bound to look at the charges. First is he recognised as a British Citizen, if no it goes no further. If yes then we look at the evidence, if there is sufficient we will send him to trial. At least it might open up this can of worms because in Thailand there is no intention of revealing the truth about last year. Picture this scenario... charges are brought, Abhisit says up yours I am staying put... INTERPOL issue an arrest warrant..

Edited February 19, 2011 by Scott
inappropriate name edited out/Scott

[Nisa]

I believe McCain was born on a US Military base.

Yes he claimed he was but there were doubters and they actually got the US Senate to approve a resolution recognizing McCain as a "natural born citizen"

Anyway ... didn't want to get too off topic with this but was simply pointing out how Thailand seems more lax in who they let run the country in terms of citizenship / place of birth.

Edited February 19, 2011 by Nisa

[mdechgan]

So lets say he does hold dual citizenship.

What is the big deal?

I know many people who hold dual citizenships.

You have to be a Thai citizen to be in Thai politics but Mark has a Thai citizenship, so what?

[mca]

ICC will be duty bound to look at the charges. First is he recognised as a British Citizen, if no it goes no further. If yes then we look at the evidence, if there is sufficient we will send him to trial.

Who's " we "?

[truethailand]

ICC will be duty bound to look at the charges. First is he recognised as a British Citizen, if no it goes no further. If yes then we look at the evidence, if there is sufficient we will send him to trial.

Who's " we "?

ICC

[Imkah]

Have any of the countries where Thaksin now is a citizen ratified their membership of ICC? If so, let's give Mr. Amsterdam a call :jap:

[truethailand]

ICC will be duty bound to look at the charges. First is he recognised as a British Citizen, if no it goes no further. If yes then we look at the evidence, if there is sufficient we will send him to trial.

Who's " we "?

ICC

If Mr Amsterdam has witnesses and not just numbers the ICC is the only place they may be safe to give evidence

[AriosAsia]

'crimes against humanity'!

the man did everything possible to stop the loss of life and keep everything peaceful. its the red shirt leaders that are responsible for the blood.

Who use the gun? he is the killer