Seeking Advice About Employment, Please Help

[TravelinMan]

Hello Everyone,

I'm actively seeking employment in Thailand (preferably Bangkok) in the E-Commerce/online marketing industry, but I'm having a really difficult time finding opportunities to apply for. Of the few opportunities I do manage to find, some state that only Thai nationals will be considered. My dream job would be working with a luxury hotel or resort to help run their web site and online marketing campaigns, but I'm open to all possibilities in my industry.

I was born and raised in the United States and am currently employed there full time working with a very well known online retailer. I have many years of E-Commerce/online marketing experience and am dead set on relocating to Thailand as soon as possible.

I'm spending all of my free time as well as burning the midnight oil searching the web for opportunities to no avail. I'm also networking to the fullest extent possible, but due to the geographical distance involved it's proving not to be an effective method at the moment unfortunately. I'm turning to you, the experts on this site, for any feedback, support, ideas, and advice you would be willing to offer. I would be very grateful for your help and really do appreciate your time.

I also have two specific questions I'd like to ask:

1. Can you please provide the names of some reputable/legitimate headhunting or executive search firms in Thailand?

2.) Can you think of places I should be looking for available opportunities? Currently I'm searching this site, the Bangkok Post, jobsdb.com, nationejobs.com, web sites for hotels/resorts, jobstreet.co.th, jobpub.com, monster.com, and web sites of many multinational corporations.

Thank you very much, and I look forward to your replies! If you have any questions or need additional information from me please don't hesitate to ask.

[ELCata]

Good grief.

[stander]

The type of position you are looking for is normally restricted to Thais only.

Without having any contacts here, I would say your chances a slim at best.

My advice would be to save as much as possible, then come over here and try and build up as many contacts within the industry, also set up a website promoting your services

[simon43]

I do not agree that this job type is normally 'restricted' to Thais. That implies a legal restriction and I'm sure that it is not on the list of professions that are restricted to non-Thais.

That being said, I agree that you will have a very hard time finding such employment in Thailand. What can you offer an employee that a Thai national cannot offer, and which would justify your (presumably) higher salary and admin time/costs for your work permit?

I would say that you have a better chance of living in Thailand and making money in this manner by setting up a (small) Thai ltd company, and offering these types of services to USA/European companies at a price which undercuts the USA/European-based competitor companies.

Simon

[TravelinMan]

Hi Everyone,

Thank you very much for your replies so far. I've seen some ads stating these positions were open to expatriates so I also believe they're not on the list of restricted professions, but I've yet to track down the official list myself to verify that. At this time I'm not looking to set up my own company, and would prefer to have a guaranteed paycheck before making such a big move.

I do realize this will be a very hard thing to accomplish, but as mentioned I'm dead set on doing it which is why I'm committing so much time and effort in my search. I'd be very appreciate if you could help out and provide places I may want to be looking, along with names of headhunting/executive search firms (especially those that may specialize in this field).

I don't want to sound egotistical or vain, but I do have a lot to offer and believe my skill set is more advanced than many candidates in the local market. I'm gauging this from the fact that my experience and knowledge is based in the United States, where staying on top of industry trends and utilizing best practices is mandatory or else you can consider your business dead in the water.

I can't tell you how many web sites for major Thailand based businesses I've looked at over the years which make me cringe, because they're lacking the absolute basics. This simply would not fly in the US, and people would be fired. The companies operating these web sites are well known and rake in revenue, so surely they have hefty budgets to work with, would more than likely prefer to hire the best, and they are paying people to do the work. The problem is, the work simply isn't getting done, and many attempts I've seen to get it done are subpar by industry standards. As I'm sure a lot of you know, it's one thing to have a web site which is functional and looks pretty, but it's an entire different ball game to have a web site that is fully optimized to capture maximum traffic, cater to Western (or target) audiences, and ultimately increase sales/conversion.

I hope to hear from you and appreciate you taking the time to post. Thank you!

[simon43]

I can't tell you how many web sites for major Thailand based businesses I've looked at over the years which make me cringe, because they're lacking the absolute basics. This simply would not fly in the US, and people would be fired

Yes, absolutely true! But I'm afraid sensible logic like yours does not apply in Thailand. A couple of issues to consider:

- Who are you going to tell in the company that their web-site is in said condition? The CEO, Manager etc? Do you think they will listen to an 'unknown junior' and a foreigner to boot telling them the stark truth?? (Think 'loss of face' etc.)

- Even if they accept that their web site is crap, do you think they will let a foreigner put it right? (Think 'loss of nationalistic face' etc)

- Even if they accept that their web-site is crap AND that you can put it right, do you think they will do all the admin paperwork to give you a work permit? (Think 'total laziness' etc)

- Even if they accept that their web-site is crap AND that you can put it right AND that it's worthwhile getting you a work permit - how long do you think you will hold down your expensive job until they get the local Thai guy to take over from you? (Think 'tight-arsed-but-he-has-a-good-point CEO' etc)

Trust me - it is much better to go the extra mile in the first place, start a little business of your own and offer your services to companies outside of Thailand - it will save you an awful lot of heartache and frustration in the long term

Simon

[DTiger]

....but I do have a lot to offer and believe my skill set is more advanced than many candidates in the local market....

I can't tell you how many web sites for major Thailand based businesses I've looked at over the years which make me cringe, because they're lacking the absolute basics.

There is one skill you probably lack: Can you at least speak fluently Thai?

And another one: Crappy websites does not mean they are not okay enough (TiT)

But being here already doing about the same kind of things, I can only advise you to prepare a little bit more your trip here. "Best" as often nothing to do with "good" here.

Good luck

[H2oDunc]

What Simon says is about right. You are not going to get the high paying , top notch executive job you are seeking. Plenty people who can knock up a decent website make a living here and as said if you base yourself here and do work on line abroad then you may make a better living. I think you just need to re think your plans a little. Good luck

[ExpatJ]

I agree with others here. Its virtually impossible that you will get a full time job working on a companies website- there is no way a company will go to the trouble of organising work permits , paying extra salary etc for a foreigner to do what 1000s of thai IT graduates could do.

Your best bet is to create your own online business.

[stander]

The consensus here is that you could come here and start your own business, if however you don’t see it that way then good luck to you.

[fstarbkk]

I can't tell you how many web sites for major Thailand based businesses I've looked at over the years which make me cringe, because they're lacking the absolute basics. This simply would not fly in the US, and people would be fired

Yes, absolutely true! But I'm afraid sensible logic like yours does not apply in Thailand. A couple of issues to consider:

- Who are you going to tell in the company that their web-site is in said condition? The CEO, Manager etc? Do you think they will listen to an 'unknown junior' and a foreigner to boot telling them the stark truth?? (Think 'loss of face' etc.)

- Even if they accept that their web site is crap, do you think they will let a foreigner put it right? (Think 'loss of nationalistic face' etc)

- Even if they accept that their web-site is crap AND that you can put it right, do you think they will do all the admin paperwork to give you a work permit? (Think 'total laziness' etc)

- Even if they accept that their web-site is crap AND that you can put it right AND that it's worthwhile getting you a work permit - how long do you think you will hold down your expensive job until they get the local Thai guy to take over from you? (Think 'tight-arsed-but-he-has-a-good-point CEO' etc)

Trust me - it is much better to go the extra mile in the first place, start a little business of your own and offer your services to companies outside of Thailand - it will save you an awful lot of heartache and frustration in the long term

Simon

Totally agree with Simon's points - Xenophobia, myopia, stingy-ness and a passion for mediocrity in major Thai companies stand in the way of your dream, not to mention the fear of being shown-up by an "outsider". I think the guiding concept in Thai business is: If you can have a prosperous business with a crappy website, why waste good money on a better one?

There are some (western) people here who run good little web-related companies. You could try to collaborate with some of them to establish yourself. But I doubt most of them are in a position to offer you a fixed paycheck up-front.

[simon43]

And just as an extra...

If you consider it too expensive/too much paperwork etc to set up your business in Thailand, why not hop over to Cambodia where there are many small IT/internet businesses serving both local and overseas sectors- being established by 'foreigners' because the company registered capital/work permit requirements are far less arduous than Thailand.

If it were not for the fact that I have family and existing business in Thailand, I would base any new IT venture in Cambodia for sure.

Simon

[FarangBuddha]

Maybe check out the "boiler-room" industry...always seems to be one of those scams operating at any one time.

Thailand is hardly a hotbed of IT-online marketing work so why the urge to relocate to Bangkok...why not tell us her name

[lannarebirth]

Though it is a couple of months old, this ad looks like about the kind of thing you are looking for. Maybe you should consider PM'ing TV menber " Valjean " as I believe he is a successful operator in the type of business you wish to find employment in.

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/429988-client-services-rockstar/

[losworld]

And just as an extra...

If you consider it too expensive/too much paperwork etc to set up your business in Thailand, why not hop over to Cambodia where there are many small IT/internet businesses serving both local and overseas sectors- being established by 'foreigners' because the company registered capital/work permit requirements are far less arduous than Thailand.

If it were not for the fact that I have family and existing business in Thailand, I would base any new IT venture in Cambodia for sure.

Simon

Simon how does the Ph compare for setting up IT?

[simon43]

Simon how does the Ph compare for setting up IT?

I haven't looked into that. I spent 2 months 'on-site', checking out Cambodia for setting up an IT business, and I spent 2 months on-site checking out PDR Lao for establishing an eco-resort, (since I have small businesses in both IT and hotels/guesthouses).

Important criteria was that I could 'own' the business myself, and that the government actually encouraged the establishment of these types of business.

On both counts, the results were more positive than Thailand. But unless someone magically creates a 48 hour day, I simply do not have the time to pursue either idea

Simon

[CharlieH]

You stated: "because they're lacking the absolute basics"

This is true to almost every aspect of Thai life, the first thing you are going to need to do if you are really determined to come here is DROP that outlook ! Let go of everything you know to be realistic.logical, common sense etc as it just doesnt apply here and you will drive yourself crazy if you try to apply western attitudes and principles here.

Things that you may consider basic & common sense just dont exist. There are no "standards" its the cheapest everytime. No good applying "better gets you more" they couldnt care less.

[TravelinMan]

Please accept my apologies for being absent from this thread for a few days. Like Simon, I too am waiting for that 48 hour day to be magically created.

Thank you all very much for taking the time to post and discuss this issue. While it is absolutely disheartening, I really do appreciate all of the information you provided and see I have quite a few things to think about before making such a big move.

Now when I find some more time I really want to dig further into this site. Wish I would have known about it before! Take care.