Scientists Puzzled By Japan Earthquakes

[webfact]

Scientists puzzled by earthquakes

By Pongphon Sarnsamak

The Nation

Japanese seismicists and geologists are being doubtful about the recent Great East Japan earthquake with 9 magnitude and killed over ten thousands people on last Friday, saying it was abnormal phenomenon.

"Nobody could tell the reasons about this strange phenomenon, " a prominent Japanese geophysicist Professor Michio Hashizume, who is lecturer of Chulalongkorn Univesity's Department of Geology.

His finding was presented at the round table discussion entitled " The new finding from recent earthquake in Japan and concerning related with Thai society" organized Chulalongkorn University's Faculty of Science.

He said he was surprised by this earthquake by the size of the area of fault. It was between 400 kilometers and 100 kilometers wide.

Moreover, at least 7 earthquakes with magnitude between 5 to 7 had occurred after the killer earthquake near Sendai on Friday, he added.

"These series of quakes are not the aftershocks. So far,nobody could explain how these small quakes linked with the earthquake in Sendai," Machio said.

The small quakes with between 5 magnitude to 7 magnitude had occurred in different areas in Japan. The quakes did not occur in the proper areas that aftershock should occur. The aftershocks should occur within 100 kilometers from the epicenter of the earthquake.

"This was very strange. Everybody is now being headache," he said.

He said the Japan Earthquake Prediction Committee had recently predicted that the earthquake with 7 magnitude nearby Sendai city would be occurred in next 30 years but it had took place earlier than the prediction.

"We need at least ten years to study about this phenomenon," he added.

Macho also expressed his concerns over the constructions in Japan especially in nuclear plants across country.

Even a preliminary report confirmed that the nuclear plants were not destroyed by the quake but they were damaged by the powerful tsunami.

That means most of constructions in Japan including nuke plants were designed and constructed to handle with the earthquake except the powerful tsunami.

"This was our weak points to handle with natural disasters," he said.

"It was our lesson to learn how to improve the facilities in Japan to prevent the devastation from tsunami," he added.

However, he said the Japan Earthquake Prediction Agency has predicted that another earthquake with 7 magnitude would take place in Japan next three days.

Meanwhile, Sathon Vicharnwannalak, a lecturer of Physics Department, Chulalongkorn University said there were a lot of confusion about the tsunami early warning messages that released by Thailand disaster related agencies such as Meteorological Department, National Disaster Warning Center,and Mineral Resources Department.

"There was no unity among related agencies to issue tsunami alert messages and caused confusion among people in 15 provinces in the south," he said.

-- The Nation 2011-03-15

[elshaheen]

Yes, an earthquake can make the ground look like one big puzzle. Wow

[webfact]

if you can't stay on topic - don't post

2 off-topic posts deleted

//Admin

[whybother]

If the pressure is released in one point, then it stands to reason that there will now be more pressure on another point ... doesn't it?

[Hawaiian]

The Pacific Tsunami Warning Center probably has more reliable information than any agency in Thailand.

[Somtamnication]

If these scientists are puzzled, then we are doomed. Earthquake prediction is nothing but snake oil science. Nature is the boss, pure and simple.

[Thaddeus]

If the pressure is released in one point, then it stands to reason that there will now be more pressure on another point ... doesn't it?

No, not really, most of the pressure is converted into energy in the form of an earthquake.

[whybother]

If the pressure is released in one point, then it stands to reason that there will now be more pressure on another point ... doesn't it?

No, not really, most of the pressure is converted into energy in the form of an earthquake.

Yes, but if the pressure at a point is released (thus causing an earthquake), then the plate will move forward causing pressure on new points (or more pressure on existing points).

In this case, these points now have enough pressure on them to break through the friction between the two plates, thus causing more earthquakes.

[atsiii]

I am at least happy that someone in Thailand is trying to learn some lessons from this disaster. The Japanese early warning system did work, and almost every cell phone in the country was beeping out warnings seconds after the initial tremors were registered. Unfortunately, the tsunami hit within minutes leaving tens of thousands with no time to escape. However, the warning system did work, and had the epicenter been further out to sea, many more would have survived. Thailand can and should learn from this experience and try for once to get its act together. Another lesson to be learned--yet, again--relates to nuclear power.

I think the Japanese scientists are perplexed because the plate tectonic models in use around the world have to date been very reliable. They are not yet usable for widespread prediction (the Japanese do a better job of this than anyone else), but they have been very reliable in modeling plate behavior. So the fact that these other quakes are not typical of normal after-shocks is causing the scientists to wonder (out loud) if something new and different is going on. In other words... if the smaller quakes are not typical of after-shocks, are they instead some kind of precursor?

Another related topic for potential discussion is what happens in these Asian honorific cultures when it's more important to save face by lying and trying to cover up the truth, than it is to ask for and accept help when there is still time to help.

Edited March 15, 2011 by atsiii

[Macmundi]

One major quake and a series of smaller quakes out of the radius of the epicenter is not impossible. It may be rare, but not impossible. Those smaller quakes are not aftershocks. There will be further quakes to follow. The Japanese are experts in building quake tolerant structures, but when tsunami comes at this scale, who would have thought. Now the lesson is learnt, back to the design board. Perhaps the Japanese can adopt the Fishing Villager's way of building to accommodate both high tide and low tide. Tsunami is also a tide, but it is just bigger. It comes in and it resides.

Edited March 15, 2011 by Macmundi

[slipperx]

Is it me or are we getting more and more large scale disasters happening more often? A hundred or so years ago it was a regular thing for the Thames to freeze over in London - now it never happens - it is not just the City has become hotter because of the housing and offices because in the suburbs around the weather is similarly warmer than before. I know we have had major disasters before it just seems that in the last few years their magnitude and frequency rate have increased substantially. But then again maybe it is just a trick of my mind? I fear more of the same thing and worry about this country which is so ill equipped mentally and practically to deal with large scale problems. Imagine if that earthquake had hit Bangkok - frightening.

[bbradsby]

Even a preliminary report confirmed that the nuclear plants were not destroyed by the quake but they were damaged by the powerful tsunami.

That means most of constructions in Japan including nuke plants were designed and constructed to handle with the earthquake except the powerful tsunami.

"This was our weak points to handle with natural disasters," he said.

"It was our lesson to learn how to improve the facilities in Japan to prevent the devastation from tsunami," he added.

it was nothing but engineering hubris to build critical nuclear facilities, with massive toxic radioactive risks to the region, so close to sea level in an area famous for its frequent & massive earthquakes & tsunamis;

it was such hubris & further, bad design decision-making, to build seawalls and then be over-confident enough to place the backup cooling system generators and/or their switchgear so low that if the seawall was breached, these systems would be inundated and fail, giving rise to radioactive emissions we now see as well as a potential nuclear meltdown.

they've not even started to really discuss the spent fuel that was inundated by the tsunami.

[Thaddeus]

If the pressure is released in one point, then it stands to reason that there will now be more pressure on another point ... doesn't it?

No, not really, most of the pressure is converted into energy in the form of an earthquake.

Yes, but if the pressure at a point is released (thus causing an earthquake), then the plate will move forward causing pressure on new points (or more pressure on existing points).

In this case, these points now have enough pressure on them to break through the friction between the two plates, thus causing more earthquakes.

Yes, that is what is giving them the headaches, normally the first release removes almost all of the pressure (potential energy) into a quake (kinetic energy) and you then get aftershocks that are nowhere near as large as the first one, only tremors, this thing acted like it had ABS fitted from the looks of things.

[Bakseedaa]

If the pressure is released in one point, then it stands to reason that there will now be more pressure on another point ... doesn't it?

Why Bother.... right name..?????

[MaiChai]

The Japanese do say Tokyo is well overdue for a major quake. Some of the buildings there are really tall. I remember staying on the 74th floor of a hotel there; had a nice view of Mount Fuji. It seems pretty clear that you can do alot of preparation, but you cannot overcome nature? The forces are just too great?

[atsiii]

Is it me or are we getting more and more large scale disasters happening more often? A hundred or so years ago it was a regular thing for the Thames to freeze over in London - now it never happens - it is not just the City has become hotter because of the housing and offices because in the suburbs around the weather is similarly warmer than before. I know we have had major disasters before it just seems that in the last few years their magnitude and frequency rate have increased substantially. But then again maybe it is just a trick of my mind? I fear more of the same thing and worry about this country which is so ill equipped mentally and practically to deal with large scale problems. Imagine if that earthquake had hit Bangkok - frightening.

I think a small part of the answer is that we continue to encroach and develop more and more in the danger zones. We build entire cities below sea level, we try to stabilize shores and coasts that by their very nature must be dynamic, we build on steep mountain sides, inside river flood zones, near the ocean, then on the ocean, then over the ocean... and on and on. So even if the magnitude and frequency of these events remains the same (which I don't know one way or the other), the resulting property damage and loss of life continues to increase--event after event. We seem incapable of learning any lessons...

[stevensdling]

The Japanese do say Tokyo is well overdue for a major quake. Some of the buildings there are really tall. I remember staying on the 74th floor of a hotel there; had a nice view of Mount Fuji. It seems pretty clear that you can do alot of preparation, but you cannot overcome nature? The forces are just too great?

I don't believe the biggest problem was the earthquake itself, but the following tsunami...

[horisize]

What puzzle? I got two words for this scientist. HAARP and EISCAT.

[ThaiKiwi]

The study into the recent earthquakes in NZ also show that the second quake was on a completely different fault than the first one of last year.

[katana]

Is it me or are we getting more and more large scale disasters happening more often?...

I think they always happened, but nowadays with the the ready availability of camcorders and satellite broadcasts, we can see pictures of the events beamed live around the world.

A hundred years ago if there was a tsunami that appeared for 15 minutes, swept your village away, then disappeared as quickly as it came, people would hardly believe you if you told them it happened.

Edited March 15, 2011 by katana

[bangon04]

"This was very strange. Everybody is now being headache," he said.

This happens to readers of the Nation a lot when trying to decipher what Nation articles are actually trying to say. Did he really say that?

[Panhandler007]

Quakes were man made!

[Preman]

If these scientists are puzzled, then we are doomed. Earthquake prediction is nothing but snake oil science. Nature is the boss, pure and simple.

There you have it! Pure and simple. - Good Post from you!

Here is my view.... as crazy as it may seem. Remember John Lennon? Imagine?

No religion - no politics, .. and even no science from our brilliant gathering of knowledge over the last couple of thousand years.

What are we dealing with now?

Guess who is boss? The Earth that we stand ground on. The Mother of all Mother's.

I think that she is giving us all a slight slap in the face .... and saying ..... wake up!

Mankind... and all our political / religious crap and wars waged against each other in the the name of protection of country, state, or religion, ..... in the the name of God... is just just so infantile.

Killing innocent people for country, state or religion or for anything is not in keeping with any tenant of any religion, .... yet it continues every day,

Now.... all countries .... have to be accountable. You say that God is on your side? Look again. Nature can demolish us all within minutes.

There should be a world wide vote, - not towards stupid politicians who are placed there by lobby groups ... and others ...... but towards allowing the higher intelligence to prevail and govern.

I hope that one day .... after all these disasters... that it it is not too late for all races and religions to hold hands and be in grace together.

[teatree]

Could the earthquake have been caused by the 'Supermoon' and solar flares? The moon controls the tides, so why couldn't it affect magma? There was a big solar flare right before the earthquake. As Prof Corbyn says in the clip, there is always the potential for an earthquake, you just need something to trigger it.

Skip to 5.50 to hear what the astrophysicist has to say.

Edited March 15, 2011 by teatree

[DP25]

The Japanese do say Tokyo is well overdue for a major quake. Some of the buildings there are really tall. I remember staying on the 74th floor of a hotel there; had a nice view of Mount Fuji. It seems pretty clear that you can do alot of preparation, but you cannot overcome nature? The forces are just too great?

Tokyo might still be overdue for a major quake from what I've read. This quake was quite a ways north and to the east. Sendai is 300 km north of Tokyo and the quake was 150 km east of that.

[Thaddeus]

Could the earthquake have been caused by the 'Supermoon' and solar flares? The moon controls the tides, so why couldn't it affect magma? There was a big solar flare right before the earthquake. As Prof Corbyn says in the clip, there is always the potential for an earthquake, you just need something to trigger it.

Skip to 5.50 to hear what the astrophysicist has to say.

Hmmmm Piers Corbyn.... he claims to be an Astrophysicist but he is a Weatherman.

He keeps the details of his methodology for making predictions a secret, and has been criticized for making unfounded claims about the power of his predictions, even after they turned out to be inaccurate. He has never published accuracy figures for his weather forecasts

Source.

Although I agree with much of his stance on global warming, when it come to trying to predict earthquakes, I'll stick with the seismologists and geophysicists thanks.

[Flatouthruthefog]

<br /><b>"This was very strange. Everybody is now being headache," he said.<br /></b><br /><br />This happens to readers of the Nation a lot when trying to decipher what Nation articles are actually trying to say. Did he really say that?<br />

<br /><br /><br />

Of course he didn't say that. 'The Nation' printed that.

I remember when the rag was a credible newspaper, not many years ago.

If they don't give a flying flick for their 'Tinglish', why should we believe anything they (try to) report?

The standard of English in the 'Chiang Mai Mail' was far superior to this trash, and they have finally folded.

How long will the credibility of tv continue to be dragged down by these shamateurs?

[Panhandler007]

The earthquakes were MANMADE!!! It is part of a grander conspiracy headed by the christian right! They are eager to bring about the second coming of Jesus! 2012! World collapse! Head for the hills! or Issan!

[solent01]

What puzzle? I got two words for this scientist. HAARP and EISCAT.

And apparently HAARP was very active on the 11th, does make one think…..

For those with an interest in this here is an interesting youtube :-

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k4uoregY2GI&feature=player_embedded

Edit to add link

Edited March 17, 2011 by solent01