Italian National Murdered In Phuket

[wagner54]

So there's a Bungalow business up for grabs. Unless of course some Thai Lady happened to be the partner and she keeps the lot. At least it should see the Police bothering to visit Phi Phi and make a few enquiries. For example, ' Your husband just got shot. Any chance of the bungalow complex at discount? Oh, and where were you?'

No doubt it'll be yet another death by misadventure. The Police concluding that he ran into 4 stray bullets that happened to be passing at the time. It happens ...................... in Thailand.

If the Police found 22,100 baht then how much did they not find in the wallet?

And their amazingly vigilant response is not to cordon the scene, put up road blocks or gather witness statements, but it is to contact the motorbike rental owner and tell him him the bad news; bike's been crashed mate. Worse still he's dead so has got out of paying the over priced repairs. Falangs eh? And worse still the Police lose out on getting their share.

Life can be cruel. So can death.

But I admire the sensitivity of the Press. No naming or photograph. Well that should ease the family's grief at learning how he was shot and left to die from his wounds and that there'll be no justice whatsoever or arrest.

Thailand.

It amazes me that you are still here in Thailand - I cannot find one positive statement or comment in your post, just plainly rude, insinuating and insulting, Hmmmm maybe not even 'plainly'! You have accused the police of stealing, his partner of colluding, and in general, Thais' and Thailand to be a Hell away from Hell. Why don't you return to the delights of whichever land you left and get mugged there, THEN complain! Why ARE you here? Maybe the guy had upset someone, that remains to be seen, but stop and think for a minute - you are upsetting many people! (Sorry Mr Editor if this is a bit of a diatribe - but invidious and bigoted people just anger me)

Well said unclekleef. RIP

[ding]

... The news from Thailand these days does not make for a civilised, lawful future at all.

I have a long time friend on Phuket who is now in hiding and under police protection along with with his children. Again over property, and fraud. The fraudulent theft and sale of his properties, cars, bank accounts and furnishings by his partner (now thankfully in jail) was seemingly aided and abetted by, amongst others, local officials. A local lawyer is also coming up in the investigation. He has told me only this week that he has become aware of many many more foreigners who have been defrauded out of their own properties. It seems to be happening regularly.

The official corruption and violence he has faced over the past 9 months has been horrendous. More anon on this as the case is currently in the courts and under further investigation. I am glad to report that the case is very much going his way.

Good that your pal is getting justice and mitigating the danger. Bad, OTH, that this is what Thais are resorting to as a business model.

Note to self: Rent is cheap - do that.

[viacc65]

R.I.P Luciano e condoglianze alla famiglia

[harleyclarkey]

Can you get 22,000 out of an ATM.

I feel for his family and rest in peace.

Yes...no problem. Depends what you have agreed with your bank. (daily limit)

[surangw]

maybe a business dispute, and the perp did not want to settle it in a court

[MrsMills]

Everyone is assuming the Italian is an innocent man that did nothing wrong.

It must be those evil Thais targeting an innocent Farang.

Farangs are always innocent.

I've just got home after trying to retrieve some of the money I am owed from Farangs. I have heard some fantastic stories as to why I cannot be paid back at this momemt.

Needless to say the Farangs are trying to cheat me,of course, it's ok as I will get by no matter what, I just feel sorry for the Thai staff that lose their jobs.

Edited March 16, 2011 by MrsMills

[Mugg]

I'm sorry but I am staggered by some of these

comments.

You make judgements without facts, displaying cynicism about every aspect of this man's character and existence in this country, where both he was and you are all guests. All this with no consideration to local crime trends (Research it I'm not going to spoon feed you). To continue your "Victor Melldrew" attitude you then insult the character of all Thais - again without fact or evidence.

It is little wonder that the ex-pat community in this country is being viewed by more and more of the native populous as being a hindrance rather than an enhancement to their development as a nation. If you dislike the Thai people, their culture and this country so much and have nothing good to say or feel about it then return to your native lands and allow the rest of us to repair the scars you leave behind you.

I truly hope that this victims family never have the misfortune of reading the inconsiderate comments posted here by so many dispassionate and selfish individuals.

And for a first post at that, well said.. Welcome to the Forum, I hope you stay around..

[cobra]

... you don't need to do anything wrong in Thailand to piss people off, ...

Sadly, that is more true than not.

[dumpling]

11mm gun - sounds Russian - not saying that it was a Russian of course

JoHnBKK ; 11 mm guns are commonly use for the Police officers and as well as the Thai soldiers ... They are quite big and can make a severe damage to the body..... To kill someone, I rather use 11 mm cos' he/she will have no chance or surviving.... ( = 0)

what ! "if I were to kill someone I RATHER USE 11MM" ......gees what a comment.

will you pop up some firecrackers...........dude?

what?

[lostboy777]

GERMAN WIFE NOT THAI

This unfortunate mans restaurant is located on a beach which is nowadays surrounded by all-night profitable beach bars that make money from drink and d###s. Quite possibly his restaurant was standing in the way of a local ganster making lots of money?

If I was an investigator I would look at Phi Phi island beach-bar owners.....NOT the ex-wife....and its seems some reports are incorrect as I think his wife wasn't Thai, but western.

RIP Luciano

[SICHONSTEVE]

Everyone is assuming the Italian is an innocent man that did nothing wrong.

Innocent? He's the victim. It has nothing to do with anything. A man was shot and killed. The perpetrator needs to be brought to justice regardless of the motive or what this man has done in the past.

And how do you know what everybody is assuming? I for one didn't make any assumptions about the man other than that he was shot while riding his motorcycle.

Yesssss!!! he's the victim in this case, granted, but do you seriously think that he is completely innocent of any act that might have resulted in his murder. Maybe he was in the wrong place at the wrong time and the person who killed him was in a bad mood and just happened to have a gun loaded with bullets on him and didn't like the colour of his bike helmet and wanted to punish him for assaulting his eyes - do me a favour will you!!!

Yep.......... this can be true.... For a month ago, a Thai airways Pilot was shot drivn' hi car to work around the swampie without enough reason only he threw the head lights on the other car. Luckily ,he didn't get kill. Apparently, there are many cases similar to this.

I'm familiar with this story. Apparently it was a bit of road rage (Thai style) after a bit of road dancing with full disco lights - I think that this was a little bit more involved than him simply cutting him up on the road or poking his tongue out at him though and he was out to get him, full stop, in order to complete his mission to get the other half of his pay day!!! I think this will prove to be closer to the mark when the details behind it are revealed.

[TAWP]

Jesus, I am starting to hope I will die in an airplane crash so people on this board won't be speculating as to why I was killed and by whom...

[SICHONSTEVE]

Everyone is assuming the Italian is an innocent man that did nothing wrong.

<deleted> you have made the 3rd comment on this subject and you are already accussing everyone of something that hasn't even been mentioned yet.

Richard10365 is simply making a statement which is perfectly valid. He is not accusing anyone of anything........ is he? so why the hysterical outcry over nothing???!!!! Keep things in context will you please. Another thing, how can he possibly accuse someone of something that hasn't been mentioned other than to say he did........well, something, I imagine, anyway!!

IMO Softgeorge's comment is also entirely valid. SICHONSTEVE's post was only the 3rd on this topic and is quick on using the word 'everyone'. If my maths are correct, in this case "everyone" amounts to 2 people.

There seems to be alot more to this story than meets the eye. The ongoing investigation should be interesting. Let's just hope and pray that the BIB don't come to any outrageous conclusions as they have done all to many times in the past.

I think that you mean that Richard's comment was only the third post. Maybe he has 6th sense as the "everyone" he referred to in his post materialised later on so maybe he was a bit on the premature side but he is damned good at predicting the future!! Perhaps he should have said I bet that everyone.........

I can also see IMO Softgeorge's point now and it kind of invalidates my response as I misinterpreted what he was trying to get over with his response. On account of this I withdraw (with immediate effect m'lud).

Edited March 16, 2011 by SICHONSTEVE

[SICHONSTEVE]

Everyone is assuming the Italian is an innocent man that did nothing wrong.

dont beleive anyone is suggesting he is innocent or gulity of anything..

That's funny!! I'm sure that a sizeable number of posters are implying that he IS the innocent victim here and I'm inclined to disagree with this appraisal as I think he must have been guilty of SOMETHING - this bears all the hallmarks of a contract killing and I appreciate that whatever he did, it didn't deserve this cold and callous execution, but get involved with or upset the mafia types at your peril NB: this is simply my take on it all and I have no evidence to back up my theory in the court of law.

I disagree. This bears all the marks of a drive-by motorcy murder. Not unusual for Phuket these days. Don't piss off the youth...that's the message.

I think we must agree to disagree on this one!!!!

[KeyserSoze01]

Who carries around 22k baht (unless you are going to buy something expensive but then you can get a bank cheque or use a credit/debit card).

Me for one...

No wallet. Who goes ANYWHERE without a wallet?

Me again... Never carry a wallet when out and about... Cash and a copy of my passport...

[paulbrun]

Maybe the money was to have a 'contract' put out on his soon-to-be ex-wife, and the shooter misunderstood and shot him instead..?

Seriously, it certainly looks like a professional 'hit', and the hitman left the live rounds as a 'statement' to say 'job done'..!

I would guess that he was in over his head in something, and a partner, either business or social, decided to take his share too..?

RIP. Too many are going this way these days.

[MAJIC]

Here we go,

another week ,another Farang Murder,another nail in the Tourism Coffin!

RIP.

Edited March 16, 2011 by MAJIC

[Skywalker69]

Another Farang suicide?

[gk10002000]

No assumptions, just a possibility, the guy could have been seen with the cash by local small time hoods, (opportunists) followed him, tried to rob him, he wouldn’t give, they flapped and shot him, in the panic for the money and to make a speedy getaway, did not search very well but felt the wallet, (I know my wallet would feel pretty fat, but it’s full of old recites and stuff, not much money)If in a panic to get away the hood may have just assumed he had the cash, jammed the wallet in his pocket and fled. But we will just have to wait and see.

Of course. I assure you that some of the ATMs at some times are "monitored" by opportunists. If they see money come out, and if it looks like you are alone or frail or vulnerable or heading down a dark ally or side roade, well the crook calls his accomplice(s) who is at the end of the Soi on his motorcycle(s). You would be the prey and hardly know you were being followed. It happens a lot in a lot of places. In the USA, people that cash out large amounts at the Casino Cashier cage have run into trouble outside or down the road or in some places all the way back in their driveway and garage.

Whatever happened here will probably not be known unless some lucky piece of evidence shows up in somebody's posession, cell phone, credit card etc.

[Panhandler007]

It interesting how Thai newspapers splash blurred images of those that have met an untimely end. Kinda like some weird voyeurism.

[alangeol]

I'm sorry but I am staggered by some of these

comments.

You make judgements without facts, displaying cynicism about every aspect of this man's character and existence in this country, where both he was and you are all guests. All this with no consideration to local crime trends (Research it I'm not going to spoon feed you). To continue your "Victor Melldrew" attitude you then insult the character of all Thais - again without fact or evidence.

It is little wonder that the ex-pat community in this country is being viewed by more and more of the native populous as being a hindrance rather than an enhancement to their development as a nation. If you dislike the Thai people, their culture and this country so much and have nothing good to say or feel about it then return to your native lands and allow the rest of us to repair the scars you leave behind you.

I truly hope that this victims family never have the misfortune of reading the inconsiderate comments posted here by so many dispassionate and selfish individuals.

ABSOLUTELY!!!!

[OzMick]

So there's a Bungalow business up for grabs. Unless of course some Thai Lady happened to be the partner and she keeps the lot. At least it should see the Police bothering to visit Phi Phi and make a few enquiries. For example, ' Your husband just got shot. Any chance of the bungalow complex at discount? Oh, and where were you?'

No doubt it'll be yet another death by misadventure. The Police concluding that he ran into 4 stray bullets that happened to be passing at the time. It happens ...................... in Thailand.

If the Police found 22,100 baht then how much did they not find in the wallet?

And their amazingly vigilant response is not to cordon the scene, put up road blocks or gather witness statements, but it is to contact the motorbike rental owner and tell him him the bad news; bike's been crashed mate. Worse still he's dead so has got out of paying the over priced repairs. Falangs eh? And worse still the Police lose out on getting their share.

Life can be cruel. So can death.

But I admire the sensitivity of the Press. No naming or photograph. Well that should ease the family's grief at learning how he was shot and left to die from his wounds and that there'll be no justice whatsoever or arrest.

Thailand.

The bike had 3 tiny scratches only visible through a magnifying glass. The bike will be off the road for 3 weeks while new panels come from BKK (at full daily rental of course) so B22100 should just cover it.

[cdnvic]

Further posts made in all caps will be deleted without notice. Please settle down a bit.

[flybynight2k1]

Agreed with housepainter and I'm not invidious nor bigoted nor live in the Amazing Thailand but been there plenty of times ... I'm realistic and this is a pretty much well picture of Thailand. Amen !

Sounds like you have established your knowledge of Thailand by reading to many forums.

[flybynight2k1]

You are wrong (again!) mate. I've been living in Thailand and never ever thought it's such a "amazing" place. I still constantly go to Thailand and my thoughts about the country and Thais get confirmation day by day. As simple as that. As it's been fond out, he was gong to get divorce from his wife... Yep this happens in Italy also, you might get killed for this... Agreed with someother posters, the iq in here is quite low. Cheers

[webfact]

UPDATE

Phuket Police: ‘Business deal’ prime motive for Butti murder

PHUKET: -- Police believe a business deal was the prime motive for the murder of Luciano Butti, 61, who was gunned down in Phuket on Tuesday night.

However, officers are also investigating Mr Butti’s ongoing divorce proceedings.

Mr Butti was to appear in court for divorce proceedings yesterday, Lt Col Phisit Cheunphet of Thalang Police told the Phuket Gazette today.

Mr Butti, who ran a bungalow rental business on Phi Phi Island, arrived on Phuket on Tuesday and saw his lawyer in Kathu from 5pm to 7pm that day.

During his meeting, he received a phone call. The lawyer told police he heard Mr Butti say in English, “I am busy right now. I cannot talk.”

Police are investigating that phone call as officers believe Mr Butti was lured to Pa Khlok by his killer specifically so he would ride along the dimly-lit road where he could be ambushed, Lt Col Phisit said.

Mr Butti was gunned down while riding a rented motorbike along the Heroines’ Monument-Pa Khlok Road at about 10pm.

His body was found at the side of the road 200 meters from the entrance to Bang Pae Waterfall.

Lt Col Phisit said CCTV footage viewed by officers showed Mr Butti visiting Ao Por Grand Marina after 7pm.

He was attacked while riding toward the Heroines' Monument.

Mr Butti was shot four times: in the chest, right collarbone, abdomen and left wrist.

Three 11mm bullet casings and three unspent 11mm bullets were found at the scene.

Police found 22,100 baht in cash in Mr Butti’s shorts, but not in a wallet.

-- Phuket Gazette 2011-03-17

[surangw]

Jesus, I am starting to hope I will die in an airplane crash so people on this board won't be speculating as to why I was killed and by whom...

or they will speculate you pissed off the pilot

[Markaew]

This seems to be a weekly news event now. Some farang shot, poisoned, committed suicide with hands behind the back, wife killed husband with family suspects, etc.

[inmysights]

... The news from Thailand these days does not make for a civilised, lawful future at all.

I have a long time friend on Phuket who is now in hiding and under police protection along with with his children. Again over property, and fraud. The fraudulent theft and sale of his properties, cars, bank accounts and furnishings by his partner (now thankfully in jail) was seemingly aided and abetted by, amongst others, local officials. A local lawyer is also coming up in the investigation. He has told me only this week that he has become aware of many many more foreigners who have been defrauded out of their own properties. It seems to be happening regularly.

The official corruption and violence he has faced over the past 9 months has been horrendous. More anon on this as the case is currently in the courts and under further investigation. I am glad to report that the case is very much going his way.

Good that your pal is getting justice and mitigating the danger. Bad, OTH, that this is what Thais are resorting to as a business model.

Note to self: Rent is cheap - do that.

Not ONLY Thais. Farang on places like Phuket are just as bad, if not more so. And renting, from what I've been told, no guarantee against theft of all your other possessions amongst these creeps, er 'friends'.

This country enables the worst of the worst to think they can get away with these nefarious acts by virtue of the fact that the judicial process is so painfully slow.

[howto]

Condolence to the family and friends of Luciano.

May he rest in peace.

I contend it is not a 11 mm cartridge

and am convinced it is a 7.62x25 Tokarev.

A closer view of the cartridge left at the scene

clearly shows a 'shoulder' on the casing below the FMJ ball round.

For handguns and revolvers,

there are very very few cartridges which have said shoulder.

I only know of 2 and the 7.62x25 Tokarev is one of them.

It is a 8mm (somewhat) common cartridge.

See the pics, judge for yourself.

The image from the scene, with the cartridge zoomed...

The 7.62x25 Tokarev

source: http://en.wikipedia....rabellum,32.JPG

L-to-R: 32acp; 7.62 Tokarev; 9mm Nato

7,62 Tokarev compared to other cartridges

source: http://en.wikipedia....AP_50AE_002.jpg

L-to-R: 9mm Nato; 7,62 Tokarev; .357sig; 10mm auto; .40sw; .45acp; .50ae

A Chinese handgun that uses a 7.62x25 Tokarev cartridge

source: http://en.wikipedia..../Type_54_pistol

Chinese Type 54 Pistol