Retirement Deposit

[Spellbound]

One for the experts

Will the Thai banks accept a cash transfer form a Debit Card (ie debited straight from a foreign bank) I want to walk into Bangkok Bank ask them to authorise 1m thb withdrawal, then put it on deposit ask for a letter to satisfy the immigration dept.

(Could this be possible using a credit card) Air miles attached to spend on this card would be nice.

Bet you know the answer Dr PP

[huski]

Will the Thai banks accept a cash transfer form a Debit Card (ie debited straight from a foreign bank) I want to walk into Bangkok Bank ask them to authorise 1m thb withdrawal

It is a three part process, withdrawling funds, exchanging to baht, deposit into your account.

Some banks/exchanges will do a cash advance. actually ends up a cash purchase on your credit card statement and yes you will get miles or bonuses because its treated as a purchase. Thai Military and Thai Farmars will do this. Bangkok Bank, has exchange services but I'm not sure if BB does cash advances on a credit card.

(Could this be possible using a credit card) Air miles attached to spend on this card would be nice.

i do it all the time from Thai Military Bank and get a cash back bonus, you will receive miles because its treated as a purchase. Thai Farmers will do it at the counters and exchange it to baht, then you hand them back the cash, deposit slip and passbook.

NOTES:

1. This has to be from a VISA or MASTERCARD, usually a CIRRUS or PLUS based system.

2. Your card will of course need a $26,000 limit or higher if you want 1M baht.

3. The CIRRUS system fails very often and will return a "denied". five minutes or one day later it will "approve" so this can be frustrating.

4. The next business day you will most likely get a phone call from your credit card company to your home country's phone even though you were approved. This is to check to make sure if your card was stolen. Return the call and tell them you plan on making more purchases from Thailand, they will note that on your account and the calls will stop.

you could wire the funds from your account, but there are some costs involved. others on this board wire funds all the time and can recommend ideas but watch ALL the costs from the banks and the exchange rate.

ATM withdrawls will zap you with a charge and there is usually a limit to the amount.

then put it on deposit ask for a letter to satisfy the immigration dept

<200 baht>, ask the bank manager only from your home branch, for the letter for immigration verifying the amount of funds on that date. usually have to pick this letter up the next day from Bangkok Bank. it could be in THAI or English language, i have had three letters for Immigration typed up by Bangkok Bank.

[dr_Pat_Pong]

Huski's advice is sound. To be certain, go into BBL and tell them what you want to do, and ask for the letter for Immigration. If there's a problem, they'll tell you in advance so you can go to another bank. I think they'll do it. Good luck.

[Thetyim]

If it doesn't work then you might have another option.

I have a Barclaycard cheque book for shops which do not accept cards but where I wish to pay by plastic.

I can write out a cheque and it will be charged to my card.

I have never done this, just giving you another possible option.

[cm boy]

I tried this out yesterday at TFB in Chiang Mai with my Visa card (£10k limit) The cashier told me that 20,000 Baht was the max at any one time. Although I could go back every day and do the same! Am I doing something wrong here?

cm boy

[Thetyim]

Yes you are doing something wrong.

10K GBP is your credit limit

20k Baht is the maximum daily CASH advance

What Spellbound and Huski are talking about is getting it put through as a purchase.

[karenfraser18]

You must open a Non- Resident account first with a bank here in Bkk and the best one is the Bangkok Bank main branch two blocks from the Sala Dang BTS station. Most of the other banks will charge you for the service and monthly for their service as well. Then you fax your bank and have them transfer the funds to your account here in Bkk. To open the account you will just withdraw the money from your home account at the ATM but it is a nominal amount and you show them the receipt from the transaction. I also suggest that you open a second account with them ( savings) and then you will get a debit card that you can use here. The balance in that account is up to you and you can always transfer more into it when you need to. This is the surest and simplest way of doing this and will save you a lot of time and money so I hope this helps.

[KevinN]

I have done this evwery month for the last year.

I have a ATM/CHECK debit card on a US bank,and I have a savings acct. at Siam Commercial bank with a ATM card.. I go into the bank,present my US atm card and my bank book and tell them how much I wish to have deposited in my savings acct. it is done in 5 minutes with a fee of 60 baht for the service.and it is in my acct. right then.

[huski]

I tried this out yesterday at TFB in Chiang Mai with my Visa card (£10k limit) The cashier told me that 20,000 Baht was the max at any one time.

20K cash advance based on a VISA CARD is the limit at THAI FARMERS BANK in one visit; it is their policy at all branches.

Although I could go back every day and do the same! Am I doing something wrong here?

At the outside exchange THAI MILITARY BANK in front of Landmark Hotel at nana there is NO LIMIT. I have pulled alot of baht when i need it out of there and can verify there is no limit and no charge plus a good exchange rate.

But you said you were in Chiang Mai so look for a better bank/exchange to take your VISA CARD.

I have done this evwery month for the last year.

I have a ATM/CHECK debit card on a US bank,and I have a savings acct. at Siam Commercial bank with a ATM card.. I go into the bank,present my US atm card and my bank book and tell them how much I wish to have deposited in my savings acct. it is done in 5 minutes with a fee of 60 baht for the service.and it is in my acct. right then.

KevenN is telling you how to do it right if you plan on using your visa to drop money into your THAI Bank account each month. They are stamping his Passbook with the deposit in one trip and taking care of:

currency withdrawl

exchange from dollars to baht

deposit into account

[cm boy]

Many thanks to you all for your help and advice. I did what KevinN does I had the 20k paid into my savings account at TFB so it would appear in my account/passbook (no charge) it's the 20k limit that is the problem. Do Visa charge anything for these transactions...I haven't had my latest statement through yet.

cm boy

[huski]

Do Visa charge anything for these transactions

using a visa card at an ATM, you pay a small fee unless its at your bank's ATM

using a visa card as a purchase/cash advance, the merchant pays a fee

[lopburi3]

You should also be aware that different use results in different exchange rates. The latest rates from SCB are as follow (all in Baht / $US):

Credit card cash advance 37.84

Credit card Sale 38.34

Telex Transfer 38.94

Travelers checks 38.84

Bank notes 38.66

ATM rate (varies) 38.55 (estimate - set by your home bank)

[huski]

lopburi3 is right, VERIFY THE EXCHANGE RATE. Makes a huge difference when you are dealing with larger amounts.

i've been in Bangkok Bank while the exchange rate dropped a few times during an exchange. i pointed out the exchange rate was alot different on my receipt and they just simply turned the rate board on the wall off.

for large amounts, have them verify the rate using the computer not a piece of paper out front of an exchange or the board on the wall of a bank.

[cm boy]

Went to Kasikorn Bank today armed with all the info from you guys and sat with the Asst. Manager for 30 mins explaining what I needed. After he called HO in Bkk he said sorry no can do! (with a smile of course) Only cash advance. So it's off to Bkk Bank tomorrow...switch accounts? (Anyone from Kasikorn out there listening in...or caring?)

Thanks again,

cm boy

[KevinN]

I went in to SCB last week and did my monthly cash transfer of 70,000 baht,I asked what the baht rate was and they looked it up and it was over 39. I had the transfer done,my book stamped and brought up to date,was charged 60 baht for the service. and was done and back on the street in 5 minutes.checked the ATM for the deposit,it was there and the next day I checked my US bank INTERNET banking and the money had been taken from my US checking acct.there is no charge from Visa as my card is a Bank ATM/CHECK card with a Visa logo in the lower corner but as far as I know has nothing to do with VISA corp. as it is just an ATM/CHECK debit card and is used like a check again my acct. but it is done electronically instead of me having to write a check. Before I thought of doing this,I did make a cash draw again my VISA and there was a 20,000 baht daily limit and I was charged with a cash draw from VISA. But on this card it says on the front of the card that it is xxx xxxxxx BANK , ATM/CHECK CARD..not a regular VISA. and the daily limit is what ever I have in my bank checking acct. and when ever I go to immigration in BKK the lady there that takes care of my visa issue just looks at my bank passbook.issues my visa and I come home for another year. Maybe she just does this because I am such a handsome, dashing looking dude,but it works for me.

[JimGant]

Using the ATM/debit card to deposit money in your Thai bank will cost you 1%, the standard ATM discount figure. Don't confuse this with the flat per transaction fee of $2 (US banks anyway) when you use the ATM machine. Also, see Lopburi's figures this thread. His ATM exchange rate reflects the 1% discount from the telex exchange rate, i.e., the ATM rate is 99% that of the telex rate. Yes, this is a 'per bank' figure, but it seems to be fairly standard worldwide.

If you use your non-Thai bank Visa Credit card to make foreign purchases, you'll also pay a 1% fee. (Some cards were charging, and may still be, 3%.) This isn't spelled out anywhere on your statement, but just do the math with the baht/your currency figures from the statement, and then compare with the bid or telex rates for that date.

So, what's the cheapest way to transfer foreign currency to a Thai bank? Well, I have to pay a $50 wire fee from my Suntrust account in Virginia to my Bangkok Bank acct. Ignoring any fees on the Thai side, I would have to send over $5000 to beat the ATM/debit card transfer route. And the breakeven point would be even higher if Bangkok Bank fees apply (they probably do, but I can't find my figures). If your wire fee is $40, then the breakeven point is $4000; $30, then $3000, etc.

Again using Lopburi's figures, if I use my Visa Credit (not Debit) card to 'purchase' Thai baht, the rate I would get from the bank is 38.34. But, as with all foreign purchases, my US-based Visa will charge 1%. So now the effective exchange rate becomes 37.96, almost a full baht off the telex rate. Including my wire fee of $50, I would have to wire slightly less than $2000 to beat the Credit Card 'purchase.' If I wired $10,000, I would be nearly 7900 baht better off than going with the Credit card; at $20,000, over 17,700 baht better off.

Numbers don't tell all, of course. The worst exchange rate is with the credit card. But unlike ATM or wire, this money doesn't immediately come out of your checking account. Instead, you could have up to 60 days of 'float' before you have to pay your credit card bill. And if this money is working in the high teens rate of return, then you could be better off.

Hopefully we'll all be able to transfer money, at acceptable rates, over the Internet pretty soon. A Swiss friend already can (but being Swiss, why doesn't this surprise me). The wire procedure in the States is incredibly ancient -- fill out a form, the clerk calls New York, takes forever to speak phonetically the information, then I pay $50. Ridiculous.

I'm getting long winded. Sorry. Oh, CM Boy: If you stuck your Visa in the ATM machine for your cash advance, as soon as the money hit your fingers, you began to pay a double digit interest rate, probably around 18% annual (unless you signed up for a super good deal). But I don't know if you'll also pay a 1% fee as with a foreign purchase. I avoid cash advances like the plague.

[JimGant]

If anyone is curious about the 1-3% extra charge on credit card foreign purchases, the following link provides more info. I certainly was caught unawares a few years back, as it is not widely understood.

http://www.epinions.com/content_1371775108

[KevinN]

JIM, I am not good at the figures,but the guy at the bank told me 39 was the rate on the 9th when I was there and made a 70,000 ATM DEBIT transfer,and my bank in calif. showed a $1,794.87 deduction from my acct. My bank does not charge me a fee when I use my ATM card in a machine here and it never shows a fee on the receipt that I get from the machine,,does this mean that I am still charged a fee?

[JimGant]

Kevin,

You've found the best of both worlds! It looks like you got the full Interbank rate (which is usually several points better than the telex rate), no 1% fee, and no flat dollar fee from you stateside bank. Suntrust always charges me $2 for every ATM transaction, and the exchange rate is 99% of the telex rate. Whether or not I'd be charged this 1% if I transfered between banks using a debit card, I don't know. (If you don't mind, next time you do an ATM transaction, send me the date, baht, and dollar figures. I'm really curious if you're even paying the 1% in this situation....)

So, who's your stateside bank? Obviously there's a lot to be gained by shopping around. I even wonder if Bangkok Bank is as accomodating as SCB?

Anyway your numbers show you've found the best way -- and rate -- to move money into Thailand. Getting away from wire transfer has been a long desire.

[huski]

So, what's the cheapest way to transfer foreign currency to a Thai bank? Well, I have to pay a $50 wire fee from my Suntrust account in Virginia to my Bangkok Bank acct.

lame

You've found the best of both worlds! It looks like you got the full Interbank rate (which is usually several points better than the telex rate), no 1% fee, and no flat dollar fee from you stateside bank. Suntrust always charges me $2 for every ATM transaction, and the exchange rate is 99% of the telex rate

1. stick your VISA card in an ATM machine that does not belong to your bank and withdrawl cash, you will pay a fee and are the at the mercy of the bank's exchange rate.

2. give your VISA card to a merchant that swipes it through an authorization machine and the merchant pays the fee. this is treated as a cash purchase on your statement, whether you are using a VISA card at BIG C or HANDING IT TO A BANK/EXCHANGE FOR CASH.

If someone is getting charged a fee it is coming directly from the entity, to try and recoup the authorization fee or make money. read my previous post of the location that does not charge any fee and there is NO LIMIT. there are many other locations in Bangkok that will do this also for no fee, Thai Farmers Bank included but the limit is 20K per visit.

[lopburi3]

give your VISA card to a merchant that swipes it through an authorization machine and the merchant pays the fee. this is treated as a cash purchase on your statement

If you use most US Credit cards here you are likely to be charged a "foreign usage' fee of perhaps 2 percent (this has nothing to do with the merchant fees). You also receive a lousy rate of exchange.

It appears KevinN has found the best method. Now we need to know if it can be done at other banks and if his US bank is somehow different.

[huski]

If you use most US Credit cards here you are likely to be charged a "foreign usage' fee of perhaps 2 percent (this has nothing to do with the merchant fees). You also receive a lousy rate of exchange.

there is no limit, foreign usage fee, or any fees from the bank/exchange at the location i described in a previous post . the exchange rate at that location is the same or better than other banks on the same day as i constantly compare. i usually use a mastercard that gives a cash back bonus because its treated as a purchase and when that is factored in, the overall exchange rate is the best i have found.

[JimGant]

huski,

Who's your credit card bank? If it's not Thai, then I guarantee you're paying at least the 1% 'clearinghouse' fee that all Visa and Mastercard banks charge for making foreign PURCHASES (not cash advances). I used to use First USA, until I found out I was paying 2% ON TOP of the 1% clearinghouse fee. I switched to MBNA, which only charges the 1%.

Click on the hperlink below for a detailed explanation (it's a repeat from the one I posted here yesterday):

http://www.epinions.com/content_1371775108

The only thing that makes sense is that you're not really making a purchase (even tho' it's being treated as a 'purchase' for the cash-back bonus feature). Instead, you're getting a cash advance. And the interest clock begins ticking immediately. If you don't pay off your credit card bill in full every month, this cash advance interest will be buried in with the other numbers, and won't be obvious.

If it really is a purchase of baht, then Mastercard charges the bank/exchange their 1.5-2.5% merchant fee. Since you're buying cash, not a rice cooker from Big C, they would be sure to pass on this cost to you in the form of a discounted exchange rate. Since this isn't happening, you must be getting a cash advance.

Or maybe you've figured out how to get tea money out of an ATM machine. Anything's possible here, I'm convinced.

[KevinN]

Jim,When I used the ATM card from my bank in the states I sometimes checked what rate I got in baht from the machine and it always figured out in dollars to that days exchange rate listed at Bank Of Asia ..But I don't do that anymore,now I just make a monthly deposit and use SCB card,and the regular deposits make the gal at immigration happy.

But when I used to pay for my internet satellite service to CSCOMS. with a visa I would be charged for the baht rate on the card and it was the foreign currency charge.so I won't do that again but most things that I have bought on Visa is not charged extra but 3% if I use Master CARD.

I use a small bank in northern calif. that has always treated me fine,I pay nothing for the checking acct, and nothing to use the ATM,they have the Golden Age where if over 55 it is free.But some other banks will tack on a chg. for using their machines.

SCB charges me nothing unless I use their card at other ATM. then it is 20 baht at the machine.

[lopburi3]

SCB charges me nothing unless I use their card at other ATM. then it is 20 baht at the machine

You must be using it out of the bank area (using upcountry on a Bangkok card or such) as there should not be any charge for using another ATM Pool machine until after the third time in one month. Then it is about 8 baht. But they all have that "out of area" charge.

Do not believe immigration is really that concerned that you deposit every month if you have funds in your account; I don't.

Your check card must have a higher cash advance limit than mine as my paperwork says only $1,500 available per day and $5,000 per day for merchant.

For me it is still easier to telephone a wire transfer than queue up in bank but believe your system seems to provide the best cost/speed. Now wonder if anyone else can get the same results?

[KevinN]

LOPBURI, Our banks are only real busy with long lines the first few days of the month and as we live upcountry,I just walk in the bank and sit down at the desk and get service,they all seem to know what I want and bring the paperwork with them to the desk and it is done very fast,and with the ATM/CHECK card it should be as easy for anyone. I have no daily limit on my card for the check use as it is just for my personal checking acct. and as long as I have the amount in my acct.I can write an electronic check for it.Which is what it amounts to.and I guess that they think that there is no danger of fraud because I am just putting it in another of my accts.there might be a limit if I wanted cash.

[cm boy]

SCB charges me nothing unless I use their card at other ATM. then it is 20 baht at the machine

You must be using it out of the bank area (using upcountry on a Bangkok card or such) as there should not be any charge for using another ATM Pool machine until after the third time in one month. Then it is about 8 baht. But they all have that "out of area" charge.

lopburi I have been getting money form 'other' banks in the same area as my TFB here in Chiang Mai for many years , the same in Phuket and Bangkok and they all charged me between 20-35 Baht fee. I have ample ATM slips to verify this. Even the SCB bank next door to my own, when the TFB is out of order (cash), charge this same fee. It would be nice to know your secrets.

cm boy

[lopburi3]

It would be nice to know your secrets.

Move to Bangkok?

I can assure you there is no fee to use another ATM Pool machine here in Bangkok (which includes just about all bank atms).

I note that KevinN is also upcountry so guess that is the price you pay.

[huski]

Currency Exchange Rate  Date : 16 January 2004

Update : 3 Effective From : 14:45  [unit : Baht per 1 unit of foreign currency]USD1 USD : 1 37.77 39.15   

USD5 USD : 5-20 38.15 39.15   

USD50 USD : 50-100 38.60 39.20

Foreign Exchange Rates

huski,Who's your credit card bank?

Cash Back Bonus $ From PayPal Inc Debit Card $5.77 USD Jan. 15, 2004 Pending Details

Debit Card Cash Advance To LANDMARK PLAZA EXCHANG BANGKOK -$384.42 USD Jan. 15, 2004 Pending Details

showing how to get a 39.6 exchange rate for 15000 baht, not an ATM, the date shows US date/time, but the actual transaction was today in Bangkok. subtract the $5.77 cash back bonus from $384.42 for the real total taken out of the account only $378.65 <39.6>

[JimGant]

huski,

Sounds like a GREAT deal -- so what's the catch? Nothing that I can see readily comes to mind. You got the Interbank exchange rate, and instead of paying the 1% ATM conversion fee, you get, instead, 1.5% cash back. A nifty 2.5% spread from us mortals (except Kevin, that is)!

I've used PayPal for eBay purchases, but I never became a "premier" member to get their Debit card. I guess when you did this, you promised to give them 'free' advertising for any and all eBay action. Maybe this great deal reflects their 'payment' for advertising. But, no, there's gotta be some hidden fees somewhere -- and they, like most of these financial characters, do like to hide true costs. The only thing I can think of is that you're both the 'buyer,' thus getting the 1.5% cashback, and the 'seller,' paying PayPal's transaction fee of 2.2%, for a net cost of .7%. This confusing info is found at:

http://www.paypal.com/cgi-bin/webscr?cmd=_...ees-ppp-outside

Anyway, if indeed you are paying .7%, you're still doing great. But please check your PayPal statements for hidden fees, and let us know what you find, if anything.

Maybe there are 'free lunches' out there.