Boxing

[Siam_superfly]

An American fighter died in the US this week, after a heavy fight. Again the anti boxing crowd are trying to ban the sport. People die all the time in sports, they fall of horses, crash cars, etc...but nobody calls for those sports to be banned...Of course boxing can never be fully banned, its to big...but many young lads and girls out there, who could be great boxers, never get the chance coz of the negative image that the sports attracts....Its one of the oldest sports on earth, and is by far the greatest....nothing comes close...its fast and furious, hard and smart....its not everybodys choice, but have those who oppose it, ever stepped through the ropes, into the square of truth......no way...

[ProfessorFart]

I agree totally. Accidents happen. Its a tragedy but boxers know the risks when they get in the ring. A kid from my ABC got a blood clot on his brain from sparring but thank Heaven he recovered OK but it goes with the territory. As an ex amat pug, I knew the risks and came through with a knackered bugle and little else.

To ban boxing would only drive it underground and that is no good for anyone.

[chonabot]

Wow , a nice post there, Fly.

Leavander Johnson ( 1970 - 2005 ) RIP

[Thaiboxer]

Western Boxing is more dangerous in the long run than Muay Thai and kickboxing. I found that hard to believe at first because Muay Thai allows elbows, knees and kicks in addition to punches. In regular boxing, most of the blows are directed towards the head so the brain takes that constant pounding. I heard from somewhere that something like 8 out of 10 boxers suffer from post career brain damage. That statistic seems a bit high but a lot of boxers do have brain damage after retirement...and example is Muhammed Ali; he shakes like a twig.

Like another poster said, boxers do know the risks they are taking when they step into the ring. Years ago, boxers didn't even wear gloves so it was even more dangerous back then. Amature boxers used to not even use headgear back in the day. At least there are several rules in place to make the sport safer. Other sports like car racing and offshore powerboat racing have taken their toll as well but those sportsmen also knew the risks. Banning boxing is definitely not the way to go. Each person has to evaluate the risks associated with his/her chosen sport before taking part. Besides, boxing does have its benefits: it provides its practicioners with excellent cardiovascular fitness, good eye/hand coordination and confidence. Also, a little boxing can go a long way in a self defense situation. Anything banned in boxing is good for the street!

[soi lurker]

Couldn't agree more SS. Ignorance is the only way boxing could be banned. Boxing is banned indefinately in Australia's military because of a death inside the boxing ring. It seems that ignorance had a major part to play there instead of the sport itself, a medical condition followed by a mismatch in talent and weight is what i beleive happened, so everyone else suffers the consequences.

According to some people, boxing is seen as a brutal sport with a talentless addiction to purposefully bludgening one's opponent. While sometimes it displays a side which does not completely come up smelling like roses, the latter could not be farther from the truth. Boxing is highly disciplined and skilled sport which requires inner courage and very high level of fitness and dedication to be successful.

[Shivek]

LAS VEGAS - Boxer Leavander Johnson, critically injured in the biggest fight of his life, died Thursday at a hospital where he was rushed with bleeding on the brain.

The 35-year-old╝s kidneys had failed and his heart was not pumping on its own when family members decided to remove him from life support, his doctor said.

ôWe had no further mode to improve his prognosis, so the family very correctly made the decision to withdraw care,╜ Dr. William Smith said. ôHe passed away very peacefully.╜

Johnson collapsed on his way to the dressing room after taking a beating in his IBF lightweight title defense Saturday night against Jesus Chavez. Doctors were operating on him within 40 minutes to relieve pressure on his brain, but he never came out of a medically induced coma.

Smith said he performed a second operation Monday to remove a blood clot but Johnson was too gravely injured to survive.

ôHe suffered a very severe injury. The problem is that the injury was to the brain itself,╜ Smith said. ôIn some cases, the punishment is absorbed by the skull, but in this young man╝s case, the brain absorbed the punishment itself.╜

Johnson╝s promoter, Lou DiBella, said Johnson╝s family members were present when he died. Johnson╝s father was his trainer and his brother was his manager.

ôWhat a wonderful guy this was. And I╝ve never met anybody so proud or so grateful to achieve his dream,╜ DiBella said. ôIf there╝s any solace to be taken in this, it╝s that he died doing what he loved. He died a champion.╜

Doctors were initially unsure Johnson would make it through the night after being injured during the fight at the MGM Grand hotel-casino, but the next day Smith expressed cautious optimism after tests showed improvement in brain function.

Johnson, who was from Atlantic City, N.J., spent 16 years as a professional fighter before finally winning a version of the 135-pound title in June. But, in his first defense, he took a beating from Chavez before finally being stopped by a flurry of punches in the 11th round.

He walked from the ring, but on the way to the dressing room began showing signs of an injury. He was rushed to University Medical Center where Smith operated on him to relieve pressure from a subdural hematoma, or bleeding on the brain.

ôThere╝ll be a lot of people who╝ll take pokes at boxing for this. We can be better for protecting our athletes. But this was not a situation where anyone failed Leavander Johnson,╜ said DiBella, who knew Johnson for more than 10 years. ôIt was just God╝s will. It╝s a sport that╝s inherently dangerous.╜

DiBella said Johnson╝s father, Bill, said Chavez was ôblameless in this tragic situation.╜ Chavez visited Johnson in the hospital the day after the fight.

Smith said it was not clear whether one punch or an accumulation of punches in the fight caused a swelling so pronounced that it pushed Johnson╝s brain from the right side of his skull to the left.

He said doctors also don╝t know for sure whether fighters who take a lot of punches during their career are more susceptible to brain damage. Johnson was in his 41st pro fight and had more than 100 amateur fights.

ôIt╝s a tough question to answer 100 percent. Certainly, some evidence suggests repeated blows over time will make a person able to resist a major injury less well,╜ Smith said. ôHis reserves for recovering from this were much less than had he never had taken the blows over time.╜

Johnson╝s death follows the July 2 death of Mexican boxer Martin Sanchez, who died a day after he was knocked out by Rustam Nugaev of Russia in a super lightweight fight in Las Vegas. That death was the fifth in the ring since 1994 in the city.

Before Sanchez died, two other fighters suffered brain injuries but survived after fights this year in Las Vegas.

Sad story. But the guy Jesus had boxing with him so wasnt "Jesus" supposed to resurrect him? I thought Jesus was supposed to raise people from the dead.

[Abandon]

I'd wager that a higher percentage of mountain climbers (on known dangerous mountains) lose their lives in their 'sport' than boxers.

Nice one to Wlad (and Peters) ...

next vitaly beats Rahman

Krasniqui beats Brewster

and RJJ batters the Magic man (so called 'cos he will disappear from boxing after Rjj is finished with him)

Anyone dare to disagree?

[Siam_superfly]

The heavy weight divison is a bit boring now that Tyson, Lewis and Holyfield are not active.....Yeh Rockman will go down "big time"......Tua is on the come back I hear...and he will beat both the Russian's if he gets going....

there is a chance of a Floyd Mayweather V Hatton fight coming soon....that would be a good fight...one in which Hatton will have problems...as he will face someone just as fit as he is this time round....

Roy Jones Jr was fighting last night I think...anybody know what happened there ?

[Siam_superfly]

Wow , a nice post there, Fly.

Leavander Johnson ( 1970 - 2005 )  RIP

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Its a pleasure Chon...

[Siam_superfly]

I agree totally. Accidents happen. Its a tragedy but boxers know the risks when they get in the ring. A kid from my ABC got a blood clot on his brain from sparring but thank Heaven he recovered OK but it goes with the territory. As an ex amat pug, I knew the risks and came through with a knackered bugle and little else.

To ban boxing would only drive it underground and that is no good for anyone.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Ahhh Pro Fart...long time no see...

The Fly looks forward to ur man Hatton fighting in America soon....

If ur man gets a fight with Floyd, well thats a dream fight for Hatton, win or lose, Hatton will have a chance to make a name for himself in the US fast....and thats where it really counts....

[Siam_superfly]

Couldn't agree more SS. Ignorance is the only way boxing could be banned. Boxing is banned indefinately in Australia's military because of a death inside the boxing ring. It seems that ignorance had a major part to play there instead of the sport itself, a medical condition followed by a mismatch in talent and weight is what i beleive happened, so everyone else suffers the consequences.

According to some people, boxing is seen as a brutal sport with a talentless addiction to purposefully bludgening one's opponent. While sometimes it displays a side which does not completely come up smelling like roses, the latter could not be farther from the truth. Boxing is highly disciplined and skilled sport which requires inner courage and very high level of fitness and dedication to be successful.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

spot on Soi..spot on....

[Siam_superfly]

I'd wager that a higher percentage of mountain climbers (on known dangerous mountains) lose their lives in their 'sport' than boxers.

Nice one to Wlad (and Peters) ...

next vitaly beats Rahman

      Krasniqui beats Brewster

      and RJJ batters the Magic man  (so called 'cos he will disappear from boxing after Rjj is finished with him)

Anyone dare to disagree?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yeh, but falling of a mountain is Ok...same as solo sailing, racing around the world, taking dangerous routes through wild oceans, and then having Navy personel risk their lives trying to save u.....the list goes on......

[chonabot]

The Fly looks forward to ur man Hatton fighting in America soon....

If ur man gets a fight with Floyd, well thats a dream fight for Hatton, win or lose, Hatton will have a chance to make a name for himself in the US fast....and thats where it really counts....

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I think Ricky will beat WBA champ - Carlos Maussa - in November, but Mayweather is a very skillful boxer. The fact that he has onl;y recently stepped up to Lt-Welter may be a factor , but he destroyed Gatti who thought the same thing.

This , when it is made, will be the fight of the year, and whoever wins will be in the top3 pound for pound IMO.

I think Ricky needs 2 fights before this one.

[ProfessorFart]

There are many sports with higher mortality rates than boxing. What really gets the goat of the PC liberal anti boxing brigade is that boxers are actually trying to inflict harm on one another.

As for Hatton/Mayweather, I think thats still some way off but As SS says it would be a win win fight for Hatton. Should he lose, especially if he puts up a good showing, everyone would have expected that anyway and if he wins the World will be his oyster.

[Abandon]

Siam - Jones - tarver is Oct 3rd. RJJ is gonna knock him stupid .....

No way Tua beats the 'russians' (presume you mean wlad and vitaly, who are Ukranian ... or do you mean Valuev?)

I can't see anyone ever beating this guy ... http://www.eastsideboxing.com/news.php?p=4730&more=1

and that is not a good thing

[chonabot]

Edited September 26, 2005 by chonabot

[chonabot]

Ah &lt;deleted&gt; I tried to put an image of the thug but was too pissed too lalalallala

Edited September 26, 2005 by chonabot

[Thaiboxer]

Some of these Thai fighters like Yodsanan 3K Battery are very talented. Yodsanan has already made a name for himself in the US by having a couple fights there. Most of these Thai boxers started off in Muay Thai before making the switch to Western Boxing. Khaosai Galaxy (perhaps the most famous in Thailand) did just that.

[chonabot]

Some of these Thai fighters like Yodsanan 3K Battery are very talented. Yodsanan has already made a name for himself in the US by having a couple fights there. Most of these Thai boxers started off in Muay Thai before making the switch to Western Boxing. Khaosai Galaxy (perhaps the most famous in Thailand) did just that.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

And your point being ?

Sorry I couldn't help it, but I love both styles and found your post to lacking in depth.

Heres a teaser , I once trained alongside Rattanapol , what was the name if the Gym?

And what were the monthly rates for a farang, in 1991?

[chonabot]

Please ignore my above post , I was drunk and was typing drivel.

[Nam Kao]

Ive trained in both and on the street the western boxer would win.

[chonabot]

Ive trained in both and on the street the western boxer would win.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I disagree. If the 2 were similar age/size/experience level, the Thaiboxers weapons would/should be able to attack/defend against the Western Boxer whilst keeping the WB out of range for punches. In closer quarters the clinch/knees/elbows would be too much. Once the 2 were n a clinch , what could the WB do apart from rabbit punches.? I agree that WB would probably punch harder/faster/more accurate than the MT , because this being his only weapon , yet the TB should be able to punch decently plus knee/elbow/pushkick/roundhouse kick/decent locking techniques. His legs would be far more powerful than the WB. The only way the WB would win , IMO, would be if he had some streetfighting experience, which IMO again, TB teaches in its entirety, or if the WB had a knockout punch.

I once had a tussle outside a pub with a quite handy looking chap, allegedly he had boxed before, the fight started and ended with a roundhouse to his ribs, took the wind out of his sails before I had the pleasure of seeing his pugilistic skills.

[Nam Kao]

I knew that would get you wound up Chonabot

[chonabot]

I knew that would get you wound up Chonabot 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Hehe , I realized that about halfway through the post , but I enjoy reading my posts even more than writing 'em!

Cheers

[Thaiboxer]

Western boxers definitely punch better than Muay Thai fighters but it's the other weapons in Muay Thai that would allow the Muay Thai fighter to dominate the Western boxer. Both disciplines lack groundfighting elements which would be important if one were learning to fight on the street. Muay Boran, the old style of Muay Thai, teaches locking, breaking, throwing and groundfighting techniques in addition to the kicks, punches, knees and elbows. That system is a complete system but unfortunately very few good teachers can be found these days. Modern Muay Thai has elements of the old style combined with some elements of Western Boxing. Some of the best fighting systems in the world are those taught to special forces soldiers. Those systems are brutal, simple and designed to accomplish one thing: to take an enemy out quickly and efficiently.

Edited September 28, 2005 by Thaiboxer

[bbtali]

Heres a teaser , I once trained alongside Rattanapol , what was the name if the Gym?

And what were the monthly rates for a farang, in 1991?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Sor Vorapin and I would hazard a guess around 8 or 9 grand for all inclusive. Was that at the gym in Talingchan after they moved from Khaosan area?

Edited September 28, 2005 by bbtali

[Nam Kao]

The WB would dominate in punching range, the TB dominates at kicking

range and inside.

TB leg kicks are awesome for the street. Hard to block if your not accustomed

to them. I like to punch combo high to get them thinking up top and sink the

leg kick deep and then right away drive a knee to the front or same spot on

the thigh. The streetfighter then cannot understand why his leg doesnt work anymore, even

if he swinging its just arm punches. Then its punch to get inside and elbow time.

Next year - Basket weaving

[chonabot]

Heres a teaser , I once trained alongside Rattanapol , what was the name if the Gym?

And what were the monthly rates for a farang, in 1991?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Sor Vorapin and I would hazard a guess around 8 or 9 grand for all inclusive. Was that at the gym in Talingchan after they moved from Khaosan area?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

This boy is good , very good!

[Thaiboxer]

Sor Vorapin now has two locations; both are far downtown. They are a rather expensive gym but still cheaper than some others. The famous one now in Talingchun is Kaewsamrit. Their top fight, Anuwat Kaewsamrit, won Fighter Of The Year twice in a row. That camp has turned out some good champion fighters, both Thai and foreign. They have an English guy who takes care of all the foreign trainees.

[bbtali]

Sor Vorapin now has two locations; both are far downtown. They are a rather expensive gym but still cheaper than some others. The famous one now in Talingchun is Kaewsamrit. Their top fight, Anuwat Kaewsamrit, won Fighter Of The Year twice in a row. That camp has turned out some good champion fighters, both Thai and foreign. They have an English guy who takes care of all the foreign trainees.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Anuwat Kaewsamrit

Ive heard he is very good possibly going to switch to international boxing in future, real hard puncher