Thai 'Red Shirts' Mark A Year Since Deadly Clash

[webfact]

Thai 'Red Shirts' mark a year since deadly clash

by Thanaporn Promyamyai

BANGKOK (AFP) -- Tens of thousands of anti-government "Red Shirts" gathered in Bangkok on Sunday to mark a year since deadly clashes between troops and protesters during their mass rally in the capital.

The rally peaked at 30,000 people in their signature scarlet garb, according to police spokesman Major General Prawut Thavornsiri, while a special branch source estimated the crowd size at nearer 50,000, undeterred by rainfall.

Thailand, which is preparing for elections set to be held later this year, remains deeply divided following the worst civil violence in decades in April and May 2010 that left more than 90 people dead, mostly civilians.

Fights between the military and protesters on April 10 last year left 26 people dead and marked a violent turning point in the rally.

The protest was halted the following month, when troops firing live rounds and backed by armoured vehicles moved in to disperse the demonstrators.

Fugitive former prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra, a hero for many Red Shirts, addressed Sunday's year-on demonstration -- the largest since the crackdown, if the higher estimate was correct.

"One year ago, there should not have been any deaths from calls for democracy," he told them during a 15-minute speech via a video link.

"They will not die for nothing, they will not be wounded for nothing. I will do my best to support the people who came out for democracy."

Thaksin said he hoped people would "show their decision clearly" in the upcoming vote.

The former premier, who was ousted in a 2006 coup and lives abroad to avoid a jail term for corruption, said he was calling from "a country in the Middle East where people are also calling for democracy," without being specific.

The Reds began Sunday's year-on demonstration with a religious ceremony at which monks prayed for the dead and relatives held pictures of their loved ones who were killed. They later held a one-minute silence in commemoration.

Among those killed on April 10 was Hiro Muramoto, a 43-year-old Japanese cameraman working for news agency Reuters.

Thai police last month said there was no evidence to show troops were responsible for his death, despite initial findings by the Department of Special Investigation that suggested they might have been.

"Today we pay tribute to Hiro's life, but remain discouraged that the circumstances of his death are still unknown a year later," said Stephen Adler, Reuters editor-in-chief.

"Hiro's family and Reuters colleagues deserve to know how this tragedy occurred and who was behind it."

Both military and protesters accused each other of using live ammunition during last year's clashes.

Recent Red Shirt gatherings have attracted tens of thousands of protesters to the capital and marked a show of strength for the movement, but have been well short of the 100,000 people who joined last year's protests at their peak.

Major General Wichai Sungprapai, of the Bangkok Metropolitan Police, said that around 3,300 officers would be deployed for Sunday's demonstration, which was set to go on into the night but appeared to be peaceful.

The Reds view Prime Minister Abhisit Vejjajiva's government as an unelected elite because it came to power in a 2008 parliamentary vote with military backing, after a court ruling threw out the previous administration.

"We don't fight for ourselves but for all Thais, for the younger generation to have equality in life," said one of Sunday's banners waved on the streets.

Thaksin is hailed by the Reds for his policies for the poor while in power, but seen by the Thai ruling elite as authoritarian, corrupt and a threat to the revered monarchy.

He faces terrorism charges in Thailand, accused of bankrolling last year's anti-government protests and of instigating unrest.

-- (c) Copyright AFP 2011-04-11

[webfact]

Divisions remain as reds, army remember their dead

By The Nation

Thaksin calls for free, fair poll, says he'll 'be home soon'as reds mark bloody 2010 clash; families of soldiers killed also make merit

The division in the country appeared stark yesterday as the red shirts and relatives of soldiers killed in the April 10 clash last year held separate ceremonies to mark the first anniversary of the bloody crackdown. Each had their views on the violence.

Former Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra, the major leader of the red movement, spoke via video-link to the rally stage at Democracy Monument to express his gratitude to the protesters who sacrificed their lives "fighting for democracy".

"I hope to see you soon," was Thaksin's main message to his supporters. He called for red shirts to "be patient", saying justice and democracy are returning to Thailand.

In a 20-minute speech from the Middle East, where he lives in exile, Thaksin called for a free and fair poll. "If this election is not free and fair, the commission who takes care of the election would regret it as a major setback for the country.

Relatives and families of the heroes killed would never give in and would continue their struggle until the country was really democratic, he said.

Thaksin's ended his talk saying: "Thank you, everyone, including the anonymous ones. I know you all. I'll come home soon."

Some 25 people died and hundreds were injured at Kok Wua Intersection one year ago when troops tried to clear out protesters near the Phan Fa Bridge. A violent street battle erupted and raged for hours. Five military officers were among the dead, reportedly killed by pro-red gunmen. A Japanese cameraman was also shot dead while standing on a vehicle filming the wild firefight. The red shirts made merit for their fallen comrades and Hiroyuki Muramoto, the cameraman who worked for Reuters, at a rally near Democracy Monument.

Stephen Adler, Reuters's editor-in-chief, issued a statement expressing disappointment in the Thai investigation into Muramoto's death.

"Today we pay tribute to Hiro's life, but remain discouraged that the circumstances of his death are still unknown a year later. Hiro's family and Reuters colleagues deserve to know how this tragedy occurred and who was behind it," he said.

Thousands of police were deployed near the monument in central Bangkok yesterday to ensure peace.

Leaders of the red-shirt Democratic Alliance Against Dictatorship, including Thida Thavornseth, Jatuporn Promphan and Korkaew Pikulthong led merit-making at the monument. Relatives took portraits of the dead protesters to the gathering.

Monks prayed for the spirits of the dead. The red leaders laid red flowers for them at the clash site. Many shouted "There are dead people here" to draw attention to the bloody drama.

Red leader Jatuporn said tens of thousands of red shirts assembled at the clash site to remember the "cruel" incident and call for justice for the protesters and Muramoto.

The Department of Special Investigation (DSI), the agency handling the legal follow-up to the red-shirt protest, failed to pin someone to take responsibility for the clash, he said. The DSI had to take responsibility for the "failure" to bring the "murderers" of the protesters and Japanese cameraman to justice, he said.

Nicha Hiranburana, widow of Colonel Romklao Thuwatham, deputy chief of staff at the Second Infantry Division, who was killed by a grenade in the dramatic clash, made merit for him at Wat Bowornnivet. Many top brass and government officials, including First Army chief Lt-General Udomdej Sitabutr and government spokesman Panitan Wattanayagorn attended the merit-making ceremony.

Nicha said she made merit for her husband Romklao and the other soldiers who died in the clash.

"The incident is a lesson for Thai society that we should not hurt each other. This is one of the great losses for the country in which Thais were killed by Thais," she said. "Romklao was a good soldier and good person. Many good people like him should not die like this. Don't kill good people like this."

Details surrounding the death of many protesters and soldiers in the clash are still unclear. The authorities say "men in black" balaclavas who were attached to the protesters killed Romklao and other troops while the red shirts claim the government ordered the Army to kill them.

-- The Nation 2011-04-11

[whybother]

The red shirts made merit for their fallen comrades and Hiroyuki Muramoto, the cameraman who worked for Reuters, at a rally near Democracy Monument.

So they don't care about the soldiers that they killed?

[sjjmmi]

The rally peaked at 30,000 people in their signature scarlet garb, according to police spokesman Major General Prawut Thavornsiri, while a special branch source estimated the crowd size at nearer 50,000, undeterred by rainfall.

[rubl]

From the OP:

Fugitive former prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra, a hero for many Red Shirts, addressed Sunday's year-on demonstration -- the largest since the crackdown, if the higher estimate was correct.

k. Thaksin's remarks made by calling from outside are probably the reason why Mrs. Thida said:

'The UDD will also closely monitor the upcoming general election. We will support the party that secures the majority vote to form the next government and will fight against outside forces that try to meddle with the poll result.' (bold mine)

[zzaa09]

The red shirts made merit for their fallen comrades and Hiroyuki Muramoto, the cameraman who worked for Reuters, at a rally near Democracy Monument.

So they don't care about the soldiers that they killed?

The establishment isn't allowed to be martyred. That's what revolutions are about.....

[virtualtraveller]

The fact that soldiers were shot at and killed from the so-called 'Black Shirts' hiding among the protesters removes their legitimacy as a peaceful movement, they crossed that line, so it becomes a war, armed resistance, they no longer can expect 'justice' as a one-way process. The Army would now have the right to protest as well on this same date against terrorism or treason. It's just another excuse for this mob to gather in a show of numbers ahead of the election. The deaths are regrettable, in terms of numbers they are minor compared to, say, drunk driving on any given night due to police negligence. Soon we'll run out of anniversary days to protest on at this rate.

How about a protest on the anniversaries of; the beginning of the war on drugs, the day of the mis-verdict against Thaksin's asset concealment case, the burning of Bangkok, the raid on the ASEAN conference in Pattaya.

I'll be interested to see how this continues, for example, if PT comes to power in the next election, will the martyred dead suddenly stop, will they pressure THEIR government for a full investigation (which includes an investigation into the UDD leaderships complicity)?

[hyperdimension]

Former Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra, the major leader of the red movement, spoke via video-link to the rally stage at Democracy Monument to express his gratitude to the protesters who sacrificed their lives "fighting for democracy".

Notice that the article has "fighting for democracy" in quotation marks. More people are becoming aware that the red movement's fight has always been for Thaksin himself, with "democracy" used merely as a tool to amass support for the fight.

So Thaksin is thanking people who died for him.

Edited April 11, 2011 by hyperdimension

[webfact]

Red-Shirt Movement Commemorate One-Year Anniversary of Deadly April 10 Incident

Yesterday, red-shirt protesters gathered around the Democracy Monument to commemorate the one-year anniversary of deadly clashes between protesters and soldiers on April 10 of last year.

The Democratic Alliance Against Dictatorship or DAAD, also known as the red-shirt group, gathered at the Democracy Monument yesterday to commemorate the one-year anniversary since the deadly clashes between soldiers and protesters, which left twenty six dead, including five soldiers and twenty-one civilians.

Pictures of the dead were displayed, while donations were being collected to help the relatives of those who lost their loved ones during last year's protest.

More than 23 companies of soldiers helped guard the area to make sure the gathering went peacefully.

Red roses were sent to commemorate the loss of red-shirt members, while live performances reenacting last year's clashes were also staged.

At 3 P.M., many red-shirt leaders including Thida Thavornseth, Jatuporn Prompan, Korkaew Pikulthong, and Shinawat Haboonpad held religious ceremonies to honor the red-shirt members who died during last year's protest.

Jatuporn urged the Department of Special Investigation, or DSI, to take responsibility for the death of the Japanese cameraman from Reuters and other red-shirt protesters.

He criticized the DSI for not being able to give an answer as to who killed the victims.

He added that the DSI handed over responsibility to the police, and is urging the army to stop intervening in politics.

He ended by calling for justice for the red-shirt people, who claim to have been working hard to bring democracy back to the nation.

-- Tan Network 2011-04-11

[PhoenixRising]

He ended by calling for justice for the red-shirt people, who claim to have been working hard to bring democracy back to the nation.

Since when has Thailand ever had a legitimate democracy free of corruption and fraud? You can't have democracy when the controlling force behind it is corruption. Deal with that first and then you have a fair chance at a real democracy.

[jdinasia]

Jatuporn urged the Department of Special Investigation, or DSI, to take responsibility for the death of the Japanese cameraman from Reuters and other red-shirt protesters.

huh?

[Robby nz]

Remember reading somewhere that Thaksin would give 200,000b to any family who had a member killed by the reds.

Could this be one of the reasons the reds have not admitted that they or the MIB associated with them killed or injured anyone?

[whybother]

Pictures of the dead were displayed, while donations were being collected to help the relatives of those who lost their loved ones during last year's protest.

...

while live performances reenacting last year's clashes were also staged.

I wonder if they showed pictures of the soldiers killed, or if any of their performances involved the shooting of grenades.

[Pi Sek]

The fact that soldiers were shot at and killed from the so-called 'Black Shirts' hiding among the protesters removes their legitimacy as a peaceful movement, they crossed that line, so it becomes a war, armed resistance, they no longer can expect 'justice' as a one-way process. The Army would now have the right to protest as well on this same date against terrorism or treason. It's just another excuse for this mob to gather in a show of numbers ahead of the election. The deaths are regrettable, in terms of numbers they are minor compared to, say, drunk driving on any given night due to police negligence. Soon we'll run out of anniversary days to protest on at this rate.

How about a protest on the anniversaries of; the beginning of the war on drugs, the day of the mis-verdict against Thaksin's asset concealment case, the burning of Bangkok, the raid on the ASEAN conference in Pattaya.

I'll be interested to see how this continues, for example, if PT comes to power in the next election, will the martyred dead suddenly stop, will they pressure THEIR government for a full investigation (which includes an investigation into the UDD leaderships complicity)?

Whilst I agree entirely with your viewpoint, I think it is unfair to say that the Black Shirts' hiding amongst the protesters and said Black Shirts' killing of soldiers is "fact". Despite various still and moving images, there are accounts - which I do not believe - to say it was "fake reds", or "government plants to discredit the reds", or any other number of conspiracy theories.

Unfortunately I fear that an accurate independently-proven conclusion will never come - it's too late now to make meaningful use of evidence and this probably serves best both the ruling elite and the Red Shirt elite.

[philw]

The fact that soldiers were shot at and killed from the so-called 'Black Shirts' hiding among the protesters removes their legitimacy as a peaceful movement, they crossed that line, so it becomes a war, armed resistance, they no longer can expect 'justice' as a one-way process. The Army would now have the right to protest as well on this same date against terrorism or treason. It's just another excuse for this mob to gather in a show of numbers ahead of the election. The deaths are regrettable, in terms of numbers they are minor compared to, say, drunk driving on any given night due to police negligence. Soon we'll run out of anniversary days to protest on at this rate.

How about a protest on the anniversaries of; the beginning of the war on drugs, the day of the mis-verdict against Thaksin's asset concealment case, the burning of Bangkok, the raid on the ASEAN conference in Pattaya.

I'll be interested to see how this continues, for example, if PT comes to power in the next election, will the martyred dead suddenly stop, will they pressure THEIR government for a full investigation (which includes an investigation into the UDD leaderships complicity)?

Whilst I agree entirely with your viewpoint, I think it is unfair to say that the Black Shirts' hiding amongst the protesters and said Black Shirts' killing of soldiers is "fact". Despite various still and moving images, there are accounts - which I do not believe - to say it was "fake reds", or "government plants to discredit the reds", or any other number of conspiracy theories.

Unfortunately I fear that an accurate independently-proven conclusion will never come - it's too late now to make meaningful use of evidence and this probably serves best both the ruling elite and the Red Shirt elite.

I fully agree with you.

Wow !!!

ph

[elcent]

who will mark the slaughters of mostly innocent civilians during the crackdown on narcotics?

While the slaughters that happened for real the red mob was warned countless times to disperse. - Enough said.

[SanitreeNapikin]

A Japanese cameraman was also shot dead while standing on a vehicle filming the wild firefight.

It is sad that he was shot and killed, but if one puts oneself in the line of fire like that, shouldn't it be expected and accepted that one's demise may come soon? Why the fuss? If there is a wild firefight going on, I am not going to stand on a car in the middle of it in my tiara and faux fur and expect to be safe. I will be cuddling up with my favorite poodle deep inside my house! We may feel sorry about this man's death, but the only blame for his death should go to him himself and the choice he made to be where he was.

[rubl]

A Japanese cameraman was also shot dead while standing on a vehicle filming the wild firefight.

It is sad that he was shot and killed, but if one puts oneself in the line of fire like that, shouldn't it be expected and accepted that one's demise may come soon? Why the fuss? If there is a wild firefight going on, I am not going to stand on a car in the middle of it in my tiara and faux fur and expect to be safe. I will be cuddling up with my favorite poodle deep inside my house! We may feel sorry about this man's death, but the only blame for his death should go to him himself and the choice he made to be where he was.

While I'm not sure I should agree with 'he asked for it', the Jap. camera man definitively put himself in harms way on his own free will.

Interesting the 'firefight' in the OP. Suggest firing between two or more armed groups. I guess one side was the Army. The other side the unarmed, peaceful protesters? Still surprised to read how you can exchange gunfire with unarmed opponents and even get killed by them

Edited April 11, 2011 by rubl

[ToffeEFCpower]

Martyrdom is a distinqiushed reward. I wouldn't call the dead reds by this but rather lamb sacrifices to the slaughter.

[phiphidon]

A Japanese cameraman was also shot dead while standing on a vehicle filming the wild firefight.

It is sad that he was shot and killed, but if one puts oneself in the line of fire like that, shouldn't it be expected and accepted that one's demise may come soon? Why the fuss? If there is a wild firefight going on, I am not going to stand on a car in the middle of it in my tiara and faux fur and expect to be safe. I will be cuddling up with my favorite poodle deep inside my house! We may feel sorry about this man's death, but the only blame for his death should go to him himself and the choice he made to be where he was.

While I'm not sure I should agree with 'he asked for it', the Jap. camera man definitively put himself in harms way on his own free will.

Interesting the 'firefight' in the OP. Suggest firing between two or more armed groups. I guess one side was the Army. The other side the unarmed, peaceful protesters? Still surprised to read how you can exchange gunfire with unarmed opponents and even get killed by them

Oh Rubi, still suprised eh? How about this scenario: "suggest firing between two or more armed groups", you guess right about one armed group being the army (although of course they denied being armed with live rounds, well, maybe the officers were but the rank and file were just armed with shields and batons, well anyway they only fired in the air, oh and self defence, or whatever the latest version is), now how about another group being armed but not being the unarmed peaceful supporters? Now, that wasn't so hard was it? Oh and by the way, the next time you need any information about dangerous situations such as wars or other such matters, I take it you'll be quite happy to remain ignorant if such people as the Japanese (not Jap.) cameraman didn't bother put themselves in harms way, I suppose?

[mitrapaap]

How many times has Thaksin promised his reds he will soon come back - and never came. But they still are st..... enough to believe him.

[rubl]

Oh Rubi, still suprised eh? How about this scenario: "suggest firing between two or more armed groups", you guess right about one armed group being the army (although of course they denied being armed with live rounds, well, maybe the officers were but the rank and file were just armed with shields and batons, well anyway they only fired in the air, oh and self defence, or whatever the latest version is), now how about another group being armed but not being the unarmed peaceful supporters? Now, that wasn't so hard was it? Oh and by the way, the next time you need any information about dangerous situations such as wars or other such matters, I take it you'll be quite happy to remain ignorant if such people as the Japanese (not Jap.) cameraman didn't bother put themselves in harms way, I suppose?

When an armed group mingles freely amongst an unarmed group, for those opposing it's a single, armed group. This has nothing to do with the army being armed or not. Please note that after a day or so the army admitted to have issued 'live rounds' just in case. With MiB and grenades lobbed that seemed a very valid cautionary move to be expected from Army personnel. Now that wasn't hard or difficult, now was it?

As for the Jap. (with that '.' an abbreviation for Japanese) cameraman I said 'he put himself in harm's way' which doesn't give any indication whether or not he was brave, foolish, dedicated, or otherwise.

I know what I write, I know what I mean. How you interpret is up to you, but it might not reflect what I write/mean. Just like two different opinions based on the same information

(PS RUBI is my female alter-ego, I am RUBL as I've told you a few times already )

Edited April 11, 2011 by rubl

[animatic]

The red shirts made merit for their fallen comrades and Hiroyuki Muramoto, the cameraman who worked for Reuters, at a rally near Democracy Monument.

So they don't care about the soldiers that they killed?

Or that the cameraman chose to be on the army side of the fight and not theirs to take his pictures.

[jayboy]

As for the Jap. (with that '.' an abbreviation for Japanese) cameraman I said 'he put himself in harm's way' which doesn't give any indication whether or not he was brave, foolish, dedicated, or otherwise.

I know what I write, I know what I mean.

We know what you meant despite your obfuscation.

[asiawatcher]

Remember reading somewhere that Thaksin would give 200,000b to any family who had a member killed by the reds.

Could this be one of the reasons the reds have not admitted that they or the MIB associated with them killed or injured anyone?

And he has yet to have paid anyone!

[hyperdimension]

Remember reading somewhere that Thaksin would give 200,000b to any family who had a member killed by the reds.

Could this be one of the reasons the reds have not admitted that they or the MIB associated with them killed or injured anyone?

And he has yet to have paid anyone!

As is his style, I think he would have only included red shirt protesters in that 200k THB payment per death deal, not soldiers or journalists (even though he uses the death of journalists for his own advantage).

So did he pay the families of the dead protesters? He did thank the people for dying for him:

Former Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra, the major leader of the red movement, spoke via video-link to the rally stage at Democracy Monument to express his gratitude to the protesters who sacrificed their lives "fighting for democracy".

Edited April 12, 2011 by hyperdimension

[rubl]

As for the Jap. (with that '.' an abbreviation for Japanese) cameraman I said 'he put himself in harm's way' which doesn't give any indication whether or not he was brave, foolish, dedicated, or otherwise.

I know what I write, I know what I mean.

We know what you meant despite your obfuscation.

'we' know?. Please excuse me and no offence meant, but 'we know'? Could you please indicate what 'you' know, before going into what 'we' know? Also a bit puzzled about the obfuscation. Please be so kind as to elaborate. I try to be clear, but I'm aware that doesn't always work. So please help me to improve