katabeachbum Posted April 20, 2011 Share Posted April 20, 2011 looks like a bargain, priced like a secondhand D-tracker, and made in Thailand m-box, any specs,pics and info? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard-BKK Posted April 20, 2011 Share Posted April 20, 2011 (edited) The specifications (in English) of the original Sachs X-Road 250 can be found here http://www.sachsbikes.com.au/xroad.php The Tiger Motor website is currently not available, it says "Bandwidth Limit Exceeded", probably from all the visits from Chinese and German Sachs people thinking what to do with the previous Thai distributor who is now apparently trying to sell Tiger X-Road 250 The original Sachs X-Road 250 looks like: Edited April 20, 2011 by katabeachbum naming and shaming removed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
katabeachbum Posted April 20, 2011 Author Share Posted April 20, 2011 The specifications (in English) of the original Sachs X-Road 250 can be found here http://www.sachsbikes.com.au/xroad.php The Tiger Motor website is currently not available, it says "Bandwidth Limit Exceeded", probably from all the visits from Chinese and German Sachs people thinking what to do with the previous Thai distributor who is now apparently trying to sell Tiger X-Road 250 The original Sachs X-Road 250 looks like: naming and shaming is illegal in Thailand, thus against Forum rules. This post has been edited by removing accusations towards Tiger. Until these accusations are proved in court and accepted published, they are not accepted on Thai Visa as that would be naming and shaming according to Thai law Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thaicbr Posted April 20, 2011 Share Posted April 20, 2011 And Richard you know dam_n fine that Tiger's website is a mess and probably all ways will be a mess.... hence the reason why every one goes to Tigersachsclub.com for all info including a very easy online purchase system with full 3 year (30,000km) factory backup. The X-road 250 sold here in Thailand was predominantly designed here by Tiger and uses a lot of Thai parts (hence the low price) details of the Thai bike (in English) can be found here http://www.tigersachsclub.com/sproduct.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexbrouwer1 Posted April 20, 2011 Share Posted April 20, 2011 Richard, what is your problem with Tiger ? I still think that Tiger is a much better bike quality wise then most of the chinese bikes that you are constantly promoting. Everywhere i hear very positive reactions from people about the service from Tiger and the quality of their bikes. And i think it is a great deal, a bike like the X-road for this kind of money. Mbox, thanks for all your help with getting me one, i am looking forward to get my new X-road, next to my good old ZX9R. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigBikeBKK Posted April 20, 2011 Share Posted April 20, 2011 Saw this bike at the 2010 Bangkok Motorbike Shot and I thought the X-road 250 looks pretty sharp. I don't care if it's a Tiger or a Sachs, but if it's got Tiger service then that's a plus. The red trellis frame and swing arm, matte black tank, offset shock, underseat exhaust- all quite nice. Headlight is boring but easily replaced. About the only thing I really dislike- the instrument cluster is really tiny and cheap looking; I'd replace it with a Koso gauge first thing. I suspect it will have underwhelming torque and Hp figures similar to that of the Kawasaki D-Tracker, but at a much lower cost. It "looks" like a motard, but you'd never want to take this bike on any serious off road adventures with the exhaust where it is now - directly under the engine, just waiting to be smashed. I'm tempted to get one but a bit loathe to buy a bike that I've never ridden and that, as far as I can tell, has never been reviewed on the road... Not sure where I'd use a bike like this. Urban assault, stunting and small tracks perhaps? Somebody hurry up and buy one so I can take it for a spin! Ride On! Tony Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexbrouwer1 Posted April 20, 2011 Share Posted April 20, 2011 Saw this bike at the 2010 Bangkok Motorbike Shot and I thought the X-road 250 looks pretty sharp. I don't care if it's a Tiger or a Sachs, but if it's got Tiger service then that's a plus. The red trellis frame and swing arm, matte black tank, offset shock, underseat exhaust- all quite nice. Headlight is boring but easily replaced. About the only thing I really dislike- the instrument cluster is really tiny and cheap looking; I'd replace it with a Koso gauge first thing. I suspect it will have underwhelming torque and Hp figures similar to that of the Kawasaki D-Tracker, but at a much lower cost. It "looks" like a motard, but you'd never want to take this bike on any serious off road adventures with the exhaust where it is now - directly under the engine, just waiting to be smashed. I'm tempted to get one but a bit loathe to buy a bike that I've never ridden and that, as far as I can tell, has never been reviewed on the road... Not sure where I'd use a bike like this. Urban assault, stunting and small tracks perhaps? Somebody hurry up and buy one so I can take it for a spin! Ride On! Tony Tony, I just ordered one today, so when i get it, you are more then welcome to try it out. Just let me know when you are planning to go to Bira again, i will come see you there. I think it will look good next to the good old ZX9R and the R1. Cheers, Alex Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigBikeBKK Posted April 20, 2011 Share Posted April 20, 2011 Tony, I just ordered one today, so when i get it, you are more then welcome to try it out. Just let me know when you are planning to go to Bira again, i will come see you there. I think it will look good next to the good old ZX9R and the R1. Cheers, Alex Hey Alex! Congratulations! Let me know when you get the new bike and I'll come down and we can have some fun on the go-cart track at BIRA. I think the X-Road would be a lot of fun on that tight twisty little track. There's also a dirt track at BIRA but I've never actually been over to look at it. Ride On! Tony Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
naboo Posted April 20, 2011 Share Posted April 20, 2011 Richard, what is your problem with Tiger ? I think its quite obvious the guys got a serious business interest in bikes from certain Chinese manufacturers and comes on here putting down Tiger for his own personal gains. Mbox seems to be above the games and replies with all seriousness. I know who's the better man. Very tempted myself by the bike, though I can't justify a third, can I? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard-BKK Posted April 20, 2011 Share Posted April 20, 2011 With Tiger Motor being the previous distributor of Sachs motorcycles, and conveniently showing everywhere pictures that display the Sachs X-Road 250 they give the impression that the X-Road 250 is associated with one of the oldest motorcycle manufacturers, and one of the best known suspension manufacturers on the planet. The bike sold by Tiger has nothing to do with SACHS BIKES. Even Tiger Motor should not use the name X-ROAD as it's an international registered trademark. The combination of registered trademark, Sachs selling the X-Road 250 for almost a year now, while the X-Road 125 was first sold almost 6 years ago.... all based on the same design and details which will probably put Tiger in a very difficult position... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigBikeBKK Posted April 20, 2011 Share Posted April 20, 2011 With Tiger Motor being the previous distributor of Sachs motorcycles, and conveniently showing everywhere pictures that display the Sachs X-Road 250 they give the impression that the X-Road 250 is associated with one of the oldest motorcycle manufacturers, and one of the best known suspension manufacturers on the planet. The bike sold by Tiger has nothing to do with SACHS BIKES. Hmmm, first you allege that the Tiger X-Road violates a Sachs trademark, then you say that "The bike sold by Tiger has nothing to do with SACHS BIKES."... Well Richard, which is it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard-BKK Posted April 20, 2011 Share Posted April 20, 2011 (edited) With Tiger Motor being the previous distributor of Sachs motorcycles, and conveniently showing everywhere pictures that display the Sachs X-Road 250 they give the impression that the X-Road 250 is associated with one of the oldest motorcycle manufacturers, and one of the best known suspension manufacturers on the planet. The bike sold by Tiger has nothing to do with SACHS BIKES. Hmmm, first you allege that the Tiger X-Road violates a Sachs trademark, then you say that "The bike sold by Tiger has nothing to do with SACHS BIKES."... Well Richard, which is it? Very simple Tony, if an expensive looking watch looks like a model from a famous brand name, but the famous brand name didn't manufacture that watch nor did it licensed anybody to produce that watch, what would that watch be? In a similar way, SACHS BIKES has nothing to do with the X-ROAD 250 sold by TIGER MOTOR Co. LTD, while every picture here, on the Tiger Sachs Club and even on the Tigermotor.co.th website (before going off-line) showed a motorcycle which displays SACHS Bikes on the fuel tank... Edited April 20, 2011 by Richard-BKK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave_boo Posted April 20, 2011 Share Posted April 20, 2011 With Tiger Motor being the previous distributor of Sachs motorcycles, and conveniently showing everywhere pictures that display the Sachs X-Road 250 they give the impression that the X-Road 250 is associated with one of the oldest motorcycle manufacturers, and one of the best known suspension manufacturers on the planet. The bike sold by Tiger has nothing to do with SACHS BIKES. Even Tiger Motor should not use the name X-ROAD as it's an international registered trademark. The combination of registered trademark, Sachs selling the X-Road 250 for almost a year now, while the X-Road 125 was first sold almost 6 years ago.... all based on the same design and details which will probably put Tiger in a very difficult position... Let me get this straight. Sachs engineered the X-Road 250, right? They then had an agreement with Tiger to produce this Sachs designed bike, right? And Sachs has essentially folded down to a design shop in Germany, right? And the old "Sachs" company that Tiger had an agreement with is Chinese, right? And now the Chinese company no longer has an agreement with Tiger, right? And we don't know what the actual agreement was in regards to previous/current models, right? In fact, all we know is what Tiger has put out in a press release, right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
katabeachbum Posted April 21, 2011 Author Share Posted April 21, 2011 With Tiger Motor being the previous distributor of Sachs motorcycles, and conveniently showing everywhere pictures that display the Sachs X-Road 250 they give the impression that the X-Road 250 is associated with one of the oldest motorcycle manufacturers, and one of the best known suspension manufacturers on the planet. The bike sold by Tiger has nothing to do with SACHS BIKES. Hmmm, first you allege that the Tiger X-Road violates a Sachs trademark, then you say that "The bike sold by Tiger has nothing to do with SACHS BIKES."... Well Richard, which is it? Very simple Tony, if an expensive looking watch looks like a model from a famous brand name, but the famous brand name didn't manufacture that watch nor did it licensed anybody to produce that watch, what would that watch be? In a similar way, SACHS BIKES has nothing to do with the X-ROAD 250 sold by TIGER MOTOR Co. LTD, while every picture here, on the Tiger Sachs Club and even on the Tigermotor.co.th website (before going off-line) showed a motorcycle which displays SACHS Bikes on the fuel tank... If Tiger used to be a dealer for SACHS, they may still display bikes with SACHS X-ROAD 250 name on them. But I assume when buying a Tiger X-Road 250, which SACHS seem to have no patent on valid in Thailand, they are not badged SACHS when leaving Tiger factory. Whatever owners badge them later, like Lexus Corona, is owners choise. anyhow it looks like a great funbike, so let SACHS and Tiger sort their stuff in court if any party desires, and we focus on the bikes here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GarryP Posted April 21, 2011 Share Posted April 21, 2011 That trademark posted above is an International Trademark. However, Thailand is not a member to the Madrid Agreement Concerning the International Registration of Marks and, thus, that argument means squat. Now, if X-ROAD was registered in Thailand as a trademark for motorcycles, it would be a different matter. I told my wife a few days ago that I had just dreamt about riding an off road bike up a mountain. I didn't know this model had been released at that time. Do you think my dreams are trying to tell me something. A Kawaker had never been in the running because I could not justify the expense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taichiplanet Posted April 21, 2011 Share Posted April 21, 2011 (edited) The Tiger eX-Sachs eX-Road 250. Yeah, doesn't matter what it is called. It looks like a nice alternative to other choices out there, and as Tony said backed by Tiger's great service team and a 3 year warranty. You probably won't get that in Thailand from a Sachs named bike that is no longer backed by the Tiger factory. What about the Tiger X-Moto 250 as a name? Alex and Tony, let me know when you go and play at Bira; i'd like to come and watch the fun! Edited April 21, 2011 by taichiplanet Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexbrouwer1 Posted April 21, 2011 Share Posted April 21, 2011 The Tiger eX-Sachs eX-Road 250. Yeah, doesn't matter what it is called. It looks like a nice alternative to other choices out there, and as Tony said backed by Tiger's great service team and a 3 year warranty. You probably won't get that in Thailand from a Sachs named bike that is no longer backed by the Tiger factory. What about the Tiger X-Moto 250 as a name? Alex and Tony, let me know when you go and play at Bira; i'd like to come and watch the fun! Taichiplanet, when i get the bike, i will let you and Tony know and will probably try to put some pictures here. As Tony said, it could be a real fun bike for going around the little cart racing track. Same as you said, i don't really mind how the bike is called, i like the bike (only seen it on the pictures) and i want to give it a try. At least it is something else then all the D-trackers. And i think it is a great deal, a bike like this for this price. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HangDongRider Posted April 21, 2011 Share Posted April 21, 2011 I´ve tested the X-Road at the TIGER factoryvisit 2010. Not a good bike indeed. The engine is rough and weak, the big tank makes it uncomfortable and the suspensions were horrible. Only the brakes were marvelous. I never would buy one. The TIGER Boxer 250 is a much better deal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taichiplanet Posted April 21, 2011 Share Posted April 21, 2011 I´ve tested the X-Road at the TIGER factoryvisit 2010. Not a good bike indeed. The engine is rough and weak, the big tank makes it uncomfortable and the suspensions were horrible. Only the brakes were marvelous. I never would buy one. The TIGER Boxer 250 is a much better deal. maybe mbox can confirm but the production X-Road is using a different engine to the one at the factory last year. Not sure about the suspension, but they have changed suspension bits on the Boxer 250 in the last year, so maybe also made changes for the X-Road too. I suppose we will have to wait for Alex to get his and get some feed back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HangDongRider Posted April 21, 2011 Share Posted April 21, 2011 I´ve tested the X-Road at the TIGER factoryvisit 2010. Not a good bike indeed. The engine is rough and weak, the big tank makes it uncomfortable and the suspensions were horrible. Only the brakes were marvelous. I never would buy one. The TIGER Boxer 250 is a much better deal. maybe mbox can confirm but the production X-Road is using a different engine to the one at the factory last year. Not sure about the suspension, but they have changed suspension bits on the Boxer 250 in the last year, so maybe also made changes for the X-Road too. I suppose we will have to wait for Alex to get his and get some feed back. Maybe. With the Boxer engine and a much smaller tank, it could be OK. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigBikeBKK Posted April 21, 2011 Share Posted April 21, 2011 I´ve tested the X-Road at the TIGER factoryvisit 2010. Not a good bike indeed. The engine is rough and weak, the big tank makes it uncomfortable and the suspensions were horrible. Only the brakes were marvelous. I never would buy one. The TIGER Boxer 250 is a much better deal. Big tank? It only carries 11 liters and certainly doesn't look big... Sounds like it will have a different engine from what you test rode, so we'll have to wait and see how that performs. As for the suspension- can you be more specific about what you didn't like? Front forks look basic and bet they could be easily modified or swapped for something better. Don't know if the rear monoshock is adjustable, but again, I'm sure it would be easy to upgrade. I'm really tempted to buy one but want a test ride first. Happy Trails! Tony Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeCharivari Posted April 21, 2011 Share Posted April 21, 2011 Richard, what is your problem with Tiger ? I still think that Tiger is a much better bike quality wise then most of the chinese bikes that you are constantly promoting. Everywhere i hear very positive reactions from people about the service from Tiger and the quality of their bikes. And i think it is a great deal, a bike like the X-road for this kind of money. Mbox, thanks for all your help with getting me one, i am looking forward to get my new X-road, next to my good old ZX9R. Ditto. I had a go at both about their versions of the Honda Cub in another thread recently, mainly over their "service centers" which both need to work on to justify that description. Having said that I wouldn't hesitate to buy another Tiger as despite their faults they are excellent value for money, the factory provides a service which is second to none (including the big 4) and their bikes are beginning to have the identity and style which is lacking among the Japanese clones. On the other hand I wouldn't touch any bike recommended by Richard-BKK; if the best he can do to promote his own bikes is to knock someone else's, then that says a lot about his bikes, not theirs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdinasia Posted April 21, 2011 Share Posted April 21, 2011 I've had a Tiger for 8+ years now. I loved it for the first 4+ years even though I replaced a flawed part at my own expense twice. Since they never fixed the design flaw on the old Joker (the ring that surrounds the speedometer/odometer rusts out in a very short time!) I am less enthused at this point. I thought about getting a new Tiger, but I am less than pleased with how they dealt with some issues on the bike I own. I am looking for something new and bigger than a 125 this year, but honestly am not sure that I would ever buy a Tiger again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMX Posted April 21, 2011 Share Posted April 21, 2011 i cannot agree with some of the judgmental calls above. This model, for example, may or may not bring to market a Tiger where QC issues, as the bike comes from the factory, are resolved. I would love to find that the bike is without problems as it arrives. Test ride reports, of course, are the bare minimum one would need before purchasing, and I'm glad that Alex is making the leap of faith and that Tony may well report on it, but then, I've been thinking that someone with a lot of experience with bikes was suited best for Tigers. Why front forks on the X-Road are not UD, while Boxers are, is a puzzle to me, except the decision to keep the price under 99K. It is obvious that the Boxer 250 RS, with Fi, is a better road design, and 27K cheaper too! Speaking of web sites, Tiger's does not report Fi on their bigger Boxer on their site (English language) yet, so I wonder about price. But the Boxer 250 RS as presently shown remains at 72K. The X-Road 250 does not appear at all so far! But about this people dissension: Certainly all participants in business try to present themselves honestly (to stay in business, for one reason) and call it as they see it. But we're all human. For my money, RichardBBK's information is accurate and also broad based - as he sees it. Mbox has always been frank online and in purchase and support-related exchanges with me, but like me he's a Tiger fan. Can't see the purpose in talking about people, it's the facts about bikes that we require. Accusing one person based on one statement is false logic - poisoning the well, it's called, or flaming or dissing etc. Richard's information about Lifan, for example, or Korean and Taiwanese bikes, cannot be lumped, in logic, as being supportive of "Chinese" bikes with poor reputations. His knowledge base is simply broader and unknown to some. As always, facts about the bikes, it seems to me, should be the meat of our thread; fatty parts about persons and personalities just get in the way. Thus endeth the sermon, sorry, but.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard-BKK Posted April 22, 2011 Share Posted April 22, 2011 (edited) Dear LeCharivari, and others... I never complained about the quality of any Tiger product? Actually if you search the Internet you probably find my receives of Tiger products in the top 3 listings... (and they mostly positive). I still consider myself a fan of Tiger products, and actual love the idea that they introduced a Motard style motorcycle. The only problem I have is that they have used a design from another Sachs Bikes, About me supporting Chinese manufacturers, I can say this – Chinese manufacturers seem now-a-day to be entering the Thai market, and offering new motorcycle models – if you look back, Tiger got the same amount of attention for motorcycles they brought on the market. The only limitations are by lack of information, therefore manufacturers like JRD and Platinum (which are actually a Malaysian and Thai brand name which are assembled from a good amount of Chines parts) have not got a good share of attention, every-time we contacted them they had the model not available or they would call back... It's safe to say that Platinum will not call back after 435 days. Probably at the end of 2011, or beginning of 2012, I would write and comment about Indian motorcycles as it's expected that some of the larger Indian motorcycle manufacturers will start moving to the Southeast Asian motorcycle market. Baja with a 200 or 250cc single-cylinder which probably will be market as a KTM or Kawasaki, and Hero Group (previous known as Hero-Honda), one of the worlds biggest motorcycle manufacturer, who has seriously invested in the 250cc an bigger motorcycle market. Hero Group also bought themselves out of the Honda group for US$ 1 billion. (and this two Indian companies are the ones already setup office in Thailand). It's true we did some work for Lifan (China not Thailand) and we have a few motorcycles in our warehouse that someday will hopeful make it on the Thai market. If somebody would take the time to look at my postings over the few years they will surely not say that I in favor of Chinese motorcycles – but like all new manufacturers on the market I believe everybody disservice a far chance. Edited April 22, 2011 by katabeachbum comments on relations between sachs, sym and tiger removed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
katabeachbum Posted April 22, 2011 Author Share Posted April 22, 2011 Speculations and comments on the relations between Sachs, SYM and Tiger have been removed, as I assume none of us know the actual facts, and if any of these companies want to do a court case in Thailand, we will be presented with facts in due time. back to the bike, dying for a test ride. wont buy before I v tried it any specs, is power on par with D-tracker 250? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taichiplanet Posted April 22, 2011 Share Posted April 22, 2011 (edited) mbox stated on his website that power was approximately 20HP, until we see an actual dyno chart read that anyway you want! Pulled these specs off the info page http://www.tigersachsclub.com/sproduct.html Model: X-Road 250 Displacement:235 cc Fuel Capacity: 11 ltr Transmission: 5 speed Front Tire: 110/70-17M/C54H TL Rear Tire: 150/60-17M/C69H TL Front Brake: Disc Brake (320mm) Rear Brake : Disc Brake (215mm) Front Suspension: Telescopic Rear Suspension: Mono Shock Wheelbase: 1410mm Seat height: 870mm Wet weight: 121,5kg So that puts it 40kgs lighter than the CBR250. Edited April 22, 2011 by taichiplanet Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RED21 Posted April 22, 2011 Share Posted April 22, 2011 Nice... nice... Been waiting for ages for the bike to be released. Will wait for the reviews, and then decide. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexbrouwer1 Posted April 22, 2011 Share Posted April 22, 2011 Speculations and comments on the relations between Sachs, SYM and Tiger have been removed, as I assume none of us know the actual facts, and if any of these companies want to do a court case in Thailand, we will be presented with facts in due time. back to the bike, dying for a test ride. wont buy before I v tried it any specs, is power on par with D-tracker 250? Agree with you, i am not interested at all in the (business) relationships between the 3 involved parties at this moment and all the specualtions about it. Up to them how they want to solve the issues between them and sort out their businesses, that is none of my business, i made a deal with Tiger about the X-road. Only interested in the bike, and hope to get it soon. Power should be around 20 hp (information given to me by Mbox), it is a 235 cc engine. It's a different engine then the testbike which was available last year with the factory visit and ridden by some people. For me it will be a bike for going around town and some short trips, for longer trips i have the ZX9R. Just read that Tiger is doing business with Yoshimura, maybe they come with some performance parts for the X-road ? :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard-BKK Posted April 22, 2011 Share Posted April 22, 2011 The price of the new Tiger motard put it nicely in the market, at the lower side we have the Sym Mbike Super Motard 200 for 72,000 THB, Tiger Motard 250 for 99,000 THB and the Kawasaki D-Tracker 250 for 147,000 THB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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