Warning About Hualumphong Toilet

[ukrules]

I have also myself quite a lot of experience in delivering these to animals, and the point is that to tranquilize an animal you have to get a lot in. The amount is dependent on body weight, and is usually calculated by body weight of animal. So if a 1kg rabbit needs 50 milligrams, ( a realistic enough dose for most animal anaesthetics) a 70 kg human would need 3.5grams for a complete knockout.

Good point about the required dosage. I wonder what dosage of Midazolam would be required for 'compliance'.

[SteeleJoe]

There is such a drug robbery and it is very common in shopping centers. Normally it is enough to allow confusion; verbally attack and grab/scratch arm and later they are able to befriend the victim into thinking they are helping. Normally it is two women who take the subject into toilet - not sure if further drug involved then - in our family case some years ago they claimed person had there gold and used intimidation - taking gold and cash (which was not much but she dressed well so likely picked for that reason) but leaving enough for taxi they talked victim into believing it was a mistake they had returned everything and they must sit and wait for them to return - after a few minutes victim recovered enough to know they had been had but very disoriented. Police report was filed and they said there had been a number of such incidents. Have seen occasional reports of teams being arrested over the years. So yes I believe it could be true.

Believe it or not but it has been proven true in Thailand. It does happen. Good luck to those who think it is a lie .

Proven true? How? When? ("In Thailand" -- but not elsewhere?)

Source please.

Edited May 22, 2011 by SteeleJoe

[vont]

My wife's sister claimed almost exactly the same last year, she had gold stolen only, but she didn't lose her purse either, apparently they were left in her room. She was in Pratunam shopping at the time and claimed a gang robbed her, but it didn't make sense why she wouldn't of had her purse with her, and she calmly ate pork bbq with us later.

I really didn't understand what happened, I knew something had happened because she was now less about 2 baht of gold, but her story didn't make sense.

Did she owe someone money from the past, and saw them, and they had to settle up on the quiet? (Maybe)

Did she get robbed under different circumstances but too shy to tell the truth? (Maybe)

Did she sell the gold? (Maybe)

Something else? (Maybe)

You will never know, and it probably won't happen again. Just be glad she is safe.

Wait, wait, wait

are you guys referring to Thai wives or spouses from homeland....?

It makes lots of sense, if you guys could be more specific in your story. Sorry, regardless.

[Nisa]

Why no mention of the police or police report?

I'm sure drugs have different properties but when a doctor needs to get a shot to work on your body fast (such as pain management) they put it directly into your body via a vein (intravenous) and not into the muscle (Intramuscular) because a shot in the muscle takes much longer to be absorbed and reach the blood stream and brain. Another fast way to the brain and blood is through inhalation.

If there was such a drug that could be absorbed through the skin quickly and then also be absorbed through the fatty tissue, any muscle and the vein wall then it would be HIGHLY dangerous and impractical to use as a weapon. Our skin is basically water proof and it would be safe to assume any drug that can penetrate into the blood stream so quickly from outside the body would also penetrate clothing and in order to be safe the attacker would need to be in a rubber suit.

This story sounds along the lines of an Urban Legend in my opinion.

[Nisa]

I'm curious to find out what kind of drug this is and how criminals can obtain it.

Wish I could help you but I've never heard of a drug that can be very quickly absorbed through the skin and be fast acting but short lived and one presumed to leave the victim feeling 100% fine and unconcerned after to the point of not wanting to go to the hospital and be checked ... as well as I'me guessing her ability to articulate to you why there should be no concern to her health to have you not demand she be checked by a doctor to determine what she was given and if there could be any long term effects.

Edited May 22, 2011 by Nisa

[SteeleJoe]

I'm curious to find out what kind of drug this is and how criminals can obtain it.

Wish I could help you but I've never heard of a drug that can be very quickly absorbed through the skin and be fast acting but short lived and one presumed to leave the victim feeling 100% fine and unconcerned after to the point of not wanting to go to the hospital and be checked ... as well as I'me guessing her ability to articulate to you why there should be no concern to her health to have you not demand she be checked by a doctor to determine what she was given and if there could be any long term effects.

Nicely done.

[ohiodad]

If you carefully read the article cited by another poster you will realize that it is probably not just DMSO, but DMSO (a solvent) mixed with another drug to form a "drug delivery system" :

I do wonder about this, if something like this DMSO stuff (which I've never heard of before) was mixed with some form of dissolved phenobarbital or other barbiturate and provided an adequate delivery system then perhaps it would produce similar effects. If hippies used to mix it with LSD then I'm sure it could be used with a variety of other substances.

Dimethyl sulfoxide is ONLY, as someone has already pointed out, a solvent. It is as correctly stated here, very often used as a delivery vehicle for drugs. On its own it is almost completely harmless, and especially at the sort of amounts that could be brushed onto somebody's skin in a semi-surreptitious attempt to "drug them". I know this because I have worked in the pharmaceutical industry for more than 10 years. I myself have dissolved many compounds in dimethyl sulfoxide with my own hands, and on more than one occasion spilled a load of it in very large quantities all over my fingers, with no ill effects whatsoever.

So the dimethyl sulfoxide alone story is palpable nonsense.

I would put almost no credence in the tranquiliser/animal sedative delivery story either. I have also myself quite a lot of experience in delivering these to animals, and the point is that to tranquilize an animal you have to get a lot in. The amount is dependent on body weight, and is usually calculated by body weight of animal. So if a 1kg rabbit needs 50 milligrams, ( a realistic enough dose for most animal anaesthetics) a 70 kg human would need 3.5grams for a complete knockout. Say half that is needed to feel woozy. That means you would need to dissolve nearly 2g of the sedative in a volume of dimethyl sulfoxide small enough to brush on someone's skin without the whole lot just rolling off, not much more than a few drops (say max 1/4 of a ml) or 8g of the drug per ml of DMSO. Nothing's that soluble, not even in DMSO.

So I have absolutely no belief in this either.

The idea that even if this impossibility could be achieved that it would be absorbed and render a person woozy in a few seconds is also absolutely beyond belief (even LSD itself wouldn't do this -I'm sure the cops 1960's LSD tale is an urban myth, but the point about LSD is that the doses needed are absolutely tiny, really minute, unlike sedatives, so this would have slightly more credibility)

So I personally am completely sceptical of this entire tale, without name of drug and some verifiable link to show that this has ever worked in the manner stated.

The idea that this is a deception to try and cover up what really happened and why makes much more sense to me, and I'd bet on it.

Partington is exactly correct. DMSO is a powerful solvent. It is dangerous only in that it can dissolve minute quantities of harmful materials. Then, if it is applied to skin, the harmful materials can be absorbed into the bloodstream.

For budding spy novelists, here is a useful link: http://www.chm.bris.ac.uk/motm/etorphine/etorphineh.htm

[Longbow212]

DMSO is a carrier for drugs to be transferred across the skin. Very useful and often used for designer steroids and other compounds that would have no efficacy if delivered orally.

I was sceptical too when I first heard this story a year or two ago. I have a medical science background and investigated. I can't recall the name of the compound now nor do I have the time to dig around on google. As for your skin being water proof, that is true particularly for polar molecules. However, fat soluble molecules can pass through. This is evidenced by feeling the effects of a shot of whiskey seconds after drinking it (alcohol passed through the membranes of your mouth). Another example is LSD papers must be handled with gloves - this is another potent drug that can pass through the skin and tiny amounts are needed. I used to work for Astrazeneca R&D and some of the drugs we handled were know to get through the skin in minute quanities. One example being dutasteride (prostate cancer/5α-reductase inhibitor) and women simply could not work with this compound as trace amounts would interfere with the development of a male foetus.

If I remember correctly the dose of the drug needed was less than a mg. Quite scary, five years at university studying theses things and I don't think I had ever come across a compound as powerful as this drug.

I believe a healthy scepticism is necessary for such stories as a large number are BS.

OP - glad your wife is OK, do not waste your time considering antagonistic comments. Thanks for the heads up to the expat community.

[Nisa]

DMSO is a carrier for drugs to be transferred across the skin. Very useful and often used for designer steroids and other compounds that would have no efficacy if delivered orally.

I was sceptical too when I first heard this story a year or two ago. I have a medical science background and investigated. I can't recall the name of the compound now nor do I have the time to dig around on google. As for your skin being water proof, that is true particularly for polar molecules. However, fat soluble molecules can pass through. This is evidenced by feeling the effects of a shot of whiskey seconds after drinking it (alcohol passed through the membranes of your mouth). Another example is LSD papers must be handled with gloves - this is another potent drug that can pass through the skin and tiny amounts are needed. I used to work for Astrazeneca R&D and some of the drugs we handled were know to get through the skin in minute quanities. One example being dutasteride (prostate cancer/5α-reductase inhibitor) and women simply could not work with this compound as trace amounts would interfere with the development of a male foetus.

If I remember correctly the dose of the drug needed was less than a mg. Quite scary, five years at university studying theses things and I don't think I had ever come across a compound as powerful as this drug.

I believe a healthy scepticism is necessary for such stories as a large number are BS.

OP - glad your wife is OK, do not waste your time considering antagonistic comments. Thanks for the heads up to the expat community.

Yes drugs pass through the skin but generally speaking it is not an efficient way of administering a drug. As you mention the person administering needs to wear gloves as well as take very good care not to get the drug on themselves or their clothing especially in a case were it is claimed only a small amount would be needed to render a person unconscious. And consider too what you fail to mention in terms of drugs such as LSD is that it takes 45-minutes to have any effect on you even when applied under the tongue where a drug can enter the body much much quicker than on the skin.

Consider that the OP is stating that a drug was put on his wife's skin that acted so fast it rendered her unaware of her surroundings within moments of coming into contact. I have to assume it worked within seconds because there is no mention of the wife putting up any kind of protest as these women supposedly applied something to her arm. I mean who allows other people to touch them in the bathroom???? Even an injection directly into your vein takes 30 seconds to a minute to take effect.

If DMSO was truly able to allow drugs to immediately enter ones systems, such as an intravenous injection, then I think it would be the number one choice for giving drugs both by doctors and addicts as it would avoid infections (HIV Transmission), blood exposure and contaminated wastes (syringes & cotton) just to name a few things.

As for the thought that these two women operate out of a particular bathroom with impunity is rather bizarre unless as it would mean nobody calls the police or seeks medical treatment after being knocked out or robbed when this is the type of incident that Thai's (and others) love to read about and makes front page news. Certainly there has to be some description of the assaulter as they would have to have spoke and approached the women in a conversational manner to touch her arm. If they acted fast and with force then there really is no need for a complicated compound such as this, not common in the medical community, because they simply could have used chloroform or some other much more available drug.

As for spreading it on her arm and identifying themselves as the attacked ... why not put it on the toilet seat or door handle?

It certainly is possible the OP left out a lot of the story but from what he has posted it just seems highly implausible as well as a highly elaborate robbery to not get too much. I mean why not rob an armored courier at a pick up location this way and not some random Thai women using a public restroom?. It is not even like they targeted this women specifically as they would have followed her in the bathroom and seen she had given her her wallet to the son.

Also I find it contradictory as well as implausible that bystanders found her because they were concerned about the stall door being locked. Exactly who becomes concerned about a stall door being locked in the bathroom? But even odder is the OP goes on to state that it was the Bathroom Attendant that acted after the son became concerned about the wife taking so long.

Given the facts provided so far it would seem this story has very little credibility of being true. But could it be possible the wife had some kind of seizure or medical emergency in the bathroom and low lives took advantage of her? Certainly the whole touching of the arm could be a red herring and have nothing to do with why she passed out but since there is no mention of going to the doctor ... if this is the case then lets hope the wife doesn't have some kind of medical condition that may have greater consequences in the future. All I know for sure is that if my wife was passed out in the bathroom for unknown reasons or unknown substances then we'd certainly be visiting the hospital.

Edited May 22, 2011 by Nisa

[futureexpat10]

Partington is exactly correct. DMSO is a powerful solvent. It is dangerous only in that it can dissolve minute quantities of harmful materials. Then, if it is applied to skin, the harmful materials can be absorbed into the bloodstream.

For budding spy novelists, here is a useful link: http://www.chm.bris..../etorphineh.htm

I read the link and I, for one, happen to believe the story is true.

1. IF etorphine is 1,000 times more powerful than morphine, enough said.

2. When I took Kung <deleted>, etc. classes, I would often come home with minor injuries. I used DMSO, the pure form by itself, on the minor injuries. Three things I noticed:

a. I could taste the DMSO in my mouth within seconds, thus showing that it goes through the body QUICKLY.

b. If I missed a part of the minor injury, the part that did not receive the DMSO bruised, the part swabbed with the DMSO did not.

c. It's easy enough to apply the DMSO to specific areas without getting it on skin where you don't want it.

3. I saw a program on TV (Travel Channel? National Geographic?) where an elephant was shot with a tranquilizer. It fell down, tried to get up, and fell down

repeatedly until dead. The shooter killed the elephant for its tusks. Why the camera crew did not interviene, I don't know. Was etorphine the drug?

Most likely, yes. If so, a person with a human dose would be "woozy" very quickly.

Assuming the story is true, the tourist police better get on the job. Otherwise the "Land of Smiles" will be known as the "Land of Scams" and the LoC, "Land of Crimes" and many of them way too dangerous for tourists to want to visit the country. The warm, fuzzy saying "Thailand is the safest country in the world" will no longer apply.

[SteeleJoe]

Partington is exactly correct. DMSO is a powerful solvent. It is dangerous only in that it can dissolve minute quantities of harmful materials. Then, if it is applied to skin, the harmful materials can be absorbed into the bloodstream.

For budding spy novelists, here is a useful link: http://www.chm.bris..../etorphineh.htm

I read the link and I, for one, happen to believe the story is true.

1. IF etorphine is 1,000 times more powerful than morphine, enough said.

2. When I took Kung <deleted>, etc. classes, I would often come home with minor injuries. I used DMSO, the pure form by itself, on the minor injuries. Three things I noticed:

a. I could taste the DMSO in my mouth within seconds, thus showing that it goes through the body QUICKLY.

b. If I missed a part of the minor injury, the part that did not receive the DMSO bruised, the part swabbed with the DMSO did not.

c. It's easy enough to apply the DMSO to specific areas without getting it on skin where you don't want it.

3. I saw a program on TV (Travel Channel? National Geographic?) where an elephant was shot with a tranquilizer. It fell down, tried to get up, and fell down

repeatedly until dead. The shooter killed the elephant for its tusks. Why the camera crew did not interviene, I don't know. Was etorphine the drug?

Most likely, yes. If so, a person with a human dose would be "woozy" very quickly.

Assuming the story is true, the tourist police better get on the job. Otherwise the "Land of Smiles" will be known as the "Land of Scams" and the LoC, "Land of Crimes" and many of them way too dangerous for tourists to want to visit the country. The warm, fuzzy saying "Thailand is the safest country in the world" will no longer apply.

Great source. Odd that that link has convinced you --despite any other poits made on the thread --thatthe story is true. But anyway:

The warm, fuzzy saying "Thailand is the safest country in the world" will no longer apply.

I've not heard this "saying" but I can tell you that it never did apply and it's ridiculous.

[janverbeem]

I know of this scam/robbery. The drug used is only licensed to zoos for sedating elephants. Tiny amounts on the skin of humans rapidly leads unconsciousness or even death if the dose is too big. I am talking about tiny tiny amounts that are needed, I am not aware of any other drug that has such powerful effects for such a small dose. This scam has occurred many times in Thailand in busy places.

Well, finally someone who believes the story, rather than the idiots who hang out on Thai Visa always looking to suggest the poster is lying (but I expected this).

BTW, my wife had previously told me this type of thing had happened before to a friend of hers in MBK shopping mall - woke up in a quiet corner with all her gold missing. I also was initially suspicious, thinking it had to be some kind of injected or inhaled drug, but I later talked with her friend and she confirmed the story.

I'm curious to find out what kind of drug this is and how criminals can obtain it.

Yes man,ununderstandable that people don't believe such an unbelievable story just because they never heard about,or maybe realise in which country they are?

Oh,you say your wifes best friend had the same thing happening to her?That's quite a coincidence isn't it?

[futureexpat10]

Partington is exactly correct. DMSO is a powerful solvent. It is dangerous only in that it can dissolve minute quantities of harmful materials. Then, if it is applied to skin, the harmful materials can be absorbed into the bloodstream.

For budding spy novelists, here is a useful link: http://www.chm.bris..../etorphineh.htm

I read the link and I, for one, happen to believe the story is true.

1. IF etorphine is 1,000 times more powerful than morphine, enough said.

2. When I took Kung <deleted>, etc. classes, I would often come home with minor injuries. I used DMSO, the pure form by itself, on the minor injuries. Three things I noticed:

a. I could taste the DMSO in my mouth within seconds, thus showing that it goes through the body QUICKLY.

b. If I missed a part of the minor injury, the part that did not receive the DMSO bruised, the part swabbed with the DMSO did not.

c. It's easy enough to apply the DMSO to specific areas without getting it on skin where you don't want it.

3. I saw a program on TV (Travel Channel? National Geographic?) where an elephant was shot with a tranquilizer. It fell down, tried to get up, and fell down

repeatedly until dead. The shooter killed the elephant for its tusks. Why the camera crew did not interviene, I don't know. Was etorphine the drug?

Most likely, yes. If so, a person with a human dose would be "woozy" very quickly.

Assuming the story is true, the tourist police better get on the job. Otherwise the "Land of Smiles" will be known as the "Land of Scams" and the LoC, "Land of Crimes" and many of them way too dangerous for tourists to want to visit the country. The warm, fuzzy saying "Thailand is the safest country in the world" will no longer apply.

Great source. Odd that that link has convinced you --despite any other poits made on the thread --thatthe story is true. But anyway:

The warm, fuzzy saying "Thailand is the safest country in the world" will no longer apply.

I've not heard this "saying" but I can tell you that it never did apply and it's ridiculous.

[lomatopo]

A WARNING !

Last week my wife was drugged and robbed in the ladies toilet at Hualumphong train station.

In the toilet she was approached by two women who applied some kind of fast-acting drug to her arm which made her very woozy.

She came to sometime later in the toilet stall when some concerned bystanders noticed the door was not locked and shook her awake.

Her watch, wedding ring, and gold necklace were missing.They didn't get her phone or wallet because she left those with my son who was waiting outside with the toilet attendent.

The toilet attendent was asked why she hadn't done anything for a long time until my son started asking why mommy wasn't coming out. Her excuse was that she thought my wife might have been sick or constipated. As for the two women who were hanging around the washroom, she knew nothing about that. But isn't it her job to look after the washroom, not just collect the money (perhaps she was in on it ?).

What did the police say when your wife filed the report? That would seem to be vital information? Did they say that this was one of a string of similar attacks/robberies in the Women's Toilet at Hua Lumphong? Have you been able to make any insurance claims on the stolen items?

If a police report was not filed then this would obviously cast doubt on the story. And, if true, not filing a police report means that others, who don't happen to read ThaiVisa and see your warning, might be subject to attack.

[DP25]

Guess you're gonna have to buy her a new watch, gold necklace, and ring now

On a side note, if you ever find out what this Thai gang is using to instantly incapacitate people and leaves them completely undamaged a few minutes later many militaries might be interested in it. A few years ago the Russians accidentally killed 130 hostages when they tried to knock out the terrorists who took them hostage with gas.

[tingtongtourist]

"Lady gets robbed of gold ant toilet after applying of mystery drug"

OR

"Lady would pawn gold and valuables, (not to be known by husband) to pay ......." (defaulting loan or gambling debt of family member ect)

Come on you guys, surely you have been to Thailand enough to see what goes on?

This is face saving, pure and straight. This heard this SO many times not even worth saying a thesedays. You (husband) are supposed to go along with this story, shut up, to add sympathy and replace whats been "lost"

This woman will concoct a fabulous story about how she gets lost,stolen,or misplaced this gold but alwasy her purse,bag and everthing else OK....and do you ever ask yourself why she never want to go to police and/or never want to talk about it...until she is forced and you will drag her along?

Usually this will happen shortly after wife and husband have had arguments over money NOT being freely sent/provided for all the relatives in need.

[Nisa]

Partington is exactly correct. DMSO is a powerful solvent. It is dangerous only in that it can dissolve minute quantities of harmful materials. Then, if it is applied to skin, the harmful materials can be absorbed into the bloodstream.

For budding spy novelists, here is a useful link: http://www.chm.bris..../etorphineh.htm

I read the link and I, for one, happen to believe the story is true.

1. IF etorphine is 1,000 times more powerful than morphine, enough said.

2. When I took Kung <deleted>, etc. classes, I would often come home with minor injuries. I used DMSO, the pure form by itself, on the minor injuries. Three things I noticed:

a. I could taste the DMSO in my mouth within seconds, thus showing that it goes through the body QUICKLY.

b. If I missed a part of the minor injury, the part that did not receive the DMSO bruised, the part swabbed with the DMSO did not.

c. It's easy enough to apply the DMSO to specific areas without getting it on skin where you don't want it.

3. I saw a program on TV (Travel Channel? National Geographic?) where an elephant was shot with a tranquilizer. It fell down, tried to get up, and fell down

repeatedly until dead. The shooter killed the elephant for its tusks. Why the camera crew did not interviene, I don't know. Was etorphine the drug?

Most likely, yes. If so, a person with a human dose would be "woozy" very quickly.

Assuming the story is true, the tourist police better get on the job. Otherwise the "Land of Smiles" will be known as the "Land of Scams" and the LoC, "Land of Crimes" and many of them way too dangerous for tourists to want to visit the country. The warm, fuzzy saying "Thailand is the safest country in the world" will no longer apply.

Where in any of these links does it show any drug that enables a drug applied to the skin to enter the blood and or get to the brain in seconds?

[powderpuff]

Don't just blame the toilet's attendant, her duty is to collect an entry-fee if it is a requirement..and to clean the toilets but not to look after those who patronise it..." perhaps she was in on it ".what a sweeping statment...

Disagree 100%. Sounds as if she's in on the scam.

[Doc50]

I believe this scam comes is passed around under the heading

What to tell your husband after you pawned the jewelry.

[sahprite]

The version I heard involved a group of about 5 young girls (about 13/14) who were friends of my daughter. They were in Paragon shopping centre and were found sitting on the floor outside a couple of exits. They were said to be in a daze and didn't know where they were or how they got there. Their phones and money had been taken. They remember talking to some strangers and that was the last thing they remember. Parents came (one was a police general) and they asked to see if anything was caught on the security cameras. Believe it or not none of them were turned on. They were all offered a small 'gratuity' to keep the incident quiet.

I was very suspicious when I heard all this from my daughter but I had it confirmed by one of the parents. There was no confirmation of how this happened to the kids and there was no mention of touching but it sounds very similar to all the previous stories. None of these kids needed the money and all their phones were new models but I did find the whole thing rather bizarre, to say the least. I'm certainly not saying this confirms anything, just passing on what I heard.

Anyway, it did amaze me that the security camera system wasn't even switched on!!

[vont]

Don't just blame the toilet's attendant, her duty is to collect an entry-fee if it is a requirement..and to clean the toilets but not to look after those who patronise it..." perhaps she was in on it ".what a sweeping statment...

Disagree 100%. Sounds as if she's in on the scam.

The following account is not a scam for sure. And I surely cannot vouch for those stories being related herein and herewith though.

While my mother in law was alive some two decades ago, she went out to the largest shopping mall in Taipei for her routine morning window shopping and Timm Summ, yum yum.

No, Taipei is not in China, no sir.

Taipei is in Taiwan, across the straight from China eastern shore. And most Chinese in Taiwan are pro western. Yes, and they love to carry u.s. dollars around to line their purses. Ladies who came in and went out with our mother in law usually would not venture out of their home with less than 10k u.s. dollars in their purses each day.

They all laughed heartily as they found out that I only carried one one hundred dollars bill in my wallet.

Coming back to the biz at hand, my mother in law, a police officer herself, gave evidence that.... as she was surrounded by three well dressed Chinese ladies, one lady walked slowly ahead of my mother in law, smiling at her and waving a handkerchief at her asking how she was doing and where she was going.

Seconds just as she was finishing her sentence that she was doing fine.... then she gave evidence that she was having difficulty breathing....

She said that a few second after that she lost her consciousness and blacked out completely....

She woke up in a coffee shop. The manager told her that her three friends brought her in and said that she was having a fainting spell and would come through in a few minutes.

She was relieved of her jade, gold, u.s. dollars, Rolex and some 10k Juan. She has been independently wealthy since her parents and grand parents generations. We inherited some gold bars from her estate, so we knew there was no need for her to lie about this sort of thing.

Did this sort of thing really really happen? Positively.

My mother in law could only remember details up to the moment of her being approached by the three well dressed ladies and

the hankie being waved as if to greet her....

Edited May 23, 2011 by vont

[ESB7]

Being robbed this way isnt pleasent but better than being beaten or stabbed and your wife wasnt phsyically harmed. Maybe a biologist or even some of those ex SAS/CIA/MI5 guys that reside in Thailand could explain the nature of this drug.

[tingtongtourist]

Don't just blame the toilet's attendant, her duty is to collect an entry-fee if it is a requirement..and to clean the toilets but not to look after those who patronise it..." perhaps she was in on it ".what a sweeping statment...

Disagree 100%. Sounds as if she's in on the scam.

YES, maybe she did tell the wife the idea of how to "loose" all the gold.

When the wife gets all the gold replaced by the husband she will go back and give the toilet attendant 500baht to use the toilet

[janverbeem]

The version I heard involved a group of about 5 young girls (about 13/14) who were friends of my daughter. They were in Paragon shopping centre and were found sitting on the floor outside a couple of exits. They were said to be in a daze and didn't know where they were or how they got there. Their phones and money had been taken. They remember talking to some strangers and that was the last thing they remember. Parents came (one was a police general) and they asked to see if anything was caught on the security cameras. Believe it or not none of them were turned on. They were all offered a small 'gratuity' to keep the incident quiet.

I was very suspicious when I heard all this from my daughter but I had it confirmed by one of the parents. There was no confirmation of how this happened to the kids and there was no mention of touching but it sounds very similar to all the previous stories. None of these kids needed the money and all their phones were new models but I did find the whole thing rather bizarre, to say the least. I'm certainly not saying this confirms anything, just passing on what I heard.

Anyway, it did amaze me that the security camera system wasn't even switched on!!

And it amazes me that they can drug 5 people at the same time without any of them noticing anything.

It even amazes me more that in a upmarket mall like Paragon NONE of the security camera's would been turned on and of course it also amazes me that one of the victims happen to have a father who is almost the highest in rank with the policeforce and that you heard the story from someone who heard it from somone while there was agreed to keep it quiet.

[Nisa]

The version I heard involved a group of about 5 young girls (about 13/14) who were friends of my daughter. They were in Paragon shopping centre and were found sitting on the floor outside a couple of exits. They were said to be in a daze and didn't know where they were or how they got there. Their phones and money had been taken. They remember talking to some strangers and that was the last thing they remember. Parents came (one was a police general) and they asked to see if anything was caught on the security cameras. Believe it or not none of them were turned on. They were all offered a small 'gratuity' to keep the incident quiet.

I was very suspicious when I heard all this from my daughter but I had it confirmed by one of the parents. There was no confirmation of how this happened to the kids and there was no mention of touching but it sounds very similar to all the previous stories. None of these kids needed the money and all their phones were new models but I did find the whole thing rather bizarre, to say the least. I'm certainly not saying this confirms anything, just passing on what I heard.

Anyway, it did amaze me that the security camera system wasn't even switched on!!

And it amazes me that they can drug 5 people at the same time without any of them noticing anything.

It even amazes me more that in a upmarket mall like Paragon NONE of the security camera's would been turned on and of course it also amazes me that one of the victims happen to have a father who is almost the highest in rank with the policeforce and that you heard the story from someone who heard it from somone while there was agreed to keep it quiet.

or that "None of these kids needed the money" stolen but either they and/or their parents accepted " small 'gratuity' to keep the incident quiet"

Maybe I am too skeptical but it amazes me people don't question at all what they are told that are clearly RUMORS and hearsay.

[partington]

A story isn't made more believable by the addition of stories that are firstly far more incredible ( we've gone from one person to five at a time, and in another tale, now the person doesn't even have to be touched, just have a handkerchief waved in front of their face!), and secondly transmitted from sources (third, fourth, fifth, sixth hand?) that are much more distant than the OP.

This is LESS believable not more.

While I would absolutely change my mind and admit being wrong at the presentation of any credible evidence, because evidence is important, I just think stories like this are so intrinsically unlikely that scepticism is the only common sense response. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. If I told you my car broke down, so I was late you'd probably not need to see much proof. If I told you it was hijacked by terrorists you'd want more proof. If I told you it flew away you'd want a bloody film of it. It's just common sense.

As many others have pointed out, the existence of an instantly acting drug that could knock someone out in seconds from a touch/brush on the skin, would have changed the face of modern crime and policing. If I had something that would allow me to steal someone's wallet in a few seconds, I would hang around international hotels in Bangkok and do it all day every day until I was stinking rich. Why only in Thailand too, wouldn't criminals everywhere want this, and being criminals, have already got hold of it?

It doesn't really add up.

[lomatopo]

It doesn't really add up.

I think it adds up. Current gold price: 22,057.80, that is a tempting price, maybe there will be a spate of similar attacks?

Still no word from the OP about the police report. That is critical, IMO.

Am also curious about the total replacement value of the stolen items? Did you pay for these originally? Have you been asked to replace them, yet? If I said the value was 50,000 baht (assumed a 2 baht necklace, ring, watch), would your wife ever ask you for that amount? Would you give it over without explanation?

And it is amazing that these thieves accurately administer just the right amount of the drug, and never choose anyone who might have complicating medical factors and possibly die all while moving with the precision and expertise of Seal Team 6.

In the past there have been reports of thieves targeting houses, pumping gas into the house to incapacitate the occupants and then rob the house. Talk about far-fetched.

Edited May 23, 2011 by lomatopo

[KRS1]

I heard stories about this kind of thing from my ex GF of 15 years ago. But the way she described how it was made is very morbid in detail and extremely disturbing, and explains why its not widely available.

Edited May 23, 2011 by KRS1

[chuang]

Don't just blame the toilet's attendent, her duty is to collect an entry-fee if it is a requirement..and to clean the toilets but not to look after those who patronise it..." perhaps she was in on it ".what a sweeping statment...

Isn't it her job to be suspicious of people who hang out in the toilet for a long time ?

She also didn't seem to be too concerned or want to do anything about the robbery (like calling the police).

There must be tons of peoples using the toilets and you expect her to keep track....come on give her a break..why not blame the thai government....

[chuang]

Don't just blame the toilet's attendant, her duty is to collect an entry-fee if it is a requirement..and to clean the toilets but not to look after those who patronise it..." perhaps she was in on it ".what a sweeping statment...

Disagree 100%. Sounds as if she's in on the scam.

YES, maybe she did tell the wife the idea of how to "loose" all the gold.

When the wife gets all the gold replaced by the husband she will go back and give the toilet attendant 500baht to use the toilet

A credible conclusion...