What Is The Price Of Cement?

[nikkie]

hi guys, any idea what is the price of a bag of cement at the various parts of the country? is it cheaper in bangkok than in farther away provinces?

the brands and types?

thanks.

[chownah]

hi guys, any idea what is the price of a bag of cement at the various parts of the country? is it cheaper in bangkok than in farther away provinces?

the brands and types?

thanks.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I'll get the ball rolling and hope that others will join in.

There are many grades of cement and the strongest and most expensive is called 'portland cement' here in Thailand. My workers call it 'seemen pahtlan'. Portland cement gets hard fast so it is not usually used for floors where you need time to work the finish so another grade will be used for floors....it is cheaper than the portland cement. These are the two most common grades in Thailand. Thai workers have opinions about which brands are best but different people have different ideas so it might be based on rumors. I've used portland cement and the slow set cement from about three different manufacturers and they all seem to work about the same....I have no preference....I do make my concrete a bit rich (I add a bit more cement to the mix than Thai people would) since I know that the workers will put too much water in (standard Thai practice in village areas is to use too much water) and using extra cement will counter this.....cement is not too expensive so unless you are on a really tight budget then its good insurance to just add a bit extra. There is also a type of cement that is used to make mortar for blocks, bricks, and ceramic tile installation. It costs about the same per bag as the slow set but the bag only has 40 kilo instead of 50 kilo so it actually does cost more. It makes the mortar 'creamier' in texture and easier to work with...you can, however make perfectly useable mortar from the slow set cement.

Prices for cement varies from month to month and I don't know why. Portland cement in a particular month might cost from 100 to 120 baht per 50 kilo bag depending on brand or in six months the range might be from 80 to 100 baht. These two ranges are ballpark upper and lower liimits that I recall in the north over the last two years...remember, this is ballpark estimating here.....because.....when you buy your cement you'll have to pay the going rate anyway so you should shop around but around here the prices are fairly uniform for the same brand and grade of cement...maybe a couple of baht difference. You will probably find that buying locally will be the best bet...two reasons for this....first if you buy locally they'll deliver for free and second I believe that the price difference across the country is small since cement is pretty much a bulk commodity and prices are competitive...you probably won't save any money by hauling cement...especially with the prices of fuel these days.

[Pink Mist]

don't reckon adding too much water is a prob Chowna but too much sand can be, usually keep the 3:1 ratio add water slowly to make mud not a slurry.

[mijan24]

don't reckon adding too much water is a prob Chowna but too much sand can be, usually keep the 3:1 ratio add water slowly to make mud not a slurry.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yes, Bronco the old 3:2:1 receipe is good for most jobs.

[chownah]

well I reckon that at the university when I studied engineering they taught us that the more water you use in mixing concrete the weaker it would be and I reckon that we even did a lab project where we mixed about 40 different recipies for concrete and found that yes indeed what they taught us seemed to be true. I also reckon that when I was an inspector for US interstate construction they taught us to be really careful about how much water was in the mix and to not let them get away with adding water without permission.

[Diablo Bob]

ALL cement sold in Thailand is a “Portland Cement” or technically a Hydraulic Cement. The origin of the term Portland Cement goes back to 1824, when the patent for Hydraulic Cement was given to Joseph Aspdin, from Leeds England. He called it Portland Cement because the color reminded him of the quarried stone from the Isle of Portland.

Portland Cement comes in 5 Types, I through V. In a nutshell, Type I is for general usage, Type II offers some Sulfate resistance, Type III is High Early cement (Chemically the same as Type I but ground finer), Type IV is low heat of hydration (Mass concrete) and Type V is High Sulfate resistance. In Thailand, you will only find Type I in a bag.

The Mortar cement Chownah mentioned is actually a blended hydraulic cement. They blend Portland cement with lime to give the creamier feel that was mention. The lime is what actually “slows” the set time on this cement blend.

One other cement that can be found in Thailand is a White Portland Cement, which is manufactured by eliminating the iron & reducing the gypsum content from the slag, this cement is hotter than a fire cracker, has a tremendous water demand and it is expensive to boot. The last time I priced this out it was running around 450 baht/50kg bag.

When designing a concrete mixture, these days we avoid the use of the ratios to describe the mixture! Why, there is no ratio given to water component of the mixture. A critical component. We work with Water/Cement ratios (As Chownah states, the less water the stronger the mix and you should experience less cracking as long as you saw cut at the proper time) and Sand/Aggregate ratios. These combinations will dictate the physical properties of the concrete mixture in its’ plastic and hardened state. Unfortunately, the reality of the situation is that Water/Cement ratio is advisory only because the coarse aggregate and sand sieve analysis have a significant affect on the amount of water required for a given slump (Finer the sand/rock the more water it takes to produce a workable mixture). I used to go out in the field and talk to concrete finishers in the USA about the finishing characteristics of a mixture, whenever the consensus was that the mixture was to rocky and it needed more sand, my adjustment was to remove sand and add more rock!

If you intend to do any flatwork, I would recommend that you consider ready-mix. The price in Buriram last August was 1200 Baht/cubic meter. YOU can specify the slump (Measurement of workability(Water content)) and make sure the contractor doesn’t just mix up some soup and flood the forms.

In saying all of this, I must admit, that over the years I have seen every which way concrete can be f**ked up, and have still seen work that doesn’t look half bad. I have produced concrete for pre-cast elements using barrel mixers and made it work. Personally, If I am going to be placing structural components (Columns, elevated decking etc.) I would opt for the ready mix. The same holds true for wearing surfaces such as driveways. If I am placing non-structural, go for the volumetric……….

As for cement type….. Well, your choice is probably going to be Type I, 80-120 baht bag!

[chownah]

Diablo Bob is exactly right that all construction cement in Thaland is portland cement....but....around where I live the term 'seemen pahtlan' (cement portland) is only use for the Type I protland cement.....most if not all of the bags of this type will have something indicating that it is Type I....though it might be printed in Thai. You probably don't want to use Type I for floors or mortar because it would set up too fast and not be as workable....but you could use it if you had to. The other types of cement in Thaland are called 'blended cements'. They contain additives...often a thing called fly ash...which make them cheaper but not as strong as Type I....these blended cements are what we use for floors.

[Diablo Bob]

Chownah,

Hint - Another way to "Slow" down the concrete is to use a chemical admixture, specifically a retarder. Now most retarders are in a family known as Lignosulphanates, or simply tree sugars...... add 1/2Kg of regular sugar to a meter of concrete, sit down and drink around 5-6 Leo's, and you can still finish the concrete. We used to have a 10# bag of sugar on every ready mix truck in Las Vegas for the eventual breakdown (Unless it was your PTO then you broke out the jack hammers) with a full load on board.

Now, in Thailand with the high humidity, you could get away with this, since our evaporation rate from the surface of the concrete is so low. Another trick, on those low humidity days, after screeding and bull floating, use a Hudson sprayer and spray a film of Diesel fuel on the surface. This acts like an evaporative retarder (Keeps the moisture in the concrete). Since it is lighter than water, it does not penetrate the surface and will wash away when the concrete gets washed, it also has no affect on the physical characteristics of the hardened concrete.