Foreign Company

[Farang#1]

hello

question:

What is the status of an American company working FROM Thailand (which means DO NOT do any deals in Thailand)

Simply sit there and still do business in the USA.

Is it possible (legaly)?

What if I bring help ( Thai? Foreign? )

What is the Thai law perspactive on something like that?

[Indo-Siam]

There are a lot of people here who do similar - particularly in three fields - 1) daytrading stocks; 2) buying and exporting trade goods; and 3) software development and on-line technical assistance. I am sure that there are other activities - these are just three that I have repeatedly seen.

I have never heard of any of these people EVER getting into trouble. Despite what a bunch of fearmongers will write on this board, there is no Thai "Gestapo" out there, hunting down independent operators,and punishing them.

So - you just come over - either with a non-immigrant visa that you "buy" off an honorary Thai consulate such as Houston - or even with just a return round-trip or onward ticket - getting a 30 day entry on arrival - and you then go on and do your thing. As long as you don't sell anything in Thailand (including services to anyone in Thailand), you are effectively invisible.

What are the downsides to operating off the books?

1) You will have to make visa runs outside Thailand every 30, 60, or 90 days - depending on whether you have an "entry on arrival", or tourist visa, or non-immigrant Class B visa.

2) Without a Thai employer of record (to withhold and pay in personal income tax), you cannot get a work permit. This blocks you from a small amount of capabilities here - such as getting a post-billing handphone account. You can generally figure out "work-arounds" for such restrictions.

3) You cannot bring in personal belongings duty-free

4) You cannot generally recover VAT for wholesale goods exported in bulk.

5) You will not accrue any time toward qualifying for permanent residency.

6) If - after five years living as a "transient" - you suddenly decideto go "legit" here, when the time comes to obtain a valid wortk permit, you must submit your passport and your work history. The work permit office is not stupid - it takes them about a nanosecond to figure out that you have been defacto "living and working in Thailand" for five years - and their attitude is that you have consciously defied their authority, and are now "rubbing their face in it".

That last "downside" is real. One of the few times we were unsuccessful in obtaining a work permit for someone was for an American here who graduated from Chula's Sasin MBA program (two years), then worked off the books for an export company here, and then GOT A JOB - with work permit - as a senior consultant with the Kennan Institute Asia. When that assignment ended, the sought to go to work for a BOI company. The BOI one-stop center WOULD NOT grant him a work permit - solely because he could not document legal employment for 18 months out of the past five years - when his passport showed he had been here all that time.

The alternate approach is to start a Thai Private Co. Ltd. here, to serve as your employment sponsor. You pay out some money to get it started (takes less than 30 days), and you then have a monthly "burn rate" forever (for maintaining a legally sufficient registered business address, monthly bookkeeping, and payment of withholding taxes). But - you can then obtain a work permit - and you become "bulletproof". If the cost is no problem, but you just want to avoid the hassles, then you can "outsource" starting and running your company to a company like mine - what you get is simply legal "cover" for your activities.

Good luck!

Steve Sykes

Managing Director

Indo-Siam Group

Bangkok

[email protected]

www.thaistartup.com

[Seen all,learnt nothing]

Is it possible (legaly)?

Steve, Indo-Siam.

Before OP acts on your advice (and I am not challenging it), I think he would wish to know if he would be technically within the law.

What could be the implications if he obtains assistance (Thai or foreign) as he is considering?

[Indo-Siam]

Ultimately, Thailand is a nation of laws - and - if you get all the way to the end of the legal process without cutting a deal, you end up standing in a Thai courtroom.

I have stood in a Thai courtroom - as a defendant. It was Labor Court - I was represanting my company. We lost. I knew going in that we would lose. But I wanted to see the process. There is no jury - a Thai court is three judges. One head judge - who is just an expert on Thai law in general - and two associate judges, who are supposed to be topical experets on the legal issue in play.

So - why do I bring this up. For something to go wrong, Mr. OP will have to end up- eventually - in a Thai courtroom, with someone presenting evidence to the judges, showing that defendant did was something illegal.

I guy landing in Thailand with a visa on arrival, going to his apartment, and working on his computer - or - going out to Chatuchak, buying a bunch of stuff, and then going to mail it at the post office - or going to an ATM machine to wihthdraw his salary from an overseas bank account - isn't going to be generating compelling evidence of committing a crime.

Work backwards from conviction - and one more semi-dodgy guy "hanging around" isn't going to stand out from the crowd.

Now - if the OP is a boiler-room type, wanting to bring over his entire 50man tele-thievery staff - that may be another story. He didn't provide enough info make intelligent comment.

There are probably a few more "downside" restrictions than I listed, for a "hanger--around without visible means of support" -I just can't think of them at the moment. If anyone can, then add your comments - that is what the OP wants to look at, and evaluate.

If you are selling nothing to Thailand - product or service - depriving no legal employee in Thailand of a job, and having no interface with any employer in Thailand - and you don't overstay your entry permit, you are effectively invisible to the Thai government. They have better things to do than look more deeply into persons with this population profile.

Cheers!

Steve

Indo-Siam

[Seen all,learnt nothing]

Thanks Steve, Indo-Siam

A very informative and interesting response, as always.

[astral]

What are the downsides to operating off the books?

6)  If - after five years living as a "transient" - you suddenly decideto go "legit" here, when the time comes to obtain a valid wortk permit, you must submit your passport and your work history.  The work permit office is not stupid - it takes them about a nanosecond to figure out that you have been defacto "living and working in Thailand" for five years - and their attitude is that you have consciously defied their authority, and are now "rubbing their face in it".

That last "downside" is real.  One of the few times we were unsuccessful in obtaining a work permit for someone was  for an American here who graduated from Chula's Sasin MBA program (two years), then worked off the books for an export company here, and then GOT A JOB - with work permit - as a senior consultant with the Kennan Institute Asia.  When that assignment ended, the sought to go to work for a BOI company.  The BOI one-stop center WOULD NOT grant him a work permit - solely because he could not document legal employment for 18 months out of the past five years - when his passport showed he had been here all that time.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

If you find yourself in these situation, just renew you passport and apply with a

nice clean one!!

If the Thai's ask, the old passport is lost/stolen whatever.