Be Prepared

[Murgatroyd]

When I arrived in early 2008 to live and get married here in Thailand I thought I had a fairly realistic budget, and would be able to have a fairly comfortable life.

I was receiving an income of about £1,167.00 per month from my investments, and at that time the British Pound bought about 67 Bhat. This produced a monthly income of about 78,000 Baht.

But times change, in this case fairly quickly... the global financial crash reduced the interest rate on my main investment from about 5% to about 0.5%, and the pound dropped like a rock against the Baht... We all hoped this would be a temporary thing, but it wasn't... as you all know to your cost.

I had to do a run back to the UK to get my cash back out of the greedy hands of my bank, who refused to let me do this by mail or fax, and reinvest it in an income producing bond. By this time I had used up precious cash reserves, and the new investments were only producing an income of about £911.00 or 42,000 (given the new exchange rate of 46 Baht to the pound). I've been here 40 months now, and the difference between my actual income and the income I originally budgeted on amounts to about 36,252 baht a month. Multiply that up and the change in interest rates and exchange rates has cost me about £31,523.00 or a massive 1,450,000 Baht... enough to buy a modest house here.

Last year both my wife and my stepdaughter needed expensive dental work, and this year I was diagnosed as having type 2 Diabetes. Not a killer, but something that required a diet of expensive medication. Then my wife found a lump in her breast... She needed two expensive operations and a course of Chemiotherapy. She's better now, but I still fear for her long term prospects. The cost all of this treatment went so far beyond anything I'd ever budgeted for that I'm having to cash in one of my income bonds a year before it was due to mature. I'll be lucky to get back what I paid into it four years ago. This will further reduce our income in the future.

The marriage visa may not be as expensive as the retirement visa in terms of the amount of capital or income required, but changes to the rules mean that you can't show half income and half lump sum to qualify, it has to be all one or the other. It will only take the exchange rate to drop a further 5 Baht against the pound and I'll be stuffed for the income qualification. That will mean taking more capital out of my savings each year until it's all gone.

My wife has recently taken a course of driving lessons, and passed her test. She has set her heart on a brand new and very expensive vehicle. The car would cost about £15,000. Even on HP I'd have to put down a deposit of over £3,500.00 and pay the rest off over 7 years at the rate of about 9000 Baht per month. I tried to tell my wife that I couldn't afford this car, and showed her how much we are already spending over and above what I receive in income. I tried to demonstrate that if we bought the car my money would run out entirely in about 9 years, but she didn't understand. She looked at me and said " Darling, I don't know how much longer I will live... I want to be a driver". I find it very hard to deny her her wish, but I'm going to have to because the money simply isn't there. Whilst preparing the figures with which to demonstrate the fact that we couldn't afford the car I realised that we were already living well over budget, and the recent medical costs had almost driven us to the wall.

So I guess what I'm trying to say is: When you are planning your idyllic retirement in Thailand, don't assume that things will go smoothly. Make sure that you have ample reserves of cash for emergencies, and be prepared for your investments to loose value whilst the exchange rate takes a savage tumble.

[Semper]

Sorry to hear about your situation. Maybe your wife could find work some where to help out your situation?

[JeffreyMcCollum]

can be a driver of a decent used car for under 100,000 Bt.

Simply all by your decisions.

Medical care here is simply less expensive as well as dental so don't cry to me.

everyday you make many choices. All choices you choose.

I live on half of what you do and my wife, daughter and I are happy.

Simply rethink your budget and all sit down and talk about it or go home !

[OlafStapleton]

What Jeff says

Hospital free for Thai person. Thai person not NEED go private, but might WANT.

Difference between 'want' and 'need' with dental work. Work need usually cheap, work want cosmetic, expensive.

I find tell wife I NEED 40k per month for me, if can pay for you to then good, if can not pay for you to then goodbye.

(I also support MIL, teen step daughter and new son from that amount)

My lifestyle not low, but I live with what have, wife live with what have (Did pay for wife private room when have baby at Thai hospital, 3 night @800bht).

Learn to live within budget, teach wife to live within budget. Else find cheaper wife or send wife to work.

Very few Thai have money manage skill, never think beyond next week. This you job.

Yes she will run you out of money if you let her, then most likely she move on.

I see this happen to foreigner many time. Foreigner with limited money can be very silly.

Sorry no sympathy, 40k a month more than most Thai family have.

(Do have sympathy for you medical expense, but find cheaper drug, change eating habit to control diabetes)

(current rate 48bht to pound, why you get 46?)

PS

2YO Honda Click 25,000bht

New Proton 4 door auto 460,000bht (9k UKP)

If not rich person don't buy 750,000bht car

Edited August 4, 2011 by OlafStapleton

[Soutpeel]

and talk about it or go home !

Nice to see there are compassionate people on TV......

Rather than seeking advice on TV, think he has illustrated even with decent forward planning, things can go down the toilet pretty quickly...

I can see this degenerating into bi-monthly Cheap Charlie thread, where are resident cheap charlies out do each other on who can spend the least....

So let me open the bidding....my monthly budget is THB 200,000/m and these days, I just dont know how to make ends meet these days in Thailand....

Edited August 4, 2011 by Soutpeel

[Semper]

Another bright idea would be to move to a cheaper house/apartement, skip the car use a motorcycle instead. I live comfortable with 35K per month, as I think many other expats do.

[englishinsiam]

The other option for the OP is some kind of Internet work.

I am always looking for new ideas and currently have 3 websites plus other business interests all online.

I trade FOrex for clients too, I always say never put your eggs in one basket try to have at least 3 or 4 income streams coming in.

The World is in a right mess now and relying on std bank/investment companies making you a living is not going to happen. You need to think outside the box and find other areas.

Good luck

[BuckarooBanzai]

I applaud the OP for telling his story of how the real world works. I believe he is giving fair warning to those starry eyed farangs who are making the jump for retirement in Thailand so they can be given fair warning to do the appropriate amount of planning. Hope all our luck improves with the exchange rate!

[Thaifan2]

>>She has set her heart on a brand new and very expensive vehicle. The car would cost about £15,000<<

Time to ditch the monkey on your back ( ie ,your wife )

[irishken]

as i am only a frequent visitor to thailand and not a expat yet i cant say how much one should live on but when i do i would expect 35000 to be enough for me.

hop your wife gets better fast

[lovelomsak]

I agree what has happened in the last 4 years I feelit has effected many retired people here in Thailand. I have met others here with the same kind of story. My advice is tighten the spending and save up the 400,000 baht in the bank needed to stay here. Then create a new budget with whatever you have, coming in monthly. You can turn this around with good planning. Just donot let the wife talk you into stupid spending. Good chance is if you go broke she may just leave you.

It appears you arenot complaining just pointing out a few things. I am lucky I am Canadian and it has gone the other way for me. Now i get more for my buck.

[irishken]

as i am only a frequent visitor to thailand and not yet a expat i cant say how much one should live on, but when i do i would expect 35000 baht to be enough for me.

hope your wife gets better soon.

Edited August 4, 2011 by irishken

[Murgatroyd]

Thanks for the advice Semper... I bought a small home business for my wife and she works hard at making ladies and children's clothing. However she keeps the money that she earns that way, because she works so hard at it and because she gave up her job to look after me..

Jeffrey, I appreciate what you say. I have indeed sat down and talked the issue through with my wife. I've explained that if we continue to live over budget and buy the wretched new car I will have to go home to earn some more money... and that this will take several years to accomplish. She was frightened to go into the local hospital and I wanted for her to get the best available treatment. So we decided on the National Cancer Hospital in Bangkok. Whilst this is not an expensive private hospital for Farangs, it still cost me somewhat more than I had on hand for this year.

Olaf, I also appreciate that my income is more that most Thai families have... I don't recall asking for sympathy on that basis. I don't seem to be getting the 48baht rate from my bank... something else I'll have to look into.

Thanks Southpeel. Funnily enough my name is Charlie... I guess I'm getting to be a cheaper one than I had hoped to be.

We live in the townhouse that My wife bought a number of years before we first met. The only difference is that I pay the mortgage now. We don't live anywhere fancy.

Thaifan2, I'm not sure that I could live with the guilt involved in "Ditching" my wife and our stepdaughter, both of which I love very much indeed. She's never asked me for anything expensive before and I feel guilty that I cannot provide what she wants.

To all the others who've posted on the thread, many thanks for your advice. I've got a lot to consider.

Edited August 4, 2011 by Murgatroyd

[Soutpeel]

The other option for the OP is some kind of Internet work.

I am always looking for new ideas and currently have 3 websites plus other business interests all online.

I trade FOrex for clients too, I always say never put your eggs in one basket try to have at least 3 or 4 income streams coming in.

The World is in a right mess now and relying on std bank/investment companies making you a living is not going to happen. You need to think outside the box and find other areas.

Good luck

Which is all illegal unless you have a WP for Thailand of course.....Which I am sure you have.....

[Wallaby]

Gee some of you are harsh.

The guy is merely telling a story of what can happen when things don't go as planned and your comfortable retirement becomes less comfortable.

OP, you have bravely opened yourself up to all sorts of derogatory comments but I, for one, thank you for reminding me that no matter how well I may plan things that sometimes things out of my control can have a severe detrimental impact on future plans.

Good luck to you and I hope all turns out well.

[OlafStapleton]

Thanks for the advice Semper... I bought a small home business for my wife and she works hard at making ladies and children's clothing. However she keeps the money that she earns that way, and she works hard at it.

Jeffrey, I appreciate what you say. I have indeed sat down and talked the issue through with my wife. I've explained that if we continue to live over budget and buy the wretched new car I will have to go home to earn some more money... and that this will take several years to accomplish. She was frightened to gi into the local hospital and I wanted for her to get the best available treatment. So we decided on the National Cancer Hospital in Bangkok. Whilst this is not an expensive private hospital for Farangs, it still cost me somewhat more than I had on hand for this year.

Olaf, I also appreciate that my income is more that most Thai families have... I don't recall asking for sympathy on that basis. I don't seem to be getting the 48baht rate from my bank... something else I'll have to look into.

Thanks Southpeel. Funnily enough my name is Charlie... I guess I'm getting to be a cheaper one than I had hoped to be.

She has business, let her pay for car

Never say you will go home to get more, many Thai happy for husband do like that, as long as he still send them money.

Better to say, I not have money Thai government chuck me out, I have to leave you.

Stop acting like ATM

[outofoz]

A salutory warning about relying on exchange rates and interest/investment rates when planning longer term living expenses, or in your case retirement..

I try and factor in a worst case scenario of a 20% drop in the Aussie dollar/baht when i do my long term planning. The Aussie dollar is super high against the greenback at the moment and interest rates on every day online accounts in Australia can return 6.5%...easy to do the Math on those figures and think everything is hunky dory for the future

[Semper]

and talk about it or go home !

Nice to see there are compassionate people on TV......

Rather than seeking advice on TV, think he has illustrated even with decent forward planning, things can go down the toilet pretty quickly...

I can see this degenerating into bi-monthly Cheap Charlie thread, where are resident cheap charlies out do each other on who can spend the least....

So let me open the bidding....my monthly budget is THB 200,000/m and these days, I just dont know how to make ends meet these days in Thailand....

I would be interested to know how you spend 200K/month. I have tried, but found it impossible.

[happyrobert]

Gee some of you are harsh.

The guy is merely telling a story of what can happen when things don't go as planned and your comfortable retirement becomes less comfortable.

OP, you have bravely opened yourself up to all sorts of derogatory comments but I, for one, thank you for reminding me that no matter how well I may plan things that sometimes things out of my control can have a severe detrimental impact on future plans.

Good luck to you and I hope all turns out well.

+1.

I'm sure you realize, Wallaby, that those who speak harshly of another's circumstances are merely feeding their low self-esteem.

I, too, applaud his openess and his concern for those who are coming after us.

[StreetCowboy]

and talk about it or go home !

Nice to see there are compassionate people on TV......

Rather than seeking advice on TV, think he has illustrated even with decent forward planning, things can go down the toilet pretty quickly...

I can see this degenerating into bi-monthly Cheap Charlie thread, where are resident cheap charlies out do each other on who can spend the least....

So let me open the bidding....my monthly budget is THB 200,000/m and these days, I just dont know how to make ends meet these days in Thailand....

I would be interested to know how you spend 200K/month. I have tried, but found it impossible.

Send your kids to an international school.

I always thought Soutpeel was relatively well off, but apparently not.

Unless that is disposable budget after tax and school fees and rent and medical insurance and alimony and yacht lease payments and all the other essentials that are deducted before the money gets to the ATM...

I get paid cash in hand, and then have to launder all these various expenses separately, and its amazing how quickly you go from Soutpeel's number to Semper's number.

SC

[Semper]

and talk about it or go home !

Nice to see there are compassionate people on TV......

Rather than seeking advice on TV, think he has illustrated even with decent forward planning, things can go down the toilet pretty quickly...

I can see this degenerating into bi-monthly Cheap Charlie thread, where are resident cheap charlies out do each other on who can spend the least....

So let me open the bidding....my monthly budget is THB 200,000/m and these days, I just dont know how to make ends meet these days in Thailand....

I would be interested to know how you spend 200K/month. I have tried, but found it impossible.

Send your kids to an international school.

I always thought Soutpeel was relatively well off, but apparently not.

Unless that is disposable budget after tax and school fees and rent and medical insurance and alimony and yacht lease payments and all the other essentials that are deducted before the money gets to the ATM...

I get paid cash in hand, and then have to launder all these various expenses separately, and its amazing how quickly you go from Soutpeel's number to Semper's number.

SC

Why am I not surprised that you would reply to this. Seen it before waiting, waiting.... and then bam.

[StreetCowboy]

...

Send your kids to an international school.

I always thought Soutpeel was relatively well off, but apparently not.

Unless that is disposable budget after tax and school fees and rent and medical insurance and alimony and yacht lease payments and all the other essentials that are deducted before the money gets to the ATM...

I get paid cash in hand, and then have to launder all these various expenses separately, and its amazing how quickly you go from Soutpeel's number to Semper's number.

SC

Why am I not surprised that you would reply to this. Seen it before waiting, waiting.... and then bam.

Sorry - I didn't understand your point; could you explain further?

SC

[Mirth]

when it comes to economics, it doesn't matter whether you're in the UK or Thailand, if one can't control their budget, everything will spiral out of control eventually due to inflation.

[Scoop1]

What Jeff says

Hospital free for Thai person. Thai person not NEED go private, but might WANT.

Difference between 'want' and 'need' with dental work. Work need usually cheap, work want cosmetic, expensive.

I find tell wife I NEED 40k per month for me, if can pay for you to then good, if can not pay for you to then goodbye.

(I also support MIL, teen step daughter and new son from that amount)

My lifestyle not low, but I live with what have, wife live with what have (Did pay for wife private room when have baby at Thai hospital, 3 night @800bht).

Learn to live within budget, teach wife to live within budget. Else find cheaper wife or send wife to work.

Very few Thai have money manage skill, never think beyond next week. This you job.

Yes she will run you out of money if you let her, then most likely she move on.

I see this happen to foreigner many time. Foreigner with limited money can be very silly.

Sorry no sympathy, 40k a month more than most Thai family have.

(Do have sympathy for you medical expense, but find cheaper drug, change eating habit to control diabetes)

(current rate 48bht to pound, why you get 46?)

PS

2YO Honda Click 25,000bht

New Proton 4 door auto 460,000bht (9k UKP)

If not rich person don't buy 750,000bht car

Very well put!!! i am looking to come live in thailand on 60000/ month, and i will have to pay rent, thats what my wage will be , untill i get my super, i have about 16000 aud as back up, i am now starting to worry???

[Scoop1]

Another bright idea would be to move to a cheaper house/apartement, skip the car use a motorcycle instead. I live comfortable with 35K per month, as I think many other expats do.

can you tell me do you pay rent and if so where is cheap??

[OlafStapleton]

Very well put!!! i am looking to come live in thailand on 60000/ month, and i will have to pay rent, thats what my wage will be , untill i get my super, i have about 16000 aud as back up, i am now starting to worry???

Not to worry, 60k plenty (if not in BK or Pats)

House rent 4-5k month, easy to support Thai family on 40k, 60k can go out and party every night.

[Scoop1]

Another bright idea would be to move to a cheaper house/apartement, skip the car use a motorcycle instead. I live comfortable with 35K per month, as I think many other expats do.

[AngelofDeath]

1. Health issues is the biggest problem to hit anyone. It will definitely drain your resources faster than you can imagine. Besides eating healthily and exercising, it seems like there isn't much one can do to minimize potential health problems.

2. Rely on multiple stream of incomes.

3. Be contented which means being able to to tell a 'need' from a 'want'.

Is there any point(s) that I missed out?

Thanks for sharing your experiences as I am still young.

[Scoop1]

Very well put!!! i am looking to come live in thailand on 60000/ month, and i will have to pay rent, thats what my wage will be , untill i get my super, i have about 16000 aud as back up, i am now starting to worry???

Not to worry, 60k plenty (if not in BK or Pats)

House rent 4-5k month, easy to support Thai family on 40k, 60k can go out and party every night.

please tell me more, the more the better!! about everything, i want to get this right, i am looking at rentals and i dont know where, to go, i looked at bang saphan, it looked nic and quiet, and sugestions i will be happy with, thank you

[thaicbr]

it basically tells everyone to make sure they have HEALTH INSURANCE.