Accupuncture For Lower Backpain

[thaisabai]

Hi all

suffering from lower spinal lumber stenosis since a few weeks. Pattaya BKK hospital suggests surgery, but don't presently have insurance. Looking for accupuncture. Any recommendations?

How is International hospital for this? are these prices reasonable?

see here: http://www.pih-inter.com/packages-promotions/6/alternative-treatment-acupuncture.html

advise appreciated

thaisabai

[ThaiKiwi]

Firstly I suggest you really confirm the cause of your symptoms. There are many causes of lower backpain and if it really is lower spinal lumber stenosis then it could be confirmed with a CT scan or MRI scan as these scans show if the nerves are actually being compressed from lumber spinal stenosis.

Does the pain reduce if you are learning forward? If so then it is a strong indicator that nerves are being compressed but relieved when leaning forward.

Because lower spinal lumber stenosis is a physical condition sometimes caused by arthritis or the wearing out of bones, I would seriously wonder if acupuncture would be a viable cure.

There is plenty of information on the Internet you can find with a simple google search so if I was you, I would do some research yourself and then compare all you read to what you already know about your condition then start asking the professionals.

[Thaifan2]

Have you had it before ?and did it just go away after a few weeks ?

I suffer from the same and it normally lasts 3 weeks and just goes away itself and may not come back again for 18 months or so .

I avoid Hospitals as doctors know very little about back pain ,and they can make it worse .

[OneZero]

Firstly I suggest you really confirm the cause of your symptoms. There are many causes of lower backpain and if it really is lower spinal lumber stenosis then it could be confirmed with a CT scan or MRI scan as these scans show if the nerves are actually being compressed from lumber spinal stenosis.

Does the pain reduce if you are learning forward? If so then it is a strong indicator that nerves are being compressed but relieved when leaning forward.

Because lower spinal lumber stenosis is a physical condition sometimes caused by arthritis or the wearing out of bones, I would seriously wonder if acupuncture would be a viable cure.

There is plenty of information on the Internet you can find with a simple google search so if I was you, I would do some research yourself and then compare all you read to what you already know about your condition then start asking the professionals.

Good advice. Also google "McKenzie Exercises"; - but these exercises bring relief to certain people when bending backward. So be careful when trying various exercises as apparently the nerves can be compressed in different ways.

[ktamp]

Try the ayuravedic massage at healthland. 300 thb for an hour. These massage therapists have gone to university and are not your typical massage therapists. She will ask you where your pain is and tailor the treatment specifically for you. I went for severe back spasms after i had an operation. I showed her my scar and that I'd had an operation two weeks ago and told her where my back hurt. I won't lie. The first session was hard. She used deep tissue massage, heat and stretching. I felt better. I went two more times and my pain was gone completely. I have a lower back problem in that I have only half of one vertabra (was born this way) and have a slipped disc. I went back to see her anytime it started giving me trouble. I think they have 3 of these massage therapists but I always saw the same lady. Book the day before because they get filled up fast.

[Darrel]

Interesting article with some suggested treatments (avoiding surgery):

http://www.spinesurgeons.ac.uk/article.asp?article=32

Sounds like the sort of thing I would want to get a second opinion about, especially if you've only had it a few weeks.

[Gonsalviz]

In Bangkok area is a Chinese hospital. I forget the name but I stayed at the Twin Towers hotel and it was withing a 10 minute walk. On Google Earth coordinates are

100 30'59.95 E

13 45'00.34 N

Be sure to have Hospitals block checked in the Layers gallery.

You have to get a Thai to translate the Name. I went there. They want you to go for around 10 sessions. Each session was 400-500 Baht. It seems no one speaks English and some of the doctors don't speak Thai. Only Chinese and English. Take a Thai with you.

I think the best treatment is Room 202 or 204. I had one Chinese lady doctor there that stabbed a needle in the side of my foot. I thought there would be more but she just came to ask me how my pain was. It was then that I realized that it was gone.

Unfortunately, I did not have the time to complete 10 visits but I am sure that it helped.

[BEENTHEREDONETHAT]

Interesting article with some suggested treatments (avoiding surgery):

http://www.spinesurg....asp?article=32

Sounds like the sort of thing I would want to get a second opinion about, especially if you've only had it a few weeks.

Thanks for that Darrel.......I've had that problem for a couple of years now but the Dr. told me it was caused by osteoarthritis. At my age (77) I'm very hesitant to go under the knife for anything, just chicken I guess. I'd rather put up with the pain. During the day I can do things to distract me from it but when I go to bed it really bugs me and I have to get up and move around several times a night..

Thanks for the website, I took the test and I'll live.

[djinn]

Could you provide the adress/direction of healthland please.

thanks in advance

Try the ayuravedic massage at healthland. 300 thb for an hour. These massage therapists have gone to university and are not your typical massage therapists. She will ask you where your pain is and tailor the treatment specifically for you. I went for severe back spasms after i had an operation. I showed her my scar and that I'd had an operation two weeks ago and told her where my back hurt. I won't lie. The first session was hard. She used deep tissue massage, heat and stretching. I felt better. I went two more times and my pain was gone completely. I have a lower back problem in that I have only half of one vertabra (was born this way) and have a slipped disc. I went back to see her anytime it started giving me trouble. I think they have 3 of these massage therapists but I always saw the same lady. Book the day before because they get filled up fast.

[Darrel]

At my age (77) I'm very hesitant to go under the knife for anything, just chicken I guess. I'd rather put up with the pain. During the day I can do things to distract me from it but when I go to bed it really bugs me and I have to get up and move around several times a night..

I understand the aversion to the knife. You never know if the surgeon is having a bad day or not.

It may not help you at all but I suffered from terrible low back pain for several months. Couldnt work out what it was at all. Then one day, for unrelated reasons involving a change of bedroom (but not a change of bed), I changed my pillow for a slightly thinner one. The pain disappeared completely overnight and never returned. Thinking back I realised that the pain had begun soon after I had started using the thicker pillow, which I had not previously used.

So worth thinking about.

Good luck.

[CatCage]

There is a big sign on the left after third road going toward Sukhumvit on Pattaya Tai for an acupuncturist its the soi by the Cat office I think, .

Another alternative to acupuncture could be a four channel tens machine, you can use the same points and do it at home at your convenience. Worked for me after one year of pain so bad from L3 and L4 that I could not even walk three meters.

[nakotic]

There is a big sign on the left after third road going toward Sukhumvit on Pattaya Tai for an acupuncturist its the soi by the Cat office I think, .

Another alternative to acupuncture could be a four channel tens machine, you can use the same points and do it at home at your convenience. Worked for me after one year of pain so bad from L3 and L4 that I could not even walk three meters.

There's another place further up Pattaya Tai at the big crossroads ( Soi Bongkai,Khopai ??),it's an Englishman ( Nigel ? ) who was in the Army or something,he's seriously good and knows what he's doing.

I had a neck problem for ages and he sorted it,sorry I don't have his number.

[ktamp]

Could you provide the adress/direction of healthland please.

thanks in advance

Try the ayuravedic massage at healthland. 300 thb for an hour. These massage therapists have gone to university and are not your typical massage therapists. She will ask you where your pain is and tailor the treatment specifically for you. I went for severe back spasms after i had an operation. I showed her my scar and that I'd had an operation two weeks ago and told her where my back hurt. I won't lie. The first session was hard. She used deep tissue massage, heat and stretching. I felt better. I went two more times and my pain was gone completely. I have a lower back problem in that I have only half of one vertabra (was born this way) and have a slipped disc. I went back to see her anytime it started giving me trouble. I think they have 3 of these massage therapists but I always saw the same lady. Book the day before because they get filled up fast.

It's on North Pattaya Rd. Pretty big place. Close to the fairtex hotel. If you are going from the dolphin roundabout, it will be on the left side. For what it's worth, I think the orthopedic department at BPH is useless. I wouldn't trust any of them there. I went after I fell concerned I had seriously jacked my back. I was in alot of pain. He spent less than 3 minutes with me and gave me loads of tylenol. My husband was having problems with his neck and the doctor he saw was an idiot. I finally sent him to my massage lady at healthland and she got him straightened out.

[muchogra]

op, 5 years ago I took my MIL twice a week for months to Hua Chiew Hospital for acupuncture to help her walk. She was 82 and had cancer. The acupuncturist was a 75 years old Chinese (he looked 50) from Beijing and had over 50 years of experience. He did a good job. Everyday there were many people for different reasons. The hospital is near the Bo Bei market in Bangkok. Another poster here had mentioned about a 10 sessions therapy for somewhere around B4,000 to B5,000, I think he meant the same hospital. There were some other lady acupuncturists there also using a combination of acupuncture and the hot suction cups.

I found an old hospital card with a phone no. 02-223-1351, fax 02-223-1253

I tried googling for you and found that within Thai Visa there's a topic on this:

Good luck.

[mark55]

There is a big sign on the left after third road going toward Sukhumvit on Pattaya Tai for an acupuncturist its the soi by the Cat office I think, .

Another alternative to acupuncture could be a four channel tens machine, you can use the same points and do it at home at your convenience. Worked for me after one year of pain so bad from L3 and L4 that I could not even walk three meters.

There's another place further up Pattaya Tai at the big crossroads ( Soi Bongkai,Khopai ??),it's an Englishman ( Nigel ? ) who was in the Army or something,he's seriously good and knows what he's doing.

I had a neck problem for ages and he sorted it,sorry I don't have his number.

his number,, 0890993845 ,

[Colin Yai]

Firstly I suggest you really confirm the cause of your symptoms. There are many causes of lower backpain and if it really is lower spinal lumber stenosis then it could be confirmed with a CT scan or MRI scan as these scans show if the nerves are actually being compressed from lumber spinal stenosis.

Does the pain reduce if you are learning forward? If so then it is a strong indicator that nerves are being compressed but relieved when leaning forward.

Because lower spinal lumber stenosis is a physical condition sometimes caused by arthritis or the wearing out of bones, I would seriously wonder if acupuncture would be a viable cure.

There is plenty of information on the Internet you can find with a simple google search so if I was you, I would do some research yourself and then compare all you read to what you already know about your condition then start asking the professionals.

I have had back problems for years but was recommended these tablets Difeline , diclofenic sodium ,they worked wonders for me in a very short space of time ,and at 30 baht for 10x50mg tablets are certainly worth a try .

[georgy]

is any of the mentioned therapists "braking bones"?

having continous pain in neck and shoulder recently i should get such treatment, as it helped me abroad some years ago.

[Bagwan]

The Royal Orthopaedic Hospital in Birmingham told me that there was nothing that they could do as they couldn't find anything wrong with me. Thankfully they did believe that I was at times in pain. I found BPH totally useless and a waste of money. If anything they made my suffering worse. I tried acupuncture andI wasn't disappointed, As I suspected, totally useless. Then I tried Sutima, a visiting masseuse who had attended Wat Po for two years. After three visits I was cured and no problems since. I used her for another 5 years out of gratefulness.

[Exsexyman]

There is a big sign on the left after third road going toward Sukhumvit on Pattaya Tai for an acupuncturist its the soi by the Cat office I think, .

Another alternative to acupuncture could be a four channel tens machine, you can use the same points and do it at home at your convenience. Worked for me after one year of pain so bad from L3 and L4 that I could not even walk three meters.

There's another place further up Pattaya Tai at the big crossroads ( Soi Bongkai,Khopai ??),it's an Englishman ( Nigel ? ) who was in the Army or something,he's seriously good and knows what he's doing.

I had a neck problem for ages and he sorted it,sorry I don't have his number.

Yes, his name is Nigel Kelsey. I think he was the physio for the British power lifting team. As nakotic says he is very good. I had a course of acupuncture / electro therapy with him, and recommend him highly. You will have to ring him and make an appointment though as he is always very busy.

[raro]

I had pain in the lower back when standing for a while. Saw a chiropractor in Bangkok and after several sessions the problem was gone. Not sure whether I had stenosis but the chiropractor is a real recommendation.

PM me for contact.

[Phil Conners]

I believe this is a health issue more than a Pattaya issue so moving to the health forum.

[Sheryl]

A 77 year old with documented arthritic changes in the spine should not go near a Chiropracter, least of all in Thailand where they tend not to be too careful in screening patients first.

I'd be a bit cautious on the massage, too. Suggest you first discuss with an orthopedic specialist what types of manipulation should be avoided. Manuevers that do wonders for others could do serious harm to you. Not all back pain in all people is alike.

Accupuncture may not help, but at least it will not harm.

Other conservative measures would be antinflammatory drugs (NSAIDs.. avoid if on anticoagulants or have a history of GI belleding, and always take with food) and heating pad to the lower back. neither of these will alter the underlying pathology but they'll alleviate the muscle spasm and tissue inflammation surrounding the spine and thus provide temporary relief.

[thaisabai]

Firstly I suggest you really confirm the cause of your symptoms. There are many causes of lower backpain and if it really is lower spinal lumber stenosis then it could be confirmed with a CT scan or MRI scan as these scans show if the nerves are actually being compressed from lumber spinal stenosis.

Does the pain reduce if you are learning forward? If so then it is a strong indicator that nerves are being compressed but relieved when leaning forward.

Because lower spinal lumber stenosis is a physical condition sometimes caused by arthritis or the wearing out of bones, I would seriously wonder if acupuncture would be a viable cure.

There is plenty of information on the Internet you can find with a simple google search so if I was you, I would do some research yourself and then compare all you read to what you already know about your condition then start asking the professionals.

thanks Thai Kiwi

yes, the BKK Pattaia hospital did an MRI and confirmed lower spinal lumber stenosis. Yes no pain when sitting and /or leaning forward. and I agree with you and was sceptic myself if acupuncture would really be the thing to do.

I am 65 and just a bit scared to do the operation. The doctor who explained the pictures to me showed me the operation pictures of another patient with similar problems who was recently operated. Saw a lot of metal and screws in this guy's back bones, a bit scary.

will further investigate on the internet and who knows, the pain may go away. it has already improved through my daily 2 hours swimming and Jacuzzi use.

but many thanks for the good advice.

[thaisabai]

Interesting article with some suggested treatments (avoiding surgery):

http://www.spinesurgeons.ac.uk/article.asp?article=32

Sounds like the sort of thing I would want to get a second opinion about, especially if you've only had it a few weeks.

thanks Darrel

excellent website

[Aatsi]

I get sciatica few years a go and lay about 4 months in bed and cant go even to shower without help then I find this

http://www.thaiacupu...e.com/index.php

and after 5 treatment (take time 2 week) I was ok and can walk and move normally again...

Edited August 21, 2011 by Aatsi

[Danlo]

There is a big sign on the left after third road going toward Sukhumvit on Pattaya Tai for an acupuncturist its the soi by the Cat office I think, .

Another alternative to acupuncture could be a four channel tens machine, you can use the same points and do it at home at your convenience. Worked for me after one year of pain so bad from L3 and L4 that I could not even walk three meters.

There's another place further up Pattaya Tai at the big crossroads ( Soi Bongkai,Khopai ??),it's an Englishman ( Nigel ? ) who was in the Army or something,he's seriously good and knows what he's doing.

I had a neck problem for ages and he sorted it,sorry I don't have his number.

Yes Nigel was the British weight lifting team Physio back along and is well talked about for his expertise in his field, don't know his number but if you go up South Pattaya road from say 2nd road past Friendship supermarket through the lights, continue on about 300 yards on from the traffic lights and on the left a small turning, has a 7/11 on the left corner, turn left there and almost immediately his shop is on the right.

[houseinbkk]

IMO acupuncture for lower back pain is a temporary fix, however id recommend Nigel for manipulating your back into position.

Getting id of slight chubbiness around the belly and getting a decent posture is whats needed for the long haul, 2 things ive yet to master

[Dag]

I would not take Bkk Hospitals word for 'requiring surgery' as gospel.....seek a 2nd and 3rd opinion....take your xrays with you to save a quid.

[eloigorri]

Does anyone know what has happened to Nigel Kelsy, the physio on Pattaya Tai 16?

He sorted me out very well last year, and I urgently need some treatment again, but his mobile is off, and his office boarded up.

I hope he is still practising somewhere.

Thanks. Ed

[cheeryble]

After a lifetime of bad back starting with morphine and a week in hospital in traction as an athlete at the age of 19, about ten years ago I had a really bad period of pain. I was literally rolling on the floor in spasm like someone in the movies.

The crunch came when I got numbness in the heel and outer thigh and, wait for it, penis.

(apparently the next step is incontinence).

At that stage even the NHS in the UK rushed me in for a scan.

Well it showed stenosis....considerable narrowing and bit of a "chicane" in the spinal chord, and, even in England, he offered me a laminectomy.

In a moment of clarity I said

"But how perfect is a normal 50 plus man's spine?"

He said "You have a point!"

I waited and even from that stage it gradually got better.

Now in Thailand 8 years it gripes occasionally but it's never been better.

Two muscles had stopped working, and one came back but I now have "missing" right calf muscle, it's gone forever, but it doesn't seem to matter at all. The important one in the foot which really did affect my walking badly came back. Numb heel persists, but who cares....

So I'm only an anecdote, but I have avoided an operation which really messes with the skeleto-muscular framework, and am pretty much just fine.

As for the "cures" given above, they may or may not have had something to do with the "treatment".

The human body tends to get better, but it sometimes takes quite a time.

Like a poster above I highly recommend diclofenac sodium (voltaren, voltarol) it so often breaks the vicious cycle of tension and spasm. My (medical) sister and I find it is almost miraculous, and is efficacious about 50% of the time. If it fails surgery is not necessarily automatically the next step.

Cheeryble

ps: yes the penis came back too!

Edited April 24, 2012 by cheeryble