Are Thais Taught Anything About The World Outside Of Thailand

[Richard4849]

There's no jobs where you'd prefer to live? How sad.

[Jingthing]

There's no jobs where you'd prefer to live? How sad.

Must be American.

[wintermute]

I guess that's a disagreement? If you think somewhere is better, why aren't you there? I think it's a valid question.

This wasn't a question about where I prefer to be or the reasons why i'm in Thailand but about which country was more developed and the reasons why. However, your off topic "get out my country" personal attack was pretty much what I expected at the tail end of any argument that has even vague criticisms about Thailand.

How about this..when the 350,000 immigrants from Thailand leave my country i'll leave yours.

Capiche?

Edited October 11, 2011 by wintermute

[StreetCowboy]

There's no jobs where you'd prefer to live? How sad.

Must be American.

I've never been offered a job in the States... Its a long time since I was offered a job beyond the Bosphorus or the Date Line, but I suppose that's the circles I move in. I've never been offered a job by a stranger, since the year after I graduated.

To be honest, I've never given much thought to which country I'd prefer to live, since I've always been happy enough wherever I've been. Middlesbrough might have worn thin, if I'd been there longer. I've sometimes chosen one job out of several options on that basis, and I've sometimes made my domestic arrangements to suit, and sometimes my choice of where to live has been financially constrained. Luckily, I don't need to rely on what I was taught at school to make those choices

SC

[Richard4849]

There was no personal attack, and no "get out of my country". I said simply you are free to move --- unless you're in jail or chained down.

As for the 350,000 Thais in America: I assume they're there because they like it there. If they don't like it there, or if they thought there was someplace they'd be happier, I'd ask them the same thing I ask you: why don't you move?

If you've made a bad life decision by coming to Thailand, it's certainly not too late to make it good.

If you consider that a "personal attack", then you have my sympathy.

[wintermute]

As for the 350,000 Thais in America: I assume they're there because they like it there. If they don't like it there, or if they thought there was someplace they'd be happier, I'd ask them the same thing I ask you: why don't you move?

I'd be happy to answer those philosophical questions and more if the topic was "Wintermute's life in Thailand and other musings" but that's not what the topic is about.

Nice try though.

[Richard4849]

As for the 350,000 Thais in America: I assume they're there because they like it there. If they don't like it there, or if they thought there was someplace they'd be happier, I'd ask them the same thing I ask you: why don't you move?

I'd be happy to answer those philosophical questions and more if the topic was "Wintermute's life in Thailand and other musings" but that's not what the topic is about.

Nice try though.

Typical end to the conversation when someone gets backed into a corner.

I hope you manage to enjoy your life here, while dreaming of being in Seoul.

[wintermute]

As for the 350,000 Thais in America: I assume they're there because they like it there. If they don't like it there, or if they thought there was someplace they'd be happier, I'd ask them the same thing I ask you: why don't you move?

I'd be happy to answer those philosophical questions and more if the topic was "Wintermute's life in Thailand and other musings" but that's not what the topic is about.

Nice try though.

Typical end to the conversation when someone gets backed into a corner.

I hope you manage to enjoy your life here, while dreaming of being in Seoul.

You didn't do anything except start up personal attacks by basically saying "get out of my country etc.." when you couldn't debate the topic anymore. Like I said, nice try.

[Richard4849]

Again, if you think that my statement "You are more than welcome to disagree, and even to move to Seoul if you think you would be happier there" was a personal attack, then again, I feel sorry for you. You must be "personally attacked" at least a hundred times a day. No wonder you are so unhappy.

[wintermute]

There's no jobs where you'd prefer to live? How sad.

Why are so many Thais living in working in America? Are there no jobs in Thailand?

How sad.

[Richard4849]

There's no jobs where you'd prefer to live? How sad.

Why are so many Thais living in working in America? Are there no jobs in Thailand?

How sad.

They are there because the like America, presumably.

And if they bitched and moaned and whinged as much about America as you and others do about Thailand, I'm sure the people there would ask them the same thing: why don't you move somewhere else?

At which point they would begin sobbing that someone "personally attacked them".

Jesus wept.

[wintermute]

They are there because the like America, presumably.

And if they bitched and moaned and whinged as much about America as you and others do about Thailand, I'm sure the people there would ask them the same thing: why don't you move somewhere else?

At which point they would begin sobbing that someone "personally attacked them".

Jesus wept.

A topic that is addressing issues about Thailand being debated in a rational civilized manner isn't "bitching and whinging." I suppose you interpret any kind of criticism as some grave offense. That's also not surprising.

[Richard4849]

They are there because the like America, presumably.

And if they bitched and moaned and whinged as much about America as you and others do about Thailand, I'm sure the people there would ask them the same thing: why don't you move somewhere else?

At which point they would begin sobbing that someone "personally attacked them".

Jesus wept.

A topic that is addressing issues about Thailand being debated in a rational civilized manner isn't "bitching and whinging." I suppose you interpret any kind of criticism as some grave offense. That's also not surprising.

Someone continually criticizes rationally -- or even irrationally -- the place where they choose to live, and I have the same question for them: why do you stay?

A question that some highly irrational people seem to take as a grave offense, rather than simply offering an answer.

Shouldn't be too difficult, but it seems to be.

Anyway, enjoy your life while continuing to waste it yearning for the other side of the fence.

[wintermute]

Someone continually criticizes rationally -- or even irrationally -- the place where they choose to live, and I have the same question for them: why do you stay?

A question that some highly irrational people seem to take as a grave offense, rather than simply offering an answer.

Shouldn't be too difficult, but it seems to be.

Anyway, enjoy your life while continuing to waste it yearning for the other side of the fence.

But this thread isn't about me or my life in Thailand, nor did I infer about what my personal preferences would be either way. Your oversensitive insecure reaction to a topic about Thai people is somewhat funny though.

Edited October 11, 2011 by Rimmer
Flame removed

[Richard4849]

When someone puts forth a theory that bewilders me, it naturally occurs for me to try to understand how they came to such a conclusion.

I'm a curious guy who always looks to increase his knowledge. It's called intellectual curiosity.

I ask questions, and usually people don't have a problem answering them.

Then again, some people refuse to answer them and instead resort to personal insults such as calling people "insecure".

Have a good day.

[ludditeman]

Richard aren't you a teacher with a TEFL?

Just wondered, as you are asking about other people's jobs, I sure you will be happy to answer.

[wintermute]

When someone puts forth a theory that bewilders me, it naturally occurs for me to try to understand how they came to such a conclusion.

I'm a curious guy who always looks to increase his knowledge. It's called intellectual curiosity.

I ask questions, and usually people don't have a problem answering them.

Then again, some people refuse to answer them and instead resort to personal insults such as calling people "insecure".

Have a good day.

Actually your remarks are the opposite of intellectual curiosity, when you get oversensitive and start implying that people should leave the country it means you're trying to silence them. I wasn't insulting you just merely stating a fact, you're insecure. Your kneejerk reactionary attitude is pretty standard stuff.

I bet i'll even know what you'll do next, run sobbing to the mods.

[wintermute]

Richard aren't you a teacher with a TEFL?

Just wondered, as you are asking about other people's jobs, I sure you will be happy to answer.

Yes Richard, please tell us about your life in TEFL and why you scan english speaking forums looking for foreigners criticizing Thailand? Are you happy doing this? Why do you care about what foreigners think?

[samran]

Now you are just being condescending.

I'm not, if there are sources available that give more information I will certainly point out that they exist. That's not being condescending at all.

On the other hand i've been reading your posts for awhile on this forum and you always come across as oversensitive and dogmatic whenever anything Thai is mentioned in even a slightly negative light. There's plenty of rubbish and trolling on this forum but it seems like you have a problem with _any_ objective criticism. That's a very Thai cultural characteristic to be honest.

To me that's just a marker for insecurity and usually when someone is that insecure it means they know what the reality is deep down and wish to repress the truth.

oversensitive and dogmatic?

I've happily admitted that corruption is rampant and if you have (really) read my other threads you'll see my view that the country is governed by a bunch morons (both sides).

And this makes me a Thai apologist?

Tough crowd you are.

[Richard4849]

Richard aren't you a teacher with a TEFL?

Just wondered, as you are asking about other people's jobs, I sure you will be happy to answer.

Yes Richard, please tell us about your life in TEFL and why you scan english speaking forums looking for foreigners criticizing Thailand? Are you happy doing this? Why do you care about what foreigners think?

I'm not and never have been a teacher -- with or without a TEFL. Is that your idea of an insult, to call someone a "teacher"?

[samran]

Richard aren't you a teacher with a TEFL?

Just wondered, as you are asking about other people's jobs, I sure you will be happy to answer.

Yes Richard, please tell us about your life in TEFL and why you scan english speaking forums looking for foreigners criticizing Thailand? Are you happy doing this? Why do you care about what foreigners think?

I'm not and never have been a teacher -- with or without a TEFL. Is that your idea of an insult, to call someone a "teacher"?

I think he was perhaps toying with 'back packer' or 'Pattaya resident', but went with teacher instead.

[Richard4849]

I wonder if third runner-up was "poo-poo head."

[ludditeman]

I wonder if third runner-up was "poo-poo head."

So while asking about others, you refuse to give out personal information.

Why not treat everyone else as you expect to be treated.

I think that's fair.

[Richard4849]

I wonder if third runner-up was "poo-poo head."

So while asking about others, you refuse to give out personal information.

Why not treat everyone else as you expect to be treated.

I think that's fair.

I didn't ask for anyone's personal information. I just asked why stay here if you don't like it?

I can answer for me: I like it here, that's why I stay.

Over to you.

[ludditeman]

I didn't ask for anyone's personal information. I just asked why stay here if you don't like it?

I can answer for me: I like it here, that's why I stay.

Over to you.

Fair enough, I like it here too, that's why I stay.

[onionluke]

I didn't ask for anyone's personal information. I just asked why stay here if you don't like it?

I can answer for me: I like it here, that's why I stay.

Over to you.

Fair enough, I like it here too, that's why I stay.

So it's goodnight from me and it's good night from him .

[xthAi76s]

Been all over the world and the Thais are absolutely the least curious people I've come across.

Another reason is that generally parents don't put much value on education; certainly not as much as Indians, Chinese, Koreans, Singaporeans, Vietnamese, Japanese etc.

Maybe another reason could be that questions are not encouraged due to the potential for someone to "lose face".

Maybe it's a combination of all three.

This has been my experience as well, but I wonder how much of this is a Thai cultural issue and how much is simply (or not so simply) a socioeconomic issue. As for the Thais who I know in my circle, many of whom I met through my wife's largely successful family here in Thailand and in the US, their friends and acquaintances and some who I met in school, they are all 1) very well educated, 2) have travelled extensively, 3) speak English fluently or very well, 4) place an extreme value on education -- their families often encouraging them very strongly to go for PhDs 5) are curious to know end, and perhaps most telling 6) almost uniformly hate being back here in Thailand and so many look for or have found ways out. The last part, for me is a psuedo-confirmation that their interest don't generally match with what they encounter most often when back here in Thailand.

I just wonder how much we are confusing between cultural values and opportunity or unfortunate socioeconomic circumstances that lead to complacency. I really don't know. But there are far more very poorly educated people here than in some of our home countries, but if we had a way to compare an average poorly educated Thai to a similarly poorly educated Brit or Aussie or 'American' (US), how much real difference would we measure? My suspicion is that it's not Thai culture per-se but other complex issues like the fairly obvious perpetual exploitation of the less fortunate here by the ruling class. You could say similar things about China, but look at how quickly China is shocking the world as it opens up. I think (and hope for the Thais and for us non-Thais living here) that the masses will get hip to these things and orchestrate a major progressive leap and move into the modern age, and it would be great to see in our lifetimes.

We should be careful when attributing (or suggesting) perceived shortcomings to culture. The world has tried to do that so many times throughout history and is proved wrong every time.

Btw, NOT SUGGESTING THAT THE POSTER QUOTED HERE HAS DONE ANY OF THESE THINGS!!

Really enjoy reading the responses here.

Edited October 12, 2011 by ThailandMan

[wintermute]

[

This has been my experience as well, but I wonder how much of this is a Thai cultural issue and how much is simply (or not so simply) a socioeconomic issue. As for the Thais who I know in my circle, many of whom I met through my wife's largely successful family here in Thailand and in the US, their friends and acquaintances and some who I met in school, they are all 1. very well educated, 2) have travelled extensively, 3) speak English fluently or very well, 4) place an extreme value on education in the typical East Asian cultural trait (Japan, China, Korea) -- their families often encouraging them very strongly to go for PhDs 5) are curious to know end, and perhaps most telling 6) almost uniformly hate being back here in Thailand and so many look for or have found ways out.

The people you are referring to are barely Thai at all. They are either born or raised overseas or spent a substantial amount of time overseas. They are acculturated to western cultural norms and education so of course they behave differently. Most of the people you mention above probably are dual citizens elsewhere as well.

One interesting thing that the majority of Thai people fail to realize is that a lot of their elite were born and raised abroad. They are multi-nationals and their life experiences are completely different from your average Thai. A lot of them live segregated lives away from the unwashed masses.

[samran]

[

This has been my experience as well, but I wonder how much of this is a Thai cultural issue and how much is simply (or not so simply) a socioeconomic issue. As for the Thais who I know in my circle, many of whom I met through my wife's largely successful family here in Thailand and in the US, their friends and acquaintances and some who I met in school, they are all 1. very well educated, 2) have travelled extensively, 3) speak English fluently or very well, 4) place an extreme value on education in the typical East Asian cultural trait (Japan, China, Korea) -- their families often encouraging them very strongly to go for PhDs 5) are curious to know end, and perhaps most telling 6) almost uniformly hate being back here in Thailand and so many look for or have found ways out.

The people you are referring to are barely Thai at all. They are either born or raised overseas or spent a substantial amount of time overseas. They are acculturated to western cultural norms and education so of course they behave differently. Most of the people you mention above probably are dual citizens elsewhere as well.

One interesting thing that the majority of Thai people fail to realize is that a lot of their elite were born and raised abroad. They are multi-nationals and their life experiences are completely different from your average Thai. A lot of them live segregated lives away from the unwashed masses.

I love the word 'elite'. It gets thrown around here quite a bit. I'd appreciate if you could define it for me in a Thai context.

I know a range of Thai people who fit Thailandman's description (except perhaps no.6). I'm sure they'd also LOVE, just LOVE your description of them being 'barely Thai at all'.

[wintermute]

I love the word 'elite'. It gets thrown around here quite a bit. I'd appreciate if you could define it for me in a Thai context.

Generation based wealthy families who have longstanding connections in commerce and industry. Their children are largely educated abroad and groomed for political or power roles in Thailand. Most of the politically active people in Thailand come from the plutocrat class aka. elite.

I know a range of Thai people who fit Thailandman's description (except perhaps no.6). I'm sure they'd also LOVE, just LOVE your description of them being 'barely Thai at all'.

It's possible to be a Thai-American, Thai-Brit, etc.. and not be part of the elite but their life experience is so drastically different from your average Thai that's foolish to call them a regular Thai person. Unless they have spent decades living in the country acculturating themselves back to Thai culture. I have also met a lot of people like this and they are very far from regular Thai people.