Landlords Gouging Flood Victims With High Rents: Thailand

[Orac]

well, I guess I have to mind my manners, it is people like you, could use more colourful language, that make human beings the scum of the world. Money over humanity is the cause of every problem in this world, the root cause is greed period, and you my friend, are the proof. Gouging is the topic of this and how people turn into scum sucking animals when the opportunity arises. People are homeless and in need of help, food and water are scarce, children are hungry and scared and heartless people who put their own greed above a human in need will get their dues. Yin and yang. You have done the yin and I hope with all my heart that yang comes to see you soon.

Hm many problems here I too have been asked " have you got a room for a month"

My fear is

they move in not only themselves but 5-6 other people into a studio room , dont want to pay a big deposit and then dissapear after the month leaving my room destroyed, what they want is a room at a 12 month price for 1 month, well it aint hapening in one of my units

You want to stay a month your'e gonna pay a 3 month price.

Bit harsh. Unless I am reading it wrong all Travelmann is saying is if ppl want to rent for one month he is only going to apply the discount he would give if it were 3 months rather than a 12 month discount. I am not sure what the figures are but I don't see anyone calling shop owners 'scum' if they are applying the same prices they did before the emergency and not discounting prices.

[johnefallis]

Hm many problems here I too have been asked " have you got a room for a month"

My fear is

they move in not only themselves but 5-6 other people into a studio room , dont want to pay a big deposit and then dissapear after the month leaving my room destroyed, what they want is a room at a 12 month price for 1 month, well it aint hapening in one of my units

You want to stay a month your'e gonna pay a 3 month price.

Its people like you that are making this situation so bad. And if you are a westerner then its DEFINITELY people like you that make the rest of us look bad.

Why could you not just do the same price and take a larger deposit???

People are in hard times here.

I would love to have encountered you on my travels to find a condo after my house flooded>

Why? Would you think whining about people not wanting to rent their rooms out for charity....1 month at 12 month lease rate......would make you right? Maybe charging by the day instead would seem more fair to you? Do the math on that....even a low low 500 THB rate per day would probably seem unreasonable in YOUR time of need?

Otherwise how would you solve the problem of turnover time and cleaning? How might you calculate how much is too much then?

[animatic]

Hm many problems here I too have been asked " have you got a room for a month"

My fear is

they move in not only themselves but 5-6 other people into a studio room , dont want to pay a big deposit and then dissapear after the month leaving my room destroyed, what they want is a room at a 12 month price for 1 month, well it aint hapening in one of my units

You want to stay a month your'e gonna pay a 3 month price.

I see part of your problem, but i think they are talking here about people already in a room that they have rented a long time. Now the landlord is forcing them to either pay higher cost or move out during a flooding.

In your case i do understand it but a higher deposit should cover it.

Make them sign a 'number of occupants agreement' subject to eviction if breeched. It's called a short term lease on PAPER. Other wise it is just the same as gouging.

'Oh, just in case they move in too many folks, I'll gouge them first.' Sorry this is bad logic and counter to good buddhist principles too.

'Supply and Demand Adjustments' during a disaster is not the same as more tenants naturally looking for rooms, or high season pricing. It is purely taking advantage of your fellow countrymen and others in their worst time of need and terror.

Do this during a disaster and it is Price Gouging, no question.

Edited October 29, 2011 by animatic

[johnefallis]

Hm many problems here I too have been asked " have you got a room for a month"

My fear is

they move in not only themselves but 5-6 other people into a studio room , dont want to pay a big deposit and then dissapear after the month leaving my room destroyed, what they want is a room at a 12 month price for 1 month, well it aint hapening in one of my units

You want to stay a month your'e gonna pay a 3 month price.

Pretty strange post.......

Okay, I'll bite....what's so "strange" about it?

[leo12345]

What many people on this topic are not understanding is that this is a once off event.

We are not talking about a regular month in month out basis.

I guess it's up to the individual, but those with such negative attitudes to people during a crisis such as this i would love to see you in such a situation how your attitude might change due to your circumstances

[GentlemanJim]

Hm many problems here I too have been asked " have you got a room for a month"

My fear is

they move in not only themselves but 5-6 other people into a studio room , dont want to pay a big deposit and then dissapear after the month leaving my room destroyed, what they want is a room at a 12 month price for 1 month, well it aint hapening in one of my units

You want to stay a month your'e gonna pay a 3 month price.

Its people like you that are making this situation so bad. And if you are a westerner then its DEFINITELY people like you that make the rest of us look bad.

Why could you not just do the same price and take a larger deposit???

People are in hard times here.

I would love to have encountered you on my travels to find a condo after my house flooded>

I agree entirely what an unpleasant person he is. Albeit I live on Koh Samui, I have several fully furnished westernised houses for rent and I am happy to let the two bedroom houses for 10K per month and the single bedroom houses for 7K per month for two months for flood victims if that helps anyone, plus a security deposit in case of damage. This is in some cases is a 50% reduction on the normal rent, as a goodwill gesture to those who are having an unpleasant time of it due to the floods. I would want proof that you are a flood victim either by producing your House Blue Book or a copy of your Lease Contract in Bangkok, showing your address. Hopefully ThaiVisa will allow those in need to contact me (they have my phone number) so that I can help in this small way, but could be quite critical to someone stranded in BKK. Sorry I am not nearer to BKK, but if you have the means to get here, we will do our best to take good care of you until the floods recede. I also hear this morning of a Family member who is buy a truck full of bottled water and is off to BKK to sell them for 150 baht each. They were surprised to hear how disgusted I am that they consider it good business to profit from those who are in desperate times - the nature of some members of the human race, I am sorry to say>

What kind of gesture of goodwill is that? These people want to pay 2500 a month? You think 10K a month is a gesture of Goodwill? You think a 50% reduction on already inflated rental prices is good? If your neighbour is buying water in bulk and driving all the way from Koh Samui to Bangkok to sell it, taking two or three days in the process, do you think he will make a vast profit? And if he does, then so what, he is getting off his arse to make money for him and his family. Just like you charge tourists over the odds to stay in your properties. Hell, I am a bit short of cash this month, can I come and stay for a 60% discount? Why not, have you no compassion man? If you want to help these people then why not let them stay in your properties for free? Now that would be a gesture of good will. There are a lot of sycophants on this thread.

[leo12345]

Hm many problems here I too have been asked " have you got a room for a month"

My fear is

they move in not only themselves but 5-6 other people into a studio room , dont want to pay a big deposit and then dissapear after the month leaving my room destroyed, what they want is a room at a 12 month price for 1 month, well it aint hapening in one of my units

You want to stay a month your'e gonna pay a 3 month price.

I see part of your problem, but i think they are talking here about people already in a room that they have rented a long time. Now the landlord is forcing them to either pay higher cost or move out during a flooding.

In your case i do understand it but a higher deposit should cover it.

Make them sign a 'number of occupants agreement' subject to eviction if breeched. It's called a short term lease on PAPER. Other wise it is just the same as gouging.

'Oh, just in case they move in too many folks, I'll gouge them first.' Sorry this is bad logic and counter to good buddhist principles too.

'Supply and Demand Adjustments' during a disaster is not the same as more tenants naturally looking for rooms, or high season pricing. It is purely taking advantage of your fellow countrymen and others in their worst time of need and terror.

Do this during a disaster and it is Price Gouging, no question.

EXACTLY

[farang000999]

There is no such thing as price gouging. The only reason this idea is created is because government officials like to buy votes. So they take the policies that are most popular with the most number of people and make them into rules. Then once they are in power they rob the country blind. yet people can't figure out that there is never a free lunch. Prices are set by demand. End of story. Attempts at price controls distort the market. Charity is nice but it is a decision to be left to the individual not the force of the populist government.

[GentlemanJim]

What many people on this topic are not understanding is that this is a once off event.

We are not talking about a regular month in month out basis.

I guess it's up to the individual, but those with such negative attitudes to people during a crisis such as this i would love to see you in such a situation how your attitude might change due to your circumstances

Open up your residence to as many strangers as you can. Pack them all in for free and then get back to us Leo.

[leo12345]

Hm many problems here I too have been asked " have you got a room for a month"

My fear is

they move in not only themselves but 5-6 other people into a studio room , dont want to pay a big deposit and then dissapear after the month leaving my room destroyed, what they want is a room at a 12 month price for 1 month, well it aint hapening in one of my units

You want to stay a month your'e gonna pay a 3 month price.

Its people like you that are making this situation so bad. And if you are a westerner then its DEFINITELY people like you that make the rest of us look bad.

Why could you not just do the same price and take a larger deposit???

People are in hard times here.

I would love to have encountered you on my travels to find a condo after my house flooded>

I agree entirely what an unpleasant person he is. Albeit I live on Koh Samui, I have several fully furnished westernised houses for rent and I am happy to let the two bedroom houses for 10K per month and the single bedroom houses for 7K per month for two months for flood victims if that helps anyone, plus a security deposit in case of damage. This is in some cases is a 50% reduction on the normal rent, as a goodwill gesture to those who are having an unpleasant time of it due to the floods. I would want proof that you are a flood victim either by producing your House Blue Book or a copy of your Lease Contract in Bangkok, showing your address. Hopefully ThaiVisa will allow those in need to contact me (they have my phone number) so that I can help in this small way, but could be quite critical to someone stranded in BKK. Sorry I am not nearer to BKK, but if you have the means to get here, we will do our best to take good care of you until the floods recede. I also hear this morning of a Family member who is buy a truck full of bottled water and is off to BKK to sell them for 150 baht each. They were surprised to hear how disgusted I am that they consider it good business to profit from those who are in desperate times - the nature of some members of the human race, I am sorry to say>

What kind of gesture of goodwill is that? These people want to pay 2500 a month? You think 10K a month is a gesture of Goodwill? You think a 50% reduction on already inflated rental prices is good? If your neighbour is buying water in bulk and driving all the way from Koh Samui to Bangkok to sell it, taking two or three days in the process, do you think he will make a vast profit? And if he does, then so what, he is getting off his arse to make money for him and his family. Just like you charge tourists over the odds to stay in your properties. Hell, I am a bit short of cash this month, can I come and stay for a 60% discount? Why not, have you no compassion man? If you want to help these people then why not let them stay in your properties for free? Now that would be a gesture of good will. There are a lot of sycophants on this thread.

Gentleman Jim

Do you know the price of real estate in Samui???

Obviously not.

[leo12345]

What many people on this topic are not understanding is that this is a once off event.

We are not talking about a regular month in month out basis.

I guess it's up to the individual, but those with such negative attitudes to people during a crisis such as this i would love to see you in such a situation how your attitude might change due to your circumstances

Open up your residence to as many strangers as you can. Pack them all in for free and then get back to us Leo.

You obviously have no clue Jim.

Never did i say my home was a temple.

I actually have left my home and am renting in Bangkok at a normal rate from an owner who has given me a 1 month contract instead of a 6 month contract.

You are a sour person.

[evanson]

The OP article fails to state whether the people who are being charged increased rates were current tennants at that property or new tennants to that property.

I read on one of the many threads yesterday that someone paying already 10k was now being 'asked' for 25k. There are many posts on gouging and it's a n extraordinarily shameful thing. Good for FOODLOVER. Are there any Thai equivalents? I'm certain there are. We just get to hear the bad stuff re the Thais on this forum.

[Scott]

One particularly nasty post has been removed. Please be civil and follow the forum rules.

[johnefallis]

Hm many problems here I too have been asked " have you got a room for a month"

My fear is

they move in not only themselves but 5-6 other people into a studio room , dont want to pay a big deposit and then dissapear after the month leaving my room destroyed, what they want is a room at a 12 month price for 1 month, well it aint hapening in one of my units

You want to stay a month your'e gonna pay a 3 month price.

I see part of your problem, but i think they are talking here about people already in a room that they hav

e rented a long time. Now the landlord is forcing them to either pay higher cost or move out during a flooding.

In your case i do understand it but a higher deposit should cover it.

Make them sign a 'number of occupants agreement' subject to eviction if breeched. It's called a short term lease on PAPER.

Other wise it is just the same as gouging.

'Oh, just in case they move in too many folks, I'll gouge them first.'

Sorry this is bad logic and counter to good buddhist principles too.

'Supply and Demand' during a disaster is not the same as

more tenants naturally looking for rooms, or high season pricing.

It is purely taking advantage of your fellow countrymen and others

in their worst time of need and terror.

Do this during a disaster and it is Price Gouging, no question.

REALLY?.......So what I hear you saying Animatic, is that a short term lease, which is what this guy is directly referring to, shouldn't cost more than a long term lease?

Because High, or low, season and they ALWAYS charge me short term rate of around three months minimum when I'm in Thailand. Still it's usually cheaper than a cheap hotel, even if I do just stay 1 month. I don't complain then, and I certainly wouldn't complain at a time of both need and high demand.

Now, if somebody is doing it to people that already have a long term lease, then the problem should easily be solved by the lease itself.

In the case if somebody unreasonably adjusts their rates too high above their actual expected increase in costs, which I would fully expect a flood would cause in a number of ways, then it might be gouging.

But that's not quite what this guy was talking about.

That being said,...I sure hope everyone has a dry place to stay during this difficult time.

My old place at Sukhumvit 50 and my friends there are now apparenntly mostly under water. My friend living in Chatuchak near Rangsit and Vipavadi is also fighting back the water from his house. So I do somewhat understand what is going on there, and really, really hope they will all be okay.

[elcent]

Hm many problems here I too have been asked " have you got a room for a month"

My fear is

they move in not only themselves but 5-6 other people into a studio room , dont want to pay a big deposit and then dissapear after the month leaving my room destroyed, what they want is a room at a 12 month price for 1 month, well it aint hapening in one of my units

You want to stay a month your'e gonna pay a 3 month price.

I see part of your problem, but i think they are talking here about people already in a room that they have rented a long time. Now the landlord is forcing them to either pay higher cost or move out during a flooding.

In your case i do understand it but a higher deposit should cover it.

Make them sign a 'number of occupants agreement' subject to eviction if breeched. It's called a short term lease on PAPER. Other wise it is just the same as gouging.

'Oh, just in case they move in too many folks, I'll gouge them first.' Sorry this is bad logic and counter to good buddhist principles too.

'Supply and Demand Adjustments' during a disaster is not the same as more tenants naturally looking for rooms, or high season pricing. It is purely taking advantage of your fellow countrymen and others in their worst time of need and terror.

Do this during a disaster and it is Price Gouging, no question.

I agree on that. It is common sense that has to rule.

The other question is, who are those landlords with so many empty rooms? There must be issues from before that. A well managed property has hardly any room available. I think they need a thorough check.

[johnefallis]

Wow, what a rant that was....I really have too little to do on this long train ride!

[Superskunk]

I rented a house in Prawet. We stay there since 3 years and I got flooding problems every year. Sometimes 30 cm in the whole house, sometimes just a little bit in the kitchen.

But I got an agreement with my landlord that I don't have to pay the rental fee if the house is flooded. Also she bought a pump for us to get rid of the water.

I think this is quite fair.

[wallswod]

So far, the department has punished 19 unscrupulous traders with fines totalling Bt43,400.

Average fine 2263baht or about $65 USD !!!!!!!!

Pay the fine and gouge I think is the motto.

Amazing Thai Style

[Lifer]

The OP article fails to state whether the people who are being charged increased rates were current tenants at that property or new tenants to that property.

Exactly. The article seems to indicate they are temporary new renters because of the floods, not current or new long term renters. If based on a short temporary period, higher rent can be expected. Happens every where, not just in Thailand.

In our housing area, owners move out and rent their places to renters who destroy property and live like slum dwellers because it is not their place. Fortunately most of the residence own and live in their own homes.

[elcent]

So far, the department has punished 19 unscrupulous traders with fines totalling Bt43,400.

Average fine 2263baht or about $65 USD !!!!!!!!

Pay the fine and gouge I think is the motto.

Amazing Thai Style

that's probably just the beginning when the tax-men come it will look different.

[GentlemanJim]

What many people on this topic are not understanding is that this is a once off event.

We are not talking about a regular month in month out basis.

I guess it's up to the individual, but those with such negative attitudes to people during a crisis such as this i would love to see you in such a situation how your attitude might change due to your circumstances

Open up your residence to as many strangers as you can. Pack them all in for free and then get back to us Leo.

You obviously have no clue Jim.

Never did i say my home was a temple.

I actually have left my home and am renting in Bangkok at a normal rate from an owner who has given me a 1 month contract instead of a 6 month contract.

You are a sour person.

By the way, yes I know the price of property on Samui, is it higher than Bangkok? ( If so why is that? It wouldnt be because of market forces would it. Supply and demand. How unfair a property on Samui costs more than where I live, it's scandalous and shouldn't be allowed ) What has that got to do with it. You said this is a one off occasion not me, you are the one saying everyone should keep their prices low. I am not sour at all, I am a realist. When you can offer out your charity then you can ask others to do the same.

[Scrubber]

This is not your usual supply & demand situation. This is people taking advantage of other people's misfortune. In times like these, people's true colours are clearly seen.

[johnefallis]

Glad to see some common sense being spoken....Gentlemanjim, Farang0000....etc.

I thought for a moment there you were all going to go down in flames!

What was being described as an increased price for short term stays is a business standard the world over...

[elcent]

Glad to see some common sense being spoken....Gentlemanjim, Farang0000....etc.

I thought for a moment there you were all going to go down in flames!

What was being described as an increased price for short term stays is a business standard the world over...

... not in emergencies!!!

There are families with children in desperate situations. Here, some try to paint a picture as if all are of the same evil bread. Or do they just give a self description?

Edited October 29, 2011 by elcent

[soomak]

i think they call this supply and demand.

Calling taking unscrupulous advantage of people's needs, when they are desperate, "supply and demand", is one way to justify cold hearted greed.

Exactly.

Nobody said short term rents shouldn't be more expensive.

They are complaining that prices were raised sharply now, when people are losing their homes and need a place to stay.

The (stupid) American way calls it supply and demand.

Normal people call it taking advantage of desperate people.

Not difficult to understand I think...

[drdoom6996]

Hm many problems here I too have been asked " have you got a room for a month"

My fear is

they move in not only themselves but 5-6 other people into a studio room , dont want to pay a big deposit and then dissapear after the month leaving my room destroyed, what they want is a room at a 12 month price for 1 month, well it aint hapening in one of my units

You want to stay a month your'e gonna pay a 3 month price.

Pretty strange post.......

Yeah, strange dude.

[khaowong1]

So Thais are complaining they are being "Faranged" wonder if the irony of someone charging more because of who you or the situation sinks in on them?

I'm sure the irony went right over their heads. :-)

[farang000999]

So let's say you have ten rooms that normally cost 5k baht and you have 100 people outside who want to rent them. I guess the "fair" thing to do is to draw straws? Why is that more "fair" than auctioning the rooms off to the highest bidders?

[tfc]

Sounds like high season at any hotel.

Or low season!

[johnefallis]

well, I guess I have to mind my manners, it is people like you, could use more colourful language, that make human beings the scum of the world. Money over humanity is the cause of every problem in this world, the root cause is greed period, and you my friend, are the proof. Gouging is the topic of this and how people turn into scum sucking animals when the opportunity arises. People are homeless and in need of help, food and water are scarce, children are hungry and scared and heartless people who put their own greed above a human in need will get their dues. Yin and yang. You have done the yin and I hope with all my heart that yang comes to see you soon.

Hm many problems here I too have been asked " have you got a room for a month"

My fear is

they move in not only themselves but 5-6 other people into a studio room , dont want to pay a big deposit and then dissapear after the month leaving my room destroyed, what they want is a room at a 12 month price for 1 month, well it aint hapening in one of my units

You want to stay a month your'e gonna pay a 3 month price.

REALLY? Another person that is willing to invest and work for free, even in the worst of conditions?

Maybe the property owners should be guaranteed their property won't sustain any damage, their rents will be paid for the months they may be empty because of the flood itself once it subsides, and all while they may be at risk themselves just being around still to offer services???

Wow. Really?

Why don't you and the government just provide them all, free, or low priced housing with complete disregard for prudent business practice?

Maybe with higher taxes? Then clean up and repair the property owners damages at the same time? At your expense, of course.

You know what I really hate, is when I go to the movies, or a sporting event, or similar, and have to pay multiple times normal price for snacks and drinks,....and that's not even during a time of increased risk or expense, it's every day!

Maybe they can earn a profit with your sentiments instead?

If you don't want it, don't freakin buy it!