Differences Between Bkk And Singapore

[Ducati]

We will be moving to BKK from SG next year (kids 10, 8, 6), brits living in SG for 3 years. Will be a company move, I work for a Bank, my wife helps out at the school but is mainly a full time mum.

We do love the lifestyle in SG, and I guess BKK is a little more 'gritty', so just wanted to hear from families who have moved to BKK. What are the pros and cons (enough of the traffic already!) and what are the main differences to expect?

ANY thoughts or observations welcome!

[EVO]

Ive never lived in Sing, but visit very regularly and it is almost a second home as my wife is Singaporean (living here in BKK).

The main difference that you got to get used to is that things just dont happen as they should here like they do in Singapore. Down in Sg, you pretty much know how things are gonna go from the moment you wake up until the moment you go to sleep. No such thing happening here. [Going back to traffic again] You might end up arriving home 3 hours later than usual. You might well end up in a motor vehicle scrape (big accidents rare in BKK as traffic so slow). All kinds of unexpected.

Then there are the things that you overlook. These are the things not expected, but generally the most important in day to day life. Prime example is when you go shopping. In Sg you can ask the sales assistant what is the difference between this toothbrush for 100 THB and that toothbrush for 150 THB. In Sg they may well explain the differences to you , which will allow you to make an educated decision. In Thailand you will recieve a blank look and a comment of, "40 baht!".

In Sg you can use your brain to get things done on your own. In Thailand, you must use others to get things done for you.

Hope this gives you some kind of idea what to expect. Its a jungle out there, but its kinda fun sometimes.

Regards

[OldAsiaHand]

The prior poster pretty much has it right. You're moving from the first world to the third. Thais can be quite warm, but in matters of daily life they are generally both dumb and slow. In spite of that, or perhaps because of it, life in the third world can indeed occasionally be fun; but more often it is both irritating and frustrating. Be prepared for that or you will be bery unhappy here.

[skylar]

Singapore is highly regulated in most aspects of everyday life. In Thailand, you muddle your way through each day. For example, people in SG line up for the bus, whereas in Thailand you will need to squeeze your way on.

[thaihome]

Best description I have heard is "Singapore is Asia for beginners". Was certainly true for me as my first year in Asia was in Singapore.

TH

[fxm88]

We do love the lifestyle in SG, and I guess BKK is a little more 'gritty', so just wanted to hear from families who have moved to BKK. What are the pros and cons (enough of the traffic already!) and what are the main differences to expect?

It sounds as though you've never been to BKK. I suggest you come visit, alone or with the family, a couple of times prior to the move.

Compared to Singapore BKK

1) is filthy, smells bad, and everything is in varying stages of disrepair;

2) has very few parks and very little green space, so fewer places for the kids to play;

3) is very cheap, but also lacking in many of the cultural offerings of richer countries;

4) has a lot fewer Chinese people; and

5) no one can speak english.

[Ducati]

Yep, we have travelled to BKK many times on business and leisure. So am aware of the sights, smells and sounds.

More interested in what its like for the family in BKK. ie raising kids?

Sounds quite negative from the previous posts. I'm sure there must be positive aspects. We have some friends here who lived with kids in BKK before moving to SG and raved about it.

[think_too_mut]

2) has very few parks and very little green space, so fewer places for the kids to play;

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Singapore has been called a "parks" or "garden" city.

Bangkok has 1 sqm of parks per head.

Paris has 20sqm. Not sure about Singapore, should be that or more.

[fxm88]

Sounds quite negative from the previous posts.  I'm sure there must be positive aspects. We have some friends here who lived with kids in BKK before moving to SG and raved about it.

Don't get me wrong, I love Thailand, it's just not very family friendly, not for western familes anyway. Your kids are yet too young but when they get to be "that age" one of biggest positives might be that there's none of this in Thailand.

[think_too_mut]

My take: don't step down from Singapore into Thailand.

Do you have any say or you might be just a pawn companies shuffle around as they please?

Personally, I would leave Tokyo (where I am a local hire) for Singapore any day.

But would not do that for a Bangkok position.

[phuketsiam]

My biggest worry would be the kids, their education (is the company helping with school fee's) and the polution, you can't escape the polution in BKK

[Ducati]

The company will pay for school fees.

If we lived on the outskirts, accepting a long daily commute, is the pollution any better there?

[thaihome]

Yep, we have travelled to BKK many times on business and leisure. So am aware of the sights, smells and sounds.

More interested in what its like for the family in BKK. ie raising kids?

Sounds quite negative from the previous posts.  I'm sure there must be positive aspects. We have some friends here who lived with kids in BKK before moving to SG and raved about it.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I think you are getting worried about nothing. Sounds like you are on a full blown expat package, something that most people on this forum don’t have much experience with which explains the negativity. I have 6 colleagues in my office with school age kids, average time here is probably 5 years and they all love it. I have l lived in 4 different Asian countries, for people like us; the lifestyle is pretty much the same, just different place.

You will live in a nice place, your kids will go to a really good school, you will have a car and driver, so the problems with public buses that you are used to in Singapore won't be an issue.

Relax.

TH.

[OldAsiaHand]

Yep, we have travelled to BKK many times on business and leisure. So am aware of the sights, smells and sounds.

More interested in what its like for the family in BKK. ie raising kids?

Sounds quite negative from the previous posts.  I'm sure there must be positive aspects. We have some friends here who lived with kids in BKK before moving to SG and raved about it.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

...I have 6 colleagues in my office with school age kids, average time here is probably 5 years and they all love it...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I have quite a different point of view on that. We have school-aged children and think this is unquestionably one of the worst cities in the world in which to raise children. There's simply nothing for children to do and no place for them to go. Worse, Thailand is a place that has little interest in or respect for education. If you're thinking of your children, stay in Singapore.

[gwmss15]

id give anything to live and work in singapore maybe someone knows how to get a job there i have been trying for years to get in

[phuketsiam]

The company will pay for school fees.

If we lived on the outskirts, accepting a long daily commute, is the pollution any better there?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yeah the polution is better futher away from congested areas, but they are all over, you will have to live near your kids school, or you are subjecting them to a long daily commute, allow well over an hour each way. If the companies paying then money is not an issue, but education standard is, but i don't have personal experience of that. My general feeling is, Thailand is great for young single people and retired people, but not so good for families or career people. You might consider leaving the family in Singapore and flying home every weekend, if you're working longs hours, stuck in traffic etc then you won't see much less of the wife and kids but when you do you will be in a cleaner healthier environment, and they will have a higher quality of life. The missus might not be so keen tho, if she knows the temptations on offer

[socalbro]

The air quality may be better on the edge of town, however it would not suprise me if the ground water is dioxins, mercury and the like. Much like in LA before anyone else knew any better the newly forming housing communities were built on top of toxic waste sights resulting in horrible health problems for all living in the area. (See: Erin Brokavich -True story)

Where the people of Singapore and their govt. would be fully aware of the results of dumping waste on site has for the workers and future land owners, I would have to say that even if company management knew of the hazards it wouldn't be enough to convince them to spend one extra Baht to properly dispose of their waste. And unlike Singapore if a govt. health official were responsible for enforcing proper waste disposal they would gladly look the other way for a few thousand Baht,

My girlfriends aunt lives in one of the nice new community developments in Bangakapi (BKK suburb), but walking past a garment company 100 meters from the entry gates I could see rainbow colored water from who knows what draining into the nearby klong (canal).

I would doubt any development managers must disclose what occupied the land before, they may not know ar not tell you even if they did and you asked them - playing stupid is an artform here - But if I were you I'd do a little reaserch into the area I was moving into for the kids sake. Just take a look at the festering klongs around BKK if you need an example.

Another main difference is that if you are ever pulled over by the police in traffic they don't want to write you a ticket - about 200 Baht palmed over to them is what they are after before letting you go. I keep 200 in the ashtrey just for that purpose alone.

Otherwise it can be a very exciting lively and enjoyable place to live.

Welcome and good luck!

[fxm88]

I have 6 colleagues in my office with school age kids, average time here is probably 5 years and they all love it.

Please do us all a favor: Ask your colleagues what it is, from their kids perspective, that's great about BKK and post their responses here. Thanks in Advance!

[singa-traz]

Don't worry, your family should be able to happily adapt to Bangkok, and soon you will forget the little red dot on the map and the fake beach of Sentosa.

I lived 7 years in Singapore, and the only things I missed are:

- the airport

- a park near my home for roller blading

- and the hainese chicken rice.

- oh, and the pepper crab ...

The rest is history.

True, in Thailand, you always have to expect the unexpected ... but, isn't it part of the fun?

It will be a different experience, whether you will like it or not, actually depends a lot on you.

The suggestion made to keep your kids and wife in Singapore must be a joke.

As for the pollution ... when I first move to Singapore ... I was welcome with the Haze, and a PSI index sticked on the TV for a few weeks

[jingjingna]

I have to agree with OldAsiaHand...and I am no Old Hand Of Asia!

[skylar]

I think you are getting worried about nothing.  Sounds like you are on a full blown expat package, something that most people on this forum don’t have much experience with which explains the negativity.  I have 6 colleagues in my office with school age kids, average time here is probably 5 years and they all love it. I have l lived in 4 different Asian countries, for people like us; the lifestyle is pretty much the same, just different place.

You will live in a nice place, your kids will go to a really good school, you will have a car and driver, so the problems with public buses that you are used to in Singapore won't be an issue.

Relax.

TH.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Thank you. My sister and I lived in Bangkok when we were young. We went to a (proper) international school, which got above average results out of pretty average people. All children in Bangkok are aware from a young age (maybe 5 onwards?) about the shadier side of society, but it was not our concern. And the bus thing was a mild analogy as to the disorganisation that exists. But that's the beauty of it. It was in no way meant to be negative. Singapore is orderly to the point of sanitisation. Bangkok makes people feel alive.

I think some people have forgotten here that kids like to play. This takes up a lot of their time, as does homework, but of course that is up to the individual. And there's heaps of activity programs at any decent international school. Most days, my sister and I biked around the sois, swam, rollerbladed, went ice skating, shopping, to Magiclands, to Leo Land, the movies and various festivals. In the company of other people our age. And I would come back again and have no doubts about bringing up children here. It's what you (and they) and your wife make of it.

[thaihome]

Please do us all a favor: Ask your colleagues what it is, from their kids perspective, that's great about BKK and post their responses here. Thanks in Advance!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Have you ever been to Nichada Thani and had any involvement in the world of the MNC expats?

The kids I am familiar with have many extracurricular activities, they play baseball, basketball, volley ball, go on trips around Thailand every couple of months, get to go see grandparents for 2 months every summer break (and are somewhat celebrities to their cousins), have been to many other Asian countries, are receiving a first class education (one colleague has 2 sons in Ivy league schools, graduates of ISB), have freedom to roam around a large gated community, the list goes on and on. Do the kids love it? As with any kid, it depends on the day and what happened.

It certainly is not paradise, and ISB certainly has problems, mostly a drug problem in the older kids they can’t seem to completely eradicate, but overall, an assignment in Bangkok is not too bad. There are certainly worse places.

TH

[lopburi3]

I have been waiting for someone to mention the real down side to Bangkok for someone with a wife but so far have only seen it addressed as "great from the single young man and retired" or some such statement (which I am in agreement with).

The down side is the potential for divorce. And it is sky high. Even if the wife can come to terms with the eye candy available to the spouse the tendency is too be suspect and try to confine activities and that leads to a rapid breakdown of trust and mutual support. As the wife is unlikely to be able to find a fulfilling job this festers into open conflict more often that most would like to admit. Marriage is not easy anywhere but in Bangkok it is strained to an extreme.

Of course the above is a generalization; but something to take into consideration.

[thaihome]

I have been waiting for someone to mention the real down side to Bangkok for someone with a wife but so far have only seen it addressed as "great from the single young man and retired" or some such statement (which I am in agreement with).

The down side is the potential for divorce.  And it is sky high.  Even if the wife can come to terms with the eye candy available to the spouse the tendency is too be suspect and try to confine activities and that leads to a rapid breakdown of trust and mutual support.  As the wife is unlikely to be able to find a fulfilling job this festers into open conflict more often that most would like to admit.  Marriage is not easy anywhere but in Bangkok it is strained to an extreme.

Of course the above is a generalization; but something to take into consideration.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I tend to agree with your generalization, but disagree that Bangkok is unique in or even worse (or easier) then any other major city in Asia. If a married man has any desire to stray, Asia is a place that will make it almost impossible to resist. The OP has lived in Singapore for some time; I think he is probably well familiar with temptations.

TH

[snoophound]

Leave the family in Sing if the moneys the same

Get an apt in bkk and mon-fri and fly back and spend weekends with the kids

We do love the lifestyle in SG, and I guess BKK is a little more 'gritty', so just wanted to hear from families who have moved to BKK. What are the pros and cons (enough of the traffic already!) and what are the main differences to expect?

It sounds as though you've never been to BKK. I suggest you come visit, alone or with the family, a couple of times prior to the move.

Compared to Singapore BKK

1) is filthy, smells bad, and everything is in varying stages of disrepair;

2) has very few parks and very little green space, so fewer places for the kids to play;

3) is very cheap, but also lacking in many of the cultural offerings of richer countries;

4) has a lot fewer Chinese people; and

5) no one can speak english.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

[lopburi3]

I tend to agree with your generalization, but disagree that Bangkok is unique in or even worse (or easier) then any other major city in Asia. If a married man has any desire to stray, Asia is a place that will make it almost impossible to resist. The OP has lived in Singapore for some time; I think he is probably well familiar with temptations.

TH

But in Thailand it is socially acceptable and often the norm to have a younger 2nd wife. Often the problem comes with the wife finding out the social climate rather than the husband actually being taken by temptation.

[AlexLah]

I have lived in Singapore for two years and now staying in Thailand for 1 year.

This week I went back to Singapore and I felt so much better.

It is clean, anything you have to arrange is convenient (banking, Internet and so on). Everebody speaks English, there are good schools.

Singapore is just a better place to live compared to Thailand.

KR,

Alex

[sierra01]

Hello again Alex!

I've only been to Singapore once, a couple of years ago, and found it very different to LOS, more like living in Farang land. I don't know what it's like to live there but from what I saw I agree with you Alex.

[thaihome]

But in Thailand it is socially acceptable and often the norm to have a younger 2nd wife.  Often the problem comes with the wife finding out the social climate rather than the husband actually being taken by temptation.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Well, the Chinese pretty much invented the minor wife thing (and it is alive and well in HK, Singapore and PRC), it is legal for a Muslim man in Malaysia to have 3 wives (if he treats them equal), and besides, I have seen little tolerance of minor wives in expat circles here.

Divorce is a big problem for expats that bring the families along, but it is not confined to Thailand (due to some high level of availability or social tolerance). Usually problems exist long before the overseas assignment. As matter of fact, the biggest scandals in my company actually happened in China and Singapore.

I am not arguing that Thailand is the same as Singapore (that is obvious), but I will argue that it is so bad for families that you should consider not bringing the family to Bangkok. Again, I qualify that I am speaking for expats on full-blown packages and not "local" expats.

TH

[Digger]

I have often wondered about the merits or otherwise of when being posted to Bangkok actually living somewhere around Burapha golf club on the way to Pattaya. My theory being that the kids are 2 minutes from their school (the American school) or 15 minutes from British school (Regents) - all the residents are expats including predom expat wifes, but the biggest difference is the quality of life - lots of activities for the kids, horseriding, swimming, football, ballet, etc etc all easily accessible and little or no traffic + a far bigger house for the expat housing housing allowance. Downside of course is the commute to BKK, but it might a price worth paying, depending upon where the company is based. A guy I know raises his family outside Pattaya and he works in BKK - Mon thru Thur and works from home on Friday and drives up on Monday morning - leaves home at 6am and in his office before 8am. If you have a driver, could be doable, but a pain if you constantly have to drive yourself.

Wierd as it may sound, it takes as long to drive from Pattaya up to BKK centre as from Sukhumvit to Silom on some days. Many many expats families on the Eastern Seaboard living completely westernised lifestyles and depending upon how a full expat package can be broken down, you could easily afford a 5 bedroom house with large land and private pool + a one bedroom apt in the CBD in BKK for less than the cost of a decent house in BKK.