Red Shirt Leader Arisman Released On 6 Million Baht Bail

[OzMick]

The accused met the conditions and requirements for bail. Thailand like many other countries grants bails to those that are accused of serious crimes. He is not accused of murder, nor is there evidence that he poses a clear and imminent threat to society at large. The likelihood the gentleman will engage in any criminal acts is nil. His supporters argue that he would not have received a fair trial had he remained and that is why he fled. His position will also be that he was engaged in legitimate protest against a defacto military dictatorship. (This doesn't mean that I agree with, or support such arguments, but those are what they are.)

I think he is in for a bit of a shock. If the evidence is there, he is going to be put in prison. It will suit the current government's needs to have him out of the way, so it is unlikely he is going to get much real support from the PTP administration. I see nothing wrong with the granting if bail particularly since he is not a threat to public security and did not engage in the physical acts referenced in other entries of this thread. It is up to the courts to judge the case based upon the evidence, evidence which the previous government should have gathered and if the charges are true, then the evidence will be overwhelming. The prosecution team is a hold over from the previous administration and know the case. I suggest that antsy foreigners relax and let the Thai justice system work its way through the case.

".........it is unlikely he is going to get much real support from the PTP administration. I see nothing wrong..........."

While Arisman was a fugitive, PTP gave his wife a party list MP position, which she uses to support his bail application. I would consider this REAL support, unless you could supply me with some reason, other than her husband's terrorism activities, for her appointment.

That you see nothing wrong is indicative of your self-imposed moral blindfold.

[hanuman1]

Your final question is rather loaded. Should I not be posting because I don't feel passionately enough about the subject matter at hand? Is that what internet forums are for? Diatribes and eulogies? You can't mean that, surely.

Judging by the experiences of some of the most vociferous anti-gov/red/PTP posters on this forum, I feel kind of lucky that I haven't been induced into feeling so passionately about these issues.

It just happens to be a personal belief of mine that to understand something as fully as possible, both sides of the coin need to be looked into - or at least accepted - in a way which sometimes can fly in the face of stereotypes and prevailing moods. It can lead to being seen as detached, uncaring, indecisive and even (in cauldrons like TVF) partizan, but one thing I assure you of is that it's not easy. I'm not actually that good at it myself, but it's the kind of thing you try to remind yourself to aim at whenever possible.

Personally, I think it's easier to just get wound up in a narrow-minded viewpoint. But then again, these days most people think they've got a harder life than the next man

You've posted in many different threads regarding this and that. Yet you're telling us we should just sit back and more or less mind our own business. It's pretty simple then. If you truly feel that way, why would you bother to post here. You saying your 1000+ posts are all 'let's all sit back and relax and let things run its course'? I doubt it.

And whether someone is partisan or not is doesn't matter because I really don't see how any reasonable person would see it as 'narrow minded' when people are disgusted by the fact that a terrorist is out on the streets on bail even after he fled for more then a year.

In the end, maybe the surprising answer is that you and I actually post for similar reasons. To guide the general discourse in a direction or manner in which we'd like it to go. It's just that you'd prefer it to go one way and I another. Please notice, I didn't say THE other, but AN other, as there are a thousand different courses and tones a discussion can take.

To address the current issue about which you feel angry, I would be the first to agree with you that terrorists belong in jail. And yet, this apparent - but as yet untested by a court of law - 'terrorist' is given bail. How can this be? You must be pretty flummoxed. It's never satisfying to feel flummoxed. It means there's a reason, but we don't know what it is. It's not that we don't understand the reason, but rather that we haven't even had the chance to understand it because there's been no explanation that makes any sense to us. More frustration. Something's missing here, otherwise we'd understand and not feel so surprised and disappointed. With me so far?

So what's missing? In my opinion it is something that can only come from an intimate, LONG term relationship with Thai culture. A level of immersion in Thai society so deep that probably not many of us would even want to experience it even if it were offered to us tomorrow.

To understand what makes others tick is to destroy a bit of ourselves. Is the reward worth the sacrifice? The answer is a personal choice, which I alluded to a few posts ago.

Letting things run their course - in the context of Thai politics - is all we can do, as you more or less admitted in your previous post. Letting things run their course closer to home is of course far dodgier advice. One cannot generalize about when it is good to let things run their course and when to intervene. i would suggest that 'intervention' to effect Thai politics in the form you suggest - diatribe by TV internet forum - is not far from being futile.

By the way, I'm not some kind of religious nutter. I drink too much and my efforts at quitting smoking are quite funny. I surreptitiously eye good looking women too much in the company of my wife and I probably should have made more of an effort at Christmas. Basically, I have some regard for the truth, just as I'm sure you do.

Edited December 28, 2011 by hanuman1

[webfact]

POLITICS

Arisman gets bail but freedom is shortlived

THE NATION

Soon after release, red leader detained by police in libel case

Red-shirt leader Arisman Pongruangrong was finally released on Bt6 million bail yesterday from Bangkok Remand Prison where he had been held in a case connected to last year's political unrest.

But his freedom was brief as police immediately detained him in another case. He was taken to Prachacheun police station to face libel proceedings brought by a Democrat MP.

At 5.45pm yesterday, Arisman stepped out of the prison, prostrated himself at the feet of his parents and held his daughter while showing the "I Love You" sign to 100 waiting supporters.

He had a brief chat with red-shirt leaders Weng Tojirakarn and Waipoj Apornrat while a vehicle played on loudspeakers an interview he gave on the day he turned himself in.

Some supporters followed Arisman to Prachacheun police station where the police planned to detain him for libel against Democrat MP Sirichok Sopha.

Earlier, the Court of Appeals yesterday overturned a lower court's bail review and granted the temporary release of Arisman.

Arisman walked out of his remand cell hoping to celebrate the holiday season with his family pending trial on charges related to terrorism in connection with last year's political disturbances.

"The defendant would have been well aware of the legal consequences before deciding to report himself to face charges, therefore there is no cause to suspect he would flee," the high court said in its appellate decision.

The lower court ruled twice to reject Arisman's bail application on grounds of flight risk as he had fled following the May 19, 2010, dispersal of red-shirt rallies at Ratchaprasong.

The defence posted the initial bail but failed to secure Arisman's release on December 7 before petitioning for the appellate review on Monday.

The high court set bail at Bt6 million and prescribed three conditions - a ban on travelling abroad before applying for an advanced judicial permit, a court order against involvement in any disturbances and another order not to tamper with evidence.

Defence lawyer Suchaiwuth Chaosuankluay said he argued for bail based on Arisman's earlier surrender to Pattaya authorities to face charges relating to the disruption of the Asean Summit in 2009.

The Pattaya Provincial Court granted bail after the defence argued that Arisman did not want to evade the law but fled for fear of his life in the face of assassination threats against the red shirts, Suchaiwuth said.

Arisman's wife and Pheu Thai MP Rapeephan said earlier that she viewed the bail for her husband as a New Year's gift granted by the high court to their family.

"This is an invaluable gift that everyone in the family could be together to celebrate the New Year," she said.

She said her husband would fight to the full extent of the law to clear his name. She also said she was taken by surprise after their nine-year-old son asked whether his father would face punishment by execution. "I am very disturbed that my child should have come up with such question because he heard his friends speculating about it," she said.

-- The Nation 2011-12-29

[webfact]

Thailand 'Red Shirt' leader re-arrested after bail

BANGKOK, December 29, 2011 (AFP) - A top "Red Shirt" leader accused of terrorism over his role in last year's opposition rallies was on Wednesday freed on bail, only to be immediately re-arrested on defamation charges, his lawyer said.

Arisman Pongruangrong, who narrowly avoided capture by police commandos in April 2010 by climbing out of the third-floor window of a Bangkok hotel, surrendered to authorities in early December after nearly 20 months on the run.

His first two bail requests were rejected but the appeal court in Bangkok agreed to release Arisman upon posting bail of six million baht ($190,000).

"The court said he showed his intention to return to fight terrorism charges," his lawyer Suchaiwut Chaosuanklauy told AFP, adding that he is banned from travelling abroad.

But soon after Arisman walked free on Wednesday evening, he was arrested again over charges related to slandering a member of the main opposition Democrat Party.

Arisman's lawyer said he would request bail for his client on Thursday.

Arisman is believed to have hidden in neighbouring Cambodia after fleeing the capital in the wake of the bungled attempt to arrest him last year in connection with mass anti-government protests that turned deadly.

He also faces charges related to the Red Shirts' storming of an Asian summit in the Thai resort city of Pattaya in 2009, forcing its cancellation as leaders were evacuated.

Also on Wednesday, another Red Shirt leader was sentenced to two years and eight months in jail for leading an attack by a group of Reds on rival royalist "Yellow Shirt" protesters in 2008 in the northeastern province of Udon Thani.

Kwanchai Praipana, who also faces terrorism charges over his role in the protests last year, was freed on bail ahead of his appeal.

More than 90 people, mostly civilians, were killed and nearly 1,900 were wounded during the two months of rallies last year, which drew about 100,000 Red Shirts, many of whom support fugitive former premier Thaksin Shinawatra.

The controversial ex-leader's sister Yingluck Shinawatra is now prime minister after a resounding election victory by his party earlier this year.

-- (c) Copyright AFP 2011-12-29

[OzMick]

Slowly but surely, the chickens are coming home to roost. On second thought, laying out B6mil to go through a revolving door and end up where you started sounds more like a turkey.

3 cheers for the grinch that stole the "New Year's gift granted by the high court to their family."

[TAWP]

If that was my wife I might spend 1.5 year in Cambodia too.

[gl555]

Your final question is rather loaded. Should I not be posting because I don't feel passionately enough about the subject matter at hand? Is that what internet forums are for? Diatribes and eulogies? You can't mean that, surely.

Judging by the experiences of some of the most vociferous anti-gov/red/PTP posters on this forum, I feel kind of lucky that I haven't been induced into feeling so passionately about these issues.

It just happens to be a personal belief of mine that to understand something as fully as possible, both sides of the coin need to be looked into - or at least accepted - in a way which sometimes can fly in the face of stereotypes and prevailing moods. It can lead to being seen as detached, uncaring, indecisive and even (in cauldrons like TVF) partizan, but one thing I assure you of is that it's not easy. I'm not actually that good at it myself, but it's the kind of thing you try to remind yourself to aim at whenever possible.

Personally, I think it's easier to just get wound up in a narrow-minded viewpoint. But then again, these days most people think they've got a harder life than the next man

You've posted in many different threads regarding this and that. Yet you're telling us we should just sit back and more or less mind our own business. It's pretty simple then. If you truly feel that way, why would you bother to post here. You saying your 1000+ posts are all 'let's all sit back and relax and let things run its course'? I doubt it.

And whether someone is partisan or not is doesn't matter because I really don't see how any reasonable person would see it as 'narrow minded' when people are disgusted by the fact that a terrorist is out on the streets on bail even after he fled for more then a year.

In the end, maybe the surprising answer is that you and I actually post for similar reasons. To guide the general discourse in a direction or manner in which we'd like it to go. It's just that you'd prefer it to go one way and I another. Please notice, I didn't say THE other, but AN other, as there are a thousand different courses and tones a discussion can take.

To address the current issue about which you feel angry, I would be the first to agree with you that terrorists belong in jail. And yet, this apparent - but as yet untested by a court of law - 'terrorist' is given bail. How can this be? You must be pretty flummoxed. It's never satisfying to feel flummoxed. It means there's a reason, but we don't know what it is. It's not that we don't understand the reason, but rather that we haven't even had the chance to understand it because there's been no explanation that makes any sense to us. More frustration. Something's missing here, otherwise we'd understand and not feel so surprised and disappointed. With me so far?

So what's missing? In my opinion it is something that can only come from an intimate, LONG term relationship with Thai culture. A level of immersion in Thai society so deep that probably not many of us would even want to experience it even if it were offered to us tomorrow.

To understand what makes others tick is to destroy a bit of ourselves. Is the reward worth the sacrifice? The answer is a personal choice, which I alluded to a few posts ago.

Letting things run their course - in the context of Thai politics - is all we can do, as you more or less admitted in your previous post. Letting things run their course closer to home is of course far dodgier advice. One cannot generalize about when it is good to let things run their course and when to intervene. i would suggest that 'intervention' to effect Thai politics in the form you suggest - diatribe by TV internet forum - is not far from being futile.

By the way, I'm not some kind of religious nutter. I drink too much and my efforts at quitting smoking are quite funny. I surreptitiously eye good looking women too much in the company of my wife and I probably should have made more of an effort at Christmas. Basically, I have some regard for the truth, just as I'm sure you do.

You're overthinking things. Perhaps there's a reason why he was let out. So what? He is still a terrorist and releasing one, especially this one, after they tried to burn this city down last year is offensive.

I've already said it. While people can't really can't really do anything, it doesn't mean they should sit around and accept it. This sabai sabai attitude is good at times but definitely not for instances like these.

[webfact]

Songkhla court grants bail for Red Shirt activist Arisman in defamation case filed by Democrat MP Sirichok /MCOT

[Moruya]

It's a shame they gave him bail a second time round. I was looking forward to 10,000 of Udon Thani's finest trecking down to Samila beach

[pimay11]

It's a shame they gave him bail a second time round. I was looking forward to 10,000 of Udon Thani's finest trecking down to Samila beach

This is possibly why he received bail. The courts didn't want another burn Bangkok campaign on their hands.

[Moruya]

It's a shame they gave him bail a second time round. I was looking forward to 10,000 of Udon Thani's finest trecking down to Samila beach

This is possibly why he received bail. The courts didn't want another burn Bangkok campaign on their hands.

The red shirts are not very popular down there and Songkhla is Prem's turf - there would not have been a very warm welcome to say the least!

[Robby nz]

Didnt I see somewhere that the justice minister recently made a call on the chief judge, or am I wrong on that one?

If it is correct then the conversation would have been interesting.

Now if Arisman was sent back to get some indication of what would happen to the big boss when he returns.......

So the man arrives with a big handfull of cash and applys for bail which is granted.

He then puts an appeal against his conviction in place while being given a cabinet post, probably deputy PM.

The appeal is granted and the conviction quashed.

Yingluck gets sick and has to leave so her new deputy is promoted.

And low and behold we have the big man in his rightful position.

And along with this we will have a constition rewrite......................................

[animatic]

If that was my wife I might spend 1.5 year in Cambodia too.

Re-quoting Churchill?

Lady: If you were my husband I'd put poison in your tea!

Winston: If you were my wife I'D DRINK IT!

[animatic]

It's a shame they gave him bail a second time round. I was looking forward to 10,000 of Udon Thani's finest trecking down to Samila beach

I am sure certain local bombers and snipers would have relished that opportunity for a shooting gallery even more.

[webfact]

LIBEL SUIT

Arisman granted bail in defamation suit

The Songkhla Court on Thursday granted bail to red shirt leader Arisman Pongruangrong, who was charged in a defamation suit against a Democrat MP.

Arisman flew to Songkhla this morning to face the charge. Democrat MP Sirichok Sopha of Songkhla filed the suit against Arisman, who was yesterday granted Bt6-million bail by the Court of Appeals in Bangkok on charges related to terrorism in connection with last year’s political disturbances.

Shortly after being freed from Bangkok Remand Prison, police detained him in another case and he was taken to Prachacheun police station to face libel proceedings brought by Sirichok.

The lower court had ruled twice to reject Arisman's bail application on the grounds of his being a flight risk, as he had fled following the May 19, 2010, dispersal of red-shirt rallies at Ratchaprasong. He surrendered earlier this month.

-- The Nation 2011-12-29

[Moruya]

LIBEL SUIT

Arisman granted bail in defamation suit

The Songkhla Court on Thursday granted bail to red shirt leader Arisman Pongruangrong, who was charged in a defamation suit against a Democrat MP.

Arisman flew to Songkhla this morning to face the charge. Democrat MP Sirichok Sopha of Songkhla filed the suit against Arisman, who was yesterday granted Bt6-million bail by the Court of Appeals in Bangkok on charges related to terrorism in connection with last year’s political disturbances.

Shortly after being freed from Bangkok Remand Prison, police detained him in another case and he was taken to Prachacheun police station to face libel proceedings brought by Sirichok.

The lower court had ruled twice to reject Arisman's bail application on the grounds of his being a flight risk, as he had fled following the May 19, 2010, dispersal of red-shirt rallies at Ratchaprasong. He surrendered earlier this month.

-- The Nation 2011-12-29

He even has a nice petrol-coloured tie.

[pimay11]

LIBEL SUIT

Arisman granted bail in defamation suit

The Songkhla Court on Thursday granted bail to red shirt leader Arisman Pongruangrong, who was charged in a defamation suit against a Democrat MP.

Arisman flew to Songkhla this morning to face the charge. Democrat MP Sirichok Sopha of Songkhla filed the suit against Arisman, who was yesterday granted Bt6-million bail by the Court of Appeals in Bangkok on charges related to terrorism in connection with last year’s political disturbances.

Shortly after being freed from Bangkok Remand Prison, police detained him in another case and he was taken to Prachacheun police station to face libel proceedings brought by Sirichok.

The lower court had ruled twice to reject Arisman's bail application on the grounds of his being a flight risk, as he had fled following the May 19, 2010, dispersal of red-shirt rallies at Ratchaprasong. He surrendered earlier this month.

-- The Nation 2011-12-29

He even has a nice petrol-coloured tie.

I'm sure his lawyer advised him not to anything RED until he receives bail.

[webfact]

NEW TOPIC

AFP: Thai Red Shirt Leader Arisman Gets Second Bail In Days

Follow this link: http://www.thaivisa....d-bail-in-days/

[Buchholz]

Arisman granted bail in defamation suit

The Songkhla Court on Thursday granted bail to red shirt leader Arisman Pongruangrong

He even has a nice petrol-coloured tie.

I'm sure his lawyer advised him not to anything RED until he receives bail.

Arisaman joined the monkhood today so no more ties.

Perhaps his lawyer advised him on that as well.

.

Edited January 19, 2012 by Buchholz

[Buchholz]

Link To Photo:

http://news.yahoo.com/photos/red-shirt-leader-arisman-pongruengrong-prays-samphanthawong-temple-photo-053206576.html

Arisman Pongruengrong, a prominent "Red Shirt" Leader charged with terrorism, invading parliament and theft of military ammunition, prays at the Samphanthawong temple as he enters monkhood in Bangkok January 19, 2012.

Pongruengrong, who is also a popular singer, entered monkhood on Thursday after being released on bail by the court last month.

REUTERS

[GentlemanJim]

Link To Photo:

http://news.yahoo.co...-053206576.html

Arisman Pongruengrong, a prominent "Red Shirt" Leader charged with terrorism, invading parliament and theft of military ammunition, prays at the Samphanthawong temple as he enters monkhood in Bangkok January 19, 2012.

Pongruengrong, who is also a popular singer, entered monkhood on Thursday after being released on bail by the court last month.

REUTERS

But surely Arisman's lawyers would never mention this in court as a ploy to try and establish that Arisman is a reformed character Nice move Arisman, a month in the monastery to avoid 5 years in the clink! I wonder if he will keep it up so that he attends his hearings in Monks robes?

[Buchholz]

Link To Photo:

http://news.yahoo.co...-053206576.html

Arisman Pongruengrong, a prominent "Red Shirt" Leader charged with terrorism, invading parliament and theft of military ammunition, prays at the Samphanthawong temple as he enters monkhood in Bangkok January 19, 2012.

Pongruengrong, who is also a popular singer, entered monkhood on Thursday after being released on bail by the court last month.

REUTERS

But surely Arisman's lawyers would never mention this in court as a ploy to try and establish that Arisman is a reformed character Nice move Arisman, a month in the monastery to avoid 5 years in the clink! I wonder if he will keep it up so that he attends his hearings in Monks robes?

As someone who was bailed out of jail recently, Arisaman, like many people, often find religion in prison.

That's especially true with those facing the death penalty, like Arisaman.

.

[Buchholz]

Arisaman and Natthawut (Both out on bail)

A Tale of Two Red Shirts....

one a new ordained monk, one a new Cabinet Minister

Khaosod newspaper (in Thai) - January 20, 2012

http://www.khaosod.co.th/view_news.php?newsid=TUROd01ERXdNakl3TURFMU5RPT0=&sectionid=TURNd01RPT0=&day=TWpBeE1pMHdNUzB5TUE9PQ==

[thaicbr]

also being a monk now probably means that even IF/ when he breaks bail they can do nothing until he stops being a monk.

[Buchholz]

also being a monk now probably means that even IF/ when he breaks bail they can do nothing until he stops being a monk.

Not necessarily the case.

Arisaman wouldn't be the first Red Shirt Fake Monk that was taken into custody for breaking the law.

.

[phiphidon]

Link To Photo:

http://news.yahoo.co...-053206576.html

Arisman Pongruengrong, a prominent "Red Shirt" Leader charged with terrorism, invading parliament and theft of military ammunition, prays at the Samphanthawong temple as he enters monkhood in Bangkok January 19, 2012.

Pongruengrong, who is also a popular singer, entered monkhood on Thursday after being released on bail by the court last month.

REUTERS

But surely Arisman's lawyers would never mention this in court as a ploy to try and establish that Arisman is a reformed character Nice move Arisman, a month in the monastery to avoid 5 years in the clink! I wonder if he will keep it up so that he attends his hearings in Monks robes?

As someone who was bailed out of jail recently, Arisaman, like many people, often find religion in prison.

That's especially true with those facing the death penalty, like Arisaman.

.

Theres that death penalty thing again Buchholz, I think most people are aware of the ultimate penalty in Thailand by now, no need to keep on about it.

[Buchholz]

Link To Photo:

http://news.yahoo.co...-053206576.html

Arisman Pongruengrong, a prominent "Red Shirt" Leader charged with terrorism, invading parliament and theft of military ammunition, prays at the Samphanthawong temple as he enters monkhood in Bangkok January 19, 2012.

Pongruengrong, who is also a popular singer, entered monkhood on Thursday after being released on bail by the court last month.

REUTERS

But surely Arisman's lawyers would never mention this in court as a ploy to try and establish that Arisman is a reformed character Nice move Arisman, a month in the monastery to avoid 5 years in the clink! I wonder if he will keep it up so that he attends his hearings in Monks robes?

As someone who was bailed out of jail recently, Arisaman, like many people, often find religion in prison.

That's especially true with those facing the death penalty, like Arisaman.

.

Theres that death penalty thing again Buchholz, I think most people are aware of the ultimate penalty in Thailand by now, no need to keep on about it.

It's hard to believe that people really do appreciate the gravity of the charges they face, when others facing the same possible consequences are promoted to become Cabinet Ministers.

,