UN's Ban seeks Israel-Palestine peace talks during upcoming Middle East visit

[Pedzie]

I agree with most of what you've written above JT...

It's 2012 now...Who are the aggressors ??

That's a loaded question. You seem to like to play simple minded black and white games over this massively complex situation. The Palestinians STILL won't accept the existence of the Jewish state. How does work negotiating peace with a people that don't accept your existence?

Yes It's a loaded question..and it ain't black or white! 'Palestinians' Are denied basic human rights! They ain't all terrorists....

If only Israel would realise this...

Make peace with thy neighbour...

[Ulysses G.]

It's 2012 now...Who are the aggressors ??

The aggressors declared war in the beginning of the conflict, refused their own state when offered one, voted in Hamas a terrorist organization, keep refusing to stop targeting civilians and sign a peace treaty.

Edited February 3, 2012 by Ulysses G.

[Pedzie]

It's 2012 now...Who are the aggressors ??

The aggressors declared war in the beginning of the conflict, refused their own state when offered one, voted in Hamas a terrorist organization, keep refusing to stop targeting civilians and sign a peace treaty.

Can you really blame them, put yourself on the other side of the fence!

[Rusty2009]

The palestinian people do not have a military,News reports repeatedly describe Israeli Military attacks against the Palestinian population as "retaliation" However when looks into the Chronolgy of death in this conflict it turns out to be different.

So if the palestinians do not have a military force, who are they shooting at with their Helicopters,fighter planes,drones,gun ships, missiles, tanks, armoured vehicles etc, etc, etc

Edited February 4, 2012 by Rusty2009

[Ulysses G.]

Yes, I can blame them. IMO they are mostly to blame for the problems and have no intention of making peace as long as Israel is in existence. Israel has bent over backwards to make peace and has been refused repeatedly.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QuVx_7ER09Y

Edited February 4, 2012 by Ulysses G.

[Ulysses G.]

The palestinian people do not have a military,

They use terrorism to attack civilians with rockets, suicide bombs and the rest, but I'm sure you knew that already.

[Scott]

This is a fairly straightforward thread about the UN's seeking of an Israeli-Palestinian discussion of peace. Continued off-topic baiting and flaming will get your post deleted and warnings issued.

[Pakboong]

Yes, I can blame them. IMO they are mostly to blame for the problems and have no intention of making peace as long as Israel is in existence. Israel has bent over backwards to make peace and has been refused repeatedly.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QuVx_7ER09Y

The Palestinians have to know, as do most of us, that a treaty will be broken and the Palestinians will be immediately blamed. Does not matter what exactly happened. They are the only ones who can break the treaty therefore, it would be completely stupid to sign one. The response to breaking the treaty would be suicide. Hamas knows they cannot control the rockets, if they could, there would be more attempts at a treaty. It is not a conspiracy theory to know or believe that the problem is a clandestine one that lives beneath the surface and is not obvious.

In a perfect world, the solution might be simple, this is far from a perfect world. The immediate response to a broken treaty would be Cast Lead 2. Not a secret really but several talk as if it is.

[Ulysses G.]

They "know" the treaty will be broken, so they won't sign it and Hamas "knows" they can't stop the rockets even though they are the ones making them. Sounds like the Alice in Wonderland theory.

Edited February 4, 2012 by Scott
formatting

[geriatrickid]

The Palestinians have to know, as do most of us, that a treaty will be broken and the Palestinians will be immediately blamed. Does not matter what exactly happened. They are the only ones who can break the treaty therefore, it would be completely stupid to sign one. The response to breaking the treaty would be suicide. Hamas knows they cannot control the rockets, if they could, there would be more attempts at a treaty. It is not a conspiracy theory to know or believe that the problem is a clandestine one that lives beneath the surface and is not obvious.

In a perfect world, the solution might be simple, this is far from a perfect world. The immediate response to a broken treaty would be Cast Lead 2. Not a secret really but several talk as if it is.

Oh please, the excuse you are providing cannot be supported. "Hamas knows they cannot control the rockets, if they could, there would be more attempts at a treaty" Do you really believe that? Try this; Hamas isn't interested in a treaty because one of its stated goals is the destruction of the state of Israel. Hamas can't control the rockets? Are you actually serious? Of course they can control the rockets. They are more often than not involved in the attacks. Hamas knows what is going in Gaza and its agents are everywhere. How else can they harass their fatah opponents and maintain a level of corruption in Gaza that makes Thai officials look like amateurs?

Edited February 4, 2012 by geriatrickid

[Pakboong]

Tthey "know" the treaty will be broken, so they won't sign it and Hamas "knows" they can't stop the rockets even though they are the ones making them. Sounds like the Alice in Wonderland theory.

So you are suggesting that after the Palestinians sign a treaty, when the next rocket flies out of Gaza at 3am. an investigation will be conducted as to who exactly fired the rockets. I don't think that is ever going to happen and is the basis for not agreeing to a treaty. There can be no treaty if only one party to the treaty can violate its terms.

[Pakboong]

The Palestinians have to know, as do most of us, that a treaty will be broken and the Palestinians will be immediately blamed. Does not matter what exactly happened. They are the only ones who can break the treaty therefore, it would be completely stupid to sign one. The response to breaking the treaty would be suicide. Hamas knows they cannot control the rockets, if they could, there would be more attempts at a treaty. It is not a conspiracy theory to know or believe that the problem is a clandestine one that lives beneath the surface and is not obvious.

In a perfect world, the solution might be simple, this is far from a perfect world. The immediate response to a broken treaty would be Cast Lead 2. Not a secret really but several talk as if it is.

Oh please, the excuse you are providing cannot be supported. "Hamas knows they cannot control the rockets, if they could, there would be more attempts at a treaty" Do you really believe that? Try this; Hamas isn't interested in a treaty because one of its stated goals is the destruction of the state of Israel. Hamas can't control the rockets? Are you actually serious? Of course they can control the rockets. They are more often than not involved in the attacks. Hamas knows what is going in Gaza and its agents are everywhere. How else can they harass their fatah opponents and maintain a level of corruption in Gaza that makes Thai officials look like amateurs?

You are also suggesting that only the Palestinians can violate the terms of any treaty they sign. They have violated every cease fire thus far so it is logical to conclude that they will violate any treaty they happen to sign.

[Ulysses G.]

If your point is that the Palestinian Arabs will not sign a peace treaty because they have no intention of honoring it anyway, you have a point.

[Scott]

One nonsense, baiting post has been removed.

[Pakboong]

If your point is that the Palestinian Arabs will not sign a peace treaty because they have no intention of honoring it anyway, you have a point.

That is part of the point indeed. They know that the treaty will not last and they will have to pay dearly with the blood of their children. You and others make the claim that the inherently bad terrorists have complete control over the rockets being fired from Gaza. I am suggesting that may not be the case. Just take their record for the year which was posted here by the OP within the last few weeks that 627 rocket and mortar attacks coming from the Gaza Strip and landing in Israel occured during 2010. I am suggesting that these Palestinians have got to be the most incompetent terrorists of all time because only one Israeli was killed from all these attacks. It was not a matter of good defence by the Israelis, rather simple incompetence on the part of the Palestinians. I am not ready to buy that one without some further considerations as to why that happened. I do not recall what the death toll on the Palestinians was but I am quite sure it was significant.

There are other players in the game who derive benefit indirectly and I cannot rule them out. You can rule them out quickly but I can't. 627 attacks, none of which were against the settlements, only the Israeli desert. The settlements obviously cannot be reached from Gaza but if the Palestinians are inherently bad, you would expect some effort on their part to terrorize the settlements. Don't bother to bring up the Fogles as that was another matter entirely. The Orthodox are starting to heat up as well as the settlers, both of which gain much more from the rocket attacks than the Palestinians.

I am positive that if the Settlers wanted to , they could turn Palestinians in Gaza to do their bidding. You have no evidence that they have not and i have no evidence to the contrary. I simply have no dog in the fight and am able to look at other possibilities which you are for whatever reason, not able to do.

[flying]

I am suggesting that these Palestinians have got to be the most incompetent terrorists of all time because only one Israeli was killed from all these attacks

627 attacks, none of which were against the settlements, only the Israeli desert.

Amazing in itself isn't it?

[cdnvic]

When it deteriorates into conspiracy theories its time to call it a day.