Chalerm Warns Hospital Employees About Probe Into Cold Medicine

[webfact]

Hospital employees warned about probe into cold medicine

The Nation on Sunday

CHIANG MAI

BANGKOK: -- Hospital employees could face serious charges if were found to supply cold medicine with pseudo-ephedrine to criminals who make drugs, Deputy Prime Minister Chalerm Yoobamrung warned yesterday.

He instructed the Department of Special Investigation (DSI) to investigate the smuggling of cold medicine out of hospitals.

Chalerm said he would send police to stay at Thai embassies in Asean countries to collect intelligence and help fight drug trafficking at its roots. He said a police attache would be sent first to China in two weeks.

Outlining anti-drug policy to police chiefs in eight upper northern provinces yesterday afternoon, Chalerm said the government's anti-drug campaign was on the right path. He said the North was the smuggling route for 87 per cent of drugs nationally, so full co-operation from Provincial Police Region 5 would lead to victory over drug trafficking. He praised region 5's drug arrests over the past 6-7 months.

Chalerm also discussed the smuggling of cold medicine with pseudo-ephedrine through hospital drug-purchase orders, saying he had instructed the DSI to look into such cases and urged the Public Health Minister to get the Food and Drug Administration to inspect hospitals' medicine orders.

Meanwhile, DSI chief Tharit Pengdit said he would propose cold medicine cases to the Special Case Committee soon. He said an initial probe found that Central Udon Thani Hospital and Thong Saen Khan Hospital in Uttaradit had suspicious activity in sending drugs outside the medical system. He said they would also ask the FDA for details on cold medicine orders from hospitals nation-wide to check if any cold medicine was slipping outside the system. So, the DSI hoping to look at other hospitals next week.

DSI security case chief Pol Lt-Colonel Pong-in Inkhao, who led the investigation team, said they initially found that 83 per cent of cold medicine was smuggled to other countries without going through the medical treatment system while 17 per cent was diverted from the medical system and smuggled to other countries.

The latter group included cold drugs that 'leak' from pharmacies, clinics and hospitals. The DSI probe was now starting to see a pattern linking them, with many paths of medicine smuggling leading to San Kamphaeng district in Chiang Mai, where a middle man would pick it up and send it to a drug-making source in other country.

In related news, a wanted drug dealer - Atthapol "Nott Kapiad" Prachoom, 29 - died in an extra-judicial killing yesterday in Nakhon Si Thammarat's Chawang district.

Police investigators found out that Atthapol, who shot his way out of a police bid to arrest him last year, was hiding in a rubber plantation in Tambon Kapiad. They surrounded the site and presented themselves to search Atthapol, who rode a motorcycle out of a shack there. Police said the man opened fire and threw a grenade at them but it was dud, resulting to a gunfight in which he was killed. They say they found a shotgun in his hand, a pistol and some bullets near him and 300 'ya ba' tablets in his motorbike basket.

In other news, Samut Prakan police yesterday announced the arrest of nine drug suspects along with 7,354 'ya ba' tablets, 91 grams of crystal meth, a pistol, seven bullets and Bt163,000 in cash.

-- The Nation 2012-03-11

[cloghead]

again...

[EyesWideOpen]

Sometimes I think I will never understand " Thainess "......Why in the bleep would you tell people that are committing wrong doing, that you are going to investigate them ??? Give them time to cover their tracks ??? I think the more normal path is the western world is to quietly start the investigation, start arresting people, and let the chips fall where they may. This reminds me of his last idea, which was to record and track phone calls made by drug dealers in prison. A terrific idea, except he told everybody about it beforehand.. Sometimes I think the goal of Chalerm in this government is comic relief. It clearly is not well thought out government policies..

[Pib]

_{Chalerm said he would send police to stay at Thai embassies in Asean countries to collect intelligence and help fight drug trafficking at its roots.}

The police will setup lottery stands just outside the embassies and while selling govt lottery tickets they will also query customers about drug traficking. A genious undercover operation!!

[maidu]

Tell Thai and farang that they don't have to buy all the pills which are prescribed. Every time someone visits a hospital, she's invariably required to buy several different types of pills. What most people don't know, is they don't have to buy all those pills. They can pick which pills they think will help them - or buy none. Some of the pills are placebos, and usually some of the pills are benign stuff from big corporations. Hospital staff are getting pay-backs for pushing unnecessary pills - supplied by the truckload, by big pharm.

[Soutpeel]

They can pick which pills they think will help them - or buy none. Some of the pills are placebos, and usually some of the pills are benign stuff from big corporations. Hospital staff are getting pay-backs for pushing unnecessary pills - supplied by the truckload, by big pharm.

Kinda defeats the point of going to a a doctor then, doesnt it ? if you are picking and choosing the meds you take......do you have a verifiable source which proves medication provided are placebos....or is it just a case of tinfoil hat time again....you are making very serious acusations

Handing out bags of "sweeties" is not just restricted to Thailand...in Asia/SEA generally its is expected by patients and they dont feel happy if they are not sent home with lots of lovely coloured tablets injest

[w11guy]

Tell Thai and farang that they don't have to buy all the pills which are prescribed. Every time someone visits a hospital, she's invariably required to buy several different types of pills. What most people don't know, is they don't have to buy all those pills. They can pick which pills they think will help them - or buy none. Some of the pills are placebos, and usually some of the pills are benign stuff from big corporations. Hospital staff are getting pay-backs for pushing unnecessary pills - supplied by the truckload, by big pharm.

Not true at all. I've visited the hospital a few times and never been asked to buy an drugs whatsoever. What you describe sounds more like what happens in the UK. There my doctor always suggested I take drugs that I didn't need.

[w11guy]

They can pick which pills they think will help them - or buy none. Some of the pills are placebos, and usually some of the pills are benign stuff from big corporations. Hospital staff are getting pay-backs for pushing unnecessary pills - supplied by the truckload, by big pharm.

Kinda defeats the point of going to a a doctor then, doesnt it ? if you are picking and choosing the meds you take......do you have a verifiable source which proves medication provided are placebos....or is it just a case of tinfoil hat time again....you are making very serious acusations

Handing out bags of "sweeties" is not just restricted to Thailand...in Asia/SEA generally its is expected by patients and they dont feel happy if they are not sent home with lots of lovely coloured tablets injest

Another thing that's not true. Thai people do not expect to go home will lots of pills. Do you actually know any Thai people?

[rkidlad]

Tell Thai and farang that they don't have to buy all the pills which are prescribed. Every time someone visits a hospital, she's invariably required to buy several different types of pills. What most people don't know, is they don't have to buy all those pills. They can pick which pills they think will help them - or buy none. Some of the pills are placebos, and usually some of the pills are benign stuff from big corporations. Hospital staff are getting pay-backs for pushing unnecessary pills - supplied by the truckload, by big pharm.

Not true at all. I've visited the hospital a few times and never been asked to buy an drugs whatsoever. What you describe sounds more like what happens in the UK. There my doctor always suggested I take drugs that I didn't need.

Every time I've been to a hospital here I've been given many pills. I always seem to get Amoxicillin. I sprained my ankle playing football once, and I was given very strong pain killers. I told the doctor I wasn't in pain but it did hurt to walk on it.

At the end of the day, you might think they're pushing too many pills on you, but you've just gotta go with what the doctor tells you. Just make sure you go to a decent hospital if you can afford it.

As for Chalerm, why would anyone listen to this criminal?

[HarrySeaman]

Hospitals charge many times what you can but the same medications for at good Thai drug stores. Even the farang drug stores like Boots are cheaper.

The last medication the doctor perscribed for me was 20 Bt/pill at the hospital, 3.5 Bt/pill at my pharmacy. Guess where I buy all my medications.

Many Thai doctors don't even know what a perscription is so simply ask your doctor for a list of medications and a schedule for taking the medications. Go to a pharmacy you can trust (ask around the farang community if you don't know) and buy your medications.

[Soutpeel]

They can pick which pills they think will help them - or buy none. Some of the pills are placebos, and usually some of the pills are benign stuff from big corporations. Hospital staff are getting pay-backs for pushing unnecessary pills - supplied by the truckload, by big pharm.

Kinda defeats the point of going to a a doctor then, doesnt it ? if you are picking and choosing the meds you take......do you have a verifiable source which proves medication provided are placebos....or is it just a case of tinfoil hat time again....you are making very serious acusations

Handing out bags of "sweeties" is not just restricted to Thailand...in Asia/SEA generally its is expected by patients and they dont feel happy if they are not sent home with lots of lovely coloured tablets injest

Another thing that's not true. Thai people do not expect to go home will lots of pills. Do you actually know any Thai people?

Yes lots and lots of them and I am actually married to one, and have many Thai collegues as well....this maybe your experience in the wilds of Isaan, or possibly in Nana or Cowboy....but not in my experience from the last 10 years....over to you

Edited March 11, 2012 by Soutpeel

[animatic]

He needs to be SEEN doing action, not actually succeeding doing it.

The Meth Makers will be stealing it in whole sale quantities, drums of it,

not trying to extract it from one person at a time cold medicine prescriptions.

Chalerm is just Ass Hat Talking again.

[animatic]

Tell Thai and farang that they don't have to buy all the pills which are prescribed. Every time someone visits a hospital, she's invariably required to buy several different types of pills. What most people don't know, is they don't have to buy all those pills. They can pick which pills they think will help them - or buy none. Some of the pills are placebos, and usually some of the pills are benign stuff from big corporations. Hospital staff are getting pay-backs for pushing unnecessary pills - supplied by the truckload, by big pharm.

Not true at all. I've visited the hospital a few times and never been asked to buy an drugs whatsoever. What you describe sounds more like what happens in the UK. There my doctor always suggested I take drugs that I didn't need.

At a certain big name hospital here, I am always giving a 'buy from the pharmacy in the hospital scrip',

but the prices are 50-400% higher there. I find you can turn them down and go to your local pharmacy for the regular price.

Edited March 11, 2012 by animatic

[anterian]

Pseudoephedrine is the most effective decongestant available, I have used it for many years, ever since they banned ephedrine (It was used to speed up greyhounds on the race track).

Many doctors, not just Thais, over prescribe, it is an easy option for them. Anything I take I research first on the Internet, uses, dosage, counter indications etc. you can often find something better and cheaper. I can't speak for Thai doctors but I find many in other countries appreciate a well informed patient and will discuss various options with you.

[Reasonableman]

The Thais I know, and I know a lot, tend to judge the quality of a health service, and medical treatment, by the size of the bag of drugs they take back home. Normally, these are far less expensive at GPO or sidewalk pharmacies than hospitals.

[TackyToo]

Chalerm: what makes me think the hospital probably gave him the wrong medicine for his ear problem again?

The procedure "we will conduct a raid next Monday at exact 13:00hrs, make sure the media attends the scene at least one hour before" seems to be adopted from a Cheech&Chong movie!

Attention all units! This is Sgt. Stedenko!

[noitom]

A big part of the Thai medical system is that the poorly underpaid doctors get a slice of the drugs provided. That's why your wife comes home from the doctor with five little plastic bags of medicine. Once I reminded my wife to have the doctor please tell her what the name is in English. The doctor asked my wife "why do you want to know?" My wife said my husband wants to know. The doctor said - "it's none of his business," knowing that the husband is farang. I resisted the temptation to go back and confront the doctor. It struck me as a vivid example of Thainess and arrogance, as well as that holier than thou attitude that they seem to have perfected.

[bigbamboo]

_{Chalerm said he would send police to stay at Thai embassies in Asean countries to collect intelligence and help fight drug trafficking at its roots.}

The police will setup lottery stands just outside the embassies and while selling govt lottery tickets they will also query customers about drug traficking. A genious undercover operation!!

Doesn't inspire much confidence, does it?

[rakman]

A big part of the Thai medical system is that the poorly underpaid doctors get a slice of the drugs provided. That's why your wife comes home from the doctor with five little plastic bags of medicine. Once I reminded my wife to have the doctor please tell her what the name is in English. The doctor asked my wife "why do you want to know?" My wife said my husband wants to know. The doctor said - "it's none of his business," knowing that the husband is farang. I resisted the temptation to go back and confront the doctor. It struck me as a vivid example of Thainess and arrogance, as well as that holier than thou attitude that they seem to have perfected.

Based on the phrasing of the exchange, the doctor may have been correct in his answer. I don't know about Thailand specifically, but Patient Privacy has become a hot topic. If you wife had said "I want to check on these drugs myself", then the doctor would have had to come up with a different excuse not to say. He probably didn't want to spend the time looking up the comparison of Thai named drug with the English language equivalent. She is smart to ask, and should insist on the answer, which is a hard thing to do with many doctors around the world, let alone culturally.

[Ijustwannateach]

The reason announcements like this seem like counterproductive law enforcement is that they're not really meant to be law enforcement- that is, they will appear to be enforcing the law (which if they did the quiet arrests of anyone connected would work) but what is actually happening is that a window is being opened for making a deal. If enough money is paid during the deal, the people who pay will themselves somehow mysteriously not be caught out as breaking the law. That doesn't mean that the rank-and-file people breaking the law are protected, either.

[MAJIC]

Sometimes I think I will never understand " Thainess "......Why in the bleep would you tell people that are committing wrong doing, that you are going to investigate them ??? Give them time to cover their tracks ??? I think the more normal path is the western world is to quietly start the investigation, start arresting people, and let the chips fall where they may. This reminds me of his last idea, which was to record and track phone calls made by drug dealers in prison. A terrific idea, except he told everybody about it beforehand.. Sometimes I think the goal of Chalerm in this government is comic relief. It clearly is not well thought out government policies..

Yes,but don't forget he is not interested in anything other than self promotion and free publicity for himself,by letting the people know he's a man of action,and shouldering the burdon of running the Country single handed.

Dosn't that remind you of someone else,who previously ran the Country?

Edited March 11, 2012 by MAJIC

[OzMick]

They can pick which pills they think will help them - or buy none. Some of the pills are placebos, and usually some of the pills are benign stuff from big corporations. Hospital staff are getting pay-backs for pushing unnecessary pills - supplied by the truckload, by big pharm.

Kinda defeats the point of going to a a doctor then, doesnt it ? if you are picking and choosing the meds you take......do you have a verifiable source which proves medication provided are placebos....or is it just a case of tinfoil hat time again....you are making very serious acusations

Handing out bags of "sweeties" is not just restricted to Thailand...in Asia/SEA generally its is expected by patients and they dont feel happy if they are not sent home with lots of lovely coloured tablets injest

I have to agree with Maidu - many of the pills handed out are unnecessary. I regularly reject the pain-killers, insist on a double dose of antibiotics (on advice from my own doctor - I am close to twice the body weight of the average Thai), and heavily reduce the numbers of other offerings such as diazepam.

Injest/ingest - nice howler. Intentional?

[maidu]

I have to agree with Maidu - many of the pills handed out are unnecessary. I regularly reject the pain-killers, insist on a double dose of antibiotics (on advice from my own doctor - I am close to twice the body weight of the average Thai), and heavily reduce the numbers of other offerings such as diazepam. Injest/ingest - nice howler. Intentional?

It appears that responses are about 3 to 2 against what I've observed. I've been to several hospitals in Thailand, on numerous occasions, often with a Thai friend. Every time, without exception, numerous pills are subscribed. It's rare that any clients (Thai or farang) turn down any pills, because they think because they're recommended by a doctor, they must be useful for the ailment. Truth is; most of the pills subscribed are not useful for the ailment. There should be an objective study on this, but it would be impossible in Thailand for two reasons: 1st: Thais are not capable of objective/scientific studies, and 2nd: Big Pharm and the Hospitals/doctors dont' want anything getting in the way of selling all those unecessary pills - which amount to hundreds of millions of baht per year divvied up among the grinning players in on the ruse.

[lannarebirth]

Pseudoephedrine is the most effective decongestant available, I have used it for many years, ever since they banned ephedrine (It was used to speed up greyhounds on the race track).

Many doctors, not just Thais, over prescribe, it is an easy option for them. Anything I take I research first on the Internet, uses, dosage, counter indications etc. you can often find something better and cheaper. I can't speak for Thai doctors but I find many in other countries appreciate a well informed patient and will discuss various options with you.

I agree. I take next to no medications ever, but the American branded Sudafed and Actifed are extremely efficacious remedies that prevent what may start as a bout of the sniffles from becoming something far far worse.

[anterian]

Pseudoephedrine is the most effective decongestant available, I have used it for many years, ever since they banned ephedrine (It was used to speed up greyhounds on the race track).

Many doctors, not just Thais, over prescribe, it is an easy option for them. Anything I take I research first on the Internet, uses, dosage, counter indications etc. you can often find something better and cheaper. I can't speak for Thai doctors but I find many in other countries appreciate a well informed patient and will discuss various options with you.

I agree. I take next to no medications ever, but the American branded Sudafed and Actifed are extremely efficacious remedies that prevent what may start as a bout of the sniffles from becoming something far far worse.

I am now in a strange situation, many of my herbal supplements are now banned by the EU in England, but I can still buy them in Thailand. Conversely I can buy Sudafed in England but not in Thailand. I am wondering if a doctor's note would cover me bringing Sudafed into Thailand?

[maidu]

When will Mr. "War on Drugs" Chalerm have the guts to tackle problems with the world's (and Thailand's) #1 most harmful drug? Perhaps when his inner ear infection lessens, and he doesn't have to drink so many bottles of whiskey to alleviate the ache.