Expat Teenagers In Phuket

[thaiIand]

Olympic swimming pools numerous on the island, Triathlon every year, Iron man every year, Various football tournaments here every year (thailand international soccer 7's last year for example), various boating and sailing activities with or without fishing, paintball, arcades, car rallys, lots of honest jobs available for young people, lots of golf, great bicycle routes, emphasis on boy scouts in schools, flying schools, surfing, kite boarding, that thing where people jump off the cliffs and glide around, cinemas, book clubs, badminton, online gaming, cooking classes, language schools....what else do people do with their social life that you cant do here?

boyscouts? They teach them NOTHING. no thais remembers any survival training. The best they do is bring them to nai yang beach and give them propane burners and a bunch of bags of mama from 7/11... looks more like going to a hotel than anything. Also when they leave its full of plastic bag and empty bottles while in the west they teach you about recycling and cleaning your shit up.

All the other things you mentioned are twice as expensive here and also they have 10x less security measures in place. All the sport facilities are all broken down or filled with dog poop.

Dont forget that your 'honest jobs' dont allow the kids to save to travail the world as a 10/15$ per hour student job would in the west. Dont forget that their mediocre school(even bis) will not help an average student get into a good university outside of the country. Dont forget that thai universities are worthless. Don't forget that all those acitivies are almost all happening past 4pm So kids sleep a lot less, Terrible for kids not to get their rest. What to they do in the day when its too hot? drugs/sex/violent tv

let's not forget about 50% of the activities you suggested would be HATED by any normal teenager of this generation.

If you're going to raise kids in thailand, move to chiang mai or be a billionaire in bangkok

[seaeagle]

Thee are so many opportunities for different sports and outdoor activities to get into and enjoy year round. Swimming, surfing, running, cycling, tennis, triathlon, thai boxing, sailing, diving, snorkeling, target shooting, paintball, music, climbing, horse riding, art classes ... If it is too hot at noon, no problem to do outdoor activities in the afternoons.

Okay, but maybe we have a different 'take' on what I'd call organised activities and the infrastructure for such sports and activities. To each of your activites, I'd respond as follows:

Swimming : in the sea? pool at home? Apart from 'Funstart', I don't know of any pool where it is easily accessible to the public and is marked with lanes for competitive swimming.

Surfing : I'm not from a surfing country, but I do know people who surf here in the low season, so I'll give you that one - almost. Most of the surfing done here, though, is internet surfing.

Running : if you call dodging the traffic, dogs and noddle stalls 'running', then I'll give you that, too! However, I'd be thinking more about running / athletic clubs, and there's not much of that here, unless you wish to count that drinking club formed in Malaysia known as HHH.

Cycling : ditto to above. Again, you take your life in your hands when biking here, and you may see a few guys around with pretty colured crash helmets on, but where is the competition and races?

Triathlon : no, you don't get any points for this, as it is made up of sports above. While phuket is a 'venue' for a triathlon, just take a look at the results. That will show you where the strong competitors come from, and it's not from here.

Tennis : yes, I'll give you this one. The ones in Phuket Town and on Chao Fa West are pretty good.

Thai boxing : hmmm - yes, it's available, but I see very few locals (other than Thais) doing this, They all seem like bulked up yanks and aussies on a 'camp' from their club back home. And that's the rub - "from a club back home" : you have clubs back in the west, but here it's all on a commercial basis.

Sailing : know nothing about this, but I do know friends who take their kids on little sail boats at Ao Yon, so I'll kind of give you this one, too.

Diving : where are the diving clubs? where are the places you can train and go diving with club volunteers? No - training and ongoing diving is just on a commercial basis.

Snorkelling : done at the seaside when you get bored with swimming. Again, no snorkelling clubs, or education around what you can see when you go snorkelling.

Target shooting : what's this? Bows and arrows, or rifle? Know nothing of this, but if you can name me a club you can join (rather than a commercial enterprise) then I'd love to know.

Paintball : oh, pleeeeze! Reminds me of a corporate day-out, rather than a regular hobby!

Music : totally agree, but it's indoor so I don't count it. Can be done anywhere : Thailand or Greenland.

Climbing : presume you don;t mean indoor walls, as we don't have these here. Do you mean the karsts of Phang Nga? If so, then, again, I'd ask for a local climbing club.

Horse riding : just maybe I'll give you that. The place in Rawai does riding, but that's all - no jumping or cross-country like you'd get elsewhere.

Art classes : as in 'after school activities'? Almost in the 'oh, pleeeze' category!

[fiddlehead]

I think there's lots to do here. And good weather to do it in.

OK, there's no snow skiing, and you have to leave the island do to white water rafting and not a lot of team sports.

If you can't find anything for your kids to do (or they can't) why stay?

If your kid has nothing to do, suggest some of the following: surfing, kiteboarding, paddle surfing, beach volleyball, water skiing (cable ski place near Kathu waterfall is full of teenagers most days), they have this highline thing in the tall trees, and if you live near Sapan Hin, there are about 6 buildings there complete with:badminton courts, swimming pools, tennis courts (just been resurfaced and are free), weight room, also, there's Muay Thai schools all over the place with lots of teenagers in them, we go to Phi Phi or Railay rock climbing at least once a year, camping (we've camped at more than 6 National Parks in this country already), mountain biking (up near the Kata Viewpoint), 4 wheeling, sailing (Chalong yacht club gives lessons to teenagers), scuba diving, skateboarding, of course football pickup games, fishing, (watched while a 3rd generation fisherman showed my son half a dozen ways to catch different species of fish while we camped on the beach on the north part of the island last year), basketball courts, ping pong, kite flying (Sapan Hin on weekends is full of people doing this), RC plane flying or gliders up at the Windmill hill Nai Harn, horseback riding, (on the beach), snorkeling, gymnastics (courses being given at Palazzo), and I'm sure I missed a few.

Many more choices here for my son than I ever had.

So many opportunities, but, I guess you have to open your eyes (and mind) to see.

By the way, took my family to the US last year, hard to find kids outside anymore. That was one of the culture shocks they had. I was quite surprised about that too.

But, I'm sure it's better where you come from.

[madjbs]

I know lots of kids who went to or go to international schools here (proper international schools). I can confidently say that the vast majority of them are good hard working kids who would look like star pupils in the average government school back home. ALL of them who graduated last year went on to very good unis, all around the world. The good schools are expensive though, but you get what you pay for!

Edited March 12, 2012 by madjbs

[Peterocket]

Olympic swimming pools numerous on the island, Triathlon every year, Iron man every year, Various football tournaments here every year (thailand international soccer 7's last year for example), various boating and sailing activities with or without fishing, paintball, arcades, car rallys, lots of honest jobs available for young people, lots of golf, great bicycle routes, emphasis on boy scouts in schools, flying schools, surfing, kite boarding, that thing where people jump off the cliffs and glide around, cinemas, book clubs, badminton, online gaming, cooking classes, language schools....what else do people do with their social life that you cant do here?

boyscouts? They teach them NOTHING. no thais remembers any survival training. The best they do is bring them to nai yang beach and give them propane burners and a bunch of bags of mama from 7/11... looks more like going to a hotel than anything. Also when they leave its full of plastic bag and empty bottles while in the west they teach you about recycling and cleaning your shit up.

All the other things you mentioned are twice as expensive here and also they have 10x less security measures in place. All the sport facilities are all broken down or filled with dog poop.

Dont forget that your 'honest jobs' dont allow the kids to save to travail the world as a 10/15$ per hour student job would in the west. Dont forget that their mediocre school(even bis) will not help an average student get into a good university outside of the country. Dont forget that thai universities are worthless. Don't forget that all those acitivies are almost all happening past 4pm So kids sleep a lot less, Terrible for kids not to get their rest. What to they do in the day when its too hot? drugs/sex/violent tv

let's not forget about 50% of the activities you suggested would be HATED by any normal teenager of this generation.

If you're going to raise kids in thailand, move to chiang mai or be a billionaire in bangkok

Changing the minds of the modern day teenager is not what this thread is about. As I think even with your knowledge of expat teenagers it would be a little buit too much work to travel the world convincing all teenagers to learn survival training in the scouts. However if you want your teenagers to attempt to stay out of trouble then scouts whether they eat mama noodles or not is better than them sitting on a corner in Croydon selling crack.

[thaiIand]

id rather have kids selling cracks to idiots than having idiot kids throwing bottles and trash on the beach with their teacher's approval.

[HongKongPhooey]

Okay, tell us. What is there to do here for teenagers? Emphasis on the do - not just socialising around malls etc.

Obviously I don't need to answer this question as it has been brilliantly answered by several members already. You started off by saying there was nothing to do but you then seemed to shift it to 'there isn't any clubs to join' So you can do running but you can't join an athletics club. Perhaps that's the case but it's hardly a reason to right a country off as a place to live. Anyhow, I wouldn't mind betting there is a lot of clubs out there that you and I aren't even aware of. Did you know there was an Aikido club in Phuket Town?

And, as for HKPhooey, the weather is the drawback here for sports and activities. People don't go out the house after 10am, then venture out again after 4.30pm - it's too hot for outdoor activities and pursuits. Unless you can show me a list of Thai gold medal winners and sporting achievements, compared to those in the normal expat countries, then you're talking rhubarb.

For me personally the hot weather is far less restricting and easier to work around than English winters, and I'm not sure what the lack of Thai gold medal winners has to do with anything. Russia has quite a good tally of medals but it's the last place I would want to live.

You are being unnecessarily negative if you ask me. For example your argument against cycling and running is that it's dangerous because of all the cars and noodle stands! The island is covered in parks, National parks and quiet areas perfect for bike rides and jogging so that's a very weak point. You seem to be obsessed with clubs, competitions and gold medals. Are you suggesting we need to live in the West just in case our kids are potential Olympic gold medal winners and we would be doing them an injustice living somewhere there's not an athletics club?

I think the lists people have posted proves without question that Phuket offers a multitude of activities for kids and adults alike. Why don't you give us a list of things that you believe are readily available in the West that aren't available in Phuket and we can see how big a problem it really is.

[HongKongPhooey]

What is socially better about lets say the UK or the USA than here?

Obviously gangs are extremely sociable and easy to join in the UK and USA but not ideal for the teenagers.

It's not a case of socially better. I was more thinking along the lines of safety and independence. I ask myself if I had a 17 year old kids right now, what would they do to socialise, where would they go. Would I feel comfortable if they went to Phuket Town for a drink and something to eat and was going to make their own way home? Would they be safe walking around Phuket Town after dark? Would I feel comfortable for them to walk anywhere on the island after dark? I'm not sure I would.

I guess the only issue I have, is how safe they would be when they're at an age where they need to have their own independence, and be out and about on their own. Would I feel they were as safe in Phuket as they would be in the UK. I don't think I would.

I always defend Phuket when people are trying to make it out as the Wild West or Bogota, when it really isn't that bad at all. But when it's your kids then what chances are you prepared to take?

I know lots of kids who went to or go to international schools here (proper international schools). I can confidently say that the vast majority of them are good hard working kids who would look like star pupils in the average government school back home. ALL of them who graduated last year went on to very good unis, all around the world. The good schools are expensive though, but you get what you pay for!

This is what I had hoped to hear because it's what I believed to be the case. I didn't buy at all that most International school kids were off the rails and being poorly raised. As 'madjbs' said, International schools on Phuket are far better than a lot of Government schools in the UK. I would liken them to a good grammar school perhaps.

So we know a decent education is available (at a price) and we know any talk of there not being anything for kids to do is utter nonsense which we shouldn't have even bothered entertaining. So what else is there? What other potential hurdles are there of raising teenagers on Phuket? So far I would say that it's a goer. I'm probably being slightly bias because that's want I want to believe but if you take out the anti Thai/Phuket ramblings of one member, and the desire for every child to be a gold medalist from another, then all the reports have been pretty positive so far.

[thaiIand]

Okay, tell us. What is there to do here for teenagers? Emphasis on the do - not just socialising around malls etc.

Obviously I don't need to answer this question as it has been brilliantly answered by several members already. You started off by saying there was nothing to do but you then seemed to shift it to 'there isn't any clubs to join' So you can do running but you can't join an athletics club. Perhaps that's the case but it's hardly a reason to right a country off as a place to live. Anyhow, I wouldn't mind betting there is a lot of clubs out there that you and I aren't even aware of. Did you know there was an Aikido club in Phuket Town?

And, as for HKPhooey, the weather is the drawback here for sports and activities. People don't go out the house after 10am, then venture out again after 4.30pm - it's too hot for outdoor activities and pursuits. Unless you can show me a list of Thai gold medal winners and sporting achievements, compared to those in the normal expat countries, then you're talking rhubarb.

For me personally the hot weather is far less restricting and easier to work around than English winters, and I'm not sure what the lack of Thai gold medal winners has to do with anything. Russia has quite a good tally of medals but it's the last place I would want to live.

You are being unnecessarily negative if you ask me. For example your argument against cycling and running is that it's dangerous because of all the cars and noodle stands! The island is covered in parks, National parks and quiet areas perfect for bike rides and jogging so that's a very weak point. You seem to be obsessed with clubs, competitions and gold medals. Are you suggesting we need to live in the West just in case our kids are potential Olympic gold medal winners and we would be doing them an injustice living somewhere there's not an athletics club?

I think the lists people have posted proves without question that Phuket offers a multitude of activities for kids and adults alike. Why don't you give us a list of things that you believe are readily available in the West that aren't available in Phuket and we can see how big a problem it really is.

amazing response in bold. Did you know in the west you have a club of everything muncipality funded in every neighborhood with classes every nights in primary schools gymnasiums? Not just one expensive for a massive island where stepping onto a street is more dangerous than going skydiving

[g00dgirl]

that thing where people jump off the cliffs and glide around

lol yeah, I left that out on purpose cause I wasn't entirely comfortable imagining my son doing it ..

seaeagle, it's perfectly safe to run and ride a bicycle if you are in the right area without a lot of traffic, agree with HongKongPhooey,

even online surfing can be educational, you seem to consider it a bad thing, too. . . well then reading books must be bad, too? It all depends on what you read ...

All the sport facilities are all broken down or filled with dog poop?

You don't wanna tell that to Mr. Hebben, the German founder of Thanyapura / Phuket International Academy who spent millions to build new facilities on Phuket.

[HongKongPhooey]

amazing response in bold. Did you know in the west you have a club of everything muncipality funded in every neighborhood with classes every nights in primary schools gymnasiums? Not just one expensive for a massive island where stepping onto a street is more dangerous than going skydiving

In the West? Are you sure about that the West is a very big place. They certainly don't have clubs of everything where I'm from and if they did they certainly wouldn't be free.

I have a house in Phuket and a house in England. The Aikido club in Phuket is about 11 miles nearer to my house than the nearest one to my house in England.

You have already said in another thread that if you couldn't afford an international school on Phuket you were going to take your kids back home when they were old enough to start school. I would hazard a guess that that is the main reason behind you leaving, and your maniacal anti Phuket posts. It's funny how you are living in Phuket now despite how much of a hell hole you believe it is.

When you move back to your home county I believe you will be doing the right thing for both you and your kids. Their education is the most important thing and clearly you are not cut out for life in Phuket.

[thaiIand]

He built his facilities in the middle of nowhere on the most dangerous road of the island. Go ahead and send your 14 year old at 4pm there on their bike. Great idea.

And even if you have a decent facility, its still run by idiots. The manager of the gym/fitness area is as clueless about anything fitness related as kid soldier would be on hanging out with your mom picking out flowers in a field.

guy does not even know what a deadlift is, that means hes never even read "Gym for beginners" Really don't want to know how badly trained are the thai staff.

Edited March 13, 2012 by LivinginKata
Offensive adjective removed

[thaiIand]

In the west i live in a normal neighborhood. Pretty standard. I can leave my house and hop on a bike. 30 meters away there is a bike trail through a park with a baseball+soccer facility. Lot's of open space with trees and a huge kiddie park and ice rink for hockey. Then i can follow that path on one of the main roads that will bring me to many other paths that can bring me to a dozen sports clubs/indoor rink/skate park/city park with lakes, trails, parks, places that teaches you how to grow vegetables and gives everyone a free city lot for it and more free sports facilities and free events in the summer and weekends. There is 13 1$ pools in my city, hundreds of summer camps for all ages, over 30 parks as the one next to my house. There is at least 5 primary school within 7km which all have 3 classes a night that are free or almost free for anyone from 2yo to 99.Anything you can think of. Also you dont need to follow to trails to be safe, you can get on a car and not die as people drive with courtesy. Drugs and booze isnt seen as a crime as its here so kids are free to enjoy without fearing jail so they behave a lot more than in thailand.

Pretty much every area ive ever visited was similar to mine. There is no reason to raise a kid in thailand, you're just putting them through a terrible society and hoping for the best. Even if it works out for the best thats just being result oriented. If i lived in a bad part of the UK as you do, i would simply move to a nordic country. You can enjoy your life when you children are out of the house with great jobs, skills and values.

It might seem that the deadbeatness of the place is a major problem for me, but the biggest one is music.

No music is a terrible way for a child to grow up, music is what saves a lot of troubled kids(not rap). The music culture in thailand is horrible, they have no diversity, no good shows. Just the same thai pop/rock crap that is jsut the same song sung in a difference whiny voice by a different band + the cracking the speaker isaan style pig slaughter. Even the nerd kid can fit in at good music shows and festivals. Here they fight and get killed at <deleted> reaggea shows.

The only reason im still here is that i got late on the visa application and i cant afford to pay 350 000baht and maybe more if they are complications while giving birth at home since we would be late to join in the state-health program.

We spent 1/3 of my kid's life in my country and even though hes very young he's always been more behaved there and happier. He's seen a lot more sunshine too. Done a lot more educational activities and made more friends.

Nothing to do here besides going to a dirty beach full of trash, broken bottles, cig butts, all the outdoor playground and parks and the same. Dirty, filled with dogs, millions thais hiding from the sun and throwing trash away. Saphan hin is dirty and quite boring Saphan Hin's beach area is worst than the only landfilling ive ever seen. Every western beach is dirty unless you get up to mai khao. Never been to the kathu parks but i am sure its no better.

I dont understand how you people can just close your eyes and go nananana when its your child's life you are talking about. Maybe YOU can live with all the crap there is here, maybe YOU can avoid it and be happy with it because of whatever has happened in your life or because you've never given an other expat country a chance or you need the girls and changs but that doesnt mean YOUR child wont succumb to the phuket vibe like everyone else has.

On a last note. I look down on people who can chose to live in a place where people fight in the street to end corruption and end up living in a place wheres kids look up to those people and hope to take their place one day. A place where abusing old elephants that are in sanctuaries is a big joke. A place where calling the cops means paying money. A place where seeing a brain splattered on the street is a common daily occurrence, a place where there is no laws enforced unless someone needs a new car or the perpetrator is white, a place where culture is seen as having little girls of 8years dressed as whores dance(can be replaced by a boring old man just speaking non stop for 5hours about whatever he sees in front of him) on a stage next to the same cheap 10-12 fried food meal repeated in 50 different stalls, A place where parades that is suppose to show patriotism consist of groups of wannabe hisos holding a sign and walking in their nice sunday clothes thinking people care about them with 2 or 3 Chinese dragons moved around by nonchalant kids

could go on forever

Edited March 12, 2012 by thaiIand

[HongKongPhooey]

He built his facilities in the middle of nowhere on the most dangerous road of the island. Go ahead and send your 14 year old at 4pm there on their bike. Great idea.

You really do get all muddled up with these threads don't you.

People who send their kids to PIA don't send them there on their own on a motorbike. You're thinking of Thai kids again.

[HongKongPhooey]

In the west i live in a normal neighborhood. Pretty standard. I can leave my house and hop on a bike. 30 meters away there is a bike trail through a park with a baseball+soccer facility. Lot's of open space with trees and a huge kiddie park and ice rink for hockey.

This is as far as I read and I have one question. Why aren't you living there then?

You're a little self righteous for someone, who this very second is living in Phuket with their child, don't you think? Shouldn't you wait until you get back home to lecture the masses about being in Phuket?

Will you still post on this forum once you get home?

Edited March 12, 2012 by HongKongPhooey

[fiddlehead]

This reminds me of the story of the old man sitting on a bench on the edge of his village.

Another man came up and said 'I've just moved into the village. What's it like here?' The first man replied 'What was it like where you came from?' and the second man said 'Oh, it was lovely, everyone was really friendly.' The first man said 'I think you'll find it pretty much like that here.'

Next day man 1 was on the bench again. Another man came up and said 'I've just moved into the village. What's it like here?' The first man replied 'What was it like where you came from?' and the second man said 'Oh, it was a miserable place, really unfriendly.' The first man said 'I think you'll find it pretty much like that here.'

[Peterocket]

I dont understand how you people can just close your eyes and go nananana when its your child's life you are talking about. Maybe YOU can live with all the crap there is here, maybe YOU can avoid it and be happy with it because of whatever has happened in your life or because you've never given an other expat country a chance or you need the girls and changs but that doesnt mean YOUR child wont succumb to the phuket vibe like everyone else has.

On a last note. I look down on people who can chose to live in a place where people fight in the street to end corruption and end up living in a place wheres kids look up to those people and hope to take their place one day. A place where abusing old elephants that are in sanctuaries is a big joke. A place where calling the cops means paying money. A place where seeing a brain splattered on the street is a common daily occurrence, a place where there is no laws enforced unless someone needs a new car or the perpetrator is white, a place where culture is seen as having little girls of 8years dressed as whores dance(can be replaced by a boring old man just speaking non stop for 5hours about whatever he sees in front of him) on a stage next to the same cheap 10-12 fried food meal repeated in 50 different stalls, A place where parades that is suppose to show patriotism consist of groups of wannabe hisos holding a sign and walking in their nice sunday clothes thinking people care about them with 2 or 3 Chinese dragons moved around by nonchalant kids

could go on forever

Fair enough if that's the only side of Phuket you see but there are likewise a lot of negatives to being brought up in the states or the UK. Schooling is the big thing, if parents cant afford one of the better schools here then I would have thought that would be a big factor.

It is interesting how no-one has made any real mention of what is better about the the west for teenagers than Phuket? Just the usual farang whinging about the police and bike accidents.

[NamKangMan]

HKP, I have a question for you, "Where would you be now and what would be your occupation and how much would you be earning, if you were raised and educated on Phuket?" (yes - I know that is three questions)

Some of the problems I see with raising and educating kids on Phuket are as follows:

1) the International Schools here are not the best. Proper International Schools, like in Bangkok, have the kids of the elite Thai's, diplomats and CEO's of multinational companies attending them. Last time I checked, the cost of one of these schools was around $25,000US a year, non-boarding. So, they are quite expensive. Many foreigners have the school fees thrown into their salary package. These are globally recognised schools, not like the schools on Phuket.

2) assuming your missus is Thai, your kids will be a "50/50" - Thai/farang. This maybe fine in an International School on Phuket, but in the wider Thai community, these kids are discriminated against. Also, you must remember, a lot of the kids at the International Schools in Phuket DO HAVE fathers that sit in a bar all day drinking. They are not all kids who's father is a Manager of Operations for a multination hotel chain on the island. For many of these these kids, mum was a bar girl and dad sold up to retire here and get drunk everyday. These kids are being bought up on a strange mix of Issan, but with money to burn. They will be your kids peers.

3) when your kids turn 18, they WILL have to leave Thailand to have any sort of tertiary education that will be recognised by the west. So, that will most likely mean a university in your home country. Most wealthy Thai's do this, you will have to do the same. A problem may occur with your child's "work ethic." Do they want to leave the sun, sea, sand and Phuket lifestyle, to have to actually do some hard study, and gain a degree? These kids have it easy here, all their life, because daddy farang has a lot of money, by Thai standards.

4) these kids are considered wealthy amongst the wider Thai community of youth, but not accepted, so, in order to gain acceptance, or "status" or "face" with full Thai's, they may engage in risk taking activity, such as alcohol, drugs, racing motorbikes, vandalism, theft etc. Some may also resort to attention seeking through self harm, which can range from simply dying their hair, body peircings, running away to "slashing" themselves. As we will always be "Aliens" here, they will always be "50/50." Some may say Thai's are very "Nationalistic" but, in my own opinion, their nationalistic views boarder on racism. These 50/50 kids will struggle to find out where they fit into Thai society and their mixed heritage may be a barrier to their success in the future, if they remain in Thailand.

5) what opportunity awaits for them, in adulthood, on Phuket, where they can be close to family? The high paying jobs on the island go to extended family members of the 10 families who run the island. Any other job, and they are just earning a few baht, which may still be ok money in Thailand, but nothing abroad. They will have to live in Bangkok to earn any sort of decent money.

Your post basically sets out the "Nature versus Nurture" argument. The "Nature" side of things (genes and chromosones) is already done. The rest is "Nurture." (parenting and environment) I will leave "Parenting" out of my post because every parent is different and every child is different, but let's look at the environment here. Prostitution, drugs, alcohol, violence, collusion, corruption etc all on Phuket. Sure, it is everwhere in the world, but very "in your face" here and is entrenched in Thai society. Do you really want to bring up your kids in an enviroment where if you want something done, you have to pay a bribe? Whilst you maybe able to protect your kids from the scams etc, the seedy side of Phuket will always be there for your children to see, at an impressionable age.

HKP, you have openly stated. "I love Phuket" - but will your kids love Phuket? Will you ask them? If they do not like Phuket, what will you do - will you consider moving? If you see them hanging around with the wrong crowd, getting bad grades etc, will you watch them go down hill, just because YOU love Phuket?

Once again, in my "limited view" I would suggest Phuket is a place to holiday and retire to, not to raise children. I'm not saying it can't be done, successfully, but there are many issues with education infastructure, cultural differences (for both family and friends of the child) language, and emotional wellbeing of the child to consider. Then, as adults, on Phuket, you have their lack of employment opportunities to consider.

Good luck with whatever decision/s you make.

Edited March 13, 2012 by NamKangMan

[madmitch]

One of the better threads I have seen on the Phuket Forum for a while.

Much must depend in where in the west you come from and may return to. I would not want my daughter living and being educated in my old stomping ground in South London, where it is more dangerous on the streets than it is in Phuket, where drugs are probably just as rife and where the kids rule at the schools.

Substitute South London with several other urban areas in the West and you have reasons for staying here.

But the world isn't just dangerous urban sprawls and I believe that my daughter would be better off being educated in the UK at secondary level, outside of these areas. But it's also a case of affordability. Education may be free but housing, bills and general expenditure is not.

It's a personal choice here. What is right for one parent may not suit another and the reasons will vary.

NB I actually agree with thailand with regard to the music scene!

[Valentine]

I did have a fairly lengthy reply to Iceman's post but I lost it when the power went off & cannot be bothered to retype.

Back to the OP. Do not forget that raising kids here they will have the benefit of learning from 2 cultures & from which they can take the best of those cultures & apply to their lives. Teenagers can be difficult no matter where you are & as for the dangers on the roads or being out at night this can apply anywhere. My feeling is as long as you have given them a good moral compass they will be OK but it does not mean you should give them carte blanche. As we all know growing up should be a wondrous experience & parenting, schools cannot teach you everything. We all had to learn & experience things for ourselves & hopefully continue to do so throughout our lives. I occasionally dwell on the fact the kids seemed to grow up too fast & what a wonderful time we had when they were younger, but the wonderful times are not over & new experiences are coming which we will continue to share. Do not forget the Thai side of the impetuous & cheeky nature, the child within, which Thais never seem to lose that help make this place sanuk.

[steelepulse]

>>Education may be free but housing, bills and general expenditure is not.

I went back home with the family last year to have a look around.Granted it was in a nice area, but the so called "free education" is a load of rubbish. When you throw in local property taxes (if you buy a house,which I would), higher income tax rates and generally a higher cost of living, it makes these $15K-25K/year schools here in TH a bargain.

[thaiIand]

again an english perosn.

Visit the good US states, Canada & the other Nordic countries. UK is borderline third world.

[Peterocket]

again an english perosn.

Visit the good US states, Canada & the other Nordic countries. UK is borderline third world.

Oh yeah the good 'ol USA. Your teenagers could play with this guy.

[HongKongPhooey]

HKP, you have openly stated. "I love Phuket" - but will your kids love Phuket? Will you ask them? If they do not like Phuket, what will you do - will you consider moving? If you see them hanging around with the wrong crowd, getting bad grades etc, will you watch them go down hill, just because YOU love Phuket?

The above section of your post is the nail on the head for me. The rest I believe is speculation, guess work, with a lot of worst case scenarios thrown in for good measure.

The bottom line for me is if you are good parents and 100% have your kids best interests as top priority then things will always work out OK.

The question is, if there's a hint that things aren't working out best for your kids are you prepared to jump on the next plane back to the UK, regardless of how much you would rather be in Phuket and regardless of how unhappy it will make you and your wife, and how much worse your life would be. If the answer to that question is yes, (which it has to be) then there shouldn't be a problem.

The kind of parents you are is crucial, and at the risk of sounding arrogant I'm not worried about our abilities in that respect.

If my kids wanted to further their education (I wouldn't try and force them, I'm not one of those people that believe a degree is the be-all and end-all) then the ability to support them financially in Europe (the same as parents would try to do if they were living there anyway) is a must. As is a constant connection with the other half of where they come from.

I don't buy all the lack of culture and music argument, because I always plan for me kids to spend a lot of time in Europe as they're growing up as well, so they as many people have mentioned will be blessed with the best from two different cultures and continents. If financially we would have to be stuck in Phuket and never be able to visit Europe then that could be a key factor in not living here.

Edited March 13, 2012 by HongKongPhooey

[HongKongPhooey]

again an english perosn.

Visit the good US states, Canada & the other Nordic countries. UK is borderline third world.

Where are you from 'thailand'? I really hope English isn't your first language wherever it is.

[thaiIand]

HKP, you have openly stated. "I love Phuket" - but will your kids love Phuket? Will you ask them? If they do not like Phuket, what will you do - will you consider moving? If you see them hanging around with the wrong crowd, getting bad grades etc, will you watch them go down hill, just because YOU love Phuket?

The question is, if there's a hint that things aren't working out best for your kids are you prepared to jump on the next plane back to the UK, regardless of how much you would rather be in Phuket and regardless of how unhappy it will make you and your wife, and how much worse your life would be. If the answer to that question is yes, (which it has to be) then there shouldn't be a problem.

my extreme view comes from the fact that MOST parents in phuket are no where decent enough people to do this.

When i drove my kid to an international school in the morning, i counted more singah chang daddies and bargirl mommies than normal people.

[HongKongPhooey]

my extreme view comes from the fact that MOST parents in phuket are no where decent enough people to do this.

When i drove my kid to an international school in the morning, i counted more singah chang daddies and bargirl mommies than normal people.

Being so quick to judge is a very bad habit.

Perhaps they were thinking the exact same about you!

[NamKangMan]

HKP, you have openly stated. "I love Phuket" - but will your kids love Phuket? Will you ask them? If they do not like Phuket, what will you do - will you consider moving? If you see them hanging around with the wrong crowd, getting bad grades etc, will you watch them go down hill, just because YOU love Phuket?

The above section of your post is the nail on the head for me. The rest I believe is speculation, guess work, with a lot of worst case scenarios thrown in for good measure.

The bottom line for me is if you are good parents and 100% have your kids best interests as top priority then things will always work out OK.

The question is, if there's a hint that things aren't working out best for your kids are you prepared to jump on the next plane back to the UK, regardless of how much you would rather be in Phuket and regardless of how unhappy it will make you and your wife, and how much worse your life would be. If the answer to that question is yes, (which it has to be) then there shouldn't be a problem.

The kind of parents you are is crucial, and at the risk of sounding arrogant I'm not worried about our abilities in that respect.

If my kids wanted to further their education (I wouldn't try and force them, I'm not one of those people that believe a degree is the be-all and end-all) then the ability to support them financially in Europe (the same as parents would try to do if they were living there anyway) is a must. As is a constant connection with the other half of where they come from.

I don't buy all the lack of culture and music argument, because I always plan for me kids to spend a lot of time in Europe as they're growing up as well, so they as many people have mentioned will be blessed with the best from two different cultures and continents. If financially we would have to be stuck in Phuket and never be able to visit Europe then that could be a key factor in not living here.

HKP, I would be interested to know what you think their employment opportunities will be like, in Thailand, near mum and dad, without a Western uni degree? The trades (hair dresser - electrician etc) pay nothing, as you know. Don't quote me on this, but I think many countries do not recognise trades certificates from Thailand. So, for example, a Thai electrician can not go to the UK and work as an electrician because the UK know he has not been properly trained. Even with a western degree, like I posted earlier, the good jobs go to members of the 10 families who own/run Phuket.

I agree with points you have said in your post, BUT, it's not just about being good parents while they are young, in the family home, it's also about the level of education you place them in and the environment in which they grow up in. These are a little out of your control on Phuket, due to availablity and the touristic nature of the island. In the west, it would be governed by your financial position as to what suburb you live in and what school you can afford to send your kids to.

Are you looking 18 years down the track? Do you want your son/daughter earning 8000 baht a month? A western degree would have to be a must, in order to get a decent job here. (here, meaning Thailand)

It really is a conflict of intrests. On one hand, we have foreigners who have worked hard for many years and retired young, or old, who want to live by the beach on Phuket - on the other hand, children come along and the best education, medical, sport, entertainment and safe enviroment for them is not on Phuket. There in, lays the dilema. Mum and Dad's happiness, versus what's truly best for the kids.

[HongKongPhooey]

HKP, I would be interested to know what you think their employment opportunities will be like, in Thailand, near mum and dad, without a Western uni degree? The trades (hair dresser - electrician etc) pay nothing, as you know. Don't quote me on this, but I think many countries do not recognise trades certificates from Thailand. So, for example, a Thai electrician can not go to the UK and work as an electrician because the UK know he has not been properly trained. Even with a western degree, like I posted earlier, the good jobs go to members of the 10 families who own/run Phuket.

I agree with points you have said in your post, BUT, it's not just about being good parents while they are young, in the family home, it's also about the level of education you place them in and the environment in which they grow up in. These are a little out of your control on Phuket, due to availablity and the touristic nature of the island. In the west, it would be governed by your financial position as to what suburb you live in and what school you can afford to send your kids to.

Are you looking 18 years down the track? Do you want your son/daughter earning 8000 baht a month? A western degree would have to be a must, in order to get a decent job here. (here, meaning Thailand)

It really is a conflict of intrests. On one hand, we have foreigners who have worked hard for many years and retired young, or old, who want to live by the beach on Phuket - on the other hand, children come along and the best education, medical, sport, entertainment and safe enviroment for them is not on Phuket. There in, lays the dilema. Mum and Dad's happiness, versus what's truly best for the kids.

I have already addressed your very last line. What's truly best for your kids has to always come before mum and dads happiness. For the sake of this argument I think we all need to take that as a given. The very topic we are discussing is whether or not we can do the right thing by our kids while living in Phuket so bringing bad parents in to the topic as many have is pointless. We are starting the discussion from the point where wanting to do what's best for our kids is a given.

I think you are missing the point some what when you talk about work opportunities in Thailand. With a decent education, the ability to further your education or training in Europe if and when the need arises then why would their work opportunities be limited to Thailand? I can safely say my kids will have a better education than I had. They will have far more knowledge of the world and be far better travelled than I ever was, and they will have had a far more interesting diverse enjoyable childhood than I ever did, and my childhood was nice and normal.

As somebody else said, people are pointing out the potential pit falls of living here but not pointing out any great advantages of living in the UK for example. I have said I believe the International schools in Thailand are better than the average free school in the UK, so that's not an argument. You have to pay for your kids to go to Uni these days so that remains the same no matter where you are based.

I think you are looking at the worst case scenario in Phuket and comparing it to the best case scenario in the West. Even the best case scenario in the West just isn't that great any more. If the Uni education was free in the UK for example and by living in Phuket I would be unable to support my kids through Uni in the West, THEN you would have a logical argument, but neither is the case, so I'm afraid I don't think you do. If I have to move back to the UK when my kids want to go to Uni then so be it. Baring in mind lots of kids go off and study abroad on their own anyway and with family members in the UK then the options are plenty. I think you are finding problems where they don't exist. I'm looking to assess the problems that do exist like crime and violence and their safety while they are teenagers. That's the only thing that concerns me.

[boogie]

I have been following this thread with interest as I am also exploring the possibility of living in Thailand, although not Phuket. As HKP has stated such a move has to put the kids future first and foremost.

I have done a fair bit of research into schools and areas to live and I feel that given the right school my children could get a very good education right up until the IB qualifications, which would potentially allow them to go on to University. My biggest concern is what would they do having finished school at 18 or so.

As I understand it ( and I stand to be corrected ) in order to qualify as a UK student at a UK university you have to be ordinarily resident in the UK for three years prior to beginning the course. Otherwise you would have to pay much higher overseas student fees. That is of course if the children have the ability or desire to go on to university. So in reality if this was the course they wanted then you would really have to return to the UK to live when they are around 15yrs old, probably not worth the disruption of uprooting them from school and resettling all over again.

Are there any other options ? I can't think of any but would be interested to hear what others think.