Crackdown On Land Owned By Foreign Residents

[frankxxxxxxxxxx]

5555 cannot stop laughing 5555...

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[tlansford]

Another bullshit story. We are not allowed to own land so all the land 'owned by foreigners' is actually owned by Thais, be it nominees or people like jay and me. The Thais still own it.

The Amity Treaty enables American citizens to own up to 1 rai of land. It has not been modified or annulled to date.

Thanks - I'll have to look that up.

[FangFerang]

So the unscrupulous wives have another way to rip off husbands? Quick scenario: one tells police, "He made me be his appointee." She gets a reward for turning him in. They confiscate the house and deport him. She owns the land already, and gets the reward money and house as bonus prizes.

That's right bonus prizes, and for a limited time only, you too can get in on this land grab fueled by the latest pusillanimous party in power and claim what is rightfully someone else's! The first 100 callers will receive a tablet computer and free iPhone! But there's more, so much more... If you smile when you pay the right tea money and testify on TV to make solid our patriotic whims being pandered as pride, you will receive a second bonus award in nationalistic sympathy and momentary fame.

Act now! Operators are standing by. dial 080-LAR-CENY. Thai nationals only, please.

[sandpaper]

Well, if they take measures to stop foreigners from owning land in Thailand, then I think it should be fair that all other countries do the same towards Thai nationals, don't you think? Anyone can own land in other countries, so why should it be different here? That's discrimination, don't you think so?

[makescents]

National Institute of Development Administration (NIDA) lecturer Piyanuch Potawanich warned that the launch of the Asean Economic Community (AEC) in 2015 would lead to more foreigners using nominees to own Thai land, especially Singaporeans, who were smart, had money and needed to invest for profit. Among many solutions, she also urged laws to punish nominees and deport any foreigners who do wrong.

That's an interesting point.

With the AEC around the corner it may be possible to use a Singaporean as a nominee to buy Thai land. It's also probable that you could enforce the nominee status in Singapore.

[simon43]

she has maintained her maiden name here in Thailand so as she can still own and buy land

References to Thai spouses not being allowed to own land are incorrect since the relevant law was repealed many years ago. A Thai spouse of a foreigner has equal rights as any other Thai person, regardless of whether or not she/he has adopted the surname of her foreign spouse.

[Nisa]

If you are a citizen you can buy land. If you are not a citizen then nothing is preventing a foreigner, legally in the country, with a Thai family from building and living in a home with their Thai family. The property just needs to be in one of their Thai family's name.

It may be a dismissive "just" to you, but then it's not you doing it. Perhaps if you have experienced relationship break-ups you could begin to get some idea of what happens and how devastating it can be psychologically and financially. Many men don't want to run that risk, and why should they be forced to, by being required to give all their life-time accumulated assets to someone else on trust alone, with no safeguards whatsoever?

Be it my ex in the US or my wife in Thailand ... I expect to loose at least 50% of what I/we have acquired in the marriage. In the US when I had kids and a house, I certainly didn't expect to get the house and expected my wife to remain in the house with the kids. So, lets no be so over dramatic.

But if you are that worried about your finances upon a possible break-up then don't marry a Thai girl and live in Thailand. No different than if you have strong Christian values you want to pass on to your kids then don't marry a Jew or a Muslim. If your big concern is having a skinny wife then stay away from one with fat parents or that eats a lot and sits on their a@@ all day.

If you don't want to buy a house for the person you want to spend the rest of your life with and aren't willing to allow her to keep that house if you break-up then don't buy the house. If you want to buy a house and commit to a wife you can kick out anytime then don't live in Thailand or many other places.

Why is this so complicated? It is no like they changed the laws here all of a sudden. Anyone planning a life here should know these things. Nobody is forcing you to have a Thai wife and family and/or live in Thailand let alone buy a home. By the way, you can buy a condo or rent/lease a house.

I guess that's the difference... if some people feel strongly that something is wrong and needs changing, they try to change it, while others are content to accept the status quo. I wonder how many foreigners know about, or even think about, the real estate law when they fall in love with a Thai and marry one. It should be compulsory reading for all.

BTW, the "wife you can kick out anytime" slur was beneath contempt. You should be truly ashamed of that remark. You must be mixing in the wrong circles.

You are being overly dramatic over an issue of law that is common knowledge and is far from uncommon in many countries. And prey tell do tell us all how you are going about changing the law ... complaining on Thaivisa and making numerous assertions about the law that are incorrect?

[FangFerang]

Sometimes, as a lark, I let my imagination walk down unexpected sois....

I wonder if some of these spokespeople read Thai Visa Forum, and come up with the craziest, most retarded things to say. They vote on the most outlandish declaration of the week and prepare. Then they hold a press conference. Right after releasing the "news", they crack open five or six bottles of mekong, and do shots whenever a post tickles their translator's fancy so much that it takes him an hour to translate it.

Nah. Sorry.

None of them have a translator.

[letitbe]

I don't know if this is 100% correct. I'm married and when we bought this house I had to sign papers that were submitted to the land office when the land deed was changed over to my wife's name stating that all the money used to purchase the land was hers and I have no claim to it. Her name is listed as the owner of the land. At the same time we also registered a 30 year lease that I have on the land (small taxes paid) so my name as well is listed on the land dead and the lease holder. She clearly owns the land but cannot go selling it while I hold a lease on the land. From what I've been told, no lease in Thailand is valid for more than 1 year UNLESS it's registered at the land office. When you register the lease you also pay the taxes on the lease payments for the entire lease term (in this case 30 years).

if you dont trust your wife dont marry - its simple. My thai wife of 17 years now and 2 children own almost all our assets since I gave it to them. People call me stupid but I would hate to be one of those who constantly worry their wives are going to take them for a ride. Its pathetic just rent a wife and I am 100% ++ agree with not letting forang own any land here and hope for our childrens sake that never changes.

[Nisa]

Well, if they take measures to stop foreigners from owning land in Thailand, then I think it should be fair that all other countries do the same towards Thai nationals, don't you think? Anyone can own land in other countries, so why should it be different here? That's discrimination, don't you think so?

Because a country has different laws than another it is discrimination? Are you aware of how many countries do not allow foreigners to own land? Countries all over the world have different laws regarding foreign investment and not only different economies but different stages of where they are in in their growth. Is it discrimination that the UK or the US will not allow a Thai to enter their country without a visa but Thais allow both countries to allow their citizens to freely travel here?

How much can we pick apart a law that is not uncommon and serves the interest of a country and its own people?

[chiangmaibruce]

The Amity Treaty enables American citizens to own up to 1 rai of land. It has not been modified or annulled to date.

Thanks - I'll have to look that up.

Don't bother, it's a myth. The Treaty specifically excludes ownership of land

Edited March 13, 2012 by chiangmaibruce

[Nisa]

I don't know if this is 100% correct. I'm married and when we bought this house I had to sign papers that were submitted to the land office when the land deed was changed over to my wife's name stating that all the money used to purchase the land was hers and I have no claim to it. Her name is listed as the owner of the land. At the same time we also registered a 30 year lease that I have on the land (small taxes paid) so my name as well is listed on the land dead and the lease holder. She clearly owns the land but cannot go selling it while I hold a lease on the land. From what I've been told, no lease in Thailand is valid for more than 1 year UNLESS it's registered at the land office. When you register the lease you also pay the taxes on the lease payments for the entire lease term (in this case 30 years).

if you dont trust your wife dont marry - its simple. My thai wife of 17 years now and 2 children own almost all our assets since I gave it to them. People call me stupid but I would hate to be one of those who constantly worry their wives are going to take them for a ride. Its pathetic just rent a wife and I am 100% ++ agree with not letting forang own any land here and hope for our childrens sake that never changes.

If people call you stupid it says a lot about them. More power to you for making a happy life here and instead of whining and moaning about what you cannot change.

[letitbe]

So the unscrupulous wives have another way to rip off husbands? Quick scenario: one tells police, "He made me be his appointee." She gets a reward for turning him in. They confiscate the house and deport him. She owns the land already, and gets the reward money and house as bonus prizes.

That's right bonus prizes, and for a limited time only, you too can get in on this land grab fueled by the latest pusillanimous party in power and claim what is rightfully someone else's! The first 100 callers will receive a tablet computer and free iPhone! But there's more, so much more... If you smile when you pay the right tea money and testify on TV to make solid our patriotic whims being pandered as pride, you will receive a second bonus award in nationalistic sympathy and momentary fame.

Act now! Operators are standing by. dial 080-LAR-CENY. Thai nationals only, please.

So the unscrupulous wives have another way to rip off husbands? Quick scenario: one tells police, "He made me be his appointee." She gets a reward for turning him in. They confiscate the house and deport him. She owns the land already, and gets the reward money and house as bonus prizes.

That's right bonus prizes, and for a limited time only, you too can get in on this land grab fueled by the latest pusillanimous party in power and claim what is rightfully someone else's! The first 100 callers will receive a tablet computer and free iPhone! But there's more, so much more... If you smile when you pay the right tea money and testify on TV to make solid our patriotic whims being pandered as pride, you will receive a second bonus award in nationalistic sympathy and momentary fame.

Act now! Operators are standing by. dial 080-LAR-CENY. Thai nationals only, please.

and i hope they do to teach all those forang who try and get round the law and dont trust their wives a lesson. If you decide you cant trust your wife your very likely not to be disappointed but then why did u marry in the first place. I loathe all those forang who marry then spend all their time worrying how they can stop their wives taking them to the cleaners. Total idiots. If after 17+ years my wife takes it all so be it.

[dustybooky]

Every time I read or hear about this, I'm reminded that not all "foreigners" are born equal in the LoS.

My landlady is snapping up land 50 / 60 rais at a fast clip, pays top baht.

She and her husband, kids have Thai passports.

They came here less than 5 years ago from China.

The land is in a Thai cousin's name but what about the passports?

Maybe the passports are a bit too new to have her cousin sell her back the land for 1 baht, go figure.

In the meantime poor Thais split 1 to 3% commissions 15 ways and are sometimes landless themselves.

D

[tlansford]

The Amity Treaty enables American citizens to own up to 1 rai of land. It has not been modified or annulled to date.

Thanks - I'll have to look that up.

Don't bother, it's a myth. The Treaty specifically excludes ownership of land

I think you are right. I did not find anything that allowed for Americans to own up to 1 rai of land.

[letitbe]

I don't know if this is 100% correct. I'm married and when we bought this house I had to sign papers that were submitted to the land office when the land deed was changed over to my wife's name stating that all the money used to purchase the land was hers and I have no claim to it. Her name is listed as the owner of the land. At the same time we also registered a 30 year lease that I have on the land (small taxes paid) so my name as well is listed on the land dead and the lease holder. She clearly owns the land but cannot go selling it while I hold a lease on the land. From what I've been told, no lease in Thailand is valid for more than 1 year UNLESS it's registered at the land office. When you register the lease you also pay the taxes on the lease payments for the entire lease term (in this case 30 years).

if you dont trust your wife dont marry - its simple. My thai wife of 17 years now and 2 children own almost all our assets since I gave it to them. People call me stupid but I would hate to be one of those who constantly worry their wives are going to take them for a ride. Its pathetic just rent a wife and I am 100% ++ agree with not letting forang own any land here and hope for our childrens sake that never changes.

If people call you stupid it says a lot about them. More power to you for making a happy life here and instead of whining and moaning about what you cannot change.

I don't know if this is 100% correct. I'm married and when we bought this house I had to sign papers that were submitted to the land office when the land deed was changed over to my wife's name stating that all the money used to purchase the land was hers and I have no claim to it. Her name is listed as the owner of the land. At the same time we also registered a 30 year lease that I have on the land (small taxes paid) so my name as well is listed on the land dead and the lease holder. She clearly owns the land but cannot go selling it while I hold a lease on the land. From what I've been told, no lease in Thailand is valid for more than 1 year UNLESS it's registered at the land office. When you register the lease you also pay the taxes on the lease payments for the entire lease term (in this case 30 years).

if you dont trust your wife dont marry - its simple. My thai wife of 17 years now and 2 children own almost all our assets since I gave it to them. People call me stupid but I would hate to be one of those who constantly worry their wives are going to take them for a ride. Its pathetic just rent a wife and I am 100% ++ agree with not letting forang own any land here and hope for our childrens sake that never changes.

If people call you stupid it says a lot about them. More power to you for making a happy life here and instead of whining and moaning about what you cannot change.

thanks i meet very few forang who cant understand that not all Thai women are dishonest and in my experience most if not all problems are caused by not being 100% honest with each other from the start. The biggest problem mostly is due to the ladies relatives who have been told all forang have endless wealth. This is the real issue which must be 100% agreed on from the start and kept to 100%. Its not easy since all Thai girls are brought up to believe their one duty is to their parents. I was fortunate in finding a lady who decided she would not be bound by that although we both agreed if her mother was hungry or in terrible need we would of course help. It was probably more difficult for my wife than me since all around her the other wives were sending money to their parents (without their husbands knowing) but in end she told her mother and family if she had to choose between she would choose me. This is more due to her need to be free of what she calls this awful system. Why she has this view I dont know since she comes from a very poor family. Her family stopped asking after a few years and then we did help a little for her mother but nothing for rest of her family. Their is nothing wrong with helping your wives family if they deserve it but sadly many are greedy vultures who will try and bleed their daughters husband dry. I am most thankful that I am perhaps so far one of I estimate 10% or less where marriage works well and in my experience age has little bearing on chance of success.

[Screws]

Obviously a lot of farangs are involved with this subject. I'll keep my ears and eyes open to see how I can protect myself. Maybe renting is the best option......

'Maybe renting is the best option.....'

Absolutely. Assets elsewhere, income here.

Otherwise your assets (& your ass), will be nowhere.

[Theoutsider]

Obviously a lot of farangs are involved with this subject. I'll keep my ears and eyes open to see how I can protect myself. Maybe renting is the best option......

'Maybe renting is the best option.....'

Absolutely. Assets elsewhere, income here.

Otherwise your assets (& your ass), will be nowhere.

Depends on who's paying the rent

And she got more assets than me.

Granted I don't expect to get 50/50 ( maybe I'm cynical or maybe I read Thai visa to much )

Edited March 13, 2012 by Theoutsider

[ParadiseLost]

Of near 200 countries in the World Thailand rates in the top 15 for International Tourism and or 3rd in all the Asia Pacific Region. Clearly there should be no arguing it is considered a top tourist destinations and that the number of arriving international) tourists .continues to trend up ... not down as so many people wish or want to believe.

The figures do of course include all the legally married, employed and long term legal non-residents who are forced to visit nearby countries to obtain visas, or just get a re-entry stamp - a practice which is ridiculed and hated by all and is discriminative and demeaning beyond belief; I wonder how you would feel being treated like a criminal every time you encounter an official, or being told that you are trying to 'steal' from the people of the nation you choose to live quite legally in. This is by the very people who are stealing as much as they can.

It's time ordinary Thai folk wake up to the harsh reality that they are being kept like mushrooms, fed on sh1t like this article and kept in the dark regarding the true land-grabbers.

There is a saying that whenever you point a finger at someone, there are three pointing back at you...

[Jimi007]

Why not go after Thais that allowed and profited from the illegal land holdings as well? Don't bother to respond, we all know the answer...

Maybe because they didn't break the law?

Right! Only farang break Thai laws... Except maybe in Phuket:

[RogueLeader]

I don't know if this is 100% correct. I'm married and when we bought this house I had to sign papers that were submitted to the land office when the land deed was changed over to my wife's name stating that all the money used to purchase the land was hers and I have no claim to it. Her name is listed as the owner of the land. At the same time we also registered a 30 year lease that I have on the land (small taxes paid) so my name as well is listed on the land dead and the lease holder. She clearly owns the land but cannot go selling it while I hold a lease on the land. From what I've been told, no lease in Thailand is valid for more than 1 year UNLESS it's registered at the land office. When you register the lease you also pay the taxes on the lease payments for the entire lease term (in this case 30 years).

You have no claim whatsoever on the land. If she wants to sell it, she can: if a dispute goes before a Thai court, they'll decide in favour of your wife and you will lose the land, the house and every single penny you've ever invested in it. You need to hang on to that marriage if you wish to remain in that house and on that land.

Harsh facts of expat life.

Edited March 13, 2012 by RogueLeader

[Jayman]

I don't know if this is 100% correct. I'm married and when we bought this house I had to sign papers that were submitted to the land office when the land deed was changed over to my wife's name stating that all the money used to purchase the land was hers and I have no claim to it. Her name is listed as the owner of the land. At the same time we also registered a 30 year lease that I have on the land (small taxes paid) so my name as well is listed on the land dead and the lease holder. She clearly owns the land but cannot go selling it while I hold a lease on the land. From what I've been told, no lease in Thailand is valid for more than 1 year UNLESS it's registered at the land office. When you register the lease you also pay the taxes on the lease payments for the entire lease term (in this case 30 years).

You have no claim whatsoever on the land. If she wants to sell it, she can: if a dispute goes before a Thai court, they'll decide in favour of your wife and you will lose the land, the house and every single penny you've ever invested in it. You need to hang on to that marriage if you wish to remain in that house and on that land.

Harsh facts of expat life.

Thanks for your harsh take on life here in LOS. Have you been burned few times I guess? I didn't get married so I could buy a house. Nor did I have a few kids to insure I could keep getting visas. I did so out of love for my wife. The house was not bought as an investment but rather a place for my family to live. I know that many like to think that all thai women are out for the money and if you stop giving they will take all from you. I have no doubt that "our" family house will end up in the hands of my 2 children and that I will not be kicked to the streets like some temple dog.

But I'm sorry to hear that this might have happened to you.

[swisstouristpattaya]

only a fool buy here,smart men like me rent and keep low profile.

all the ownerships through companies exist to f... you up at the end.married,give her all,and she will quit you,ahah....house gone,and she will deport you like a bum,ahah....

buy even condo and you will feel your pain very soon.

thailand=rent land....

[CARLIN]

only a fool buy here,smart men like me rent and keep low profile.

all the ownerships through companies exist to f... you up at the end.married,give her all,and she will quit you,ahah....house gone,and she will deport you like a bum,ahah....

buy even condo and you will feel your pain very soon.

thailand=rent land....

Think that sumed it up

.

[ttelise]

Thais are not very smart. I actually encourage them to continue down their path and see where it gets them. Stuff like this and their little political frenzy are building blocks for a great and prosperous country. I think it speaks volumes that they would even articulate such a concern. Interesting when an entire race cannot see the forest for the trees and has a complete inability to address the root of their problems.

[RogueLeader]

I don't know if this is 100% correct. I'm married and when we bought this house I had to sign papers that were submitted to the land office when the land deed was changed over to my wife's name stating that all the money used to purchase the land was hers and I have no claim to it. Her name is listed as the owner of the land. At the same time we also registered a 30 year lease that I have on the land (small taxes paid) so my name as well is listed on the land dead and the lease holder. She clearly owns the land but cannot go selling it while I hold a lease on the land. From what I've been told, no lease in Thailand is valid for more than 1 year UNLESS it's registered at the land office. When you register the lease you also pay the taxes on the lease payments for the entire lease term (in this case 30 years).

You have no claim whatsoever on the land. If she wants to sell it, she can: if a dispute goes before a Thai court, they'll decide in favour of your wife and you will lose the land, the house and every single penny you've ever invested in it. You need to hang on to that marriage if you wish to remain in that house and on that land.

Harsh facts of expat life.

Thanks for your harsh take on life here in LOS. Have you been burned few times I guess? I didn't get married so I could buy a house. Nor did I have a few kids to insure I could keep getting visas. I did so out of love for my wife. The house was not bought as an investment but rather a place for my family to live. I know that many like to think that all thai women are out for the money and if you stop giving they will take all from you. I have no doubt that "our" family house will end up in the hands of my 2 children and that I will not be kicked to the streets like some temple dog.

But I'm sorry to hear that this might have happened to you.

Whoa. Steady. You've assumed a lot of things there.

It hasn't happened to me. I've never had any sort of sexual relationship with any Thai woman and I'm not especially interested in doing so. But every time I'm in Thailand I look around me with eyes unclouded by lust and uncoloured by bitterness towards women, either Thai or Western and I see, almost without exception, men being stung. if you're one of the ones who managed to do it well and properly (and I know a few of them) and you and you aren't partly a farang ATM, then well done. But when you say:

She clearly owns the land but cannot go selling it while I hold a lease on the land

You are just factually wrong. She can sell it. Obviously you're very secure in your situation and this isn't a problem for you, but you need to be aware that this simply is not true.

You've clearly been in Thailand for some time and are no mug, so you know that your wife fully expects you to take financial care of her and to a certain extent, her extended family for the rest of her life. It's the biggest mistake that most expats make, the meaning of 'I love you'.

[Jayman]

Whoa. Steady. You've assumed a lot of things there. It hasn't happened to me. I've never had any sort of sexual relationship with any Thai woman and I'm not especially interested in doing so. But every time I'm in Thailand I look around me with eyes unclouded by lust and uncoloured by bitterness towards women, either Thai or Western and I see, almost without exception, men being stung. if you're one of the ones who managed to do it well and properly (and I know a few of them) and you and you aren't partly a farang ATM, then well done. But when you say:

She clearly owns the land but cannot go selling it while I hold a lease on the land

You are just factually wrong. She can sell it. Obviously you're very secure in your situation and this isn't a problem for you, but you need to be aware that this simply is not true. You've clearly been in Thailand for some time and are no mug, so you know that your wife fully expects you to take financial care of her and to a certain extent, her extended family for the rest of her life. It's the biggest mistake that most expats make, the meaning of 'I love you'.

So if they bank is listed on the land deed as the lien holder it CANNOT be sold but if a farang is listed on the land deed as the lien holder it can?

Ok.. if you say so.

[Jayman]

I don't know if this is 100% correct. I'm married and when we bought this house I had to sign papers that were submitted to the land office when the land deed was changed over to my wife's name stating that all the money used to purchase the land was hers and I have no claim to it. Her name is listed as the owner of the land. At the same time we also registered a 30 year lease that I have on the land (small taxes paid) so my name as well is listed on the land dead and the lease holder. She clearly owns the land but cannot go selling it while I hold a lease on the land. From what I've been told, no lease in Thailand is valid for more than 1 year UNLESS it's registered at the land office. When you register the lease you also pay the taxes on the lease payments for the entire lease term (in this case 30 years).

You have no claim whatsoever on the land. If she wants to sell it, she can: if a dispute goes before a Thai court, they'll decide in favour of your wife and you will lose the land, the house and every single penny you've ever invested in it. You need to hang on to that marriage if you wish to remain in that house and on that land.

Harsh facts of expat life.

Thanks for your harsh take on life here in LOS. Have you been burned few times I guess? I didn't get married so I could buy a house. Nor did I have a few kids to insure I could keep getting visas. I did so out of love for my wife. The house was not bought as an investment but rather a place for my family to live. I know that many like to think that all thai women are out for the money and if you stop giving they will take all from you. I have no doubt that "our" family house will end up in the hands of my 2 children and that I will not be kicked to the streets like some temple dog.

But I'm sorry to hear that this might have happened to you.

Whoa. Steady. You've assumed a lot of things there.

It hasn't happened to me. I've never had any sort of sexual relationship with any Thai woman and I'm not especially interested in doing so. But every time I'm in Thailand I look around me with eyes unclouded by lust and uncoloured by bitterness towards women, either Thai or Western and I see, almost without exception, men being stung. if you're one of the ones who managed to do it well and properly (and I know a few of them) and you and you aren't partly a farang ATM, then well done.

I said sorry if this "might" have happened to you. I don't assume anything including that you know what you are talking about. You now state that you have no first hand knowledge abut what you are talking about but rather what you have seen with your eyes walking around thailand.

Ok. Well just cause some poster on TV prints something doesn't make it so. I am more interested in what the law says and even more so in 1st hand experience in a given situation. All the air chair experts can spread whatever observations they want but unless they are a thai lawyer or experienced it first hand I will not give too much weight to what they are saying.

[goober]

They only have to raid the 100's of law offices who have all the information on the companies owners and holdings.

Scary indeed.

[gamini]

This statement is ridiculous. "foreigners owning land through their Thai wives" He can't own the land. period.

As as for the Land department getting foreigners Thai wives to state that the land was bought with their own money is even more ridiculous. Just imagine a Thai man married to a foreigner being asked to this.If I give my wife 10 million baht as a present it becomes her money. If she buys land the day after she is buying it with her money. case closed. The wife can not in any way be termed as a nominee.

However if land is bought through a Thai Company with the wife as a a shareholder, I don't think that there is any problem either.