Foreign-Owned Thailand

[webfact]

Foreign-owned Thailand

BANGKOK: -- Other than the issues of land ownership and public land encroachment problems, another serious problem is the hoarding of Thai land by foreigners. This issue was brought to light during a seminar organized by the Senate on land ownership frauds in which many foreigners, by whatever means, are allowed to own real estate properties in the country.

According to Ombudsman Sriracha Charoenpanich, a third of all the land in country, approximately 100 million rai, is now owned by foreigners through economic and legal loopholes.

After the 1997 financial crisis and the drive to promote direct foreign investments, any foreigner, in possession of more than one million U.S. dollar in assets in Thailand, is permitted to own real estates in Thailand. It is unsettling that up to 90 percent of land along Ban Phe Beach in Rayong Province are now under foreign ownership. Meanwhile, about 30 percent of prime real estates in some popular beach towns such as Pattaya or Hua Hin are now owned by non-Thais. The similar trend could be seen elsewhere in Phuket Province and Koh Samui Island. Foreigners could easily own Thai land through marriages with Thai citizens or nominee companies.

A law expert of the National institute of Development Administration believes that the problem will be more severe, especially after the formation of the ASEAN Economic Community om 2015. Foreign investors may try to exploit the legal loopholes to buy up prime real estates. Thailand must gear up and integrate its enforcement agencies to be more effective. The real estate laws need to be revised with more strict penalties in place and the foreigners who break them must be deported out of the country.

The problem of proxy land ownership by non-citizens must be addressed soon before a large chunk of the country falls under foreign ownership. The laws have to be modified to stop real estate ownership frauds in order to preserve Thailand for our future generations.

Translated and Rewritten by Kongkrai Maksrivorawan.

-- Tan Network 2012-03-15

[rogerman]

The biggest problem other than their fat heads, alter ego's, and inflamed pride is that there won't be much of a future generation as most people will have fled the country

[wolf5370]

The thing is "by proxy" is meaningless. The fact is that almost none of the land is owned by foreigners - some held by Thai spouses (the key being "Thai" spouses) with no long term recourse to the foreigner if that spouse should die. The rest is held in companies that are majority owned by Thais - as this is what the laws says in relation to companies owning land. This is just the usual baloney.

The question should be asked - if lland was owned bt foreigners, so what? They can't exactly take it home with them. They are paying at least the same taxes and fees on that land. What is the issue? The usual klap-trap about foreigners pricing out locals is spouted in answer - and it is just that klap-trap. At the moment wealthy Thais control the prices of land in areas - and in some areas certainly have pushed locals out. Wealthy Thais buy up tracts of land nad build condos in tourist and popular areas that local Thais could not afford. Most foreigners would want land to live on. If it was on some idea of investment, then there are about a million better places on earth to invest in land on - places where land prices increase and ownership is guaranteed and there are laws to stop neighbours doing whatever they like "next door" to devalue your land.

If foreigners could ow land, then there would be a new invigoration in land/property markets, and a move away from the monopolistic status quo. It's not hard to see the real meaning behind such report as this - its just flag waving, blaming the foreigner and turning attention away from the large corrupt and illegal practises perpatrated by wealthy land owning (encroching) Thais.

Edit: Just to add...

A law expert of the National institute of Development Administration believes that the problem will be more severe, especially after the formation of the ASEAN Economic Community om 2015. Foreign investors may try to exploit the legal loopholes to buy up prime real estates. Thailand must gear up and integrate its enforcement agencies to be more effective. The real estate laws need to be revised with more strict penalties in place and the foreigners who break them must be deported out of the country.

...Does this sound like a ploy to get grubby hands on said prime real estate me wonders!

Edited March 15, 2012 by wolf5370

[ratcatcher]

Sriracha Charoenpanich = xenophobe.

Edited March 15, 2012 by ratcatcher

[AlexDorneles]

I agree with the Thais to a certain extend. In my country (Brazil) foreigners could own unlimited amounts of land until a few years ago. You know what happened? The Chinese came in and bought vast amounts of agriculture land, I am talking about huge areas that equal the size of small countries in Europe. They come in <snip> up the soil with their polluting pesticides and herbicides all to produce food mostly for their cattle back in China. This is a real problem in Brazil nowadays and many other countries in South America. In Panama, central America they did the same thing, the tip of the country on the pacific side is almost entirely owned by Chinese companies, not even the Panamanians can get in there. I would not be surprised they are doing this in Thailand because of the Chinese.

Edited March 15, 2012 by metisdead
Profanity removed.

[givenall]

Hey Thailand grow up you want our money, but don’t want to give up anything. Think again

[bigbamboo]

You can understand why Thailand has this fear of foreigners buying up their prime land and forcing out the 'ordinary Thai' but in reality it is the rich, well connected Thais who do this anyway.

Quite where the ombudsman gets these inflated figures from I don't know..... maybe by using the same abacus TAT uses perhaps?

[laurentbkk]

I know some Thais who bought a vineyard and castle in Europe , they could buy it without any problem , where is the problem for foreigner to own lands in here ...Its time to grow up and stop to believe the bad white people want to own everything .... so I would ask this question : What about Thais who own lands abroad ? shall we ask our government to make a law just for Thais who buy lands in my country? I dont think so .....

[HeavyDrinker]

All this is, is laying the foundations so the Powers That Be can get their hands on this land for their own means while claiming to be acting in the "National Interest".

Sadly the population in general are so kept in the dark that they'll swallow it all and think "Ombudsmen" like this chap are heroes.

[wolf5370]

In a country with a real press, this muppet would have his story and figures ripped apart (and the reasons behind such a statement protrayed and villified) - but in Thailand, where you can go to jail for saying the truth about someone and embarrassing them, anyhting that is said by the powers that be just get regurgatated verbatum by the media.

[airconsult]

It's interesting that he's making such a noise about this when in other news...

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/540896-phuket-phang-na-krabi-land-encroachment-to-be-probed/

The Royal Forestry Department seems to know who is buying, and who is incorrectly assessing by aerial photo.

I still think he's trying to distract everyone.

[thaicbr]

Thailand IS majority owned by Foreign interests. Chinese Thais.

Some live in Dubai.

[givenall]

When everything fails, use Nationalism, terrorism, capitalism to scare the people and may be they will not see the truth

[bangkockney]

Use of loopholes is not fraud, so stop tarnishing people with this rubbish.

[Kilgore Trout]

This idea is clearly a lie perpetuated by those in power to turn criticism against them to a scapegoat; is it no surprise that that scapegoat is "foreigners?"

But I'm sure most Thais will be wise enough to see through the BS...................NOT!!

Quite predictable and unimaginative; two concepts which describe Thailand and its peoples well.

[bigbamboo]

Use of loopholes is not fraud, so stop tarnishing people with this rubbish.

A law with a loophole is worthless.

Edited March 15, 2012 by bigbamboo

[NanLaew]

So foreigners own 30%, the military 20%, state-owned enterprises 20%, the Crown has another 20% and temples have the remaining 10%.

Wow! The disenfranchised Thai has bugger all after all!

It's all smoke and mirrors anyway as land area is a 2-dimensional premise whereas what is built on the land is a 3-dimensional construct. That's why you can have thousands of people shoehorned into government blocks or hundreds of foreigners jammed into condominiums. Look at the population density of Hong Kong versus Bangkok for example. At the end of the day, there's much, much more Thai people living in Thai-owned houses, apartments and condominiums on Thai-owned land than there are foreigners living in 'foreign-owned' condominiums or on 'foreign-owned' farms.

[Thai at Heart]

Yawn.

How many foreigners have their name on a chanote? Virtually none

How many chanotes are in the hands of THAI companies with minority foreign shareholders? Thousands

How many chanotes are in the hands of THAI people with foreign spouses? Thousands

So is he saying he will crack down on Thais?

Xenophobic statements for the gallery. The paper these statements are written on isn't even worthy of fish and chip wrapper. Bog roll would be too good for it..

[andre47]

There are no real loopholes. The actual laws are very clear. Foreigners cannot own land in Thailand. Most of the foreigners who are thinking that they are owning land are wrong. They don't own it. If the Thai goverment wants all these foreigners will loose "their" land very quick. Be warned! Farangs have no real rights here in Thailand.

[Thai at Heart]

There are no real loopholes. The actual laws are very clear. Foreigners cannot own land in Thailand. Most of the foreigners who are thinking that they are owning land are wrong. They don't own it. If the Thai goverment wants all these foreigners will loose "their" land very quick. Be warned! Farangs have no real rights here in Thailand.

How can you lose something you never had?

[hgma]

well.....my experience is that incase subjects like this one comes up ....immigration will follow up.

its fasten our visa seatbelt time again.......,i am buckled in already (extension in april)

[billd766]

I live on 14 rai of land with my wife and son and she also has a shop and restaurant on another 10 rai of land.

How much of that land is mine?

Err zero.

How much of the land is my wife's?

All of it.

How much will go to our son when she dies?

All of it.

We are planning on putting all the land etc in our son's name this year anyway.

For me there is no problem about owning land in any country.

I can't dig it up and take it back to the country I came from and when I am dead it doesn't really matter.

Edited for bad spelling

Edited March 15, 2012 by billd766

[loong]

I live on 14 rai of land with my wife and son and she also has a shop and restaurant on another 10 rai of land.

How much of that land is mine?

Err zero.

How much of the land is my wife's?

All of it.

How much will go to our son when she dies?

All of it.

We are planning on putting all the land etc in our son's name this year anyway.

For me there is no problem about owning land in any country.

I can't dig it up and take it back to the country I came from and when I am dead it doesn't really matter.

Edited for bad spelling

I knew a Wealthy Thai woman (lottery win) that put all of her land etc into her son's name.

The son married and soon died in an accident. Everything was then in the daughter-in-law's name and the Mother was destitute and homeless

[jonclark]

How do you 'hoard" land? Stick it in a cupboard under the stairs until the New Year??

[bkk_mike]

Isn't what he's really saying...

Thai's own land, but the Thai person is related to a foreigner (spouse, brother-in-law, etc.), so we think they got the money for the land from the foreigner, and therefore we want to take it away from the Thai person that owns it because it really means the foreigner owns it.

This would get laughed out of court by any reasonable judge...

(Now the nominee shareholders of "Thai" companies... - that might be a different matter entirely as that may actually be provable in court... However, if they start going down that road, there are lots of rocks to be turned over, starting with DTAC, Tesco, Toyota, Nissan, Western Digital, etc. etc. It would rather go against the attempt to get companies to continue to invest in Thailand after the flooding...)

[anterian]

The ethnic Chinese Thais desperately cling to their ill gotten gains.

[Gone]

They want us out more and more every day. This is NOT the time that Thailand should be screwing with there biggest investors and I don't mean land wise. If we all left tomorrow what would happen to Thailand? The same thing that happened to the twin towers I think.

[RKASA]

How do you 'hoard" land? Stick it in a cupboard under the stairs until the New Year??

Don't do it - that is the first place they look.

[Nip]

I agree with the Thais to a certain extend. In my country (Brazil) foreigners could own unlimited amounts of land until a few years ago. You know what happened? The Chinese came in and bought vast amounts of agriculture land, I am talking about huge areas that equal the size of small countries in Europe. They come in <snip> up the soil with their polluting pesticides and herbicides all to produce food mostly for their cattle back in China. This is a real problem in Brazil nowadays and many other countries in South America. In Panama, central America they did the same thing, the tip of the country on the pacific side is almost entirely owned by Chinese companies, not even the Panamanians can get in there. I would not be surprised they are doing this in Thailand because of the Chinese.

You know what? The Chinese own most of Thailand too but they are Thai - Chinese...

[andre47]

Isn't what he's really saying...

Thai's own land, but the Thai person is related to a foreigner (spouse, brother-in-law, etc.), so we think they got the money for the land from the foreigner, and therefore we want to take it away from the Thai person that owns it because it really means the foreigner owns it.

This would get laughed out of court by any reasonable judge...

(Now the nominee shareholders of "Thai" companies... - that might be a different matter entirely as that may actually be provable in court... However, if they start going down that road, there are lots of rocks to be turned over, starting with DTAC, Tesco, Toyota, Nissan, Western Digital, etc. etc. It would rather go against the attempt to get companies to continue to invest in Thailand after the flooding...)

Companies and Investors can buy land under certain conditions. They also can lease land for 60 years. Normal farangs can lease only for 30 years.