Should I Stay Or Should I Go?

[fanta rood]

will you get bored if you retire early? what if everyone in europe decides to go on early retirement? is it fair to others if you go on early retirement while the others still need to work and pay for your retirement? what about the future of your kids?

no offense

[chonabot]

will you get bored if you retire early? what if everyone in europe decides to go on early retirement? is it fair to others if you go on early retirement while the others still need to work and pay for your retirement? what about the future of your kids?

no offense

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

This confirms to me that Fanta Rood is a Troll.

He posted this inane nonsense yeaterday and received no replies , another identical post.

If the OP retires , how would he be supported by others? He has worked Bloody hard and is in the position to benefit from his hard graft. He is supporting a wife and child and will continue doing so , whether he stays or leaves.

To the OP I say go for it! I am 40 and intend to stay another 5 years in the UK to prepare for the move , if I were in your position I would go , but maybe with a business plan in Los to boost earnings.

[fanta rood]

Screaming out on the forums whos a troll wont do anyone good. Your reasoning is way wrong. And I hate that word it makes you look like a sheep on the internet

But you know what makes me a troll and I dont mind. I'm not on these forums to make friends. With these questions I try to let people know what my opinion is while at the same time makes me understand there motives. I dont care if I'm radical. Also I did say no offense

[chonabot]

Screaming out on the forums whos a troll wont do anyone good. Your reasoning is way wrong. And I hate that word it makes you look like a sheep on the internet

But you know what makes me a troll and I dont mind. I'm not on these forums to make friends. With these questions I try to let people know what my opinion is while at the same time makes me understand there motives. I dont care if I'm radical. Also I did say no offense

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Apologies to the OP for this distraction.

Fanta Rood can you elaborate on your original post , is it fair to others if you go on early retirement while the others still need to work and pay for your retirement? - in particular ?

I'm sure a few of us would like to hear your "radical" reasoning.

[Fast Eddie]

I find Fanta Rood quite amusing at times. His writing style is very reminscent of that eurasian/Vladimir Jugovic chap, who appeared a couple of weeks ago and got banned twice after about thirty minutes of 'radical' ranting. Maybe his alter egos?

Having said that, i do have an unusual sense of humour at times.

Is he a troll? An interesting question.

Edited December 20, 2005 by Fast Eddie

[fanta rood]

if it makes me radical in your eyes. Forget about it =)

I'm glad I could amuse you eddie =)

[chonabot]

About as radical as a bag of carrot peelings , if you make claims please be prepared to explain or back them up , otherwise you are just confirming everones exceedingly low opinions of your good self.

[Dragonman]

Screaming out on the forums whos a troll wont do anyone good. Your reasoning is way wrong. And I hate that word it makes you look like a sheep on the internet

But you know what makes me a troll and I dont mind. I'm not on these forums to make friends. With these questions I try to let people know what my opinion is while at the same time makes me understand there motives. I dont care if I'm radical. Also I did say no offense

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Apologies to the OP for this distraction.

Fanta Rood can you elaborate on your original post , is it fair to others if you go on early retirement while the others still need to work and pay for your retirement? - in particular ?

I'm sure a few of us would like to hear your "radical" reasoning.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yeah, I paid vast amounts in pension contributions for 30 years so that I could claim a small pension at 50 which takes care of me and my family out here. People who still work don't give me a penny, and in fact since I still pay tax in UK, but can't claim any benefits, I am looking after them

[Steve2UK]

Englishoak, you don't say exactly where you have been living in LOS or now in the UK. That has a bearing on my thinking about the possibilities if only because of the arithmetic: the rental potential of (say) a London property as against the cost of living in a part of LOS cheaper than Bangkok, Phuket etc.

That aside for the moment, the key practical factor weighing on your mind seems to be what's best for your daughter in the next five years. IMHO, that should actually be the next ten years or so - i.e. long enough to take her through a university education. Far more than in the UK, a degree seems to be the essential starting point of any professional "career" in Thailand - hence my emphasis on the longer timescale. I'm also assuming that any plan you make ends up with you all living in LOS for good - it's just a matter of from when.

So, I'm inclined to concentrate on where a good education/degree could be more easily funded - which seems to be almost certainly Thailand rather than the UK. I'm no expert on the Thai education system, but it's clear to me that many tens of thousands of Thai youngsters go through it and do well from it - in Thailand. There's a trace in some of the posts so far that suggests that a Thai (i.e. not "international") school education is somehow inadequate; that might be true for expats living/working in Thailand temporarily and looking ahead to when they/their children move elsewhere - but I don't see it as anything like so relevant for a family whose home will continue to be in Thailand. If that sounds to some like I'm talking about "only good enough for Thailand", let me emphasise that I mean it in a positive sense - i.e "right for Thailand".

I infer from what you say that there are good (and positive) reasons why your daughter is still in Thailand while you (the parents) have spent the last two years in the UK. If that's the case, I assume that the reasons will continue to be relevant - and positive. Like you, I'm less than impressed with the general state and atmosphere of school education in the UK; outside the top academies etc, it's something of a lottery. No doubt it's variable in Thailand, too - but less money talks louder/buys better there than in the UK.

Which brings me back to where you'd be based in Thailand and what your general income as a combination of UK property/investment return would be. My instinct is that UK property prices are not going to plummet anytime soon and will at least keep pace with UK inflation, so there's no need to rush to sell on that count. Would it not be better to keep your options open by sticking to rental income from your UK property - and also rent in Thailand for the next few years (particularly as you seem to be able to live relatively Thai-style economical as opposed to more expensive farang-style)? I'm also factoring in the point that Thai rents seem to be generally around 5% of property value compared to around 10% of UK property value - and with less of a tendency for the property value to appreciate. After deductions, you'd probably be getting about 8% return on property capital (compared to 4.5% on invested sale proceeds) - and still have the option to sell/return later. You might regard 5-10 years of renting in Thailand (as opposed to buying) as "lost money", but it a] might be covered by the better income from UK rental, b] allow you to finance your daughter's full education in Thailand and c] keep your options open longer.

I know you said that renting out in the UK was a pain before, but others seem to make it work - I guess it's the luck of the draw with the agent/tenant.

Obviously, the other key financial factor to consider is whether your net income (i.e. after living costs) is significantly greater in the UK than in Thailand. If it isn't, then you're not growing your capital enough to make it worth delaying the move you obviously want to make.

Not sure if any of what I've said helps your thinking but it's as much as I can come up with based on the info you've provided. Good luck with whatever you decide.

[SK1972]

If you have absolutely nothing in UK left for you, then move. Just remember, visiting/vacationing is way different from actually living in a country.

Good judgment comes from experience, and often experience comes from bad judgment - Rita Mae Brown

What one has not experienced, one will never understand in print - Isadora Duncan

Good luck!

Edited December 21, 2005 by SK1972

[mraitchison]

Educate your daughter in the UK. NOt here unless you can afford an International School and even then they are not that great.

If you want her to learn to think for herself then keep her out of schools here.

[SK1972]

Educate your daughter in the UK. NOt here unless you can afford an International School and even then they are not that great.

If you want her to learn to think for herself then keep her out of schools here.

I strongly agree with the above!

My dilemma is this should I sell up & get back to where I am comfortable

Extracted from 1st post.

I would advise against selling up. Had a friend who did that and lost everything he had. He is back home living with his mother now.....and he is 45!

If you can afford to move to LOS with what you have without having to sell anything, then that's fine. If not, do not take the gamble! No risk is worth it.

Edited December 21, 2005 by SK1972

[unforgiven]

Iv'e been back in the uk now for the past 2 years after living in Thailand for the previous 3 years. I have to admit it has been harder to re-adjust than I thought. Most of you returning to the uk will understand what I mean without me harping on.

My status is Happily married to a thai here in the uk with a daughter currently in LOS. If I bring her over then I will have to stay for at least 5 years to maximise her education here.

I'm 40 years young and active, love going out but since returning I am feeling trapped and am all too aware I am letting my best years slip on by in the UK

I should also mention that all my friends in Thailand are Thai and I am very used to and enjoy living Thai style. Adjusting will not be a problem

At present I can liquidate assets to the tune of 200k invest in offshore at lets say 4.5% = 9000 pa. with the bonus of about 100K maturing in 5 years and another 150k in 10 years.

I reckon to set up a life in LOL i'll have to invest between 2-4m bht. Or lets say 50k That will include land,house,car,fittings etc

That will leave about 150k x 4.5% = 6750pa 

I expect after a year I will probably be earning 10000bht a month as before. pocket money but got to do something and I enjoy it.

I don't intend to draw on my savings but live off the interest. As I see it, I only have to scrape by for a few years. I feel like i'm doing that already in the uk.

I have a property in the uk and have rented out while I was in LOS I did find it a pain and although it allowed me a life in thailand I don't relish doing that again long term.

With a family in the UK I don't see my savings increasing over the time I am here. (It's not cheap to take a family on holiday to Thailand)

I also believe that over the next 5 years property here will drop or stagnate at the least. That in turn bodes well for savings if I am right, plus allows a return to invest in property before another upturn.

My main problem is I need to liquidate the house to get capital. re mortgage is out as it would affect money gained from a rental.

My dilemma is this should I sell up & get back to where I am comfortable, LOS or stick it out in the uk for 5 years.

What would you do?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I know it's a tough call,I lived in Thai on and off for 15 years sometimes for years in a row.Big mistake,if I was you I'd stay in the west maye australia and educate my daughter and holiday regularly in Thai, going native was a big mistake for me,,, remember "YOU FALANG" "YOU NOT THAI"

[Buff-horns]

remember if you burn your bridges ,if you want to come back at some time in the future,

property prices will be out of your reach .

so if you go there you die there .

[Neeranam]

How long have you been married?

If you have been married only a couple of years, wait.

How old is your daughter?

Is she yours or a step-daughter?

I'd say this is very important information.

Money has got nothing to do with things for me.

I was offered a job in the UK yesterday paying 8 times what I get in Thailand, just as a start to get back into the oil business after 13 years out. It took me a while(2 hours) to answer them. After 2 days in the Uk, I've had enough - f'ing freezing and depressing. No amount of cash could tempt me to live back here.

I went to Thailand at age 27 with 1 thousand pounds and I have exactly that much now, aged 40. I wouldn't change it for the world!

Edited December 21, 2005 by Neeranam

[Heng]

I went to Thailand at age 27 with 1 thousand pounds and I have exactly that much now, aged 40. I wouldn't change it for the world!

That's fine for those who are mentally stable or have safety nets back home, but for a lot of people with few options and no family support... that's only a few steps away from the Pattaya-Phuket balconey swan dive.

Chai sam suan, om nung suan. And for those that can, chai nung suan, om sam suan. Just like a trusty sidearm, better to have it and not need it, than to need it and not have it.

[mraitchison]

My safety net worries me - I have a little bit of cash stashed away for an emergency but I know its there and I am always aware of when I spend a little bit of it.

[roamer]

As the OP stated, his main concern is for his daughters education, and that raises issues that deeply divide many people on this board. There is a school of thought that says get the education sorted in the UK, recognised as a superior system, free, and all the other benefits that accrue from an English education.

But his wife is less than impressed with the attitudes of some of the kids she sees in the Uk. There are some great state schools here in the UK, a lot of mediocre schools and an awful lot of crap ones too. I live near one of the top ones, less than half a mile, problem is its catchment area does'nt extend beyond 400 yards, inside of which a curious amount of Labour politicians and allied types have puchased houses at incredibly inflated prices. Very easy to spout about the the fact that their children go to state schools when that state school just happens to be one of the top schools in the country.

Our daughter came to England speaking almost zero English aged 7, went to a very good state primary school....how I envy the speed with which she has absorbed the language and popular culture. There is no way she could have got that in Thailand even at the "best" international schools. Soon we have to look at secondary schools...its not as bad as it could be, reasonable chance of getting into an acceptable school...in marked contrast to some of my friends who face the prospect of sink schools or going private at immense cost.

However for us, like the OP,s wife we are less impressed with some of the kids and the attitudes on the tour of the secondary schools, enough to make Thailand and an international school, (Chiang Mai and NOT Bangkok,) a reasonable choice.

Sure there is a lot of divided opinion here about international schools, most of which relates to Bangkok, totally different enviroment from Chiang Mai as far as schools are concerned. quite a few expats in Chiang Mai are more than happy with their kids education there.

Sometimes I think the almost automatic reply of the English system being preferable is voiced by those who are too long out of the system to know any better. Fact is that for most English parents education is their biggest worry and the difference between a good school for your kids and a hel_l hole is as little as a postcode.

There is no right and wrong here, just a matter of choices.

[marshbags]

There is no right and wrong here, just a matter of choices.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I have spoken to many young Thai,s who have had the benefit of some u.k. education and they stand miles above the unfortunate ones who haven,t ( cannot )

They make a big impression by there mature outlook and expanded knowledge of the world outside Thailand.

Even the areas where people class the standards as low are by far better than so called class establishments here.

Again you only have to compare the different attitudes to come to this conclusion.

Learning another culture while educating can only broaden there outlook and not hinder it.

As roamer says it is down to choice and what suits your personal needs that makes the difference.

marshbags

[mraitchison]

On the education front my brother in the UK is buying a small apartment about 20 miles from his house to get his kid into a decent school.

Absolute madness that only 20 miles seperates my nephew from a good education or a shit poor school.

[Steve2UK]

Reading Roamer's post prompts me to add a note to my earlier comments. It was actually Chiang Mai that I had in mind when I suggested that there are very good Thai (i.e. as opposed to "international") schools in Thailand - at least two highly-rated ones in CM..... effectively the equivalent of UK grammar schools or academies.

A further thought: in terms of getting the broader outlook that a UK secondary education might be thought to offer (compared to a Thai one), maybe the fact that the OP is himself British could/should be taken into account? Parents can add a lot to their child's education and development - regardless of where it happens. I'm in danger of sounding racist here (suggesting that Thai-only parents couldn't/wouldn't be any help) - but I'm thinking mainly about the benefits of the parents being from different cultures. As it happens, I'm the product of Brit-German parents; not a huge cultural difference, you might think, but I know that my early exposure to both (London for the most part but also small-town life in Germany) made a big difference to how I grew up and the outlook I developed. Then again, my (German) mother was a committed book-reader and I inherited her habit of reading widely.